MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: Uncle Rico on February 18, 2022, 11:11:51 AM
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Have the Bears found the right GM-Coach combo or is bad ownership too much to overcome?
Will Karon Rodgers be back in GB? What about Adams? If so, what kind of playoff choke will they give us in January of 2023?
Vikings went all-in on an analytics GM and dove into the McVay pool of coaches. Will it work or will kissing your Cousins limit the ceiling?
Are the Lions quietly the most stable team in the NFC North?
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Is Dan Marino the all-time biggest loser/choker in NFL history?
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Is Dan Marino the all-time biggest loser/choker in NFL history?
He’s up there
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No running game. No defense.
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No running game. No defense.
Not true. He ran from many paternity tests and failed to play defense a lot during extramarital affairs
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Don't care. Yo are full of rumors and hearsay today.
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Rodgers with a post last night that have many speculating retirement. He will be on the McAfee show at 12 CT.
I’m thinking he’s going to laugh at people jumping to conclusions and say no decision has been made. I think he enjoys getting social media people riled up.
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Rodgers with a post last night that have many speculating retirement. He will be on the McAfee show at 12 CT.
I’m thinking he’s going to laugh at people jumping to conclusions and say no decision has been made. I think he enjoys getting social media people riled up.
He’s so much like Favre now it’s amazing. Wonder what culture wars he’ll fight today?
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Rodgers tells his fans they’re suckers
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Rodgers tells his fans they’re suckers
McAfee was lowkey pissed he didn't drag it out.
The only outcome that I will be irritated by is if he retires - if he wants to go play his hand someplace else, all the credit to him. Not sure there's a better roster that is ready to receive him. Unload him, get the assets and be prepared to go all in on a QB in '23 if/when Love isn't the answer.
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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33348778/green-bay-packers-qb-aaron-rodgers-explains-instagram-post-says-made-decision-future
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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33348778/green-bay-packers-qb-aaron-rodgers-explains-instagram-post-says-made-decision-future
Interesting how the link says the exact opposite of what Aaron said.
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We gotta stop thinking of 12 as anything but an edgelord. He's out there sh1tposting day in and day out and seems to get more joy from getting people to bite on his posts/quips/whatevers than anything else.
I'll believe something he says about his future when the ink is dry on a deal, and not a second before.
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He must have did this just to boost ratings for his buddy Pat McAfee
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People scry into his posts and statements like their Roman augurs looking for omens in bird entrails, but the simplest explanation is absolutely the most likely: He is screwing with everyone until proven otherwise.
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We gotta stop thinking of 12 as anything but an edgelord. He's out there sh1tposting day in and day out and seems to get more joy from getting people to bite on his posts/quips/whatevers than anything else.
I'll believe something he says about his future when the ink is dry on a deal, and not a second before.
The Edgelords sound like a band playing on a Summerfest free stage at 2 pm.
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The Edgelords sound like a band playing on a Summerfest free stage at 2 pm.
😂😂😂
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The Edgelords sound like a band playing on a Summerfest free stage at 2 pm.
Maybe this summer? From Cleveland... https://www.facebook.com/TheEdgelords/
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Maybe this summer? From Cleveland... https://www.facebook.com/TheEdgelords/
Holy crap! LMAO
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Have the Bears found the right GM-Coach combo or is bad ownership too much to overcome?
Will Karon Rodgers be back in GB? What about Adams? If so, what kind of playoff choke will they give us in January of 2023?
Vikings went all-in on an analytics GM and dove into the McVay pool of coaches. Will it work or will kissing your Cousins limit the ceiling?
Are the Lions quietly the most stable team in the NFC North?
I don't know that guy. Do you mean Karon Bradley? Man, I wish he would have stuck around, he would have been a nice reserve for us, especially in 04-05 when we had no PG.
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People scry into his posts and statements like their Roman augurs looking for omens in bird entrails, but the simplest explanation is absolutely the most likely: He is screwing with everyone until proven otherwise.
He's giving people what they deserve. Personally, I think it's great. Everyone is trying to read tea leaves, and he's said he will make an announcement when he's ready. He has literally told everyone what he is going to do. So uhh.... just be patient.
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Troy Aikman your new MNF analyst.
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Troy Aikman your new MNF analyst.
Does Greg Olsen get the top spot now at Fox? Or, will it be Sean Payton?
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Troy Aikman your new MNF analyst.
Lots of new announcing crews next year.
Tirico-Collinsworth
Aikman-?
Buck-?
Al Michaels back at ESPN? Amazon?
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Does Greg Olsen get the top spot now at Fox? Or, will it be Sean Payton?
We can only hope ...
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ8Wzbu3xyc7zytcHvLQfDJCB1gfiOjKXKOtyYyU-piZc9mRu9lcwEXZ6yGXZblTzWQAG8&usqp=CAU)
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Maybe this summer? From Cleveland... https://www.facebook.com/TheEdgelords/
From the looks of them, I'd say more like 1982.
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Does Greg Olsen get the top spot now at Fox? Or, will it be Sean Payton?
That's a good call, RJ. Olsen is outstanding.
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Does Greg Olsen get the top spot now at Fox? Or, will it be Sean Payton?
My guess is Olsen.
Michaels to Amazon.
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From the looks of them, I'd say more like 1982.
Have you been to Summerfest lately? They'd fit right in on an early afternoon side stage leading up to Styx. REO Speedwagon, Cheap Trick, etc.
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Chiefs hire Nagy as Quarterbacks coach.
I just find that kinda funny.
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Chiefs hire Nagy as Quarterbacks coach.
I just find that kinda funny.
Only kinda funny. Man butchers working with a new QB...gets job training other QBs. Only in coaching, CEOs and politics, due people proven to be inept fall on such fertile new grounds.
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Ali Marlet Bucs offensive lineman retires af age 28. Wants to maintain health
https://nypost.com/2022/02/27/ali-marpet-buccaneers-pro-bowler-stunningly-retires-at-28/amp/
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Ali Marlet Bucs offensive lineman retires af age 28. Wants to maintain health
https://nypost.com/2022/02/27/ali-marpet-buccaneers-pro-bowler-stunningly-retires-at-28/amp/
With the money guys can make early in their careers why not get out while you have your physical health and can life your best life. Marpet shoukd be good for the rest of his life. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/tampa-bay-buccaneers/ali-marpet-16785/
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Coming from Vikings news writer especially , this may be the dumbest article every written
https://www.yahoo.com/news/souhan-packers-fans-paid-high-224800752.html
(https://www.yahoo.com/news/souhan-packers-fans-paid-high-224800752.html)
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Coming from Vikings news writer especially , this may be the dumbest article every written
https://www.yahoo.com/news/souhan-packers-fans-paid-high-224800752.html
(https://www.yahoo.com/news/souhan-packers-fans-paid-high-224800752.html)
What made Brady great is the same thing that has limited Rodgers. Brady always made sure his contracts were very team friendly, which allowed them to stack the team, and have tremendous rosters. Rodgers always wanted to be paid, and paid well. There just hasn't been the roster room, to go get more ammo for him.
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Rodgers tells his fans they’re suckers
What? Rodgers was traded to the Giants?
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Packers finally playing in London
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Hopefully no vaccination restrictions at that point.
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What made Brady great is the same thing that has limited Rodgers. Brady always made sure his contracts were very team friendly, which allowed them to stack the team, and have tremendous rosters. Rodgers always wanted to be paid, and paid well. There just hasn't been the roster room, to go get more ammo for him.
I think your post is a little misleading. ARod was not even in the top 5 QBs last year in compensation.
Both players have had contracts structured with signing bonuses to lower their cap numbers. Brady has averaged $13.3 mil per year in his career; Rodgers $12.9 mil.
The real truth lies somewhere in the middle of our 2 posts.
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https://www.tmj4.com/sports/green-bay-packers/study-finds-aaron-rodgers-to-be-the-most-despised-person-in-the-nfl
Pete Carroll is on my personal list. Along with Rodgers.
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https://www.tmj4.com/sports/green-bay-packers/study-finds-aaron-rodgers-to-be-the-most-despised-person-in-the-nfl
Pete Carroll is on my personal list. Along with Rodgers.
Stuff Media
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Things going well on the Aaron Rogers front per Ian Rapoport
https://mobile.twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1499490186174083078?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1499490186174083078%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-9805333001281281727.ampproject.net%2F2202230359001%2Fframe.html
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NFL halts all covid protocols
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Favre is dragging his decision out and making sure all the reporters that cover the league know about it. He’s very torn about the lack of attention, I mean where he wants to play
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Favre is dragging his decision out and making sure all the reporters that cover the league know about it. He’s very torn about the lack of attention, I mean where he wants to play
He'll be back.
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He'll be back.
Yeah, Favre just loves the drama. It stokes his ego
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NFL halts all covid protocols
Oh, iz covid over? Hoo new, hey?
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Oh, iz covid over? Hoo new, hey?
COVID’s been over since November 2020. Duh.
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Yeah, Favre just loves the drama. It stokes his ego
While I know it is hard to tell them apart, but when in doubt remember: Favre is the one that sends dick pics, Rodgers is the one that is a dick.
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Cross off Mike Florio as a knowledgeable sports writer - sure, the packers are going let Rodgers negotiate the trades.
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/aaron-rodgers-specific-destinations-place-045058307.html (https://www.yahoo.com/sports/aaron-rodgers-specific-destinations-place-045058307.html)
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Cross off Mike Florio as a knowledgeable sports writer - sure, the packers are going let Rodgers negotiate the trades.
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/aaron-rodgers-specific-destinations-place-045058307.html (https://www.yahoo.com/sports/aaron-rodgers-specific-destinations-place-045058307.html)
I think he was crossed off awhile ago. Especially in relation to Packers news.
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Florio is full of crap
https://mobile.twitter.com/mattschneidman/status/1500124634183880705 (https://mobile.twitter.com/mattschneidman/status/1500124634183880705)
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https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/03/04/aaron-rodgers-has-specific-destinations-in-place-if-he-chooses-to-leave-the-packers/
"Per a source with knowledge of the situation, Rodgers has specific deals lined up with other teams — and those teams have trade compensation lined up with the Packers. The potential moves have been arranged, essentially, with the permission of the Packers."
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See above 4 messages
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/03/04/aaron-rodgers-has-specific-destinations-in-place-if-he-chooses-to-leave-the-packers/
"Per a source with knowledge of the situation, Rodgers has specific deals lined up with other teams — and those teams have trade compensation lined up with the Packers. The potential moves have been arranged, essentially, with the permission of the Packers."
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https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/03/04/aaron-rodgers-has-specific-destinations-in-place-if-he-chooses-to-leave-the-packers/
"Per a source with knowledge of the situation, Rodgers has specific deals lined up with other teams — and those teams have trade compensation lined up with the Packers. The potential moves have been arranged, essentially, with the permission of the Packers."
Profootballtalk IS Mike Florio.
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See above 4 messages
You beat me by 7 seconds! :o
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If I had to believe Florio or Favre, I’ll take Florio
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He ain't goin' knoware, aina?
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Or a couple hours…
You beat me by 7 seconds! :o
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Uhh.....what else should those that don't follow football know about this d-tackle Jordan Davis? 6'6 340 lbs? He ran a 4.78 40?? What kind of destruction and damage are we projecting in the NFL?
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Uhh.....what else should those that don't follow football know about this d-tackle Jordan Davis? 6'6 340 lbs? He ran a 4.78 40?? What kind of destruction and damage are we projecting in the NFL?
He's a defensive tackle. Being fast doesn't mean he is good.
Having said that, this sprint/hype has probably moved him up in the first round.
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Uhh.....what else should those that don't follow football know about this d-tackle Jordan Davis? 6'6 340 lbs? He ran a 4.78 40?? What kind of destruction and damage are we projecting in the NFL?
Super freaky athlete with the potential to be a dominant NFL player. Lots of things to consider. Who drafts him? What kind of coaching does he get? What kind of teammates does he have? Does he have the motor to be great? Was incredible this past year at Georgia.
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He's a defensive tackle. Being fast doesn't mean he is good.
Having said that, this sprint/hype has probably moved him up in the first round.
I mean, he was the Outland and Bednarik award winner, that means he’s good. His speed is notable cause he was already a beast. His DT teammate actually ran a faster 40
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He's a defensive tackle. Being fast doesn't mean he is good.
Having said that, this sprint/hype has probably moved him up in the first round.
His splits were good too. He's an athletic big man - couple clips circulating of him giving chase down the line.
Hes still a run stopper by default, but he has the athleticism to develop as a pass rusher
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Yeah guys, I know. Which is why I said he is moving up the first round. lol
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Calvin ridley suspended for betting on games.
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Calvin ridley suspended for betting on games.
Why? If owners can offer coaches money to lose, why should Ridley be suspended?
I dunno. Maybe I wouldn’t have jumped in bed with every gambling operation if I were sports leagues
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Supposedly he was also doing it while he was on his leave from the team for mental health issues. Not exactly a Pete Rose situation if thats the case.
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Why? If owners can offer coaches money to lose, why should Ridley be suspended?
I dunno. Maybe I wouldn’t have jumped in bed with every gambling operation if I were sports leagues
Wait until you hear about the Premiere League.
Calvin Ridley didn't bet on NFL games because the league has a deal with BetMGM, any more than Aldon Smith has a drinking problem because of all the Bud Light commercials.
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Wait until you hear about the Premiere League.
Calvin Ridley didn't bet on NFL games because the league has a deal with BetMGM, any more than Aldon Smith has a drinking problem because of all the Bud Light commercials.
Right. He should be able to bet on games
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Right. He should be able to bet on games
No, he shouldn't.
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No, he shouldn't.
I disagree
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I disagree
I see that.
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An athlete shouldn't bet on his or her own league's games.
There are plenty of other sports he or she can bet on. If it's too much of a burden to avoid betting on NFL games, an NFL player can become an ex-NFL player.
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An athlete shouldn't bet on his or her own league's games.
There are plenty of other sports he or she can bet on. If it's too much of a burden to avoid betting on NFL games, an NFL player can become an ex-NFL player.
This is the correct response.
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As I said all along - Rodgers signs in GB.
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As I said all along - Rodgers signs in GB.
4 years, $200 million. $153m guaranteed. Makes him the highest paid player in NFL history.
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That should help the salary cap
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That should help the salary cap
NFL salary cap problems are easily navigable.
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This pretty much confirms Adams is back. Rodgers would want some sort of assurance the Packers would re-sign him before agreeing to a deal.
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This pretty much confirms Adams is back. Rodgers would want some sort of assurance the Packers would re-sign him before agreeing to a deal.
I agree.
I predicted during his standoff last summer that he would be under center in September. I predicted the last couple months that he would be back next year. My final prediction is he will not play out all 4 years in GB.
Oops. One more. Gutey will draft a WR - probably Olave or Williams.
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But I was told by all the bears fans on the board he wasn’t coming back.
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The Jordan Love pick worked out beautifully.
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Chit, knot only duz he own da Bears, he kan buy 'em, hey?
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not quite as good as bears pick trubisky
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Adios Love, and da horse ewe road inn on, hey?
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That should help the salary cap
Salary cap went up $26 million to $208 million for the 2022 season, and is expected to go up just as much for 2023.
This won't be an issue.
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Pack tagged Adams.
They'll go for a super bowl for 2-3 years with Rodgers.
They'll kick the salary cap "can" down the road to the years after Rodgers.
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Pack still has a Championship run left so this signing makes sense for both parties.
Now get special teams fixed
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The Jordan Love pick worked out beautifully.
Yeah. I think this deal says almost as much about their confidence in Love's future as it does wanting AR back.
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The Jordan Love pick worked out beautifully.
Love is 23, don’t think they’ll be ready to
move on quite yet….if Jockey’s hunch is right that Rodgers will not play the full 4 years, having a 26 year old just entering his Prime (age wise) and well versed by that point in the offense isn’t a terrible back up plan.
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Pack tagged Adams.
I think that is temporary - deadline was today. Now that Rodgers contract is done, Adams will be re-signed soon - probably for 4 years.
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I guess the Packers aren’t serious about winning Super Bowls. Feel bad for the fans
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Love is 23, don’t think they’ll be ready to
move on quite yet….if Jockey’s hunch is right that Rodgers will not play the full 4 years, having a 26 year old just entering his Prime (age wise) and well versed by that point in the offense isn’t a terrible back up plan.
Wrong. They would have to pick up Love's 5th year option for that to occur. I would be shocked if they do.
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Love wuz da best thang dat happened two #12, hey?
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Love is 23, don’t think they’ll be ready to
move on quite yet….if Jockey’s hunch is right that Rodgers will not play the full 4 years, having a 26 year old just entering his Prime (age wise) and well versed by that point in the offense isn’t a terrible back up plan.
And in the meantime, he's as affordable a backup QB as you'll find. So might as well ride it out.
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We talked about this a lot, 99.9% of players who try to burn down their franchise the morning of the draft will not be employed by said team much longer. However, with Rodgers, the one thing that was always going to bring him back was a massive new contract. I'm skeptical that the final numbers will be 4 years/$200 mil with the $153 fully guaranteed upfront. I'd expect this to be a four year, year to year deal, where by Rodgers signing bonus pays out in installments every March 1st going forward, and the "will he come back?" narrative will play out each year still moving forward, but gives the team some level of protection from cap hell.
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If we're considering age and contract (which we always should when evaluating players), Justin Fields is already the top QB in the NFC North and it's not even close. And I say that as someone who stands by my criticism of Ryan Pace for trading up for him.
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If we're considering age and contract (which we always should when evaluating players), Justin Fields is already the top QB in the NFC North and it's not even close. And I say that as someone who stands by my criticism of Ryan Pace for trading up for him.
I mean, if you consider paying a QB a bad thing and don't care much about on-field performance, sure.
But otherwise, I'm not so sure that the guy with the worst QBR in the NFL last season is better than Aaron Rodgers.
As for the importance of age and contract, only two of the last 15 Super Bowl winning QBs were on the first contract and/or under the age of 27.
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Russell Wilson to Broncos. Stealing some spotlight from AR.
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Dominoes are falling!
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We talked about this a lot, 99.9% of players who try to burn down their franchise the morning of the draft will not be employed by said team much longer. However, with Rodgers, the one thing that was always going to bring him back was a massive new contract. I'm skeptical that the final numbers will be 4 years/$200 mil with the $153 fully guaranteed upfront. I'd expect this to be a four year, year to year deal, where by Rodgers signing bonus pays out in installments every March 1st going forward, and the "will he come back?" narrative will play out each year still moving forward, but gives the team some level of protection from cap hell.
Early reports were a $55 Mil signing bonus payed immediately w/ $2 million salary for '22.
We'll see if that is correct. I expect he will play 3 years and then mull retirement. I doubt if he will ever play for a different team.
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I mean, if you consider paying a QB a bad thing and don't care much about on-field performance, sure.
But otherwise, I'm not so sure that the guy with the worst QBR in the NFL last season is better than Aaron Rodgers.
As for the importance of age and contract, only two of the last 15 Super Bowl winning QBs were on the first contract and/or under the age of 27.
https://twitter.com/michaeldavsmith/status/1136709172446269444 (https://twitter.com/michaeldavsmith/status/1136709172446269444)
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Hoo boy, Denver went all in like nobody's gone all in since the Herschel Walker trade.
Seattle gets QB Drew Lock, TE Noah Fant, DL Shelby Harris, two first-round picks, two second-round picks and a fifth-round pick.
Denver gets Russell Wilson and a fourth-round pick.
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Hoo boy, Denver went all in like nobody's gone all in since the Herschel Walker trade.
Seattle gets QB Drew Lock, TE Noah Fant, DL Shelby Harris, two first-round picks, two second-round picks and a fifth-round pick.
Denver gets Russell Wilson and a fourth-round pick.
Seahawks got better today while the Packers got worse
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Hoo boy, Denver went all in like nobody's gone all in since the Herschel Walker trade.
Seattle gets QB Drew Lock, TE Noah Fant, DL Shelby Harris, two first-round picks, two second-round picks and a fifth-round pick.
Denver gets Russell Wilson and a fourth-round pick.
That’s a lot more than I’d be willing to part ways with for someone who might be washed up.
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Seahawks got better today while the Packers got worse
You think having Love or Locke at QB makes GB better?
I know you don't like ARod, but that is next level crazy.
Drew Locke is not leading Seattle to the promised land. Plus, there are no franchise QBs for them to grab with the picks they got back.
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You think having Love or Locke at QB makes GB better?
I know you don't like ARod, but that is next level crazy.
Drew Locke is not leading Seattle to the promised land. Plus, there are no franchise QBs for them to grab with the picks they got back.
Seattle got rid of a malcontent and can start fresh. Short term pain for long term gain
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Hoo boy, Denver went all in like nobody's gone all in since the Herschel Walker trade.
Seattle gets QB Drew Lock, TE Noah Fant, DL Shelby Harris, two first-round picks, two second-round picks and a fifth-round pick.
Denver gets Russell Wilson and a fourth-round pick.
Homestead High School stand up! Dude had a really roundabout path to being a regular NFL contributor but made the most of his chances in a couple marquee spots. Good for him for getting past some immaturity and "character" issues in his youth
Great move for the Seahawks. They can see what they have in Locke and Eason for a season while they figure out if Carson will ever not be made of glass. They upgrade a weak TE position.
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You think having Love or Locke at QB makes GB better?
I know you don't like ARod, but that is next level crazy.
Drew Locke is not leading Seattle to the promised land. Plus, there are no franchise QBs for them to grab with the picks they got back.
I'd be surprised if Seattle sees Lock as their longtime answer at QB. He's the least valuable asset they received in this deal.
But they get two good starters (Fant and Harris) and the #9 and #40 picks in the upcoming draft, which should mean two more young starters if they don't mess it up.
Then they get Denver's first two picks in 2023. Russ is great and all, but the AFC West is going to be a murderer's row next year, so those easily could be a top 20 and a top 50 pick, or better ... and hence two more young starters if Seattle picks well.
That's a heck of a start to what was an inevitable rebuilding process. As has been noted, Seattle likely wasn't going to win with Russ anyhow.
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Seattle got rid of a malcontent and can start fresh. Short term pain for long term gain
Yeah, I was hoping GB would rip off that bandaid this year
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If I'm Tom Brady, I'm coming back immediately and negotiating my exit out of Tampa and out to San Francisco.
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Seattle got rid of a malcontent and can start fresh. Short term pain for long term gain
Lots of teams have gone for decades without a franchise-type QB.
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Lots of teams have gone for decades without a franchise-type QB.
Listen, I know Packers fans can’t see Rodgers for what he is. I get it. I’m a recovering fan looking to come back to the family after he’s gone but he’s not taking this team to the promised land. And after they come up short again in 2022, how long will they have to wait next off-season for him to decide if he wants to retire or not like 4?
If we’re so concerned the franchise can’t find another qb, then maybe that says the front office isn’t any good. It’s time to say good bye and thank him for all the cool regular season stats.
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::)
https://twitter.com/AaronRodgers12/status/1501282463632568322?s=20&t=FbNDXmmBq-i-BeC_VKePKQ
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the pack has at least one more year to "hope" as opposed to what most other teams do not have. if we had jordan love, we have no hope. that's a lost season. yeah, i guess it sucks to be the best team in the NFL only to lose in 1st or 2nd round, but still have that chance most other teams don't. i'll go with the former every day
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I'd be surprised if Seattle sees Lock as their longtime answer at QB. He's the least valuable asset they received in this deal.
But they get two good starters (Fant and Harris) and the #9 and #40 picks in the upcoming draft, which should mean two more young starters if they don't mess it up.
Then they get Denver's first two picks in 2023. Russ is great and all, but the AFC West is going to be a murderer's row next year, so those easily could be a top 20 and a top 50 pick, or better ... and hence two more young starters if Seattle picks well.
That's a heck of a start to what was an inevitable rebuilding process. As has been noted, Seattle likely wasn't going to win with Russ anyhow.
Stroud or Young may be franchise QBs when/if they come out next year, but it is doubtful Seattle will be bad enough this year to be in position to get either. So they are getting a good young piece in Fant and 4 high picks, but not a QB to tie it together. They will be able to re-build an awful defense, but it will be like watching the Bears on offense.
Still, a great trade for both teams.
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::)
https://twitter.com/AaronRodgers12/status/1501282463632568322?s=20&t=FbNDXmmBq-i-BeC_VKePKQ
He hasn't signed yet. When he does, Schefter will be the first to announce it with the actual terms of the deal.
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Since Peyton Manning retired in 2015, Denver has had the following QBs:
Trevor Siemian
Paxton Lynch
Brock Osweiler
Case Keenum
Drew Lock
Joe Flacco
Brandon Allen
Jeff Driskel
Brett Rypien
Teddy Bridgewater
That could be Seattle for the next half dozen years.
The Athletic gave a B+ grade to Denver and a D to Seattle. Maybe a little harsh, but of the 20 teams that have made the championship round in the last five years, 18 (90%) had an offense that finished in the top quarter (8th or better) in Football Outsiders’ DVOA metric. I don't expect Seattle to do that for several years.
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The Jordan Love pick worked out beautifully.
jsonline agrees with you
In the two seasons since general manager Brian Gutekunst stunned the NFL by trading up to select Love in the first round of the 2020 draft, Aaron Rodgers has returned to MVP form and now is on the verge of signing a contract extension with the Packers.
How many first-round picks can say they’ve had that kind of impact on their team? Because to think the Love pick had nothing to do with Rodgers’ play ignores basic human nature. Rodgers wanted to put himself back in the driver’s seat and stick it to Gutekunst from the moment the GM drafted Love. The only way to do that was to play great football.
This was Tom Brady-Jimmy Garoppolo all over again.
“As for the narrative Love was a wasted a pick, I disagree,” a former GM in the league said Tuesday. “That pick totally refocused and refreshed Rodgers as a player and as a competitor.”
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Since Peyton Manning retired in 2015, Denver has had the following QBs:
Trevor Siemian
Paxton Lynch
Brock Osweiler
Case Keenum
Drew Lock
Joe Flacco
Brandon Allen
Jeff Driskel
Brett Rypien
Teddy Bridgewater
That could be Seattle for the next half dozen years.
The Athletic gave a B+ grade to Denver and a D to Seattle. Maybe a little harsh, but of the 20 teams that have made the championship round in the last five years, 18 (90%) had an offense that finished in the top quarter (8th or better) in Football Outsiders’ DVOA metric. I don't expect Seattle to do that for several years.
It’s a good thing Seattle drafted Russell Wilson in the 3rd round. The GOAT was a 6th round pick.
Mahomes and Allen had as many questions as answers when they were drafted.
Seattle shedded an overpriced QB and can begin a rebuild. Smart to cut bait instead of keeping around a QB for nostalgia sake
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jsonline agrees with you
In the two seasons since general manager Brian Gutekunst stunned the NFL by trading up to select Love in the first round of the 2020 draft, Aaron Rodgers has returned to MVP form and now is on the verge of signing a contract extension with the Packers.
How many first-round picks can say they’ve had that kind of impact on their team? Because to think the Love pick had nothing to do with Rodgers’ play ignores basic human nature. Rodgers wanted to put himself back in the driver’s seat and stick it to Gutekunst from the moment the GM drafted Love. The only way to do that was to play great football.
This was Tom Brady-Jimmy Garoppolo all over again.
“As for the narrative Love was a wasted a pick, I disagree,” a former GM in the league said Tuesday. “That pick totally refocused and refreshed Rodgers as a player and as a competitor.”
This is a brilliant take.
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Stroud or Young may be franchise QBs when/if they come out next year, but it is doubtful Seattle will be bad enough this year to be in position to get either. So they are getting a good young piece in Fant and 4 high picks, but not a QB to tie it together. They will be able to re-build an awful defense, but it will be like watching the Bears on offense.
Still, a great trade for both teams.
Seattle may not be bad enough next year to get a top 3 pick, but thanks to this trade they'll have the draft capital to move up and get one of those picks.
Then again, they might be bad enough to get a top 3 pick on their own. NFC West is tough and the Seahawks have to play the AFC West next year, which is probably 4 losses.
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Seattle may not be bad enough next year to get a top 3 pick, but thanks to this trade they'll have the draft capital to move up and get one of those picks.
Then again, they might be bad enough to get a top 3 pick on their own. NFC West is tough and the Seahawks have to play the AFC West next year, which is probably 4 losses.
They also get the NFC South, Detroit, and both NYC teams.
I do wonder if they’ll try to move Metcalf. He’ll be in the final year of his rookie deal and I’m not sure what his trade value will be based on him needing a new contract. Vegas would be an interesting landing spot for Metcalf.
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I do wonder if they’ll try to move Metcalf. He’ll be in the final year of his rookie deal and I’m not sure what his trade value will be based on him needing a new contract. Vegas would be an interesting landing spot for Metcalf
Metcalf might be one of the players worth keeping, given his age. Lockett would seem the guy Seattle would want to deal.
That said, any trade for Metcalf might need to be predicated on having an extension in place. Not sure Seattle could get value for him otherwise.
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Carson Wentz to the
Football Team Commanders for two third-round picks.
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Great deal for the Colts. Wentz is awful.
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“As for the narrative Love was a wasted a pick, I disagree,” a former GM in the league said Tuesday. “That pick totally refocused and refreshed Rodgers as a player and as a competitor.”
Yep, all the Packers had to do was trade up to draft a bad QB so that the guy they were paying tens of millions of dollars to could be refocused and refreshed enough to choke in the playoffs again.
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Yep, all the Packers had to do was trade up to draft a bad QB so that the guy they were paying tens of millions of dollars to could be refocused and refreshed enough to choke in the playoffs again.
Haters gonna hate.
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Haters gonna hate.
He’s not wrong
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https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1502038653366939661?t=E2oRJSJawm2uNPGMxoS9qw&s=19
Bears trading Mack.
Whoa
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https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1502038653366939661?t=E2oRJSJawm2uNPGMxoS9qw&s=19
Bears trading Mack.
Whoa
2nd and 6th round pick. Like this move for the Bears
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Not shocked on the Mack trade, this was going to be his last season in Chicago, Bears got something for him. They’ll carry $24 mil in dead cap on Mack, but it’ll actually create $6 million in cap space.
Loved the trade with Oakland when it happened, didn’t pan out, but still think it was a shot worth taking.
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2nd and 6th round pick. Like this move for the Bears
They need draft picks bad. Like the move.
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Good move for the Bears. Mack was not going to be a key piece to the next good Bears team so better to recoup some assets now.
Now could Quinn also be on the move?
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They need draft picks bad. Like the move.
They weren’t re-signing him. I’m sure a lot of people think they didn’t get enough but I’m not sure what his market was/is.
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They weren’t re-signing him. I’m sure a lot of people think they didn’t get enough but I’m not sure what his market was/is.
He was still under contract through 2024.
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Good move for the Bears. Mack was not going to be a key piece to the next good Bears team so better to recoup some assets now.
Now could Quinn also be on the move?
Quinn’s contract is very reasonable. I get that he’s 32, but I’d expect if they do move him, they’d get a slightly better return than on Mack.
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He was still under contract through 2024.
I see that. I mis-read something elsewhere. Still think it was the right move long term
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I see that. I mis-read something elsewhere. Still think it was the right move long term
It was absolutely the right move. Love Mack and hope he does well for the Chargers but he was not going to be a big contributor when (if) the Bears are good again. Plus he's older, declining and recently injury prone. No complaints from me on the move.
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Quinn’s contract is very reasonable. I get that he’s 32, but I’d expect if they do move him, they’d get a slightly better return than on Mack.
Here's what would worry me about Quinn:
2016 - 4 sacks
2017 - 8.5 sacks
2018 - 6.5 sacks
2019 - 11.5 sacks
2020 - 2 sacks
2021 - 18.5 sacks
He's had a real hard time putting together back-to-back seasons since 2013-14.
Anyhow, while it's far from his fault, hard to look at the Mack trade as anything but a failure for the Bears. They gave up two firsts and handed him $91 million over four years and didn't win a single playoff game.
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Here's what would worry me about Quinn:
2016 - 4 sacks
2017 - 8.5 sacks
2018 - 6.5 sacks
2019 - 11.5 sacks
2020 - 2 sacks
2021 - 18.5 sacks
He's had a real hard time putting together back-to-back seasons since 2013-14.
Anyhow, while it's far from his fault, hard to look at the Mack trade as anything but a failure for the Bears. They gave up two firsts and handed him $91 million over four years and didn't win a single playoff game.
Yup
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Here's what would worry me about Quinn:
2016 - 4 sacks
2017 - 8.5 sacks
2018 - 6.5 sacks
2019 - 11.5 sacks
2020 - 2 sacks
2021 - 18.5 sacks
He's had a real hard time putting together back-to-back seasons since 2013-14.
Anyhow, while it's far from his fault, hard to look at the Mack trade as anything but a failure for the Bears. They gave up two firsts and handed him $91 million over four years and didn't win a single playoff game.
Yeah, it didn’t work out, but I still don’t mind that Pace made that move at the time.
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Yeah, it didn’t work out, but I still don’t mind that Pace made that move at the time.
Yup. It was a very un-Bears move that I liked.
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Anyhow, while it's far from his fault, hard to look at the Mack trade as anything but a failure for the Bears. They gave up two firsts and handed him $91 million over four years and didn't win a single playoff game.
Yet another infuriating footnote from the Pace/Nagy era. The trade/contract was good. Mack did everything he was advertised to, especially early on, but they just didn't have the comprehensive team for it to matter.
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Yeah, it didn’t work out, but I still don’t mind that Pace made that move at the time.
You make a move like that when you think you're one star player away from contending.
Easy to say in hindsight, of course, but Pace obviously misjudged how close the Bears were to contending.
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You make a move like that when you think you're one star player away from contending.
Easy to say in hindsight, of course, but Pace obviously misjudged how close the Bears were to contending.
Pace misjudged a lot of things.....
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Yeah, it didn’t work out, but I still don’t mind that Pace made that move at the time.
My first thought was that this shows how much of a colossal failure the trade was. But after reading your posts, I agree that it was a risk worth taking and at the time a bold move.
Sometimes I forget that hindsight is 20/20...but doesn't mean a decision at the time was a bad one.
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Not shocked on the Mack trade, this was going to be his last season in Chicago, Bears got something for him. They’ll carry $24 mil in dead cap on Mack, but it’ll actually create $6 million in cap space.
Loved the trade with Oakland when it happened, didn’t pan out, but still think it was a shot worth taking.
Agree on all counts. With the Bears moving to a 4-3, Mack was a not a fit moving forward.
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Agree on all counts. With the Bears moving to a 4-3, Mack was a not a fit moving forward.
He was DPOY in a 4-3 in Oakland.
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He was DPOY in a 4-3 in Oakland.
Doesn't mean he was a good fit in the Colts scheme which is very much stop the rush first. In the Bears 3-4 his value was as a pass rusher. Can Smith convert to be a MLB? Can an aging Mack convert to a Will LB in that scheme? Not so much imo. Worth the trade thus.
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Doesn't mean he was a good fit in the Colts scheme which is very much stop the rush first. In the Bears 3-4 his value was as a pass rusher. Can Smith convert to be a MLB? Can an aging Mack convert to a Will LB in that scheme? Not so much imo. Worth the trade thus.
From what I've read many think Smith fits best at the Will in Eberflus' defense.
Mack wasn't an incomplete player....he was also good against the run and I think he would have been fine in the 4-3. Still the right move to trade him now while he had value and you can gain assets and cap space.
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Doesn't mean he was a good fit in the Colts scheme which is very much stop the rush first. In the Bears 3-4 his value was as a pass rusher. Can Smith convert to be a MLB? Can an aging Mack convert to a Will LB in that scheme? Not so much imo. Worth the trade thus.
I'm not knocking the trade, just the idea that Mack has scheme limitations.
Justin Houston, a similar but older and lesser player, had success in 2019 and 2020 as a hand-in-the-dirt DE in the Colts' 4-3.
And, as Vander mentioned, Mack is an elite run-stopper.
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I'm not knocking the trade, just the idea that Mack has scheme limitations.
Justin Houston, a similar but older and lesser player, had success in 2019 and 2020 as a hand-in-the-dirt DE in the Colts' 4-3.
And, as Vander mentioned, Mack is an elite run-stopper.
The Will plays between the tackle and the guard. I don't see that as Mack's strength or more so, value (good point Vander on it being Smith's).
More so, the Bears obviously didn't think Mack was the best fit either as they traded him (the Sam linebacker usually comes out in the Nickel). Staley is a Fangio protégée with the 3-4 and in fact was Mack's coach with the 2018 Bears (his best Bears' season).
In any regard, glad the Bears were able to get good value for a guy who has been pretty banged up. I think we can all agree he was elite.
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The Will plays between the tackle and the guard. I don't see that as Mack's strength or more so, value (good point Vander on it being Smith's).
Maybe we're talking past each other at this point, but I don't think Mack is a WILL in a 4-3. I think he's a 9 tech DE, which is basically what he played in Oakland.
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Maybe we're talking past each other at this point, but I don't think Mack is a WILL in a 4-3. I think he's a 9 tech DE, which is basically what he played in Oakland.
Agree. I was arguing fit in the Colts system and the only spot I could see for him was Will which is not a fit. Fangio more than Pagano played Mack as that pass rusher and blitzed a lot more. I thought Pagano wasted Mack's talent.
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Bears will have $158 million in cap space going into next off season (that’ll change based on what they do this year, but I don’t expect them to spend big). They’ll also create $17 mil next March when they release Eddie Jackson and Eddie Goldman.
Be interesting to see what Poles philosophy will be, especially with what type of extension they offer to Roquan Smith.
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Bears will have $158 million in cap space going into next off season (that’ll change based on what they do this year, but I don’t expect them to spend big). They’ll also create $17 mil next March when they release Eddie Jackson and Eddie Goldman.
Be interesting to see what Poles philosophy will be, especially with what type of extension they offer to Roquan Smith.
https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1502379374548561923?t=1m3TGF0SRPbM-KLGIpc6sQ&s=19
Bears releasing Goldman today
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https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1502379374548561923?t=1m3TGF0SRPbM-KLGIpc6sQ&s=19
Bears releasing Goldman today
Yeah, heard that just now. Was going to happen either this year or next, not surprising.
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Deshaun Watson cleared of all criminal charges
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Good to see Schefter being a stooge again. Only been a couple of weeks.
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Good to see Schefter being a stooge again. Only been a couple of weeks.
Schefter is simply a mouthpiece for Goodell and the owners. When they want info put out, they leak it to him.
Same as MLB does for Jeff Passan. Rosenthal used to be that guy - until he actually started wring what he saw.
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Schefter is simply a mouthpiece for Goodell and the owners. When they want info put out, they leak it to him.
Same as MLB does for Jeff Passan. Rosenthal used to be that guy - until he actually started wring what he saw.
Passan is a players writer. He is most definitely not an owners or league guy
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Bears cut Cohen too
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Deshaun Watson cleared of all criminal charges
dodged 22 legal bullets eyn'a?
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Schefter is simply a mouthpiece for Goodell and the owners. When they want info put out, they leak it to him.
Same as MLB does for Jeff Passan. Rosenthal used to be that guy - until he actually started wring what he saw.
MLB owners criticize Passan for usually taking the players’ side.
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Dallas trading Amari Cooper to the Browns for a 5th round pick.
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Deshaun Watson cleared of all criminal charges
I've read a half-dozen articles since this happened, and all 6 mention the Panthers prominently as a landing site.
Panthers owner David Tepper has been high on Watson since before there were any charges against Watson. He also was vocal about cleaning up the franchise's image; the team was sold only because the previous owner was basically fired by the league for being a sexual deviant.
Plus, numerous advanced offensive-line metrics indicate that the Panthers have one of the 3 worst lines in the league. They are expected to address that in the draft and free agency ... unless they trade all their first-round pick in this and future drafts for Watson, whose $35M/year contract also would use up much of their cap space.
Plus the Panthers have no second- or third-round picks this year, so if they trade their first for Watson, they have little chance to draft a lineman who'll be any good. And if they pay Watson, it's hard to see how they'll pay a lineman.
Plus, Watson has a no-trade clause and in the past has vetoed Carolina as a destination.
Plus there are still 22 civil suits outstanding against Watson. And the league could still suspend him.
And then there's the fact that in Watson's best season, the Texans were still 4-12. Turns out that even a standout QB can't rescue a horrid team.
As much as I want the Panthers to have an elite QB, if I put all that together it's hard for me to be excited about a deal for Watson.
Maybe they figure out a way to keep this year's draft pick (#6 overall) to draft a lineman. And maybe they figure out a way to restructure Watson's contract and/or to dump Darnold's $19M salary to open cap space. All after maybe they convince Watson to waive his no-trade clause.
Wow ... that's a lot of maybes.
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Great reasoning for GB signing Rodgers.
Beats being the Panthers, Jets, Bears, Giants, Commanders, etc.
Yet that is what many Packers’ fans want.
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Brady unretires.
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Brady unretires.
Awesome
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Shortest retirement ever?
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Shut up and throw da fookin' ball, hey?
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Spent a month being a full-time dad and said, “When’s minicamp?”
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I never thought Brady wanted to retire. Seemed like the Missus was pushing it .
With the higher salary cap can Tampa reload with some new talent to surround Brady. Obviously , Gronk will come back now.
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Spent a month being a full-time dad and said, “When’s minicamp?”
Meh, spent 6 weeks loading up on PEDs for recovery and added strength, without having to worry about being tested. When the short acting drugs dropped below testable levels, signed back up for another season.
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70% of Panthers fans surveyed by The Athletic do not want the team to pursue Watson.
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70% of Panthers fans surveyed by The Athletic do not want the team to pursue Watson.
So 30% of Panther fans are looking forward to supporting a creep who sexually assaults women.
And Packers fans turn on ARod cuz he’s a needy diva? A crazy world, man.
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Steelers signing the NVP, aka Mitch Trubisky.
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Christian Kirk got PAID.
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Christian Kirk got PAID.
Just beat me to this.
Somewhere, Davante Adams is making plans to buy a few more mansions.
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Adams really isn’t gonna want to play for the Packers now.
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DT Larry Ogunjobi to the Bears, 3/$40.5.
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JC Jackson to the Chargers, that defense could be really good.
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Christian Kirk’s deal is essentially 2 years/$39 million.
I’d have big concerns if I were a Packer fan about Adams. There’s a 1% chance he plays on the tag this year. When the tag number is what Christian F’n Kirk is getting, that’s a big problem.
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Christian Kirk’s deal is essentially 2 years/$39 million.
I’d have big concerns if I were a Packer fan about Adams. There’s a 1% chance he plays on the tag this year. When the tag number is what Christian F’n Kirk is getting, that’s a big problem.
Haha - does Rodgers pull a reverse Brady if they can't find a way to extend Adams?
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Rodgers isn’t signed but Packers are moving again. Getting Campbell back is huge, also re-signing Preston Smith.
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DT Larry Ogunjobi to the Bears, 3/$40.5.
Can't really explain this one. You're trying to dump salary, so you spend a lot on a DT that is a good player but is just 'fine'
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So 30% of Panther fans are looking forward to supporting a creep who sexually assaults women.
And Packers fans turn on ARod cuz he’s a needy diva? A crazy world, man.
I guess that's one way to look at it.
FWIW, I'm part of the 70%.
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About 24 hours before Tom Brady unretired, somebody paid like $580K for the football he threw his last touchdown with.
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About 24 hours before Tom Brady unretired, somebody paid like $580K for the football he threw his last touchdown with.
I could see Tom being the seller (or using a straw seller) just to squeeze every last drop of juice outta the retirement orange too.
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About 24 hours before Tom Brady unretired, somebody paid like $580K for the football he threw his last a touchdown with.
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Kirk Cousins does it again get another fully guaranteed extension . This time for $35 million.
https://vikingswire.usatoday.com/2022/03/16/kirk-cousins-michael-jordan-contract-negotiations/
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Kirk Cousins does it again get another fully guaranteed extension . This time for $35 million.
https://vikingswire.usatoday.com/2022/03/16/kirk-cousins-michael-jordan-contract-negotiations/
Good.
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Happy for Allen Robinson, good dude, really good player in some mediocre/bad offenses around him. Gets paid and goes to a great situation for him.
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Happy for Allen Robinson, good dude, really good player in some mediocre/bad offenses around him. Gets paid and goes to a great situation for him.
Totally agree. He's gonna put up BIG numbers as the number #2 behind Kupp.
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Bye Davante
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Bye Davante
AFC West is going to be nuts.
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Why pay Rodgers
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Why pay Rodgers
Because an elite QB is WWWWWWWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYY better than having an elite WR.
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Because an elite QB is WWWWWWWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYY better than having an elite WR.
Sure, but why give your notoriously mercurial elite QB $50 million a year and then not surround him with the pieces needed to win a championship and keep him happy?
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Hate to see him go - but you can't pay everyone.
I'd much rather have Jaire & Elgton re-sign than Adams (mainly because of age).
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I thought Vegas would trade for a stud WR, but thought it would be DK Metcalf.
Once Kirk signed his ridiculous contract, it was the end of the end of Adams in Green Bay. There was no way they could pay him and Rodgers in the neighborhood of $75-$80 million this year and next.
It would be hilarious if Green Bay drafted a QB with the first round pick acquired from Vegas.
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Adams' new contract = $141.25M over 5 years.
Of course, what really counts is what's guaranteed.
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Rapaport reporting that Rodgers knew. Confusing times. Can't wait for WR1 Cole Beasley
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https://twitter.com/RobDemovsky/status/1504606438425088003?t=FkGj4mRtyQadkatQjYlE1g&s=19
Adams wanted out. Qaron knew all along
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Congrats on everyone getting paid. Would have been nice to let someone else absorb a 70m dead cap hit under the circumstances
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Sure, but why give your notoriously mercurial elite QB $50 million a year and then not surround him with the pieces needed to win a championship and keep him happy?
Apparently the Packers don't believe that signing Adams to a monsterous contract is necessary to win a championship.
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Apparently the Packers don't believe that signing Adams to a monsterous contract is necessary to win a championship.
They are incorrect.
I will say, Rodgers will likely avoid a lot of bad tendencies (that often ended in glorious ways) without Adams
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They are incorrect.
Well I trust Gutey more than you when it comes to that opinion.
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Apparently the Packers don't believe that signing Adams to a monsterous contract is necessary to win a championship.
Apparently they do, since they reportedly were willing to give Adams the same deal.
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Apparently they do, since they reportedly were willing to give Adams the same deal.
So then your beef shouldn't be with the Packers.
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Need to understand all the elements of the trade .
https://clutchpoints.com/raiders-news-packers-trade-davante-adams-to-las-vegas-in-blockbuster-deal/
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So then your beef shouldn't be with the Packers.
I mean, there's a reason why Adams didn't want to take the Packers money, right?
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Well I trust Gutey more than you when it comes to that opinion.
Gutsy is reaching Detroit levels of pissing off generational talents.
Rodgers very well could be a better pure system QB without Adams, but there is no world in which this version of the Packers is better.
Proof will obviously be in what they do with the capital, but the odds are against them striking gold
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Apparently the Packers don't believe that signing Adams to a monsterous contract is necessary to win a championship.
NM
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Other than getting da bread, I think Adams fooked himself over. He'll be just another guy with someone other than #12 tossin' 'im da pigskin. And, I know Carr and he were teammates in college, aina?
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Gutsy is reaching Detroit levels of pissing off generational talents.
Yeah, the GM who has gotten them to NFCCG in two of the last three years, and the #1 seed in the last two, is just like Detroit's.
Great comparison.
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Apparently they do, since they reportedly were willing to give Adams the same deal.
There’s 0% chance they were willing to give him that same contract. You know it as well as I do. Green Bay & national media is going to be dizzy from the spin the Packers are throwing out there.
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I mean, there's a reason why Adams didn't want to take the Packers money, right?
Sure. But neither you nor I know what those reasons are.
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Sure. But neither you nor I know what those reasons are.
In the last year, Adams went from saying he wanted to remain in Green Bay to wanting out. And that 12 months coincided with the Packers' front office dicking around with him on a long-term deal
Could these things be related? We'll never know.
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In the last year, Adams went from saying he wanted to remain in Green Bay to wanting out. And that 12 months coincided with the Packers' front office dicking around with him on a long-term deal
Could these things be related? We'll never know.
You mean the long term deal that they apparently offered him? You are engaging in circular logic right now.
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You mean the long term deal that they apparently offered him? You are engaging in circular logic right now.
Not really.
Rather than extending him any time over the last year, they franchised him, after he'd said he wouldn't play under the tag.
Setting fire to bridges sometimes gets you burned.
But apparently a GM who has a history of alienating his star players deserves the benefit of the doubt here.
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Not really.
Rather than extending him any time over the last year, they franchised him, after he'd said he wouldn't play under the tag.
Setting fire to bridges sometimes gets you burned.
But apparently a GM who has a history of alienating his star players deserves the benefit of the doubt here.
"A history of alienating his star players?" Before this, he alienated one...who is still on the team. I am not sure what you wanted him to do. I mean, he offered to make him the highest paid WR ever right? But he turned him down, and went to a lesser team, because he got his feelings hurt? Well OK. I'm not blaming him for that.
Meanwhile he has overseen a team that needed to be rebuilt around Rodgers, and has completely done so.
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Congrats on dumbest post of the day.
Gutsy is reaching Detroit levels of pissing off generational talents.
Rodgers very well could be a better pure system QB without Adams, but there is no world in which this version of the Packers is better.
Proof will obviously be in what they do with the capital, but the odds are against them striking gold
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@RapSheet: Final thought (for now) on the Davante Adams trade: His agents Frank Bauer and Kenny Chapman confirm that the #Packers offered more money than the contract he’ll sign in Las Vegas.
Simply, it was his lifelong dream to be with the #Raiders.
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It doesn't bother me that Watson told the Panthers "thanks, but no thanks."
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@RapSheet: Final thought (for now) on the Davante Adams trade: His agents Frank Bauer and Kenny Chapman confirm that the #Packers offered more money than the contract he’ll sign in Las Vegas.
Simply, it was his lifelong dream to be with the #Raiders.
Well, fook 'im then, hey?
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@RapSheet: Final thought (for now) on the Davante Adams trade: His agents Frank Bauer and Kenny Chapman confirm that the #Packers offered more money than the contract he’ll sign in Las Vegas.
Simply, it was his lifelong dream to be with the #Raiders.
Somehow still Gutey’s fault?
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I thought the biggest issue with the contract talks through the season was deciding what top WR money was. Hopkins contract threw everything out of whack.
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@RapSheet: Final thought (for now) on the Davante Adams trade: His agents Frank Bauer and Kenny Chapman confirm that the #Packers offered more money than the contract he’ll sign in Las Vegas.
Simply, it was his lifelong dream to be with the #Raiders.
Lol, this is flat out wrong and a lie. The agents are trying to save face for the Packers because, well, they have other clients and GB is a business partner.
Simply put, Adams was on the non exclusive franchise tag. The MINIMUM the Packers are entitled to get are two first round picks if/when Adams signs an offer sheet with the contract terms the Raiders ended up offering and if they declined to match. If indeed the Packers were “willing to match” the Raiders contract, they absolutely could have!
Someone(s) are lying here. The Packers inexplicably traded Adams for 65 cents on the dollar when the Raiders/NFL were handing them $1, no questions asked.
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Somehow still Gutey’s fault?
Pretty much. Per Rob Demovsky on ESPN this morning, by the time the Packers decided they were willing to match the Raiders' offers, Adams' frustration level with the organization had reached the point where he just wanted to move on.
Also Gutey's fault, as Dish notes, the Packers could have forced the Raiders to submit an offer sheet and then either match the offer or extract two first-round picks from Vegas. Instead, they accepted less that what they were entitled.
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Somehow still Gutey’s fault?
Yes.
Look, two things can be true.
Gutey is a good talent evaluator and a good roster constructor.
AND
He has managed to alienate the two best players that have come thru Green Bay in the past decade plus. One he had to pay and mortgage the future to retain. The other one he shipped out for less value than he was entitled to. As Dish said, the Packers had the leverage - do you think he was going to sit out his age 30 season? There was a decent chance they'd have tagged him next year too for a 20% bump. Even less leverage for Davante.
You can reframe the team so the identity is not solely Rodgers to Adams, but there is no world in which the Packers are better. They had no WRs that could get open despite Adams consistently being double teamed. Now what? You're playing the lottery with the draft to think you'll find anyone close over the next 2-3 seasons.
If your purported goal is Super Bowl, I don't see a way to reconcile this move with keeping Rodgers. Burn it all down and put all your chips in the lottery if a divisional title is your highest goal.
TL;DR the Packers will still win the North easily but who cares?
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Pretty much. Per Rob Demovsky on ESPN this morning, by the time the Packers decided they were willing to match the Raiders' offers, Adams' frustration level with the organization had reached the point where he just wanted to move on.
Also Gutey's fault, as Dish notes, the Packers could have forced the Raiders to submit an offer sheet and then either match the offer or extract two first-round picks from Vegas. Instead, they accepted less that what they were entitled.
If the additional 1st round pick would be 2023, maybe the Pack decided they'd rather have the 2nd round pick this year because it's more valuable for them going for it immediately.
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DT Larry Ogunjobi to the Bears, 3/$40.5.
Except the cat failed his physical.
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If the additional 1st round pick would be 2023, maybe the Pack decided they'd rather have the 2nd round pick this year because it's more valuable for them going for it immediately.
That's my take as well. Packers could go OL, DL, and two WR in the first two rounds.
I wouldn't be surprised to see the Packers combine a 3rd with the Raiders pick to move up, if there's a player they really want to get.
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Except the cat failed his physical.
Eh, whatever. At least the front office was transparent about it and proactive.
Not like the Bears we’re gonna win anything anyways.
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If the additional 1st round pick would be 2023, maybe the Pack decided they'd rather have the 2nd round pick this year because it's more valuable for them going for it immediately.
They could be thinking that, but if so, it's a terrible decision, value wise.
Using the draft value chart, the two picks the Packers are getting combine to have the value of a 13th overall pick.
Even if the Raiders win the AFC next year- a longshot- the two firsts would be values at the 8th overall pick. If the Raiders finish something like 10-7, then it's worth around the 6th/7th overall.
And that's not mentioning the benefit of a 5th year option on both picks.
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Pretty much. Per Rob Demovsky on ESPN this morning, by the time the Packers decided they were willing to match the Raiders' offers, Adams' frustration level with the organization had reached the point where he just wanted to move on.
Also Gutey's fault, as Dish notes, the Packers could have forced the Raiders to submit an offer sheet and then either match the offer or extract two first-round picks from Vegas. Instead, they accepted less that what they were entitled.
Or, as others have stated, they wanted the current second round pick instead of next year's first.
But anyway, the first paragraph doesn't make a lot of sense. If the Packer's wanted to match the Raiders, they could have regardless of what Adams' wanted. He would hardly be the first player tagged who is "frustrated" with the organization that tags them. That is pretty common pretty much every year in the NFL.
We will see what happens. My guess is that Adams doesn't live up to that contract pretty much like most receivers that sign big time deals.
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GB could very well trade for a vet. Lockett or Metcalfe jump to mind as prime examples. Seattle needs draft picks to rebuild. Also sign a vet if they can get a guy like Landry or Ju Ju cheap. One of the 1st 2 picks will be a WR. Olave is my best guess.
I also predict GB will rate higher offensively this coming year than they did last year. Not a knock on Adams -just a much more diversified offense.
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GB could very well trade for a vet. Lockett or Metcalfe jump to mind as prime examples. Seattle needs draft picks to rebuild. Also sign a vet if they can get a guy like Landry or Ju Ju cheap. One of the 1st 2 picks will be a WR. Olave is my best guess.
I also predict GB will rate higher offensively this coming year than they did last year. Not a knock on Adams -just a much more diversified offense.
Yeah, Rodgers won’t be able to lock onto Adams in clutch situations and maybe he’ll choke less
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Yeah, Rodgers won’t be able to lock onto Adams in clutch situations and maybe he’ll choke less
Yup. Adams was a crutch in the clutch.
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Watson to the Browns and they're giving him $230 million guaranteed.
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Watson to the Browns and they're giving him $230 million guaranteed.
Your move, Vikings
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Watson to the Browns and they're giving him $230 million guaranteed.
Wow. I gotta say I'm happy he won't be in the NFC South.
What an interesting story, and an interesting development.
I haven't followed the Browns enough to know how good or bad Mayfield has been. From the few Clev games I've seen, the highlights/lowlights, the stats and the standings, he's been disappointing.
If healthy, can he be the catalyst for a winning team or is he just not good enough?
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Wow. I gotta say I'm happy he won't be in the NFC South.
What an interesting story, and an interesting development.
I haven't followed the Browns enough to know how good or bad Mayfield has been. From the few Clev games I've seen, the highlights/lowlights, the stats and the standings, he's been disappointing.
If healthy, can he be the catalyst for a winning team or is he just not good enough?
Mayfield was solid, not great, two years ago. He was terrible last year, but also injured.
He can he had for cheap. But after the Sam Darnold Experiment, do the Panthers want to try that path again?
Good for Cleveland going all in, I guess, but does Watson make them better than anyone in the AFC West or the Bills?
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Joe Burrow and Justin Herbert are going to get half a billion guaranteed combined between the two of them in 2024.
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The Giants will still suck; the Jets too.
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The Giants will still suck; the Jets too.
And my Bears too. They are at best 2 maybe 3 years away from being decent.
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Adams contract details are out. If I’m a Packer fan, I’d stop reading this now.
5 years/$140, which is really 3/$67 ($66 guaranteed)
2022 cap hit $8
2023 cap hit $30
2024 cap hit $21
Two years of fluff at more than manageable dead cap hits (7.7 in 25 and 3.8 in 26).
That’s a fantastic contract for Vegas.
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Adams contract details are out. If I’m a Packer fan, I’d stop reading this now.
5 years/$140, which is really 3/$67 ($66 guaranteed)
2022 cap hit $8
2023 cap hit $30
2024 cap hit $21
Two years of fluff at more than manageable dead cap hits (7.7 in 25 and 3.8 in 26).
That’s a fantastic contract for Vegas.
I’ve been assured by Packers fans the Raiders will regret this trade
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I’ve been assured by Packers fans the Raiders will regret this trade
The Packers cooled on him? Probably can't cut it academically.
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Adams contract details are out. If I’m a Packer fan, I’d stop reading this now.
5 years/$140, which is really 3/$67 ($66 guaranteed)
2022 cap hit $8
2023 cap hit $30
2024 cap hit $21
Two years of fluff at more than manageable dead cap hits (7.7 in 25 and 3.8 in 26).
That’s a fantastic contract for Vegas.
You see, there was simply no way to fit it under the cap
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Is a possible explanation here that Adams was sick of the Aaron Rodgers circus, and didn’t want to play for the Packers again (even if it meant a QB downgrade) but that isn’t all Guteys fault? That still leaves open the question of why Gutey took less than the two first rounders as comp, but maybe it was to facilitate getting Adams to where he wanted to go? Charitable, I know, but it doesn’t seem dramatically less likely than the explanation that Adams was mad at Gutey for doing what all GMs do.
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Is a possible explanation here that Adams was sick of the Aaron Rodgers circus, and didn’t want to play for the Packers again (even if it meant a QB downgrade) but that isn’t all Guteys fault? That still leaves open the question of why Gutey took less than the two first rounders as comp, but maybe it was to facilitate getting Adams to where he wanted to go? Charitable, I know, but it doesn’t seem dramatically less likely than the explanation that Adams was mad at Gutey for doing what all GMs do.
Getting a first and second this year, versus firsts in consecutive years, was likely the motivation. I just don’t understand that if the contract was that friendly why the Packers just didn’t match? Maybe they thought that it wasn’t worth it anyway? More money and picks for the defense?
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Getting a first and second this year, versus firsts in consecutive years, was likely the motivation. I just don’t understand that if the contract was that friendly why the Packers just didn’t match? Maybe they thought that it wasn’t worth it anyway? More money and picks for the defense?
They knew Adams had zero desire to be in Green Bay anymore
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They knew Adams had zero desire to be in Green Bay anymore
Which makes me wonder if the personal connection with Rodgers wasn’t as advertised.
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Which makes me wonder if the personal connection with Rodgers wasn’t as advertised.
That's what I mean. To me this feels like Adams knew he had a good thing going on the field, especially in a contract year, and is a professional so he just bit his lip and said all the right things. But when it came time to get his and set up the rest of his career, he wanted to move on. I wouldn't be shocked if this is coming as a big dose of humble pie to Rodgers too, who probably assumed that if he kept feeding Davante and re-signed, that Davante would re-sign too so long as the Packers found the money.
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Which makes me wonder if the personal connection with Rodgers wasn’t as advertised.
Maybe? Adams is also 29 and if he truly wanted to play with the Raiders and Carr, this was his best opportunity to do so when still in his prime.
People always mocks players who decide not to play with Rodgers, but it worked out for OBJ
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Maybe? Adams is also 29 and if he truly wanted to play with the Raiders and Carr, this was his best opportunity to do so when still in his prime.
People always mocks players who decide not to play with Rodgers, but it worked out for OBJ
I’m not mocking him. I’m just surprised.
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I’m not mocking him. I’m just surprised.
That wasn’t directed at you
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I think Davante didn’t want to freeze his butt off any more in Green Bay
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I think Davante didn’t want to freeze his butt off any more in Green Bay
i think that's absolutely a factor. It's not for everyone
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Matt Ryan to the Colts for a 3rd.
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Matt Ryan to the Colts for a 3rd.
Outside of a few teams, the NFC quickly is becoming the NFL's version of AAA ball.
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Jameis re-signing with the Saints.
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Jameis re-signing with the Saints.
Congrats to Jameis for having more guaranteed money than his starting fullback.
Elsewhere in the division, Matt Ryan's trade has the largest dead cap hit of all time (Aaron Rodgers: Hold my Kombucha), so the Falcons save only $9M this year. Absolute malpractice that they did not line up a QB on this roster in lieu of Kyle Pitts - don't really care if he's the second coming of Tony Gonzales.
Jordan Love could be actually be a viable candidate - either he's good enough to keep you away from the 1st overall pick and you might have a QB OR you're in prime position to be Bad for Bryce, Yuck for Young, etc etc.
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Matt Ryan to the Colts for a 3rd.
I can't remember an offseason in recent memory with so much starting QB movement. Ryan, Wentz, Wilson, Watson, Mayfield upcoming most likely.
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Congrats to Jameis for having more guaranteed money than his starting fullback.
Elsewhere in the division, Matt Ryan's trade has the largest dead cap hit of all time (Aaron Rodgers: Hold my Kombucha), so the Falcons save only $9M this year. Absolute malpractice that they did not line up a QB on this roster in lieu of Kyle Pitts - don't really care if he's the second coming of Tony Gonzales.
Jordan Love could be actually be a viable candidate - either he's good enough to keep you away from the 1st overall pick and you might have a QB OR you're in prime position to be Bad for Bryce, Yuck for Young, etc etc.
Falcons just signed Marcus Mariota.
Hope they have a good Plan B, because Mariota hasn't been able stay healthy for 4+ years, even as a backup in Vegas.
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Falcons just signed Marcus Mariota.
Hope they have a good Plan B, because Mariota hasn't been able stay healthy for 4+ years, even as a backup in Vegas.
I'm assuming they are setting up to get Malik Willis, in which case I like what they are doing. Take their medicine on all this dead cap, get something back for Matt Ryan, bring in a guy who plays a smiliar style to Willis, and who presumably will be okay with playing a bridge role.
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I'm assuming they are setting up to get Malik Willis, in which case I like what they are doing. Take their medicine on all this dead cap, get something back for Matt Ryan, bring in a guy who plays a smiliar style to Willis, and who presumably will be okay with playing a bridge role.
This is the smart thing to do. They should not concern themselves with sucking this year. They should concern themselves with having a plan that involves sucking this year with an intermediate-term goal to stop sucking. And if you're going to take a wild swing, Willis is a good guy to bet on - crazy tools.
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Speaking of QBs, amusing story, my sister and BIL went to the Mavs game last night and got floor seats from a client of his. As part of the ticket, they had a lounge they went to during halftime. Also in the lounge last night happened to be Kyler Murray. After standing in line next to him to get a drink, she said him being listed as 5'10 is HYSTERICAL. A friend of theirs also in the lounge is 5'7 and she said Murray maybe had an inch on her, at best.
Not entirely surprising, cause I don't think anyone who has watched him thought he was anywhere near 6', but still funny to hear from a direct interaction nonetheless.
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Tyreke will get paid, but he makes the KC offense so much more dangerous with him. I don’t think if he’s a Jet or Dolphin, his impact won’t be the same.
I don’t like whatever potential trade goes down for either side.
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Packers should use the two picks they got from The Raiders and trade that for Tyreke . I assume the money that they offered Davante would be the same they would offer Tyreke.
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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33572293/sources-minnesota-vikings-land-olb-zadarius-smith-three-year-42-million-deal
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Tyreke to Dolphins for 5 draft picks
1, 2 and 3 round this year
4 and 6 in 2023
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Tyreke to Dolphins for 5 draft picks
1, 2 and 3 round this year
4 and 6 in 2023
Either the Packers or Dolphins got fleeced.
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Either the Packers or Dolphins got fleeced.
My thought immediately was the Packers really misread things with Adams on all accounts. KC got way more for Hill.
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Well, at least Adams was the top paid receiver for a few days. Is he going to go demand a raise now?
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Tyreke to Dolphins for 5 draft picks
1, 2 and 3 round this year
4 and 6 in 2023
JESUS WHAT THE HELL
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My thought immediately was the Packers really misread things with Adams on all accounts. KC got way more for Hill.
Aren’t the situations pretty different? Adams wasn’t under contract and wanted to go to the Raiders. Hill was still under contract and had two teams bidding for him.
Plus the first rounder the Packers got is 7 spots higher. Also, I think you are limited on the return for trading a guy that you tag.
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Aren’t the situations pretty different? Adams wasn’t under contract and wanted to go to the Raiders. Hill was still under contract and had two teams bidding for him.
Plus the first rounder the Packers got is 7 spots higher. Also, I think you are limited on the return for trading a guy that you tag.
The first rounder is 7 spots higher, but the second is three spots higher, then you're throwing in a third, fourth and sixth.
Per the draft value chart, the Dolphins gave up more draft capital just in the 2022 draft than the Raiders, not counting next year's picks.
As for the tag, that should have led to a better return (minimum two firsts) than what the Packers accepted.
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To me, no move this offseason was more fascinating than this Tyreke trade. I can understand why KC did it, but I would have waited until next off season (even if it meant I got a little less in return). I don't know if this will make sense, but as good a player as Hill is, to me he's 1.5x better because he's on KC and playing with Mahomes. The Chiefs offense isn't perfect, but with Hill & Kelce on the field at the same time, it's such a difficult time to game plan against them.
The Chiefs got a haul, and would have had a very difficult decision next year on what to do with Hill (I'd have franchised him for one year). I don't think Hill will be as durable as say Adams long term, and once Hill starts to slow down, that'll be the beginning of the end.
If I'm in the AFC West, I'm ecstatic right now. The Chiefs could draft a very good WR in the first round, but that rookie probably won't fit like Hill did (at least immediately) in that offense.
I'm really curious if the Packers had conversations with the Jets/Dolphins on Adams. Really curious.
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Either the Packers or Dolphins got fleeced.
According to the NFL Draft value chart, GB & Miami got virtually the same value back for Adams and Hill.
So, unless one thinks there is a huge difference between these guys value to their teams (and that value depends a lot on the cast of players around them), the trades really did not favor either teams.
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It will be interesting to see how effective davante will be with a quarterback with less ability than Rodgers throwing to him. Remember when Jenkins left the pack for the Vikings? His numbers (except for his contract $$’s)never came close to those he generated under favre
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It will be interesting to see how effective davante will be with a quarterback with less ability than Rodgers throwing to him. Remember when Jenkins left the pack for the Vikings? His numbers (except for his contract $$’s)never came close to those he generated under favre
Who?
I'm guessing you mean Greg Jennings? Who played his first 2 years with Favre, but spent much more time (and was more productive) with Rodgers.
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It will be interesting to see how effective davante will be with a quarterback with less ability than Rodgers throwing to him. Remember when Jenkins left the pack for the Vikings? His numbers (except for his contract $$’s)never came close to those he generated under favre
Adams wants a Super Bowl. He wasn’t getting that with Rodgers as his QB
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Adams wants a Super Bowl. He wasn’t getting that with Rodgers as his QB
If Adams wants a Super Bowl, Derek Carr is sure as hell not gonna take him there if Rodgers couldn't.
Yeah, I know it was a troll job, but I bit anyway.
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If Adams wants a Super Bowl, Derek Carr is sure as hell not gonna take him there if Rodgers couldn't.
Yeah, I know it was a troll job, but I bit anyway.
If Matthew Stafford, Nick Foles and Joe Flacco can win a Super Bowl, Derek Carr can win a Super Bowl. The guy dragged a team to the playoffs throwing the ball to Zay Jones, Hunter Renfrow and Foster Moreau.
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Who?
I'm guessing you mean Greg Jennings? Who played his first 2 years with Favre, but spent much more time (and was more productive) with Rodgers.
(https://wwwcache.wralsportsfan.com/asset/voices/2019/01/17/18131818/forget_it_he_s_rolling-DMID1-5hiej78ui-250x250.gif)
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According to the NFL Draft value chart, GB & Miami got virtually the same value back for Adams and Hill.
So, unless one thinks there is a huge difference between these guys value to their teams (and that value depends a lot on the cast of players around them), the trades really did not favor either teams.
Yep, trades almost identical in value if you assume that Miami is in the middle of the pack next year, discounted for time value of money.
I have no real problem in value, with the exception that I thought both teams should have gotten more. But it was consistent with similar leverage.
I would be fine with the Packers flipping both Raiders picks for Metcalf. They'll pay him too, but he's only 25 and going on his 2nd contract and he's dirt cheap this year to use that money elsewhere
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Yep, trades almost identical in value if you assume that Miami is in the middle of the pack next year, discounted for time value of money.
I have no real problem in value, with the exception that I thought both teams should have gotten more. But it was consistent with similar leverage.
I would be fine with the Packers flipping both Raiders picks for Metcalf. They'll pay him too, but he's only 25 and going on his 2nd contract and he's dirt cheap this year to use that money elsewhere
If we can pull that off, I think the Packers definitely win on those trades.
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Yep, trades almost identical in value if you assume that Miami is in the middle of the pack next year, discounted for time value of money.
I have no real problem in value, with the exception that I thought both teams should have gotten more. But it was consistent with similar leverage.
I would be fine with the Packers flipping both Raiders picks for Metcalf. They'll pay him too, but he's only 25 and going on his 2nd contract and he's dirt cheap this year to use that money elsewhere
I'd rather they traded for Lockett instead of Metcalfe. Way cheaper to keep with a reasonable salary for the next several years. Stats aren't a lot different and would cost a lot less to acquire (no 1st rounder). Money to keep Jaire is #1 right now.
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I'd rather they traded for Lockett instead of Metcalfe. Way cheaper to keep with a reasonable salary for the next several years. Stats aren't a lot different and would cost a lot less to acquire (no 1st rounder). Money to keep Jaire is #1 right now.
The age old looking up Lockett's age, and instead typing in trent lockett
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If Matthew Stafford, Nick Foles and Joe Flacco can win a Super Bowl, Derek Carr can win a Super Bowl. The guy dragged a team to the playoffs throwing the ball to Zay Jones, Hunter Renfrow and Foster Moreau.
The Raiders aren't coming out of the AFC West. It's the best division in football.
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Yep, trades almost identical in value if you assume that Miami is in the middle of the pack next year, discounted for time value of money.
I have no real problem in value, with the exception that I thought both teams should have gotten more. But it was consistent with similar leverage.
I would be fine with the Packers flipping both Raiders picks for Metcalf. They'll pay him too, but he's only 25 and going on his 2nd contract and he's dirt cheap this year to use that money elsewhere
A bit of a gamble considering he is a total head case.
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I'd rather they traded for Lockett instead of Metcalfe. Way cheaper to keep with a reasonable salary for the next several years. Stats aren't a lot different and would cost a lot less to acquire (no 1st rounder). Money to keep Jaire is #1 right now.
Yes, this is correct. Plus Metcalfe is a head case and would be a gamble. Draft the future number 1 receiver. I hope they don't piss away the first round picks.
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If we can pull that off, I think the Packers definitely win on those trades.
Davante Adams straight up for DK Metcalf is a win for the Packers?
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The Raiders aren't coming out of the AFC West. It's the best division in football.
Any team that goes 3-3 in that division, maybe even 2-4, has a chance at the playoffs.
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Article by Silverstein today that Adams let them know he wanted a trade to LV right after the season ended and they did their best to achieve that
Shortly after the season ended, he made it known that he wanted out and his desire was to play for the Las Vegas Raiders and quarterback Derek Carr, his former college teammate and close friend, a source said. The public didn’t know Adams was adamant about leaving for the team he cheered for while growing up in East Palo Alto, California. But it was no secret among Packers officials that Adams wanted out.
The Packers had a better offer on the table than from the summer – one source said it was $25 million per year over three years – but Adams, after speaking with Carr and Bauer, was adamant he wanted to move on. Specifically, he wanted to play for the Raiders.
As many have reported, Rodgers knew about Adams’ desire well before he signed his record-breaking $151 million extension. There wasn’t anything he could do about it. Undoubtedly, he wanted Adams to stay, but his priority was his own contract and he wound up doing what was best for him.
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JESUS WHAT THE HELL
This was my reaction too.
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Any team that goes 3-3 in that division, maybe even 2-4, has a chance at the playoffs.
If the rest of the AFC was a dumpster fire, maybe. But it isn't. The AFC is as loaded as it has ever been with super star talent on great teams.
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To me, no move this offseason was more fascinating than this Tyreke trade. I can understand why KC did it, but I would have waited until next off season (even if it meant I got a little less in return). I don't know if this will make sense, but as good a player as Hill is, to me he's 1.5x better because he's on KC and playing with Mahomes. The Chiefs offense isn't perfect, but with Hill & Kelce on the field at the same time, it's such a difficult time to game plan against them.
The Chiefs got a haul, and would have had a very difficult decision next year on what to do with Hill (I'd have franchised him for one year). I don't think Hill will be as durable as say Adams long term, and once Hill starts to slow down, that'll be the beginning of the end.
If I'm in the AFC West, I'm ecstatic right now. The Chiefs could draft a very good WR in the first round, but that rookie probably won't fit like Hill did (at least immediately) in that offense.
I'm really curious if the Packers had conversations with the Jets/Dolphins on Adams. Really curious.
The bolded is likely why they traded him now versus next year.
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The bolded is likely why they traded him now versus next year.
They traded him now because he told the Chiefs he didn't want to play another game with them.
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MVS to Chiefs - not a big surprise after losing Hill. They rely on speed with their WRs.
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They traded him now because he told the Chiefs he didn't want to play another game with them.
I think its both. Players say stuff like that all the time. Like Dish said, the Chiefs knew they had an interesting choice coming up. If they didn't get a big haul like they did, or if they had a more concrete plan for next year (say 1 more year and then the franchise tag), it would have been brushed off and things carry on. As it happens, it all worked out so thats why they traded him
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Rumors of course, but chiefs and pack reaching out to Seattle for lockett and metcalf
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Rumors of course, but chiefs and pack reaching out to Seattle for lockett and metcalf
Makes sense. Seattle is a last place team with almost a 0% chance for the Playoffs - they need draft picks to re-build. Metcalf may get them a 1st. I don't think Lockett will.
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Hard to believe this will work out for the Dolphins. How often does brokering this much of the future for a single wideout work out? I'm prepared to say never.
Look at this list https://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/share.fcgi?id=JDI5G (https://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/share.fcgi?id=JDI5G) of every WR trade involving a 1st round pick since 2000. Were any of those 10 trades worth it for the team giving away that much? Maybe arguably Keyshawn, but I'd say not a single one.
Are the Fish going to be the first? Hah. No-brainer for the Chiefs, on the other hand.
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MVS to Chiefs - not a big surprise after losing Hill. They rely on speed with their WRs.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33586619/kansas-city-chiefs-add-wr-reach-three-year-deal-marquez-valdes-scantling
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Article by Silverstein today that Adams let them know he wanted a trade to LV right after the season ended and they did their best to achieve that
Another interesting thing in that article is apparently you can't sign and trade franchise players for other players, which I did not know. Helps contextualize the haul
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Chandon Sullivan to the Vikings. Double win for the Packers.
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NFL changes OT rule for the playoffs, ensuring that each team will get the ball on offense once. Rule stays the same as it had been for the regular season - TD wins the game, FG or less gives the other team a chance to tie or win.
I would have been fine had they not made the change because the defense has the right to make a stop, but I'm also fine with the change. At the very least, it will remove a ready-made excuse for teams that lose.
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NFL changes OT rule for the playoffs, ensuring that each team will get the ball on offense once. Rule stays the same as it had been for the regular season - TD wins the game, FG or less gives the other team a chance to tie or win.
I would have been fine had they not made the change because the defense has the right to make a stop, but I'm also fine with the change. At the very least, it will remove a ready-made excuse for teams that lose.
My guess is a lot of teams ,who win the coin toss in the Playoff OT, will elect to defend.
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Bruce Arians moving to Front Office and Todd Bowles new Head Coach of Bucs
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/bruce-arians-stepping-down-buccaneers-head-coach-front-office-position-report
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Bruce Arians moving to Front Office and Todd Bowles new Head Coach of Bucs
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/bruce-arians-stepping-down-buccaneers-head-coach-front-office-position-report
WOW. That will be a change. Hope it goes better than Bowles last go around. He doesn’t have a roster excuse this time
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WOW. That will be a change. Hope it goes better than Bowles last go around. He doesn’t have a roster excuse this time
Article with details on Arians thought process. Essentially he wanted to turn over a good team to Todd Bowles, giving him a better chance at success than with a crappy team that might have hired him at some point.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/03/30/bruce-arians-steps-down-bucs-nfl-fmia-peter-king/?cid=fmiatw
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Article with details on Arians thought process. Essentially he wanted to turn over a good team to Todd Bowles, giving him a better chance at success than with a crappy team that might have hired him at some point.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/03/30/bruce-arians-steps-down-bucs-nfl-fmia-peter-king/?cid=fmiatw
Lol, yeah, I’m sure that’s the reason.
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Lol, yeah, I’m sure that’s the reason.
Obviously , Brady drove the process
The good news on this deal for The Bucs is they may now have a stronger position to sign The Honey Badger ( he is engaged to Bowles Step daughter )
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Lol, yeah, I’m sure that’s the reason.
Very nice of Brady to feel that way about Bowles 8-)
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Big Time signing for the Rams
https://nypost.com/2022/03/31/bobby-wagner-signing-big-rams-deal-after-messy-seahawks-split/
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Big Time signing for the Rams
https://nypost.com/2022/03/31/bobby-wagner-signing-big-rams-deal-after-messy-seahawks-split/
5 years $50m for a 31 year old former All-Pro who hasn't been hurt a ton seems reasonable. Let's see how it works out.
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Gronk not yet ready to commit to return
https://www.tmz.com/2022/04/05/rob-gronkowski-still-undecided-about-football-future-not-ready-to-commit/
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Gronk not yet ready to commit to return
https://www.tmz.com/2022/04/05/rob-gronkowski-still-undecided-about-football-future-not-ready-to-commit/
Group needs to spend a bit more time exploring his feelings/the coeds at Arizona
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Panthers coach joins Flores’ lawsuit against the NFL alleging racial discrimination
https://www.charlotteobserver.com/sports/nfl/carolina-panthers/article260202455.html?ac_cid=DM631287&ac_bid=-505163832
Steve Wilks, the Panthers’ secondary coach and defensive passing game coordinator, is joining Brian Flores’ lawsuit against the NFL alleging racial discrimination in its hiring practices.
Wilks alleges that the Arizona Cardinals discriminated against him when they fired him in 2018 after one season as head coach.
“Mr. Wilks was hired as a ‘bridge coach’ and was not given any meaningful chance to succeed,” the complaint states. “He was unfairly and discriminatorily fired after just one season.”
The Cardinals hired Wilks in 2018 after he spent a season as the Panthers’ defensive coordinator under Ron Rivera. The Cardinals finished the 2018 season 3-13, setting them up for the No. 1 pick in the draft.
Coaches are rarely fired after one season unless their lone seasons are mired with controversy, similar to Urban Meyer in Jacksonville. Wilks’ time wasn’t.
The lawsuit alleges that Cardinals general manager Steve Keim, who is white, made poor personnel decisions and was convicted for a DUI that offseason, yet was still given a contract extension, while Wilks was fired.
“Mr. Wilks was replaced by a white coach, Kliff Kingsbury, who had no prior NFL coaching experience and was coming off of multiple losing seasons as a Head Coach at Texas Tech,” the lawsuit states. “Mr. Kingsbury, armed with quarterback Kyler Murray, has been given a much longer leash than Mr. Wilks and, to his credit, has succeeded. That said, Mr. Wilks, given the same opportunity afforded to Mr. Kingsbury, surely would have succeeded as well.”
At the time Wilks was hired, the Cardinals didn’t have a franchise quarterback. Wilks alleges in the lawsuit that before the 2018 NFL draft, he urged Cardinals general manager Steve Keim to trade up to the seventh spot to draft quarterback Josh Allen, who is now considered one of the top quarterbacks in the league.
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This is way more damning than anything else that has come out so far.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/04/07/mike-mularkey-revealed-titans-did-sham-rooney-rule-interviews-after-hiring-him-as-coach/
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This is way more damning than anything else that has come out so far.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/04/07/mike-mularkey-revealed-titans-did-sham-rooney-rule-interviews-after-hiring-him-as-coach/
Wow, that's something.
Not surprising in the least, but still incredible to see those details.
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Business as usual.
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More Brett Favre and welfare fraud.
https://mississippitoday.org/2022/04/06/brett-favre-used-fame-favors-welfare-dollars/
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More Brett Favre and welfare fraud.
https://mississippitoday.org/2022/04/06/brett-favre-used-fame-favors-welfare-dollars/
Just a simple country boy.
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More Brett Favre and welfare fraud.
https://mississippitoday.org/2022/04/06/brett-favre-used-fame-favors-welfare-dollars/
This doesn't even get close to making the list of the worst things he's done.
Dude is just an awful human being.
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More Brett Favre and welfare fraud.
https://mississippitoday.org/2022/04/06/brett-favre-used-fame-favors-welfare-dollars/
More business as usual.
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Dwayne Haskins was killed this morning when he hit by a car
https://twitter.com/adamschefter/status/1512807191731912711?s=21&t=1FdmFOpCgFavlAw8EHIbLA
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Dwayne Haskins was killed this morning when he hit by a car
https://twitter.com/adamschefter/status/1512807191731912711?s=21&t=1FdmFOpCgFavlAw8EHIbLA
Only 24 years old. Devastating
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Gil Brandt with some “interesting” hot takes on Haskins.
Probably time for ‘ol Gil to stop doing interviews.
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Gil Brandt with some “interesting” hot takes on Haskins.
Probably time for ‘ol Gil to stop doing interviews.
Jfc
https://twitter.com/PeteDamilatis/status/1512835278653767684?t=0Hdn6aqtqXDUBx6bfI59uQ&s=19
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I forgot to mention Schefter’s awful tweet too.
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Dwayne Haskins was killed this morning when he hit by a car
https://twitter.com/adamschefter/status/1512807191731912711?s=21&t=1FdmFOpCgFavlAw8EHIbLA
Heart breaking
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Gil Brandt with some “interesting” hot takes on Haskins.
Probably time for ‘ol Gil to stop doing interviews.
What the holy unnatural carnal knowledge?
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Gronk says if he comes back he will only play for The Bucs. Says his Girlfriend, Camille Kostek, wants him to come back because she likes all the other Wives and Girlfriends.
https://www.si.com/nfl/buccaneers/news/rob-gronkowski-confirms-the-team-he-would-play-for-in-2022
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This story is so bizarre.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/2022/04/08/sports/inside-tom-bradys-un-retirement-how-brian-flores-soccer-match-were-among-key-factors/
Apparently Stephen Ross and Tom Brady hatched a plan for Brady to retire, then join the Dolphins as an executive. Later on, he was going to "unretire," with the Dolphins approaching the Bucs to trade his rights to Miami, and then hire Sean Payton as head coach. But then the Flores lawsuit blew the whole thing up.
So now Brady is back with the Bucs, but with only one year on his contract. The Dolphins went out and hired Mike McDaniel, a one year coordinator, as head coach. If the Dolphins fail, which seems likely to me, will the Brady and Payton deal be back on for Miami?
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And some are now speculating that Belichick intentionally sent his "congrats on the Giants gig" tweet to Flores, with the knowledge that Flores would use it in a suit against the Dolphins, scuttling their Tom Brady plans in the process.
That seem too "next level" even for Belichick.
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And some are now speculating that Belichick intentionally sent his "congrats on the Giants gig" tweet to Flores, with the knowledge that Flores would use it in a suit against the Dolphins, scuttling their Tom Brady plans in the process.
That seem too "next level" even for Belichick.
I would actually gain respect for ol' Belicheat for that one if true.
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I think Packers signing Sammy Watkins is a solid niche pickup . Comes at a low price with contract mostly incentive based. Rodgers will have a lot more targets to hand out so maybe Sammy finds some of that form he flashed a couple years ago in the playoffs with The Chiefs
https://www.packers.com/news/5-things-to-know-about-new-packers-wr-sammy-watkins
Hopefully some quality Receivers are availed when the Packers draft
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I think Packers signing Sammy Watkins is a solid niche pickup . Comes at a low price with contract mostly incentive based. Rodgers will have a lot more targets to hand out so maybe Sammy finds some of that form he flashed a couple years ago in the playoffs with The Chiefs
https://www.packers.com/news/5-things-to-know-about-new-packers-wr-sammy-watkins
Hopefully some quality Receivers are availed when the Packers draft
Watkins hasnt been the same since breaking his foot in 2016. He's had barely 1000 yards and less than 10 TDs in the last 3 seasons combined. A first round pick like Olave is far more intriguing and exciting if you're the Packers. Watkins will just be depth at a good price.
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Watkins hasnt been the same since breaking his foot in 2016. He's had barely 1000 yards and less than 10 TDs in the last 3 seasons combined. A first round pick like Olave is far more intriguing and exciting if you're the Packers. Watkins will just be depth at a good price.
That’s good hat I am saying . There will be injuries and The Pack will need the depth.
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Watkins hasnt been the same since breaking his foot in 2016. He's had barely 1000 yards and less than 10 TDs in the last 3 seasons combined. A first round pick like Olave is far more intriguing and exciting if you're the Packers. Watkins will just be depth at a good price.
Word on the street is Sammy pulled both of his hammies on the way out of the building after signing his contract.
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Deebo wants a trade.
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Deebo wants a trade.
On a related note, I'd love a million dollars.
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Same agent represents Deebo, AJ Brown and DK.
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Packers have the draft picks to make a deal for Deebo happen. I doubt the 49ers would be willing to trade a good player to a team they have to go through in the playoffs. However, stranger things have happened.
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Good article detailing the wide receivers available in the Draft. Treylon Burks is a tough guy he hunts wild boar with a knife. Should be good fighting for the ball and on yards after catch , with that attitude.
https://www.si.com/nfl/packers/news/2022-nfl-draft-ultimate-preview-receivers#gid=ci029f33c5c00027cc&pid=ranking-the-draft-need
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Let’s build a team of boar fighters.
Woo- Hoo!
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Just another reason why Peyton Manning is beloved.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33815614/peyton-manning-partners-georgia-tech-demaryius-thomas-scholarship (https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33815614/peyton-manning-partners-georgia-tech-demaryius-thomas-scholarship)
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Let’s build a team of boar fighters.
Woo- Hoo!
More on Treylon
https://mobile.twitter.com/ScottBarrettDFB/status/1519321216288317441?cxt=HHwWgoCjyZam25UqAAAA
https://www.4029tv.com/article/treylon-burks-hog-hunting-nfl-draft-arkansas/39830906
https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2022/04/25/packers-linked-to-first-round-interest-in-arkansas-wr-treylon-burks/
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I hope Packers keep both their first round picks
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I hope Packers keep both their first round picks
I would be alright trading back 28 a few spots to the early second round if they could still get someone they wanted. I could see them trade up to the early second round and keep the two firsts.
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I hope Packers keep both their first round picks
They need to find a QB that isn’t a regular season stat padder and find a winner like Stafford
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I was right about Stafford's first season in LA. I'll double down. Two years, two rings.
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I was right about Stafford's first season in LA. I'll double down. Two years, two rings.
I’ll be pulling for him.
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In his first media interview in 16 months, Panthers owner David Tepper quickly shot down reports that Matt Rhule will be on the hot seat going into his third season as coach.
“I’ve said it — five years, five years, five years — from the time coach Rhule was there. And maybe it’ll be six years, I don’t know, from the time he was hired,” Tepper said with a chuckle.
“I think it’s just building that foundation, having patience to build that foundation, trying to get fans to have patience for that foundation, to have sustained winning. And it’s hard to build that foundation. It’s hard.”
Talk about COLE!
Two years ago, Tepper was swept away by Rhule's enthusiasm and gave him a huge contract to keep him from interviewing elsewhere. And Tepper said at the time that it would take many years to build a legit contender, which is why he gave Rhule a 7-year contract. It appears the NFL's richest owner is willing to wait at least a couple more years, frustrating some of my friends who wanted Rhule fired after last season.
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Good news for Jags fans
Shad Kahn bought the county fairground next to the Stadium and will convert it into a parking lot . Fairground moving to an agricultural area.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2022/04/29/jaguars-owner-shad-khans-development-company-agrees-to-buy-jacksonville-fairgrounds/?outputType=amp
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Guess we know why Arizona was so eager to add pass catchers this weekend.
@AdamSchefter
Cardinals’ Pro-Bowl WR DeAndre Hopkins is being suspended six games for violating the NFL’s Performance Enhancing Drug policy, league sources tell ESPN.
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Would like to see the Pack sign Julio Jones. I think there is one more year of gas left in the tank .
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Guess we know why Arizona was so eager to add pass catchers this weekend.
@AdamSchefter
Cardinals’ Pro-Bowl WR DeAndre Hopkins is being suspended six games for violating the NFL’s Performance Enhancing Drug policy, league sources tell ESPN.
I'm always amazed when someone tests positive. With all the technology, and money out there, most are doping, just in undetectable ways. When someone tests positive, it means either the technology failed, or they just didn't even bother trying to evade the tests...or they accidentally consumed something they didn't realized had a PED (while they were willfully violated the PED rules).
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I'm always amazed when someone tests positive. With all the technology, and money out there, most are doping, just in undetectable ways. When someone tests positive, it means either the technology failed, or they just didn't even bother trying to evade the tests...or they accidentally consumed something they didn't realized had a PED (while they were willfully violated the PED rules).
How many NFL players do you think are taking illegal PED's?
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How many NFL players do you think are taking illegal PED's?
97%
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97%
Name the 3%, dammit!
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Name the 3%, dammit!
The Packers roster is clean. #PackersPeople
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I'm always amazed when someone tests positive. With all the technology, and money out there, most are doping, just in undetectable ways. When someone tests positive, it means either the technology failed, or they just didn't even bother trying to evade the tests...or they accidentally consumed something they didn't realized had a PED (while they were willfully violated the PED rules).
Its always either an F-up on the cloaking cycle or something innocuous that causes a reaction with their PED cycle that pops up. Its crazy.
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How many NFL players do you think are taking illegal PED's?
I think the vast majority are actively taking them, and my guess would be nearly all have taken them during their career.
There is a ton of money on the line to be the best. And plenty of technology to evade detection. If you know all your peers are "cheating" you will too.
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Its always either an F-up on the cloaking cycle or something innocuous that causes a reaction with their PED cycle that pops up. Its crazy.
I think Braun basically took his recovery PED (my non-scientific term) thinking he wasn’t going to get tested and that’s why it was off the charts.
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Guess we know why Arizona was so eager to add pass catchers this weekend.
@AdamSchefter
Cardinals’ Pro-Bowl WR DeAndre Hopkins is being suspended six games for violating the NFL’s Performance Enhancing Drug policy, league sources tell ESPN.
No way for him to know the side effects of those drugs, just like the covid vaccine
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https://twitter.com/ChiSportUpdates/status/1521620053782839296?t=08cgj57imjWkmtvpJJQjkA&s=19
People are saying
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https://twitter.com/ChiSportUpdates/status/1521620053782839296?t=08cgj57imjWkmtvpJJQjkA&s=19
People are saying
Oh, lord. That’s an embarrassing thing to say
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https://twitter.com/ChiSportUpdates/status/1521620053782839296?t=08cgj57imjWkmtvpJJQjkA&s=19
People are saying
Has a real Gregg "I've Had 11 Job Offers" Williams feel to it.
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https://twitter.com/ChiSportUpdates/status/1521620053782839296?t=08cgj57imjWkmtvpJJQjkA&s=19
People are saying
The NFC North is the fifth they keeps giving for the Packers
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https://twitter.com/ChiSportUpdates/status/1521620053782839296?t=08cgj57imjWkmtvpJJQjkA&s=19
People are saying
As a Bears fan I can honestly say, that is embarrassing.
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As a Bears fan I can honestly say, that is embarrassing.
That right there is why you put candidates through a fake press conference.
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That right there is why you put candidates through a fake press conference.
YES.
What's next? Is the Bear's GM going to tell us about a note someone passed him in gym class?
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Of all the things that embarrass me as a Bears fan, this scarcely even registers. I just hope its even 20% true.
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October 9: Giants v. Packers at Tottenham Hotspur Stadium, 8:30 AM Central.
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^ Bet on the Giants
My D-i-L always meets her father at an away game each season and this time it's the London game, Packers lose almost every game they attend.
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Is that a 'home' game for the Packers? I'd be pissed if I was a season ticket holder if it is.
I've heard some teams, like the Bears, have told the NFL "no thanks" to having a home game over seas. As founders of the NFL, I assume the Bears and Packers can dictate to the NFL that they will not loose a home game.
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Is that a 'home' game for the Packers? I'd be pissed if I was a season ticket holder if it is.
I've heard some teams, like the Bears, have told the NFL "no thanks" to having a home game over seas. As founders of the NFL, I assume the Bears and Packers can dictate to the NFL that they will not loose a home game.
It has been designated as a "home" game for the Packers. The team’s designated ninth home game was used on the trip to London.
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The Packers will still get eight home games. The franchise is not unhappy about this.
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The Packers will still get eight home games. The franchise is not unhappy about this.
There are a ton of overseas Packer fans. London will be great for the team.
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Brady to get 10 year $375 million contract as Fox lead analyst effective when he decides to retire .
https://nypost.com/2022/05/10/tom-brady-gets-monster-10-year-375-million-deal-from-fox-sports/
Wow.
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Brady to get 10 year $375 million contract as Fox lead analyst effective when he decides to retire .
https://nypost.com/2022/05/10/tom-brady-gets-monster-10-year-375-million-deal-from-fox-sports/
Wow.
Absolutely baffling to me. Ive seen nothing from Brady that tells me he's gonna be some lights out, A+++ analyst. I would have said it was ridiculous for Manning in the same position, and he showed far more potential for it than Brady. We saw how Brees struggled.
The other shocking side story was Jim Rome getting $30MM a year from CBS Sports. I mean, I know his radio show/podcast is very successful, but that is a HUGE chunk of change for someone that a lot of knowledgeable sports fans don't realize is still relevant.
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Brady to get 10 year $375 million contract as Fox lead analyst effective when he decides to retire .
https://nypost.com/2022/05/10/tom-brady-gets-monster-10-year-375-million-deal-from-fox-sports/
Wow.
Wear kan ya get a gig like dat, hey?
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Absolutely baffling to me. Ive seen nothing from Brady that tells me he's gonna be some lights out, A+++ analyst. I would have said it was ridiculous for Manning in the same position, and he showed far more potential for it than Brady. We saw how Brees struggled.
The other shocking side story was Jim Rome getting $30MM a year from CBS Sports. I mean, I know his radio show/podcast is very successful, but that is a HUGE chunk of change for someone that a lot of knowledgeable sports fans don't realize is still relevant.
Manning would have been fantastic because he pairs personality with knowledge, but he has a good gig dicking around on ESPN 2. I would not have anticipated Romo being as good as he is, but he very quickly became the best in the business
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Wear kan ya get a gig like dat, hey?
He will literally make more announcing then he made his entire NFL career.
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Absolutely baffling to me. Ive seen nothing from Brady that tells me he's gonna be some lights out, A+++ analyst. I would have said it was ridiculous for Manning in the same position, and he showed far more potential for it than Brady. We saw how Brees struggled.
The other shocking side story was Jim Rome getting $30MM a year from CBS Sports. I mean, I know his radio show/podcast is very successful, but that is a HUGE chunk of change for someone that a lot of knowledgeable sports fans don't realize is still relevant.
Jim Rome still has a job… any job? Wow. Efficient market my patoot, 0% chance there’s a positive ROI there especially considering the opportunity cost of paying him $30M to be invisible means you could spend $30M on literally any other productive asset.
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To be fair, where is CBS Sports going to spend that money. Pete Prisco?
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Funny munny.
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Jim Rome still has a job… any job? Wow. Efficient market my patoot, 0% chance there’s a positive ROI there especially considering the opportunity cost of paying him $30M to be invisible means you could spend $30M on literally any other productive asset.
Count me as one who didn't know Rome was still working. I think this is the first time I've seen his name in 10+ years. Is this a 'come back', or has he been working this entire time?
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He has been working the whole time.
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Those who follow TV sports are speculating that Greg Olsen will be FOX's lead football analyst this season, and then Brady will take the job next year.
I doubt Brady will be better than the outstanding Olsen, let alone 20x better (or however much more Brady will be paid than Olsen).
After perhaps the initial telecast or two with some folks tuning in to see if Brady's any good, how many people will watch a game with Brady as the analyst who wouldn't have watched it anyway no matter who was the analyst?
This just seems like FOX spending money for the sake of spending money.
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Those who follow TV sports are speculating that Greg Olsen will be FOX's lead football analyst this season, and then Brady will take the job next year.
I doubt Brady will be better than the outstanding Olsen, let alone 20x better (or however much more Brady will be paid than Olsen).
After perhaps the initial telecast or two with some folks tuning in to see if Brady's any good, how many people will watch a game with Brady as the analyst who wouldn't have watched it anyway no matter who was the analyst?
This just seems like FOX spending money for the sake of spending money.
And Olsen is yet another guy who showed a ton of personality as a player. Starting doing sideline work and analyst work while playing, then worked his way up.
Brady? I mean, I'm not trying to argue his legacy as a player, but nobody except the biggest Brady fanboys think he has some super engaging personality or charisma. Its just ridiculous to me.
Will people tune in to watch Brady who wouldn't have otherwise? Yea, Mpretty boys. But just wait till he does a Pats game and says something less than fawning over the Pats, if he's indeed being an objective analyst, they will lose their minds.
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Yeah I don't get shelling out that much money for a TV analyst. Are that many more people going to watch because of Brady, Romo, Aikman, etc. to make these contracts worth it?
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Yeah I don't get shelling out that much money for a TV analyst. Are that many more people going to watch because of Brady, Romo, Aikman, etc. to make these contracts worth it?
It seems exorbitant, and perhaps I'm wrong to trust that any of these people know what they're doing, but I would guess that the accountants over at FOX, CBS and ESPN have a pretty good idea what kind of revenue their NFL broadcasts will generate and how much more they can ask for an ad buy from a game with Brady, Romo and Aikman attached.
They may be projecting wrongly, but I don't think they're spending money for the sake of spending it. They have reason to believe these guys will boost revenues.
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Absolutely baffling to me. Ive seen nothing from Brady that tells me he's gonna be some lights out, A+++ analyst. I would have said it was ridiculous for Manning in the same position, and he showed far more potential for it than Brady. We saw how Brees struggled.
The other shocking side story was Jim Rome getting $30MM a year from CBS Sports. I mean, I know his radio show/podcast is very successful, but that is a HUGE chunk of change for someone that a lot of knowledgeable sports fans don't realize is still relevant.
I don't get it either. Will a large audience tune in to hear Brady's thoughts? Is is value THAT much higher than someone you could get for far less money?
Baffling is the perfect word.
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This is anecdotal and a sample of 1, but if I’m torn between 2 games, I’d maybe choose the one with Romo because of his style. Granted that would be a tiebreaker below which one impacts my fantasy matchup more.
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This is anecdotal and a sample of 1, but if I’m torn between 2 games, I’d maybe choose the one with Romo because of his style. Granted that would be a tiebreaker below which one impacts my fantasy matchup more.
I think people would watch Pol Pot call NFL games. How many people legit don’t watch because of who the announcer is? Every fanbase thinks announcers are biased against their team and still tune in
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It seems exorbitant, and perhaps I'm wrong to trust that any of these people know what they're doing, but I would guess that the accountants over at FOX, CBS and ESPN have a pretty good idea what kind of revenue their NFL broadcasts will generate and how much more they can ask for an ad buy from a game with Brady, Romo and Aikman attached.
They may be projecting wrongly, but I don't think they're spending money for the sake of spending it. They have reason to believe these guys will boost revenues.
Are more people watching those games because of the announcers or because those announcers are usually doing the best games?
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https://www.theplayerstribune.com/posts/tarik-cohen-mental-health-nfl-football
This was an interesting read
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It seems exorbitant, and perhaps I'm wrong to trust that any of these people know what they're doing, but I would guess that the accountants over at FOX, CBS and ESPN have a pretty good idea what kind of revenue their NFL broadcasts will generate and how much more they can ask for an ad buy from a game with Brady, Romo and Aikman attached.
They may be projecting wrongly, but I don't think they're spending money for the sake of spending it. They have reason to believe these guys will boost revenues.
I think the networks will try to leverage the presence of these guys into increases in pricing for advertisers...they have to do something to make up for cratering ratings across their non-live-sports programming and this is as good a try as any. As someone familiar with the buyer's side of the desk, I don't think it will work in the sense that ratings will be higher, but they may be able to leverage an incremental percentage point or two pricing increase vs year prior. Analysts aren't gonna drive incremental viewership but they might make one network's inventory more attractive than anothers.
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Just one man's position; I've never watched a sporting event because of the announcer. I have turned some off, rarely, because of the announcer.
Now, I have listened to some baseball on the radio because of the announcers.
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I think the networks will try to leverage the presence of these guys into increases in pricing for advertisers...they have to do something to make up for cratering ratings across their non-live-sports programming and this is as good a try as any. As someone familiar with the buyer's side of the desk, I don't think it will work in the sense that ratings will be higher, but they may be able to leverage an incremental percentage point or two pricing increase vs year prior. Analysts aren't gonna drive incremental viewership but they might make one network's inventory more attractive than anothers.
As good a take as any.
Bravo to Brady (and/or his agent) for not “settling” for pathetic Aikman money.
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I think the networks will try to leverage the presence of these guys into increases in pricing for advertisers...they have to do something to make up for cratering ratings across their non-live-sports programming and this is as good a try as any. As someone familiar with the buyer's side of the desk, I don't think it will work in the sense that ratings will be higher, but they may be able to leverage an incremental percentage point or two pricing increase vs year prior. Analysts aren't gonna drive incremental viewership but they might make one network's inventory more attractive than anothers.
Yea, makes sense. One thing that was always surprising to me, at least initially, in my media agency days was what a terrible ROI the NFL was. The side programming (recap shows, NFL draft, etc...) and digital properties had good value, but the actual games themselves were often just tables stakes to be seen as spending in the category. And that 10-12 years ago before the live TV space changed dramatically.
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Bears @ Packers week 2 on SNF. I think Bears @ Pack on SNF has happened 20 years in a row now.
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Bears @ Packers week 2 on SNF. I think Bears @ Pack on SNF has happened 20 years in a row now.
Kind of amazing...
2022: Sunday night
2021: Sunday night
2020: Sunday night
2019: Sunday 1:00
2018: Sunday night
2017: Thursday night
2016: Thursday night
2015: Thursday night
2014: Sunday night
2013: Monday night
2012: Thursday night
2011: Sunday night
So only once in the last 12 seasons have the Bears played the Packers @ Lambeau on a Sunday afternoon.
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Watt's da point of havin' a schedule announcement show wen da 'hole fookin' schedule is leaked beafour hand, hey?
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Packers 2022 schedule leaks, per SI.com:
https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/05/12/packers-2022-nfl-schedule-leak-report
Week 2 vs. Bears Sunday Night Football
Week 4 vs. Patriots at 4:25 p.m. ET
Week 6 vs. Jets at 1 p.m. ET
Week 11 vs. Titans Thursday Night Football
Week 15 vs. Rams Monday Night Football
Week 16 at Dolphins Christmas Day Game at 1 p.m. ET
Week 17 vs. Vikings on Sunday
Week 18 vs. Lions on Sunday
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Packers 2022 schedule leaks, per SI.com:
https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/05/12/packers-2022-nfl-schedule-leak-report
Week 2 vs. Bears Sunday Night Football
Week 4 vs. Patriots at 4:25 p.m. ET
Week 6 vs. Jets at 1 p.m. ET
Week 11 vs. Titans Thursday Night Football
Week 15 vs. Rams Monday Night Football
Week 16 at Dolphins Christmas Day Game at 1 p.m. ET
Week 17 vs. Vikings on Sunday
Week 18 vs. Lions on Sunday
I see 1 win unless they replace the QB
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Week 14 -- BYE ! ! ! :( 8-)
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I see 1 win unless they replace the QB
Yeah, dey gotta peddle Luv's ass, aina?
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Yeah, dey gotta peddle Luv's ass, aina?
No, 12. If they don’t, then I know they aren’t a serious franchise and are more concerned with fan service
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10 ain't worth stink, hey?
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10 ain't worth stink, hey?
Neither is 12, hey?
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Ian Rapoport @RapSheet
The #Raiders are actually working out FA QB Colin Kaepernick today, source said. His first workout in years.
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Ian Rapoport @RapSheet
The #Raiders are actually working out FA QB Colin Kaepernick today, source said. His first workout in years.
Sad to see the Raiders become so woke. If they sign him I’m cancelling my NFL RedZone subscription.
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I could be mistaken, but didn't Kaepernick in the past say he wasn't interested in being a backup? If so, he's not supplanting Carr so not sure why the Raiders. If he has changed his mind on this, then good for him and I hope he does well in the work/tryout
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NFL takes $7.5 million from each team for St. Louis settlement (https://sports.yahoo.com/nfl-takes-7-5-million-212717553.html)
Rams owner Stan Kroenke doesn’t back away from his obligations. Unless he does.
Although Cowboys owner Jerry Jones proclaimed last year that Kroenke is a “man of principle” who “doesn’t back away” at a time when reporting suggested that Kroenke was trying to back away from his promise to indemnify his partners regarding the litigation filed following the relocation of the Rams, a significant portion of the $790 million settlement has been foisted upon the league’s teams.
Daniel Kaplan of TheAthletic.com reports that the league has “quietly” taken $7.5 million from each team in connection with the settlement. This amounts to $232.5 million.
It’s unclear whether they’ll get the money back. Per Kaplan, some team executives complained that the situation has created budgeting issues, since they don’t know whether and when the money will be returned.
Kroenke’s argument for solely bearing the costs of the litigation but not the settlement comes from the indemnity provision crafted by the league and adopted by the owners. At least one owner previously, and privately, has characterized the failure of the indemnity provision to include the amount of the settlement “malpractice” by the lawyers.
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I could be mistaken, but didn't Kaepernick in the past say he wasn't interested in being a backup? If so, he's not supplanting Carr so not sure why the Raiders. If he has changed his mind on this, then good for him and I hope he does well in the work/tryout
If that's true, he's delusional about his abilities. You can't sit for years and expect to come in as a starter, particularly when his last years weren't all that great as it was.
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If that's true, he's delusional about his abilities. You can't sit for years and expect to come in as a starter, particularly when his last years weren't all that great as it was.
That was what was publicly stated in 2018-2019. I know he refused the Broncos on that basis. But I just see now he stated last month that he'd be willing to be a backup. In that case, I hope he sticks if nothing but to put an end to a lot of dumb narratives about his actual football ability.
In the years since he's been out of the league, it feels like some want to make him out to be peak Michael Vick while others act like he was Seneca Wallace
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Why would he voluntarily return to slavery?
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Antonio Brown looks like he can’t get any takers for his services.
https://nypost.com/2022/05/29/antonio-brown-says-he-wont-play-in-nfl-in-2022/
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As we go through the offseason where salaries and new contracts come up, the disparity in NFL salaries compared to other sports never ceases to amaze me. I know roster size has a big part of it, but its still so crazy.
Just watched an episode of the IAMATHLETE podcast with Aaron Donald. One of the hosts was Lesean McCoy. Shady was a STUD at his peak. 2 time first team All Pro. 7 Pro Bowl seasons. All Decade team for the 2010s. Rushing yards leader, incredible 2 way RB. He made $60MM in a 12 year NFL career.
Looking at the Bucks. George Hill has never made an All Star game. Steady but unspectacular guard, but his best seasons he wasn't even the best guard on his team, much less one of the tops in even his division. But through 12 seasons he made just over $90MM...
Brook Lopez. Another good but not great player. Tons of empty stats on bad teams. 1 ASG but nobody is talking about him with the tops at his position...through 12 seasons he made double McCoy's career earnings.
Mommas don't let your kids be football players, especially not RBs.
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Why would he voluntarily return to slavery?
Stunning that you take his words out of context.
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As we go through the offseason where salaries and new contracts come up, the disparity in NFL salaries compared to other sports never ceases to amaze me. I know roster size has a big part of it, but its still so crazy.
Just watched an episode of the IAMATHLETE podcast with Aaron Donald. One of the hosts was Lesean McCoy. Shady was a STUD at his peak. 2 time first team All Pro. 7 Pro Bowl seasons. All Decade team for the 2010s. Rushing yards leader, incredible 2 way RB. He made $60MM in a 12 year NFL career.
Looking at the Bucks. George Hill has never made an All Star game. Steady but unspectacular guard, but his best seasons he wasn't even the best guard on his team, much less one of the tops in even his division. But through 12 seasons he made just over $90MM...
Brook Lopez. Another good but not great player. Tons of empty stats on bad teams. 1 ASG but nobody is talking about him with the tops at his position...through 12 seasons he made double McCoy's career earnings.
Mommas don't let your kids be football players, especially not RBs.
That doesn’t even account for the lack of guarantees for NFL. George Hill could have torn his ACL and gotten all his contract. Not the same for McCoy.
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As we go through the offseason where salaries and new contracts come up, the disparity in NFL salaries compared to other sports never ceases to amaze me. I know roster size has a big part of it, but its still so crazy.
Just watched an episode of the IAMATHLETE podcast with Aaron Donald. One of the hosts was Lesean McCoy. Shady was a STUD at his peak. 2 time first team All Pro. 7 Pro Bowl seasons. All Decade team for the 2010s. Rushing yards leader, incredible 2 way RB. He made $60MM in a 12 year NFL career.
Looking at the Bucks. George Hill has never made an All Star game. Steady but unspectacular guard, but his best seasons he wasn't even the best guard on his team, much less one of the tops in even his division. But through 12 seasons he made just over $90MM...
Brook Lopez. Another good but not great player. Tons of empty stats on bad teams. 1 ASG but nobody is talking about him with the tops at his position...through 12 seasons he made double McCoy's career earnings.
Mommas don't let your kids be football players, especially not RBs.
Is Aaron Donald really this dumb? He had no idea what he was talking about - to the point where he said it isn’t about money and it is about money in the same sentence.
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Is Aaron Donald really this dumb? He had no idea what he was talking about - to the point where he said it isn’t about money and it is about money in the same sentence.
I took it as "its not about money" in the sense that he doesn't need it. He's made $100MM so he's good. But at the same time, its about money from the respect/value angle. Aaron Rodgers doesn't need money but he has an infatuation with being paid the highest or amongst the very top.
I mean, if you're willing to retire if not for a deal you think you deserve, its sort of beyond money at that point in terms of the actual impact on your life. But the money represents respect or stature.
He's done everything there is to do. He has a ring, he has multiple DPOY, he's a surefire HOFer.
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I took it as "its not about money" in the sense that he doesn't need it. He's made $100MM so he's good. But at the same time, its about money from the respect/value angle. Aaron Rodgers doesn't need money but he has an infatuation with being paid the highest or amongst the very top.
I mean, if you're willing to retire if not for a deal you think you deserve, its sort of beyond money at that point in terms of the actual impact on your life. But the money represents respect or stature.
He's done everything there is to do. He has a ring, he has multiple DPOY, he's a surefire HOFer.
I pretty much agree with your comments, but the way respect is measured in the League is thru $$$$. That makes it about Money.
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Akiem Hicks to Bucs
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/tampa-bay-bucaneers-sign-former-pro-bowler-akiem-hicks
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I took it as "its not about money" in the sense that he doesn't need it. He's made $100MM so he's good. But at the same time, its about money from the respect/value angle. Aaron Rodgers doesn't need money but he has an infatuation with being paid the highest or amongst the very top.
I mean, if you're willing to retire if not for a deal you think you deserve, its sort of beyond money at that point in terms of the actual impact on your life. But the money represents respect or stature.
He's done everything there is to do. He has a ring, he has multiple DPOY, he's a surefire HOFer.
Yeah, it does sound crazy, but in pro sports, money often IS respect. I am the best, therefore I am the highest paid.
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Man the Browns trade for Deshaun Watson is looking extremely questionable right now.
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Man the Browns trade for Deshaun Watson is looking extremely questionable right now.
Only "right now"? This looked like a terrible decision from the start, beginning with alienating Mayfield
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Only "right now"? This looked like a terrible decision from the start, beginning with alienating Mayfield
Mayfield is nothing special. Average QB. I don't fault the Browns for wanting to upgrade over him. However, doing so with Watson was a terrible decision.
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The Panthers' QB situation has been a dumpster fire ever since Cam's injuries in 2018, but I was very glad they didn't get Watson.
They supposedly are interested in Mayfield, but only if the Browns pay most of his salary. I'm meh about it, though if healthy he's gotta be better than Darnold.
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I honestly haven't followed the plethora of accusations against DeShaun Watson but WTH?
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The Commanders' defensive team meetings are going to be interesting this season.
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The Commanders' defensive team meetings are going to be interesting this season.
Why does he even answer anything related to either incident.
"I'm not going to talk about anything like that, I'm here to talk about our team, and specifically defense."
What a dope.
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The Commanders' defensive team meetings are going to be interesting this season.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnbczJEUMAAeG1R.jpg)
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There's a wint tweet for everything.
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Gronk retires again. Great career over for good it seems . Body took too much abuse .
https://twitter.com/RobGronkowski/status/1539314500280537089
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Deshaun Watson Settles 20 of the 24 Sexual Misconduct Cases Against Him
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/21/sports/football/deshaun-watson-settlements.html?campaign_id=60&emc=edit_na_20220621&instance_id=0&nl=breaking-news&ref=headline®i_id=108420427&segment_id=96350&user_id=d36dcf821462fdd16ec3636710a855fa
Meanwhile, Herschel Walker, who has been highly critical of "absentee fathers" has been discovered to have fathered 3 children he mostly (or completely) ignored.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/herschel-walker-critic-of-absentee-dads-admits-to-yet-another-secret-son
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Deshaun Watson Settles 20 of the 24 Sexual Misconduct Cases Against Him
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/21/sports/football/deshaun-watson-settlements.html?campaign_id=60&emc=edit_na_20220621&instance_id=0&nl=breaking-news&ref=headline®i_id=108420427&segment_id=96350&user_id=d36dcf821462fdd16ec3636710a855fa
Meanwhile, Herschel Walker, who has been highly critical of "absentee fathers" has been discovered to have fathered 3 children he mostly (or completely) ignored.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/herschel-walker-critic-of-absentee-dads-admits-to-yet-another-secret-son
This year will be the 1st time I have ever rooted for a guy to get injured - hopefully career ending. Screw Browns fans!
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Almost every Browns' fan I know is EXTREMELY conflicted about the franchise right now.
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Almost every Browns' fan I know is EXTREMELY conflicted about the franchise right now.
I don’t know what the percentage is, but I would imagine it is pretty high.
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Tony Siragusa dies at 55
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WSJ says NFL wants to suspend Watson indefinitely, with the earliest reinstatement comingin 2023.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/deshaun-watson-nfl-suspension-contract-11656194645
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WSJ says NFL wants to suspend Watson indefinitely, with the earliest reinstatement comingin 2023.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/deshaun-watson-nfl-suspension-contract-11656194645
Browns should keep Baker Mayfield he still has one year left guaranteed so why not use him
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WSJ says NFL wants to suspend Watson indefinitely, with the earliest reinstatement comingin 2023.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/deshaun-watson-nfl-suspension-contract-11656194645
So glad the Panthers didn’t get that guy.
Browns should keep Baker Mayfield he still has one year left guaranteed so why not use him
The problem is that you’ve told the world that he sucks.
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Browns should keep Baker Mayfield he still has one year left guaranteed so why not use him
Problem is, Baker doesn't want to be there and may very well sit out.
Even if he doesn't, do you want a guy half-assing it as your starting QB?
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Problem is, Baker doesn't want to be there and may very well sit out.
Even if he doesn't, do you want a guy half-assing it as your starting QB?
[/quote
I think he would try as hard as possible . If he does well he would be in line for a big second contract somewhere .
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WSJ says NFL wants to suspend Watson indefinitely, with the earliest reinstatement comingin 2023.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/deshaun-watson-nfl-suspension-contract-11656194645
Kaep was right. 🤬🤬🤬
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Demaryius Thomas had CTE. Seems to be the case for many of these players.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34196429/boston-university-researchers-say-late-nfl-star-wide-receiver-demaryius-thomas-suffered-degenerative-brain-disease-cte
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Demaryius Thomas had CTE. Seems to be the case for many of these players.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34196429/boston-university-researchers-say-late-nfl-star-wide-receiver-demaryius-thomas-suffered-degenerative-brain-disease-cte
Well, yeah. Football kills but it’s entertaining as hell
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Baker is a Panther.
Congrats, 82.
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Baker is a Panther.
Congrats, 82.
For a conditional fifth round pick. That seems...cheap.
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For a conditional fifth round pick. That seems...cheap.
Plus, Cleveland is taking on 2/3 of Mayfield's salary.
Heck of an offseason for the Browns.
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I mean, I get that Mayfield sucked last year. But he was also hurt. Seems a little early to be throwing in the towel on that experiment.
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I mean, I get that Mayfield sucked last year. But he was also hurt. Seems a little early to be throwing in the towel on that experiment.
Yea, its not like he hasn't shown the ability to be a solid NFL QB.
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The Dave Tepper era...
22-43, 0 winning seasons, 0 playoff appearances, 3 straight 5 win seasons, favored in 2 of 17 games in the look ahead 2022 season.
Traded away:
2nd/3rd/4th/4th/5th/6th for QB's Mayfield/Darnold/Corral
No bueno.
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The Dave Tepper era...
22-43, 0 winning seasons, 0 playoff appearances, 3 straight 5 win seasons, favored in 2 of 17 games in the look ahead 2022 season.
Traded away:
2nd/3rd/4th/4th/5th/6th for QB's Mayfield/Darnold/Corral
No bueno.
Also:
- Hired Matt Rhule
- Gave a RB a $30 million guarantee immediately after a dreaded 400+ touch season, when he was still two years away from free agency. Predictable results ensue
- Signed Denzel Perryman to a two-year deal, traded him three months later for a 6th round pick, watched him put up a Pro Bowl season for the Raiders
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I mean, I get that Mayfield sucked last year. But he was also hurt. Seems a little early to be throwing in the towel on that experiment.
I think he will be a Jay Cutler type QB. Not in style of course (since that would assume Cuter had style). But rather that he will be just a guy ranked somewhere around 20th among NFL QBs. Better than Darnold, but not good enough to be a guy who can lead you to the Playoffs on a regular basis.
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The Dave Tepper era...
22-43, 0 winning seasons, 0 playoff appearances, 3 straight 5 win seasons, favored in 2 of 17 games in the look ahead 2022 season.
Traded away:
2nd/3rd/4th/4th/5th/6th for QB's Mayfield/Darnold/Corral
No bueno.
Surprised he didn't work for the Bears. The resume' is there.
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Baker is a Panther.
Congrats, 82.
Thanks?
Can't be worse than Darnold ... right? Please tell me that's right!
The Dave Tepper era...
22-43, 0 winning seasons, 0 playoff appearances, 3 straight 5 win seasons, favored in 2 of 17 games in the look ahead 2022 season.
Traded away:
2nd/3rd/4th/4th/5th/6th for QB's Mayfield/Darnold/Corral
No bueno.
Also:
- Hired Matt Rhule
- Gave a RB a $30 million guarantee immediately after a dreaded 400+ touch season, when he was still two years away from free agency. Predictable results ensue
- Signed Denzel Perryman to a two-year deal, traded him three months later for a 6th round pick, watched him put up a Pro Bowl season for the Raiders
He also entered a deal with a Charlotte suburb (Rock Hill, SC) to build the team's new training site there ... and reneged on it shortly thereafter, but not until after the suburb had spent millions of dollars getting the site ready.
The NFL's richest owner also is greasing the wheel toward the bazillion dollars in taxpayer money he expects to receive to build a new stadium.
So yes, the Tepper Era has been splendid so far.
But at least we've got Baker Mayfield!!!
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WSJ says NFL wants to suspend Watson indefinitely, with the earliest reinstatement comingin 2023.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/deshaun-watson-nfl-suspension-contract-11656194645
The Paul Hourning/Alex Karras punishment. Both were reinstated by Pete Rozelle after one year.
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Appearing on Spotify's "Drive," Tom Brady said his wealth is the “hardest thing” about raising their children.
“We have people that clean for us. We have people that make our food. We have people that drive us to the airport if we need that. … We get off a plane and there’s people waiting there for us and we get ushered in. That’s my kids’ reality, which is the hard part to say, ‘Guys, this is not the way reality really is. … What can we do about that?’”
I mean, anybody with kids can relate to that.
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Eh, Tom Brady drives me nuts, but he seems like a pretty decent family guy. I get what he is saying, although it would obviously be a nice problem to have.
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When you suck, as the Panthers do now and have for most of their existence, you'll try to find non-results ways to fire up the masses.
They just announced that, for the first time, they'll wear black helmets, black jerseys and black pants in their one prime-time game this season (Thu 11/10). The short video they released along with the announcement said they're "bringing out the Dark Side."
https://www.panthers.com/news/panthers-unveil-black-helmets-all-black-uniform-combination?utm_source=email&utm_medium=email_news&utm_campaign=black_helmets_2022&utm_content=07-19&utm_term=subscriber_news
I don't do Panthers fan sites -- Scoop's as much fan fun as I can handle -- but newspaper reports say those sites are "blowing up" after seeing the video. I do like the all-black look as an alternate uniform ... but I'd rather they had a great quarterback.
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... but I'd rather they had a great quarterback.
(Lions fan snorts) Yeah, like that matters.
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(Lions fan snorts) Yeah, like that matters.
C'mon now ... you guys won a lot when Bobby Layne was under center!
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I do like the all-black look as an alternate uniform ... but I'd rather they had a great quarterback.
I don't know about "great" but I personally think that Mayfield can be a very good quarterback. He was playing well before he got hurt last year and ended up playing hurt pretty much all season. The Browns did him a real disservice by allowing it. I hope he does really well for Carolina.
I think that Carolina made a very good trade there. As a Browns fan, I hope that management learned a little something about the stupidity of totally trashing and devaluing a player before you try to trade him. I doubt it.
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When you suck, as the Panthers do now and have for most of their existence, you'll try to find non-results ways to fire up the masses.
They just announced that, for the first time, they'll wear black helmets, black jerseys and black pants in their one prime-time game this season (Thu 11/10). The short video they released along with the announcement said they're "bringing out the Dark Side."
https://www.panthers.com/news/panthers-unveil-black-helmets-all-black-uniform-combination?utm_source=email&utm_medium=email_news&utm_campaign=black_helmets_2022&utm_content=07-19&utm_term=subscriber_news
I don't do Panthers fan sites -- Scoop's as much fan fun as I can handle -- but newspaper reports say those sites are "blowing up" after seeing the video. I do like the all-black look as an alternate uniform ... but I'd rather they had a great quarterback.
Those are nice. It’s about time the NFL let teams get more creative with the different colored helmets. There should be some solid alternates this year.
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I don't know about "great" but I personally think that Mayfield can be a very good quarterback. He was playing well before he got hurt last year and ended up playing hurt pretty much all season. The Browns did him a real disservice by allowing it. I hope he does really well for Carolina.
I think that Carolina made a very good trade there. As a Browns fan, I hope that management learned a little something about the stupidity of totally trashing and devaluing a player before you try to trade him. I doubt it.
I agree it was a good trade. The Panthers gave up very little and won't have to pay most of the salary Mayfield's due.
He played pretty darn well in 2020, including a great performance in a playoff win at Pittsburgh, and we Panthers fans are hoping that a healthy, motivated Mayfield could make our team one of the NFL's surprise stories this season. The Panthers have some offensive weapons (if McCaffrey stays healthy) and they've upgraded what had been a horrible line ... so come on, Baker, show us what you've got!
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Talk about digging up an old quote:
Quote from: MU82 on July 11, 1970, 05:13:30 PM
... but I'd rather they had a great quarterback.
(Lions fan snorts) Yeah, like that matters.
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Talk about digging up an old quote:
Quote from: MU82 on July 11, 1970, 05:13:30 PM
... but I'd rather they had a great quarterback.
(Lions fan snorts) Yeah, like that matters.
Wut? I was 9 years old on July 11, 1970.
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Those are nice. It’s about time the NFL let teams get more creative with the different colored helmets. There should be some solid alternates this year.
I LOVE LOVE the Bengals white alternate helmets they teased this week
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I LOVE LOVE the Bengals white alternate helmets they teased this week
Yeah those are nice. I have yet to see an alternate that I don’t like quite a bit.
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Those are nice. It’s about time the NFL let teams get more creative with the different colored helmets. There should be some solid alternates this year.
I don’t think they are doing it to make fans happy. These new look unis are money trees.
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I don’t think they are doing it to make fans happy. These new look unis are money trees.
Did they change the uniform rule? I thought it was just allowing a second helmet now. Not many fans are buying helmets.
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These Panthers helmets are great - best adaptation of the new shell rule, at least until the Bengals' pictures leak. The Saints black lids are gross...they should have gone white
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Bakhtiari going on the PUP can’t be great.
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Bakhtiari going on the PUP can’t be great.
Yeah that isn't great. He can come off anytime before first game, but yeah... he might be done if this doesn't resolve soon.
He's been very open with his recovery.
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Bakhtiari going on the PUP can’t be great.
He wants out. My sources tell me him and Rodgers had a major blowup in the locker
Room before the NFC Championship game
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Texans rookie John Metchie diagnosed with leukemia, likely to miss 2022 season
https://sports.yahoo.com/texans-rookie-john-metchie-diagnosed-with-leukemia-likely-to-miss-2022-season-185627714.html
Houston rookie wide receiver John Metchie III said in a statement through the Texans that he was diagnosed with Acute Promyelocytic Leukemia (APL). He said he is receiving great medical care and expects to recover, but will likely miss the 2022 NFL season because of it.
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He wants out. My sources tell me him and Rodgers had a major blowup in the locker
Room before the NFC Championship game
Why were they in the locker room for the 49ers/Rams NFC Championship game?
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Why were they in the locker room for the 49ers/Rams NFC Championship game?
Rodgers was trying to broker a trade to the 49ers and Shanahan invited him to the game. Bahk found out and confronted him at the game. Big blowout
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Why were they in the locker room for the 49ers/Rams NFC Championship game?
Rico is trolling.
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Rico is trolling.
You can believe the lane stream media like The View or me. Your choice
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Texans rookie John Metchie diagnosed with leukemia, likely to miss 2022 season
https://sports.yahoo.com/texans-rookie-john-metchie-diagnosed-with-leukemia-likely-to-miss-2022-season-185627714.html
Houston rookie wide receiver John Metchie III said in a statement through the Texans that he was diagnosed with Acute Promyelocytic Leukemia (APL). He said he is receiving great medical care and expects to recover, but will likely miss the 2022 NFL season because of it.
Advances in treating leukemia have come a long way. I can remember Red Skelton making a heartfelt plea at the end of his weekly TV show back in the 1950s in raising funds for leukemia research after the death of his 8 year old son succumbed to the disease. Then there was the tragic story of Ernie Davis. It is gratifying that the word leukemia is no longer a certain death sentence it once was.
The movie the Express is well worth the time. It is the story about Ernie Davis the first African American to win the Heisman Trophy.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0469903/
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Advances in treating leukemia have come a long way. I can remember Red Skelton making a heartfelt plea at the end of his weekly TV show back in the 1950s in raising funds for leukemia research after the death of his 8 year old son succumbed to the disease. Then there was the tragic story of Ernie Davis. It is gratifying that the word leukemia is no longer a certain death sentence it once was.
The movie the Express is well worth the time. It is the story about Ernie Davis the first African American to win the Heisman Trophy.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0469903/
Let's not forget Al McGuire.
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Advances in treating leukemia have come a long way. I can remember Red Skelton making a heartfelt plea at the end of his weekly TV show back in the 1950s in raising funds for leukemia research after the death of his 8 year old son succumbed to the disease. Then there was the tragic story of Ernie Davis. It is gratifying that the word leukemia is no longer a certain death sentence it once was.
The movie the Express is well worth the time. It is the story about Ernie Davis the first African American to win the Heisman Trophy.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0469903/
This is all true. As many of you know, back in 2014, my then four year old son was diagnosed with AML leukemia. There's no "good leukemia" and AML has the worst survival rate of all forms of leukemia. The reality of things is that had my son been born in 1995, instead of 2010, it probably would have turned out very differently (that's the best way I can put it).
Need more Be The Match donors though, if you've ever thought about it, it's easy to get tested, and very much can save someone's life.
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The details coming out about the Kyler Murray contract are ... interesting?
Did the Cardinals just guarantee $160 million to a guy they don't trust?
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The details coming out about the Kyler Murray contract ate ... interesting?
Did the Cardinals just guarantee $160 million to a guy they don't trust?
The Athletic came out with their QB tiers today based off of the opinions of coaches, GMs, coordinators and scouts. The 2 highest paid QBs are ranked 9th and 13th. Neither is considered a Tier 1 QB.
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The Athletic came out with their QB tiers today based off of the opinions of coaches, GMs, coordinators and scouts. The 2 highest paid QBs are ranked 9th and 13th. Neither is considered a Tier 1 QB.
Not surprising, it seems like whoever signed most recently is the highest paid, regardless of performance. That said, the Brown's contract with Watson is a major head scratcher. Typical Browns. ::)
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Not surprising, it seems like whoever signed most recently is the highest paid, regardless of performance. That said, the Brown's contract with Watson is a major head scratcher. Typical Browns. ::)
Watson would be totally worth it, if not for the off the field stuff, at least his actual performance as a QB justifies the money. He was tremendous in 2020. Not like a guy who needs a preparation stipulation in his contract.
He's fun to watch when he's at his best, but Ive thought Murray was a clown without personality and a lame attitude going back to his OU days. Nothing has changed that sentiment since he got to the NFL
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Not sure it's a great sign that the Cardinals felt they had to include a mandatory 4-hours-per-week of film watching in Murray's contract.
EDIT: Here's a take by The Athletic's Chris Branch:
Buried in Murray’s deal is the most juvenile contract clause possible for a professional athlete: Do your homework, alright?
NFL Network reported Monday that Murray will be required to do at least four hours of “independent study” before each week’s game. This study material will be provided by the team, and time spent in team meetings for normal game prep does not count toward the four hours. Yes, this is a real thing.
To earn those four hours of weekly credit, the team will monitor Murray’s iPad usage to ensure he avoids activity that might “distract his attention” (actual contract language!) while he does this independent study.
This sounds perfectly fine for a middle-school assignment. I’ll even allow a tightly run college sports program. But this? For adults? Absurd. The amount of suspicion and mistrust baked into this contract — which could default, by the way, if Murray fails to adhere to the homework — is honestly bonkers.
Two true things: It’s a bad look for Murray for obvious reasons, and an equally bad look for the Cardinals, who were concerned enough about Murray’s preparation to put this clause in … but are still paying him $160 million guaranteed anyway.
Good luck to all involved.
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Ok guys, I don't live in the Chicago area, but it seems the Bears are moving to Arlington Heights where they will build a new stadium.
Do you think it will happen?
I know many New Yorkers were unhappy when the Jets and Giants moved out of the city to play in Jersey, but that was so long ago no one cares anymore.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/26/chicago-bears-solider-field-renovations-plans-dome-arlington-heights-nfl
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It will happen and most Bears fans will be fine. Arlington Heights is pretty accessible.
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Ok guys, I don't live in the Chicago area, but it seems the Bears are moving to Arlington Heights where they will build a new stadium.
Do you think it will happen?
I know many New Yorkers were unhappy when the Jets and Giants moved out of the city to play in Jersey, but that was so long ago no one cares anymore.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/26/chicago-bears-solider-field-renovations-plans-dome-arlington-heights-nfl
Yes, it will happen. Still years away, but it is a no brainer for the organization. The lack of owning their own stadium has always handicapped the Bears organization revenue wise. Arlington Heights is their opportunity to solve this.
On the fan side, Soldier Field is not a good place to watch a game. Outside a few voices, I doubt it will be all that missed. Also, most of the STHs live in the suburbs anyway.
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Yes, it will happen. Still years away, but it is a no brainer for the organization. The lack of owning their own stadium has always handicapped the Bears organization revenue wise. Arlington Heights is their opportunity to solve this.
On the fan side, Soldier Field is not a good place to watch a game. Outside a few voices, I doubt it will be all that missed. Also, most of the STHs live in the suburbs anyway.
Will the the stadium be mostly paid for by the Bears or will the state kick in some dough? I know NY state is kicking in in excess of a billion dollars to build a new stadium in Buffalo where as the Jets and Giants paid for 90% of 1.5 billion for Metlife stadium. The Jets ownership wanted a retractable roof but the Giants nixed that part of the the deal, so no roof which I thought was a dumb move.
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Will the the stadium be mostly paid for by the Bears or will the state kick in some dough? I know NY state is kicking in in excess of a billion dollars to build a new stadium in Buffalo where as the Jets and Giants paid for 90% of 1.5 billion for Metlife stadium. The Jets ownership wanted a retractable roof but the Giants nixed that part of the the deal, so no roof which I thought was a dumb move.
TBD. I don't see the Bears getting a huge chunk of government money for this project. However, it is likely they receive some funds for at least infrastructure improvements around the new site. This is going to be a huge complex. Also, it will be a dome stadium to host other large scale events. That's a guarantee.
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Yes, it will happen. Still years away, but it is a no brainer for the organization. The lack of owning their own stadium has always handicapped the Bears organization revenue wise. Arlington Heights is their opportunity to solve this.
On the fan side, Soldier Field is not a good place to watch a game. Outside a few voices, I doubt it will be all that missed. Also, most of the STHs live in the suburbs anyway.
YEP. I'm a big Bears fan, have been since I was a little kid. In the decade I lived in Chicago, I actually turned down Bears tickets more times than I went to an actual game. By a comfortable margin. Not a great place to watch a game and once you get to late October/November, its downright uncomfortable.
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YEP. I'm a big Bears fan, have been since I was a little kid. In the decade I lived in Chicago, I actually turned down Bears tickets more times than I went to an actual game. By a comfortable margin. Not a great place to watch a game and once you get to late October/November, its downright uncomfortable.
This is an interesting comment and one that applies across both the NFL and college.
Unless your franchise is uber successful, actually going to a game in a northern climate is often a chore. The viewing experience from the comfort of your living room has become a much simpler and oftentimes, better viewing experience.
The college games are long and so full of commercials, watching at the stadium is tedious at this point. The Big Ten schools are learning this the hard way. You may have sold out games based on ticket sales but actually having full attendance? Not so much.
The NFL remains unique enough that it isn’t as glaring, but look at Ford Field and Soldier Field late in the season. Lots of empty seats. Mix in night games across the season and the in-stadium experience has lessened through the years.
There are unicorns, such as Green Bay but it wasn’t that long ago, there were plenty of Sundays in the 80’e when tickets could be gotten for cheap or simply couldn’t be given away.
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There are unicorns, such as Green Bay but it wasn’t that long ago, there were plenty of Sundays in the 80’e when tickets could be gotten for cheap or simply couldn’t be given away.
Even Packer tickets in December are insanely easy to get for a pretty cheap price. I probably could have found under face tickets for the 49er playoff game last January, but I had no desire to go.
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On the fan side, Soldier Field is not a good place to watch a game.
I'm no expert, but I actually like the stadium to watch a game. This is the first time I've heard complaints about the stadium for actual game experience. Everyone I've talked to thinks it rates very high. Now it is on the small side which helps. Most everyone agrees it looks terrible and game day access & parking are not good. Compared to Denver where I've had lower level, club level, upper level and even a suite for one year, I prefer Soldier Field for watching a game.
I'd be cool with Arlington Heights and I think I'd really only miss the lakefront.
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YEP. I'm a big Bears fan, have been since I was a little kid. In the decade I lived in Chicago, I actually turned down Bears tickets more times than I went to an actual game. By a comfortable margin. Not a great place to watch a game and once you get to late October/November, its downright uncomfortable.
When I'm in my seat, watching the game and weather isn't a major factor, Soldier Field is on par with the other handful of NFL stadiums I've been to. It's everything else about the experience that's worse. Concessions are lacking, the concourses are narrow and bland, the bathroom lines are awful, getting in and out of the stadium is bad, and getting in and out of the parking lots is worse.
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When I'm in my seat, watching the game and weather isn't a major factor, Soldier Field is on par with the other handful of NFL stadiums I've been to. It's everything else about the experience that's worse. Concessions are lacking, the concourses are narrow and bland, the bathroom lines are awful, getting in and out of the stadium is bad, and getting in and out of the parking lots is worse.
And that’s why the move is a no-brained for them IMO. The game day experience is more than just the game now or has to be
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And that’s why the move is a no-brained for them IMO. The game day experience is more than just the game now or has to be
More than that, between hosting other events and developing the surrounding land, moving to Arlington Heights will pretty much allow the Bears to print money. Most people don't realize how big that Arlington Park property is. The land needed for the stadium and parking will take up only about a quarter of the site.
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I'm no expert, but I actually like the stadium to watch a game. This is the first time I've heard complaints about the stadium for actual game experience. Everyone I've talked to thinks it rates very high. Now it is on the small side which helps. Most everyone agrees it looks terrible and game day access & parking are not good. Compared to Denver where I've had lower level, club level, upper level and even a suite for one year, I prefer Soldier Field for watching a game.
I'd be cool with Arlington Heights and I think I'd really only miss the lakefront.
I was speaking about the full experience. I agree with you, the viewing experience is good.
However, everything else about attending a game at Soldier Field is bad to completely sucks.
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More than that, between hosting other events and developing the surrounding land, moving to Arlington Heights will pretty much allow the Bears to print money. Most people don't realize how big that Arlington Park property is. Th land needed for the stadium and parking will take up only about a quarter of the site.
Agree. Calling it a new stadium is an undersell. It really will be a large scale entertainment and shopping complex.
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More than that, between hosting other events and developing the surrounding land, moving to Arlington Heights will pretty much allow the Bears to print money. Most people don't realize how big that Arlington Park property is. The land needed for the stadium and parking will take up only about a quarter of the site.
Yup. I understand tradition and all that. If Soldier Field could provide anything close to Arlington Park, you’d stay but they simply can’t.
Packers have been pretty smart about this with regards to upgrading the Lambeau experience. Until I started traveling for more sporting events did I understand what a bonus having these districts are. In Milwaukee, if I were the Brewers, that’s what they need to start doing around AmFam
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In Milwaukee, if I were the Brewers, that’s what they need to start doing around AmFam
Agreed and there is talk about developing areas of the parking lots like that.
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Agreed and there is talk about developing areas of the parking lots like that.
I love tailgating and it’s part of the culture but I wouldn’t complain about other options
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Agreed and there is talk about developing areas of the parking lots like that.
The areas along the river from 94 down to Fredrick Miller way should be developed into space for commerce. The areas West of the stadium and East of Mitchell Blvd should similarly be developed.
If more space is needed for the vision parking structures should be built to compensate for the missing parking and land should be reclaimed from the lots.
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I know this is the NFL thread, but the Sox may end up in Arlington as well. A lot of Sox fans don’t realize it, but come 2031, they aren’t playing at 35th & Shields any longer.
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I know this is the NFL thread, but the Sox may end up in Arlington as well. A lot of Sox fans don’t realize it, but come 2031, they aren’t playing at 35th & Shields any longer.
The last cookie cutter stadium built. Bad timing like the Trop
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I know this is the NFL thread, but the Sox may end up in Arlington as well. A lot of Sox fans don’t realize it, but come 2031, they aren’t playing at 35th & Shields any longer.
I'd like to think this is true, but I have a hard time believing Reinsdorf is going to fund a stadium on his own and I can't imagine there's any chance the state legislature or Cook County coughs up money to move a team out of Chicago.
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I'd like to think this is true, but I have a hard time believing Reinsdorf is going to fund a stadium on his own and I can't imagine there's any chance the state legislature or Cook County coughs up money to move a team out of Chicago.
Will Jerry be around to make that call? Does Michael want to keep the Sox? Will this be an issue for new ownership?
I think the future of the Sox on both the ownership and stadium front is murky.
To bring this back on topic, Arlington Heights is huge for the Bears because it helps solidify the franchise prior to Virginia's passing.
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I'd like to think this is true, but I have a hard time believing Reinsdorf is going to fund a stadium on his own and I can't imagine there's any chance the state legislature or Cook County coughs up money to move a team out of Chicago.
The “planned obsolescence” clause in the original naming rights deal (pushed out to 2029, option for 2030 when Guaranteed Rate took over) all but assured the Sox are playing elsewhere in 2031. The last 3 years of the deal, ISFA has a clause where they’re not on the hook for any improvements.
Either Reinsdorf thought he’d be dead by 2026/2027, or he plans on selling in the next few years.
I agree with everything you said, but there is a definite showdown coming between the Sox and the city/state in some capacity. There’s no way MLB will host the 2033 MLB All Star Game at an “outdated” Sox park.
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The “planned obsolescence” clause in the original naming rights deal (pushed out to 2029, option for 2030 when Guaranteed Rate took over) all but assured the Sox are playing elsewhere in 2031. The last 3 years of the deal, ISFA has a clause where they’re not on the hook for any improvements.
Either Reinsdorf thought he’d be dead by 2026/2027, or he plans on selling in the next few years.
I agree with everything you said, but there is a definite showdown coming between the Sox and the city/state in some capacity. There’s no way MLB will host the 2033 MLB All Star Game at an “outdated” Sox park.
It is hard to believe but Dodger stadium is the 3rd oldest park in the Majors and I don't think that park is "outdated". Perhaps the Sox are looking for a better location. It amazes me that some stadiums that are not even 40 years old are being replaced. As some have said it is not about the game anymore but the "experience".
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It is hard to believe but Dodger stadium is the 3rd oldest park in the Majors and I don't think that park is "outdated". Perhaps the Sox are looking for a better location. It amazes me that some stadiums that are not even 40 years old are being replaced. As some have said it is not about the game anymore but the "experience".
40 years is a long time. How long should these places last? 40 years ago there was no internet, and MTV was just coming on the air. More than half the people currently alive were not born.
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40 years is a long time. How long should these places last? 40 years ago there was no internet, and MTV was just coming on the air. More than half the people currently alive were not born.
So the Sox will get their third stadium while the Cubs stay at Wrigley, go figure; not to mention Fenway, though those venues do have their charm. If you put a winning team on the field the place where they play won't matter much, at least to the fans.
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It is hard to believe but Dodger stadium is the 3rd oldest park in the Majors and I don't think that park is "outdated". Perhaps the Sox are looking for a better location. It amazes me that some stadiums that are not even 40 years old are being replaced. As some have said it is not about the game anymore but the "experience".
40? You have two that were less than 30 replaced recently - for the Rangers and the Braves.
The problem with a lot of stadiums is that they aren't maintained well at all. If the team is in charge of it, they really won't do much because they'd rather just get a new stadium in the end. If the municipality is, they oftentimes don't allocate enough.
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So the Sox will get their third stadium while the Cubs stay at Wrigley, go figure; not to mention Fenway, though those venues do have their charm. If you put a winning team on the field the place where they play won't matter much, at least to the fans.
Look at the Cardinals. Almost 1/4 of the stadium is filled nightly
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So the Sox will get their third stadium while the Cubs stay at Wrigley, go figure; not to mention Fenway, though those venues do have their charm. If you put a winning team on the field the place where they play won't matter much, at least to the fans.
Cool. Fenway and Wrigley both suck.
They've tricked their fans into them being classic so they don't have to upgrade. 8-)
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Cool. Fenway and Wrigley both suck.
They've tricked their fans into them being classic so they don't have to upgrade. 8-)
Even as a Cubs fan I would agree with you, but new Wrigley after the facelift is much improved.
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As a Bear season ticket subscriber for 27 years, I've been in both the "old" and "new" Soldier Field as well as Champaign.
I concur with other comments in this thread. The new Soldier Field is a great place to watch a game, once you're inside. We were in 438 near the top for many years and it was incredible what you saw on the field compared to the view of television. The game was much more real. For the last five years or so, we moved down to Row 12 in 438 and it was fantastic. But climbing Mt. McCaskey to get up to upper level seats -- ugh!!! I had friends that would not go with me because that climb was way too stressful.
Getting to Soldier Field, getting access to amenities and getting into and out of the stadium was a nightmare. My fear was that someone was going to be crushed to death exiting the 300/400 level and headed downstairs. And the buses to Millennium Park -- yikes. Cattle being led to slaughter are treated more humanely. They could not have built a stadium in a place more unfriendly for most of Chicago.
For a $300 million cost overrun, you think they could have done better.
As to Arlington Heights, they Gone! There is nothing the Mayor and the Governor can do short of condemning about 100 acres of land somewhere and giving it to the Bears. That, I guarantee, will not happen. The Mayor and her hench-people are protecting the interests of the Chicago Park District.
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Not sure it's a great sign that the Cardinals felt they had to include a mandatory 4-hours-per-week of film watching in Murray's contract.
They removed the clause from the contract yesterday because it made both sides look idiotic.
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Heard today on ESPN radio an interview with him, I think from when he was a rookie. He said he doesn't need to study and do that all 24 hr stuff. He knows what's coming. Its all in his head. He doesn't need to view previous games of the opponents, or even his own past games, becuz he knows what's coming...lol 8-)
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Deshaun Watson's suspension is two games fewer than Mychal Kendricks got for insider trading.
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Deshaun Watson's suspension is two games fewer than Mychal Kendricks got for insider trading.
Pretty disgraceful
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Deshaun Watson's suspension is two games fewer than Mychal Kendricks got for insider trading.
This is a good time to remember Kendricks' had one of the stupidest and most hilariously flagrant insider trading records of all time.
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Deshaun Watson's suspension is two games fewer than Mychal Kendricks got for insider trading.
Justice is based on who was victimized. As Scott Galloway likes to point out, Elizabeth Holmes didn't get prosecuted because her crapty blood tests didn't work for consumers, she got prosecuted because her lies screwed over wealthy investors.
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Justice is based on who was victimized. As Scott Galloway likes to point out, Elizabeth Holmes didn't get prosecuted because her crapty blood tests didn't work for consumers, she got prosecuted because her lies screwed over wealthy investors.
Women don’t matter. In society, but especially in sports. The man is a serial sexual predator who is so evil that he has to have a clause in his contract that he can only get massages under team supervision.
His punishment? A $300,000 fine. Enjoy America, women.
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Deshaun Watson's suspension is two games fewer than Mychal Kendricks got for insider trading.
One difference is Kendricks plead guilty where Watson has only settled. I would like to think the penalty would be much harsher if he was found guilty. Granted, the prison sentence would likely outweigh the NFL suspension.
I’m not sure if the NFL also took into account that he missed all of last year.
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One difference is Kendricks plead guilty where Watson has only settled. I would like to think the penalty would be much harsher if he was found guilty. Granted, the prison sentence would likely outweigh the NFL suspension.
I’m not sure if the NFL also took into account that he missed all of last year.
This still will be appealed and Goodell will get final say. I would like to think he will increase the punishment especially considering the flak he took for the Ray Rice debacle.
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One difference is Kendricks plead guilty where Watson has only settled. I would like to think the penalty would be much harsher if he was found guilty. Granted, the prison sentence would likely outweigh the NFL suspension.
I’m not sure if the NFL also took into account that he missed all of last year.
To be clear, this wasn't the decision of thr NFL. It's a retired judge hired to decide the matter.
And her rationale for the slap on the wrist is pretty appalling. Essentially, she found that the NFL proved Watson committed sexual assault, endangered others and harmed the league, but because players in similar circumstances only got six games (looking at you, Ben), that's how she must also find.
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https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/08/02/nfl-suspends-stephen-ross-for-tampering-with-sean-payton-tom-brady/
Between this and the whole "Tank for Tua" scenario, it doesn't seem like Stephen Ross is a very competent owner.
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https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/08/02/nfl-suspends-stephen-ross-for-tampering-with-sean-payton-tom-brady/
Between this and the whole "Tank for Tua" scenario, it doesn't seem like Stephen Ross is a very competent owner.
Fits in well with the majority of NFL owners
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To be clear, this wasn't the decision of thr NFL. It's a retired judge hired to decide the matter.
And her rationale for the slap on the wrist is pretty appalling. Essentially, she found that the NFL proved Watson committed sexual assault, endangered others and harmed the league, but because players in similar circumstances only got six games (looking at you, Ben), that's how she must also find.
Thanks for the background. Jockey too.
Will be interesting to see where it goes from here.
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https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/08/02/nfl-suspends-stephen-ross-for-tampering-with-sean-payton-tom-brady/
Between this and the whole "Tank for Tua" scenario, it doesn't seem like Stephen Ross is a very competent owner.
I am a life long Dolphin fan. He is not.
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Good metaphor for the Browns' decision to go all-in on Watson: https://twitter.com/i/status/1558229380656254977.
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Some rookie apparently booted a 82 yard punt yesterday? How is that humanly possible?
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Google 'Punt god'. All will be explained.
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Some rookie apparently booted a 82 yard punt yesterday? How is that humanly possible?
By kicking the football
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After watching my Bears yesterday, I really think they could be the first 0-17 team in NFL history.
I wonder if Matt Eberflus (a curios choice for head coach) is a sacrificial lamb for the rebuild. He may be a decent coach but I give him about 5% chance to be the coach in two years.
As Bears fans, we are going to have to trust "The Process".
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After watching my Bears yesterday, I really think they could be the first 0-17 team in NFL history.
I wonder if Matt Eberflus (a curios choice for head coach) is a sacrificial lamb for the rebuild. He may be a decent coach but I give him about 5% chance to be the coach in two years.
As Bears fans, we are going to have to trust "The Process".
After "trusting" the process for 28 years, I've had enough.
I'm not of the belief they will go 0-17, but I think 3-14 is reasonable. I think they'll make the Detroit Lions look good.
The Roquan Smith problem is indicative of the Bears. They have one of the 100 best players in the NFL but they refuse to give him a contract. And they won't trade him. Even though they traded arguably their best defensive player, Khalil Mack, to San Diego.
This team has no wide outs, no defense secondary and an offensive line that will have Justin Fields flat on his back more than a lady of the evening. They'll beat the Packers just in time for the second coming of St. Vincent of Green Bay.
I was a season ticket holder for years. I gave my tickets up this year because I'm moving and because no hope for this team and no value in holding the tickets. They will suck seawater until they move to Arlington Heights between 2027 and 2029. Until then, count on the McCaskeys to be the McCheapos.
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After "trusting" the process for 28 years, I've had enough.
I'm not of the belief they will go 0-17, but I think 3-14 is reasonable. I think they'll make the Detroit Lions look good.
The Roquan Smith problem is indicative of the Bears. They have one of the 100 best players in the NFL but they refuse to give him a contract. And they won't trade him. Even though they traded arguably their best defensive player, Khalil Mack, to San Diego.
This team has no wide outs, no defense secondary and an offensive line that will have Justin Fields flat on his back more than a lady of the evening. They'll beat the Packers just in time for the second coming of St. Vincent of Green Bay.
I was a season ticket holder for years. I gave my tickets up this year because I'm moving and because no hope for this team and no value in holding the tickets. They will suck seawater until they move to Arlington Heights between 2027 and 2029. Until then, count on the McCaskeys to be the McCheapos.
1. Roquan does not deserve to be the highest paid LB in the league
2. The defensive secondary is going to be very good
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1. Roquan does not deserve to be the highest paid LB in the league
True, but when your team sucks, you have to make compromises. Roquan is a compromise that needs to happen. He's the only lights out player on that defense.
2. The defensive secondary is going to be very good.
In your dreams. They're going to be picked apart by every average or better quarterback in the league. Give a quarterback time and that secondary will be the Burnt Toast of the NFL.
Every team in the division has a better quarterback than the Bears do and the wide receivers came straight from Libertyville High School. Fields will have 0.5 seconds to throw before he's nailed again and again and again. He may be the second coming of Tom Brady and Joe Montana but he's going to be running for his life.
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Overpaying for talent is what bad franchises do.
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Every team in the division has a better quarterback than the Bears do and the wide receivers came straight from Libertyville High School. Fields will have 0.5 seconds to throw before he's nailed again and again and again. He may be the second coming of Tom Brady and Joe Montana but he's going to be running for his life.
I cant believe I'm defending this terrible roster, but thats just silly. Mooney just came off a 1000 yard season despite playing in a horrific offense with a QB running for his life. Pringle had a really nice season in his first opportunity at any sort of an expanded role in KC and doesn't drop the ball. And Velus Jones Jr is a potential WEAPON and has looked really nice during camp. This WR core is nowhere near as bad as the early 2000s debacles.
Also, you realize that a DB/secondary can be very good even if they aren't put in good positions to succeed. The secondary is young but extremely talent. Jaylon Johnson had a really good rookie season. Kyler Gordon and Brisker are both super promising. Just because QBs have time and there is no push upfront doesn't mean the secondary sucks.
This team is gonna be bad, but dramatically trashing every single position group on shaky ground just makes you sound like a Chicken Little meatball fan who calls into The Score after every loss freaking out.
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Every team in the division has a better quarterback than the Bears do and the wide receivers came straight from Libertyville High School. Fields will have 0.5 seconds to throw before he's nailed again and again and again. He may be the second coming of Tom Brady and Joe Montana but he's going to be running for his life.
Fields is better than Rodgers
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I cant believe I'm defending this terrible roster, but thats just silly. Mooney just came off a 1000 yard season despite playing in a horrific offense with a QB running for his life. Pringle had a really nice season in his first opportunity at any sort of an expanded role in KC and doesn't drop the ball. And Velus Jones Jr is a potential WEAPON and has looked really nice during camp. This WR core is nowhere near as bad as the early 2000s debacles.
Also, you realize that a DB/secondary can be very good even if they aren't put in good positions to succeed. The secondary is young but extremely talent. Jaylon Johnson had a really good rookie season. Kyler Gordon and Brisker are both super promising. Just because QBs have time and there is no push upfront doesn't mean the secondary sucks.
This team is gonna be bad, but dramatically trashing every single position group on shaky ground just makes you sound like a Chicken Little meatball fan who calls into The Score after every loss freaking out.
Brother Wags:
1) I've never called the Score and I don't think I've listened to 670 since it converted from all news years ago.
2) I'm a die hard Packers fan who loves pro football -- hence the Bears tickets. I've enjoyed some of the more interesting Bears games over the years, including the ones where Green Bay won! I have a soft spot for the Bears but even their own grandmothers acknowledge they're going to suck this year!
3) The Bears will go cheap until Arlington Heights is about ready to open. For you Bear fans, that means five to seven years of non-stop crap football.
4) You may have a higher opinion of their position groupings than I do. But they still suck!
6) Fields > Rodgers? In what universe???????
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Brother Wags:
1) I've never called the Score and I don't think I've listened to 670 since it converted from all news years ago.
2) I'm a die hard Packers fan who loves pro football -- hence the Bears tickets. I've enjoyed some of the more interesting Bears games over the years, including the ones where Green Bay won! I have a soft spot for the Bears but even their own grandmothers acknowledge they're going to suck this year!
3) The Bears will go cheap until Arlington Heights is about ready to open. For you Bear fans, that means five to seven years of non-stop crap football.
4) You may have a higher opinion of their position groupings than I do. But they still suck!
6) Fields > Rodgers? In what universe???????
So, nothing fundamentally changes.
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Fields is better than Rodgers
In the 40 YD dash?
I like Fields but I could see a scenario where Rodgers is still in the NFL and Fields is not. I wouldn't bet on it but it wouldn't shock me.
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Fields is better than Rodgers
Rodgers is much better than Fields at publicly ripping his receivers.
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Rodgers is much better than Fields at publicly ripping his receivers.
When Brady does it, he is a great leader who is ultra competitive.
When Rodgers does it, he is toxic.
Keep that in mind.
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When Brady does it, he is a great leader who is ultra competitive.
When Rodgers does it, he is toxic.
Keep that in mind.
It's almost as if a 7 rings matter.
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It's almost as if a 7 rings matter.
non sequiter
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non sequiter
Not at all.
When you're the greatest winner in the history of the sport and a guy with a famed work ethic dedication to his craft, it buys a ton of credibility when it comes to setting and enforcing high expectations for teammates.
On the other hand, when you're a guy who consistently underachieves when it matters most and spends the offseason tripping in Peru, people tend to take you a little less seriously when you complain about others not living up to your expectations.
You don't have to like it, but them's the facts.
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Rodgers is a proven loser. Fields still hasn’t had enough reps to prove that he is a loser, too. It’s possible he’s a bigger loser than Rodgers. Time will tell
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Rodgers is a proven loser. Fields still hasn’t had enough reps to prove that he is a loser, too. It’s possible he’s a bigger loser than Rodgers. Time will tell
As a Bears fan, I'd take that proven loser every day of the week and twice on Sundays.
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Not at all.
When you're the greatest winner in the history of the sport and a guy with a famed work ethic dedication to his craft, it buys a ton of credibility when it comes to setting and enforcing high expectations for teammates.
On the other hand, when you're a guy who consistently underachieves when it matters most and spends the offseason tripping in Peru, people tend to take you a little less seriously when you complain about others not living up to your expectations.
You don't have to like it, but them's the facts.
The point I'm making is that ESPN has a clear anti-Rodgers slant in almost all of it's writing.
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As a Bears fan, I'd take that proven loser every day of the week and twice on Sundays.
If you like meaningless stats, he’s your guy
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Watson gets 11 games and a $5 million fine.
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The point I'm making is that ESPN has a clear anti-Rodgers slant in almost all of it's writing.
I'm not sure which ESPN writing you're referring to. In the instance I reference, Rodgers went off in public. Everyone saw the video, which spoke for itself.
The media does eat that stuff up because it's so much juicier than usual QB-speak or coach-speak, but stuff like that is almost always better handled face-to-face and in private.
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Watson gets 11 games and a $5 million fine.
Got off easy.
Edit: wasn’t meant to be a pun.
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Got off easy.
Edit: wasn’t meant to be a pun.
I thought so.
The whole thing is gross. I want to come down on the NFL but I’m not sure what other recourse they have other than to blackball Watson. That was off the table once Cleveland gave him that crazy deal.
He’s a predator and an example of how talent will always trump doing the right thing with regards to employing athletes. The NFL might care about women but they prove time and time again they might not.
It’s sad they won’t actually be hurt financially by this but will be business as usual. There’s a whole topic worth of items that make sports leagues gross but the majority of the world simply doesn’t care. I have no moral high ground here. I have little doubt the NFL will be on in my house this year
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I thought so.
The whole thing is gross. I want to come down on the NFL but I’m not sure what other recourse they have other than to blackball Watson. That was off the table once Cleveland gave him that crazy deal.
He’s a predator and an example of how talent will always trump doing the right thing with regards to employing athletes. The NFL might care about women but they prove time and time again they might not.
It’s sad they won’t actually be hurt financially by this but will be business as usual. There’s a whole topic worth of items that make sports leagues gross but the majority of the world simply doesn’t care. I have no moral high ground here. I have little doubt the NFL will be on in my house this year
Yep.
I also don't understand what makes the NFL think having the owners issue statements like this is a good idea.
https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1560301469030653954?s=20&t=l2QgKTOm83f9SWMp65_-QQ
Everyone knows they aren't going to invest significant time or money into that. Why even say something that ridiculous?
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I thought so.
The whole thing is gross. I want to come down on the NFL but I’m not sure what other recourse they have other than to blackball Watson. That was off the table once Cleveland gave him that crazy deal.
He’s a predator and an example of how talent will always trump doing the right thing with regards to employing athletes. The NFL might care about women but they prove time and time again they might not.
It’s sad they won’t actually be hurt financially by this but will be business as usual. There’s a whole topic worth of items that make sports leagues gross but the majority of the world simply doesn’t care. I have no moral high ground here. I have little doubt the NFL will be on in my house this year
This is dead on. Its disappointing but its also straight in line with the precedent that the NFL has set forever. And also why I find it hard to gin up the same level of negative feelings and outrage for the LIV Tour as some do. Not that I embrace it, I just kind of shrug. I think...
1) sportwashing is overblown, IMO, because I find it hard to believe that people would ever have their feelings significantly changed about a country's reputation cause they owned a soccer club or a golf tour.
2) Professional sports is overrun with unsavory activity and detestable characters, whether athletes, governing bodies, or ownership. And its not a uniquely American thing. Look at European soccer. Look at scandals and ownership in top level cricket. The list goes on and on. Love of sport, and the money that comes with it, trumps all.
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This is dead on. Its disappointing but its also straight in line with the precedent that the NFL has set forever. And also why I find it hard to gin up the same level of negative feelings and outrage for the LIV Tour as some do. Not that I embrace it, I just kind of shrug. I think...
1) sportwashing is overblown, IMO, because I find it hard to believe that people would ever have their feelings significantly changed about a country's reputation cause they owned a soccer club or a golf tour.
2) Professional sports is overrun with unsavory activity and detestable characters, whether athletes, governing bodies, or ownership. And its not a uniquely American thing. Look at European soccer. Look at scandals and ownership in top level cricket. The list goes on and on. Love of sport, and the money that comes with it, trumps all.
There’s probably a correlation between where we are as a society (local, nationally, worldly) based on fan behavior but that’s above my pay grade
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Yep.
I also don't understand what makes the NFL think having the owners issue statements like this is a good idea.
https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1560301469030653954?s=20&t=l2QgKTOm83f9SWMp65_-QQ
Everyone knows they aren't going to invest significant time or money into that. Why even say something that ridiculous?
Pretty straight forward.
We are against sexually assaulting women except if it helps us win games and make us more money. But, otherwise, we're with all you little ladies.
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I'm not sure which ESPN writing you're referring to. In the instance I reference, Rodgers went off in public. Everyone saw the video, which spoke for itself.
The media does eat that stuff up because it's so much juicier than usual QB-speak or coach-speak, but stuff like that is almost always better handled face-to-face and in private.
It is basically a meme that if ESPN publishes a story about Rodgers it will have a negative slant.
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It is basically a meme that if ESPN publishes a story about Rodgers it will have a negative slant.
Most players - when they want to get some info out in public - talk to one of the 'insiders' at ESPN. Rodgers doesn't.
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Most players - when they want to get some info out in public - talk to one of the 'insiders' at ESPN. Rodgers doesn't.
No, he has his agent leak news to Schefter so he has plausible deniability.
He also sat down and talked at length to Kevin Van Valkenburg before the playoffs last year in a piece done for ESPN
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No, he has his agent leak news to Schefter so he has plausible deniability.
He also sat down and talked at length to Kevin Van Valkenburg before the playoffs last year in a piece done for ESPN
He just goes on Pat Macafee and says whatever he wants.
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He just goes on Pat Macafee and says whatever he wants.
That, too, but the negotiating stuff comes from the agent
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Welp, that garbage from Watson might have been the worst "apology" ever. What a douchenozzle.
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Pretty straight forward.
We are against sexually assaulting women except if it helps us win games and make us more money. But, otherwise, we're with all you little ladies.
Same thing can be said for everything.
"We are against PEDs, except when a major athlete with huge sponsor contracts pops and the sponsors tell us we are not allowed to report the positive test and take action."
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This was an entertaining read - top 10 saddest QB competitions.
https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2022/8/18/23307940/ranking-nfl-quarterback-battles-baker-mayfield-sam-darnold-drew-lock-geno-smith-panthers-seahawks
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This was an entertaining read - top 10 saddest QB competitions.
https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2022/8/18/23307940/ranking-nfl-quarterback-battles-baker-mayfield-sam-darnold-drew-lock-geno-smith-panthers-seahawks
That was fun ... and notable to me in that 3 of the 10 dreadful battles belonged to the Panthers, all in the last 20 years.
I actually moved to Charlotte just before the 2010 season and decided I'd root for the team. I somehow found it in me to watch every effen Jimmy Clausen start. I guess I'm a glutton for punishment, but by Week 10 I was all-in on the Tank For Cam train.
That this writer thinks this season's Mayfield-Darnold situation will actually be worse than that -- "I’ve got a feeling this is going to be an all-timer" -- ugh ... but I really don't see how it could possibly be true.
Ever the optimist, I'm telling myself that Mayfield will play as well as he did when he was healthy in 2020, and that will give the Panthers a chance to vastly exceed expectations. But sure ... he could suck, get benched, Darnold could be even worse, and I'll have another 5-win season to "celebrate."
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That was fun ... and notable to me in that 3 of the 10 dreadful battles belonged to the Panthers, all in the last 20 years.
I actually moved to Charlotte just before the 2010 season and decided I'd root for the team. I somehow found it in me to watch every effen Jimmy Clausen start. I guess I'm a glutton for punishment, but by Week 10 I was all-in on the Tank For Cam train.
That this writer thinks this season's Mayfield-Darnold situation will actually be worse than that -- "I’ve got a feeling this is going to be an all-timer" -- ugh ... but I really don't see how it could possibly be true.
Ever the optimist, I'm telling myself that Mayfield will play as well as he did when he was healthy in 2020, and that will give the Panthers a chance to vastly exceed expectations. But sure ... he could suck, get benched, Darnold could be even worse, and I'll have another 5-win season to "celebrate."
Not having the ‘87 Packers listed is a slap in the face of terrible QB play
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This is dead on. Its disappointing but its also straight in line with the precedent that the NFL has set forever. And also why I find it hard to gin up the same level of negative feelings and outrage for the LIV Tour as some do. Not that I embrace it, I just kind of shrug. I think...
1) sportwashing is overblown, IMO, because I find it hard to believe that people would ever have their feelings significantly changed about a country's reputation cause they owned a soccer club or a golf tour.
2) Professional sports is overrun with unsavory activity and detestable characters, whether athletes, governing bodies, or ownership. And its not a uniquely American thing. Look at European soccer. Look at scandals and ownership in top level cricket. The list goes on and on. Love of sport, and the money that comes with it, trumps all.
I knew a lot of people who said they'd never watch the NFL again after Michael Vick came back. A few weeks later, I'm at a bar watching games with them. Plenty of people claim to have boycotted due to Kaepernick, and yet ratings continue to climb. Now, the 1994 baseball strike, that turned people off for a long time.
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I knew a lot of people who said they'd never watch the NFL again after Michael Vick came back. A few weeks later, I'm at a bar watching games with them. Plenty of people claim to have boycotted due to Kaepernick, and yet ratings continue to climb. Now, the 1994 baseball strike, that turned people off for a long time.
“Greed” turns off sports fans more than criminal activity
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“Greed” turns off sports fans more than criminal activity
definitely. People could have accepted a strike, but not cancelation of the World Series, which even war couldn't cancel.
My dad didn't watch baseball for 12 years after that. It wasn't until the Tigers made the 2006 ALCS against the Yankees that he was drawn back in.
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This was an entertaining read - top 10 saddest QB competitions.
https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2022/8/18/23307940/ranking-nfl-quarterback-battles-baker-mayfield-sam-darnold-drew-lock-geno-smith-panthers-seahawks
Notable miss:
2006 Raiders - Andrew Walter vs Aaron Brooks vs Marques Tuiasosopo
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definitely. People could have accepted a strike, but not cancelation of the World Series, which even war couldn't cancel.
My dad didn't watch baseball for 12 years after that. It wasn't until the Tigers made the 2006 ALCS against the Yankees that he was drawn back in.
The World Series ratings in 1995 were higher than in 1993. They were in decline before 1994, and after a blip up, declined after 1995. World Series ratings aren't the sole indicator of baseball's popularity. Per game attendance took about a decade to recover after that, but 1995 attendance was still better than you saw in the mid to late 1980s.
So IDK. I think by and large baseball would be in the same place today without the 1994 strike.
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The World Series ratings in 1995 were higher than in 1993. They were in decline before 1994, and after a blip up, declined after 1995. World Series ratings aren't the sole indicator of baseball's popularity. Per game attendance took about a decade to recover after that, but 1995 attendance was still better than you saw in the mid to late 1980s.
So IDK. I think by and large baseball would be in the same place today without the 1994 strike.
I think that’s true. I do believe there were more actual people quitting baseball than quit the NFL, however. Whether that number is significant, I don’t know.
‘95 did have the Indians component to the World Series and I would guess having it back caught more eyeballs.
The rise in attendance also probably had to do with the new stadiums opening across baseball. Cleveland had a strong attendance run in that time frame. Expanded playoffs almost certainly made an attendance impact as well as more teams were in contention
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I knew a lot of people who said they'd never watch the NFL again after Michael Vick came back. A few weeks later, I'm at a bar watching games with them. Plenty of people claim to have boycotted due to Kaepernick, and yet ratings continue to climb. Now, the 1994 baseball strike, that turned people off for a long time.
Not sure where ratings are at now for the NFL and it's been a few years since the Kap and related protests, but the NFL took a material hit to ratings (10%-15%) for a couple of years. I never saw that it was a direct correlation from Kap to lower ratings, but it happened at the same time. I dare say the ratings hit was a motivation for owners to not give Kap another shot.
People have short/selective memories for good products or people. Nike and Apple can pay crap wages in poor conditions overseas and we all still gobble up the products. (just two of many companies)
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I knew a lot of people who said they'd never watch the NFL again after Michael Vick came back. A few weeks later, I'm at a bar watching games with them. Plenty of people claim to have boycotted due to Kaepernick, and yet ratings continue to climb. Now, the 1994 baseball strike, that turned people off for a long time.
There is no comparison between Vick and Watson. Vick admitted his guilt, did his time, and apologized.
Watson has denied his guilt. Watson served no time for his crimes - in fact, he denies he committed any crime. Watson has refused to apologize.
The League and the Browns are so positive that Watson is a sexual predator and remains a threat to society that he is banned from hiring a masseuse.
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I know most people don't, but I find value in the preseason. Small sample size for sure, but I saw absolutely nothing from Seattle last night. Bad body language, penalties, lack of talent, odd coaching. They're sitting at +750 (FD) for fewest wins, and I'm probably going to take action on it.
I think Houston will be competent, the Jags should be better. The Falcons could give the Seahawks a run (the two teams play each other in week 3).
I'll probably write up a post next week on stuff I like for this coming year, but this one really stands out to me.
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I know most people don't, but I find value in the preseason. Small sample size for sure, but I saw absolutely nothing from Seattle last night. Bad body language, penalties, lack of talent, odd coaching. They're sitting at +750 (FD) for fewest wins, and I'm probably going to take action on it.
I think Houston will be competent, the Jags should be better. The Falcons could give the Seahawks a run (the two teams play each other in week 3).
I'll probably write up a post next week on stuff I like for this coming year, but this one really stands out to me.
It'll be between them and the Bears.
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Tom Brady missing two weeks of training camp to go film The Masked Singer is a great conspiracy theory.
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In the least-shocking story of the preseason, the Panthers have named Baker Mayfield their starting QB.
https://www.panthers.com/news/baker-mayfield-starter-analysis-opportunity-starter-panthers-quarterback?utm_source=email&utm_medium=email_news&utm_campaign=starting_qb_2022&utm_content=08-22&utm_term=subscriber_news
You don't make that trade if you're not gonna start him. Mayfield, the coach and the GM all have a lot on the line.
He was pretty darn good in 2020, pretty darn bad last season. Obviously, I'm hoping for the return of the former.
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Tom Brady missing two weeks of training camp to go film The Masked Singer is a great conspiracy theory.
I like the theory that he needed time off to have his facial fillers adjusted. Which totally tracks.
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You don't make that trade if you're not gonna start him. Mayfield, the coach and the GM all have a lot on the line.
I don't know, what did they trade for him? Thirty-seven cents and some pocket lint?
He was pretty darn good in 2020, pretty darn bad last season. Obviously, I'm hoping for the return of the former.
He was injured for nearly the entire season last year. As I've said on here before, Carolina made a great trade. Mayfield is a solid quarterback.
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I like the theory that he needed time off to have his facial fillers adjusted. Which totally tracks.
My personal favorite is that Giselle is divorcing him because he can't stop football.
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I don't know, what did they trade for him? Thirty-seven cents and some pocket lint?
Has less to do with what they gave up (probably a 4th round pick), than the fact is the third consecutive season Ruhle has gone out and acquired a new starting QB. If he goes 0-for-3 on that, he's gone.
He may be gone anyhow if they don't make the playoffs, but if Baker flops, he won't finish the season.
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I don't know, what did they trade for him? Thirty-seven cents and some pocket lint?
It wasn't what they gave up. It was that if you're going to bring in a big-personality guy like Mayfield, you can't do it thinking he'll be anything other than QB1. It's kind of like when they brought back Newton last season; they didn't do it to back up Sam Darnold.
He was injured for nearly the entire season last year. As I've said on here before, Carolina made a great trade. Mayfield is a solid quarterback.
Yessir re the injury. He had a very nice season in 2020 and that's what we're hoping to see here.
third consecutive season Ruhle has gone out and acquired a new starting QB. If he goes 0-for-3 on that, he's gone.
He may be gone anyhow if they don't make the playoffs, but if Baker flops, he won't finish the season.
You're probably right about all of this. Here's hoping Mayfield is a playoff QB again, as he was in 2020, and he gets the support he needs. The Panthers rebuilt the OL, so we'll see soon enough if that's any good, and it would sure be nice if McCaffrey could stay healthy.
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82, honest question: you’ve mentioned you’ve lived in Minneapolis and Chicago out of college. Did you root for the Vikings and Bears when you lived in those cities? Who was your team growing up? I find it interesting that you took on a new team later on in life
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82, honest question: you’ve mentioned you’ve lived in Minneapolis and Chicago out of college. Did you root for the Vikings and Bears when you lived in those cities? Who was your team growing up? I find it interesting that you took on a new team later on in life
The Dolphins were the best team in the world when I was a kid, and that's who I pulled for. I stayed with them through the Shula/Marino pairing. No, I didn't root for the Vikings or Bears -- or any other Minneapolis or Chicago teams.
When I moved to Charlotte, I hadn't been a fan of any pro team for many, many years. So I thought, why not? They were the worst team in the NFL the year I moved here, so I sure wasn't a frontrunner like I was when I was a kid!
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The Dolphins were the best team in the world when I was a kid, and that's who I pulled for. I stayed with them through the Shula/Marino pairing. No, I didn't root for the Vikings or Bears -- or any other Minneapolis or Chicago teams.
When I moved to Charlotte, I hadn't been a fan of any pro team for many, many years. So I thought, why not? They were the worst team in the NFL the year I moved here, so I sure wasn't a frontrunner like I was when I was a kid!
This is an absolute lie. We all know the Panther fanship is due to the affinity and respect you had for Jerry Richardson, the man, the human, and the owner. Down to only eating at his Hardee's locations when seeking out fast food.
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This is an absolute lie. We all know the Panther fanship is due to the affinity and respect you had for Jerry Richardson, the man, the human, and the owner. Down to only eating at his Hardee's locations when seeking out fast food.
Ya got me! Who can resist rise 'n' shine breakfast biscuits?!?!
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Ya got me! Who can resist rise 'n' shine breakfast biscuits?!?!
Especially on Jeans Day.
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Yeah, he’s a sick mfer.
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And here's why Browns fans don't deserve nice things
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fau-bhPUcAIEE5H?format=jpg&name=medium
https://phantom-marca.unidadeditorial.es/97318ceb3f8c85e5926b6179b0c1f730/resize/1320/f/webp/assets/multimedia/imagenes/2022/08/22/16611304960001.jpg
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And here's why Browns fans don't deserve nice things
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fau-bhPUcAIEE5H?format=jpg&name=medium
https://phantom-marca.unidadeditorial.es/97318ceb3f8c85e5926b6179b0c1f730/resize/1320/f/webp/assets/multimedia/imagenes/2022/08/22/16611304960001.jpg
I don't know if a singular moron and a street vendor hawking trash are the best representations of a fanbase.
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I don't know if a singular moron and a street vendor hawking trash are the best representations of a fanbase.
Hope that’s how people feel about scoopers
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I don't know if a singular moron and a street vendor hawking trash are the best representations of a fanbase.
Yeah, I'm sure it's just two people.
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Hope that’s how people feel about scoopers
I think there is a consensus as to who the moron is. Not sure about the street vendor.
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Yeah, I'm sure it's just two people.
There is a difference between "I'll deal with it if it wins us football games" and "I'll actively applaud and/or mock his alleged crimes". If you think a large chunk of the fanbase is like "LOL sexual assault, f these women" thats a pretty cynical view of humanity. Ive yet to speak to a Browns fan, and I know a lot, that totally fine with the entire circus. There are large groups of morons in every fanbase, but thats like saying "insert NFL fanbase" doesn't deserve nice things cause some of their fans posted negatively online about players kneeling.
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There is a difference between "I'll deal with it if it wins us football games" and "I'll actively applaud and/or mock his alleged crimes". If you think a large chunk of the fanbase is like "LOL sexual assault, f these women" thats a pretty cynical view of humanity. Ive yet to speak to a Browns fan, and I know a lot, that totally fine with the entire circus. There are large groups of morons in every fanbase, but thats like saying "insert NFL fanbase" doesn't deserve nice things cause some of their fans posted negatively online about players kneeling.
That's a lot of straw men in one paragraph, Wags.
No doubt the many fine people who support the Cleveland Browns appreciate you rushing in to defend them against gentle mocking on the internet.
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That's a lot of straw men in one paragraph, Wags.
No doubt the many fine people who support the Cleveland Browns appreciate you rushing in to defend them against gentle mocking on the internet.
Im not rushing in to defend them any more than I would any other base that got the treatment. I may have mistook your gentle mocking for disgust, but there has been plenty of high and mighty behavior and disgust towards the Browns fanbase over the last month or two as if all Browns fans should be burning their jerseys and turning in season tickets cause of the situation, and its dumb. Broad brushing fanbases is stupid, unless its UW.
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Buddy of mine sent me this today, made me laugh
(https://preview.redd.it/9334f9iodo6z.jpg?auto=webp&s=c3ee17d2ffa11bd447b2d36d7c306ce6fe0f3049)
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Buddy of mine sent me this today, made me laugh
(https://preview.redd.it/9334f9iodo6z.jpg?auto=webp&s=c3ee17d2ffa11bd447b2d36d7c306ce6fe0f3049)
Hilarious except Nicole was a Cali girl he met in Beverly Hills when his career in Buffalo was over. Womp Womp.
Though the Falcons had the 2nd pick that year, so maybe he would have set roots in Atlanta instead of escaping Buffalo for LA whenever possible, thus mitigating the situation ;D
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Dish's NFL Year Long Gambling Picks That You Didn't Ask For
Excited for what I feel could be a very wide open year in the NFL. We did decently on these last year, so here's some debatable content.
My favorite bet is Eagles to win the NFC East, +160 on DK.
I liked this even before Tyron Smith's injury last night. A lot of this is dependent on Jalen Hurts continued development. I like what the Eagles did this offseason, and the rest of the division doesn't scare me. Most importantly, they may have the easiest schedule in the league.
While we're on the Eagles, Eagles to win the NFC is +1100 on DK. Just sayin.
Offensive ROY - Isaiah Likely +6000 on DK
Likely is arguably WR2 on Baltimore, and if Mark Andrews misses any time at all, he'll take over TE1 snaps. Pardon the unintended pun, but I like this pick based on the volume Likely will probably get, and the odds at +6000. Doubs/Pickens are both now in the +1000ish range, and any value on either is long gone. I do think there is potential for Malik Wills and at +5000, could be worth a lotto ticket.
Comeback Player of The Year - Travis Etienne +2500 on DK
I think Etienne will have a really solid debut with Doug Pederson at the helm. With James Robinson still kinda iffy, Etienne should be the workhorse in Jax. I didn't look it up, but always feels like this goes to a player coming off a major injury.
Fewest Wins - Seattle +700 on DK
I'm going to riff on the state of the Bears for a second. I have a friend in the national media who is now covering the Bears, and I spoke to this person recently, and the take from this person was this: "Different feel altogether this preseason. They're not going to be good, but they're not going to be all time horrible like many nationally are predicting. There's a level of competence here that was sorely lacking under Nagy. Special teams is solid so far, defense better than I expected. If the offensive line can protect, they'll sneak up on some people, especially the Niners in Week 1. Probably finish last in the North (Lions continue to improve), but this doesn't look nor feel like a horrible team to me."
Wait to see on the above, if the Bears offensive line is as bad as it seems it's going to be, I don't know how they stay competitive, this obviously isn't a team built to come from behind.
Highest Scoring Team - Vikings +2000
This number feels too high for a new regime, with perhaps the best WR in football, and a top 10 RB. Cousins play of course is the question mark. The schedule isn't too shabby either.
Dallas Cowboys To Miss The Playoffs +175
Each year, there feels like a snake bitten team. Last year it was the Ravens (who missed the playoffs). I'm going to go with Dallas this year. Going into preseason, their offensive line (usually their strength), had question marks, and now the Smith injury makes those question marks stronger. I'm also betting on some negative regression on all the defensive turnover TD's Dallas produced last year.
Baker Mayfield Under 3700.5 passing yards -110
I just don't see anything good coming from this Panthers team this year. I fully expect Sam Darnold to eventually get some starts, which would only help this one. Baker's passing yards by year in his first four years: 3,725, 3,827, 3,563, 3,010.
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Punt god ... yikes.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34460423/buffalo-bills-punter-matt-araiza-two-san-diego-state-football-players-accused-gang-raping-minor-lawsuit
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Peddle #10's ass, aina?
#freeziggy2022v2or3
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Shout to Aaron Donald for restraining himself to just swinging helmets at guys instead of trying to choke them.
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Or shoot 'em, hey?
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Bills release Matt Araiza, aka Punt God
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Bills release Matt Araiza, aka Punt God
Was it the rape? Too bad for him he’s not a QB God
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Bears move to 3-0 in the preseason. Just as everyone expected :o
Fields looked great yesterday. If only he could play against teams missing their starting DEs, he'd be set.
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Bears move to 3-0 in the preseason. Just as everyone expected :o
Fields looked great yesterday. If only he could play against teams missing their starting DEs, he'd be set.
As a Bears fan, I'd like to be happy about this.
Then I remembered NFL preseason is about as good of an indicator of a teams performance as the NBA Summer League.
I still think 0-17 is a possible outcome for the Bears. Not likely, but possible.
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Bills release Matt Araiza, aka Punt God
Urban Dictionary definition of “punter”, hey?
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As a Bears fan, I'd like to be happy about this.
Then I remembered NFL preseason is about as good of an indicator of a teams performance as the NBA Summer League.
I still think 0-17 is a possible outcome for the Bears. Not likely, but possible.
John Harbaugh on Line 1.
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As a Bears fan, I'd like to be happy about this.
Then I remembered NFL preseason is about as good of an indicator of a teams performance as the NBA Summer League.
I still think 0-17 is a possible outcome for the Bears. Not likely, but possible.
Not a chance. They are not a good team but they have too much talent to be that abysmal. Additionally, by all accounts from camp, the new coaching staff has put in some much needed discipline and structure.
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Not a chance. They are not a good team but they have too much talent to be that abysmal. Additionally, by all accounts from camp, the new coaching staff has put in some much needed discipline and structure.
They’ll sweep the Packers
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Ugh ...
@MikeGarafolo
#Commanders RB Brian Robinson is in stable condition after being shot as the victim in an attempted robbery, sources say.
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https://twitter.com/edsbs/status/1564738067730243585?s=21&t=WJASfkhiu6cSgzSi5aoBIw
Good thought on the Jon Gruden rehab tour
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As a Bears fan, I'd like to be happy about this.
Then I remembered NFL preseason is about as good of an indicator of a teams performance as the NBA Summer League.
I still think 0-17 is a possible outcome for the Bears. Not likely, but possible.
The Lions were 4-0 in the 2008 preseason.
I heard yesterday that Baltimore has not lost a preseason game in six seasons now (23 straight games). They've gone to the playoffs in two of those seasons.
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How much does Ryan Poole hate his roster to have made six waiver claims today?
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How much does Ryan Poole hate his roster to have made six waiver claims today?
Not sure about Ryan Poole, but Ryan Poles has been very aggressive. I saw yesterday that the 53 man had only 22 holdovers from last year.
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Not sure about Ryan Poole, but Ryan Poles has been very aggressive. I saw yesterday that the 53 man had only 22 holdovers from last year.
Reminds me of when Ron Wolf and Ted Thompson took over in Green Bay. Smart on his part.
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Not sure about Ryan Poole, but Ryan Poles has been very aggressive. I saw yesterday that the 53 man had only 22 holdovers from last year.
Will be interesting to see if a fresh start helps Leatherwood develop. Not much downside for the Bears on the move. They have plenty of cap space and the cap hit is modest.
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Will be interesting to see if a fresh start helps Leatherwood develop. Not much downside for the Bears on the move. They have plenty of cap space and the cap hit is modest.
There is a huge downside. He was probably the worst pass blocking OL in the NFL. Fields could get killed if Leatherwood is on the field.
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Panthers sign former Bears kicker Eddie Pineiro.
The words “former Bears kicker” do not inspire confidence.
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There is a huge downside. He was probably the worst pass blocking OL in the NFL. Fields could get killed if Leatherwood is on the field.
I don't believe the Bears are bringing him in to start Week 1. He also was a rookie last year and he's only 23.
There's a chance that the new regime in Las Vegas cut him prematurely. He might improve. Of course, he might continue to suck and the Raiders were correct. But, for a team like the Bears with cap space and not a great deal of talent along the Oline, I failed to see the downsides with taking a flyer on a guy like Leatherwood.
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Not sure about Ryan Poole, but Ryan Poles has been very aggressive. I saw yesterday that the 53 man had only 22 holdovers from last year.
Aggressive or… has sh1t to work with
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Panthers sign former Bears kicker Eddie Pineiro.
The words “former Bears kicker” do not inspire confidence.
Pineiro was fine for the Bears in 2019. He was 23/28 on FGs. He had stint with the Jets in 2021 and was 8/8 on FGs.
His big issue has been staying healthy. That's how he lost the Bears job. Got hurt in training camp in 2020 and never got his job back from his replacement, Cairo Santos.
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Aggressive or… has sh1t to work with
Both statements are true.
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Reminds me of when Ron Wolf and Ted Thompson took over in Green Bay. Smart on his part.
Yep. Both culturally and to try and build something meaningful. They have an absurd amount of cap space next year too.
I don't believe the Bears are bringing him in to start Week 1. He also was a rookie last year and he's only 23.
There's a chance that the new regime in Las Vegas cut him prematurely. He might improve. Of course, he might continue to suck and the Raiders were correct. But, for a team like the Bears with cap space and not a great deal of talent along the Oline, I failed to see the downsides with taking a flyer on a guy like Leatherwood.
Exactly. He's a season removed from being unanimous AA and winning a bunch of CFB awards. He anchored a dominant OL. He wasn't some speculative project. And its not like he has a bunch of red flag character issues.
None of that means anything in the NFL of course, but a disappointing season on a team that had a bunch of issues internally isn't a massive black eye for me. And add to that McDaniels coming in who likely has a different mindset on OL coming from BB in NE.
If he doesn't work, NBD. Otherwise the Bears get a steal of a young talented OL. He wouldn't be the first lineman to struggle early and then turn into a solid contributor.
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Yep. Both culturally and to try and build something meaningful. They have an absurd amount of cap space next year too.
Exactly. He's a season removed from being unanimous AA and winning a bunch of CFB awards. He anchored a dominant OL. He wasn't some speculative project. And its not like he has a bunch of red flag character issues.
None of that means anything in the NFL of course, but a disappointing season on a team that had a bunch of issues internally isn't a massive black eye for me. And add to that McDaniels coming in who likely has a different mindset on OL coming from BB in NE.
If he doesn't work, NBD. Otherwise the Bears get a steal of a young talented OL. He wouldn't be the first lineman to struggle early and then turn into a solid contributor.
Cardinals fans, I mean Packers fans missing what the Bears are doing today forget their own past.
Will it work? Who knows but its not like the players they had were a group close fo winning. Blow the mother up
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Cardinals fans, I mean Packers fans missing what the Bears are doing today forget their own past.
Will it work? Who knows but its not like the players they had were a group close fo winning. Blow the mother up
I don't question the best fans in football.
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Any Packers fans under 35 probably didn’t forget their own past, they just weren’t alive for that time.
But yeah, pretty wild Packers fans would show little faith in what the Bears are doing.
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Pineiro was fine for the Bears in 2019. He was 23/28 on FGs. He had stint with the Jets in 2021 and was 8/8 on FGs.
His big issue has been staying healthy. That's how he lost the Bears job. Got hurt in training camp in 2020 and never got his job back from his replacement, Cairo Santos.
Thanks for the info.
I was bummed because the Panthers went through kickers like crazy before they finally got a good one in Gonzalez … and then he gets hurt. So here’s hoping Pineiro kicks well and stays healthy.
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Any Packers fans under 35 probably didn’t forget their own past, they just weren’t alive for that time.
But yeah, pretty wild Packers fans would show little faith in what the Bears are doing.
If the Bears were chasing 9 wins like usual by building a team through trading draft picks and chasing fancy, big name free agents, I’d be laughing at them, too.
The last real good Bears teams were Lovie’s teams and those teams had a core of homegrown talent with sprinkled in veteran FA’s.
We can also question the viability of the QB as a franchise player but what the front office has done thus far has been prudent in a market that often crucifies prudent.
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Exactly. He's a season removed from being unanimous AA and winning a bunch of CFB awards. He anchored a dominant OL. He wasn't some speculative project. And its not like he has a bunch of red flag character issues.
None of that means anything in the NFL of course, but a disappointing season on a team that had a bunch of issues internally isn't a massive black eye for me. And add to that McDaniels coming in who likely has a different mindset on OL coming from BB in NE.
If he doesn't work, NBD. Otherwise the Bears get a steal of a young talented OL. He wouldn't be the first lineman to struggle early and then turn into a solid contributor.
Admittedly I only saw him 3 or 4 times last year. Looked exactly like Mandarich as a rookie. He then developed into a below average NFL player.
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Admittedly I only saw him 3 or 4 times last year. Looked exactly like Mandarich as a rookie. He then developed into a below average NFL player.
Fair, but Mandrich also had huge substance abuse and attitude issues from the jump.
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Yep. Both culturally and to try and build something meaningful. They have an absurd amount of cap space next year too.
Exactly. He's a season removed from being unanimous AA and winning a bunch of CFB awards. He anchored a dominant OL. He wasn't some speculative project. And its not like he has a bunch of red flag character issues.
None of that means anything in the NFL of course, but a disappointing season on a team that had a bunch of issues internally isn't a massive black eye for me. And add to that McDaniels coming in who likely has a different mindset on OL coming from BB in NE.
If he doesn't work, NBD. Otherwise the Bears get a steal of a young talented OL. He wouldn't be the first lineman to struggle early and then turn into a solid contributor.
He's a mess.
The physical tools are fine, but his technique is awful, his confidence is zero and he's somehow regressed from last year. Two different coaching staffs have worked with him and decided he can't play.
I suspect the Raiders wouldn't be eager to give up on last year's first round pick and eat his signing bonus (and potentially his fully guaranteed contract ... they can thank the Bears for taking them off the hook) if they had any hope the light might go on. And you can talk about a new coaching staff and all, but the reality is a team doesn't cut a 17th overall pick and eat an $8 million signing bonus without the owner signing off on it.
Maybe the light will go on. He was better at guard last year than tackle, so maybe that's where he ends up, where his technical flaws and bad hands/feet won't be so exposed.
My question, though, is why claim him? Let him clear waivers and try to sign him for 1-2 years on the cheap. Instead, the Bears are locked in on what's essentially a 3 year, $6 million fully guaranteed deal.
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My question, though, is why claim him? Let him clear waivers and try to sign him for 1-2 years on the cheap. Instead, the Bears are locked in on what's essentially a 3 year, $6 million fully guaranteed deal.
That's a good question, especially knowing now that only the Bears submitted a waiver claim on him.
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Is Russell Wilson a HoFer?
Opinions?
Stafford is borderline at best right now and I would put Wilson behind him.
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Is Russell Wilson a HoFer?
Opinions?
Stafford is borderline at best right now and I would put Wilson behind him.
Man its close. It depends how much you care about counting stats I guess. Cause Wilson will finish top 10 in TDs, yards, 4th Qtr comebacks. Figure he has another Pro Bowl or 2 in him, so he'll have 10+ Pro Bowls.
Stafford has him beat in most all counting stats but Pro Bowls, which is wholly not his fault.
I think the next 3-4 years does a lot for both of their legacies.
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Man its close. It depends how much you care about counting stats I guess. Cause Wilson will finish top 10 in TDs, yards, 4th Qtr comebacks. Figure he has another Pro Bowl or 2 in him, so he'll have 10+ Pro Bowls.
Stafford has him beat in most all counting stats but Pro Bowls, which is wholly not his fault.
I think the next 3-4 years does a lot for both of their legacies.
I think they both probably get in with their SB wins.
This tool has Russ closer
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/hof/hofm_QB.htm
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I think they both probably get in with their SB wins.
Super Bowl wins and very good stats are a Hall of Fame lock for a QB
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If Stafford. had put up the same numbers for any other franchise, it would not even be a discussion. Do the same thing for a couple more years, get fitted for a blazer.
Alas, even though the Lions literally went more than a decade without winning a game started by another quarterback, even though more than half of his career wins are 4th quarter comebacks, of which he has more than Favre, the utter incompetence of the rest of the franchise put a pall over his HOF stats.
So glad he went somewhere he could win.
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Man its close. It depends how much you care about counting stats I guess. Cause Wilson will finish top 10 in TDs, yards, 4th Qtr comebacks. Figure he has another Pro Bowl or 2 in him, so he'll have 10+ Pro Bowls.
Stafford has him beat in most all counting stats but Pro Bowls, which is wholly not his fault.
I think the next 3-4 years does a lot for both of their legacies.
He has never been the best or near best at any time in his career, but accumulation of stats will probably get him there
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He has never been the best or near best at any time in his career, but accumulation of stats will probably get him there
I hear you, but I don't think the HOF has been predicated on that alone for awhile. Look at the last classes.
Issac Bruce was only Second Team All Pro once, made only 4 Pro Bowls in a 15 year career.
Edgerrin James was sensational as a rookie, and a great year 2, but then was always secondary to guys like LT, Shaun Alexander, Curtis Martin, and others through the prime of his career. But he accumulated a lot of stats playing with Manning.
Andre Reed was really good on good teams, but I don't know if he was "elite".
Wilson is certainly a better QB and had a better career than Joe Namath ;D
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I hear you, but I don't think the HOF has been predicated on that alone for awhile. Look at the last classes.
Issac Bruce was only Second Team All Pro once, made only 4 Pro Bowls in a 15 year career.
Edgerrin James was sensational as a rookie, and a great year 2, but then was always secondary to guys like LT, Shaun Alexander, Curtis Martin, and others through the prime of his career. But he accumulated a lot of stats playing with Manning.
Andre Reed was really good on good teams, but I don't know if he was "elite".
Wilson is certainly a better QB and had a better career than Joe Namath ;D
Joe Namath had debilitating injuries most of his career . When healthy Broadway Joe was phenomenal .
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Joe Namath had debilitating injuries most of his career . When healthy Broadway Joe was phenomenal .
Most overrated QB of all time. Without a doubt.
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Stafford in the HoF? If he ends up with the one SB I have my doubts. I don't think he's ever been considered a top five QB in any of his seasons. Last year he was 8th in Passer Rating. I'd take Brady, Rodgers, Mahomes, Allen, Wilson and Burrow ahead of him. Career PR lower than Derek Carr.
I wouldn't argue against him if he makes it as he seems like a nice guy and a very good QB, but I'd don't think of him as great/HoF.
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Is Russell Wilson a HoFer?
Opinions?
Stafford is borderline at best right now and I would put Wilson behind him.
Forget the stats, he should be in the Hall for creating concussion-curing water alone.
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Forget the stats, he should be in the Hall for creating concussion-curing water alone.
And being so innovative that he practices talking to the huddle on 1 knee in his solo pregame warmups
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Ted Phillips retiring after this season. Dare to dream Bears fans, dare to dream.
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I think the move to Arlington Heights is great, but NFC North football does not belong in a dome. I know this is all about non football revenue, but it's going to be sad when the Bears are not playing real winter football. That said, they only played one or two games after December 21 anyway.
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I think the move to Arlington Heights is great, but NFC North football does not belong in a dome. I know this is all about non football revenue, but it's going to be sad when the Bears are not playing real winter football. That said, they only played one or two games after December 21 anyway.
If the Packers domed Lambeau Field, there would be much outrage. But the tickets would instantly become much more valuable.
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I think the move to Arlington Heights is great, but NFC North football does not belong in a dome. I know this is all about non football revenue, but it's going to be sad when the Bears are not playing real winter football. That said, they only played one or two games after December 21 anyway.
75% of the NFC will be domed now. When the Packers hit their losing cycle, fans will be clamoring for a dome in Green Bay.
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If the Packers domed Lambeau Field, there would be much outrage. But the tickets would instantly become much more valuable.
Absolutely. But in a small market without realistic ability to host a Super Bowl, the incentive is not the same as it is in Chicagoland. It's the right business move, but that doesn't mean it's not a bummer.
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Absolutely. But in a small market without realistic ability to host a Super Bowl, the incentive is not the same as it is in Chicagoland. It's the right business move, but that doesn't mean it's not a bummer.
Agreed. Makes sense.
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I think the move to Arlington Heights is great, but NFC North football does not belong in a dome. I know this is all about non football revenue, but it's going to be sad when the Bears are not playing real winter football. That said, they only played one or two games after December 21 anyway.
The death of the whole meme of Bear fans talking about Bear weather and arguing that the deplorable state of Soldier Field's turf is an advantage is cause enough to mourn the move.
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The death of the whole meme of Bear fans talking about Bear weather and arguing that the deplorable state of Soldier Field's turf is an advantage is cause enough to mourn the move.
The Bear Weather meme in fact had a rather poor record. I still will not forget sitting through the Artic 1989 NFC Championship game where the West Coast 49ers kicked their azz.
I have never been so cold. I had a freezer suit on, boxes of corrugated for my feet and had Vaseline gelled on my face. I was made colder on each Montana to Rice pass.
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As a Minnesotan who knows how the movie ends every year, this is still funny:
https://www.reddit.com/r/VikingsTrophyCase/
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Who ya got tonight?
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Confirmed, no retractable roof at new Soldiers.
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Confirmed, no retractable roof at new Soldiers.
Would be a waste of money. I can't wait for the meatballs to get all worked up about it.
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Who ya got tonight?
Rooting for The Bills
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This is an ass-kicking. I guess the Bills are for real.
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Who ya got tonight?
Bills by 21.
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Jalen Ramsey, 2018
http://pic.twitter.com/NqVMJH5Mm3
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Bet Bills tonight but a little modestly.
Should of pounded the fu ck outta it
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If the Packers don’t win the Super Bowl this year I’m rooting for the Bills.
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Cutler had a tough game.
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I was concerned about a couple of the big hits Allen took last night. He even delivered one or two himself. Big, strong QBs like him can take (and give) punishment ... but only so much before their bodies rebel.
They might be strong, but their elbows and shoulders and knees and heads are still just elbows and shoulders and knees and heads. For years, Cam Newton seemed indestructible .... until he wasn't.
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I was concerned about a couple of the big hits Allen took last night. He even delivered one or two himself. Big, strong QBs like him can take (and give) punishment ... but only so much before their bodies rebel.
They might be strong, but their elbows and shoulders and knees and heads are still just elbows and shoulders and knees and heads. For years, Cam Newton seemed indestructible .... until he wasn't.
That stiff arm Allen put out was incredible, but I thought the same thing. He is not going to last long doing that kind of stuff.
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Agree. He's also so big and tough to bring down that he seems to get kind of twisted down a lot when he's running. On more than one occassion last night he was well beyond the line of scrimmage and got tackled awkwardly with a leg caught under him or in an awkward position, and I thought for sure he'd get up with a limp.
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Looks like Soldier Field is in mid-season form. ::) ::) ::)
https://twitter.com/CamInman/status/1568986187590766592?s=20&t=NLBegvQsHG-_MQ5xxcCK-A
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Looks like Soldier Field is in mid-season form. ::) ::) ::)
https://twitter.com/CamInman/status/1568986187590766592?s=20&t=NLBegvQsHG-_MQ5xxcCK-A
Need to turn it into a horse track.
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Strong first series for the Bears.
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🐻 🐻❄ 🐻 🐻❄
We're still in this!
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Where was Fields throwing that? WTF?
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Good news for Packers fans is Lance looks bad, and Fields looks even worse. Maybe Fields should try putting MORE air under his screen passes.
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The Bears are about 7 years away.
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The Bears are about 7 years away.
Oh come on. They only need a QB, OL, RB, WRs, DL...
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Oh come on. They only need a QB, OL, RB, WRs, DL...
10 years? I may have overshot.
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Are Hamp and O'B still on the radio?
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Free play…and fields throws it into the stands. Lol.
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Free play…and fields throws it into the stands. Lol.
The 🐻 🐻❄ would be down 21-0 if this was a normal weather day.
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The Super Bowl loser jinx seemed to have quickly caught up with Joe Burrow.
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3 tipped passes, 2 fumbles, 1 INT, and a 10-point halftime deficit. The Panthers’ Baker Mayfield Era is off to a smashing start!
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#puddlegate
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Fields with 3 yards passing in the 1st half.
That’s more than 1 yard per quarter.
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3 tipped passes, 2 fumbles, 1 INT, and a 10-point halftime deficit. The Panthers’ Baker Mayfield Era is off to a smashing start!
That pick was baaaad.
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Every time I turn on Falcons/Saints, the Falcons are just smashing New Orleans.
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Fields 5/8 for 105 yards and 2 TDs in the second half. Thats a bit better.
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Fields 5/8 for 105 yards and 2 TDs in the second half. Thats a bit better.
🐻 🐻❄ 🐻 🐻❄!!!
But you can't miss that XP.
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Gotta love the SF penalties today!
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Lot of freezing cold takes here today.
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Lot of freezing cold takes here today.
How in the world are Da Bears winning this game?
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Lot of freezing cold takes here today.
Lot of terrible football today
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Lot of freezing cold takes here today.
(https://thumbs.gfycat.com/FoolhardyBreakableCurassow-size_restricted.gif)
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S ame hit
O ld utta
L ions uck
Coincidence?
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So my statement that the Bears could go 0-17 was wrong. That was a not-so hot take. :(
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Far too early or incomplete to make complete reads, but I'm pretty damn confident that a Nagy Bears team doesn't reverse course and correct like they did today. For that alone I'm pleased and impressed with Eberflus thus far.
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So my statement that the Bears could go 0-17 was wrong. That was a not-so hot take. :(
They’re still terrible. 49ers better hope Lance grows up quick
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Cincy last possession in OT, they punted with 15 seconds on the play clock, while the game clock was running.
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Pack might wanna try guarding the best receiver in the league
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They’re still terrible. 49ers better hope Lance grows up quick
I agree with both statements.
Fields was not too impressive. Even considering the bad talent around him, he looked so-so throwing the ball and making decisions.
1-16? ;)
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I agree with both statements.
Fields was not too impressive. Even considering the bad talent around him, he looked so-so throwing the ball and making decisions.
1-16? ;)
I think there are a lot of bad teams in the league this year. Been a lot of bad football
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I think there are a lot of bad teams in the league this year. Been a lot of bad football
Side effect of most teams rarely or not at all playing their starters in the preseason.
Nor that it's a bad thing, but most teams looked a little out of sync today.
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With a 17 game season and 14 teams making the playoffs, I think teams feel there is a little more margin for error at the beginning of the season.
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With a 17 game season and 14 teams making the playoffs, I think teams feel there is a little more margin for error at the beginning of the season.
I think there’s a lot of truth to this. Still, I wouldn’t like my team punting on a division game to start the season
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I agree with both statements.
Fields was not too impressive. Even considering the bad talent around him, he looked so-so throwing the ball and making decisions.
1-16? ;)
The Bears won’t be good but you’re not giving enough weight to just how awful the previous staff was. They’ll win at least 5 games.
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Brady giving a tutorial tonight on how to play well despite a weak offensive line .
Watching a football genius at work is fun
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It’s easy to overreact to what happens in week 1.
That said, this Cowboys offense without Tyron Smith sucks.
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Cowboys hapless … and now Dak is out “several weeks” with hand injury.
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Geno Smith is 16 and a half games away from being named MVP.
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Denver has looked borderline incompetent all night on offense.
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Not a great night for Nathaniel Hackett.
At all.
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Not a great night for Nathaniel Hackett.
At all.
Brutal.
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I have no idea what the hell Denver did all night, and the end was borderline a fireable offense.
-
After Week 1, the Seattle Seahawks sit alone atop the NFC West.
As expected.
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I have no idea what the hell Denver did all night, and the end was borderline a fireable offense.
it was Seattle's superbowl. They'll be alright. Russ is rusty
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Peddle Love to da 'boys for CeeDee Lamb, hey?
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Peddle Love to da 'boys for CeeDee Lamb, hey?
Peddle Rodgers to da ‘boys for CeeDee Lamb and a bunch of firsts and seconds, hey?
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The opener was like an Xmas song for Baker Mayfield:
5 tipped passes
4 fumbled snaps
3 long TD drives
2 Panthers touchdowns
And a really stupid INT
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With a 17 game season and 14 teams making the playoffs, I think teams feel there is a little more margin for error at the beginning of the season.
Ex) Packers losing to the Saints last year and Rodgers throwing 4 picks.
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The quote of the day brought to you by former NY Jets employee Jenn Sterger:
Sterger certainly hasn’t forgotten, commenting on Favre’s latest issues Tuesday with a series of tweets, including: “Oh.. NOWWWWW he gets in trouble for inappropriate texts.”
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Is Buffalo the SB favorite?
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Is Buffalo the SB favorite?
No, the Packers are
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The Chargers look dangerous to me.
-
The Chargers look dangerous to me.
They stink
-
Among the Panthers' many woes today -- including fumbling away the opening kickoff, a lost fumble on the first possession, and late defensive ineptitude -- we unfortunately were treated to Bad Baker today.
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I am sure the comeback in Miami means a lot Tua Dolphin fan.
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I am sure the comeback in Miami means a lot Tua Dolphin fan.
That Tyreek Hill addition looks good. Playmakers seem helpful
-
Having
Tua(2 QB league) on 1 team
Hill on 1 team
Waddle on 2 teams.
Really helped in fantasy today.
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Arizona is absolutely atrocious.
-
If only Kyler studied.
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Nathaniel Hackett is so brutal, he’s not going to survive to next year. My god.
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Nathaniel Hackett is so brutal, he’s not going to survive to next year. My god.
4th and 2 at Houston's 36...down three...and he punts?
Does he hate Russ or something?
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4th and 2 at Houston's 36...down three...and he punts?
Does he hate Russ or something?
Broncos Nation....LETS RIDE
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Good thing the 49ers didn’t dump Jimmy G.
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Nathaniel Hackett is so brutal, he’s not going to survive to next year. My god.
Forget all of his horrible decisions.
Isnt the first thing as a coach game plan to win??
This is two straight weeks where Williams and Gordon are in a basic time share. There is not a human being on earth that can argue it should be anything less than 80/20 williams. That dude is a legit weapon and Hackett basically says "nahhhh not gonna use him"
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Among the Panthers' many woes today -- including fumbling away the opening kickoff, a lost fumble on the first possession, and late defensive ineptitude -- we unfortunately were treated to Bad Baker today.
Who woulda thunk, Giants 2-0.
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I can’t believe Arizona won.
-
Arizona is absolutely atrocious.
Did you miss the colts game?
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Nathaniel Hackett is so brutal, he’s not going to survive to next year. My god.
Rhule might not survive to next month. And I’m not saying that’s a bad thing.
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The bears are who we thought they were
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Fields is…not good.
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WTF was that?
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Bears probably would’ve scored easily if they just went for it on 4th. The review gave the packers a much needed breather.
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Smart to go out of the gun there.
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There was little chance that would be reversed. Had to challenge it, though.
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There was little chance that would be reversed. Had to challenge it, though.
Believe it’s automatically reviewed as a turnover.
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Believe it’s automatically reviewed as a turnover.
Nope. It was challenged.
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I don’t think either of these teams are very good
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The Packers are just fine.
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Fields is…not good.
Yeah, maybe he dropped because scouts saw he just wasn’t very good as opposed to other reasons.
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Nope. It was challenged.
Interesting. Thought turnovers, even if on downs, were automatically reviewed.
The Packers are just fine.
They’re fine, they’ll win the North. But, at least for now, I think they’re CLEARLY a step behind teams like the Bills and Chiefs. About equal with teams like the Bucs, Chargers, Rams, etc. The O Line still worries me, and I’m not sure Bakh will ever be close to what he was, so not sure it gets good enough this year.
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Also, bi-annual Bears down post.
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Believe it’s automatically reviewed as a turnover.
Not considered an auto-challenge kind of "turnover."
Had the refs called it a TD, that would have stood, too.
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Noticed this during the game, had to double check this to confirm.
Jaylon Johnson 0 targets, also 0 targets last week. Every corner in the league with 50 snaps or more two weeks in, has at minimum 7 targets.
Gordon is going to have to learn fast.
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So wait … the guy who beat the Panthers with a zillion-yard FG last week shanked a PAT this week that contributed to Cleveland’s come-from-way-ahead loss to the Jets? Crazy game.
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7-11 for 70 yards? For the game? Smh.
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Interesting. Thought turnovers, even if on downs, were automatically reviewed.
They’re fine, they’ll win the North. But, at least for now, I think they’re CLEARLY a step behind teams like the Bills and Chiefs. About equal with teams like the Bucs, Chargers, Rams, etc. The O Line still worries me, and I’m not sure Bakh will ever be close to what he was, so not sure it gets good enough this year.
No they aren’t winning the Super Bowl, but I don’t think “they aren’t very good” is accurate.
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Did you miss the colts game?
It felt like Ryan had more interceptions than Taylor had carries.
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Tower,
Are you feeling better about the Lions this year - at least in relation to past years?
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I think they are better than last year. However, they have only played adequate defense for one half in two games. They certainly have the weapons on offense. I doubt, though, that they can win a game where they score in the low 20's. I just don't see the run stoppers or playmakers at linebacker or safety.
So, improved, but I am not thinking playoffs
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I think they are better than last year. However, they have only played adequate defense for one half in two games. They certainly have the weapons on offense. I doubt, though, that they can win a game where they score in the low 20's. I just don't see the run stoppers or playmakers at linebacker or safety.
So, improved, but I am not thinking playoffs
The Lions and the Bears are similar in the fact that neither are good teams and neither have complete rosters that would lead to success, but both seem to have an identity, a heart, and semblance of competency to game plan and culture that was sorely lacking under Patricia and Nagy.
Its entertaining to watch the Lions, good and bad, which couldnt be said in the past.
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San Fran catches a break, literally - at least in the short-term - with Lance injury.
Garoppolo may be just a game manager, but Niners are much better with him on the field than Lance.
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I still don't know if Campbell can coach. But he can lead.
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Nathaniel Hackett is so brutal, he’s not going to survive to next year. My god.
Doubt Byron Leftwich could do better.
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After the Panthers lost Sunday, one of my favorite wing joints in Charlotte offered 10 free wings to every customer if Matt Rhule were fired by 5 p.m. Monday.
Damn ... that would have been sweet!
Meanwhile, some Panthers players are telling fans who are gonna boo the team at home games to not even bother coming. Ugh. You can't "beat" the fans. Just terrible.
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From Seeking Alpha:
Amazon.com's (AMZN) initial exclusive Thursday Night Football broadcast - between the Los Angeles Chargers and Kansas City Chiefs - drew in 13M viewers last week, according to analytics firm Nielsen. While the data can be compared to several metrics (same week last year, similar matchups, season averages, etc.), the bottom line is that the online audience figures are roughly in line with those that compare to traditional TV. Amazon is the first streaming service to hold exclusive rights to an NFL game package, in a deal that will cost the tech giant about $1.2B per year through 2033.
Quote: "By every measure, Thursday Night Football on Prime Video was a resounding success," said Jay Marine, global head of Amazon's sports division. "The audience numbers exceeded all of our expectations for viewership."
The deal is already bearing fruit, with Amazon Prime signups going through the roof during the three-hour period of the game. In fact, the new subscriber additions beat those that took place on Prime Day, Black Friday and Cyber Monday - combined. Amazon also partnered with DirecTV (T) in a multiyear agreement for the satellite TV provider to air TNF in more than 300K bars, restaurants, hotels and casinos.
Joining the game: Apple (AAPL) is also upping its sports streaming efforts as it looks to generate more cash flow from an expansion into online services. Tonight's matchup between the New York Yankees and Boston Red Sox will only be streamed on Apple TV+, meaning users will need an Apple ID to watch the game (which is still being broadcast for free for a limited time). Besides being one of the fiercest rivalries in all of American sports, the Yankees just clinched a playoff spot and slugger Aaron Judge is closing in on a home run record.
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That's actually nuts.
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That's actually nuts.
What's nuts, Hards?
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What's nuts, Hards?
How successful prime sales were because of TNF.
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Raiders…yikes.
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As a Packer fan, I wish for Fields to have a long career in Chicago.
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How successful prime sales were because of TNF.
Thanks for the response. Agreed.
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Minnesota is unstoppable running between the tackles. They go to the air and go to the edge and out think themselves.
Detroit does not have the playmakers in the middle.
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I just saw Fields' stats today. Wow just wow.
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I just saw Fields' stats today. Wow just wow.
I think the lack of NFL talent on the Bears starts with the QB.
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Detroit returns the favor.
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I think the lack of NFL talent on the Bears starts with the QB.
We're 10 yrs away? The fact that this franchise has essentially not had a quarterback since Sid Luckman is astounding. McMahon was good and a solid leader but certainly not great.
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NFL: We care about the health and safety of our players, especially when it comes to head injuries.
Also the NFL: Tua starts the second half after this just before halftime…
https://www.instagram.com/p/Ci8Jk9OpYqb/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
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Shades of the airflow at the Metrodome.
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Attempting the FG there was the worst of the options for the Lions.
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Well how about them Bears? Probably the only game of the year they will be favored to win, they did just that. Fields is a stud! 27.7 RTG. Amazing.
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Terrible call by Campbell.
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S
O
L
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Terrible call by Campbell.
And there ya go.
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Attempting the FG there was the worst of the options for the Lions.
Yup.
#1 punt
#2 go for it
#3 FG
This loss is on the coach.
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Fields = a poor man’s Mitch Trubisky.
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Yup.
#1 punt
#2 go for it
#3 FG
This loss is on the coach.
And it’s a distant third.
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Man just a series of great endings for the early kickoffs today.
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The only offensive play I saw of the Bills today was on the highlight show, and Josh Allen gacked at the end of the game with a guy open in the end zone.
Surprised to see the Chiefs. Not the least bit surprised to see the Lions and Lovie find ways to lose.
And thankfully, the Panthers won't go 0-17 thanks to a win over a bad Saints team. Mayfield was a disaster but our D and special teams played well.
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Saints & Raiders have a lot of problems.
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The only offensive play I saw of the Bills today was on the highlight show, and Josh Allen gacked at the end of the game with a guy open in the end zone.
Surprised to see the Chiefs. Not the least bit surprised to see the Lions and Lovie find ways to lose.
And thankfully, the Panthers won't go 0-17 thanks to a win over a bad Saints team. Mayfield was a disaster but our D and special teams played well.
What happens week-to-week in the NFL is totally random nowadays. What we think is irrelevant. We won’t know until the Super Bowl is over
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Not true. The one guarantee is that Detroit will not win a playoff game.
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Not true. The one guarantee is that Detroit will not win a playoff game.
I thought that happens when they announce the schedule each year.
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Not true. The one guarantee is that Detroit will not win a playoff game.
I still like this Lions team.
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Fields = a poor man’s Mitch Trubisky.
Zingggg!
That's not fair to Mitch.
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Not enough playmakers on defense. Only way to win is to win a shootout. I predict they will not win a game scoring under 28 this year.
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Not enough playmakers on defense. Only way to win is to win a shootout. I predict they will not win a game scoring under 28 this year.
I don’t disagree with this. Still, a fun team
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Well how about them Bears? Probably the only game of the year they will be favored to win, they did just that. Fields is a stud! 27.7 RTG. Amazing.
Waiting on the updated loss prediction from you!
Fields was horrendous, but the defense stepped up countless times and that was a remarkable running performance.
I said it Week 1. This is not a good team, but the culture and composure and management from a coaching perspective is night and day.
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I don’t disagree with this. Still, a fun team
If a 5-6 win team can be fun.
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If a 5-6 win team can be fun.
I think they’ll be better than that
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Waiting on the updated loss prediction from you!
Fields was horrendous, but the defense stepped up countless times and that was a remarkable running performance.
I said it Week 1. This is not a good team, but the culture and composure and management from a coaching perspective is night and day.
I remember hearing that when Matt Nagy took over and had a good first season with the Bears too.
Need a quarterback in this league. Culture and composure only go so far.
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Waiting on the updated loss prediction from you!
Fields was horrendous, but the defense stepped up countless times and that was a remarkable running performance.
I said it Week 1. This is not a good team, but the culture and composure and management from a coaching perspective is night and day.
Still sticking to my preseason prediction of 3. I don't think they will be favored in any remaining game. Washington maybe and that would be win 3.
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I think they’ll be better than that
I think they are going to lose many games with scores similar to week 1 and today.
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Need a quarterback in this league. Culture and composure only go so far.
"Fields had 82 net passing yards on a day in which he had two fumbles and two interceptions."
That's not going to work for the Bears?
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This is where Joe Barry struggles.
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Still sticking to my preseason prediction of 3. I don't think they will be favored in any remaining game. Washington maybe and that would be win 3.
That’s crazy. How many $$$ you want to back that up with? Their D isn’t good and their QB is bad. But they’ve rushed for 560 yards and 5.4 yds per carry over the first 3 games. Any team that can run the ball like that wins more than 3 games.
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Joe Barry chokes.
Brady chokes right back.
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What a brutal half to watch.
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That’s crazy. How many $$$ you want to back that up with? Their D isn’t good and their QB is bad. But they’ve rushed for 560 yards and 5.4 yds per carry over the first 3 games. Any team that can run the ball like that wins more than 3 games.
One of those games was a blowout loss. The other was the Texans.
Running the ball is pretty useless without even a decent quarterback and receivers.
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That’s crazy. How many $$$ you want to back that up with? Their D isn’t good and their QB is bad. But they’ve rushed for 560 yards and 5.4 yds per carry over the first 3 games. Any team that can run the ball like that wins more than 3 games.
Mostly because defenses are perfectly happy to let them run knowing they can't pass. Especially if the other team is winning
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Still sticking to my preseason prediction of 3. I don't think they will be favored in any remaining game. Washington maybe and that would be win 3.
Falcons stink. Jets stink. Commanders stink. Lions at home is probably a coin flip. Plus it’s the NFL, they likely steal one they shouldn’t win. I think 5 is likely. 6 isn’t a stretch
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The Broncos negligent usage of Williams continues to ruin drives.
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Quay Walker looks awesome so far.
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Denver is terrible. That’s not a good football team, at all.
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Denver is terrible. That’s not a good football team, at all.
And the 9ers lost to them AND the Bears. Yikes.
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Mostly because defenses are perfectly happy to let them run knowing they can't pass. Especially if the other team is winning
You don’t understand football. Against a one dimensional offense th defense goes all out to stop what you do well and DARES you to do what you’re weak at - if they can. So far the Bears opponents have been unable to do that (I.e., stop the run). And that’s why a pretty bad team is 2-1 right now.
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And the 9ers lost to them AND the Bears. Yikes.
Yeah, losing to both the Bears & Broncos is not a good look. I had zero confidence in Jimmy G to lead a go ahead drive.
I stand by my Broncos comment, that team is not good.
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Bills OC Ken Dorsey totally trashed his area of the coaches’ box immediately after they lost. Pretty damn funny to watch.
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Quay Walker looks awesome so far.
He’s going to be great. But he gets out of place at times. Experience will fix that.
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That’s crazy. How many $$$ you want to back that up with? Their D isn’t good and their QB is bad. But they’ve rushed for 560 yards and 5.4 yds per carry over the first 3 games. Any team that can run the ball like that wins more than 3 games.
With 2 wins already I think you are perfectly reasonable to expect more than 3 wins. But I'm "crazy"? Except for the Washington game, which they should be favored in, the Bears will not be favored to win any games. Unless you think the Vegas guys are idiots or crazy, then the reasonable person should expect them to be 3-14.
As a Bears fan, I don't enjoy this rebuild either, but it has to be done. The massive roster turnover WILL continue beyond this year because they, IMHO, a lot of players who are not just poor NFL player, but players who should not be on NFL teams. I could see 50% of this team not being back next year and most of the cut players will not be in the NFL next year.
The worst part, as a Bears fan, is that Fields does not look like a NFL caliber QB. I hope will all my heart Fields turns it around, if not, I can see them picking a QB in the first round and they should.
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With 2 wins already I think you are perfectly reasonable to expect more than 3 wins. But I'm "crazy"? Except for the Washington game, which they should be favored in, the Bears will not be favored to win any games. Unless you think the Vegas guys are idiots or crazy, then the reasonable person should expect them to be 3-14.
I don't think you're crazy, but I don't think that's the right way to look at betting projections. Say for argument's sake that Vegas gives the Bears a 25% shot of winning in each of their remaining games besides Washington which we will give them as a win. You have to multiply that 75% likelihood of loss by each remaining game. So they have 75% chance of losing their next game. 75% x 75% = 56.25% of losing the next 2 games. 56.25% x 75% =42.1875% of losing their next three games. Do that for all the remaining games and the Bears would have a 2.3757264% chance of losing the other 13 games.
I haven't actually looked but my guess is that Vegas gives the Bears a lot better than 25% chance in most of their remaining games. So while yes the Bears will be the underdog in 13/14 remaining games, it is not reasonable to expect that they will lose ever game that they are an underdog in.
Disclaimer, I am a Packers fan and think the Bears still suck
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Finally ... The Pro Bowl is dead.
https://sports.yahoo.com/report-nfl-replacing-pro-bowl-with-week-of-skills-competitions-flag-football-game-130108755.html
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Finally ... The Pro Bowl is dead.
https://sports.yahoo.com/report-nfl-replacing-pro-bowl-with-week-of-skills-competitions-flag-football-game-130108755.html
From the tweet: "The Pro Bowl Games will also integrate new challenges, where players showcase their football and non-football skills in a fun and memorable way."
I'm having flashbacks of The Superstars
(https://www.tvguide.com/a/img/resize/2442a6045f021a2f5e15bd9ce327e3ecbc46d53d/catalog/provider/10/8/10-75EB54B7-3AE2-43C7-8A8A-58C33CBBB6D0.jpg?auto=webp&fit=crop&height=675&width=1200)
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Disclaimer, I am a Packers fan and think the Bears still suck
I think every Halas & McCaskey family member would agree with you.
The only saving grace for this Bears fan is that it is by design, not poor management.
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From the tweet: "The Pro Bowl Games will also integrate new challenges, where players showcase their football and non-football skills in a fun and memorable way."
I'm having flashbacks of The Superstars
(https://www.tvguide.com/a/img/resize/2442a6045f021a2f5e15bd9ce327e3ecbc46d53d/catalog/provider/10/8/10-75EB54B7-3AE2-43C7-8A8A-58C33CBBB6D0.jpg?auto=webp&fit=crop&height=675&width=1200)
Bring back American Gladiators and have the NFL players compete.
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"Fields had 82 net passing yards on a day in which he had two fumbles and two interceptions."
That's not going to work for the Bears?
Fields is the worst in the pocket QB I have seen on the Bears. I'm not old enough to have watched Bobby Douglass, but the Bears might have found their modern day equivalent. As a thrower, Fields has no feel in the pocket, abysmal footwork, a poor release and is beyond indecisive in reading the defense and letting it rip.
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I haven't actually looked but my guess is that Vegas gives the Bears a lot better than 25% chance in most of their remaining games. So while yes the Bears will be the underdog in 13/14 remaining games, it is not reasonable to expect that they will lose ever game that they are an underdog in.
You make sound points but my intentional memory block of statistics class at MU prevents me from verifying your numbers.
For grins, I looked at ESPN and the Bears are predicted to lose every game left on their schedule, even Washington. I think we can agree the Bears are a shoe in for a top 5 pick in next years draft.
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Fields is the worst in the pocket QB I have seen on the Bears. I'm not old enough to have watched Bobby Douglass, but the Bears might have found their modern day equivalent. As a thrower, Fields has no feel in the pocket, abysmal footwork, a poor release and is beyond indecisive in reading the defense and letting it rip.
I agree. He is brutal. And Bobby Douglas had twice the arm of Justin Fields. Nobody knew where it would go though.
I still think the better comparison is Trubisky. Neither one can read a defense and neither is too accurate.
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I don't think you're crazy, but I don't think that's the right way to look at betting projections. Say for argument's sake that Vegas gives the Bears a 25% shot of winning in each of their remaining games besides Washington which we will give them as a win. You have to multiply that 75% likelihood of loss by each remaining game. So they have 75% chance of losing their next game. 75% x 75% = 56.25% of losing the next 2 games. 56.25% x 75% =42.1875% of losing their next three games. Do that for all the remaining games and the Bears would have a 2.3757264% chance of losing the other 13 games.
I haven't actually looked but my guess is that Vegas gives the Bears a lot better than 25% chance in most of their remaining games. So while yes the Bears will be the underdog in 13/14 remaining games, it is not reasonable to expect that they will lose ever game that they are an underdog in.
Disclaimer, I am a Packers fan and think the Bears still suck
TAMU
You’re correct. My best guess is that the Bears (on average) have about a 35% in each of their remaining 14 games. Most likely win number is 6, next most likely 5, then 7. 2 chances in 1000 they don’t win any.
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Giants with a good chance at being 4-0 when they square off vs. GB in London
Edit: never mind
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I don’t think the Miami medical staff will be able to get away with calling this one a back injury.
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Chris Nowinski, co-founder and CEO of the Concussion Legacy Foundation, and co-founder of the Boston University CTE Center, earlier today:
@ChrisNowinski1: If Tua takes the field tonight, it's a massive step back for #concussion care in the NFL.
If he has a 2nd concussion that destroys his season or career, everyone involved will be sued & should lose their jobs, coaches included. We all saw it, even they must know this isn't right
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Terrifying. Never should’ve been playing the second half and certainly not 5 days later.
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Fins are screwed.
An absolutely massive lawsuit is coming.
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I guess I missed that he was hurt on Sunday. This sounds like a mess. Hopefully he's okay.
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Disgusting.
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The Bears offensive line actively tried to get Fields killed. Pass Pro is just SHOCKING.
He played better today in many facets, but he still doesn't look comfortable in the pocket and making some of the precision reads...which is completely amplified by a porous O Line. Man that was an ugly game.
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Kenny completed all 13 of his passes today. Unfortunately 3 of those were caught by Jets.
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Not enough playmakers on defense. Only way to win is to win a shootout. I predict they will not win a game scoring under 28 this year.
Lions bump
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Cut Rodgers and give Gary his money.
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I remember when people wanted Gutey gone for the Gary pick.
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Last second invite to a corporate suite at Raiders game
Allegiant is quite the stadium
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Was Rodgers tailgating in the parking lot before the game?
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Don’t do drugs, kids.
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Was Rodgers tailgating in the parking lot before the game?
Him and the defense.
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And the officials.
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He played better today in many facets
I guess he was better than last week (when he had 2 fumbles and 2 interceptions) but he was still awful.
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Joe Barry Carroll is in way over his head.
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Him and the defense.
Patriots running it right down their throats.
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I guess he was better than last week (when he had 2 fumbles and 2 interceptions) but he was still awful.
A rookie 4th round nobody small colleges QB for New England is a better QB than Fields. So is Davis Mills So is Cooper Rush.
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What a waste of a challenge/timeout.
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This feels like the most Rodgers has gone downfield in awhile.
I don’t know why the Packers hate timeouts.
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What an awful challenge. That timeout would be nice.
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Mason with a probably comfortable FG attempt if MLF doesn’t challenge that obviously incomplete pass.
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That timeout would have been real nice to have had there.
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The Packers bypassing the fair catch/free kick option at the end of regulation was stupid. Not Matt LaFleur’s finest hour here.
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I guess he was better than last week (when he had 2 fumbles and 2 interceptions) but he was still awful.
He made a couple of nice throws and ran intelligently. Its something...considering the Giants were in the backfield faster and more often. than watching UGA play FCS Southeast.
I never said he was great, or even good. He airmailed a throw that made me scream. But he also had receivers dropping straight forward catches and had to run for his life multiple times every drive.
A rookie 4th round nobody small colleges QB for New England is a better QB than Fields. So is Davis Mills So is Cooper Rush.
Zappe was CUSA player of the year at Western Kentucky, not like he was at Carroll College. And he threw for under 100 yards, but yes, definitely the second coming.
And Cooper Rush is in his 7th NFL season. 7 years in the same franchise, seeing NFL defenses every week in practice, not thrust in to a crap team with no experience, not exactly a great comparison.
But yes, we get it, you think Fields is the worst QB to ever start in the NFC North.
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He made a couple of nice throws and ran intelligently. Its something...considering the Giants were in the backfield faster and more often. than watching UGA play FCS Southeast.
I never said he was great, or even good. He airmailed a throw that made me scream. But he also had receivers dropping straight forward catches and had to run for his life multiple times every drive.
Zappe was CUSA player of the year at Western Kentucky, not like he was at Carroll College. And he threw for under 100 yards, but yes, definitely the second coming.
And Cooper Rush is in his 7th NFL season. 7 years in the same franchise, seeing NFL defenses every week in practice, not thrust in to a crap team with no experience, not exactly a great comparison.
But yes, we get it, you think Fields is the worst QB to ever start in the NFC North.
He isn’t inspiring any confidence if I’m a bears fan, even with the caveats
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My lord Mahomes.
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The Packers bypassing the fair catch/free kick option at the end of regulation was stupid. Not Matt LaFleur’s finest hour here.
I think that’s what they wanted to do but the punt was so short that Rodgers couldn’t get up to catch it.
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My lord Mahomes.
I just happened to flip it on a few mins ago. That was seriously ridiculous. And the Bears could have had him. Smh.
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And the Bears could have had him. Smh.
I think it is a felony in Illinois to speak or write that.
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I think it is a felony in Illinois to speak or write that.
I'll admit to not knowing much about football but there is no explanation for trading up to take Trubisky in that draft with Mahomes or Watson available. And I believe Mahomes had an impeccable reputation off the field and was extremely impressive at all the workouts. The Bears would likely have 2 or more SB's in the last 5 yrs if they took Mahomes.
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I'll admit to not knowing much about football but there is no explanation for trading up to take Trubisky in that draft with Mahomes or Watson available. And I believe Mahomes had an impeccable reputation off the field and was extremely impressive at all the workouts. The Bears would likely have 2 or more SB's in the last 5 yrs if they took Mahomes.
The biggest issue scouts had with Mahomes was the Texas Tech system he played in and his accuracy with the deep ball coming from that system.
Trubiskey though, that’s inexplicable
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This is just a clinic the Chiefs are putting on. I think we’ll look back in two months and wonder how the hell the Colts beat the Chiefs.
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This is just a clinic the Chiefs are putting on. I think we’ll look back in two months and wonder how the hell the Colts beat the Chiefs.
Dish
I wondering right now.
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Trubiskey though, that’s inexplicable
Understatement of the century. Top 5 wost trades/drafts ever.
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Zappe was CUSA player of the year at Western Kentucky, not like he was at Carroll College. And he threw for under 100 yards, but yes, definitely the second coming.
And Cooper Rush is in his 7th NFL season. 7 years in the same franchise, seeing NFL defenses every week in practice, not thrust in to a crap team with no experience, not exactly a great comparison.
But yes, we get it, you think Fields is the worst QB to ever start in the NFC North.
A little heavy on the exaggeration - even to make a point.
You make the same excuses for Fields as others did for Trubisky. But he has been terrible.
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He made a couple of nice throws and ran intelligently. Its something...considering the Giants were in the backfield faster and more often. than watching UGA play FCS Southeast.
I never said he was great, or even good. He airmailed a throw that made me scream. But he also had receivers dropping straight forward catches and had to run for his life multiple times every drive.
I don’t know, Wags. He’s capable of the big play, but he also makes a ton of big mistakes. And I don’t trust his accuracy or his decision making. Hope to be proven wrong.
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A little heavy on the exaggeration - even to make a point.
You make the same excuses for Fields as others did for Trubisky. But he has been terrible.
Fair enough.
And I never made excuses for Trubisky. I was NEVER sold on him. And there are no excuses today, I never even said he was good, I just said that he was getting absolutely bum rushed, which isn't an excuse. Its just fact. The Giants' blitz was as repeatedly effective as Jones running outside. Fields rarely had time to even look downfield, much less throw a good ball.
Fields played at a high level in college (which I know doesn't mean squat in the NFL) so he has a track record of shining in the moment against high level talent. Couple that with I still think his skill set is incredibly intriguing with a high ceiling, and I'm just not ready to throw dirt on the guy after less than 15 starts.
I don’t know, Wags. He’s capable of the big play, but he also makes a ton of big mistakes. And I don’t trust his accuracy or his decision making. Hope to be proven wrong.
I dont disagree with any of that. Like I said before, thats why I'm looking at games and looking for "ok he did that better." "This was promising" instead of "this guy is absolutely terrible, this franchise is doomed". Look at Josh Allen. His Rookie year on a bad team was HORRIFIC. Then midway through Year 2 he figured it out and then here we are. I'm not saying Fields is gonna be an All Pro in 2-3 years, but he'd not be the first top 10 QB in a rough situation to figure it out and become a great player.
His accuracy is very concerning. The decision making can come. I just hope Getsy can scheme him gameplans to make him effective. They opened him up to start the game and he made good throws. We'll see. TBD still for me.
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Should be an interesting game next week: Packers vs. Giants in London; a 9:30/8:30 ET/CT start in London. Dallas owned the Giant offensive line and their defense can be sloppy at times, but who would have thought the Giants would be 3-1 at this juncture. I think the Pack should win this game, but then again I am so used to the Giants losing I think any team they play should win the game. Maybe this season will be different.
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Should be an interesting game next week: Packers vs. Giants in London; a 9:30/8:30 ET/CT start in London. Dallas owned the Giant offensive line and their defense can be sloppy at times, but who would have thought the Giants would be 3-1 at this juncture. I think the Pack should win this game, but then again I am so used to the Giants losing I think any team they play should win the game. Maybe this season will be different.
Do the Giants have a third-string QB playing the majority of the game? Otherwise, they’ll be fine. The Packers are terrible
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Do the Giants have a third-string QB playing the majority of the game? Otherwise, they’ll be fine. The Packers are terrible
The Lions would still give up 35 to the third string QB.
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The Lions would still give up 35 to the third string QB.
Probably
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In the second half of yesterday's loss to mediocre Arizona, Panthers fans booed Baker Mayfield and chanted that the coach should be fired.
I was there, and neither booed nor chanted, but I don't blame fans for being restless. This season's product, much like the previous two seasons under Matt Rhule, has been both bad and boring. And Mayfield has been worse than I thought he'd be ... and I came in with pretty low expectations.
A lot had to go right for the Panthers to have a winning record this season. Mayfield being very good was one of those things. He hasn't been. So after four games, the season already feels like it's over and we're now down to waiting for the coach to get fired. Fun!
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And I never made excuses for Trubisky. I was NEVER sold on him. And there are no excuses today, I never even said he was good, I just said that he was getting absolutely bum rushed, which isn't an excuse. Its just fact. The Giants' blitz was as repeatedly effective as Jones running outside. Fields rarely had time to even look downfield, much less throw a good ball.
The bolded is where its at for me. The worst part about teams starting young QBs behind crappy offensive lines multiple years in a row early in their development is that you end up having QBs bounce out of the league with grades of "Incomplete." I'm of the pretty firm belief that not having time to throw for the first two or three years of QB's career ruins him to the point where we don't know how good he ever could have been. The window of opportunity to start at QB is generally so short that ruined young QBs don't have an opportunity to unlearn the skiddishness and bad habits. Or they just end up bouncing from one crappy team with a crappy O-Line to another, so its not like we get a real read. I feel like Sam Darnold is in this category. I definitely think he had the skills and swagger to be good, but playing for bad Jets and Panthers teams just ruined him to the point where he'd basically have to be the backup on a competent franchise for like 3-5 years to have any hopes of meaningfully developing.
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But yes, we get it, you think Fields is the worst QB to ever start in the NFC North.
He might be!
The bolded is where its at for me. The worst part about teams starting young QBs behind crappy offensive lines multiple years in a row early in their development is that you end up having QBs bounce out of the league with grades of "Incomplete." I'm of the pretty firm belief that not having time to throw for the first two or three years of QB's career ruins him to the point where we don't know how good he ever could have been. The window of opportunity to start at QB is generally so short that ruined young QBs don't have an opportunity to unlearn the skiddishness and bad habits. Or they just end up bouncing from one crappy team with a crappy O-Line to another, so its not like we get a real read. I feel like Sam Darnold is in this category. I definitely think he had the skills and swagger to be good, but playing for bad Jets and Panthers teams just ruined him to the point where he'd basically have to be the backup on a competent franchise for like 3-5 years to have any hopes of meaningfully developing.
Meh. If you're good you're good. Joe Burrow played behind a porous offensive line to start his career (and continues to do so) and is a stud, even after tearing his ACL. Kyler Murray played behind a bad offensive line to start his career and is at least a solid quarterback. Of course it helps to have an awesome offensive line. But most teams drafting at the top (where most of the best quarterbacks will be drafted) don't have good offensive lines. If you're a stud, you usually figure it out.
Yes, the Bears offensive line stinks and Fields has to run for his life at times. But there are also times where he doesn't make his read when he has the opportunity, then tries to scramble, and ends up getting sacked.
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Do the Giants have a third-string QB playing the majority of the game? Otherwise, they’ll be fine. The Packers are terrible
So we both agree, both 3-1 teams are terrible; and yes, the Giants just may have their 3rd string QB playing on Sunday.
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He might be!
Meh. If you're good you're good. Joe Burrow played behind a porous offensive line to start his career (and continues to do so) and is a stud, even after tearing his ACL. Kyler Murray played behind a bad offensive line to start his career and is at least a solid quarterback. Of course it helps to have an awesome offensive line. But most teams drafting at the top (where most of the best quarterbacks will be drafted) don't have good offensive lines. If you're a stud, you usually figure it out.
Yes, the Bears offensive line stinks and Fields has to run for his life at times. But there are also times where he doesn't make his read when he has the opportunity, then tries to scramble, and ends up getting sacked.
Burrow wasn't great that first year. He made some plays but he also fumbled a ton, got hammered a bunch, etc... And that was in an offense designed to air it out. He threw 70 more attempts in the 10 games before getting hurt than Fields has in his entire career to date. Zac Taylor emphasized him getting comfortable in a way Nagy never did. He made a huge leap last year, but that also was largely aided by a top 5 superstar WR who also happened to be his college running mate. He also has 2 other WRs arguably better than anyone Fields is throwing to plus a Pro Bowl caliber RB who is an excellent pass catcher. Its not a knock on Burrow, I absolutely love him, just that its not like for like.
Kyler Murray also had an offense built around him running around, negating bad OL play, plus DeAndre Hopkins.
Again, its not making excuses for Fields being absolutely terrible at times. Ive said his reads have been bad and he's clearly getting flustered. But he's also lacking clear advantages guys like Murray and Burrow had. The book on him isn't finished. His OC is still a big question mark too. We'll see what happens.
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Quote of the day:
“Our team will respond. They always do.”
-- Matt Rhule.
The Panthers have won a grand total of 11 games in 2 1/4 seasons under him, and they are 5-18 in games after losses.
That's some response!
BTW, supposedly Rhule's name is being linked with the Madison opening if he gets the heave-ho here. He was a good college coach, and Madison probably could do a lot worse.
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Quote of the day:
“Our team will respond. They always do.”
-- Matt Rhule.
The Panthers have won a grand total of 11 games in 2 1/4 seasons under him, and they are 5-18 in games after losses.
That's some response!
BTW, supposedly Rhule's name is being linked with the Madison opening if he gets the heave-ho here. He was a good college coach, and Madison probably could do a lot worse.
Yeah, I don't think Rhule is coming to Wisconsin. I would guess the next head coach will be...
70% - Jim Leonhard
15% - Lance Leipold
10% - Dave Aranada (who would likely not be all that interested)
5% - field
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Yeah, I don't think Rhule is coming to Wisconsin. I would guess the next head coach will be...
70% - Jim Leonhard
15% - Lance Leipold
10% - Dave Aranada (who would likely not be all that interested)
5% - field
Just relayed what I read in The Athletic. (Rhule continues to be linked to college openings with The Athletic’s Bruce Feldman listing Rhule among possible candidates at Wisconsin. Rhule would not say whether he or his agent had been contacted about any college jobs.) I have neither any knowledge about Madison football, nor do I care about them, but I know others here do.
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Sounds like Rhule’s agent is going to work on a new landing spot.
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Writer doing the writer's thing of linking candidates despite no information whatsoever that either party is interested.
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Writer doing the writer's thing of linking candidates despite no information whatsoever that either party is interested.
*Agents linking
Feldman links names from sources to help the agent/source drum up interest knowing Rhule’s days are numbered
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Writer doing the writer's thing of linking candidates despite no information whatsoever that either party is interested.
Writers are pure evil.
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*Agents linking
Feldman links names from sources to help the agent/source drum up interest knowing Rhule’s days are numbered
OK, I can give you that.
Anyway, I think this has been Leonhard's job since he turned down the Packers 18 months ago.
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OK, I can give you that.
Anyway, I think this has been Leonhard's job since he turned down the Packers 18 months ago.
Yup, agree with that.
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I see that the guy who ran onto the field against Denver has filed a police report against Bobby Wagner.
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Baker Mayfield's offense is dead last in total yardage and third-down conversion rate.
But at least Mayfield is #1 in most passes batted down -- 11 in 4 games.
Since entering the league 5 years ago, he is by far the NFL leader in passes batted.
I mean, the guy isn't 5-7, he's 6-1. QBs shorter than him -- Brees, Wilson, Murray, many others -- didn't/don't constantly get their passes batted away. One Mayfield had last week led to a game-deciding INT.
No wonder the Browns were more willing to invest in a serial sexual-assaulter.
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Baker Mayfield's offense is dead last in total yardage and third-down conversion rate.
But at least Mayfield is #1 in most passes batted down -- 11 in 4 games.
Since entering the league 5 years ago, he is by far the NFL leader in passes batted.
I mean, the guy isn't 5-7, he's 6-1. QBs shorter than him -- Brees, Wilson, Murray, many others -- didn't/don't constantly get their passes batted away. One Mayfield had last week led to a game-deciding INT.
No wonder the Browns were more willing to invest in a serial sexual-assaulter.
He still has about 50% more passing yards than Justin Fields.
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I see that the guy who ran onto the field against Denver has filed a police report against Bobby Wagner.
And all sensible people with legitimate interest in animal rights causes hang their heads in shame.
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And all sensible people with legitimate interest in animal rights causes hang their heads in shame.
Yup. I am an animal rights guy and these people embarrass the cause.
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Both these teams tonight are terrible.
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Both these teams tonight are terrible.
Next week isn’t any better
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Both these teams tonight are terrible.
They’re both that completely dull version of crappy too. There’s at least 4-5 teams who will probably end up with fewer wins than these two but that I’d much rather watch.
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Next week isn’t any better
Difference is both teams tonight should have contended for their respective divisions.
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Russ is legit bad.
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Russ is legit bad.
That's quite a pass with 2:13 left, eh?
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That's quite a pass with 2:13 left, eh?
What’s funny is I posted this a while ago, before even his first awful interception.
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It's like watching two over-the-hill, punch-drunk boxers pawing at each other.
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Russ should be embarrassed.
And the Broncos as a franchise should be disbanded for giving a contract like that to a guy who wasnt due a contract, before he even played a game with you.
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OT. Perfect.
Al Michaels is cracking me up talking about how wonderful this is gonna be.
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Tim Tebow ran a better bronco offense than Russ. Fans leaving early and Herbie calls em out. Love it
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Broncos Country, let's ride.
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What an atrocious 4th & 1 call.
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Nathaniel Hackett has got to go
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What an atrocious 4th & 1 call.
The 3rd & 1 call sucked, too. Fake the handoff, and Wilson walks into the end zone.
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Hackett has been bad - unless things turn around he is gone after this year.
But they are stuck with Wilson for a few more seasons after this. His production has been slipping for a couple of years now...and he's already 34! (He didn't get into the league until he was 24.) He probably is still a top 10 quarterback because there is just a lot of bad quarterbacks out there right now, but he's not one I would feel comfortable resting my franchise on at this point.
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rhis sure ain't gonna help team chemistry, but hamler has a point, EXCEPT, not the venue to bring it up. any real football fan could have seen this by themselves. now hamler is going to have a big sign on his jersey, well the one he used to have
https://nypost.com/2022/10/07/kj-hamler-disgusted-by-russell-wilson-missing-him-on-final-play/
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Hackett has been bad - unless things turn around he is gone after this year.
But they are stuck with Wilson for a few more seasons after this. His production has been slipping for a couple of years now...and he's already 34! (He didn't get into the league until he was 24.) He probably is still a top 10 quarterback because there is just a lot of bad quarterbacks out there right now, but he's not one I would feel comfortable resting my franchise on at this point.
Tough week for Shopko Badger fans. Fired the coach who they said helped develop Badgers legend Russell and now Russ is fading faster than Greg Norman on an Augusta Sunday
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From what I've seen of Russ this year, it is his reads/timing that have been BAD. I haven't watched his throws closely enough to see if he can still zing it, though I suspect he's average at worst on that. But he has looked like a young QB -locking in on one target, being indecisive then throwing late, having no sense of risk-reward, etc. Even Herbstreit was biting his tongue by the end of the game last night. Some of that can probably be chalked up to new team, new system, but Russ's head does not look in it right now.
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From what I've seen of Russ this year, it is his reads/timing that have been BAD. I haven't watched his throws closely enough to see if he can still zing it, though I suspect he's average at worst on that. But he has looked like a young QB -locking in on one target, being indecisive then throwing late, having no sense of risk-reward, etc. Even Herbstreit was biting his tongue by the end of the game last night. Some of that can probably be chalked up to new team, new system, but Russ's head does not look in it right now.
Too much magic concussion water? Maybe too little? Not the proper amount of magic concussion water adjusted for altitude. That's gotta be it.
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Too much magic concussion water? Maybe too little? Not the proper amount of magic concussion water adjusted for altitude. That's gotta be it.
He grossly and hilariously overpaid for his house in Denver. I would think the altitude has been messing with his head from the start
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He grossly and hilariously overpaid for his house in Denver. I would think the altitude has been messing with his head from the start
seriously. I remember the news reports. $25 mil for that?? Come on man...
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odell says chiefs, packers, rams, bills, ravens
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Yikes
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Yikes
Just proves the Bears are a dreadful team almost completely devoid of NFL talent (I'd guess 40+ players will not be back next year). This is by design and the worst part of a rebuild.
I hope Fields can figure it out and the high draft choices in the next few years are not needed for a QB; but even taking into account the data provided, he doe not look NFL capable.
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I can't bet against the Panthers, but if I could ... them being less than a TD underdog to the Niners would sure look attractive.
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Just proves the Bears are a dreadful team almost completely devoid of NFL talent (I'd guess 40+ players will not be back next year). This is by design and the worst part of a rebuild.
I hope Fields can figure it out and the high draft choices in the next few years are not needed for a QB; but even taking into account the data provided, he doe not look NFL capable.
What are our chances in Minny?
A) 25%
B) 15%
C) 5%
D) 0.0%
I'm going with D. :(
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First defensive play for Detroit, defender going to the hospital. No bueno.
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Cousins was only 13-13 for 125 yards in the 1st Q.
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What is the record for most consecutive completions?
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What is the record for most consecutive completions?
69
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Mattison to get a TD +550 live. He’s going to be busy in the second half.
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69
Channeling your inner dentist, oona?
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WTF?? Why would the Bears go for two there? Smh.
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And then an onside kick????? Sweet Jesus.
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WTF?? Why would the Bears go for two there? Smh.
A conversion puts them within 3. A point after puts you down 4. Would need a TD either way.
Not a bad call there.
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A conversion puts them within 3. A point after puts you down 4. Would need a TD either way.
Not a bad call there.
I disagree but they got away with both decisions.
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I’m not sure what to say about this Bears/Vikings game.
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I'm stunned. The 🐻 have a real shot to pull this off.
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Unbelievably stupid play.
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That was…something.
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That was…something.
Clock running down, 2steps from the sidelines, and he turns it back to the inside.
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Clock running down, 2steps from the sidelines, and he turns it back to the inside.
Yup, he should have went out of bounds about 4 yards before, he could have strolled out of bounds.
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Atrocious roughing the passer call in Tampa.
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Vikes D is so bad.
4-1 is good I guess though.
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Carson Wentz, ladies and gentlemen.
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Yup, he should have went out of bounds about 4 yards before, he could have strolled out of bounds.
100% correct. Although they still probably would have lost.
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Competitive loss was exactly what I wanted for the bears
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Atrocious roughing the passer call in Tampa.
Just saw it. Uhhh.....that was beyond ridiculous.
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I can't bet against the Panthers, but if I could ... them being less than a TD underdog to the Niners would sure look attractive.
I need to start betting against the Panthers ... although I probably won't get a mortal lock like this one.
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Sounds like Brandon Staley's own players are getting tired of his Smarter than the Average Bear routine.
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I need to start betting against the Panthers ... although I probably won't get a mortal lock like this one.
Well, 82, you won't have Matt Rhule to kick around anymore.
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Skol Vikings. Hasn’t always been pretty, but 4-1 and all alone at the top of the division feels good. Super bowl, home boy
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Well, 82, you won't have Matt Rhule to kick around anymore.
Yep, everyone who had him in the First Coach Fired pool, congrats ... not that the payout would be that high because this wasn't all that surprising. He was 11-27.
Going in, I thought this just-completed 3-game home stretch would decide his fate. They opened by beating the Saints but they looked horrible these last two weeks, and no doubt Tepper was mortified by the fact that there were more 49ers fans at the stadium yesterday than Panthers fans. All game, Niners fans were chanting "De-fense! De-fense!" when the Panthers had the ball, and it was loud ... though not as loud as the "Fire Rhule!" chants. I was there, and I'm pretty sure the two most drunk, most obnoxious 49ers fans in America were sitting behind us, so that was pleasant -- as was watching Mayfield throw a horrible pick-6.
The Panthers actually have a decent amount of talent -- quite a few talking heads picked them to contend before this season. But that was all dependent on Mayfield being very good, and he hasn't been. The offense has sucked every single game, including the one they won, despite McCaffrey being healthy and productive. The OC Rhule brought in, Ben McAdoo, has been extremely unimpressive and predictable. They are last in the league in several offensive categories.
Rhule seems like a decent guy, and he looked like a good college coach. But he was in over his head with this job, as most college coaches are. He'll be compensated nicely for not coaching in the NFL, and he's now free to pursue college riches.
Regardless of the sport, it's never fun to be a fan of any team when the season is over only a quarter of the way into it. I hate rooting for my team to go 1-16 so they can get the No. 1 pick.
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I never understood how Rhule became a hot name in the NFL coaching carousal to begin with. He had one year of NFL experience prior to getting the Carolina job. He was a good college coach, but a college coach. I thought NFL teams had learned from this. I guess not. Good work by his agent though. And, he has another huge payday coming from Nebraska or Colorado or Arizona State or Georgia Tech.
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I never understood how Rhule became a hot name in the NFL coaching carousal to begin with. He had one year of NFL experience prior to getting the Carolina job. He was a good college coach, but a college coach. I thought NFL teams had learned from this. I guess not. Good work by his agent though. And, he has another huge payday coming from Nebraska or Colorado or Arizona State or Georgia Tech.
And none of those spots will be easy to repeat his success at Baylor.
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And none of those spots will be easy to repeat his success at Baylor.
I don't know. He was a terrible NFL coach, obviously, but he stepped into two terrible college situations and quickly made both programs respectable.
Hard to imagine there's a more challenging college job out there than what he faced when he took over at Baylor. Which isn't to say that he'll have the same success, just that he's faced tougher circumstances and succeeded.
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And none of those spots will be easy to repeat his success at Baylor.
I think Arizona State would be the place he could duplicate the success. After USC and UCLA leave for the real Ivy League, there is a void to fill.
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I don't know. He was a terrible NFL coach, obviously, but he stepped into two terrible college situations and quickly made both programs respectable.
Hard to imagine there's a more challenging college job out there than what he faced when he took over at Baylor. Which isn't to say that he'll have the same success, just that he's faced tougher circumstances and succeeded.
Don’t disagree. Now that he’s had failure, though, I wonder if that seeps into how he coaches moving forward. It’s weird how hot shots like him can fizzle quick after their first taste of failure
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I think Arizona State would be the place he could duplicate the success. After USC and UCLA leave for the real Ivy League, there is a void to fill.
Do you think they can compete with OSU, Baylor, TCU, BYU, UC, etc.? ;)
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Don’t disagree. Now that he’s had failure, though, I wonder if that seeps into how he coaches moving forward. It’s weird how hot shots like him can fizzle quick after their first taste of failure
Maybe it'll be like when a so-so (or worse) Big East basketball player steps down to the MAC or Sun Belt or wherever and becomes the BMOC.
I'm not saying Rhule is any Saban or Holtz, but they were NFL failures who went back to college and did OK. And there have been others.
Having said that, I have absolutely no idea if he'll do well upon returning to college. He could be outstanding, or he could suck. We'll see. Either way, he'll get paid for the rest of us to find out.
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Feel like Rhule has Spurrier vibes.
Succeeded at a program in a tough spot with relative success (Rhule at Temple, Spurrier taking over a moribund Duke team and winning their first conference title in 25+ years).
Went to a good program that was in a rough spot (Rhule at Baylor, Spurrier taking over a Florida program that had been good at times but never a prime contender in the SEC).
Flopped hard in a short stretch in the NFL (Carolina/Washington).
Back to college. Spurrier didn't replicate what he did at UF in Columbia, but South Carolina had been alright, decent years under Holtz, and Spurrier made them a top 10 team in New Years Day bowls and won the SEC East. I think Rhule could do that. Georgia Tech makes the most sense for him, IMO. Given his geographic history. But Nebraska will pay a lot more.
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I don't know. He was a terrible NFL coach, obviously, but he stepped into two terrible college situations and quickly made both programs respectable.
Hard to imagine there's a more challenging college job out there than what he faced when he took over at Baylor. Which isn't to say that he'll have the same success, just that he's faced tougher circumstances and succeeded.
Yeah, I don't think blue bloods aren't going to beat down the door for him, but I could see him land at a place like Louisville or Arizona State.
EDIT: Good call on Georgia Tech Wags...
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Feel like Rhule has Spurrier vibes.
Succeeded at a program in a tough spot with relative success (Rhule at Temple, Spurrier taking over a moribund Duke team and winning their first conference title in 25+ years).
Went to a good program that was in a rough spot (Rhule at Baylor, Spurrier taking over a Florida program that had been good at times but never a prime contender in the SEC).
Flopped hard in a short stretch in the NFL (Carolina/Washington).
Back to college. Spurrier didn't replicate what he did at UF in Columbia, but South Carolina had been alright, decent years under Holtz, and Spurrier made them a top 10 team in New Years Day bowls and won the SEC East. I think Rhule could do that. Georgia Tech makes the most sense for him, IMO. Given his geographic history. But Nebraska will pay a lot more.
I’d take Arizona State before Georgia Tech. Tech is hard to get transfers into and he’ll need to be quick on his feet building a roster and I think Arizona State will be easier to do that at.
I wouldn’t touch the Nebraska job if I were him. Trev Alberts as your boss sounds terrible
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Feel like Rhule has Spurrier vibes.
Succeeded at a program in a tough spot with relative success (Rhule at Temple, Spurrier taking over a moribund Duke team and winning their first conference title in 25+ years).
Went to a good program that was in a rough spot (Rhule at Baylor, Spurrier taking over a Florida program that had been good at times but never a prime contender in the SEC).
Flopped hard in a short stretch in the NFL (Carolina/Washington).
Back to college. Spurrier didn't replicate what he did at UF in Columbia, but South Carolina had been alright, decent years under Holtz, and Spurrier made them a top 10 team in New Years Day bowls and won the SEC East. I think Rhule could do that. Georgia Tech makes the most sense for him, IMO. Given his geographic history. But Nebraska will pay a lot more.
The track record of coaches that had success in college, failed in the NFL, but came back to college football is pretty good. I would expect Rhule to find solid success wherever he goes.
Auburn is another job that looks to be opening. If so, I would expect Rhule to be at the top of their list.
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The track record of coaches that had success in college, failed in the NFL, but came back to college football is pretty good. I would expect Rhule to find solid success wherever he goes.
Auburn is another job that looks to be opening. If so, I would expect Rhule to be at the top of their list.
Those people in Auburn are nuts
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Those people in Auburn are nuts
True. But, so are the guys in Lincoln.
At Auburn, I believe that it's still possible for a coach to achieve a high level of success. At Nebraska, that would require a time machine.
Honestly, both jobs suck.
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True. But, so are the guys in Lincoln.
At Auburn, I believe that it's still possible for a coach to achieve a high level of success. At Nebraska, that would require a time machine.
Honestly, both jobs suck.
Auburn is a good job where you can build a consistent top 20 program that can even figure in the top 10 some years. Big-time resources and facilities. Money to burn. Best conference. Great recruiting territory. Solid tradition.
The problem, the fan base looks to big brother to the west and demands similar results, or else. They might get that once ina blue moon, but expecting it consistently is silly. at least so long as Saban is still around.
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Auburn is a good job where you can build a consistent top 20 program that can even figure in the top 10 some years. Big-time resources and facilities. Money to burn. Best conference. Great recruiting territory. Solid tradition.
The problem, the fan base looks to big brother to the west and demands similar results, or else. They might get that once ina blue moon, but expecting it consistently is silly. at least so long as Saban is still around.
Completely agree. The Saban era has melted the minds of the Auburn faithful. It's why the job currently sucks.
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The last former NFL head coach hired by Nebraska worked out so well...
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The last former NFL head coach hired by Nebraska worked out so well...
No coach is going to met the expectations of that fanbase. They want Ohio State like results. Ain't happening.
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Oh, you don't have to tell me. At least this time they have a "Nebraska Guy" at AD.
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No coach is going to met the expectations of that fanbase. They want Ohio State like results. Ain't happening.
Crazy how things change. 20 years ago, Ohio State wanted Nebraska type results (which they still have not seen).
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Crazy how things change. 20 years ago, Ohio State wanted Nebraska type results (which they still have not seen).
Huh? Ohio State won the national championship exactly 20 years ago.
The 2002 Buckeyes.
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Huh? Ohio State won the national championship exactly 20 years ago.
The 2002 Buckeyes.
And 2014.
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Huh? Ohio State won the national championship exactly 20 years ago.
The 2002 Buckeyes.
Yea, not to mention Ohio St has miles more success and history than Nebraska pre-Osborne. Even during Osborne's crescendo in the mid 90s, OSU was still finishing top 5. And that was with Cooper, who is arguably the worst/most disappointing OSU coach since Hayes.
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Raiders are curb stomping the Chiefs thus far.
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Raiders are curb stomping the Chiefs thus far.
Packers could use a guy like Davante Adams
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Unfathomable call.
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Got home from umpiring and saw that Raiders were leading 20-10 at halftime. Took a quick shower. Sat down in front of the TV … to see that it was 24-20 Chiefs.
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I wouldn't have gone for 2 if I were McDaniels, but at least I understand why he did.
But why the hell did Reid go for 2 on the previous possession by the Chiefs?
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Packers could use a guy like Davante Adams
He put the Raiders over the top.
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I wouldn't have gone for 2 if I were McDaniels, but at least I understand why he did.
But why the hell did Reid go for 2 on the previous possession by the Chiefs?
ALWAYS go for 2 in the 4th quarter when a TD puts you up 7. Every. Single. Time.
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I wouldn't have gone for 2 if I were McDaniels, but at least I understand why he did.
But why the hell did Reid go for 2 on the previous possession by the Chiefs?
I like the one from Reid. As dish said, in the 4th qtr teams should almost always do that. At least any team with a quality offense
Especially this day in age with the 33 yard PAT.
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Adams should be suspended a game for pushing that audio guy postgame. Pretty classless and terrible.
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ALWAYS go for 2 in the 4th quarter when a TD puts you up 7. Every. Single. Time.
Really? Take the gamble to go up 9 instead of taking the 8, which would force the opponent to not only score a TD but also a 2-pt conversion? That's what analytics says? Seems really weird to me, but OK ... I learned something.
Adams should be suspended a game for pushing that audio guy postgame. Pretty classless and terrible.
The guy he shoulda shoved was Renfro, who threw a cross-body block on Adams on the Raiders' final play. I'm not sure I've ever seen that before. Hell, Draymond woulda punched Renfro in the face. (And Al might have, too.)
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Really? Take the gamble to go up 9 instead of taking the 8, which would force the opponent to not only score a TD but also a 2-pt conversion? That's what analytics says? Seems really weird to me, but OK ... I learned something.
Yes, the 2 is high percentage and in most cases in the 4th if you get it, effectively ends the game(or gives you faaaaaaaar better odds then up 8).
If you kick the extra point, that is still missable. And even with a make the other team just needs a good 2 pt play call to tie.
Miss the 2 pt and they still have to make the non gimme extra point. And worst case youre tied looking at OT.
So basically play to win and even if you miss youre still up a TD.
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Huh? Ohio State won the national championship exactly 20 years ago.
The 2002 Buckeyes.
My bad. 30 years should have been the time frame. 3 championships in about 4 years to OSU's 2 in 20 years.
OSU is in a much better place and has been in the past 20 years, no doubt. My point was in the 90's Nebraska was king of college football. Everyone, including Bama, wanted to be Nebraska.
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I wouldn't have gone for 2 if I were McDaniels, but at least I understand why he did.
But why the hell did Reid go for 2 on the previous possession by the Chiefs?
Though it didn't work out, going for two was the right move by the Raiders.
Playing for OT against the Chiefs on the road doesn't make a lot of sense when picking up a few yards can put you in position to win in regulation.
Even if you don't get it, with all your timeouts plus the 2-minute warning, you get the ball back with time if your defense holds. And if your defense doesn't hold, you're losing anyhow.
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Thanks for your explainers on 2-point tries, PGs and Pak.
Meanwhile ...
(https://scontent-atl3-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/311573117_5843061325726461_3887252596425006118_n.jpg?stp=dst-jpg_s526x296&_nc_cat=103&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=dbeb18&_nc_ohc=d-tV-5_KEkQAX_RMiml&tn=sD8Vy0dufBXd3yfO&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-2.xx&oh=00_AT9Vj3AB4Ya7iggOmeC7AFb5p6JqiL4SWqx_FpBJvo9qDA&oe=634ACDDD)
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Classy move by Devonte.
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Classy move by Devonte.
Did he do something other than the apology? Feels like that’s sort of the bare minimum in the situation.
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He apologized, but kinda made excuses for doing something that was pretty bad.
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Did he do something other than the apology? Feels like that’s sort of the bare minimum in the situation.
He cut off his arms and begged football fans to forgive him
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Yeah as apologies go, that one was pretty weak. "I bumped into him....kind of pushed him"
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He apologized, but kinda made excuses for doing something that was pretty bad.
Pretty weak apology. I understand his frustration but any of us that have played competitive sports has felt it at some time and we didn’t lash out.
Maybe he should have apologized for bobbling a possible game deciding catch in the end zone instead.
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Davante shouldn’t apologize at all. Anyone that had to play with Aaron Rodgers for nearly a decade probably has a lot of PTSD
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Pretty weak apology. I understand his frustration but any of us that have played competitive sports has felt it at some time and we didn’t lash out.
Maybe he should have apologized for bobbling a possible game deciding catch in the end zone instead.
I didn't see much of the game. He bobbled a potential TD pass earlier in the game in addition to the bobbled pass on the sideline in the final minute that, had he caught it, would have set up the winning FG?
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Pretty weak apology. I understand his frustration but any of us that have played competitive sports has felt it at some time and we didn’t lash out.
Maybe he should have apologized for bobbling a possible game deciding catch in the end zone instead.
Really bad look for Davante, both the actual push and the non-apology.
Probably deserves a 1-game suspension, but I doubt he will get it.
Wonder if he has any buyers remorse going to the Raiders. Targeted 54 times this year, but only 29 receptions.
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Really bad look for Davante, both the actual push and the non-apology.
Probably deserves a 1-game suspension, but I doubt he will get it.
Wonder if he has any buyers remorse going to the Raiders. Targeted 54 times this year, but only 29 receptions.
I don't know about buyer's remorse. His numbers will be down, but they aren't awful. I just think he wanted out of Green Bay (I don't think Rodgers and him were particularly close and he knew Rodgers had at best one or two years left), got to go play with his friend (Carr) and got a big contract extension out of it.
FWIW, I have heard nothing but positives about Adams off the field. This action seems like a pretty out-of-character move.
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I don't know about buyer's remorse. His numbers will be down, but they aren't awful. I just think he wanted out of Green Bay (I don't think Rodgers and him were particularly close and he knew Rodgers had at best one or two years left), got to go play with his friend (Carr) and got a big contract extension out of it.
FWIW, I have heard nothing but positives about Adams off the field. This action seems like a pretty out-of-character move.
Having played with Rodgers for nearly a decade, not many knew him better. The idea he has remorse leaving a “great situation” seems to be mostly wishful thinking. He got paid. He got to play with a friend. He’s playing closer to home. Maybe the grass isn’t greener but maybe the place he left isn’t that green either
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Update, the cameraman has filed assault charges in KC court against Adams and is claiming whiplash and a concussion. CASH GRAB CITTTTAAAAYYYY
I salute his bravery and hope he is able to somehow find a reasonable quality of life after surviving such a heinous attack
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Update, the cameraman has filed assault charges in KC court against Adams and is claiming whiplash and a concussion. CASH GRAB CITTTTAAAAYYYY
I salute his bravery and hope he is able to somehow find a reasonable quality of life after surviving such a heinous attack
Well, if he didn't assault him, this wouldn't be an issue.
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Well, if he didn't assault him, this wouldn't be an issue.
Agreed
Also agree it is a cash grab.
Welcome to America, everyone is a victim.
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Agreed
Also agree it is a cash grab.
Welcome to America, everyone is a victim.
This is my point. Adams is in the wrong. That's not in question, not excusing his behavior.
But the exaggeration of injuries and increasing in severity of everything when the accused has money is pathetic. Its like a minor fender bender in a parking lot suddenly has one driver in a neck brace because he was back into by someone in a luxury car.
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This is my point. Adams is in the wrong. That's not in question, not excusing his behavior.
But the exaggeration of injuries and increasing in severity of everything when the accused has money is pathetic. Its like a minor fender bender in a parking lot suddenly has one driver in a neck brace because he was back into by someone in a luxury car.
Well, not a single one of us here knows what kind of injuries the guy suffered, or if he sustained any injuries at all, so we don't know if there was an "exaggeration" of them or not.
Given the tiny bit of evidence we have, the only thing we know is that, as you said, Adams was in the wrong.
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Yeah, butt da kamera dude kut rite in front of 'im. Know signal, know horn, know nothin', hey?
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Yeah, butt da kamera dude kut rite in front of 'im. Know signal, know horn, know nothin', hey?
Just like a driver in SE Wisconsin!
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This is my point. Adams is in the wrong. That's not in question, not excusing his behavior.
But the exaggeration of injuries and increasing in severity of everything when the accused has money is pathetic. Its like a minor fender bender in a parking lot suddenly has one driver in a neck brace because he was back into by someone in a luxury car.
Just like the Brady bunch.
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Just like the Brady bunch.
That's funny because I had the exact same thought when I first read Wags' post.
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Reminds me of the old movie, Jack Lemon, Walter Matthau, in "The Fortune Cookie"
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That's funny because I had the exact same thought when I first read Wags' post.
me 3. Who's going to drop the briefcase?
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Time for the Bears and Commanders in a can’t miss Primetime game
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Time for the Bears and Commanders in a can’t miss Primetime game
We're all in this together.
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Time for the Bears to stop throwing interceptions 5 yards from a touchdown. Ridiculous.
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We're all in this together.
Entirely possible this game ends 2-1
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Perfect play call. Sweet Jesus.
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Seriously? Smh.
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Thursday Night Football has become a comedy show.
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Time for the Bears to stop throwing interceptions 5 yards from a touchdown. Ridiculous.
First (unrushed from the Washington 5) he bounces one off of a defensive lineman’s helmet for an interception. Then with nobody near him he overthrows an easy TD in the flat (again from the Washington 5). Instead of 14-0, it’s 0-0. The guy is brutal.
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First (unrushed from the Washington 5) he bounces one off of a defensive lineman’s helmet for an interception. Then with nobody near him he overthrows an easy TD in the flat (again from the Washington 5). Instead of 14-0, it’s 0-0. The guy is brutal.
Terrible. That honestly can't happen Lenny.
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WTF!!! Fields is driving me nuts.
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Don’t worry guys, Bears are in primetime again next week too.
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At least it won’t end 0-0.
One of these QBs will throw a Pick 6.
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Terrible. That honestly can't happen Lenny.
Totally wide open receiver 8 yards down the field on third and three, he throws it 40 yards down field not even close to a well covered receiver.
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At least it won’t end 0-0.
One of these QBs will throw a Pick 6.
My prediction is Bears 10-3. Both teams are garbage.
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This has been a terrific game to live bet…just sayin.
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My prediction is Bears 10-3. Both teams are garbage.
The Bear’s QB is garbage. The rest of the team isn’t terrible.
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This has been a terrific game to live bet…just sayin.
Sounds like someone is cashing’ in.
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The Bear’s QB is garbage. The rest of the team isn’t terrible.
Did you see that last pass?? WTH?
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Well, that was the dagger.
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Well, that was the dagger.
LOL.
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Live betting first TD scored: Either D/ST options are +2200.
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Live betting first TD scored: Either D/ST options are +2200.
Excuse my ignorance but what does that mean?
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Siemian time?
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Excuse my ignorance but what does that mean?
If you bet 100 that Washington’s Defense or special teams scores the first TD (and they do) you win 2200. Same for the Bears.
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If you bet 100 that Washington’s Defense or special teams scores the first TD (and they do) you win 2200. Same for the Bears.
Thar sounds like a very good bet.
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Surprised they didn't review that.
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Surprised they didn't review that.
They booth review every TD.
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New lawsuit against Watson.
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Inexcusable muff there.
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Roquan folds like an accordion.
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Well, Wentz is the best blocking QB in the league.
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Any guesses on who gets cut this week?
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Complete and utter embarrassment. On every level known to man.
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Slye is one of the worst kickers in pro football.
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Slye is one of the worst kickers in pro football.
Punt it and make them go 90.
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OMG!
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I guess that was only fitting.
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2 straight TNF games in which the winning team rolled to 12 whole points.
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That’ll end up being a great loss for the Bears.
If you’re not going to the playoffs, better to be bad and lose to other bad teams.
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That’ll end up being a great loss for the Bears.
If you’re not going to the playoffs, better to be bad and lose to other bad teams.
Sound thinking in theory, but they may still need to find a QB for the future.
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That’ll end up being a great loss for the Bears.
If you’re not going to the playoffs, better to be bad and lose to other bad teams.
Do we now win the draft tie breaker with Washington?
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Do we now win the draft tie breaker with Washington?
No, head to head doesn’t matter as a tiebreaker. It just helps in that Washington now has an additional win.
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Do we now win the draft tie breaker with Washington?
No, but you got the tiebreaker for the playoffs.
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There was a moment on the first drive where Fields had a WR breaking open over the middle and he missed him and took a sack.
In a football game, there are a lot of plays and it’s hard to get worked up over one play but this really illustrated how much work he has to do. I was a Fields apologist when he came out but if he couldn’t recognize this happening (and his eyes were locked into this receiver) in his second season, I don’t think his future is very bright. This is a basic NFL throw.
I don’t think I’ll scoff at the Ohio State QB NFL failures anymore. They have distinct advantages in college because they have so many electric weapons at WR and usually very good RBs to complement their passing game. The room for error against some of the dregs of the Big Ten is far larger. This is why I’m always leery of the praise of Badger or Michigan or mid-2010 Michigan State defenses. The league lacks speed and top level athletes. OSU benefits on offense and those defenses benefit playing Rutgers and Iowa
What really hammered this home was Herbstreit being critical of him not making that throw. I’m not a Herbstreit hater but he’s usually pretty milquetoast in criticizing players. Can it click for Fields? Maybe but I doubt it’s with the current Bears roster which lacks talent at WR.
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There was a moment on the first drive where Fields had a WR breaking open over the middle and he missed him and took a sack.
In a football game, there are a lot of plays and it’s hard to get worked up over one play but this really illustrated how much work he has to do. I was a Fields apologist when he came out but if he couldn’t recognize this happening (and his eyes were locked into this receiver) in his second season, I don’t think his future is very bright. This is a basic NFL throw.
I don’t think I’ll scoff at the Ohio State QB NFL failures anymore. They have distinct advantages in college because they have so many electric weapons at WR and usually very good RBs to complement their passing game. The room for error against some of the dregs of the Big Ten is far larger. This is why I’m always leery of the praise of Badger or Michigan or mid-2010 Michigan State defenses. The league lacks speed and top level athletes. OSU benefits on offense and those defenses benefit playing Rutgers and Iowa
What really hammered this home was Herbstreit being critical of him not making that throw. I’m not a Herbstreit hater but he’s usually pretty milquetoast in criticizing players. Can it click for Fields? Maybe but I doubt it’s with the current Bears roster which lacks talent at WR.
I agree with you. I truly hope Fields gets better but it seems less likely each week. This is a good season to make an evaluation; little is expected of the team so the losses don't matter. The Bears are 2-3 years away from being competitive, so a reset at QB is not a killer. And, it has been stated before, that the current staff has no connection to him so moving on will be easy since they will not be blamed for his failure.
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There was a moment on the first drive where Fields had a WR breaking open over the middle and he missed him and took a sack.
In a football game, there are a lot of plays and it’s hard to get worked up over one play but this really illustrated how much work he has to do. I was a Fields apologist when he came out but if he couldn’t recognize this happening (and his eyes were locked into this receiver) in his second season, I don’t think his future is very bright. This is a basic NFL throw.
I don’t think I’ll scoff at the Ohio State QB NFL failures anymore. They have distinct advantages in college because they have so many electric weapons at WR and usually very good RBs to complement their passing game. The room for error against some of the dregs of the Big Ten is far larger. This is why I’m always leery of the praise of Badger or Michigan or mid-2010 Michigan State defenses. The league lacks speed and top level athletes. OSU benefits on offense and those defenses benefit playing Rutgers and Iowa
What really hammered this home was Herbstreit being critical of him not making that throw. I’m not a Herbstreit hater but he’s usually pretty milquetoast in criticizing players. Can it click for Fields? Maybe but I doubt it’s with the current Bears roster which lacks talent at WR.
Herbstreit was both fair and accurate. IMO, Fields doesn't have the soft skills at the moment to play the position. Struggles seeing the field, is not decisive with the football, does not anticipate throws (especially in the middle of the field), poor internal clock in the pocket, etc. His physical abilities really don't matter unless he can improve these parts of his game.
The Bears poor talent certainly doesn't help, but at the same time, Fields only exacerbates their issues. The OL is very poor, yet no QB is holding the ball longer than Fields. The WRs are not good, but when the coaching staff does scheme them open or provides a favorable match-up, far too often Fields is not taking advantage.
This was the knock on him coming out of Ohio State. So far, the scouts have been correct.
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I'd love to see the Bears continue to trade draft picks to take a QB in the first round every 3-4 years.
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Herbstreit was both fair and accurate. IMO, Fields doesn't have the soft skills at the moment to play the position. Struggles seeing the field, is not decisive with the football, does not anticipate throws (especially in the middle of the field), poor internal clock in the pocket, etc. His physical abilities really don't matter unless he can improve these parts of his game.
The Bears poor talent certainly doesn't help, but at the same time, Fields only exacerbates their issues. The OL is very poor, yet no QB is holding the ball longer than Fields. The WRs are not good, but when the coaching staff does scheme them open or provides a favorable match-up, far too often Fields is not taking advantage.
This was the knock on him coming out of Ohio State. So far, the scouts have been correct.
Yea thats the frustrating part. He's not in a position to succeed, but he's still failing where he can. He played a much better second half, but his first half was brutal. Decision making/timing is something many young QBs struggle with making the jump to the NFL, but its hard to see him making the jump and improving on that in his current situation.
He's a smart and effective runner, its great to see him slide instead of getting maimed. He's making more and more good throws, changing arm and delivery angles, his deep ball is looking nice. But he's missing touch throws and not seeing developing routes, its all for naught.
I don't agree that its a good season to make an evaluation cause he's in such a brutal surrounding talent situation, but he's not earned benefit of the doubt with a lot of his play. With all due respect, the idea that the Bears "aren't bad" outside of Fields struggling is absolute insanity. Outside of decent RBs and Mooney, who is a good WR2/3 not a WR1, there are zero play makers, the line is atrocious, and the defense is suspect outside of the secondary.
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Talent around Fields is bad, but most of the things you guys are mentioning are coaching issues.
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He will put up 28 against Detroit.
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There are a myriad of issues with the Bears but I think Fields has had a significant sample size. That missed td throw in the end zone just can't happen. Perfect play call, the guy is wide open, and you overthrow him by 5 yards on a 10 yard pass? Can't happen. He also holds onto the ball too long and often makes the wrong decision where to go with the ball. There's also the problem that he continues to get decked and this won't end well for him if it continues. He's a tremendous athlete, and doesn't have much around him, but in order to turn the corner his decision making has to be made faster and with more confidence.
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Yea thats the frustrating part. He's not in a position to succeed, but he's still failing where he can. He played a much better second half, but his first half was brutal. Decision making/timing is something many young QBs struggle with making the jump to the NFL, but its hard to see him making the jump and improving on that in his current situation.
He's a smart and effective runner, its great to see him slide instead of getting maimed. He's making more and more good throws, changing arm and delivery angles, his deep ball is looking nice. But he's missing touch throws and not seeing developing routes, its all for naught.
I don't agree that its a good season to make an evaluation cause he's in such a brutal surrounding talent situation, but he's not earned benefit of the doubt with a lot of his play. With all due respect, the idea that the Bears "aren't bad" outside of Fields struggling is absolute insanity. Outside of decent RBs and Mooney, who is a good WR2/3 not a WR1, there are zero play makers, the line is atrocious, and the defense is suspect outside of the secondary.
Oh, the talent on the Bears is horrible. Both OL and DL are brutal. As you state, only the secondary and RBs rooms are any good. But, I would argue that QB play has to be at the top of their concerns. It has to be. The position is too important.
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I agree with you. I truly hope Fields gets better but it seems less likely each week. This is a good season to make an evaluation; little is expected of the team so the losses don't matter. The Bears are 2-3 years away from being competitive, so a reset at QB is not a killer. And, it has been stated before, that the current staff has no connection to him so moving on will be easy since they will not be blamed for his failure.
Not having to pay Fields at year 5 if he doesn’t develop helps the salary cap but you still need to find a QB and if they have to trade for one again, they’ll still be chasing their tail
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He will put up 28 against Detroit.
Those are the kind of Pyrrhic victories Bears fans and FO have celebrated the last decade or so. If this FO does that, they’re doomed to be stuck in mediocrity
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Talent around Fields is bad, but most of the things you guys are mentioning are coaching issues.
Coaching can only do so much. The concern I have is even when the coaches are putting Fields in a good spot, the plays are not being made. The play Rico mentioned is a perfect example and examples like that show up far too often.
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QBs are like PGs. Yes, they can improve and should improve over time. But the really good ones -- and definitely the great ones -- have innate abilities to anticipate what's going to happen and where teammates are going to be, make quick decisions, and execute well.
I don't know why anybody would conclude, given the sample size, that Fields has it.
Through repetition, study and coaching, can he be a serviceable NFL QB who can commit fewer turnovers, scare teams with his feet and occasionally make plays with his arm? I suppose. But there are very few teams who win anything worthwhile with serviceable QBs. For every Trent Dilfer, who managed once to not screw things up, there are a zillion "OK" QBs who never get there. And Fields still has a long way to get to "OK."
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Talent around Fields is bad, but most of the things you guys are mentioning are coaching issues.
I disagree. Fields being unable to read defenses - a la Trubisky - is on him, not the coaches. It is a skill that Fields does not possess.
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I disagree. Fields being unable to read defenses - a la Trubisky - is on him, not the coaches. It is a skill that Fields does not possess.
You're trying to tell me that it is difficult to read defenses? Or are you saying the coaches aren't able to teach how to?
A TON of bonehead QBs could read defenses.
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Peddle Love ta da Bears, hey?
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Talent around Fields is bad, but most of the things you guys are mentioning are coaching issues.
I missed most of the first half, which sounds like it was by far worse for Fields than the second half. But at least from the second half, I saw as many issues around Fields - drops, guys not running to the sticks, blown protections - as I saw things that I would pin on him.
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Peddle Love ta da Bears, hey?
Ha, right?
Serious question, since you brought him up, would any team trade for Love? Obviously it would be for a single 7-8 round pick, but is he worth that even?
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Ha, right?
Serious question, since you brought him up, would any team trade for Love? Obviously it would be for a single 7-8 round pick, but is he worth that even?
IMO, he is worth more than that. Serviceable in the preseason.
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You're trying to tell me that it is difficult to read defenses? Or are you saying the coaches aren't able to teach how to?
A TON of bonehead QBs could read defenses.
I am saying it is a skill that a QB has or doesn’t have. It is difficult to read defenses and it is not something that can be taught by coaches. Refined? Yes. But not taught. It’s about how his brain is wired. Think teaching math to a kid who has no aptitude for math. You just go in circles trying to teach it.
Trubisky has a lot of physical skills and he seems like a pretty bright guy. But he does not have the skill of reading defenses. Nagy couldn’t teach him and Tomlin can’t teach him.
Fields takes more time in the pocket because he has no idea what he is looking at as a play progresses.
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He's worth a kickin' tee and a used Bike, hey?
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Ha, right?
Serious question, since you brought him up, would any team trade for Love? Obviously it would be for a single 7-8 round pick, but is he worth that even?
Yes, I'm thinking teams would give up their 8th rounder for Love.
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Yes, I'm thinking teams would give up their 8th rounder for Love.
QB play in the NFL has been pretty awful, so someone would probably take a flyer.
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I'd love to see the Bears continue to trade draft picks to take a QB in the first round every 3-4 years.
Bears might be so bad that they don't have to can't trade up in the draft to get a QB.
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https://youtube.com/shorts/nRjtL9UvweE?feature=share
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https://youtube.com/shorts/nRjtL9UvweE?feature=share
See that to me didn't seem like an inability to read the defense. He was cocked back ready to make that throw. That looked like holding the ball too long/timing, and a lack of confidence in either himself or his OL.
Its still bad. Its missing throws you need/want your QB to make, but the nuance is relevant
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See that to me didn't seem like an inability to read the defense. He was cocked back ready to make that throw. That looked like holding the ball too long/timing, and a lack of confidence in either himself or his OL.
Its still bad. Its missing throws you need/want your QB to make, but the nuance is relevant
I disagree, Wags. I think he was unable to read the defensive deployment to know that he was open. He’s not gonna get receivers in the NFL that are “Ohio State open”. And if I’m not mistaken, I believe that was his 1st read.
If not for his running ability, he would already be considered a complete bust.
I might add that I am rooting for Fields. He seems like a great young man and I would love to see the Packers - Bears rivalry resurrected. But I don’t see it.
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Yes, I'm thinking teams would give up their 8th rounder for Love.
I was thinking 9th or 10th rounder. But no lower than 13th.
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There’s little to no difference between Atlanta/New Orleans/Tampa.
You could convince me Tampa is the worst of the three.
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There’s little to no difference between Atlanta/New Orleans/Tampa.
You could convince me Tampa is the worst of the three.
Yeah, the division's there for the taking this season. The Panthers picked a bad year to have (another) bad year.
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The Lions picked a bad time to have a bad 65 years.
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Saquon just pissed off about a million fantasy football players. And maybe some gamblers, too.
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What’s going on in Tampa, with Brady just showing up whenever he feels like it, is ridiculous. They deserved to lose to an awful Steelers team today.
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What’s going on in Tampa, with Brady just showing up whenever he feels like it, is ridiculous. They deserved to lose to an awful Steelers team today.
Tampa had a chance before the season started to acquire some veteran o line to replace 2 injured vets . Instead they go with rookie and inexperienced second year guys. They are getting thrown around like rag dolls by defense .
The Buc O line is trash and Brady has no time to throw
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McCaffrey got picked up and thrown down on his head. No flag. Mike Pereira said it should have been a personal foul.
Had that been Brady, it would have been a 100-yard penalty, a loss of 3 draft picks and a national emergency.
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McCaffrey got picked up and thrown down on his head. No flag. Mike Pereira said it should have been a personal foul.
Had that been Brady, it would have been a 100-yard penalty, a loss of 3 draft picks and a national emergency.
Illustrates the big problem with NFL refs.
Terrible call on the Brady play last week so everyone compensates too far the other way.
There was a play in the GB game where a 300 lb. dL blasted a guy clearly out of bounds. Refs gathered and talked and decided no flag.
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Illustrates the big problem with NFL refs.
Terrible call on the Brady play last week so everyone compensates too far the other way.
There was a play in the GB game where a 300 lb. dL blasted a guy clearly out of bounds. Refs gathered and talked and decided no flag.
No more unnecessary roughness penalties. Make men, men again
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The Panthers just were flagged for a horrible roughing-the-passer call. Mike Pereira said, "That's just not a foul. We've gone too far the other way."
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Pussification of da National Football League, aina?
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Pussification of da National Football League, aina?
After the call against Brady, I thought the NFL just need to put flags on the QBs or just not allow them to be touched. Seriously. I don't want my team to sack a QB, especially in a tight game. The chance of a flag is too great and the rules are way too vague. The current system is unfair to the players, refs and fans.
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How in the world did they miss that tripping in Chiefs/Bills??
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Bills got sum playmakers, aina?
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Bills got sum playmakers, aina?
Yup, they have Kumerow
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Cuttin' his ass wuz da beginnin' of da end fore da Pack, hey?
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Cuttin' his ass wuz da beginnin' of da end fore da Pack, hey?
Coupled with never replacing Kuhn, the franchise hasn’t recovered
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Robbie Anderson is probably going to become available tonight…don’t know enough about him except he has enough “mojo” to get into it with his handlers. That could be a big strike against him on the discipline side, but is he worth a look by packers? Carolinas got to eat a lot of cash but his salary is only $575k
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The Panthers would be thrilled if another team would take Anderson off their hands. I doubt the price would be that high.
He led the NFL in drops last season. He has trouble getting open despite having elite speed, meaning he goes through the motions far too often. He never makes difficult catches. He weighs about 150 pounds and can be tackled with a feather. He has publicly argued with coaches and teammates several times. And he’s vastly overpaid.
Having said that, he has had a couple good years, including his first with the Panthers. Best case scenario for his new team is he plays with a chip on his shoulder and as if his career depends on it, and he helps the team. There IS speed and some talent there.
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I just looked at the Bears schedule. If they finish with more than 5 wins I'd be shocked. It's not inconceivable they finish 4-13.
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They play the Lions twice. Do you have those as wins?
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After the call against Brady, I thought the NFL just need to put flags on the QBs or just not allow them to be touched. Seriously. I don't want my team to sack a QB, especially in a tight game. The chance of a flag is too great and the rules are way too vague. The current system is unfair to the players, refs and fans.
Actually very true
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They play the Lions twice. Do you have those as wins?
No
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The Bears are who we thought they were - just another team in the middle of the dregs that will pick somewhere between 4th and 10th next year. The only game they've lost by more than a possession was the opener in Green Bay. They played the Vikings and Giants tough on the road and those teams have two losses between them. As far as bad teams go, they arent THAT bad. 5-6 wins is about right. They will do something like split with Detroit, and some versions of the Dolphins, Jets, and Falcons will actually be bad when they play them. Then they'll surprise someone they shouldn't - I think they win one of those two home games against the Eagles or Buffalo on Saturday Christmas Eve.
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I read an article yesterday that detailed out the NINE Bears starters who will not be back next year. If they are cutting 9 starters you will most likely see 30+ players off the roster. I bet the vast majority of those don't make other teams and are watching football on Sunday next year.
They have 15 rookies on the team. I'd say there are 25 NFL caliber players on the 53 man squad and I could see them trading 2-3 of those players.
IMHO, the idea of the Bears winning 5-6 games is wishful thinking by Bears fans. (sticking with my 3 win prediction).
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Robbie Anderson -- see ya!
Went to Arizona for what ESPN is saying is a 2024 sixth-rounder and 2025 seventh-rounder. I'd have thought the Panthers might get a little more, but I'm just glad he's gone. He's going from one horse manure team to another, and he can go drop Kyle Murray's passes now.
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Robbie Anderson -- see ya!
Went to Arizona for what ESPN is saying is a 2024 sixth-rounder and 2025 seventh-rounder. I'd have thought the Panthers might get a little more, but I'm just glad he's gone. He's going from one horse manure team to another, and he can go drop Kyle Murray's passes now.
All on the Panthers' dime.
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All on the Panthers' dime.
Well, almost all. According to ESPN:
The Cardinals will take on Anderson's $575,000 salary for the rest of the year, while the Panthers -- who restructured his contract in March -- will take a $20 million dead-cap hit spread across this season and next.
The Charlotte Observer said:
The trade creates roughly $9.7 million in dead cap money for the Panthers over the next two years. However, the Panthers are off the hook for Anderson’s $12 million salary in 2023. Anderson is set to make $8.8 million in base salary next year with another $3.2 million coming through roster bonuses.
Not sure what's right because I don't follow that stuff.
But yes, it sucks that the Panthers basically have to pay to give this clown away. His act wore thin last season, and it's only gotten worse. It happens. We were gonna go 2-15 or 3-14 with him; might as well do it without him.
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Commandos lose Wentz. Probably a long term win
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Commandos lose Wentz. Probably a long term win
Short term too. Wentz is terrible.
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While Rodgers deserves some of the blame for GB's performance, it is the offensive line that has stunk up the place. As bad as any line in the league - including the Bears. The Bears Stout duo ;D on the right side of thew line 0 Jenkins and Borom - are better that the right side of the Packers line.
According to ESPN Analytics, the Packers ranked 20th in pass-block win rate and 24th in run-block win rate entering Week 6, before their struggles against the Jets who had four sacks, nine quarterback hits and 15 pressures.
Fields takes so many sacks because he can't read a defense and holds the ball forever. Rodgers gets hammered despite getting rid of the ball at the 2nd quickest rate in the league.
Meanwhile the defense is a bottom third of the league squad. Absolutely terrible against the run and they have no clue how to get takeaways ranking near the bottom of the league - only the Raiders and Commanders take the ball away less. There is no aggressiveness whatsoever as we see by the totally passive play of the DBs.
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While Rodgers deserves some of the blame for GB's performance, it is the offensive line that has stunk up the place. As bad as any line in the league - including the Bears. The Bears Stout duo ;D on the right side of thew line 0 Jenkins and Borom - are better that the right side of the Packers line.
According to ESPN Analytics, the Packers ranked 20th in pass-block win rate and 24th in run-block win rate entering Week 6, before their struggles against the Jets who had four sacks, nine quarterback hits and 15 pressures.
Fields takes so many sacks because he can't read a defense and holds the ball forever. Rodgers gets hammered despite getting rid of the ball at the 2nd quickest rate in the league.
Meanwhile the defense is a bottom third of the league squad. Absolutely terrible against the run and they have no clue how to get takeaways ranking near the bottom of the league - only the Raiders and Commanders take the ball away less. There is no aggressiveness whatsoever as we see by the totally passive play of the DBs.
Where are you finding bottom 3rd defense?
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Where are you finding bottom 3rd defense?
Look at DVOA this week. If you know what that is.
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Look at DVOA this week. If you know what that is.
Okay!
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This MNF game has been really terribly played and coached. Other than that it’s been great.
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Fitting.
Neither team is good enough to make a play to win.
Takes a mistake to score.
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This MNF game has been really terribly played and coached. Other than that it’s been great.
Russell Effen Wilson. Not many QBs have had such a significant decline in such a short period of time.
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Russell Effen Wilson. Not many QBs have had such a significant decline in such a short period of time.
Matt Stafford says hi. Super bowl MVP last year, and in the running for MVP. He's doing his best Joey Harrington impression this season.
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Matt Stafford says high. Super bowl MVP last year, and in the running for MVP. He's doing his best Joey Harrington impression this season.
Bad o-lines help precipitate declines
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Russell Effen Wilson. Not many QBs have had such a significant decline in such a short period of time.
I actually think he was a bit overrated. He benefitted greatly from a strong running game and his legs. And when both of those fell off, he didn't really have the abilities to win games consistently with his arm.
And I said this earlier, but he was old when he got into the league - a 24 year old rookie.
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This MNF game has been really terribly played and coached. Other than that it’s been great.
For the most part, the quality of play in NFL this season has not been great. I do wonder if the insane coaching carousal of the last few years is really starting to diminish the product. I'm not sure that turning over 25-30% of your HCs every off-season is a recipe for league-wide success.
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I actually think he was a bit greatly overrated.
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For the most part, the quality of play in NFL this season has not been great. I do wonder if the insane coaching carousal of the last few years is really starting to diminish the product. I'm not sure that turning over 25-30% of your HCs every off-season is a recipe for league-wide success.
That and I think teams don't go as full out as they used to during training camp.
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That and I think teams don't go as full out as they used to during training camp.
Piggy-backing on what you and RJax are getting at, the most glaring thing is just how bad offensive line play has been across a lot of the NFL.
I know there is criticism from people in the nfl about colleges not developing QBs that are NFL ready, but I’m starting to wonder about o-line development at the college level.
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I actually think he was a bit overrated. He benefitted greatly from a strong running game and his legs. And when both of those fell off, he didn't really have the abilities to win games consistently with his arm.
And I said this earlier, but he was old when he got into the league - a 24 year old rookie.
That's all reasonable. I did see him engineer some pretty incredible comebacks with his arm, though, including a few against decent Panthers teams.
Bad o-lines help precipitate declines
As is that. Tough to excel (or even be OK) when getting bludgeoned.
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Stafford's production is nearly always tied to the amount of times he gets put on the ground.
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Early season scoring down almost 10 points a game from just 2 years ago.
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Early season scoring down almost 10 points a game from just 2 years ago.
Not enough protection for the QBs by the league,
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Early season scoring down almost 10 points a game from just 2 years ago.
QB play has been quite subpar across the league. Only 4 QBs (Tagovailoa, Allen, Smith, and Mahomes) have a RTG above 100.
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Man, if the allegation is true that the NFL leaked the witness report for their WFT investigation to Dan Snyder, that's the most reprehensible thing yet.
Edit: Edit to say that if true, it also lends further credibility into the reporting that Snyder has dirt on Goodell imo.
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Man, if the allegation is true that the NFL leaked the witness report for their WFT investigation to Dan Snyder, that's the most reprehensible thing yet.
Edit: Edit to say that if true, it also lends further credibility into the reporting that Snyder has dirt on Goodell imo.
Many, many layers to this. Snyder still owns the team because he does have plenty of dirt - whether it be on Goodell or other owners. ecexutives, etc. (lookin' at you, Mr. Jones).
Going back to Gruden, there was no reason for the NFL to leak the emails, but there certainly was for Snyder to release them.
From an ESPN article a couple days ago:
DAN SNYDER DOES this thing when he feels cornered, say those who know him well. He paces in a hotel suite, or on his superyacht, or at River View, his $48 million Virginia estate. Cradling a drink in one hand, he tells members of his inner circle about the dirt he has accumulated on fellow owners, coaches, executives, even his own employees -- all the stuff he's learned from other sources, including private investigative firms. He never says exactly what he knows, only that in his 23 years as owner of the Washington Commanders, he knows a lot. And that in the zero-sum world of billionaires, this is how you survive. Snyder recently told a close associate that he has gathered enough secrets to "blow up" several NFL owners, the league office and even commissioner Roger Goodell.
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Early season scoring down almost 10 points a game from just 2 years ago.
Despite the best efforts of the Lion defense.
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Despite the best efforts of the Lion defense.
I smiled at this, Tower.
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https://www.yahoo.com/sports/lions-dt-levi-onwuzurike-undergoes-195500344.html
The curse of the Lions.
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Interesting owners meetings so far.
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Interesting owners meetings so far.
;D ;D
Who does Jerry hate more? Goodell or Kraft?
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Kraft vs Jerrah is some real root for the meteor ish.
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Kraft vs Jones
Irsay vs Snyder
A couple blue blood matchups
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Kraft vs Jones
Irsay vs Snyder
A couple blue blood matchups
Irsay is Nova.
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Kraft vs Jones
Irsay vs Snyder
A couple blue blood matchups
Irsay v Snyder is great cause Irsay is a total wild card but seems like he could be a great hang and fun in a social setting (before he gets too obliterated) while Synder is the arrogant standoffish prick who you can’t figure out why he’s so full of himself with a healthy dash of Randall from Recess
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Randall from Recess
That's a reference that like 10 of us will understand :D ;D ;D
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Kraft vs Jones
Irsay vs Snyder
A couple blue blood matchups
Mark Davis vs Barbers
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In the 1980s, this was one of the NFL's great franchises. Now it bounces prize checks for fans.
https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/investigations/washington-commanders-fan-says-teams-14000-dollar-prize-check-bounced/65-02631143-b75a-4e2b-a92a-ad489e901563
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Christian McCaffery traded to the Niners for draft picks.
Ballsy move by Lynch, but I'm not sure that an injury prone RB puts them over the top.
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Hot take…I would play CMC in the slot if I were the Niners (yes I realize they have Deebo).
Niners gave up way too much here. A third and a fourth should have sufficed.
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When healthy, McCaffrey has been one of the best offensive players in the NFL. He has been healthy in 4 of his 6 seasons, including this one, when he looked great despite being the target of every defense the sucky Panthers have played. Having 2 injury-filled seasons obviously isn't good, though, and Niners fans will have to do what we here in NC have done -- cross their fingers every time he touches the ball.
In addition to being surprisingly tough between the tackles for a little guy, he is a tremendous receiver -- the best hands I've ever seen at the position. He's also a great blocker, routinely makes the right read picking up blitzes. And he's only 26.
Once the Panthers decided they were gonna tank to draft a QB, I guess it made sense to get as much as they could for CMC. They were the league's worst offense with him, and they'll be the league's worst offense without him.
I think the haul is pretty decent -- the Panthers got it by pitting the Niners and Rams against each other.
Dish, I've often said I wished the Panthers would play CMC more in the slot. He's such a freakin' good RB, though, I don't blame them for using him in the backfield.
As a Panthers fan, I'll miss watching him play for my team. Along with Newton, Kuechly and Steve Smith, he's one of the four best players the Panthers have had since I moved to town.
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Once the Panthers decided they were gonna tank to draft a QB, I guess it made sense to get as much as they could for CMC. They were the league's worst offense with him, and they'll be the league's worst offense without him.
I think the haul is pretty decent -- the Panthers got it by pitting the Niners and Rams against each other.
+1 on all here. The structure of his deal pretty much required that he be traded now, because paying him $10+M next year was never going to happen. He basically costs the 49ers no money this year, which probably had a bit to do with driving up his value. From what I can tell on Spotrac (disclaimer - a lot about NFL accounting is a mystery to me), the 49ers and Rams each have $4-$5 M in space, so even an expensive prorated contract could be tough for them to take on.
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+1 on all here. The structure of his deal pretty much required that he be traded now, because paying him $10+M next year was never going to happen. He basically costs the 49ers no money this year, which probably had a bit to do with driving up his value. From what I can tell on Spotrac (disclaimer - a lot about NFL accounting is a mystery to me), the 49ers and Rams each have $4-$5 M in space, so even an expensive prorated contract could be tough for them to take on.
Thanks for the Spotrac info. I check out the site and its very cool. For grins I looked at my Bears for next year and they have $106MM of cap space. That is crazy. I wonder how they will overpay bad players to use up that money.
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Thanks for the Spotrac info. I check out the site and its very cool. For grins I looked at my Bears for next year and they have $106MM of cap space. That is crazy. I wonder how they will overpay bad players to use up that money.
Very easily and predictably.
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I wonder if Brady retires before the season ends.
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Hopefully Rodgers too
I wonder if Brady retires before the season ends.
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I wonder if the Lions get more wins than last year. (3)
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I wonder if Brady retires before the season ends.
Bruce Arians has to be smiling about all of this.
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Chiefs free agent receivers really coming around. Must be nice.
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Jimmy G. 😳😳😳
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Chiefs free agent receivers really coming around. Must be nice.
Surprised Mahomes doesn’t need the offense simplified
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Chiefs free agent receivers really coming around. Must be nice.
It helps to have a QB who WRs want to play for, instead of one who just rips the players in the media.
Many of the free agent WRs are in part recruited by the QB. Rodgers is kind of known as a malcontent, and odd guy that isn't particularly easy to work with, but who thinks his crap don't stink.
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It helps to have a QB who WRs want to play for, instead of one who just rips the players in the media.
Many of the free agent WRs are in part recruited by the QB. Rodgers is kind of known as a malcontent, and odd guy that isn't particularly easy to work with, but who thinks his crap don't stink.
Davante did not want to stay in Green Bay.
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Davante did not want to stay in Green Bay.
Yes, he wanted out. Not sure if you are agreeing and listing him as an example, or just listing something not material to the post.
Other QBs are very active and successful in helping recruit free agent WRs to the team. Rodgers is kind of well known as a malcontent, and a difficult person.
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Yes, he wanted out. Not sure if you are agreeing and listing him as an example, or just listing something not material to the post.
Other QBs are very active and successful in helping recruit free agent WRs to the team. Rodgers is kind of well known as a malcontent, and a difficult person.
Sorry. I am using him as an example to your point.
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I wonder if the Lions get more wins than last year. (3)
I’ll take the over. They’ll beat the bears twice and probably pick up a couple other wins. I’m guessing they end with 5 which may be a good thing since it’s a QB heavy draft and I think Will Anderson would be perfect for them
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Sorry. I am using him as an example to your point.
I thought that was what you are doing, but unsure as I've seen others on here argue other things in regards to Adams and can't keep track of who makes what arguments anymore.
Sorry if my response seemed aggressive, have a migraine this evening and probably shouldn't be posting.
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I wonder if Brady retires before the season ends.
Brady looked bad today.
He wasn't helped by a couple of drops, including Mike Evans almost impossibly bricking a walk-in TD early in the game. But Brady had all day to throw on most of his dropbacks, and the Panthers were down 2 starting CBs, and yet Brady's reads were often late, and several of his throws were off the mark.
He's been counted out before -- including in the Super Bowl against Atlanta -- and he always has responded.
But he hasn't always been 45. Athletes DO get old eventually. Even Brady.
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Falcons are sitting at +350 to win the NFC South.
I know they get trounced and boat raced out of Cincy today, but check out their next 7 games.
CAR
LAC
@CAR
CHI
@WAS
PIT
@NO
Tampa’s next 7:
BAL
LAR
SEA
@CLE
NO
@SF
CIN
Atlanta could easily head into Week 16 up two games on a lousy Tampa Bay team.
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Wonder if Stephen Ross is going to actually care about needing a reason to fire Mike McDaniel at the end of the year so he can hire Sean Payton…
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Falcons are sitting at +350 to win the NFC South.
I know they get trounced and boat raced out of Cincy today, but check out their next 7 games.
CAR
LAC
@CAR
CHI
@WAS
PIT
@NO
Tampa’s next 7:
BAL
LAR
SEA
@CLE
NO
@SF
CIN
Atlanta could easily head into Week 16 up two games on a lousy Tampa Bay team.
The Panthers' schedule is tougher than Atlanta's, but they play the Falcons 2 of the next 3 games (sandwiched around a loss at Cinci) and could be in first place in mid-November with a 4-0 record against the NFC South (and 0-6 against the rest of the NFL). Which is a perfect illustration of this sh!tty division.
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Wonder if Stephen Ross is going to actually care about needing a reason to fire Mike McDaniel at the end of the year so he can hire Sean Payton…
He was reaaaallll close to giving Ross a reason about halfway through the Bengals game...
I generally really like McDaniel, although sometimes his playcalling drives me a little nuts. I LOVE the design of his offense and think his playsheet is one of the best out there. But he has a tendency to get away from those running schemes that make it great, even when the ground game is effective. I would have much preferred to see another 4-6 carries for each of Mostert and Edmonds last night and to see Tua well under 30 attempts.
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Wonder if Stephen Ross is going to actually care about needing a reason to fire Mike McDaniel at the end of the year so he can hire Sean Payton…
That would be a fantastically short sighted and dumb idea, so I'm fairly certain Ross will do it
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Giants 6-1, who woulda thunk? Wow, down 17-13 in 3rd quarter, go fourth and goal rather that the easy 3 point chip shot and fail; yet still win the game. I wonder if those kind of gambles will continue to pay off in the second half of the season.
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Giants 6-1, who woulda thunk? Wow, down 17-13 in 3rd quarter, go fourth and goal rather that the easy 3 point chip shot and fail; yet still win the game. I wonder if those kind of gambles will continue to pay off in the second half of the season.
Analytics probably say to always go for a touchdown over a field goal when down 4.
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Colts bench Matty Ice for the season. Which washed up QB will they get next year?
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Colts bench Matty Ice for the season. Which washed up QB will they get next year?
Packers should be on the horn. And then 12 can live in Indy with Pat McAfee
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Colts bench Matty Ice for the season. Which washed up QB will they get next year?
Lotsa old QBs goin' over the cliff this year. Brady, Rodgers, Stafford, Ryan, Wilson.
I don't know if this has ever happened on such a large scale.
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Colts bench Matty Ice for the season. Which washed up QB will they get next year?
He was a bad idea from the get-go. He was toast last season.
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Colts bench Matty Ice for the season. Which washed up QB will they get next year?
On Sunday, Ehlinger will become the seventh quarterback to start a game for the Colts since Reich became the team's coach in 2018.
On their way to reaching Cleveland Browns level.
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There is a dearth of franchise quarterbacks out there.
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Brady looked bad today.
He wasn't helped by a couple of drops, including Mike Evans almost impossibly bricking a walk-in TD early in the game. But Brady had all day to throw on most of his dropbacks, and the Panthers were down 2 starting CBs, and yet Brady's reads were often late, and several of his throws were off the mark.
He's been counted out before -- including in the Super Bowl against Atlanta -- and he always has responded.
But he hasn't always been 45. Athletes DO get old eventually. Even Brady.
Some interesting comparisons with Brady and Rodgers highlight why they may be having problems this year.
They are 1 and 2 in quickest to throw, which to a large part is because neither is really capable of getting out of the pocket on roll outs.
Rodgers is number 1, and Brady is also fairly high up on shortest air yards per completion. Which means they are not throwing the ball particularly far downfield on completions.
Normally, that shorter passes should lead to a higher on target %. But both Rodgers and Brady are dead middle of the road in terms of accuracy (on target %).
So, they are making short throws, aren't very accurate, and easy to pressure as they can't scramble. That makes it tough to win games.
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Some interesting comparisons with Brady and Rodgers highlight why they may be having problems this year.
They are 1 and 2 in quickest to throw, which to a large part is because neither is really capable of getting out of the pocket on roll outs.
Rodgers is number 1, and Brady is also fairly high up on shortest air yards per completion. Which means they are not throwing the ball particularly far downfield on completions.
Normally, that shorter passes should lead to a higher on target %. But both Rodgers and Brady are dead middle of the road in terms of accuracy (on target %).
So, they are making short throws, aren't very accurate, and easy to pressure as they can't scramble. That makes it tough to win games.
Oh, Rodgers has been throwing the ball far downfield, just not remotely in the vicinity of his receivers.
(Which, I know, is what you said..."on completions").
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There is a dearth of franchise quarterbacks out there.
Yup.
I think orgs aren't quick enough to move on. And prefer free agent vets to rookies.
They need to keep drafting until you find one. Bears should be drafting minimum 1 per year.
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Yup.
I think orgs aren't quick enough to move on. And prefer free agent vets to rookies.
They need to keep drafting until you find one. Bears should be drafting minimum 1 per year.
Yeah, it all seems to be counterintuitive. A journeyman FA is not the way to build a strong team. You have to develop a QBS.
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Nice pick there by Da Bears
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After that Zappe TD pass, I texted my brother “here comes the Fields INT drive”. Luckily I bet it at +550 too.
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So, who trades for Mac Jones?
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So, who trades for Mac Jones?
A little young for the Colts…
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Heckuva response by the Bears and Fields
-
This first half has been arguably the most interesting half of primetime football all year.
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Not one of Belichick’s finest efforts tonite.
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Some interesting comparisons with Brady and Rodgers highlight why they may be having problems this year.
They are 1 and 2 in quickest to throw, which to a large part is because neither is really capable of getting out of the pocket on roll outs.
Rodgers is number 1, and Brady is also fairly high up on shortest air yards per completion. Which means they are not throwing the ball particularly far downfield on completions.
Normally, that shorter passes should lead to a higher on target %. But both Rodgers and Brady are dead middle of the road in terms of accuracy (on target %).
So, they are making short throws, aren't very accurate, and easy to pressure as they can't scramble. That makes it tough to win games.
Rodgers always was good moving in and around the pocket, and he could scramble downfield effectively if things broke down.
I have seen very little of the Packers this season. Does he no longer move well?
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Just an ass whipping tonight.
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Good work by the Bears.
Also, maybe -- like Brady and Rodgers -- Belichick has lost it!
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Is it time to Bear down? Best performance by the Bears in like a decade. 🐻
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That was something else. No one saw that coming.
I haven’t seen the Bears dominate like that in a long, long time. To do it against the Pats in Foxboro was really impressive. They’re suddenly in the playoff hunt in a terrible NFC.
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That was something else. No one saw that coming.
I haven’t seen the Bears dominate like that in a long, long time. To do it against the Pats in Foxboro was really impressive. They’re suddenly in the playoff hunt in a terrible NFC.
Very impressive D and run game. O line was stellar. Smacked the Pats in the mouth tonight.
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That was something else. No one saw that coming.
I haven’t seen the Bears dominate like that in a long, long time. To do it against the Pats in Foxboro was really impressive. They’re suddenly in the playoff hunt in a terrible NFC.
I thought this would be a pretty clean under. Bears TT was like 14.5 which seemed totally fair given how bad it had been and how stingy the Pats D had been, baffling how well they played. It was really fun to watch, which I’ve not said about the Bears lately.
My only gripe was the last TD drive. You’re firmly in control, Fields has played pretty well, they just had him hand it off repeatedly instead of trying to get him reps or in rhythm short throws. Missed opportunity IMO. The throw he had to Herbert for the TD was really damn good.
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The Athletic's power rankings has San Fran at #10.
Parity!
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The Athletic's power rankings has San Fran at #10.
Parity!
Parity sucks
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Yeah, it all seems to be counterintuitive. A journeyman FA is not the way to build a strong team. You have to develop a QBS.
Totally agree. And the veterans getting passed around to start aren't cheap! Bringing in a starter you didn't develop is crazy expensive even to be middle of the road. Wentz, Darnold, Ryan all have cap hits of over $18.5 million.
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Parity sucks
All things being equal, I agree. At the end of the day.
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Totally agree. And the veterans getting passed around to start aren't cheap! Bringing in a starter you didn't develop is crazy expensive even to be middle of the road. Wentz, Darnold, Ryan all have cap hits of over $18.5 million.
I think it depends. Wentz absolutely stinks, but he wasn't terrible in Indy and is not yet 30, so I sort of get it. Ryan on the other hand, that was baffling. He was steadily declining in Atlanta.
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Totally agree. And the veterans getting passed around to start aren't cheap! Bringing in a starter you didn't develop is crazy expensive even to be middle of the road. Wentz, Darnold, Ryan all have cap hits of over $18.5 million.
Who is this "Darnold" guy you mentioned. Never heard of him!
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Interesting Washington Post article on how difficult it is for a Black interim coach in the NFL to get promoted to the actual coaching job.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/interactive/2022/interim-black-nfl-coaches/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F383921d%2F635958f8f3d9003c581b7aaf%2F5f8d147cae7e8a56e5b732a4%2F27%2F72%2F635958f8f3d9003c581b7aaf&wp_cu=b1005792a416de1fbe1f17e5cf366b7d%7CB1FF71CA724A36FAE0530100007F88D6
If an interim job is indeed an audition for a full-time one, Black coaches are held to a higher standard.
Typically inheriting losing teams midseason, interim coaches rarely perform well, amassing a combined winning percentage of .347 since 1990.
For White coaches, The Post found, performing this poorly appears to have little impact on their ability to turn their interim experience into a full-time job: Ten of 32 White interims who replaced full-time coaches midseason were promoted to the permanent job, with a combined winning percentage of just .361.
For Black coaches, though, the bar is higher. Just three of 14 Black interim coaches, not including Wilks this season, have been retained on a permanent basis — and all three led their struggling teams to records of .500 or better.
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Bears trading Robert Quinn to the Eagles.
Update: 4th round pick coming back
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Bears trading Robert Quinn to the Eagles.
Update: 4th round pick coming back
A decent return for a guy with 6 tackles and 1 sack.
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With the Quinn trade, the Bears will now be $135 million below the cap for 2023 (that's at this year's cap number, if the cap goes up, obviously so will this number). Still have to figure out what to do with Roquan, and he'd obviously take up space here. Have to think if things don't work out in Indy this offseason (he'll most likely be tagged), Quenton Nelson would be high on the Bears wishlist this offseason.
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With the Quinn trade, the Bears will now be $135 million below the cap for 2023 (that's at this year's cap number, if the cap goes up, obviously so will this number). Still have to figure out what to do with Roquan, and he'd obviously take up space here. Have to think if things don't work out in Indy this offseason (he'll most likely be tagged), Quenton Nelson would be high on the Bears wishlist this offseason.
Nelson signed a four-year extension in September.
As a Bears guy, be grateful. No guard is worth $20 million a year.
Assuming Lamar stays in Baltimore, next year's FA class is seriously lacking in star power.
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With the Quinn trade, the Bears will now be $135 million below the cap for 2023 (that's at this year's cap number, if the cap goes up, obviously so will this number). Still have to figure out what to do with Roquan, and he'd obviously take up space here. Have to think if things don't work out in Indy this offseason (he'll most likely be tagged), Quenton Nelson would be high on the Bears wishlist this offseason.
As a Bears fan, them having that much money makes me nervous. Hope the new guys are smarter than the old.
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Nelson signed a four-year extension in September.
As a Bears guy, be grateful. No guard is worth $20 million a year.
Assuming Lamar stays in Baltimore, next year's FA class is seriously lacking in star power.
Ahh, he did, that's my bad. I was thinking more of both the fit (Eberflus being from Indy) and the need, but yes, your point is certainly valid.
I do wonder if they'll end up "buying" draft picks by taking on a bad contract or two.
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Nelson signed a four-year extension in September.
As a Bears guy, be grateful. No guard is worth $20 million a year.
Assuming Lamar stays in Baltimore, next year's FA class is seriously lacking in star power.
While every fan wants a splash, I'm almost grateful there wont be some huge splashy big money MUST HAVE stars when the Bears have deep pockets next year. For a team with as many holes as they do, I'd rather they get a bunch of above average pieces than drop $20-25MM on 2-3 guys. Hopefully Poles is thinking the same.
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I’ll take Horrible NFL Divisions for $200, Ghost of Alex.
If the Panthers win Sunday at Atlanta, they’ll be tied for first place.
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Actually winner of Panthers/Falcons on Sunday will have sole possession of 1st in the NFC South.
Unbelievable.
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Actually winner of Panthers/Falcons on Sunday will have sole possession of 1st in the NFC South.
Unbelievable.
Depends on meaning of “sole.” If the Panthers win, they, TB and Atl will all be 3-5, so not really “sole.” But the Panthers will be 1-0 against each of the division’s teams, so they’d be good with tiebreakers.
Atlanta would be alone in first with a win.
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I’ll take Horrible NFL Divisions for $200, Ghost of Alex.
If the Panthers win Sunday at Atlanta, they’ll be tied for first place.
So the Panthers are trying to dump anyone they can for draft picks, figuring they are in rebuild mode and might as well play for a better draft pick...and simultaneously might be in 1st place in their division.
Crazy NFL season so far.
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So the Panthers are trying to dump anyone they can for draft picks, figuring they are in rebuild mode and might as well play for a better draft pick...and simultaneously might be in 1st place in their division.
Crazy NFL season so far.
Well, the Panthers reportedly turned down 2 first-round draft picks for Brian Burns, their young Pro Bowl edge rusher. And they have publicly stated that they want to build around Burns, D.J. Moore, Jeremy Chinn and their other good young players. So unless something changes before the trade deadline, I'm not sure it's accurate to say they'll "dump anyone they can."
I hated losing McCaffrey but I understand the trade and most observers think the Panthers got more than they should have been able to get for him. Otherwise, Robbie Anderson had to go -- they'd have cut him if Arizona didn't throw draft picks their way -- and if they can move non-core guys for draft capital that'll be fine, too. Baker Mayfield, anyone? Pretty please?
But yes, it's been a crazy NFL season.
I did just hear that Panthers scouts wanted the team to trade up in 2020 so they could draft Herbert but new coach Matt Rhule didn't want to. Yet another reason for Panthers fans to hate Rhule.
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So much for the Bears turning the corner. Good grief.
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So much for the Bears turning the corner. Good grief.
Anyone, outside the Bear's locker room, who thought the Bears turned a corner has not looked at the roster. Even a three wins the roster has mostly non-NFL talent. A massive turnover of most of the roster is coming. They have 15 rookies; you don't have 15 rookies make a team if you have any sort of talent.
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Anyone, outside the Bear's locker room, who thought the Bears turned a corner has not looked at the roster. Even a three wins the roster has mostly non-NFL talent. A massive turnover of most of the roster is coming. They have 15 rookies; you don't have 15 rookies make a team if you have any sort of talent.
Two dumb play calls to close the half.
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Miami-Detroit felt like a video game in the first half.
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Yep. Maybe they don't trust Fields. IMO, they shouldn't.
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Yep. Maybe they don't trust Fields. IMO, they shouldn't.
He threw two catchable passes in the end zone. The defense was abysmal in the first half.
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Dammit. Should have the 🐻 gone for 2 there with close to 10 mins left in the 3rd Q?? I say no.
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Third quarter.... same old Lions
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That was crazy! Why did Fields jump over that guy? WTF????
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Cam Newton loves that business decision.
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Hell of a box score for Davante Adams this afternoon.
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Hell of a box score for Davante Adams this afternoon.
He’s really imposing his will on the Raidahs.
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Zach Wilson has been atrocious today.
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Will the Cowboys hang 60 on the Bears?
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Hell of a box score for Davante Adams this afternoon.
Both of his total yards were big.
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Will the Cowboys hang 60 on the Bears?
What happened to their defense? Or is it just that bad?
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Panthers secondary totally gave up on Byrd TD.
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OMG!
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Dumb. Dumb. Dumb.
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I’ve watched most of Falcons/Panthers, unreal this entire game. Wow, what an awful penalty.
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Total Lions move by the Panther WR.
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What happened to their defense? Or is it just that bad?
I think the Bears D is good (not very good, not great). I think they have managed the games, up till today, to keep the games low scoring and somewhat close. Also, they traded a good player this week.
Everyone knows they are in tank/rebuild mode, but even with only three wins, they maybe ahead of schedule. (I say maybe because nobody would be shocked if they lose out)
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Vikes D is hanging by a thread in most games.
But winning.
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Vikes D is hanging by a thread in most games.
But winning.
That’s good enough in today’s NFL. The rules are so skewed towards offenses, it’s hard to be great on defense every week. Just be good at tackling and avoid procedural penalties is a great way to PLU defense nowadays
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I’ve watched most of Falcons/Panthers, unreal this entire game. Wow, what an awful penalty.
It was a very exciting game ... but when you're a fan of the team that ultimately loses, your perception gets skewed.
In a span of 10 seconds at the end of regulation, it went from "There is no way we can win this game" to "There is no way we can lose this game." A friend and I were watching at a local sports bar, and it was wild in there.
As for the penalty ... it's not like the helmet-removal rule is new. It was a selfish and idiotic act by D.J. Moore, and it ruined an amazing play he made on that ball, which also was thrown incredibly well. (BTW, Moore, who is a very good receiver, dropped a much easier 4th-down pass right in his hands to end the previous possession -- a drop that at the time seemed to have ended the Panthers' chances.)
Still, there's no rule prohibiting a kicker from making a long PAT. And certainly no rule prohibiting a kicker from making a 33-yard FG in overtime.
The Panthers obviously have to cut Pineiro, yet another Bears kicking bust. You can't keep a PK whom you can't trust to make a 30-yard FG with the game on the line.
Not that it matters. The Panthers didn't deserve to be in the playoff conversation anyway, and now they certainly won't be. Time to start thinking about which QB my guys will draft.
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Roquan is a Raven.
Bears getting a 2nd and 5th back
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Roquan is a Raven.
Bears getting a 2nd and 5th back
In other words, the new Bears' brass considered him to be vastly overrated.
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In other words, the new Bears' brass considered him to be vastly overrated.
?
I think a 2nd and a 5th is a pretty good return.
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?
I think a 2nd and a 5th is a pretty good return.
Agreed. Bears are positioning themselves well.
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Great trade, don’t have to make a decision on paying Roquan, and the most valuable draft asset is as many second round picks as you can get.
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?
I think a 2nd and a 5th is a pretty good return.
The fact they're dealing him is a failure. This is the kind of player they should be building around in hopes of turning into a contender during the latter years of Fields' first contract (which is a big part of why you trade two firsts to acquire Fields in the first place).
Trading Smith seems an admission that this team doesn't hope to compete in the next 3-4 years and they know Roquan doesn't want to be a part of the organization.
As for the return, meh. Off-ball linebackers aren't the most valuable commodity in the NFL, but a late second and a fifth for a 25-year-old Pro Bowler isn't much. I wonder if the might have done better trying a tag-and-trade in the offseason.
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As for the return, meh. Off-ball linebackers aren't the most valuable commodity in the NFL, but a late second and a fifth for a 25-year-old Pro Bowler isn't much. I wonder if the might have done better trying a tag-and-trade in the offseason.
No, they would not have gotten more in a tag/trade in the offseason. The offseason market for him existed this past summer, and risking injury the rest of the season, to see him also walk, wasn’t worth it.
With as much under the cap as they’re going to be, they wouldn’t have gotten a compensatory pick for him walking either.
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?
I think a 2nd and a 5th is a pretty good return.
Lenny, I wasn't speaking about the return, as I agree with you on that point.
I was referring to them wanting to get rid of him (at a young age) rather than pay him. Unless, of course, he had told them privately that he would not re-sign.
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No, they would not have gotten more in a tag/trade in the offseason. The offseason market for him existed this past summer, and risking injury the rest of the season, to see him also walk, wasn’t worth it.
With as much under the cap as they’re going to be, they wouldn’t have gotten a compensatory pick for him walking either.
I'm not understanding you here. Why do you think they would have let him walk this offseason?
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Great trade, don’t have to make a decision on paying Roquan, and the most valuable draft asset is as many second round picks as you can get.
More picks - especially in the 2nd - 4th rounds is definitely a recipe for success.
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More picks - especially in the 2nd - 4th rounds is definitely a recipe for success.
Only if they're used correctly.
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I'm not understanding you here. Why do you think they would have let him walk this offseason?
They didn't think he was worth $100MM like he thinks he is and/or the relationship underlying a long term deal was too strained after the offseason.
I think Poles likes Smith, as many do, but realizes that a big payday (overpay or not) for an off ball LB isn't the best use of funds for a team with as many holes as the Bears. Jockey deeming it "vastly overrated" may be a bit harsh, but I think the Bears and Smith are clearly split on his contract valuation.
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Yep. Maybe they don't trust Fields. IMO, they shouldn't.
Yet he had another really nice game yesterday and may be turning the corner.
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I'm not understanding you here. Why do you think they would have let him walk this offseason?
They weren’t going to tag him, he wasn’t going to play under the tag, both sides knew very well where the other stood. Roquan/Bears relationship was over after this season. It made all the sense in the world to move him based on that knowledge.
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The fact they're dealing him is a failure. This is the kind of player they should be building around in hopes of turning into a contender during the latter years of Fields' first contract (which is a big part of why you trade two firsts to acquire Fields in the first place).
Trading Smith seems an admission that this team doesn't hope to compete in the next 3-4 years and they know Roquan doesn't want to be a part of the organization.
As for the return, meh. Off-ball linebackers aren't the most valuable commodity in the NFL, but a late second and a fifth for a 25-year-old Pro Bowler isn't much. I wonder if the might have done better trying a tag-and-trade in the offseason.
A whole lot of hyperbole in here, IMO. They could not come to an agreement with Smith and it was pretty clear they weren't going to pay Smith what he and Saint Omni wanted. So instead of going through a repeat you move the player for assets. They certainly weren't getting a 1st rounder for an offball linebacker who wants to be paid $20 million+ per season.
Quick turnarounds happen all the time in the NFL. Trading him in no way concedes that they don't hope to compete in the next 3-4 years. If Fields is the real deal, and things are looking better recently, there's no reason not to expect a competitive team by the 2024 season with all of the financial flexibility and a full allotment of draft picks.
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Only if they're used correctly.
Maybe.
I read a study that teams with the most picks over the years tend to have the best drafts. The obvious reason being there is a bigger margin for error. Thompson used this strategy in GB often trading down to acquire more draft picks. And until his last couple years when he started to lose it mentally, it was generally successful.
One caveat that I can think of might be that GMs who are smart enough to stockpile picks might also be smart enough to use them better.
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Maybe.
I read a study that teams with the most picks over the years tend to have the best drafts. The obvious reason being there is a bigger margin for error. Thompson used this strategy in GB often trading down to acquire more draft picks. And until his last couple years when he started to lose it mentally, it was generally successful.
One caveat that I can think of might be that GMs who are smart enough to stockpile picks might also be smart enough to use them better.
That’s fair. We’ll see!
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They weren’t going to tag him, he wasn’t going to play under the tag, both sides knew very well where the other stood. Roquan/Bears relationship was over after this season. It made all the sense in the world to move him based on that knowledge.
Trading away building-block type players in their prime because you think it's going to be difficult to sign them rarely works out in the NFL. (see: Raiders and Khalil Mack).
And players who threaten not to hold out under the tag - pretty much every player who's ever been tagged and not named Kirk Cousins - rarely follow through on that threat. Good organizations use the tag as leverage for a long-term deal.
The fact the Bears felt compelled to make this trade is an organizational failure.
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Maybe.
I read a study that teams with the most picks over the years tend to have the best drafts. The obvious reason being there is a bigger margin for error. Thompson used this strategy in GB often trading down to acquire more draft picks. And until his last couple years when he started to lose it mentally, it was generally successful.
One caveat that I can think of might be that GMs who are smart enough to stockpile picks might also be smart enough to use them better.
None of those rules apply to Detroit
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Trading away building-block type players in their prime because you think it's going to be difficult to sign them rarely works out in the NFL. (see: Raiders and Khalil Mack).
And players who threaten not to hold out under the tag - pretty much every player who's ever been tagged and not named Kirk Cousins - rarely follow through on that threat. Good organizations use the tag as leverage for a long-term deal.
The fact the Bears felt compelled to make this trade is an organizational failure.
Eh you are being hyperbolic here. The new regime may not have been sold on Roquan as the guys who drafted him.
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Eh you are being hyperbolic here. The new regime may not have been sold on Roquan as the guys who drafted him.
Agree with this. I understand the urge to criticize everything the Bears do because a lot of what they have done the past 20 years has been dumb and shortsighted. This isn’t the case. Smith is fine as a player but he’s not a guy you build a defense around. Let’s revisit his career in 2-3 years.
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Agree with this. I understand the urge to criticize everything the Bears do because a lot of what they have done the past 20 years has been dumb and shortsighted. This isn’t the case. Smith is fine as a player but he’s not a guy you build a defense around. Let’s revisit his career in 2-3 years.
For the record, I'm not a Bears fan and have no skin in the game whether they're great or terrible.
I'm just a firm believer that you don't win in the NFL by trading away (or letting walk) young, quality players because you don't want to pay them or are afraid of a contract dispute.
That's what Jacksonville did after a team full of young players nearly led them to the Super Bowl in the 2017 season. They're 17-56 since the 2018 AFC Championship game, despite accumulating a ton of draft capital for guys like Ramsey, Ngakoue, Fowler, Bouye, etc., and having a boatload of high picks of their own.
Just for fun, here are the teams with the most draft capital from 2017-21:
2017: Browns, 49ers, Bears
2018: Browns, Broncos, Giants
2019: Giants, Raiders, Cardinals
2020: Dolphins, Bengals, Jaguars
2021:Jaguars, Jets, Dolphins
The 49ers are legit, the Bengals had a great run last year and will be good as long as Burrow is healthy, and the Dolphins seemed to have turned a comer. But most of these franchises remain mediocre and worse, despite all the picks.
I don't really care if the Bears suck or not. I just think this is a bad move and it's egregiously dumb to think lots of picks = winning.
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Agree with this. I understand the urge to criticize everything the Bears do because a lot of what they have done the past 20 years has been dumb and shortsighted. This isn’t the case. Smith is fine as a player but he’s not a guy you build a defense around. Let’s revisit his career in 2-3 years.
He's very good against running teams or teams that mostly feature a short passing game. Roquan is a downhill player. See his play from the Patriots game. However, he's pretty meh against the league's better offenses (better QBs) because he is not a good coverage backer.
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For the record, I'm not a Bears fan and have no skin in the game whether they're great or terrible.
I'm just a firm believer that you don't win in the NFL by trading away (or letting walk) young, quality players because you don't want to pay them or are afraid of a contract dispute.
That's what Jacksonville did after a team full of young players nearly led them to the Super Bowl in the 2017 season. They're 17-56 since the 2018 AFC Championship game, despite accumulating a ton of draft capital for guys like Ramsey, Ngakoue, Fowler, Bouye, etc., and having a boatload of high picks of their own.
I agree that teams on the verge of a Super Bowl shouldn’t be trading talent for future assets.
But I don’t think the Bears are on the verge of a Super Bowl.
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None of those rules apply to Detroit
It would probably take too long to respond - but Matt Millen would be prominent in my answer.
He was so bad that you have to take 20 years before and 20 years after his regime to restore Detroit-world order.
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Agree with this. I understand the urge to criticize everything the Bears do because a lot of what they have done the past 20 years has been dumb and shortsighted. This isn’t the case. Smith is fine as a player but he’s not a guy you build a defense around. Let’s revisit his career in 2-3 years.
I think the answer is somewhere between you and Pakuni. Yeah, Roquan was overrated a bit and the Bears' brass may not have been enthralled with him. But on the other hand, no team is gonna win by just relying on young players (as Pakuni deftly pointed out).
With all the cap money, they can get some vets, but teams almost always overpay in the FA market.
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It would probably take too long to respond - but Matt Millen would be prominent in my answer.
He was so bad that you have to take 20 years before and 20 years after his regime to restore Detroit-world order.
Quinn-tricia extended the stench.
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Trading away building-block type players in their prime because you think it's going to be difficult to sign them rarely works out in the NFL. (see: Raiders and Khalil Mack).
And players who threaten not to hold out under the tag - pretty much every player who's ever been tagged and not named Kirk Cousins - rarely follow through on that threat. Good organizations use the tag as leverage for a long-term deal.
The fact the Bears felt compelled to make this trade is an organizational failure.
In this case, it’s not an organizational failure. How closely did you follow the contract negotiations this summer?
Not wanting to pay $20 million+ per year to fill a non-premium position isn’t unreasonable. Especially after the crapshow from this summer, mostly due to Smith representing himself.
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Trading away building-block type players in their prime because you think it's going to be difficult to sign them rarely works out in the NFL. (see: Raiders and Khalil Mack).
And players who threaten not to hold out under the tag - pretty much every player who's ever been tagged and not named Kirk Cousins - rarely follow through on that threat. Good organizations use the tag as leverage for a long-term deal.
The fact the Bears felt compelled to make this trade is an organizational failure.
I mean, the new regime was never ever giving him a long term deal at $20 M per year, let alone franchise him at $18 M. It’s not a position that they feel compelled to pay a premium for, right or wrong.
Their defense is clearly being built in the secondary and at the line. There was no way in hell philosophically they were committing resources at the LB spot.
The failure would have been letting him walk for nothing, knowing they wouldn’t qualify for a comp pick.
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What happened to the bengals this season?
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What happened to the bengals this season?
Garbage offensive line and had a bit of luck running through the playoffs last year
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Ex-NFL ref and NBC rules analyst Terry McAulay said there should’ve been no penalty on Panthers WR D.J. Moore for removing his helmet to celebrate his last-minute TD because Moore wasn't actually on the field when he took off his helmet.
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Ex-NFL ref and NBC rules analyst Terry McAulay said there should’ve been no penalty on Panthers WR D.J. Moore for removing his helmet to celebrate his last-minute TD because Moore wasn't actually on the field when he took off his helmet.
Oh
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Garbage offensive line and had a bit of luck running through the playoffs last year
Yeah they got hot last year in the playoffs, but were a 10-7 team during the season.
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Ex-NFL ref and NBC rules analyst Terry McAulay said there should’ve been no penalty on Panthers WR D.J. Moore for removing his helmet to celebrate his last-minute TD because Moore wasn't actually on the field when he took off his helmet.
Stupid, over-legislated rule. A turnover is celebrated with 60 yard team sprints and posing, but players cannot get too excited on a touchdown for fear of a taunting penalty.
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Stupid, over-legislated rule. A turnover is celebrated with 60 yard team sprints and posing, but players cannot get too excited on a touchdown for fear of a taunting penalty.
Definitely a stupid rule. And it's made all the stupider when it's not enforced properly, as apparently was the case.
That being said, there is a rule, and even if Moore was off the field of play it was just barely. It was an incredible play -- Mahomes called it the pass of the year -- and it looked like it was gonna win the game, so I can't blame Moore for celebrating. Just keep the helmet on because the rule does exist.
And, of course, it's not illegal for the PK to actually make the longer PAT -- or the 32-yarder in overtime. Pineiro actually got a vote of confidence from the coach yesterday. If the Panthers were contenders he'd have gotten the ax IMHO, but at 2-6 they don't want to spend any $$ on another kick. Maybe their thinking is if Pineiro rebounds to have a good rest of the season, fine; if he doesn't, his incompetence could help them get a top-3 draft pick.
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Stupid, over-legislated rule. A turnover is celebrated with 60 yard team sprints and posing, but players cannot get too excited on a touchdown for fear of a taunting penalty.
I think they consider it more of a safety thing than a taunting thing.
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Lions trading Hockenson to the Vikings.
Inexecusable!
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Claypool to Bears for a 2nd.
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Lions trading Hockenson to the Vikings.
Inexecusable!
Not a fan with it being to a division rival but A) 2022 is already another lost season, B) his rookie deal is up. He wanted to 5 TE money and he’s not top 5, C) got an extra 2nd and 3rd round pick for the 2023 draft. A better haul than the Bears got for Smith.
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Claypool to Bears for a 2nd.
Gutey is waiting for Amari Rodgers to break out.
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Gotta say, I don't love the Claypool trade from a Bears perspective.
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Gutey is waiting for Amari Rodgers to break out.
https://twitter.com/JosinaAnderson/status/1587502660172894209?s=20&t=Ivi-jdHd8LlgEq67Ipw7jQ
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Gotta say, I don't love the Claypool trade from a Bears perspective.
Yeah I don't get it. Next year is the last year on his deal, so even if this goes fairly well, they're trading a 2nd rounder for the opportunity to pay Claypool market value in 2024. Wouldn't you rather just take a WR you like in the 2nd round?
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Gotta say, I don't love the Claypool trade from a Bears perspective.
He's an elite athlete, but has run very hot and cold in Pittsburgh and pretty much wore out his welcome there. The ascendance George Pickens made him expendable, and a likely early second seems to be a great return.
The Steelers don't often make bad decisions on receivers.
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If the 2nd rounder was the Ravens pick, I'd be kinda ok with it. But trading their own 2nd for Claypool, and having to pay him...ehh, not feeling it. Their second round pick will be around #40, and that's just way too much value to give up.
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He's an elite athlete, but has run very hot and cold in Pittsburgh and pretty much wore out his welcome there. The ascendance George Pickens made him expendable, and a likely early second seems to be a great return.
The Steelers don't often make bad decisions on receivers.
Yeah, that’s a great point on the Steelers, if they’re trading you a wideout, something isn’t working out with that guy.
I would much rather have Calvin Ridley and the package Jax gave up for him than Claypool.
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Calvin Ridley traded to the Jags.
What are the odds of that? Bet he never saw it coming. Though I'd wager to guess Trevor Lawrence is happy about this.
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FWIW, here's what CBS Sports said about the Lions trading Hockenson to the Vikings:
With Irv Smith Jr. banged up, Minnesota needed some help at tight end. Instead, they got a massive upgrade. Hockenson has battled his own injuries, but when healthy, he's easily a top-10 pass catcher at his position, rounding out an already-impressive Vikings group that includes Dalvin Cook, Justin Jefferson and Adam Thielen. All the Vikings are surrendering, to secure Hockenson through at least 2023 on a reasonable deal, is essentially the equivalent of a second-rounder. Detroit has reason to sell, to be sure, but why did their trade chip have to be one of their few proven building blocks, who will now play them twice a year and be difficult to replace even with the improved draft capital?
Vikings grade: A
Lions grade: D+
Before the Panthers lost Sunday, they had been mentioned as a possible pursuer of Hockenson, and I wouldn't have minded that at all.
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Bradley Chubb to Miami for a 1st (49ers), 4th and Chase Edmonds.
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When the Packers decided to pay Rodgers $50M rather than move on to the guy they moved up to take in the first round to replace him, they should've been going all in for Rodgers's remaining time with the Packers. That's your Super Bowl window. They absolutely should've tagged Davante (they could tag him for 2 years. There's 0 chance Davante sits out for 2 years hoping the Packers trade him. He has no leverage) and then, if still needed, made one more "all in" move to get another wideout at the deadline. Instead Gutey trades Davante for Christian Watson and Devonte Wyatt and sits on his hands at the deadline.
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When the Packers decided to pay Rodgers $50M rather than move on to the guy they moved up to take in the first round to replace him, they should've been going all in for Rodgers's remaining time with the Packers. That's your Super Bowl window. They absolutely should've tagged Davante (they could tag him for 2 years. There's 0 chance Davante sits out for 2 years hoping the Packers trade him. He has no leverage) and then, if still needed, made one more "all in" move to get another wideout at the deadline. Instead Gutey trades Davante for Christian Watson and Devonte Wyatt and sits on his hands at the deadline.
What an idiot. He condemned the Packers to mediocrity for this year and maybe longer.
Goodbye Aaron. No way Rodgers plays for this mess next year.
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Goodbye Aaron. No way Rodgers plays for this mess next year.
That would have to be a retirement wouldn't it? Cap nerds, correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought he's basically unmoveable.
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Yeah, that’s a great point on the Steelers, if they’re trading you a wideout, something isn’t working out with that guy.
I would much rather have Calvin Ridley and the package Jax gave up for him than Claypool.
You'd rather have a guy that will be 28 and will have not played competitively in nearly 2 years by the time the 2023 season starts? Ok....I know 28 isn't old for a WR and they didn't give up a lot but plenty of risk here.
And part of the reason for the Claypool deal is to get Fields more help this season to see if he can continue to play well. Not to mention, the WR crop in free agency is garbage since Metcalf, Samuel, Brown, and McLaurin all signed extensions. Unless you're excited about adding a Lazard, JuJu, or Jakobi Meyers.
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You'd rather have a guy that will be 28 and will have not played competitively in nearly 2 years by the time the 2023 season starts? Ok....I know 28 isn't old for a WR and they didn't give up a lot but plenty of risk here.
And part of the reason for the Claypool deal is to get Fields more help this season to see if he can continue to play well. Not to mention, the WR crop in free agency is garbage since Metcalf, Samuel, Brown, and McLaurin all signed extensions. Unless you're excited about adding a Lazard, JuJu, or Jakobi Meyers.
I get what you’re saying, but yes, I’d take the upside of Ridley at the possibility of a lower asset cost. Both Ridley & Claypool will be playing for contracts next season.
I’m just not a huge Claypool fan though either.
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I get what you’re saying, but yes, I’d take the upside of Ridley at the possibility of a lower asset cost. Both Ridley & Claypool will be playing for contracts next season.
I’m just not a huge Claypool fan though either.
Cause he went to ND, obviously. The idea of 2 Notre Dame alums being Fields prominent targets really upsets me.
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When the Packers decided to pay Rodgers $50M rather than move on to the guy they moved up to take in the first round to replace him, they should've been going all in for Rodgers's remaining time with the Packers. That's your Super Bowl window. They absolutely should've tagged Davante (they could tag him for 2 years. There's 0 chance Davante sits out for 2 years hoping the Packers trade him. He has no leverage) and then, if still needed, made one more "all in" move to get another wideout at the deadline. Instead Gutey trades Davante for Christian Watson and Devonte Wyatt and sits on his hands at the deadline.
That's because Gutey doesn't actually have a strategy.
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That would have to be a retirement wouldn't it? Cap nerds, correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought he's basically unmoveable.
I'm not convinced the salary cap is real. There's enough weird cap wizardry and shell game antics with every contract as to make every report of "Team X is over the cap" functionally meaningless. I'll believe there are cap consequences to a personnel decision the moment teams aren't talking about their cap problems while simultaneously resigning dudes to long term deals. We're gonna find out that they're paying dudes against the 2046 cap number like everyone's Bobby Bonilla and Dan Orlovsky is gonna put on horn rimmed glasses and nod at what savvy cap management that is and we'll all just keep on going about our business.
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That's because Gutey doesn't actually have a strategy.
I think he has a strategy, but it is a dated one of over-valuing draft picks. As wades points out above, the Packers post-Rodgers are going to be bad. And if they are going to be bad, they may as well be REALLY bad with a cap situation that will take a couple years to fix. But during that time you are drafting high and hopefully building back your talent base.
In the meantime, go all in.
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I'm not convinced the salary cap is real. There's enough weird cap wizardry and shell game antics with every contract as to make every report of "Team X is over the cap" functionally meaningless. I'll believe there are cap consequences to a personnel decision the moment teams aren't talking about their cap problems while simultaneously resigning dudes to long term deals. We're gonna find out that they're paying dudes against the 2046 cap number like everyone's Bobby Bonilla and Dan Orlovsky is gonna put on horn rimmed glasses and nod at what savvy cap management that is and we'll all just keep on going about our business.
My understanding is that Rodgers contract was essentially for two years - this year and next. After that, it becomes a lot easier to manage if he retires.
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I think he has a strategy, but it is a dated one of over-valuing draft picks. As wades points out above, the Packers post-Rodgers are going to be bad. And if they are going to be bad, they may as well be REALLY bad with a cap situation that will take a couple years to fix. But during that time you are drafting high and hopefully building back your talent base.
In the meantime, go all in.
Yeah, but you can only over-value draft picks if you're good at drafting.
He's not.
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Yeah, but you can only over-value draft picks if you're good at drafting.
He's not.
Well yeah. As I said elsewhere, Mark Murphy has to fix this but I doubt he does so after this season.
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Commanders for sale. Probably will be for $5B.
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RIP to the OG Punt Gawd, Ray Guy.
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Commanders for sale. Probably will be for $5B.
One of the early rumors is that Bezos, perhaps with Jay-Z as partner, is gonna bid big.
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Although there has been an ongoing social media debate over whether Panthers WR D.J. Moore was in the field of play when he was penalized for taking off his helmet to celebrate his amazing 62-yard catch that seemingly won last week's game (but actually only tied it), photos from the game also revealed that Panthers TE Stephen Sullivan sprinted down the field and took his helmet off as well. Sullivan, not Moore, was fined almost $5K by the NFL during the week.
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Pack whiffed on claypool and waller
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Pack whiffed on claypool
Primus didn't
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Pack whiffed on claypool and waller
Claypool perhaps, but as much as I like making fun of the Packers, I don’t see it as a whiff when a team doesn’t want to move a player or deems him too valuable. It’s not like Waller moved elsewhere
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Pack whiffed on claypool and waller
Not sure what they were supposed to do, they made the better offer. It appears that Pittsburgh did not want to trade him to the Packers period.
Maybe they were a bit sore, as they wanted to trade for Rodgers and it all appeared to be gamesmanship by Rodgers?
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Fields is turning into a dude before our eyes.
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Vikings doing their best to upstage the Packers fail
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the colts patriots game looks like 2 high school quarterbacks playing
Update: 4th quarter, NE finally broke 100 yds passing. Indy sitting at 81 passing yards
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the colts patriots game looks like 2 high school quarterbacks playing
Update: 4th quarter, NE finally broke 100 yds passing. Indy sitting at 81 passing yards
Kinda like Detroit - GB.
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Bears got jobbed big time on the no call on interference on Claypool.
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Fields is turning into a dude before our eyes.
17/28 for 123YDS. Getting better but not a 'dude'. Top 18-23 QB maybe.
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17/28 for 123YDS. Getter better but not a 'dude'. Top 18-23 QB maybe.
Did you watch the game?
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I watched during commercials. Fields looked under control and made a bunch of plays with his feet.
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Did you watch the game?
I did not.
I do think he is making great strides. He was a bottom 5 QB at the beginning of the season but I concede he might be as good at 18th now. I just don't think overall he's a 'dude' yet.
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17/28 for 123YDS. Getter better but not a 'dude'. Top 18-23 QB maybe.
Lol.
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I remember when Mitchell was becoming a dude before our eyes weeks 4-6 in 2018.
If the best thing your QB can do is limit passing attempts, he’s not a dude.
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Did you watch the game?
Just to clarify, If you could draft current QBs for the future, Fields could be top 10.
If you had to pick a QB for next week, I'd take the following before Fields:
Allen, Burrow, Brady, Mahomes, Huts, Herbert, Murry, Smith, Rodgers, Stafford, Cousins, Wilson, Garappolo, Tua, Jackson & Prescott.
Then 17 - 21 in no particular order: Fields, Rush, D. Jones, Wentz & Carr.
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I did not.
I do think he is making great strides. He was a bottom 5 QB at the beginning of the season but I concede he might be as good at 18th now. I just don't think overall he's a 'dude' yet.
Yup, if you didn’t watch the game, you have no idea what you’re talking about. He was awesome today.
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Yup, if you didn’t watch the game, you have no idea what you’re talking about. He was awesome today.
As a life long Bears fan I hope you are right (about being a dude). I believe you that he was awesome today. Maybe I'm letting a life time of poor QB play in Chicago prejudice my outlook.
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So are the Packers trying to beat the Bears again this year by getting a higher draft choice. :o
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As a life long Bears fan I hope you are right (about being a dude). I believe you that he was awesome today. Maybe I'm letting a life time of poor QB play in Chicago prejudice my outlook.
He’s not there yet, but the last three weeks especially, one can see it happening. He’s arguably the main reason the Bears were in that game today.
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He’s not there yet, but the last three weeks especially, one can see it happening. He’s arguably the main reason the Bears were in that game today.
I watched every snap and the most impressive part was that he looked in control. Made all the right calls on his designed runs and his ball placement was pretty good. The TD to Mooney was perfect and the last pass of the game was dropped but was probably one of his 10 best plays of the day.
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This Bucs / Rams game is AWFUL. Jeez neither of these teams even looks remotely close.
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The best thing to happen to the Bears was to lose that game today while Fields looked great. I’d be fine with that recipe the rest of the season. Stay in the top ten of the draft, hope to find a way to finish last in the North somehow to get a 4th place schedule for 2023.
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The best thing to happen to the Bears was to lose that game today while Fields looked great. I’d be fine with that recipe the rest of the season. Stay in the top ten of the draft, hope to find a way to finish last in the North somehow to get a 4th place schedule for 2023.
3 team race to the bottom in the north.
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McCarthy bring his 'boys inta Lambeau next week. Oughta be major payback time, aina?
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3 team race to the bottom in the north.
Right?!?
I guess Bears fans can at least take comfort in the fact that they managed the roster and salary cap to be there.
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What are the Rams doing, lol
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WTF were the Rams doing on defense there?
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Seattle is 6-3 and up 1.5 games in the NFC West after losing their starting RB and trotting out Geno Smith at QB. O/U on wins coming into the season was 5.5. Give Pete Carroll COY already.
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17/28 for 123YDS. Getting better but not a 'dude'. Top 18-23 QB maybe.
Why comment if you didn’t actually watch the game? He’s looked like a completely different player the last 4 games and Getsy has done an outstanding job since the mini-bye.
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Seattle is 6-3 and up 1.5 games in the NFC West after losing their starting RB and trotting out Geno Smith at QB. O/U on wins coming into the season was 5.5. Give Pete Carroll COY already.
My vote is for Robert Saleh. All around good dude as well.
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The best thing to happen to the Bears was to lose that game today while Fields looked great. I’d be fine with that recipe the rest of the season. Stay in the top ten of the draft, hope to find a way to finish last in the North somehow to get a 4th place schedule for 2023.
That's funny. My son, a big Bears fan, said almost the exact same to me in a text message about a half-hour after the game.
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At least Davante is having success.
2-6
Any team that hired Josh McDaniels deserves this.
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COY is going to be a really interesting award this year. I have a lot of preseason Sirianni futures at 18-1, so outside of my financial bias, there’s strong cases for Carroll, Vrabel, Saleh and Dabol.
I really thought the Seahawks were going to be total garbage, what they’re doing is remarkable (I would vote for Carroll).
Unrelated, unless he gets hurt, Tyreek is going to obliterate 2,000 receiving yards in 16 games. He’s still plus money to win OPY (+250).
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Buy Josh Allen MVP odds on the dip.
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Right?!?
I guess Bears fans can at least take comfort in the fact that they managed the roster and salary cap to be there.
Still think they won’t win another game?
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He’s not there yet, but the last three weeks especially, one can see it happening. He’s arguably the main reason the Bears were in that game today.
Dish
I wasn’t a Fields fan, thought he wasn’t an accurate enough passer and was too slow with his decision making. But he has size, strength and athletic ability that’s off the charts. And he’s making strides on his weaknesses. Hope to eat major crow for the next several years.
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Still think they won’t win another game?
While possible, I think you are right. Looking at the schedule I think 4-13 is most likely. My crystal ball was not so good.
Nobody saw the 49ers & Pats wins.
The Bears coaches deserve a lot of credit if they get this team to 4 wins.
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Pasqualoni fired as the Carolina defensive coordinator. Not actually interesting in and of itself, except for the question it creates. Why, in the name of all that is good and holy, would any team ever hire a Quinn/Patricia assistant?
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Frank Reich was just fired.
I mentioned this a few weeks ago, I don't believe the league turning over 25-30% of it's coaches every offseason is good for the sport. There are some coaches who are clearly out of their depth (see Matt Rhule) that need to go. However, this is the type of firing I'm talking about.
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Frank Reich was just fired.
I mentioned this a few weeks ago, I don't believe the league turning over 25-30% of it's coaches every offseason is good for the sport. There are some coaches who are clearly out of their depth (see Matt Rhule) that need to go. However, this is the type of firing I'm talking about.
Reich is going to make an awesome O-Coordinator/QB specialist for some team next year. I'm thinking someone like the Steelers or Jets bring him in.
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Reich is going to make an awesome O-Coordinator/QB specialist for some team next year. I'm thinking someone like the Steelers or Jets bring him in.
I think it is very possible he gets another HC job in 2023. Especially, if you have 8 or more openings again this year.
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Pasqualoni fired as the Carolina defensive coordinator. Not actually interesting in and of itself, except for the question it creates. Why, in the name of all that is good and holy, would any team ever hire a Quinn/Patricia assistant?
He was the DL coach. But, outside of a good run as Syracuse head coach in the Donovan McNabb era, he has had a series of jobs where he lasts one or two years and I can't think of any instance where any of the teams he worked for were actually any good! Seriously, look at this! Do coaches hire him hoping that they get fired or something?
Syracuse (1991–2004)
Head coach
Dallas Cowboys (2005)
Tight ends coach
Dallas Cowboys (2006–2007)
Linebackers coach
Miami Dolphins (2008–2009)
Defensive coordinator
Dallas Cowboys (2010)
Defensive line coach
Connecticut (2011–2013)
Head coach
Chicago Bears (2014)
Defensive line coach
Houston Texans (2015)
Defensive line coach
Boston College (–2016––2017)
Defensive line coach
Detroit Lions (2018–2019)
Defensive coordinator
Florida (–2020––2021)
Special assistant to the head coach
Carolina Panthers (2022)
Defensive line coach
The other thing is, you are 73 years old! Just go home!
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Jeff Saturday (!!!!!!) your interim Colts HC.
W.T.F.
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He was the DL coach. But, outside of a good run as Syracuse head coach in the Donovan McNabb era, he has had a series of jobs where he lasts one or two years and I can't think of any instance where any of the teams he worked for were actually any good! Seriously, look at this! Do coaches hire him hoping that they get fired or something?
Syracuse (1991–2004)
Head coach
Dallas Cowboys (2005)
Tight ends coach
Dallas Cowboys (2006–2007)
Linebackers coach
Miami Dolphins (2008–2009)
Defensive coordinator
Dallas Cowboys (2010)
Defensive line coach
Connecticut (2011–2013)
Head coach
Chicago Bears (2014)
Defensive line coach
Houston Texans (2015)
Defensive line coach
Boston College (–2016––2017)
Defensive line coach
Detroit Lions (2018–2019)
Defensive coordinator
Florida (–2020––2021)
Special assistant to the head coach
Carolina Panthers (2022)
Defensive line coach
The other thing is, you are 73 years old! Just go home!
Just in time to run for the US Senate.
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Jeff Saturday (!!!!!!) your interim Colts HC.
W.T.F.
This is literally lol stuff. But fwiw, all of the NFL owners cosplaying supervillains should take note - THIS is how you are supposed to do rich, insane pro sports franchise owner.
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Jeff Saturday (!!!!!!) your interim Colts HC.
W.T.F.
They've fired everyone else so it was either him or Stan from Terre Haute.
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My vote is for Robert Saleh. All around good dude as well.
I like Saleh, that’s who i wanted the Lions to hire but in classic Lions fashion they took too long. With Carroll, the impression was this was a tanking year to get Bryce Young or CJ Stroud. Until his injury Drew Lock was going to start at QB.
The Jets are building, they need Wilson to be more consistent. Losing Hall at RB hurt, he was going to be the OROY. But that was a hell of a coahing jib yesterday
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Jeff Saturday (!!!!!!) your interim Colts HC.
W.T.F.
The obvious answer to a GM who can't find a QB, but invests about $44 million in cap space on a center, guard and right tackle.
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He was the DL coach. But, outside of a good run as Syracuse head coach in the Donovan McNabb era, he has had a series of jobs where he lasts one or two years and I can't think of any instance where any of the teams he worked for were actually any good! Seriously, look at this! Do coaches hire him hoping that they get fired or something?
Syracuse (1991–2004)
Head coach
Dallas Cowboys (2005)
Tight ends coach
Dallas Cowboys (2006–2007)
Linebackers coach
Miami Dolphins (2008–2009)
Defensive coordinator
Dallas Cowboys (2010)
Defensive line coach
Connecticut (2011–2013)
Head coach
Chicago Bears (2014)
Defensive line coach
Houston Texans (2015)
Defensive line coach
Boston College (–2016––2017)
Defensive line coach
Detroit Lions (2018–2019)
Defensive coordinator
Florida (–2020––2021)
Special assistant to the head coach
Carolina Panthers (2022)
Defensive line coach
The other thing is, you are 73 years old! Just go home!
I think it says a lot that he was a successful D3 coach, then had a pretty nice tenure at Cuse that didn't end all that poorly...yet he still couldn't get another HC job until that terrible UCONN gig 8 years later.
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I didn’t realize both John Fox & Gus Bradley are on the Colts staff.
Say what you will about Twitter (I know there’s a thread on it), I honestly thought it was a Schefter parody account when I saw the tweet half an hour ago.
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Jeff Saturday (!!!!!!) your interim Colts HC.
W.T.F.
this is how you tank for a top 5 pick as they’re only one game out of fifth right now.
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this is how you tank for a top 5 pick as they’re only one game out of fifth right now.
Yep. Jonathon Taylor will nurse that ankle injury the rest of the year.
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Jeff Saturday (!!!!!!) your interim Colts HC.
W.T.F.
Taking a revolutionary approach and building the team from the center out.
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The new Colts coach filled out the rest of his staff:
OC - Billy Sunday
DC - Rick Monday
ST - Tuesday Weld
DL - Wednesday Addams
OL - Thursday October Christian XI
Enforcement Officer - Joe Friday
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The new Colts coach filled out the rest of his staff:
OC - Billy Sunday
DC - Rick Monday
ST - Tuesday Weld
DL - Wednesday Addams
OL - Thursday October Christian XI
Enforcement Officer - Joe Friday
I hope you didn’t work on this all day.
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I hope you didn’t work on this all day.
Now this was way funnier than the 82 post.
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While possible, I think you are right. Looking at the schedule I think 4-13 is most likely. My crystal ball was not so good.
Nobody saw the 49ers & Pats wins.
The Bears coaches deserve a lot of credit if they get this team to 4 wins.
I’m thinking more like 6.
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I hope you didn’t work on this all day.
Took me 3 minutes. But thanks for your concern. I'll admit that I did have to google "famous people named Thursday." There ain't many!!!!
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Just in time to run for the US Senate.
Too young for the office of President, hey?
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I hope you didn’t work on this all day.
What else is he going to do? Dusting and vacuuming is Tuesday.
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We know Irsay is a huge rock music fan. I guess he’s been listen to a lot of 70s Elton John lately.
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Stafford in concussion protocols. Apparently occurred Sunday. Another gaffe by NFL.
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https://titanswire.usatoday.com/2022/11/04/tennessee-titans-mike-vrabel-impersonation-will-compton/
Good, good stuff here.
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Am I happy the Panthers won? Honestly, I don’t know.
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Am I happy the Panthers won? Honestly, I don’t know.
Asked nobody.
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Justin fields is good
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Fields was 500:1 for Offensive Player of the Year on Tuesday.
Last 4 weeks, if you parlayed his rushing over with him to score a TD, you’d be in Scrooge McDuck’s pool of gold.
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Weird seeing the Vikings play an actual decent team.
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Vikings coach outsmarted himself, and it’s a 14-point swing.
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Justin Fields is a very good NFL running back. Bears are doing a good job of not having him throw the football.
And Kirk Cousins is still Kirk Cousins.
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Justin Fields is a very good NFL running back. Bears are doing a good job of not having him throw the football.
And Kirk Cousins is still Kirk Cousins.
His QBR today is 147.0.
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His QBR today is 147.0.
Congratulations to him. That certainly is a vast improvement from his QBR of 55.1 on the season going into today. Averaging passing 147 yards/game. Again, Bears doing a great job of making sure he doesn’t have to make throws that any high school QB could make (see: Kmet TD).
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Congratulations to him. That certainly is a vast improvement from his QBR of 55.1 on the season going into today. Averaging passing 147 yards/game. Again, Bears doing a great job of making sure he doesn’t have to make throws that any high school QB could make (see: Kmet TD).
Lol, he entered today 14th in QBR. He has the HIGHEST QBR of any QB in the NFL over the last 5 weeks.
Too funny.
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Lol, he entered today 14th in QBR. He has the HIGHEST QBR of any QB in the NFL over the last 5 weeks.
Too funny.
And the most yards he has thrown for in those 5 games is 208. Agreed, too funny. Training wheels fully in tact. As they should be.
That’s not an ideal pick 6 there. Then again, Bears fans want the Bears to lose. So he’s performing perfectly.
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And the most yards he has thrown for in those 5 games is 208. Agreed, too funny. Training wheels fully in tact. As they should be.
That’s not an ideal pick 6 there. Then again, Bears fans want the Bears to lose. So he’s performing perfectly.
Yup, it’s definitely weird for a Packers fan to know the Bears have the best QB in the division finally, I feel for ya.
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Just looking at passing yards seems to be a narrow view of the modern quarterback.
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You have 3 timeouts. You get sacked on second down with under 2 to play. Take the time out!
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Absolutely beautiful loss, exactly what any Bears fan should want. That was awesome.
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Justin Jefferson is a heck of a WR.
One of the best catches I've seen.
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One of the best catches I have ever seen.
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Justin Jefferson is a heck of a WR.
One of the best catches I've seen.
I don’t ever remember a better one.
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I don’t ever remember a better one.
Better that the OBJ catch. Unbelievable. What do they teach LSU receivers?
Vikings are living a charmed life right now.
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That catch was unbelievable, maybe the best ever.
-
Vikings channeling the Lions with that finish.
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I think Cousins scored but you can’t overturn the call on the field.
-
If the running back holds onto the ball in the previous play, it doesn't matter.
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If the running back holds onto the ball in the previous play, it doesn't matter.
This.
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I think Cousins scored but you can’t overturn the call on the field.
Shoulder down before the ball broke the plane.
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O.M. G!!!!
-
Dear Lord
-
Buffalo out-Lioned the Vikings.
-
Incredibly still time left for Buffalo.
-
My goodness
-
My goodness
I have no stake in this game, but how was that Bills catch not reviewed?
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Yup, it’s definitely weird for a Packers fan to know the Bears have the best QB in the division finally, I feel for ya.
LOL! If it helps you sleep at night feel free to tell yourself that but boy. That is a take.
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I have no stake in this game, but how was that Bills catch not reviewed?
That was a brutal no review. Pretty inexcusable.
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Buffalo had this game won about 10x.
On the Jefferson catch, one of the best I’ve ever seen, the defender needed to slap the ball down and not go for the pick. But I get it - instincts come in.
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You can say that someone other than Jefferson is the best receiver in football.
But you would be wrong.
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LOL! If it helps you sleep at night feel free to tell yourself that but boy. That is a take.
I don't think Mrs. Fields would select Justin over Aaron if she was a GM.
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I don't think Mrs. Fields would select Justin over Aaron if she was a GM.
Fields is the best running QB, but that’s it.
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That game was exhausting … and I had no horse in the race.
Enjoyable, but exhausting.
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Looks like the Josh Allen MVP take will be ending. Did so much but tried to do too much on that last pass. What a game though.
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LOL! If it helps you sleep at night feel free to tell yourself that but boy. That is a take.
If the Packers called the Bears and salary cap doesn’t matter, and said “we’ll trade Rodgers for Fields”, the Bears would hang up on them.
This is great by the way, thank you for the laughs here!
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If the Packers called the Bears and salary cap doesn’t matter, and said “we’ll trade Rodgers for Fields”, the Bears would hang up on them.
This is great by the way, thank you for the laughs here!
Well no sh!t. If I had a terrible team and had an elite running back playing quarterback I wouldn’t trade him for Rodgers either. Rodgers is like 20 years older. That’s not what your claim was. But yeah you definitely needed to shift the goal posts because people were already laughing at you.
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Well no sh!t. If I had a terrible team and had an elite running back playing quarterback I wouldn’t trade him for Rodgers either. Rodgers is like 20 years older. That’s not what your claim was. But yeah you definitely needed to shift the goal posts because people were already laughing at you.
What goalposts did I shift? He has had the highest QBR among ANY QB in the NFL the last 5 weeks. Fact.
Who laughed at me?
You got all bent out of shape because I said Fields is the best QB in the division (spoiler alert: he is).
You do you, pal. Again THANK YOU for the laughs. Enjoy your Sunday bro.
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What goalposts did I shift? He has had the highest QBR among ANY QB in the NFL the last 5 weeks. Fact.
Who laughed at me?
You got all bent out of shape because I said Fields is the best QB in the division (spoiler alert: he is).
You do you, pal. Again THANK YOU for the laughs. Enjoy your Sunday bro.
Fields has improved leaps and bounds since the beginning of the year. Credit to the staff and him. Packers fans know the end is near
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What goalposts did I shift? He has had the highest QBR among ANY QB in the NFL the last 5 weeks. Fact.
Who laughed at me?
You got all bent out of shape because I said Fields is the best QB in the division (spoiler alert: he is).
You do you, pal. Again THANK YOU for the laughs. Enjoy your Sunday bro.
Who the best QB in the division is has nothing to do with who you want for the entire rest of your franchise. Glad you shifted the goalposts.
But hey if you think Cooper Rush, Jicoby Brissett, Marcus Marriotta, and Geno Smith are four of the top 10 quarterbacks in the NFL I don’t know what to tell you. I’ll just say you’re right, I can’t argue with you. Lol
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Who the best QB in the division is has nothing to do with who you want for the entire rest of your franchise. Glad you shifted the goalposts.
But hey if you think Cooper Rush, Jicoby Brissett, Marcus Marriotta, and Geno Smith are four of the top 10 quarterbacks in the NFL I don’t know what to tell you. I’ll just say you’re right, I can’t argue with you. Lol
That’s it? That’s all you got? I’m offended, you’re better than that Wades.
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That’s it? That’s all you got? I’m offended, you’re better than that Wades.
Like I said. No arguments. Rush, Brissett, Marriotta, Smith too 10 QBs. I was wrong.
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Ford is obviously not as good as he looks today, but did we really have to put up with 9 games of Darnell Savage at safety?
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LOL! If it helps you sleep at night feel free to tell yourself that but boy. That is a take.
But boy? In 2022? For shame.
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If Watson can develop some ball skills, he could be a heck of a WR. Unfortunately, players don't often develop ball skills at this point of their career.
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Who is the worst Rodgers in GB?
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I’m not sure Josh McDaniels is employed tomorrow.
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Behind a paywall so I won't post it, but a Detroit Free Press columnist has an article today saying that the Lions won't succeed until they ditch Goff and find their Fields. I laughed for several reasons.
1. As if the Lions can find success. Please. Sanders, Megatron, Stafford ... another Fields can't fix the Lions.
2. The outsider, big picture perspective about Fields vs the scoop message board perspective. Give the kid time to learn and grow.
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This board has had quite a range of opinions on Fields.
Last season and even into the early part of this season, the general feeling, even from Bears fans, seemed to be that he couldn't be a QB for an NFL team that actually hoped to win. But in the space of a month or so, he's become the next great thing. All of those are generalizations; I know that some Scoopers had more nuanced views.
I'm not a Bears fan, but I've had opinions on Fields too. I was relieved when the Panthers didn't draft him because his work at Ohio State didn't lead me to believe he'd be a franchise QB, and nothing we saw through the early part of this season made me feel my team had missed out on anything. I don't see Bears games where I live, so all I see are the highlights, and he sure has had a lot of those the past many weeks. What I'll say now is, "We'll see." There have been a lot of Next Steve Youngs and Next Michael Vicks, and few actually become anything close. But maybe Fields will be that good, and if I were a Bears fan I'd finally have some hope.
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This board has had quite a range of opinions on Fields.
Last season and even into the early part of this season, the general feeling, even from Bears fans, seemed to be that he couldn't be a QB for an NFL team that actually hoped to win. But in the space of a month or so, he's become the next great thing. All of those are generalizations; I know that some Scoopers had more nuanced views.
I'm not a Bears fan, but I've had opinions on Fields too. I was relieved when the Panthers didn't draft him because his work at Ohio State didn't lead me to believe he'd be a franchise QB, and nothing we saw through the early part of this season made me feel my team had missed out on anything. I don't see Bears games where I live, so all I see are the highlights, and he sure has had a lot of those the past many weeks. What I'll say now is, "We'll see." There have been a lot of Next Steve Youngs and Next Michael Vicks, and few actually become anything close. But maybe Fields will be that good, and if I were a Bears fan I'd finally have some hope.
Yeah I most definitely get the excitement, but I just don't know if this was of playing QB is sustainable long-term. We will see.
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This board has had quite a range of opinions on Fields.
Last season and even into the early part of this season, the general feeling, even from Bears fans, seemed to be that he couldn't be a QB for an NFL team that actually hoped to win. But in the space of a month or so, he's become the next great thing. All of those are generalizations; I know that some Scoopers had more nuanced views.
I'm not a Bears fan, but I've had opinions on Fields too. I was relieved when the Panthers didn't draft him because his work at Ohio State didn't lead me to believe he'd be a franchise QB, and nothing we saw through the early part of this season made me feel my team had missed out on anything. I don't see Bears games where I live, so all I see are the highlights, and he sure has had a lot of those the past many weeks. What I'll say now is, "We'll see." There have been a lot of Next Steve Youngs and Next Michael Vicks, and few actually become anything close. But maybe Fields will be that good, and if I were a Bears fan I'd finally have some hope.
The excitement comes from the week-to-week improvement. Earlier in the year, it didn’t look like his decision making process was quick enough for the NFL. At the moment, it appears the game is slowing down for him.
He still has a lack of playmakers around him and bad o-line in front of him.
Is it sustainable? That’s a very fair question and at some point, he’ll have to learn throwing it away is ok versus forcing passes or taking a big hit.
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He's a great running back.
Obviously if you're building an NFC North franchise from the ground up he's the QB you'd want out of all the NFC North QBs. He's 23 and, again, an elite running back. You can build a competent offensive scheme around that skill.
But the idea that he's currently the best QB in the NFC North today is...well, laughable doesn't even describe it. If you got down to Championship weekend and stripped each team of their QB and said, "You need to select one NFC North QB to play this week and in the Super Bowl, and after that everything is back to how your roster is going forward" 32/32 GMs are taking Rodgers 1, Cousins 2, Fields 3, Goff 4.
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He's a great running back.
Obviously if you're building an NFC North franchise from the ground up he's the QB you'd want out of all the NFC North QBs. He's 23 and, again, an elite running back. You can build a competent offensive scheme around that skill.
But the idea that he's currently the best QB in the NFC North today is...well, laughable doesn't even describe it. If you got down to Championship weekend and stripped each team of their QB and said, "You need to select one NFC North QB to play this week and in the Super Bowl, and after that everything is back to how your roster is going forward" 32/32 GMs are taking Rodgers 1, Cousins 2, Fields 3, Goff 4.
Rodgers is a loser
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Fields has been a dude lately. I just have an issue trusting QBs that are better runners than passers. They are fun to watch (watching Manziel was some of my favorite college football memories) and can win you a good amount of games, but I don't think they can win you a super bowl. Russell Wilson is the only one I can think of to ever win the big one. Kaep, Newton, and McNabb are the only other ones I can think of who made it to the Super Bowl. I also think they have a much shorter shelf life than other QBs.
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What has me most excited about Fields is over the last month +, has been his development in the pocket. As he's gained confidence and continued to develop, his pocket presence, his throws, his accuracy have all dramatically improved. He is showing a lot of signs of becoming a dude, but he isn't there yet. The pick he threw was terrible, you can't do that. The problem had been those decisions in the past would manifest themselves and lead to another turnover, or poor decisions.
Talent around you matters as a QB. I know stats aren't everyone's favorite measurement, and you can have hot takes on Kmet and Mooney, but...
Fields targets Kmet/Mooney: 8.3 Yards per Attempt, 66% completion rate, 1st down rate 36%
Fields targets anyone else: 6.4 Yards per Attempt, 53% completion rate, 1st down rate 24%
Arguably the best throw Fields has made the last month was the 4th down pass to essentially end the game last week against Miami, which was a perfectly placed bullet that St. Brown dropped.
Great description of Fields in the pocket: https://twitter.com/danorlovsky7/status/1591934683016990720
I don't want anyone on here to have a heart attack, but if you want to listen to more Orlovsky on Fields: https://twitter.com/GetUpESPN/status/1592158462225436672?cxt=HHwWgMCi8fHrvZgsAAAA
To be clear, I don't think Fields is an MVP candidate (you can't be on a 3-7 team), but he can be in the conversation for OPOY (which I mentioned yesterday). If you don't watch much Bears football, or only watch when your team is in another tv window, or only look at a box score, cool, whatever. But if you're watching him closely week to week, you see it happening as a passer.
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What has me most excited about Fields is over the last month +, has been his development in the pocket. As he's gained confidence and continued to develop, his pocket presence, his throws, his accuracy have all dramatically improved. He is showing a lot of signs of becoming a dude, but he isn't there yet. The pick he threw was terrible, you can't do that. The problem had been those decisions in the past would manifest themselves and lead to another turnover, or poor decisions.
The amount of development in his pocket presence and throwing has been remarkable. He has been changing arm angles and throwing deliveries so intelligently on a consistent basis. The pick 6 was terrible but his immediate response on the next possession was remarkable. He's learning and growing SUPER fast in real time and its amazing to watch.
The "great running back" backhanded compliment BS is the same crap that people said about Lamar Jackson. Despite Lamar having a career 97.5 QB rating, 65% completion percentage, and a better than 2:1 TD to INT ratio in all but one season.
He's an elite runner but acting like he's fatally flawed as a passer in perpetuity is just willful ignorance. The other thing I love about him as a runner is his willingness to slide, which is so damn important for a mobile QB. Can't stand him, but thats another thing Russell Wilson has always done well and has helped keep him healthy.
The offensive coaching staff in Chicago deserves IMMENSE kudos. Its been truly special work
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When do Bears fans want to start seeing some wins from their dude? I find it hard to reconcile being both super excited about the great progress he's making, but also celebrating the fact that, in large part because of his momentum changing, awful pick 6, the Bears lost to the awful Lions, which helps them get an easier schedule (because teams stay the same year to year, so teams who finished low in the standings will do so next year as well so, easier schedule) and a higher draft pick.
So, is next year the year your dude needs to be better than, like, 5-12?
Also, for as good as Lamar has been, he's 1-3 in career playoff games and has 4 total touchdowns (3 throwing, 1 rushing) to 5 INTs and 5 lost fumbles over those 4 games.
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When do Bears fans want to start seeing some wins from their dude? I find it hard to reconcile being both super excited about the great progress he's making, but also celebrating the fact that, in large part because of his momentum changing, awful pick 6, the Bears lost to the awful Lions, which helps them get an easier schedule (because teams stay the same year to year, so teams who finished low in the standings will do so next year as well so, easier schedule) and a higher draft pick.
So, is next year the year your dude needs to be better than, like, 5-12?
Also, for as good as Lamar has been, he's 1-3 in career playoff games and has 4 total touchdowns (3 throwing, 1 rushing) to 5 INTs and 5 lost fumbles over those 4 games.
We want to see improvement from fields and losses to help in the draft. Rebuild through the draft and with a tonnof cap space. 70% of the guys on the current roster will be gone next year.
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When do Bears fans want to start seeing some wins from their dude? I find it hard to reconcile being both super excited about the great progress he's making, but also celebrating the fact that, in large part because of his momentum changing, awful pick 6, the Bears lost to the awful Lions, which helps them get an easier schedule (because teams stay the same year to year, so teams who finished low in the standings will do so next year as well so, easier schedule) and a higher draft pick.
So, is next year the year your dude needs to be better than, like, 5-12?
Also, for as good as Lamar has been, he's 1-3 in career playoff games and has 4 total touchdowns (3 throwing, 1 rushing) to 5 INTs and 5 lost fumbles over those 4 games.
(super pessimistic "Bears have a great chance of being 0-17" fan has entered the chat)
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This team was never going anywhere this year. Id like them to win games after they secure another top 10 pick.
And more revisionist history. Again, the pick 6 was terrible, but the Bears had already let Detroit go 65 yards on 6 plays for a TD the drive before. The pick 6 wasn't the jolt to jumpstart them. And, not only that, Fields immediately returned and lead them to a TD to go back up 6 after Santos shanked the XP. Then the Bears forced a 3 and out right after. There were 3 full possessions after the Pick 6 where Detroit had no momentum, maybe negative momentum. The Lions really only showed life after the Bears let them inexplicably complete a 44 yard pass to a nobody backup WR on 3rd and long with 3 min to play.
Since the Commanders game, Fields has been 59/92 for 620 yards with 8 TDs to 2 INTs and a 105 Passer Rating. Then add 467 yards rushing and another 5 TDs on the ground. The Bears have averaged 31 points a game. I'm not sure what else you want him to do or why Bears fans should expect to see "wins from their dude" when the defense has given up 38 points a game the last 3 weeks. He isn't playing Mike LB or FS. Besides the fact that the Bears losing for a better draft pick is the best thing for their long term future, I'm not sure why Bears should feel poorly in any way about his performance, given those stats, just cause a bad team isn't winning.
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Bears D is horrendous as a unit, talent-wise. Hard to win if you can't stop anyone.
Bears oline is serviceable for the run, super bad in pass pro. I'll judge Fields pure passer ability when he has time/space to throw. If throws are terrible then or making bad reads/decision, it'll be a more accurate assessment.
I don't think he'll ever be Rodgers/Manning/Brady with presnap diagnosis/decision making, and that's okay if he's successful with all the other stuff
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I acknowledge this is fluid, but yes, where you finish in the division matters with next years schedule, having 3 games determined on it.
Right now (again, this is fluid) the last place finisher in the North would get at Pittsburgh, at Washington, Rams (home)
3rd place: at Cleveland, at Dallas, Arizona (home)
2nd place: at Cincy, at NY Giants, San Francisco (home)
1st place: at Baltimore, at Philly, Seattle (home)
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(super pessimistic "Bears have a great chance of being 0-17" fan has entered the chat)
::)
This team was never going anywhere this year. Id like them to win games after they secure another top 10 pick.
And more revisionist history. Again, the pick 6 was terrible, but the Bears had already let Detroit go 65 yards on 6 plays for a TD the drive before. The pick 6 wasn't the jolt to jumpstart them. And, not only that, Fields immediately returned and lead them to a TD to go back up 6 after Santos shanked the XP. Then the Bears forced a 3 and out right after. There were 3 full possessions after the Pick 6 where Detroit had no momentum, maybe negative momentum. The Lions really only showed life after the Bears let them inexplicably complete a 44 yard pass to a nobody backup WR on 3rd and long with 3 min to play.
Since the Commanders game, Fields has been 59/92 for 620 yards with 8 TDs to 2 INTs and a 105 Passer Rating. Then add 467 yards rushing and another 5 TDs on the ground. The Bears have averaged 31 points a game. I'm not sure what else you want him to do or why Bears fans should expect to see "wins from their dude" when the defense has given up 38 points a game the last 3 weeks. He isn't playing Mike LB or FS. Besides the fact that the Bears losing for a better draft pick is the best thing for their long term future, I'm not sure why Bears should feel poorly in any way about his performance, given those stats, just cause a bad team isn't winning.
I certainly never said the Bears have a chance at 0-17. I'm saying 5-12 because...well, frankly, they're on pace to go 5.1-11.9. So sorry if rounding down from 5.1 to 5.0, since there aren't 1/10th of wins out there to get, is super pessimistic I guess.
You really don't think the pick 6 changed the course of that football game? My god. I mean, the lengths fans will go to tell themselves Fields was awesome is hysterical. He lofted up a horrendous pass that literally put 7 points on the board for the Lions in a game they lost by one! But that loss is to be celebrated, so job well done, the pick 6 didn't matter in the end result...or something. If the Bears simply go 3 and out and punt the ball away that's an entirely different game. I'm just saying, if I'm a Bears fan yes it's better to lose games than to finish like 7-10 (too pessimistic still?). BUT if I think Justin Fields is a dude and I see my 14 point second half lead cut to 7 and then he throws that pick? Yeah, I'm not celebrating that loss. That's a game that we should have won and a game I want to see my team win if I want to build with my dude as a QB.
I guess good job Justin. The Bears may be giving up 38/game the last 3 weeks, but the defense wasn't even on the field for 7 of those. But that's on the defense and not on Justin I guess.
You gave a really long winded answer avoiding the question. When do you want to see your dude start to win? Is it next year when they blow a ton of money on free agents and have another top 10 draft pick with a 4th place schedule? At some point, dudes need to win to be a dude. So I'm wondering, when is that point for Chicago fans?
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I certainly never said the Bears have a chance at 0-17. I'm saying 5-12 because...well, frankly, they're on pace to go 5.1-11.9. So sorry if rounding down from 5.1 to 5.0, since there aren't 1/10th of wins out there to get, is super pessimistic I guess.
First of all, hands up, no you didn't. That was WhiteTrash. I confused my 2 word name posters starting with a W, thats my bad.
You really don't think the pick 6 changed the course of that football game? My god. I mean, the lengths fans will go to tell themselves Fields was awesome is hysterical. He lofted up a horrendous pass that literally put 7 points on the board for the Lions in a game they lost by one! But that loss is to be celebrated, so job well done, the pick 6 didn't matter in the end result...or something. If the Bears simply go 3 and out and punt the ball away that's an entirely different game. I'm just saying, if I'm a Bears fan yes it's better to lose games than to finish like 7-10 (too pessimistic still?). BUT if I think Justin Fields is a dude and I see my 14 point second half lead cut to 7 and then he throws that pick? Yeah, I'm not celebrating that loss. That's a game that we should have won and a game I want to see my team win if I want to build with my dude as a QB.
Of course it changed the course of a game. Any scoring play changes the course of the game. All I said was it wasn't momentum changing. It didn't kill a promising drive (they were buried 2nd and 18 in the shadow of their goal posts), the Bears immediately scored right after, and the Lions didn't do anything meaningful with that "momentum change" until 7 min of game time later. It was an inexcusable, uncharacteristically bad (given the last 4 games) throw from Fields. Nobody is debating or defending that. But again, he was very good again, almost a 100 QB rating again, and made a ton of plays with his legs while showing composure and better game understanding. If you're going to look at a game where a team scores 30 points and look at a single bad throw from a QB and go "ehh, I don't know about him as the guy", I think your expectations are whacked out.
And since you're playing what ifs with the Bears punting if he didn't throw that Pick 6. If a NFL kicker makes a simple XP, then actually Fields gets the ball back, tie game, with 2:30 and 3 TOs.
Bears fans are supposedly going to great lengths to convince themselves Fields was awful, yet you're going great lengths to put that entire loss (and perception of Fields as the guy) on a single really bad throw.
I guess good job Justin. The Bears may be giving up 38/game the last 3 weeks, but the defense wasn't even on the field for 7 of those. But that's on the defense and not on Justin I guess.
You gave a really long winded answer avoiding the question. When do you want to see your dude start to win? Is it next year when they blow a ton of money on free agents and have another top 10 draft pick with a 4th place schedule? At some point, dudes need to win to be a dude. So I'm wondering, when is that point for Chicago fans?
What does that even mean? Oh they only gave up 24 this week, not 31 cause Fields sucks, so they really weren't the problem? The point was the defense is horrific and porous. And doesn't put the team, or Fields, in a position to win.
I didn't avoid the question. But yes, next year. This year all you want to see from Fields is development and not getting hurt. I could give a F*** if they finish 3-14 versus 6-11. Moral victories are dumb when its the difference in 5-6 draft slots on a team desperate for talent. Only meatball idiots or Virginia McCaskey hope to win every week when its clearly not a .500 football team. The difference in this team from week to week compared to the Nagy teams is not even close. That plus Fields growth is all reasonable and intelligent Bears fans need for next year.
And maybe if the developmental QB was struggling in confidence and you want to see him get one. But they suffered losses while he continues to improve tremendously week to week.
(Week 15: Fields goes 21/25 for 260 yards 3 TDs, rushes for 90 yards and a TD. Bears lose 55-28 to the Eagles)
WithoutBias: "Can you really feel confident that Fields is a dude if the Bears don't win? Dudes need to win and a Dude would win a game against a quality team like that"
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Fields has been a dude lately. I just have an issue trusting QBs that are better runners than passers. They are fun to watch (watching Manziel was some of my favorite college football memories) and can win you a good amount of games, but I don't think they can win you a super bowl. Russell Wilson is the only one I can think of to ever win the big one. Kaep, Newton, and McNabb are the only other ones I can think of who made it to the Super Bowl. I also think they have a much shorter shelf life than other QBs.
I guess it depends on how you define running QBs. Steve Young, a spectacular runner, won a Super Bowl. Fran Tarkenton got to 3 Super Bowls. Roger Staubach -- often criticized in his younger days for scrambling too much -- was a multiple-time champion.
None of the above was a "better runner than passer," especially by the time he had his most career success, but neither was Wilson nor McNabb.
Plenty of other great-running QBs, including Vick, Cunningham and Culpepper, were good enough to get their teams to conference championship games -- which is as far as all-time great non-run-first QB Aaron Rodgers has taken the Packers in any of the last 11 years.
A team can win, and win pretty big, with a great running QB. But yes, it's very difficult to go all the way with one, especially one who'd truly be defined as a "better runner than passer" QB.
But there really aren't many of those. And most don't have enough longevity to stay healthy and/or great long enough for championship-level teams to be built around them. Cam Newton and Duante Culpepper seemed indestructible ... until they weren't.
The best of all worlds is a guy like Mahomes -- he's great in a normal pocket, great in a moving pocket, and a great scrambler when he has to be. But he's not a big guy, and I hope he has lasting power because he sure is fun to watch.
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But there really aren't many of those. And most don't have enough longevity to stay healthy and/or great long enough for championship-level teams to be built around them. Cam Newton and Duante Culpepper seemed indestructible ... until they weren't.
The best of all worlds is a guy like Mahomes -- he's great in a normal pocket, great in a moving pocket, and a great scrambler when he has to be. But he's not a big guy, and I hope he has lasting power because he sure is fun to watch.
This is good nuance. I also think the way a QB runs is important in terms of health. Cam Newton and Culpepper were MONSTERS, so they were perfectly happy to smash into people and run them over. Which is great until its not. Then have a smaller guy who is more of the modern running passer QB in RG3 who just never avoided hits. He took WAYYY too many of them.
But Lamar Jackson has remained remarkably healthy so far. His only significant injury was an ankle injury that had nothing to do with scrambling, it was on a simple rushed throw away from just out of the pocket. Michael Vick, after breaking his leg in preseason early on in his career, was pretty injury free the majority of his career.
I mentioned Russell Wilson before because of his use of the slide, he's never been injured (though thats probably due to his concussion water, naturally). Given how often Fields slides this early in his career, I'd hope he'd mirror some of the same.
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Plenty of only good running backs throw 8 tds in 4 weeks
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Never a doubt. SKOL Vikings! Hope we do well in the playoffs.
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Plenty of only good running backs throw 8 tds in 4 weeks
2 TDs per week? Damn! I stand corrected!
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2 TDs per week? Damn! I stand corrected!
You realize there are only 2 QBs that are averaging more than 2 Passing TDs a week? 5 of the Pro Bowl selections last year at QB didn't average 2 passing TDs a game. This isn't the own you think it is...
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I am a Bears fan who thought 0-17 was a possibility (not a probable win total) and predicted 3 wins (since changed to 4). As a fan I recognized and agreed with the GM to tear the roster down, bring in a bunch of rookies, get draft choices and free up massive cap space. The Bears constructed this team for the future with little or no regard for winning this year. I think they have accomplished all the goals. They deserve credit.
Does getting an A+ on the first steps of a rebuild guaranty future success? Hell no.
As for winning now. As a fan I'd like to see higher draft picks that a 3-4 win team gets than a 7-8 win team. The majority of this team will not be back next year, by design, so building up and upon wins doesn't matter much.
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You realize there are only 2 QBs that are averaging more than 2 Passing TDs a week? 5 of the Pro Bowl selections last year at QB didn't average 2 passing TDs a game. This isn't the own you think it is...
Almost like this is Green and gold hued goggles and not critical thinking
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Almost like this is Green and gold hued goggles and not critical thinking
There are Packer fans that think this team can still win the Super Bowl this year
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That’s throwing for 2 tds a week but also running for another 5 of them in that time span. It’s ok to admit when a disliked division opponent has a good performing player. Lord knows I’ve had to do it my whole life with Packers QBs.
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I guess it depends on how you define running QBs. Steve Young, a spectacular runner, won a Super Bowl. Fran Tarkenton got to 3 Super Bowls. Roger Staubach -- often criticized in his younger days for scrambling too much -- was a multiple-time champion.
None of the above was a "better runner than passer," especially by the time he had his most career success, but neither was Wilson nor McNabb.
Plenty of other great-running QBs, including Vick, Cunningham and Culpepper, were good enough to get their teams to conference championship games -- which is as far as all-time great non-run-first QB Aaron Rodgers has taken the Packers in any of the last 11 years.
A team can win, and win pretty big, with a great running QB. But yes, it's very difficult to go all the way with one, especially one who'd truly be defined as a "better runner than passer" QB.
But there really aren't many of those. And most don't have enough longevity to stay healthy and/or great long enough for championship-level teams to be built around them. Cam Newton and Duante Culpepper seemed indestructible ... until they weren't.
The best of all worlds is a guy like Mahomes -- he's great in a normal pocket, great in a moving pocket, and a great scrambler when he has to be. But he's not a big guy, and I hope he has lasting power because he sure is fun to watch.
This was a fun Fran Tarkenton memory .
https://thevikingage.com/2021/10/27/fran-tarkenton-brawl-minnesota-vikings-1974/
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This was a fun Fran Tarkenton memory .
https://thevikingage.com/2021/10/27/fran-tarkenton-brawl-minnesota-vikings-1974/
He's lived an "interesting" life.
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There are Packer fans that think this team can still win the Super Bowl this year
Entitled Town, aina?
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Entitled Town, aina?
Justin Fields can’t possibly be getting better but Christian Watson is now better than Davante Adams
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He's lived an "interesting" life.
2018 article on Fran.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2018/01/29/fran-tarkenton-speaks-his-mind-doping-anthem-protests-and-tom-brady/1074005001/
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All 4 NFC East teams could each easily be over 7 wins by Week 12. That was a huge win by Washington for the NFC playoff picture.
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Thank you WASH.
Still think its pretty slim the Vikes end up with the NFC best record and bye. But tonight definitely increased the chances.
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Thanks to the Eagles' loss ...
In this, the 50th anniversary season of their 1972 undefeated campaign, the Dolphins officially will remain the only unbeaten, untied championship team in the history of major North American professional sports.
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This was a fun Fran Tarkenton memory .
https://thevikingage.com/2021/10/27/fran-tarkenton-brawl-minnesota-vikings-1974/
George Mira was a roving QB as well. Played for SF in the late 60s. Saw him play against the Packers when they played in Milwaukee. Not as a good as Fran but gave the Packer defense fits as he always seemed to find an open receiver. SF was a pretty poor team back then which is why not to many people remember George.
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George Mira was a roving QB as well. Played for SF in the late 60s. Saw him play against the Packers when they played in Milwaukee. Not as a good as Fran but gave the Packer defense fits as he always seemed to find an open receiver. SF was a pretty poor team back then which is why not to many people remember George.
People don’t remember him because he started a total of 8 games in his entire career and had a QB rating of 57.4. He sucked.
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People don’t remember him because he started a total of 8 games in his entire career and had a QB rating of 57.4. He sucked.
Lololololol
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George Mira was a roving QB as well. Played for SF in the late 60s. Saw him play against the Packers when they played in Milwaukee. Not as a good as Fran but gave the Packer defense fits as he always seemed to find an open receiver. SF was a pretty poor team back then which is why not to many people remember George.
According to Pro Football Reference, Mira only played in Milwaukee once (1966) and did not throw a pass. He had one rushing attempt for one yard.
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According to Pro Football Reference, Mira only played in Milwaukee once (1966) and did not throw a pass. He had one rushing attempt for one yard.
He may be conflating it with a game they played earlier that season in San Francisco, where the Niners upset the Packers. It looks like he had a fairly decent game that day.
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I can never get enough George Mira discussion. I vote for a separate George Mira thread or board. Mira-scoop.com?
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I can never get enough George Mira discussion. I vote for a separate George Mira thread or board. Mira-scoop.com?
He was the MVP of the 1974 World Bowl! And the wikipedia entry from that game is amazing.
"Original plans for the World Bowl had the 1974 championship scheduled for November 29, the day after Thanksgiving 1974 at the Gator Bowl in Jacksonville, Florida. However, the WFL decided to expand its playoff field from four to six teams, pushing the championship back a week; furthermore, the host Jacksonville Sharks folded during the season, leading to the league moving the game to the home stadium of the higher seeded playoff team (in this case, Birmingham). A cash prize of $10,000 was brought onto Legion Field for the league's season MVP award, which was split between three players. The league presented the players with actual cash ($1 bills stacked on a table) in lieu of the standard practice of a check in order to avoid the scrutiny of a whether a WFL cheque would even clear the bank. However, after the ceremonies, the locker room of the champion Americans was raided and all team assets, including uniforms, were seized to collect on the team's debts. The day before the playoffs began the IRS had put lien on the Birmingham Americans over a $237,000 tax debt. The league negotiated a deal where the IRS allowed Birmingham to play in exchange for a portion of the gate receipts which were used to help pay off the debt. In addition, the Americans and Blazers players had gone unpaid for several weeks and refused to play until they were paid. It took Birmingham's owner Bill Putnam's promise of championship rings if they won and the league dividing the remaining gate receipts 60/40 (based on who won the game) to settle the dispute."
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I guess it depends on how you define running QBs. Steve Young, a spectacular runner, won a Super Bowl. Fran Tarkenton got to 3 Super Bowls. Roger Staubach -- often criticized in his younger days for scrambling too much -- was a multiple-time champion.
None of the above was a "better runner than passer," especially by the time he had his most career success, but neither was Wilson nor McNabb.
Plenty of other great-running QBs, including Vick, Cunningham and Culpepper, were good enough to get their teams to conference championship games -- which is as far as all-time great non-run-first QB Aaron Rodgers has taken the Packers in any of the last 11 years.
A team can win, and win pretty big, with a great running QB. But yes, it's very difficult to go all the way with one, especially one who'd truly be defined as a "better runner than passer" QB.
But there really aren't many of those. And most don't have enough longevity to stay healthy and/or great long enough for championship-level teams to be built around them. Cam Newton and Duante Culpepper seemed indestructible ... until they weren't.
The best of all worlds is a guy like Mahomes -- he's great in a normal pocket, great in a moving pocket, and a great scrambler when he has to be. But he's not a big guy, and I hope he has lasting power because he sure is fun to watch.
I mean you had to go back to the QBs who won the super bowl in 1994, 1977, and 1971, and made the super bowl in 1973-1976 to find examples. Young winning a super bowl 29 super bowls ago isn't really relevant to today's NFL. Running QBs were more of a novelty back then, defenses are much better equipped to handle them now then they were.
BTW, want to feel old? After this season, Steve Young's Super Bowl 29, will be in the "old" half of super bowls. His win will be closer in time to the first super bowl than the most recent super bowl. I still remember watching that game as a kid.
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I mean you had to go back to the QBs who won the super bowl in 1994, 1977, and 1971, and made the super bowl in 1973-1976 to find examples. Young winning a super bowl 29 super bowls ago isn't really relevant to today's NFL. Running QBs were more of a novelty back then, defenses are much better equipped to handle them now then they were.
BTW, want to feel old? After this season, Steve Young's Super Bowl 29, will be in the "old" half of super bowls. His win will be closer in time to the first super bowl than the most recent super bowl. I still remember watching that game as a kid.
That brings up an interesting side topic. What is everyones first Superbowl memory?
My first memory is Lynn Swann against the Dallas Cowboys. SuperBowl X
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That brings up an interesting side topic. What is everyones first Superbowl memory?
My first memory is Lynn Swann against the Dallas Cowboys. SuperBowl X
Yeah, that's mine as well. A couple of years after that, McDonalds (of all places) put out some magazines on the history of the first 11 Super Bowls. I distinctly remember my dad getting them for me, and I would page through them in amazement. "The Chiefs won a Super Bowl???"
https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/1977-mcdonalds-history-super-bowl-430569069
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That brings up an interesting side topic. What is everyones first Superbowl memory?
My first memory is Lynn Swann against the Dallas Cowboys. SuperBowl X
49ers goal line stand against the Bengals in Super Bowl XVI and Earl Cooper’s left-handed spike
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I mean you had to go back to the QBs who won the super bowl in 1994, 1977, and 1971, and made the super bowl in 1973-1976 to find examples. Young winning a super bowl 29 super bowls ago isn't really relevant to today's NFL. Running QBs were more of a novelty back then, defenses are much better equipped to handle them now then they were.
BTW, want to feel old? After this season, Steve Young's Super Bowl 29, will be in the "old" half of super bowls. His win will be closer in time to the first super bowl than the most recent super bowl. I still remember watching that game as a kid.
Ehh depends. Are we talking "QB who uses run as a key part of their arsenal"? Cause 2013 SF with Kaepernick, then back to back SBs for Seattle in 2014/2015 with Russell Wilson, then Cam Newton and Carolina the year after. Seattle won in 2014, but then the others were 1 possession games until the end. So its not at all crazy that their "running QB" led teams could have won a SB.
The QB has to be a good passer as well, but its not just Steve Young thats been successful in that mode at the highest level.
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Fun fact...in Fran Tarkenton's last year as an NFL quarterback, he started all 16 games, lead the league in passing yards at 216 yards a game....and threw 32 INTs.
QB stats from back then are just wildly inefficient.
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Fun fact...in Fran Tarkenton's last year as an NFL quarterback, he started all 16 games, lead the league in passing yards at 216 yards a game....and threw 32 INTs.
QB stats from back then are just wildly inefficient.
Things started to change with the elimination of hand checking beyond 5 yards and the advent of the west coast offense
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Things started to change with the elimination of hand checking beyond 5 yards and the advent of the west coast offense
Oh I know. I just think its funny for as much as quarterbacks are loathe to throw them now, I can just imagine ole Fran shrugging his shoulders, trotting off to the sidelines and lighting up a cigarette or something.
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Ehh depends. Are we talking "QB who uses run as a key part of their arsenal"? Cause 2013 SF with Kaepernick, then back to back SBs for Seattle in 2014/2015 with Russell Wilson, then Cam Newton and Carolina the year after. Seattle won in 2014, but then the others were 1 possession games until the end. So its not at all crazy that their "running QB" led teams could have won a SB.
The QB has to be a good passer as well, but its not just Steve Young thats been successful in that mode at the highest level.
Yes, you beat me to it, Wags. Plenty of teams with outstanding running QBs (and some would argue better-running-than-passing QBs if you're talking about Newton and Kaepernick) have been championship-level teams in recent years. And yes, the examples I gave of older QBs works, too.
Fun fact...in Fran Tarkenton's last year as an NFL quarterback, he started all 16 games, lead the league in passing yards at 216 yards a game....and threw 32 INTs.
QB stats from back then are just wildly inefficient.
The Dolphins won back-to-back Super Bowls after the 1972 and 1973 seasons. Bob Griese, who called his own plays, threw a TOTAL of 18 passes in those two games. I remember reading Sports Illustrated's account of SB7 (the one at the end of the perfect season), and it said something like, "And then Griese did something that nobody in the stadium expected -- he threw a pass. To his tight end. On FIRST DOWN!" It was another world back then QB-stats wise.
That brings up an interesting side topic. What is everyones first Superbowl memory?
My first memory is Lynn Swann against the Dallas Cowboys. SuperBowl X
The first SB I actually sat down and watched was 7, with the Dolphins ("my team" back then) beating Washington to cap their unbeaten season. So if we're talking memorable moments, Yepremian's "pass" that got intercepted and kept Wash in the game. Had he made the kick there, it would have been a 17-0 win to cap a 17-0 season, which would have been perfect as the season. Instead, it was nail-biting time until the Dolphins' famed "No-Name Defense" put the game away.
I was a huge Csonka fan, so the way he ran all over the Vikings the following year is a great memory. But I like your choice of the Swann game. He was brilliant, and amazing to watch because he was so smooth and graceful and measured before he'd kill the opponent -- a silent assassin.
The two guys I just mentioned -- Csonka and Swann -- had absolutely perfect names to describe how they played football!
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That brings up an interesting side topic. What is everyones first Superbowl memory?
My first memory is Lynn Swann against the Dallas Cowboys. SuperBowl X
Garo Yepremian's non-kick.
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Ehh depends. Are we talking "QB who uses run as a key part of their arsenal"? Cause 2013 SF with Kaepernick, then back to back SBs for Seattle in 2014/2015 with Russell Wilson, then Cam Newton and Carolina the year after. Seattle won in 2014, but then the others were 1 possession games until the end. So its not at all crazy that their "running QB" led teams could have won a SB.
The QB has to be a good passer as well, but its not just Steve Young thats been successful in that mode at the highest level.
You missed the original post, I mentioned all of those examples. 1 running QB has won a SB in the past almost 30 years. 4 have lost in the Super Bowl. In that time at least 25 other QBs have made the super bowl
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Also, the year Steve Young won the Super Bowl, he rushed for 18.3 yards a game. That would have been good for 18th among QBs last season. Not counting his 5 game rookie season, he never rushed for more than 37.7 yards a game in a season. That would have been good for 5th last season. Given how much more prolific Young's passing was compared to his running, I don't know that I would label him a running QB, at least not in the sense that it's used today.
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Steve Young was a quarterback who could run. He wasn't a "running quarterback."
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Amari Rodgers let go. About 4 years too late.
The dude had the most fumbles of any non-quarterback in the NFL this season. Think about that. He plays like 4 snaps a game. That's mind boggling. More than Geno Smith, Tom Brady, Lamar Jackson, Russell Wilson, Joe Burrow, Davis Mills, and Kirk Cousins.
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You missed the original post, I mentioned all of those examples. 1 running QB has won a SB in the past almost 30 years. 4 have lost in the Super Bowl. In that time at least 25 other QBs have made the super bowl
I didn't miss any posts. I didn't need to go back to Steve Young.
In the last 10 SBs, 11 different QBs played. 4 of them were "running QBs". And thats not including Mahomes who rushes 70 times a season which is substantially more than most QBs.
But we shall see. Of the top 5 teams in the NFL right now, 3 have "running QBs" in the Bills, Eagles, and Ravens.
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Starr...McGee...Touchdown, aina?
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Steve Young was a quarterback who could run. He wasn't a "running quarterback."
When he got his NFL start with a bad Tampa Bay team, Young often had to be a "running for his life quarterback"!
And in his early years with SF, when he'd replace an injured Montana, he did stuff like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbPwwmEcws0
But yes, by the time he actually was ready to replace Montana as the triggerman for the prolific SF offense, he was more of a pocket passer -- and a damn good one for many years.
His career arc was fairly similar to Staubach's: He was a scrambler (which isn't really the same as a "running QB") before becoming a great pocket passer who could run when necessary.
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When he got his NFL start with a bad Tampa Bay team, Young often had to be a "running for his life quarterback"!
And in his early years with SF, when he'd replace an injured Montana, he did stuff like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbPwwmEcws0
That's exactly what I mean. That was a pass play where he scrambled. That wasn't some sort of RPO or designed run like you see these days.
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That's exactly what I mean. That was a pass play where he scrambled. That wasn't some sort of RPO or designed run like you see these days.
Yes.
His career arc was fairly similar to Staubach's: He was a scrambler (which isn't really the same as a "running QB") before becoming a great pocket passer who could run when necessary.
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When he got his NFL start with a bad Tampa Bay team, Young often had to be a "running for his life quarterback"!
And in his early years with SF, when he'd replace an injured Montana, he did stuff like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbPwwmEcws0
But yes, by the time he actually was ready to replace Montana as the triggerman for the prolific SF offense, he was more of a pocket passer -- and a damn good one for many years.
His career arc was fairly similar to Staubach's: He was a scrambler (which isn't really the same as a "running QB") before becoming a great pocket passer who could run when necessary.
Those really good years in the early 90s, he still ran A LOT for the era. He was in the high 60s to 70s in terms of number of carries. That would be above average for a QB even now. He was clocked at 4.55 in the 40 coming out of BYU. He absolutely would have been running RPOs in the modern game.
But this is all belaboring the point. If you can’t throw as a QB, you won’t have success. If you leave the pocket at the first available moment you won’t have success. Russell Wilson showed that you can be a running QB and be very successful and healthy as long as you pick your moments. Lamar Jackson has been a wild success as a running weapon QB while also being an efficient passer. Jalen Hurts was more a runner than a passer coming out of college, he’s not a pocket passer by any stretch, and he’s in the top 2 in the MVP hunt. Josh Allen is a dual threat whose becoming a superstar on a very dangerous team.
The NFL is always changing. And I think the notion of “running QBs can’t win” is eroding, so long as they are in the proper scheme. Many of the ”failed” mobile QBs of the 2000s and 2010s were a bit ahead of their time and in archaic systems. If RG3 played for the Harbaugh Ravens in his early 20s or for Brian Daboll, I truly think he’d have not only stayed more healthy, but also been a star.
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Those really good years in the early 90s, he still ran A LOT for the era. He was in the high 60s to 70s in terms of number of carries. That would be above average for a QB even now. He was clocked at 4.55 in the 40 coming out of BYU. He absolutely would have been running RPOs in the modern game.
But this is all belaboring the point. If you can’t throw as a QB, you won’t have success. If you leave the pocket at the first available moment you won’t have success. Russell Wilson showed that you can be a running QB and be very successful and healthy as long as you pick your moments. Lamar Jackson has been a wild success as a running weapon QB while also being an efficient passer. Jalen Hurts was more a runner than a passer coming out of college, he’s not a pocket passer by any stretch, and he’s in the top 2 in the MVP hunt. Josh Allen is a dual threat whose becoming a superstar on a very dangerous team.
The NFL is always changing. And I think the notion of “running QBs can’t win” is eroding, so long as they are in the proper scheme. Many of the ”failed” mobile QBs of the 2000s and 2010s were a bit ahead of their time and in archaic systems. If RG3 played for the Harbaugh Ravens in his early 20s or for Brian Daboll, I truly think he’d have not only stayed more healthy, but also been a star.
I remember very well (as I'm sure you and most Scoopers do) the hype around Vick. He was THE FUTURE OF THE NFL! Except he wasn't, because there are very few human beings who can be both an electric runner and a very good passer. Newton was similar (though larger), Allen, Mahomes, Jackson. Each has had success. But as you stated, you obviously have to be able to throw the ball with competence. Those who also can make adjustments on the fly, read defenses, etc, will end up the best.
For all the hype surrounding Allen -- who is great, and I love watching him -- he makes some incredibly huge mistakes. He simply can't have the kind of mistakes he made last game if the Bills actually are going to win it all with him. But he's still relatively young, he's clearly super-talented, and I like his chances of being great.
Is Josh Allen a "running quarterback"? Well, it all depends on definitions. He's a heck of a quarterback who is a fantastic runner.
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Whenever I watch Josh Allen I think "that's Brett Favre." Huge arm, very talented, a gunslinger, and a decent scrambler. They just call more pure running plays for Allen because that's what people do now. Mike Holmgren would never have done that for Favre.
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Whenever I watch Josh Allen I think "that's Brett Favre." Huge arm, very talented, a gunslinger, and a decent scrambler. They just call more pure running plays for Allen because that's what people do now. Mike Holmgren would never have done that for Favre.
I'm pretty sure Allen is faster than Favre was, bigger than Favre, and just a better runner, but I get the comparison.
What I've said is Allen is a more accurate version of Cam Newton. Both were large men, surprisingly fast, could run over you or around you. Both have/had big arms. Allen's a better passer, Cam at his best was more of a runner. But pretty similar all-around.
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Whenever I watch Josh Allen I think "that's Brett Favre." Huge arm, very talented, a gunslinger, and a decent scrambler. They just call more pure running plays for Allen because that's what people do now. Mike Holmgren would never have done that for Favre.
Thats kind of my point that I made about Steve Young. The notion of a "running QB" has changed because the game has changed and those strengths can be leveraged better and its not some slight on the QB's deficiencies as a passer
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Vick was the future of the NFL. In his first 4 seasons, he only played in 5 games due to injury his 3rd season and only played in 8 games his rookie year due to being a rookie. His 2nd and 4th seasons he finished top 4 in MVP voting. He just happened to run a dog fighting ring that changed the course of his career.
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Vick was the future of the NFL. In his first 4 seasons, he only played in 5 games due to injury his 3rd season and only played in 8 games his rookie year due to being a rookie. His 2nd and 4th seasons he finished top 4 in MVP voting. He just happened to run a dog fighting ring that changed the course of his career.
And then came back after 2 years away, not just away but in prison, and a year later was second in the Offensive Player of the Year voting. Just an absolute phenom.
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Vick was the future of the NFL. In his first 4 seasons, he only played in 5 games due to injury his 3rd season and only played in 8 games his rookie year due to being a rookie. His 2nd and 4th seasons he finished top 4 in MVP voting. He just happened to run a dog fighting ring that changed the course of his career.
But his style of play wasn't really the future because so few could play that way.
As for his performance ... while he was still putting up insane running stats, his decline as a passer was evident in the 2 seasons before the dog-fighting suspension. He was no MVP candidate in either 2005 or 2006 when he was completing 54% of his passes, committing 46 turnovers, putting up a 74.4 passer rating and "leading" the Falcons to a 15-17 record.
Vick sure was fun to watch, though. And after being reinstated, he did have a very nice career comeback for a couple years there with the Eagles.
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Will be curious to see how the Cleveland/Buffalo game plays out this weekend. The forecast is ridiculous.
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Long as the snow is under 3 feet, they should be OK.
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Long as the snow is under 3 feet, they should be OK.
Discussions underway about moving the game to Detroit. It works logistically as Buffalo is scheduled to beat the Lions there on Thanksgiving
https://www.woodwardsports.com/stories/buffalo-bills-game-could-be-played-at-ford-field
EDIT: now official per ESPN. Off to Detroit
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Buncha snowflakes
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Nice.
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Game moved to DTW, aina?
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Rodgers has gone 16 straight games under 300 yards.
Justin Fields has no 300 yard games as a pro, just so were even Steven here.
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Rodgers has gone 16 straight games under 300 yards.
Justin Fields has no 300 yard games as a pro, just so were even Steven here.
Fields has never done a State Farm commercial
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I was watching our heroes dispatch the mighty LIU Sharks, so I didn't tune into the latest Packers debacle until late in the third quarter. But Rodgers looked borderline incompetent over the 18 or so minutes of game time that I watched.
If I didn't know it was Aaron Rodgers, I might have thought it was Jordan Love. Or a late-model Cam Newton. Or (insert name of any inaccurate, choking QB). And as Packers fans know, this wasn't the first time that's been the case this season.
Unlike many here, I'm neither a Rodgers fan or hater. I always marveled at his talent. It's pretty incredible to see what he's become.
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Shoulda fookin' married Danica, aina?
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Shoulda fookin' married Danica, aina?
Think of the money he saved avoiding a divorce settlement.
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Rodgers still has $100 million guaranteed from the packers after this season.
That's a lot of shares to sell.
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Rodgers still has $100 million guaranteed from the packers after this season.
That's a lot of shares to sell.
Just a terrible contract and totally unnecessary.
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Unlike many here, I'm neither a Rodgers fan or hater. I always marveled at his talent. It's pretty incredible to see what he's become.
Too many magic mushrooms.
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Rodgers still has $100 million guaranteed from the packers after this season.
That's a lot of shares to sell.
Professional sports franchises all have money trees they can pick from at any time.
His contract may make it hard to deal with the salary cap, but means little to the team's ability to spend money.
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Professional sports franchises all have money trees they can pick from at any time.
His contract may make it hard to deal with the salary cap, but means little to the team's ability to spend money.
I believe his comment was tongue-in-cheek about the shares because I laughed
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I believe his comment was tongue-in-cheek about the shares because I laughed
The shares part was a funny.
Actually, the $100m albatross contract is funny too, just in a different way.
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Just a terrible contract and totally unnecessary.
Timing could not have been worse for the Packers. While on the contract that was super team-friendly, he was the MVP. When they gave him a bunch of money to commit to him, he turns back into a pumpkin.
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The shares part was a funny.
I figured it was since money from shares can’t be used for player’s contracts.
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How are the Bills players & staff supposed to get to the airport tomorrow? How did they not leave yesterday?
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I figured it was since money from shares can’t be used for player’s contracts.
Money from buying shares should be lit on fire. Same results, removing money from a suckered writ large.
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How are the Bills players & staff supposed to get to the airport tomorrow? How did they not leave yesterday?
Only 13 inches recorded at Buffalo airport so far. 70% of flights cancelled, so there’s a chance.
66 inches is the most recent report in Orchard Park.
https://twitter.com/BuffaloBills/status/1593756187794735104
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'Only 13 inches'
Said no one ever.
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How are the Bills players & staff supposed to get to the airport tomorrow? How did they not leave yesterday?
Bills Mafia showed up to dig players cars out of driveways
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77 inches of snow in Buffalo.
Feel like a piker having only received two feet.
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77 inches of snow in Buffalo.
Feel like a piker having only received two feet.
Bills game sold out in Detroit.
https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/local/2022/11/20/tickets-no-longer-being-sold-for-browns-bills-game-in-detroit/
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Ravens won the toss ... and decided to take the ball.
I don't follow them, so I don't know if this is what Harbaugh usually does to try to get Jackson going. I do know that the Ravens have gotten off to double-digit leads in every game, so maybe that's how Harbaugh plays it.
This time, they got about to midfield but then were stopped by the Panthers and had to punt.
In the olden days, teams always took the ball if they won the toss, but it now seems they always defer.
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Ravens won the toss ... and decided to take the ball.
I don't follow them, so I don't know if this is what Harbaugh usually does to try to get Jackson going. I do know that the Ravens have gotten off to double-digit leads in every game, so maybe that's how Harbaugh plays it.
This time, they got about to midfield but then were stopped by the Panthers and had to punt.
In the olden days, teams always took the ball if they won the toss, but it now seems they always defer.
Back in the day, they didn't have the option to defer. The rule only changed in 2008. So you would always elect to take the ball because the team that lost the toss selects to start the second half.
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Back in the day, they didn't have the option to defer. The rule only changed in 2008. So you would always elect to take the ball because the team that lost the toss selects to start the second half.
True. I forgot about that.
Pretty rare for a team to take the ball these days.
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Bears need to do a better job protecting Fields
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Fiekds is going to get killed running the ball. Maybe thr Bears should now tank for a higher pick?
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Fields wasn’t good today, and that play calling that last drive made zero sense.
Fantastic outcome though.
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The Bears don’t need to change a thing. This is perfect. Fields is showing signs of being good and then throwing games away while they go for a higher draft pick and a 4th place schedule. Definitely more important than having your dude find ways to win close games.
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Maybe thr Bears should now tank for a higher pick?
"tank now for a higher pick"?????? Have you seen the roster they put together this season? This tank job started last February.
Have to give the Bears 'A+' on the execution of the season plan.
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The Bears don’t need to change a thing. This is perfect. Fields is showing signs of being good and then throwing games away while they go for a higher draft pick and a 4th place schedule. Definitely more important than having your dude find ways to win close games.
Maybe so but then they better do a better job protecting him from getting injured. Calling two run plays there? Borderline criminal
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Maybe so but then they better do a better job protecting him from getting injured. Calling two run plays there? Borderline criminal
He was being sarcastic.
But it was absurd to having him running when he was nowhere close to healthy and nursing his hamstring and shoulder
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Bears last best chance for win #4 is at Detroit, a game that the Lions will be the favorite.
I guess Minny at Chicago might be an opportunity with the Vikings sitting the starters. It would be a shame if Fields had a "hamstring pull" <wink, wink> for that game.
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He was being sarcastic.
But it was absurd to having him running when he was nowhere close to healthy and nursing his hamstring and shoulder
Ah, my bad on the first part
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The Zach Wilson experience in New York is going embarrassingly bad. You can’t have that attitude, especially in NYC.
https://twitter.com/snyjets/status/1594446441287540736?s=46&t=Tdr--48qifoQgZCW-St9GQ
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Cowboys are annihilating the Vikings. An absolute thrashing
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Vikings 8-2, -2 point differential. Absolute frauds, exposed today.
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Vikings 8-2, -2 point differential. Absolute frauds, exposed today.
They had the 8th best point differential going into today. They had a horrible game today that skews their point differential. They aren’t 37 points worse than the Cowboys. They aren’t 8-1 good. But they’re a good team in a bad NFC.
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During the NCAA hoops season, a couple Scoopers have written about the "luck factor."
The Vikings seemed to have something similar going this season. Lots of close wins, including a couple (like the Bills game) in which they were beneficiaries of amazing fortune.
Not saying they're bad. You don't get to 8-1 if you suck at football. But ...
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During the NCAA hoops season, a couple Scoopers have written about the "luck factor."
The Vikings seemed to have something similar going this season. Lots of close wins, including a couple (like the Bills game) in which they were beneficiaries of amazing fortune.
Not saying they're bad. You don't get to 8-1 if you suck at football. But ...
Being lucky and 8-2 is great. Betting on them to make a deep run? Not so much.
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They had the 8th best point differential going into today. They had a horrible game today that skews their point differential. They aren’t 37 points worse than the Cowboys. They aren’t 8-1 good. But they’re a good team in a bad NFC.
Coming into today, they were #1 in the league in penalty differential, 17th in DVOA, a negative offense success rate relative to their defense success rate, recovery on an absurd 67% of fumbles, and out gained by their opponents on a per play basis.
That was all BEFORE today’s blasting.
Frauds.
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After MN beat Buffalo, my Minnesotan sisters were talking about booking flights and tickets to the Superbowl.
It's like they haven't seen the movie before.
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Back in the day, they didn't have the option to defer. The rule only changed in 2008. So you would always elect to take the ball because the team that lost the toss selects to start the second half.
Yes, they did. Marty Mornhinweg took the wind in 2002. It just made zero sense to defer.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-2002-11-25-0211250170-story.html
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Marty, being a Lion coach, made that choice for overtime.
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Marty, being a Lion coach, made that choice for overtime.
Really hard to tell what has been worse for the last few decades - the coaches or the players.
Two of my good buddies here in Wisconsin are Lions fans, so I always have a soft spot in my heart for them - unless they are playing GB. But this year, I am rooting for the Lions to beat the Packers so Gutey can screw up another high pick.
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Coming into today, they were #1 in the league in penalty differential, 17th in DVOA, a negative offense success rate relative to their defense success rate, recovery on an absurd 67% of fumbles, and out gained by their opponents on a per play basis.
That was all BEFORE today’s blasting.
Frauds.
Not being penalized is an important thing.
That’s the same system that ranks the Packers as a top 10 offense (and not even 10th).
Frauds in the sense of not as good as a team on pace to go 15-2? Sure. They’re a good football team though.
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Entertaining game between Chargers and Chiefs. Mahomes gets the last word. We’ll see what happens!
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Mahomes to Kelce. What a combo. Two guys headed for the Hall of Fame.
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Lions +650 right this second to make playoffs. The rest of their schedule is EASY too. Huge finish coming up here.
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That Lions clock management on the tying FG drive was something.
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I think the lions offense is even better than it looks, because Goff is worse than it makes him look.
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Ghost of Matt Mullen on the sidelines?
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I think the lions offense is even better than it looks, because Goff is worse than it makes him look.
They are also an example of how you can't blame the Packers woes on a lack of talent on offense. The lions don't really have talent at the skill positions, but seem to have an offense that looks more efficient.
If Goff threw that last pass on target it was a TD.
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If Goff through that last pass on target it was a TD.
Yup and there’s no way that the WR pulling up on that route was even an option given the coverage.
He also missed on an easy throw to Swift in the flat on the last drive that would have been good for 7 and out of bounds, to force a 3rd down. He’s the definition of just a guy.
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Most quarterbacks right now are just a guy.
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One of the most intriguing story lines developing over the coming months: What if Jimmy Garoppolo leads the 49ers to the championship? With that defense, with an excellent offensive coach, and with all the weapons surrounding Garoppolo, it definitely could happen. I mean, he was in the SB just 3 years ago with a less-talented group around him.
Do you just let that championship-winning QB walk (he'll be an unrestricted free agent) and then hand everything over to Trey Lance, who has proven about as much as a high-level QB as the average Scooper has? Do you re-sign the championship-winning QB? Do you let him walk and bring in an old man who has expressed interest in playing in the area (Rodgers, Brady)? If you don't turn the team over to Lance, what do you do with Lance -- how much trade value would he have?
With the Panthers out of it, one team I'm rooting for the rest of this season will be the Niners -- partly because I like McCaffrey but mostly because I really want to see how the above scenario plays out.
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One of the most intriguing story lines developing over the coming months: What if Jimmy Garoppolo leads the 49ers to the championship? With that defense, with an excellent offensive coach, and with all the weapons surrounding Garoppolo, it definitely could happen. I mean, he was in the SB just 3 years ago with a less-talented group around him.
Do you just let that championship-winning QB walk (he'll be an unrestricted free agent) and then hand everything over to Trey Lance, who has proven about as much as a high-level QB as the average Scooper has? Do you re-sign the championship-winning QB? Do you let him walk and bring in an old man who has expressed interest in playing in the area (Rodgers, Brady)? If you don't turn the team over to Lance, what do you do with Lance -- how much trade value would he have?
With the Panthers out of it, one team I'm rooting for the rest of this season will be the Niners -- partly because I like McCaffrey but mostly because I really want to see how the above scenario plays out.
The niners way is to dump the QB that got you there.
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I don’t have the slightest idea what the Dolphins are doing. This is brutal decision having your backup QB come in, chuck unnecessary bombs, run no clock at all. Makes zero sense.
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Panthers win currently puts the Bears at #2 in the draft.
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Trevor Lawrence coming out party today. Imagine wasting a year of this guy with Urban Meyer.
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The niners way is to dump the QB that got you there.
they're waiting for arod to become available to atone for their mistake 17 years ago
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Panthers win currently puts the Bears at #2 in the draft.
Come on down, Will Anderson
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Come on down, Will Anderson
If I’m Houston, I’d take Anderson at 1, and then take a QB with the Browns pick (currently #9). They could package that pick to move back up too.
PS - I want the Bears to draft Anderson.
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If I’m Houston, I’d take Anderson at 1, and then take a QB with the Browns pick (currently #9). They could package that pick to move back up too.
PS - I want the Bears to draft Anderson.
Yeah, none of the QBs seem like certain franchise QBs. Lot can change between now and then. Either way, Bears will have a lot of great options to make a pick or trade for extra picks
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Terrible clock management down the stretch lost the game for The Bucs today
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Yeah, none of the QBs seem like certain franchise QBs. Lot can change between now and then. Either way, Bears will have a lot of great options to make a pick or trade for extra picks
If the bears end up a top 3 pick and don't trade down, I think I'll be disappointed
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Terrible clock management down the stretch lost the game for The Bucs today
Brady doesn’t know how to use the clock.
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Panthers win currently puts the Bears at #2 in the draft.
We can't even lose right!
Actually, Darnold looked pretty sharp playing behind a good OL and supported by a strong run attack.
Terrible clock management down the stretch lost the game for The Bucs today
Good. Eff Brady.
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He probably won’t win it because his team isn’t good, but Maxx Crosby should be in the conversation for DPOY,
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Fields vs Love next week?
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Fields vs Love next week?
I’ve heard Fields won’t be back (potentially) until after the bye week.
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Yesterday was the first chance I got to see Russell Wilson for an entire game. He was tentative, had happy feet and was inaccurate. His only TD drive came during garbage time. He was significantly outplayed by Sam Darnold. If I didn't know it was Wilson, I'd have wondered, "Who's this scrub the Broncos have at QB?"
The Athletic (and others) are saying it might turn out to have been the worst trade in NFL history. (Or the best, from Seattle's POV.)
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I still can’t believe this Colts team beat the Chiefs and almost beat the Eagles.
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That clock management by Saturday should be fireable.
Thats what happens when you hire a guy out of ESPNs offices out of nowhere.
Mind boggling.
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Oh, no, Antonio.
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Oh, no, Antonio.
Jail and physical/mental health evaluation.
This man 100% has CTE and will be dead in five years if he runs around without help.
Yes, I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
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Jail and physical/mental health evaluation.
This man 100% has CTE and will be dead in five years if he runs around without help.
Yes, I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
I'm significantly more concerned about everyone else's well-being...his ship has sailed
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Fans, at least in some places, have more power than many think.
In an interview with the Charlotte Observer, Matt Rhule said he believed that the fact that many fans loudly turned on him during home games -- shouting “Fire Matt Rhule!” during several of his final home games -- helped seal his fate.
“I never lost the locker room. But I lost the fans.”
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Justin Fields is a very good NFL running back. Bears are doing a good job of not having him throw the football.
And Kirk Cousins is still Kirk Cousins.
Bump?
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Yeah I can definitely see why people are high on Fields.
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Watson’s going to be a co-favorite for OROY by end of the day.
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Yeah I can definitely see why people are high on Fields.
The transformation over the last 6 weeks has been pretty remarkable. Fantastic job by the coaching staff in Chicago. (Can’t remember last time I’ve said that in the last few years)
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The transformation over the last 6 weeks has been pretty remarkable. Fantastic job by the coaching staff in Chicago. (Can’t remember last time I’ve said that in the last few years)
He’ll at least have to lead a game winning drive at least once before he is anything more than a glorified RB.
For now he is content throwing INTs.
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Perfect outcome for the bears
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Agreed. Seeing my dude continually unable to close out games is exactly what I’d want.
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For the future of the franchise, a loss is 100% the preferred outcome.
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Imagine losing yet another game to your arch-rival and claiming it’s the “preferred outcome” so you can move up a few draft spots.
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Perfect outcome. Fields was great, team lost, good day for the Bears.
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Perfect outcome. Fields was great, team lost, good day for the Bears.
Whatever it takes to cope I guess.
To be clear, I understand completely why you are saying what you are saying. I just think at some point, you need to win. I mean, winning is fun! If you trust your front office, they will find talent no matter where they draft. And again, we are only talking about a few spots difference here.
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Whatever it takes to cope I guess.
To be clear, I understand completely why you are saying what you are saying. I just think at some point, you need to win. I mean, winning is fun! If you trust your front office, they will find talent no matter where they draft. And again, we are only talking about a few spots difference here.
If you’re not going to make the playoffs, be atrocious. Finishing 6-11 or 7-10 is a total waste. The Bears have been sitting at #2, and they won’t catch Houston for #1 anyway.
Now, the argument I won’t disagree with is “now can you draft and make good decisions in the offseason?”. If they eff it up, then I agree 100%, what’s the point.
The development of Fields and seeing what else on the roster sticks should be all that matters the last month here.
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The development of Fields and seeing what else on the roster sticks should be all that matters the last month here.
But, are they even developing Fields? He has shown he can pass when everybody expects run. He has not yet shown he can pass when a pass is expected. If they really want to develop him, they need to throw 40 times a game for the rest of the season. then we will have some insight into what he is as a passer.
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But, are they even developing Fields? He has shown he can pass when everybody expects run. He has not yet shown he can pass when a pass is expected. If they really want to develop him, they need to throw 40 times a game for the rest of the season. then we will have some insight into what he is as a passer.
Wut?
You cannot do that with this offensive line without getting him killed.
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I know this was a long time ago, and may not be indicative of how most teams would approach this, but in 1992 the Packers started the season 3-6. Favre took over as starter in game 4. They finished the season winning 6 of 7 but not making the playoffs.
I don't think there was ever any regret that they didn't lose some of those games. In the 1993 NFL draft, they ended up getting three starters for them in the '97 Super Bowl. (Wayne Simmons, Earl Dotson, Doug Evans). They also drafted Mark Brunnell, who was traded for two draft picks in 1995 - one of whom resulted in another Super Bowl starter in William Henderson, the other an All-Pro special teams player in Travis Jervey.
Sure the Bears should be playing everyone to see who actually can contribute in the future, but this isn't the NBA when it comes to drafting. Good personnel departments will find value. IMO you might as well win in the meantime.
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I know this was a long time ago, and may not be indicative of how most teams would approach this, but in 1992 the Packers started the season 3-6. Favre took over as starter in game 4. They finished the season winning 6 of 7 but not making the playoffs.
I don't think there was ever any regret that they didn't lose some of those games. In the 1993 NFL draft, they ended up getting three starters for them in the '97 Super Bowl. (Wayne Simmons, Earl Dotson, Doug Evans). They also drafted Mark Brunnell, who was traded for two draft picks in 1995 - one of whom resulted in another Super Bowl starter in William Henderson, the other an All-Pro special teams player in Travis Jervey.
Sure the Bears should be playing everyone to see who actually can contribute in the future, but this isn't the NBA when it comes to drafting. Good personnel departments will find value. IMO you might as well win in the meantime.
You kinda answered your own question though, what really mattered was they knew Favre was going to be their guy.
The price for a QB in the draft today seems inherently higher from an asset cost standpoint then back then. The Dolphins trade of their pick at #3 to San Fran netted them Tyreek Hill, Jaylen Waddle, and Bradley Chubb as an example.
It’s not just the higher draft pick, you also want a 4th place schedule. With three games now (instead of two) with uncommon opponents among your division, makes a difference.
Obviously overall winning >>>> losing, it’s taking them a really LONG time to get there, but one can see a light at the end of the tunnel, and at this point, it’s fine for them to lose. A year from now it won’t be.
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Jaguars stink. First time all season that the Lions had all of their wide receivers and Swift healthy.
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Whatever it takes to cope I guess.
To be clear, I understand completely why you are saying what you are saying. I just think at some point, you need to win. I mean, winning is fun! If you trust your front office, they will find talent no matter where they draft. And again, we are only talking about a few spots difference here.
With all due respect, I don't think you do understand. If you did, you wouldn't say "Whatever it takes to cope...".
The losses are exactly what the ownership, management and fans expected and want.
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With all due respect, I don't think you do understand. If you did, you wouldn't say "Whatever it takes to cope...".
The losses are exactly what the ownership, management and fans expected and want.
The Bears ownership doesn’t want to lose to the Packers.
And if the management want them to keep losing, that says a lot about them. But not in a good way.
But I actually don’t think they feel that way. They’re smarter than that.
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c
The Bears ownership doesn’t want to lose to the Packers.
And if the management want them to keep losing, that says a lot about them. But not in a good way.
But I actually don’t think they feel that way. They’re smarter than that.
Right, the Bears are trying to win.
They have 15 rookies on the team and have traded their best players. According to one site the average NFL team consist of 6 rookies.
I don't know, maybe you're a Packers fan who is upset millions of Bears fans are happy with the losses. Not some, not most, every Bears fan I know is more than good with the lose today.
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cRight, the Bears are trying to win.
They have 15 rookies on the team and have traded their best players. According to one site the average NFL team consist of 6 rookies.
I don't know, maybe you're a Packers fan who is upset millions of Bears fans are happy with the losses. Not some, not most, every Bears fan I know is more than good with the lose today.
If you are saying that they are prioritizing player development over winning, I agree with you. But that’s not what you said. You said the ownership and management want them to lose.
Are you saying that they were happy that Fields and Co failed down the stretch? Not a chance.
And I don’t care what the fans think or want. It seemed like those in attendance wanted them to win. 🤷♂️🤷♂️🤷♂️
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Are the bears really going to get good fast enough before they have to start paying Fields real money if he really is that good?
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If you are saying that they are prioritizing player development over winning, I agree with you. But that’s not what you said. You said the ownership and management want them to lose.
Are you saying that they were happy that Fields and Co failed down the stretch? Not a chance.
And I don’t care what the fans think or want. It seemed like those in attendance wanted them to win. 🤷♂️🤷♂️🤷♂️
Fair enough, they are prioritizing player development over winning. They are prioritizing draft capital over winning. They are prioritizing future success over winning. They are prioritizing cap space over winning. Heck, they maybe prioritizing the club's holiday party over winning.
I'll concede, that somewhere in the Bears' list of 100 things to do this season is winning games.
Call it what you want but everyone knows what the Bears are doing.
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Are the bears really going to get good fast enough before they have to start paying Fields real money if he really is that good?
They have him on his rookie deal for three more years after this one...assuming they pick up his option.
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Are the bears really going to get good fast enough before they have to start paying Fields real money if he really is that good?
Tanking in the easy part of the Bears plan (A+ so far); the hard part is still to come. Money will not be an issue for the Bears, spending it well is the real question.
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The Bears ownership doesn’t want to lose to the Packers.
And if the management want them to keep losing, that says a lot about them. But not in a good way.
But I actually don’t think they feel that way. They’re smarter than that.
Management does want them to lose - but just this year. That is exactly why they traded Mack, Quinn, and Roquan.
Maybe ‘want’ isn’t exactly the right word. Maybe ‘ willing to accept’ losing is better.
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Are the bears really going to get good fast enough before they have to start paying Fields real money if he really is that good?
They’re going to have the highest amount of free cap space heading into an offseason that any team has ever had in league history. They have no long term financial commitments of consequence to anyone.
Now whether they use that space wisely is another question entirely and right to question. But they’re positioned great in a few years to pay Fields and add high priced talent along the way.
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Tell me every Bears fan is thrilled with losses. Then go look at the reactions here after they smoked the Patriots or beat the 49ers. They weren't hoping for losses there. They were THRILLED! Even trying to troll Packers fans talking about how they're going to finish last in the NFC North.
If the Bears were just dominated from start to finish in these games, sure you're happy to get a better draft pick. But if I'm thinking Fields is "a dude," I'm not celebrating that he can't sustain a drive (previous games) or throws picks in the last 2 possessions of games they're in position to win. Even if it drops me a couple draft picks (oh no!). If I'm thinking he's "a dude," I'm looking for him to go out and win those games. And I'm jacked up if he does, and disappointed if he's turning the ball over in situations where he can win the game.
But that's just me. It's funny seeing Bears fans being thrilled about losses, while also talking about Shaka building a winning culture.
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Tell me every Bears fan is thrilled with losses. Then go look at the reactions here after they smoked the Patriots or beat the 49ers. They weren't hoping for losses there. They were THRILLED! Even trying to troll Packers fans talking about how they're going to finish last in the NFC North.
If the Bears were just dominated from start to finish in these games, sure you're happy to get a better draft pick. But if I'm thinking Fields is "a dude," I'm not celebrating that he can't sustain a drive (previous games) or throws picks in the last 2 possessions of games they're in position to win. Even if it drops me a couple draft picks (oh no!). If I'm thinking he's "a dude," I'm looking for him to go out and win those games. And I'm jacked up if he does, and disappointed if he's turning the ball over in situations where he can win the game.
But that's just me. It's funny seeing Bears fans being thrilled about losses, while also talking about Shaka building a winning culture.
Exactly.
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Jaguars stink. First time all season that the Lions had all of their wide receivers and Swift healthy.
Loving that the Lions are winning and could sneak into the playoffs and will still end up with a top five pick thanks to the Rams bottoming out.
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Ironies abound.
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Tell me every Bears fan is thrilled with losses. Then go look at the reactions here after they smoked the Patriots or beat the 49ers. They weren't hoping for losses there. They were THRILLED! Even trying to troll Packers fans talking about how they're going to finish last in the NFC North.
If the Bears were just dominated from start to finish in these games, sure you're happy to get a better draft pick. But if I'm thinking Fields is "a dude," I'm not celebrating that he can't sustain a drive (previous games) or throws picks in the last 2 possessions of games they're in position to win. Even if it drops me a couple draft picks (oh no!). If I'm thinking he's "a dude," I'm looking for him to go out and win those games. And I'm jacked up if he does, and disappointed if he's turning the ball over in situations where he can win the game.
But that's just me. It's funny seeing Bears fans being thrilled about losses, while also talking about Shaka building a winning culture.
Lol.
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Lol.
Agreed. There is a lot to laugh about.
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I find it very hard to root for the Panthers to lose, even though they desperately need a franchise QB. I figure they’re plenty good at losing even when they don’t try to do it.
I look at it two ways:
1. If my guys win, OK, I always like to watch a winning performance; if they lose, OK, we get a higher draft pick.
2. It doesn’t matter what I root for, anyway. What’s gonna happen on the field is gonna happen.
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I find it very hard to root for the Panthers to lose, even though they desperately need a franchise QB. I figure they’re plenty good at losing even when they don’t try to do it.
I look at it two ways:
1. If my guys win, OK, I always like to watch a winning performance; if they lose, OK, we get a higher draft pick.
2. It doesn’t matter what I root for, anyway. What’s gonna happen on the field is gonna happen.
And for me if I had a young quarterback who all I cared about was his development, part of what I'd hope he would develop is the ability to close out wins when he has a late lead and the ball.
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You guys are right, I was wrong. Finishing 7-10, with the 15th pick, not making a reasonable educated decision towards my young 1st round picks fifth year option, that’s definitely something I’d rather build on going into 2023.
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And for me if I had a young quarterback who all I cared about was his development, part of what I'd hope he would develop is the ability to close out wins when he has a late lead and the ball.
But that doesn't help you improve the rest of the team, right?
Higher draft capital allows you to do that in the situation where you need significant roster overhaul
Why can't both things happen concurrently?
I just don't understand the rant earlier. Either you have a "dude" and you hope he develops this year and then you build around him with excellent draft standing. Or you determine he doesn't have the ability and you can move on with excellent draft standing.
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But that doesn't help you improve the rest of the team, right?
It’s funny because Green Bay does have a young quarterback that they don’t care to develop.
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You guys are right, I was wrong. Finishing 7-10, with the 15th pick, not making a reasonable educated decision towards my young 1st round picks fifth year option, that’s definitely something I’d rather build on going into 2023.
Don’t lump me in with “you guys.” It doesn’t matter to me what you root for regarding your team, and I totally understand you hoping for better draft position. I was just saying that I, personally, have trouble pulling for losses for my team.
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Don’t lump me in with “you guys.” It doesn’t matter to me what you root for regarding your team, and I totally understand you hoping for better draft position. I was just saying that I, personally, have trouble pulling for losses for my team.
Has anyone "pulled for losses"? Or have people said a loss is fine in the context of a rebuild? And if Fields keeps developing so the franchise doesn't also have to rebuild the QB position, even better.
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Tell me every Bears fan is thrilled with losses. Then go look at the reactions here after they smoked the Patriots or beat the 49ers. They weren't hoping for losses there. They were THRILLED! Even trying to troll Packers fans talking about how they're going to finish last in the NFC North.
If the Bears were just dominated from start to finish in these games, sure you're happy to get a better draft pick. But if I'm thinking Fields is "a dude," I'm not celebrating that he can't sustain a drive (previous games) or throws picks in the last 2 possessions of games they're in position to win. Even if it drops me a couple draft picks (oh no!). If I'm thinking he's "a dude," I'm looking for him to go out and win those games. And I'm jacked up if he does, and disappointed if he's turning the ball over in situations where he can win the game.
But that's just me. It's funny seeing Bears fans being thrilled about losses, while also talking about Shaka building a winning culture.
I think the Bears are in a great position to build something the next 2-4 years. I don't think a few spot differential in draft position and a 4th place schedule matter all that much in whether they succeed in capitlizing on that opportunity. The right QB-1, signing the right guys with all that cap-space and draft picks, and having the right GM/coach/locker-room-dynamic are orders of magnitude more important. See: Detroit Lions. The celebration of losing is bizarre to me. I can understand "oh well, we lost but at least ...." but instead I keep seeing "this is great. it's exactly the plan and what we want.".
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Has anyone "pulled for losses"? Or have people said a loss is fine in the context of a rebuild? And if Fields keeps developing so the franchise doesn't also have to rebuild the QB position, even better.
Considering every time the Bears lose we have a couple Bears fans coming on here saying it’s a “great result,” I’d say it seems Bears fans are pulling for losses. Even when their dude threw picks in back to back possessions with a chance to win a football game.
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I think the Bears are in a great position to build something the next 2-4 years. I don't think a few spot differential in draft position and a 4th place schedule matter all that much in whether they succeed in capitlizing on that opportunity. The right QB-1, signing the right guys with all that cap-space and draft picks, and having the right GM/coach/locker-room-dynamic are orders of magnitude more important. See: Detroit Lions. The celebration of losing is bizarre to me. I can understand "oh well, we lost but at least ...." but instead I keep seeing "this is great. it's exactly the plan and what we want.".
Agreed. And how they lose matters.
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Considering every time the Bears lose we have a couple Bears fans coming on here saying it’s a “great result,” I’d say it seems Bears fans are pulling for losses. Even when their dude threw picks in back to back possessions with a chance to win a football game.
It is a great result for a rebuild.
Again, maybe they decide the "dude" isn't good enough and they can go get another QB in the draft.
Such a weird thing that a knowledgeable sports fan like you can't imagine a scenario where getting as much draft capital as possible (and evaluating the future of the QB position) is good for a rebuild.
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It is a great result for a rebuild.
Again, maybe they decide the "dude" isn't good enough and they can go get another QB in the draft.
Such a weird thing that a knowledgeable sports fan like you can't imagine a scenario where getting as much draft capital as possible (and evaluating the future of the QB position) is good for a rebuild.
I do get that. What I don’t get is celebrating that the guy I claim has shown these incredible strides and is my future upon which I do rebuild throws interceptions in back to back drives with a chance to beat my rival. Because “great result! 4th place schedule and second draft pick!”
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I do get that. What I don’t get is celebrating that the guy I claim has shown these incredible strides and is my future upon which I do rebuild throws interceptions in back to back drives with a chance to beat my rival. Because “great result! 4th place schedule and second draft pick!”
As I've now said multiple times, can't the rebuild potentially include a new QB?
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As I've now said multiple times, can't the rebuild potentially include a new QB?
It can. But if Fields isn’t a dude, your higher draft pick this season really won’t matter much in the long run.
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Has anyone "pulled for losses"? Or have people said a loss is fine in the context of a rebuild? And if Fields keeps developing so the franchise doesn't also have to rebuild the QB position, even better.
I'm not in the room sitting next to Bears fans. Maybe y'all really want to win every single game but just don't express it publicly. I don't know, and it really doesn't matter to me.
All I said was that as a Panthers fan, I'd rather see my team win but I look at a loss (and the improved draft position that goes with it) as an OK consolation prize. Oh, and I also said that it doesn't matter what I root for; if it did we wouldn't have lost that effen SB to Denver!
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Is any Bears fan on here bothered by either interception Fields threw today? St. Brown burns Fields on a bum route, and after getting torched most of the game, Alexander finally makes a play off St. Brown’s laziness. The other pick is in garbage time, bad decision, didn’t change the outcome of the game. If he keeps getting better and learns from it, that’s what any second year QB should do.
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Is any Bears fan on here bothered by either interception Fields threw today? St. Brown burns Fields on a bum route, and after getting torched most of the game, Alexander finally makes a play off St. Brown’s laziness. The other pick is in garbage time, bad decision, didn’t change the outcome of the game. If he keeps getting better and learns from it, that’s what any second year QB should do.
This Packers fan wasn’t bothered with them either. I know I should be because fourth place schedules and higher draft picks were on the line, oh well.
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It can. But if Fields isn’t a dude, your higher draft pick this season really won’t matter much in the long run.
Higher draft picks give you the chance to take a highly rated QB, if you need it.
So, ya, it would help in the long run.
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Higher draft picks give you the chance to take a highly rated QB, if you need it.
So, ya, it would help in the long run.
But the Bears will not be taking a QB in the first round this year.
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This Packers fan wasn’t bothered with them either. I know I should be because fourth place schedules and higher draft picks were on the line, oh well.
Yup, big win today. That 7-10 record is going straight to Guinness.
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As a Bears fan, the outrage of Packer fans about the Bears' strategy makes me more confident in the strategy.
It would really suck if I felt the Bears were trying to be good, possibly SuperBowl good and were 5-8. That would be a nightmare.
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Having a top 4 pick in a strong qb year can equate to much more overall traded draft capital if teams are willing to bite hard for their guy. Weirdly obsessed with an opposing fan base’s buy in to a strategy though. I suppose the mediocrity I'm numb to is new and scary to others.
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As a Bears fan, the outrage of Packer fans about the Bears' strategy makes me more confident in the strategy.
It would really suck if I felt the Bears were trying to be good, possibly SuperBowl good and were 5-8. That would be a nightmare.
I mostly agree, but the jury is still out on Fields. Running QBs do not win SBs and Justin hasn’t impressed as a passer. Better WRs will help, but he has to get a lot better.
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As a Bears fan, the outrage of Packer fans about the Bears' strategy makes me more confident in the strategy.
It would really suck if I felt the Bears were trying to be good, possibly SuperBowl good and were 5-8. That would be a nightmare.
Again the Bears aren’t trying to lose games. They are trying to win them. They are obviously doing so while going young, saving cap space and seeing what their young QB can do.
But they wanted Fields to complete the comeback. Most of the fans did too. At least the ones at the stadium seemed to. Didn’t hear many fans cheering the loss.
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But the Bears will not be taking a QB in the first round this year.
If they don't believe in fields, why not?
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Glad Bears fans are very confident in what the Bears are doing because of how Packers fans are responding to it. In the 33 years of my life I’ve felt almost exactly the same about the Bears as I do now, but maybe this year it’s different!
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Yup, big win today. That 7-10 record is going straight to Guinness.
I would rather finish 7-10 and beat the Bears yesterday than finish 6-11 and gain a few spots in the draft.
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Bears Fans: Expect your ownership to be reluctant to spend any discretionary money on this team until Arlington Heights is ready for competitive play. I think there will be too many distractions and too much need for non-football related expenditures. Bear Down for a rough ride for at least four more years.
Packers Fans: Your ownership made a horrible decision on Aaron Rodgers. Sorry, they did. He's a great football player but you are now saddled with Rodgers for at least another year and maybe two. If Jordan Love is the real thing, he's be the real thing for someone else. That, in turn, means the Packers have an almost guaranteed period of Randy Wright-era quarterbacking. If Love isn't the real thing, the Packers wasted a draft choice that could have helped them this year!
At the beginning of the 2022 season, I predicted the Bears wouldn't win more than three games. That was a big reason why I gave my season tickets up, rather than using some of them and parceling the rest out. Wow, the Bears are doing their damdest to make that happen.
The Packers, meanwhile, are a complete mystery. How could the coaches and front office miss this badly?
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Having a top 4 pick in a strong qb year can equate to much more overall traded draft capital if teams are willing to bite hard for their guy. Weirdly obsessed with an opposing fan base’s buy in to a strategy though. I suppose the mediocrity I'm numb to is new and scary to others.
It's not a strong QB year. Bryce Young ought to be a lock for #1 to Houston, but after that there are big questions about Stroud and even bigger questions about Levis. They'll both get drafted too high, but I don't see any team mortgaging the future to move up a few spots for them.
As for the Bears, no, they're not trying to lose. Nobody in the NFL tries to lose. They'll accept losses as part of the rebuilding process, and are happy to deal older players and expiring contracts as part of that process, but that's not the same as trying to lose. If they were trying to lose, Fields would not have played yesterday.
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It's not a strong QB year. Bryce Young ought to be a lock for #1 to Houston, but after that there are big questions about Stroud and even bigger questions about Levis. They'll both get drafted too high, but I don't see any team mortgaging the future to move up a few spots for them.
As for the Bears, no, they're not trying to lose. Nobody in the NFL tries to lose. They'll accept losses as part of the rebuilding process, and are happy to deal older players and expiring contracts as part of that process, but that's not the same as trying to lose. If they were trying to lose, Fields would not have played yesterday.
Exactly.
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In other news, that Washington/Giants tie was a buzzkill for Detroit. Lions having beaten both teams now get hosed if all three teams finish with 9 wins.
That Vikings/Lions line certainly is very interesting this Sunday.
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It's not a strong QB year. Bryce Young ought to be a lock for #1 to Houston, but after that there are big questions about Stroud and even bigger questions about Levis. They'll both get drafted too high, but I don't see any team mortgaging the future to move up a few spots for them.
This is the NFL. I’ll be shocked if both Stroud and Levis aren’t top 5. I agree with you that they aren’t worthy, but that isn’t a factor when it comes to drafting QBs.
A few years ago, no one could have seen a team mortgaging their future for Mitch.
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This is the NFL. I’ll be shocked if both Stroud and Levis aren’t top 5. I agree with you that they aren’t worthy, but that isn’t a factor when it comes to drafting QBs.
A few years ago, no one could have seen a team mortgaging their future for Mitch.
Two 3rd round picks and a 4th is not mortgaging the future. Anyway the issue was selecting Mitch, not the trade.
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Nobody in the NFL tries to lose.
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQa9G-uDsKQUALsCqHTzzPQATdBrQSgcS16dA&usqp=CAU)
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Two 3rd round picks and a 4th is not mortgaging the future. Anyway the issue was selecting Mitch, not the trade.
Don’t forget to add the 1st rounder that they wasted on a stiff like Mitch. Which led to using more picks to make up for that debacle (Mack and Fields).
Added together, that’s a pretty big mortgage.
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I never suggested the Bears were trying to lose. I said they were not going to do everything they possibly could to win.
I stand by that. This team has been too miserable for too long to do anything else. It’s the difference between neglectful and negligent. The Bears are the former.
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Don’t forget to add the 1st rounder that they wasted on a stiff like Mitch. Which led to using more picks to make up for that debacle (Mack and Fields).
Added together, that’s a pretty big mortgage.
I agree with this, they paid a premium price to trade up to take Mitch.
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Bears fans are really feeling themselves.
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For the record, I never said the Bears players or coaches are trying to lose. They are giving 100% effort to win. I'm sure they are disappointed in the record.
Ownership and management are not prioritizing winning. I don't think they are upset at all with the record.
My experience with fans I know is every one of them is hoping they Bears get the highest draft choice possible. They are A-OK with the record.
I have not seen any press bashing the Bears for the plan in place. If anything I have heard praise for them going young, developing players like Fields, freeing up cap space and giving up on a season that was never going to amount to much anyway. I don't consume a lot of NFL press so maybe there is condemnation of the Bears plan, I just have not seen or heard it.
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For the record, I never said the Bears players or coaches are trying to lose. They are giving 100% effort to win. I'm sure they are disappointed in the record.
Ownership and management are not prioritizing winning. I don't think they are upset at all with the record.
My experience with fans I know is every one of them is hoping they Bears get the highest draft choice possible. They are A-OK with the record.
I have not seen any press bashing the Bears for the plan in place. If anything I have heard praise for them going young, developing players like Fields, freeing up cap space and giving up on a season that was never going to amount to much anyway. I don't consume a lot of NFL press so maybe there is condemnation of the Bears plan, I just have not seen or heard it.
I've heard that the Bears are planning to put up a cardboard cutout of Virginia McCaskey in the locker room, a la Major League, next year.
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Higher draft picks give you the chance to take a highly rated QB, if you need it.
So, ya, it would help in the long run.
Has any team in recent memory been unable to take a highly rated QB because they won a game?
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Has any team in recent memory been unable to take a highly rated QB because they won a game?
Jets lost Trevor Lawrence by beating the Rams n 2020 in week 15.
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Has any team in recent memory been unable to take a highly rated QB because they won a game?
Not recent memory, but the ‘97 Bears started 1-10. They won 3 of their final 5 games that season and ended up with the fifth pick.
Had they lost one more game, they’d have tied the Colts for worst record, and would have had the same strength of schedule as the Colts.
Top pick that year was Peyton Manning. Bears took Curtis Enis (Charles Woodson went one pick before Enis).
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It's not a strong QB year. Bryce Young ought to be a lock for #1 to Houston, but after that there are big questions about Stroud and even bigger questions about Levis. They'll both get drafted too high, but I don't see any team mortgaging the future to move up a few spots for them.
As for the Bears, no, they're not trying to lose. Nobody in the NFL tries to lose. They'll accept losses as part of the rebuilding process, and are happy to deal older players and expiring contracts as part of that process, but that's not the same as trying to lose. If they were trying to lose, Fields would not have played yesterday.
I mean, there’s potentially 4 QBs in the top 10 vs last years first one taken at #20. YOY it’s far stronger
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Has any team in recent memory been unable to take a highly rated QB because they won a game?
What am I missing about this "winning one game" narrative? The Bears have positioned the team to lose lots of games and end up with a high draft choices. I agree losing 13 or 14 games is not a huge difference but losing 10 would be a material change in daft capital.
For the Bears, every loss helps...... so from Bears fans we say "thank you Aaron Rodgers".
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I mean, there’s potentially 4 QBs in the top 10 vs last years first one taken at #20. YOY it’s far stronger
I'd be surprised to see more than two QBs in the top 10, though I suppose there's a chance someone falls in love with Richardson's tools.
Anyhow, my larger point is that none of these guys, outside Young, are likely to entice a QB-needy team like the Panthers or Colts give up multiple firsts-plus to move up into the top 5 for. They're more likely to wait and see who falls to them. Of course, crazier and dumber things have happened (see: 49ers giving 3 firsts for Trey Lance), but I just don't see these guys generating that hype.
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Not recent memory, but the ‘97 Bears started 1-10. They won 3 of their final 5 games that season and ended up with the fifth pick.
Had they lost one more game, they’d have tied the Colts for worst record, and would have had the same strength of schedule as the Colts.
Top pick that year was Peyton Manning. Bears took Curtis Enis (Charles Woodson went one pick before Enis).
I remember that, Dish. Wannstedt was totally trying to lose to St. Louis in the next-to-last week but the Rams also wanted to lose, it was a complete shyteshow, and the Bears ended up somehow winning 13-10.
IIRC, even if they had finished 3-13, they would have lost the tiebreaker to the Colts for the #1 pick. But that was seen as OK back then because all the experts were high on Ryan Leaf.
Also IIRC, a meaningless next-to-last game win over Washington in 2020 cost the Panthers a top-3 pick.
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Jets lost Trevor Lawrence by beating the Rams n 2020 in week 15.
Did it stop them from taking a highly rated QB?
They still had their choice among four others.
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Not recent memory, but the ‘97 Bears started 1-10. They won 3 of their final 5 games that season and ended up with the fifth pick.
Had they lost one more game, they’d have tied the Colts for worst record, and would have had the same strength of schedule as the Colts.
Top pick that year was Peyton Manning. Bears took Curtis Enis (Charles Woodson went one pick before Enis).
They'd have taken Leaf.
Look, I chose my words intentionally. I never asked whether a team never lost out on a particular player by winning an extra game. I asked whether they missed on a chance to draft a highly ranked QB.
There was nothing preventing the Bears from trading up (like the Chargers did) that year for Leaf.
I'm sure if we try hard enough we can find an instance where it's happened. But the fact we have to try hard illustrates it's pretty rare.
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For the record, I never said the Bears players or coaches are trying to lose. They are giving 100% effort to win. I'm sure they are disappointed in the record.
You said they want to lose.
The losses are exactly what the ownership, management and fans expected and want.
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Has any team in recent memory been unable to take a highly rated QB because they won a game?
Packers lost out on Troy Aikman because they won the last week in Phoenix. They picked Tony Mandarich #2 over Barry Sanders, Derrick Thomas and Deion Sanders.
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I'd be surprised to see more than two QBs in the top 10, though I suppose there's a chance someone falls in love with Richardson's tools.
Anyhow, my larger point is that none of these guys, outside Young, are likely to entice a QB-needy team like the Panthers or Colts give up multiple firsts-plus to move up into the top 5 for. They're more likely to wait and see who falls to them. Of course, crazier and dumber things have happened (see: 49ers giving 3 firsts for Trey Lance), but I just don't see these guys generating that hype.
The hype season is just about to start though. Let's revisit in late March.
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Packers lost out on Troy Aikman because they won the last week in Phoenix. They picked Tony Mandarich #2 over Barry Sanders, Derrick Thomas and Deion Sanders.
That's close to a great example, but the Cowboys had the lower strength of schedule that year, so they'd have won the tiebreaker and still gotten Aikman.
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That's close to a great example, but the Cowboys had the lower strength of schedule that year, so they'd have won the tiebreaker and still gotten Aikman.
I think they only had the lower SOS because the Packers beat the Cardinals.
https://www.yahoo.com/video/what-if-the-packers-had-tanked-properly-and-drafted-troy-aikman-232442085.html
"The 1988 Packers were very good at losing. They were 2-12 after 14 games. Had they lost either of their last two games, they’d have had the top pick in the 1989 NFL draft. Aikman was the Packers’ preferred choice."
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U guys gonna be cheering for the NFC North’s leader in the playoffs, hey??
We keep pulling it out (paws)
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You said they want to lose.
Exactly.
Players and coaches want to win. 100% effort to win every game.
Ownership and management want to and expect to lose.
I'm not sure where this is being lost on people. The Bears have not reinvented the wheel here. The Astros and 76ers have played this same strategy.
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Ownership and management want to and expect to lose.
Yeah, I just don't think this is the case at all. Are you seriously suggesting that Virginia wants to lose?
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Yeah, I just don't think this is the case at all. Are you seriously suggesting that Virginia wants to lose?
White Trash may be overstating it, but this team was built to tank by the GM. And, no, Virginia doesn't want to lose to GB.
But, Poles' had 4 goals this season. Get the cap where he wanted it. Improve draft position. Find out if Fields was THE guy going forward. Find out if there are any other players worthy of being there when they are ready to contend (going into this year, only Jalen Johnson was in that group).
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Yeah, I just don't think this is the case at all. Are you seriously suggesting that Virginia wants to lose?
I don't know if Virginia knows what she wants for breakfast these days. She is a dear old woman who loves the Bears but I don't think she has a firm grasp on what is happening. I believe she turned over control and decision making years ago.
Regardless, it is simple logic to conclude the Bears ownership wants to lose. The McCaskeys and Ryans and other owners would have fired the entire front office after replacing 30 players, putting 15 rookies on the team and traded the best players if they wanted to simply win as many games as possible this year.
I suppose if your theory is that the Bears owners have lost complete control of their franchise, then you could argue that ownership doesn't want to lose. You would be correct ......... and the greatest story/scandal in the history of professional sports is occurring right before our eyes.
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White Trash may be overstating it, but this team was built to tank by the GM. And, no, Virginia doesn't want to lose to GB.
But, Poles' had 4 goals this season. Get the cap where he wanted it. Improve draft position. Find out if Fields was THE guy going forward. Find out if there are any other players worthy of being there when they are ready to contend (going into this year, only Jalen Johnson was in that group).
I agree with all of this.
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Yeah, I just don't think this is the case at all. Are you seriously suggesting that Virginia wants to lose?
No. However, when the plan was to have Equanimeous St. Brown be one of the team's leaders in snaps at the WR position, you can't really say that management is looking to win either. Jaire Alexander is right, he's a scrub.
I think its ok to say that Bears management is not actively rooting for the team to lose, while accepting that's the likely outcome and they are ok with it given the plan they put into place.
Whether that plan has merit or not is another debate.
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Let me put it this way, the Bears don't want to lose like I don't want a ticket as I drive 150 mph through a school zone while drinking a beer and being chased by the cops.
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Let me put it this way, the Bears don't want to lose like I don't want a ticket as I drive 150 mph through a school zone while drinking a beer and being chased by the cops.
Would you come on here and scream about a "great result!" every time you got a ticket, though?
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I agree with all of this.
You agree at "the Bears are built to tank" but you think they don't want to lose???
I guess I have a different definition of "tank" than you. Maybe that is why we can't agree.
Here is what Iowa Law Review says: "In a broad sense, “tanking” is a term used to describe when sports teams lose games on purpose to secure some sort of future competitive advantage."
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Would you come on here and scream about a "great result!" every time you got a ticket, though?
I'm sorry the analogy was lost on you.
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You agree at "the Bears are built to tank" but you think they don't want to lose???
I guess I have a different definition of "tank" than you. Maybe that is why we can't agree.
Here is what Iowa Law Review says: "In a broad sense, “tanking” is a term used to describe when sports teams lose games on purpose to secure some sort of future competitive advantage."
There is a difference between Poles tanking for this year and Virginia wanting to lose.
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All this Bears rebuild talk, it is the Lions that are the far more interesting team. They are vastly head of the Bears in the rebuild department, with more draft assets in the short-term as well.
While the Bears OL sucks, the Lions have one of the league's better units.
Hutchinson is a difference maker at DE, with true star potential. The Bears don't have even one league average starter on their current DL.
The Lions have the St. Brown who is actually good and an exciting prospect with a boatload of talent in Jameson Williams. The Bears have Mooney who is decent and enigmatic Chase Claypool.
The Bears currently have the 2nd pick, but thanks to the Stafford trade, the Lions have the 3rd selection. Do the Rams win another game this season? Plus, the Lions have their own 1st round pick and two 2nd round selections. Now, that's a ton of draft capital.
Of course, the question mark is the QB position and Goff. But, Lions might have the draft capital to perhaps entice Houston to get Young. Or, continue to draft talented guys. Imagine Jalen Carter or Will Andersen on that line with Hutchinson.
The NFC is weak. I don't see that changing anytime soon. With talent around him, Goff has shown the ability to have playoff success. The Lions are the team to watch in 2023.
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You agree at "the Bears are built to tank" but you think they don't want to lose???
I guess I have a different definition of "tank" than you. Maybe that is why we can't agree.
Here is what Iowa Law Review says: "In a broad sense, “tanking” is a term used to describe when sports teams lose games on purpose to secure some sort of future competitive advantage."
If this team went 15-2 it would be a failed season in your eyes I guess.
There is a difference between Poles tanking for this year and Virginia wanting to lose.
Yep.
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If this team went 15-2 it would be a failed season in your eyes I guess.
And with that, I rest my case.
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You agree at "the Bears are built to tank" but you think they don't want to lose???
I guess I have a different definition of "tank" than you. Maybe that is why we can't agree.
Here is what Iowa Law Review says: "In a broad sense, “tanking” is a term used to describe when sports teams lose games on purpose to secure some sort of future competitive advantage."
If you honestly believe the Bears are losing on purpose, why was Fields playing yesterday? The Bears had plausible deniability for sitting him, and it's pretty clear that Nathan Peterman or Tim Boyle behind center would have greatly enhanced the chances of a loss.
Weird way to try to lose.
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Starting to wonder if teams knew what they were doing when they passed on Byron Leftwich.
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Mark Ingram should be waived before the plane leaves the tarmac back to New Orleans. That play cost the Saints the game.
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Mark Ingram should be waived before the plane leaves the tarmac back to New Orleans. That play cost the Saints the game.
Great result for them!
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Great result for them!
Great result for the Eagles, who own New Orleans' first pick.
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Mark Ingram should be waived before the plane leaves the tarmac back to New Orleans. That play cost the Saints the game.
In fairness, he was hurt and shouldn't have been in the game.
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Great result for them!
This doesn’t make any sense, they don’t own their draft pick.
I see how you’re trying to be cute here. Swing and a miss, down on strikes.
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In fairness, he was hurt and shouldn't have been in the game.
Also, if only the Saints had a RB on their roster who is usually among league leaders in RB receptions.
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This doesn’t make any sense, they don’t own their draft pick.
I see how you’re trying to be cute here. Swing and a miss, down on strikes.
Standings only affect where you draft in the first round? Thought you said early second round picks are the most valuable draft capital you can get.
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Standings only affect where you draft in the first round? Thought you said early second round picks are the most valuable draft capital you can get.
I actually respect that you completely whiffed in remembering the Saints didn’t own their first round pick and tried to save face here.
Yes, I’ve said and believe if a team collects as many second round picks as possible, it’s a competitive advantage to roster build and cap build. So I guess great result for the Saints? I’m not sure why that take lives rent free in some people’s heads around here.
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If you honestly believe the Bears are losing on purpose, why was Fields playing yesterday? The Bears had plausible deniability for sitting him, and it's pretty clear that Nathan Peterman or Tim Boyle behind center would have greatly enhanced the chances of a loss.
Weird way to try to lose.
Yes, I honestly believe the Bears are trying to lose. Me and 99% of NFL fans and the media believe that. Congrats on being contrarian.
Also, if you read the previous post here, the Bears are trying to evaluate talent for the future including Fields who most people don't think is an all-pro player at this point and needs reps, lots of reps, for his own growth and for management to decide if he is the future QB of the Bears.
Maybe you should address Sultan who agreed that the Bears are tanking. Maybe he can persuade you that the Bears are not trying to win.
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I actually respect that you completely whiffed in remembering the Saints didn’t own their first round pick and tried to save face here.
Yes, I’ve said and believe if a team collects as many second round picks as possible, it’s a competitive advantage to roster build and cap build. So I guess great result for the Saints? I’m not sure why that take lives rent free in some people’s heads around here.
Whiffed on what? You admit that early second round picks are the most valuable picks you can obtain, and the Saints picks just got better by losing last night.
The Bears have "great results" every time they lose, but a different non contender should cut a guy for helping them lose a game? Seems like some odd logic.
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The Bears are not trying to lose on purpose, to think otherwise is silly.
Their roster overall is poor, they traded away defensive assets, and the roster got worse. Ownership absolutely wants to win each game, but the front office understands that if the by product of each game happens to be a loss, it’s long term beneficial to them.
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Yes, I honestly believe the Bears are trying to lose. Me and 99% of NFL fans and the media believe that. Congrats on being contrarian.
There is no dumber argument than the one in which someone makes the impossible to prove claim that "everyone agrees with me."
By the way, does Justin Fields know he's trying to lose?
"Nobody has that mindset on our team," quarterback Justin Fields said. "Everybody on the team, including the coaches, we want to win games. We want to every game. So nobody's waving the white flag."
https://www.si.com/nfl/bears/news/justin-fields-says-nobodys-waving-the-white-flag
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Lots of talking past each other here - which happens often in Scoopdom.
As an organization, the Bears clearly did not prioritize winning this season, especially once it became obvious that winning wasn't gonna happen. They traded good players, they have promoted young players who otherwise might not have played, they are pretty obviously more interested in building draft capital and increasing salary-cap space.
But coaches and players are not wired to think about anything other than winning. Players and coaches aren't going into any game asking, "How do we lose today?"
Players and coaches on teams that have operated as the Bears have this season do not need to try to lose. It just happens because of the talent and/or experience disparity compared to the teams they are playing.
And I like to think that most of the people involved in all the discussion know all of this.
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Lots of talking past each other here - which happens often in Scoopdom.
As an organization, the Bears clearly did not prioritize winning this season, especially once it became obvious that winning wasn't gonna happen. They traded good players, they have promoted young players who otherwise might not have played, they are pretty obviously more interested in building draft capital and increasing salary-cap space.
But coaches and players are not wired to think about anything other than winning. Players and coaches aren't going into any game asking, "How do we lose today?"
Players and coaches on teams that have operated as the Bears have this season do not need to try to lose. It just happens because of the talent and/or experience disparity compared to the teams they are playing.
And I like to think that most of the people involved in all the discussion know all of this.
You give people here too much credit.
Some cannot understand the difference between the front office looking to the future (cap space and draft assets) and the players and coaches trying to win every time they step on the field in the present.
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Lots of talking past each other here - which happens often in Scoopdom.
As an organization, the Bears clearly did not prioritize winning this season, especially once it became obvious that winning wasn't gonna happen. They traded good players, they have promoted young players who otherwise might not have played, they are pretty obviously more interested in building draft capital and increasing salary-cap space.
But coaches and players are not wired to think about anything other than winning. Players and coaches aren't going into any game asking, "How do we lose today?"
Players and coaches on teams that have operated as the Bears have this season do not need to try to lose. It just happens because of the talent and/or experience disparity compared to the teams they are playing.
And I like to think that most of the people involved in all the discussion know all of this.
Actually, several of us have made the distinction between a front-office that is prioritizing the rebuilding process over short-term success vs. the team, which is trying to win every time they take the field.
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Actually, several of us have made the distinction between a front-office that is prioritizing the rebuilding process over short-term success vs. the team, which is trying to win every time they take the field.
100% agree. I have said multiple times the players and coaches are giving 100% to win every game and are disappointed in the record.
The quote above from Justin Fields proves my point.
What I don't understand is how a somewhat common strategy of tanking / losing games for the long term benefit of a team, and the fact that the fans like it and understand the benefits of it, is so difficult to understand.
This seems like a win/win scenario: Packers win = happy GB fans; Bears lose = happy Chicago fans.
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Packers have won 8 straight against the Bears? Extremely short sited. Why win games against your rival when it’s helping them improve their draft stock and hurts your own?
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Maxx Crosby has been held about a million times tonight.
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What a horrific loss.
Raiders jump offside twice on the first Rams TD drive (once on 4th down). The Raiders then have 3rd & 1, don’t make it, and then punt on 4th down.
Huge sack on final drive that probably does in the Rams, and Tillery with the worst penalty you’ll ever see, not only gives LA a free first down, but stops the clock.
Complete meltdown, absolutely Raider like.
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What a horrific loss.
Raiders jump offside twice on the first Rams TD drive (once on 4th down). The Raiders then have 3rd & 1, don’t make it, and then punt on 4th down.
Huge sack on final drive that probably does in the Rams, and Tillery with the worst penalty you’ll ever see, not only gives LA a free first down, but stops the clock.
Complete meltdown, absolutely Raider like.
Great result!
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Great result!
Rent free baby, rent free!
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Mitch Trubisky … just doing Mitch Trubisky things.
Edit: And then doing them again!
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Lions find their new tight end.
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Too funny. Nobody went with him.
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Bucs will make the playoffs cause the South is terrible, but they are bad. I would stay away from Brady when he tries to get out of town next year.
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The fat lady sang, went home, and is resting comfortably.
It’s time to put the stone on Brady’s grave.
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Brandon Staley stinks.
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Are we sure Tua is ok? He’s been like really really bad the last two weeks. He can’t throw with any accuracy, he has the yips or something.
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Bucs will make the playoffs cause the South is terrible, but they are bad. I would stay away from Brady when he tries to get out of town next year.
If the Panthers win out, which would include their second win of the season over TB, they'd win the South. Not that I expect them to win out ... but I don't expect the Bucs to do it, either.
All one needs to know about how putrid the division is ... is that the Panthers are playing by far the best of the 4 teams.
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If the Panthers win out, which would include their second win of the season over TB, they'd win the South. Not that I expect them to win out ... but I don't expect the Bucs to do it, either.
All one needs to know about how putrid the division is ... is that the Panthers are playing by far the best of the 4 teams.
Who woulda ever thunk that Darnold may be the best QB in the division?
That should just be a snarky throwaway line, but it might actually be true.
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Stat just shown on Sportscenter:
There have been more than 250 teams in NFL history to have won 10 of their first 13 games. These Vikings are the only one to have been outscored on the season.
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9 one possession wins. 3 double digit losses. Good for them. Detroit has six one possession losses. Therefore, Minnesota has the record they do and Detroit has the record they do.
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9 one possession wins. 3 double digit losses. Good for them. Detroit has six one possession losses. Therefore, Minnesota has the record they do and Detroit has the record they do.
Yessir. I wasn't trying to say the Vikings didn't deserve to be in first place or anything. I just thought it was an interesting stat.
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Anybody adding Sewell to their fantasy rosters?
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Anybody adding Sewell to their fantasy rosters?
To reset the old adage about Chris Carter - He only gets 1st downs.
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Weather is going to suck on the road for Detroit 3 out of their last 4. (New Jersey, Chicago, Green Bay) Can Goff hit his receivers in the cold/wind/snow? Will the defense be able to hold up if a team commits to grinding it out up the middle? Will the fact that it is the Lions mean that there will be some inexplicable letdown?
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Weather is going to suck on the road for Detroit 3 out of their last 4. (New Jersey, Chicago, Green Bay) Can Goff hit his receivers in the cold/wind/snow? Will the defense be able to hold up if a team commits to grinding it out up the middle? Will the fact that it is the Lions mean that there will be some inexplicable letdown?
Bears are at Detroit.
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Mea Culpa. Bears in Detroit. At Carolina.
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Now they want to eject players for roughing the passer.
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/nfl-considering-ejections-roughing-the-passer-penalties-report
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Now they want to eject players for roughing the passer.
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/nfl-considering-ejections-roughing-the-passer-penalties-report
Yeah, the article you posted brought it up as a hypothetical. But I do agree with the article that some of this should be video assisted because there have been bad calls both ways this season.
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Now they want to eject players for roughing the passer.
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/nfl-considering-ejections-roughing-the-passer-penalties-report
So if you look in the general direction of Brady or Rodgers, your ejected?
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So if you look in the general direction of Brady or Rodgers, your ejected?
You are ejected if you line up against those 2.
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So if you look in the general direction of Brady or Rodgers, your ejected?
Defenders assumed that was already the case.
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Now they want to eject players for roughing the passer.
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/nfl-considering-ejections-roughing-the-passer-penalties-report
$$$$$. Star QBs = high ratings. High ratings = bigger contracts with the networks.
That is why they protect them.
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This Cardinals story is incredible.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/12/17/some-are-trying-to-suggest-the-sean-kugler-mistaken-identity-claim-is-a-reference-to-steve-keim/
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The Cardinal way.
Too easy.
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I think they’re saying “boourns” in Minneapolis.
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I think they’re saying “boourns” in Minneapolis.
Lions are the best team in the NFC North
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Nope. The records are what they are for a reason. The Lions are hot right now. The Vikings are the better team.
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Nope. The records are what they are for a reason. The Lions are hot right now. The Vikings are the better team.
Disagree
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Vikings may be a bit better, but they are the biggest fraud team in the NFL in a long time. Would not be surprised to see them finish with 6 losses.
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Is this a local broadcast team they hired? The color commentator is openly rooting for the Vikings.
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Playing at home and finding a way to fall behind the Colts by 1,000 points at halftime is pretty damn impressive.
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That unnecessary roughness call against the colts was a worse call than most roughing the passers.
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Not allowed to tackle Justin Jefferson anymore?
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vikings just got major hosed-that was clearly a fumble and a touchdown. i have never seen a whistle that quick this year when bringing down a runner
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that crew just cost themselves a trip to the playoffs
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I didn't see the game, but nice comeback by the Vikings. Falling behind a horrible team by 1,000 points was almost impossible ... but so was coming back from that deficit. Good on them.
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I didn't see the game, but nice comeback by the Vikings. Falling behind a horrible team by 1,000 points was almost impossible ... but so was coming back from that deficit. Good on them.
So, it was a weird 33-0 deficit. Like, a good team would have been up 45-0 or more. The Vikings gave up a punt block TD, int return TD and twice stopped on 4th and 1 in their own territory around the 30.
Indy still had a chance to salt it away late but instead of just running to run clock, threw some passes. The Vikings lost two fumble return TDs on bad calls, too.
Basically, if a team was going to overcome a 33-point halftime deficit, this was probably the game to do it
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The Panthers have been running the ball like crazy the last few weeks, and sometimes they use an offensive package featuring 8 linemen -- including at both TE spots and 325-pound Cade Mays at fullback.
They call it their Arby's package.
I'm not making that up.
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The Panthers have been running the ball like crazy the last few weeks, and sometimes they use an offensive package featuring 8 linemen -- including at both TE spots and 325 Cade Mays at fullback.
They call it their Arby's package.
I'm not making that up.
I watched the end of their game against the Seahawks and Seattle couldn’t stop them at all.
Modern football is so slanted to the passing game, defenses have spent years figuring out ways to counter that. There is probably something to outmuscling teams as defenses focus more on speed and rushing the passer. Not saying the game will tilt back to running the ball first but there is probably a place to try it
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They call it their Arby's package.
I'm not making that up.
As usual, Scoop was before it's time.
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The Panthers have been running the ball like crazy the last few weeks, and sometimes they use an offensive package featuring 8 linemen -- including at both TE spots and 325-pound Cade Mays at fullback.
They call it their Arby's package.
I'm not making that up.
But have any of them caught a pass with the game on the line?
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But have any of them caught a pass with the game on the line?
Yeah, that was a great play by your guy!
If both our teams win today, it sets up a huge game between them next weekend. Big wager coming up, tower!
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If the Lions win, you have to give me a chipping lesson. If the Panthers win, I give you a chipping lesson.
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Vikings may be a bit better, but they are the biggest fraud team in the NFL in a long time. Would not be surprised to see them finish with 6 losses.
Agree. They're 10-0 in one possession games. That's incredibly lucky.
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Or mentally tough. You can look at a bunch of stats that show that the Vikings are not as good as their record. But in the end, they have found a way. The current fashionably hot team, Detroit, has lost 5 games by one possession. Minnesota has found ways to win. The Lions, as usual, have found ways to lose.
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Or mentally tough. You can look at a bunch of stats that show that the Vikings are not as good as their record. But in the end, they have found a way. The current fashionably hot team, Detroit, has lost 5 games by one possession. Minnesota has found ways to win. The Lions, as usual, have found ways to lose.
Damn dude, you sound like you have battered wife syndrome.
Lions are actually good.
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If the Lions win, you have to give me a chipping lesson. If the Panthers win, I give you a chipping lesson.
If I give you a chipping lesson, you will never be able to unsee that. You'd probably swear off golf forever!!!
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Teams that “find a way to win” during the regular season, tend not to win in the playoffs.
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Bill Parcells says "you are who your record says you are". He knows something about pro football. Maybe not as much as Scoopers, but are decent source of football knowledge.
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Damn dude, you sound like you have battered wife syndrome.
Lions are actually good.
They are. But they built too deep a hole early in the year. Injuries. The margin for error doesn't exist. Like Villanova or Creighton, they hurt themselves too much early and now have to run the table and hope for help.
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If I give you a chipping lesson, you will never be able to unsee that. You'd probably swear off golf forever!!!
Oh, yeah?!?!?! Fine, we'll give the chipping lesson to charity!
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They are. But they built too deep a hole early in the year. Injuries. The margin for error doesn't exist. Like Villanova or Creighton, they hurt themselves too much early and now have to run the table and hope for help.
Ant they are still the Lions
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Minnesotan here, I have zero doubt the Vikings are the worst 11 win team in the history of the NFL. I have zero doubt their post-season will end in a loss and have nothing to show for a season for the 62nd time.
They have/will set an NFL record for luck and perhaps entertainment value.
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Lions fan... at least you have gone to Super Bowls.
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Lions fan... at least you have gone to Super Bowls.
Yeah, but they're Charlie Brown.
*yoink*
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Holy cow Fields. (bears need a kicker)
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Looks like the Bears march to greatness is going to continue with another loss. The 4-13 dream lives!!!
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Looks like the Bears march to greatness is going to continue with another loss. The 4-13 dream lives!!!
Whoop! Whoop!!! ;D
I see win #4 vs the Vikings' 3rd string to finish the season.
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Looks like the Bears march to greatness is going to continue with another loss. The 4-13 dream lives!!!
And, as of now, Fields has thrown for more yards than he’s rushed for! (An extra 3 of them.) Maybe he’ll break the century mark on the game.
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And, as of now, Fields has thrown for more yards than he’s rushed for! (An extra 3 of them.) Maybe he’ll break the century mark on the game.
Reps for Fields - Check
Stay Healthy - Check
Lose Game - Check
Passing grade for Bears today.
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That Pokes/Jags game was wild.
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Reps for Fields - Check
Stay Healthy - Check
Lose Game - Check
Passing grade for Bears today.
Lol. Still can’t believe Bears fans think this is progress.
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Hurts RTG - 65
Fields RTG - 119
Considering the intentional lack of talent on the Bears, they have been some what competitive. (I'm not saying they are like 10-15 plays from being a .500 team, but they are not embarrassing)
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but they are not embarrassing
There’s a rallying cry.
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Looks like the Bears march to greatness is going to continue with another loss. The 4-13 dream lives!!!
Except for the injuries, ideal outcome. Competitive the whole way, a loss, and one more week down.
I say this because it’s true, you (Sultan) are smart enough to know the worst thing you can be in pro sports is in purgatory hell as a barely under .500 to barely over .500 team. There’s absolutely no point whatsoever for the Bears to win a single game from here on out.
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Except for the injuries, ideal outcome. Competitive the whole way, a loss, and one more week down.
I say this because it’s true, you (Sultan) are smart enough to know the worst thing you can be in pro sports is in purgatory hell as a barely under .500 to barely over .500 team. There’s absolutely no point whatsoever for the Bears to win a single game from here on out.
The NBA? Yep. The NFL? Not really.
Philadelphia was 9-8 last year. Minnesota was 8-9. They are probably the two top seeds in the NFC this year.
You don't think teams like Detroit believe that going from 3-13-1 to near .500 (and possibly a playoff birth) is a sign of progress? Do you think they are regretting winning these games because they may have a 2nd place schedule and lower draft picks next year? Not a chance.
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The NBA? Yep. The NFL? Not really.
Philadelphia was 9-8 last year. Minnesota was 8-9. They are probably the two top seeds in the NFC this year.
You don't think teams like Detroit believe that going from 3-13-1 to near .500 (and possibly a playoff birth) is a sign of progress? Do you think they are regretting winning these games because they may have a 2nd place schedule and lower draft picks next year? Not a chance.
So what goodwill would the Bears finishing 5-12 instead of 3-14 bring them?
Sure, I agree if you make the leap the next season after being 3-14 is obviously great and what you want. Progress is of course what you want from year to year. Philly is better as their young QB progressed. If you’re constantly 6-11 to 9-8, what good is that? Bears last three seasons, 8-8, 8-8, 6-11. That’s not a long term recipe for success. Bottoming out, with their QB position set is the best possible outcome.
I mean this as a compliment, you’re better than this take.
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The NBA? Yep. The NFL? Not really.
Philadelphia was 9-8 last year. Minnesota was 8-9. They are probably the two top seeds in the NFC this year.
You don't think teams like Detroit believe that going from 3-13-1 to near .500 (and possibly a playoff birth) is a sign of progress? Do you think they are regretting winning these games because they may have a 2nd place schedule and lower draft picks next year? Not a chance.
I think the Bears have shown progress
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That Pokes/Jags game was wild.
I’ve never seen a team try to give a game away so many times in the 4th. The possession after the Lawrence fumble was scared s***less. Then OT, what a disaster
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The NBA? Yep. The NFL? Not really.
Philadelphia was 9-8 last year. Minnesota was 8-9. They are probably the two top seeds in the NFC this year.
You don't think teams like Detroit believe that going from 3-13-1 to near .500 (and possibly a playoff birth) is a sign of progress? Do you think they are regretting winning these games because they may have a 2nd place schedule and lower draft picks next year? Not a chance.
NFL: Indy (2x), Bengals & Bills off the top of my head. I think Vikings did this and the Eagles dumped talent for draft picks. Those two teams have been building towards wining and last year was positive for both teams. The Bear's and us fans will be happy if the Bears are 8-9 or 9-8 next year. That would be the next positive step in the process.
Tanking is one strategy but has no guaranty of success. If the Bears' management and coaches suck, then this will be a terrible mess.
The fact they have a plan that does not include getting the 14-18 pick every year is good.
EDIT: - Also 49ers 2016-2018 tanked.
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Oh, yeah?!?!?! Fine, we'll give the chipping lesson to charity!
Your lads took care of business. Mine couldn't stop the mighty Steelers just about all game.
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.
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Your lads took care of business. Mine couldn't stop the mighty Steelers just about all game.
The play that won it for Detroit was basically a goal line play. St Brown in motion left to right, all motion to the right off the snap. Tight end drags across the field right to left. You see variations off it all of the time at the goal line. He caught the ball and there was no one around. 50 yards later... Badly blown coverage by the Jets.
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So what goodwill would the Bears finishing 5-12 instead of 3-14 bring them?
Sure, I agree if you make the leap the next season after being 3-14 is obviously great and what you want. Progress is of course what you want from year to year. Philly is better as their young QB progressed. If you’re constantly 6-11 to 9-8, what good is that? Bears last three seasons, 8-8, 8-8, 6-11. That’s not a long term recipe for success. Bottoming out, with their QB position set is the best possible outcome.
I mean this as a compliment, you’re better than this take.
You said “barely .500” before and now are saying 5-12? You’re better than shifting goalpost arguments.
The reason the Bears haven’t made the leap from near .500 isn’t because they are drafting around 15 or so. It is because they made horrible personnel and coaching decisions. Even at the top of the draft!
They now have new guys in charge. If they are good, they will find talent no matter where they draft. If they aren’t, it won’t matter where they draft. This isn’t the NBA.
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NFL: Indy (2x), Bengals & Bills off the top of my head. I think Vikings did this and the Eagles dumped talent for draft picks. Those two teams have been building towards wining and last year was positive for both teams. The Bear's and us fans will be happy if the Bears are 8-9 or 9-8 next year. That would be the next positive step in the process.
Tanking is one strategy but has no guaranty of success. If the Bears' management and coaches suck, then this will be a terrible mess.
The fact they have a plan that does not include getting the 14-18 pick every year is good.
EDIT: - Also 49ers 2016-2018 tanked.
Again I think trading away talent for picks is a great strategy. Good on the Bers for doing that!
Losing games is not a sign of progress though. It’s just not a good thing.
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The play that won it for Detroit was basically a goal line play. St Brown in motion left to right, all motion to the right off the snap. Tight end drags across the field right to left. You see variations off it all of the time at the goal line. He caught the ball and there was no one around. 50 yards later... Badly blown coverage by the Jets.
Did the TE purposely fall after blocking at the start of the play? It was a great design. CJ Mosely is 57 in the play that looks lost and follows the QB right. I’ve seen that play before with the TE coming out of the scrum uncovered
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He chipped and then crossed the formation against the flow. Again, goal line play. 1 yard throw. Works well. Never thought it could go for 50.
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He chipped and then crossed the formation against the flow. Again, goal line play. 1 yard throw. Works well. Never thought it could go for 50.
I’ve seen that more in college in those situations. Big plays can be made off those but you can only do it so many times
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Hurts RTG - 65
Fields RTG - 119
Considering the intentional lack of talent on the Bears, they have been some what competitive. (I'm not saying they are like 10-15 plays from being a .500 team, but they are not embarrassing)
Losing 10 out of last 11 games isn’t embarrassing?
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Not most seasons for the Lions.
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You said “barely .500” before and now are saying 5-12? You’re better than shifting goalpost arguments.
The reason the Bears haven’t made the leap from near .500 isn’t because they are drafting around 15 or so. It is because they made horrible personnel and coaching decisions. Even at the top of the draft!
They now have new guys in charge. If they are good, they will find talent no matter where they draft. If they aren’t, it won’t matter where they draft. This isn’t the NBA.
You keep mentioning the NBA for some reason. The only pro sport that openly rewards losing/tanking is the NFL. There’s no draft lottery in the NFL, you also get “rewarded” with three games (out of 17) on your schedule being different than your division (no other league does that).
I’m not shifting any goal posts, if year in/year out you’re around .500, that’s a long term recipe for never getting better. It’s not rocket surgery to realize 3-14 is better than 5-12 long term. Yes, I did that on purpose.
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I do appreciate that when Justin Fields throws INTs in back to back possessions with a chance to beat the Packers it’s the WR’s fault on the first and the second doesn’t matter because it was a 2 score game and the Bears weren’t going to win. But when they’re down 2 scores with 4 minutes left and score at the end of the game they were “competitive the whole way.”
Kind of like how Bears fans don’t want wins, except there were fireworks going off here by Bears fans when they beat the 9ers and Pats this year.
At least you guys are consistent I’ll give you that.
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Losing 10 out of last 11 games isn’t embarrassing?
No it is not because:
1. the Bears are in a rebuild and trying to get high draft choices by trading their best players and bringing in like 30 new players including 15 rookies. This has also freed up about $120M in cap space,
2. if you watched the games, which I would not suggest you do if you are not a Bears fan and its a tough watch even for Bears fans, you can see they are mildly competitive and not loosing by 30-40 points per game. Its commendable for a team mostly of players who don't belong in the NFL.
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the raider mystique?? if cole wasn't out of bounds...his left foot left a mark in the white chalk and replays says NO?? crazy
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OMG Patriots.
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Nobody mentions Brady Magic when his team blows a big lead.
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OMG Patriots.
Belichick teams never beat themselves, though.
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God be with whatever Pats beat writer asks the first question to Belichick in the postgame presser.
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Belichick teams never beat themselves, though.
Belichick is the GOAT, but his decision to turn his offense over to Matt Patricia and Joe Judge is as inexplicable as it gets.
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Belichick is the GOAT, but his decision to turn his offense over to Matt Patricia and Joe Judge is as inexplicable as it gets.
Agreed with all this.
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OMG Patriots.
I'm calling that play Co-lateral Damage.
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Belichick is the GOAT, but his decision to turn his offense over to Matt Patricia and Joe Judge is as inexplicable as it gets.
Oh absolutely. That goes under the "Even great coaches make stupid decisions sometimes" file. So does the way today's game ended -- totally giving away that game is 100% on the head coach.
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I'm calling that play Co-lateral Damage.
I don't know if you saw that some place else or came up with it on your own, but I like it!
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I'm calling that play Co-lateral Damage.
The Err-Maculate Reception.
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I'm calling that play Co-lateral Damage.
You win the internet today!
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I don't know if you saw that some place else or came up with it on your own, but I like it!
Thanks Dish! My own creation.
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The Err-Maculate Reception.
Not bad, not bad.
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Found this replay:
https://twitter.com/FrankieG1998/status/1604634987126575105?t=k_MbNP8KF9RJhxm26EkYdA&s=19 (https://twitter.com/FrankieG1998/status/1604634987126575105?t=k_MbNP8KF9RJhxm26EkYdA&s=19)
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Belichick is the GOAT, but his decision to turn his offense over to Matt Patricia and Joe Judge is as inexplicable as it gets.
Is Belichick the GOAT or is he a very good coach who was lucky to have the Goat on his team?
What is his percentage making the Playoffs minus Brady? In fact, in a quite large sample size, I believe he is a sub-.500 coach without Tom.
I’d take Parcells any day.
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Is Belichick the GOAT or is he a very good coach who was lucky to have the Goat on his team?
What is his percentage making the Playoffs minus Brady? In fact, in a quite large sample size, I believe he is a sub-.500 coach without Tom.
I’d take Parcells any day.
Give me Mini Ditka any day :D
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Is Belichick the GOAT or is he a very good coach who was lucky to have the Goat on his team?
What is his percentage making the Playoffs minus Brady? In fact, in a quite large sample size, I believe he is a sub-.500 coach without Tom.
I’d take Parcells any day.
Coaches are bad when their roster is bad. That checks out.
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Not that Washington deserved to win, but the refs simply chose to ignore a blatant interference on Washington’s final play.
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Coaches are bad when their roster is bad. That checks out.
Couldn’t agree more.
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Losing 10 out of last 11 games isn’t embarrassing?
No. See the Bears are playing three dimensional chess. Losing is actually winning and winning is actually losing. You only wish you could understand their brilliance.
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You keep mentioning the NBA for some reason. The only pro sport that openly rewards losing/tanking is the NFL. There’s no draft lottery in the NFL, you also get “rewarded” with three games (out of 17) on your schedule being different than your division (no other league does that).
I’m not shifting any goal posts, if year in/year out you’re around .500, that’s a long term recipe for never getting better. It’s not rocket surgery to realize 3-14 is better than 5-12 long term. Yes, I did that on purpose.
I am bringing up the NBA because that is a league where your clearest, and almost only path to success is drafting near the top of the first round. In the NFL, you can build a team though drafting in the middle of the rounds. Good organizations add talent that way all of the time.
The Bears weren't mired in mediocrity because they finished 8-8 a couple of times. They were mired in mediocrity because Ryan Pace sucked at his job. A good GM would have gotten the talent to move that 8-8 team to a 12-4 one. Or maybe never would have drafted Mitch Trubisky in the first place.
Honestly I would much rather be 7-7 at this point if I were a Bear fan. First, because winning is fun. Second, you may actually make the playoffs this year. But third and most importantly, it actually shows progress!
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After his team was humiliated at home by the not-even-mediocre Steelers, Carolina coach Steve Wilks had his own version of Jim Mora's infamous "Playoffs?" rant:
“I don’t want anybody in this building talking playoffs. We’ve got to worry about trying to get ourselves right to win a football game."
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Belichick is the GOAT, but his decision to turn his offense over to Matt Patricia and Joe Judge is as inexplicable as it gets.
This is it. And I think speaks to a larger problem with BB and the Patriots. Their staff is ridiculously inbred. Any fired coach who used to be an assistant there is brought back into the fold. And two of his kids are defensive assistants!
This just feels like its not ending well for him.
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I am bringing up the NBA because that is a league where your clearest, and almost only path to success is drafting near the top of the first round. In the NFL, you can build a team though drafting in the middle of the rounds. Good organizations add talent that way all of the time.
The Bears weren't mired in mediocrity because they finished 8-8 a couple of times. They were mired in mediocrity because Ryan Pace sucked at his job. A good GM would have gotten the talent to move that 8-8 team to a 12-4 one. Or maybe never would have drafted Mitch Trubisky in the first place.
Honestly I would much rather be 7-7 at this point if I were a Bear fan. First, because winning is fun. Second, you may actually make the playoffs this year. But third and most importantly, it actually shows progress!
Quick question, is the boldest really true in the NBA? I guess it depends on what one means "near the top of the first round". If one is talking top 3 picks. It's simply not true. Here's the list
2 1 Paolo Banchero Duke Orlando Magic
2 Chet Holmgren Gonzaga Oklahoma City Thunder
3 Jabari Smith Auburn Houston Rockets
2021 1 Cade Cunningham Oklahoma State Detroit Pistons
2 Jalen Green NBA G-League Houston Rockets
3 Evan Mobley USC Cleveland Cavaliers
2020 1 Anthony Edwards Georgia Minnesota Timberwolves
2 James Wiseman Memphis Golden State Warriors
3 LaMelo Ball Australia Charlotte Hornets
2019 1 Zion Williamson Duke New Orleans Pelicans
2 Ja Morant Murray State Memphis Grizzlies
3 RJ Barrett Duke New York Knicks
2018 1 Deandre Ayton Arizona Phoenix Suns
2 Marvin Bagley III Duke Sacramento Kings
3 Luka Doncic Spain Atlanta Hawks
2017 1 Markelle Fultz Washington Philadelphia 76ers
2 Lonzo Ball UCLA Los Angeles Lakers
3 Jayson Tatum Duke Boston Celtics
2016 1 Ben Simmons LSU Philadelphia 76ers
2 Brandon Ingram Duke Los Angeles Lakers
3 Jaylen Brown California Boston Celtics
2015 1 Karl-Anthony Towns Kentucky Minnesota Timberwolves
2 D'Angelo Russell Ohio State Los Angeles Lakers
3 Jahlil Okafor Duke Philadelphia 76ers
2014 1 Andrew Wiggins Kansas Cleveland Cavaliers
2 Jabari Parker Duke Milwaukee Bucks
3 Joel Embiid Kansas Philadelphia 76ers
2013 1 Anthony Bennett UNLV Cleveland Cavaliers
2 Victor Oladipo Indiana Orlando Magic
3 Otto Porter Georgetown Washington Wizards
2012 1 Anthony Davis Kentucky New Orleans Hornets
2 Michael Kidd-Gilchrist Kentucky Charlotte Bobcats
3 Bradley Beal Florida Washington Wizards
2011 1 Kyrie Irving Duke Cleveland Cavaliers
2 Derrick Williams Arizona Minnesota Timberwolves
3 Enes Kanter Turkey Utah Jazz
2010 1 John Wall Kentucky Washington Wizards
2 Evan Turner Ohio State Philadelphia 76ers
3 Derrick Favors Georgia Tech New Jersey Nets
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I probably overstated it, but if you look at that list I see the core of the current Boston Celtics, a two time NBA MVP, the top players on contenders like the Sixers, Grizzlies and Pelicans.
Furthermore, I think you are looking at this wrong. Here is the list of championship teams in the 2000s that didn't have someone who was one of their core players drafted in the top 10.
2021 Milwaukee Bucks
2019 Toronto Raptors
I believe that the 2020 Lakers were the only team who had a top ten pick, but who didn't draft any of them (or set up draft day trades for them.)
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Quick question, is the boldest really true in the NBA? I guess it depends on what one means "near the top of the first round". If one is talking top 3 picks. It's simply not true. Here's the list
2 1 Paolo Banchero Duke Orlando Magic
2 Chet Holmgren Gonzaga Oklahoma City Thunder
3 Jabari Smith Auburn Houston Rockets
2021 1 Cade Cunningham Oklahoma State Detroit Pistons
2 Jalen Green NBA G-League Houston Rockets
3 Evan Mobley USC Cleveland Cavaliers
2020 1 Anthony Edwards Georgia Minnesota Timberwolves
2 James Wiseman Memphis Golden State Warriors
3 LaMelo Ball Australia Charlotte Hornets
2019 1 Zion Williamson Duke New Orleans Pelicans
2 Ja Morant Murray State Memphis Grizzlies
3 RJ Barrett Duke New York Knicks
2018 1 Deandre Ayton Arizona Phoenix Suns
2 Marvin Bagley III Duke Sacramento Kings
3 Luka Doncic Spain Atlanta Hawks
2017 1 Markelle Fultz Washington Philadelphia 76ers
2 Lonzo Ball UCLA Los Angeles Lakers
3 Jayson Tatum Duke Boston Celtics
2016 1 Ben Simmons LSU Philadelphia 76ers
2 Brandon Ingram Duke Los Angeles Lakers
3 Jaylen Brown California Boston Celtics
2015 1 Karl-Anthony Towns Kentucky Minnesota Timberwolves
2 D'Angelo Russell Ohio State Los Angeles Lakers
3 Jahlil Okafor Duke Philadelphia 76ers
2014 1 Andrew Wiggins Kansas Cleveland Cavaliers
2 Jabari Parker Duke Milwaukee Bucks
3 Joel Embiid Kansas Philadelphia 76ers
2013 1 Anthony Bennett UNLV Cleveland Cavaliers
2 Victor Oladipo Indiana Orlando Magic
3 Otto Porter Georgetown Washington Wizards
2012 1 Anthony Davis Kentucky New Orleans Hornets
2 Michael Kidd-Gilchrist Kentucky Charlotte Bobcats
3 Bradley Beal Florida Washington Wizards
2011 1 Kyrie Irving Duke Cleveland Cavaliers
2 Derrick Williams Arizona Minnesota Timberwolves
3 Enes Kanter Turkey Utah Jazz
2010 1 John Wall Kentucky Washington Wizards
2 Evan Turner Ohio State Philadelphia 76ers
3 Derrick Favors Georgia Tech New Jersey Nets
That’s pretty much proving it IS how you need to win in the NBA. Look at the top 2 teams in each conference right now and who their best players are. Bucks obviously struck gold with Giannis, so yes, it can be done without a top pick, but that’s MUCH harder than being at the top. Celtics, both Tatum and Brown were their own top 3 picks. Pels got Zion at the top. Grizz got Ja at the top.
Bigger markets have a chance to build a “super team,” but even those seem to have a pretty short window and can blow up in ugly ways.
The teams that draft at the top usually wind up being the teams that win big down the road. That’s not the case in the NFL. Teams like the Packers and Patriots have typically drafted towards the bottom and remained Super Bowl contenders for a very long time. Teams like the Lions, Jets, Browns have been drafting towards the top for a very long time and are very rarely Super Bowl contenders.
With a single pick an NBA franchise can flip. That’s not really the case in the NFL. Even if you get your future HOF QB, it’s still going to take years to build around him, and chances are you’ll have to draft well in the middle of the draft at some point.
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I probably overstated it, but if you look at that list I see the core of the current Boston Celtics, a two time NBA MVP, the top players on contenders like the Sixers, Grizzlies and Pelicans.
Furthermore, I think you are looking at this wrong. Here is the list of championship teams in the 2000s that didn't have someone who was one of their core players drafted in the top 10.
2021 Milwaukee Bucks
2019 Toronto Raptors
I believe that the 2020 Lakers were the only team who didn't draft any of their core players in the top 10 (or set up draft day trades for them.)
My point is that "tanking" in the NBA does not get you anywhere, especially not anything quickly. Nobody on the list won a championship (except Wiseman) on their own team since Kyrie.
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My point is that "tanking" in the NBA does not get you anywhere, especially not anything quickly. Nobody on the list won a championship (except Wiseman) on their own team since Kyrie.
1. I never said it was guaranteed to succeed.
2. You limited the scope to the top 3.
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1. I never said it was guaranteed to succeed.
2. You limited the scope to the top 3.
Of course you didn't say it was guaranteed to succeed, because it clearly doesn't. I limited it to the Top 3, because, to me, tanking insinuates we are going to lose to get a better chance to get the Top pick. Nobody tanks with the hope of getting in the back half of the lottery.
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Honestly I would much rather be 7-7 at this point if I were a Bear fan. First, because winning is fun. Second, you may actually make the playoffs this year. But third and most importantly, it actually shows progress!
I disagree, 7-7 would show no progress and the team would be a year older, if the Bears made the playoffs they would not be a serious contender for the SB. I do agree winning is fun, which is the goal of this rebuild process.
I think reasonable minds can disagree about the merit of the Bears' strategy. There are good arguments on both sides.
Rejecting what the Bears' strategy is, was confusing for me. I don't think the Bears could do any more other than have a press conference saying "we are tanking and welcome the loses, stock piling draft choices and clearing record amounts of cap space". The NFL would fine them for that.
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I think reasonable minds can disagree about the merit of the Bears' strategy. There are good arguments on both sides.
I think everyone pretty much agrees with the Bears' strategy in that the front office is saying "we are building to be successful in 2-3 years, and we are indifferent to the results in the meantime." I think the disagreement boils down to: after you accept the front office's decision to punt on near-term results, is the Bears future brighter if they go 4-13 instead of 8-9?
I'm in the camp that no, the Bears' future is not materially impacted by whether they win or lose these games. As a Dolphins fan, I had to deal with this exact issue during the 2019 tank for Tua year. Flores and Fitzmagic went on a meaningless heater, and I was in fan no man's land about whether winning those games was a good thing. That was even more pronounced because the front office's indifference to winning was in service of getting a specific QB, whereas the Bears debate is just about the value of picking 4-6 spots earlier with no particular draft target in mind.
My two cents is that a front office punting games is the hardest position to be in as a fan - its actually easier to root for your team to lose than to be told that the games don't matter. But fortunately in the NFL, the value of losing games just isn't significant enough to ever actually root against your team (e.g., Tua got hurt, slipped, and the Dolphins got him anyway, which never would have happened in the NBA). So just root for your team to win with the standing disclaimer that you know the front office isn't putting the players and coaches in the best position to succeed, in service of future success.
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Honestly I would much rather be 7-7 at this point if I were a Bear fan. First, because winning is fun. Second, you may actually make the playoffs this year. But third and most importantly, it actually shows progress!
They have a bottom three roster, I mean I’d like to be a millionaire too, but the reality is I’m not, and a bottom of the league roster isn’t going 7-7 at this point. They now have a young good QB, which is what they haven’t had. Drafting at 2 doesn’t guarantee anything, they have to still make good decisions in the draft and free agency. But I guess we agree to disagree on the value of picking at 2 instead of 6 or 7 or wherever, fair enough, I do respect your opinions on here.
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Belichick is the GOAT, but his decision to turn his offense over to Matt Patricia and Joe Judge is as inexplicable as it gets.
Belichick is 78-86 without Tom Brady under center.
He's a damn good coach, but great players can make coaches appear better than they are.
For an example see: McCarthy, Mike
I am ready for the heat this take will bring.
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Belichick is 78-86 without Tom Brady under center.
He's a damn good coach, but great players can make coaches appear better than they are.
For an example see: McCarthy, Mike
I am ready for the heat this take will bring.
It's the right take, so there should be little if any heat.
Not only does Belichick have a losing record sans Brady ... but Brady promptly won the Super Bowl sans Belichick. TB didn't need BB, but BB has yet to prove he doesn't need TB.
None of which means Belichick hasn't been one of the best coaches ever; it's all opinion anyway. I mean, those regarded as the most accomplished (a term I prefer to "best") coaches in history, regardless of sport, have always had lots of talent. Phil Jackson, Red Auerbach, Vince Lombardi, Chuck Noll, Bill Walsh, Toe Blake, Scotty Bowman, Casey Stengel, Joe McCarthy, etc etc etc ... tons of talent.
There's little question that Belichick is the most accomplished NFL coach of the Super Bowl era. He's got the most Super Bowl victories -- that's the ultimate accomplishment in his sport. GOAT? That's a matter of opinion.
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Is Belichick the GOAT or is he a very good coach who was lucky to have the Goat on his team?
What is his percentage making the Playoffs minus Brady? In fact, in a quite large sample size, I believe he is a sub-.500 coach without Tom.
I’d take Parcells any day.
He was under 40 when he took over a bad Browns team, with a terrible defense that gave up like 450 points the year before. And a roster put together by a GM who would get canned the next year. And still he turned them into the best defense in the league and won 11 games 3 years later.
Then he figured it out, as many coaches do after a failure, by the time he got to NE. Those early NE teams won cause of BB's system and defense. Brady wasn't a superstar when they went 14-2 and won the SB in 2003, he was rather average that year. 2004 he made a Pro Bowl, but wasn't other worldly. I'd argue he didn't start carrying BB or the Pats until 2007, and then the next decade he was the Brady we all know.
We all know the 11-5 with Matt Cassell. But they won 10 games and made the playoffs last year with a pretty shmeh roster.
Belichick is the GOAT, but his decision to turn his offense over to Matt Patricia and Joe Judge is as inexplicable as it gets.
This is it. And I think speaks to a larger problem with BB and the Patriots. Their staff is ridiculously inbred. Any fired coach who used to be an assistant there is brought back into the fold. And two of his kids are defensive assistants!
This just feels like its not ending well for him.
Yea, I feel any post-Brady lull is less about Brady and more about hubris. His personnel decisions have been pretty horrible. Both with players, and much more so with coaching. The Matt Patricia moving to OC is a quintessential "I'm smarter than everyone else, my track record proves it".
Brady went to a stacked team that just didn't have a QB. 2 Pro Bowl WRs already, then added a a HOF WR in Brown and a HOF TE in Gronk, plus 2 good RBs to a team that had none. And a gnarly defense. Brady didn't lift up a bunch of also rans.
Also, Parcells as the GOAT? The same Parcells who basically alternated playoff contending years with sub .500 seasons? Great coach and football mind but wildly inconsistent.
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Also, Parcells as the GOAT? The same Parcells who basically alternated playoff contending years with sub .500 seasons? Great coach and football mind but wildly inconsistent.
Not quite accurate.
He was below .500 3 times and in the Playoffs 9 times. The other times he was below .500 were in his 1st season on rebuilding teams. And every losing team that he took over was in the playoffs by his 2nd season.
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Belichick is 78-86 without Tom Brady under center.
He's a damn good coach, but great players can make coaches appear better than they are.
For an example see: McCarthy, Mike
I am ready for the heat this take will bring.
Bill Walsh was 17-23-1 without Joe Montana under center.
I imagine that if we dive in, we'd find that most coaches seen as great look a lot less great when forced to play below average quarterbacks.
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Not quite accurate.
He was below .500 3 times and in the Playoffs 9 times. The other times he was below .500 were in his 1st season on rebuilding teams. And every losing team that he took over was in the playoffs by his 2nd season.
I was thinking the NE/NJ years which was Bad, Playoffs, Bad, Super Bowl appearance...then Decent, AFC Champ, win 4 straight to finish the year at 8-8. Still, not a paragon of consistency throughout his career. Even his Giants stretch was very good, not GOAT worthy.
But we all know Parcells was carried by Jeff Hostetler, not his coaching
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Bill Walsh was 17-23-1 without Joe Montana under center.
I imagine that if we dive in, we'd find that most coaches seen as great look a lot less great when forced to play below average quarterbacks.
Absolutely.
Don Shula did have a pretty nice record with fill-ins, though.
Many don't remember that during the Dolphins' perfect season 50 years ago, they lost Bob Griese to injury in Game 5. Earl Morrall, himself a former star but a 38-year-old retread by 1972, took over and led Miami to wins in the rest of their regular-season games and also in their playoff opener. When Morrall struggled in the first half of the AFC title game (which was inexplicably played in Pittsburgh despite the Dolphins having been 15-0), Shula pivoted back to Griese, who led them to victory in that game and then in the Super Bowl.
As the young Baltimore head coach in 1965, with both Unitas and his backup hurt, Shula plugged in RB Tom Matte at QB. The Colts beat the Rams in Matte's first game (which was the regular-season finale) but then lost to the eventual champion Packers in overtime in the playoffs.
But yes, Shula was a lot smarter when Unitas, Griese and Marino were healthy and at their best. Bradshaw, Montana, Aikman and Brady made their coaches look pretty smart, too.
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One could argue Parcells won two super bowls because he had Belichick on staff
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One could argue Parcells won two super bowls because he had Belichick on staff
Parcells did win one of those with a backup QB who was mediocre at best.
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Parcells did win one of those with a backup QB who was mediocre at best.
With a great defensive game plan
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They have a bottom three roster, I mean I’d like to be a millionaire too, but the reality is I’m not, and a bottom of the league roster isn’t going 7-7 at this point. They now have a young good QB, which is what they haven’t had. Drafting at 2 doesn’t guarantee anything, they have to still make good decisions in the draft and free agency. But I guess we agree to disagree on the value of picking at 2 instead of 6 or 7 or wherever, fair enough, I do respect your opinions on here.
There is clear statistical data to show higher draft picks preform better than lower picks (pick 1-5 about 50% All Pro, pick 15-20 about 30% All Pro and so on). NFL GMs have placed high value on draft picks and there is trade data to prove even slightly better picks are worth material draft/player capital. I hope there is no disagreement on these facts.
Teams who are starting a rebuild prefer draft position over wins because the need for a large infusion of talent is needed to build toward a championship. Those teams, like the Bears, have a many players who will not be on the team long term because they are not good and there is little value in developing them as players or team mates.
Teams, again like the Bears, increase the likelihood of getting better talent (in all rounds of the draft) by picking higher or picking more, as the data proves out.
But again, if the GM and coaches are not good, then all the loses, draft picks and cap money are a waste.
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The posts in this thread on October 24th are hilarious. Bears fans certainly weren’t explaining how much they wanted to lose games and how valuable their 4th place schedule and 2nd pick were going to be. Same with 9/11 posts. Very cold takes…that appear to have been not so cold.
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The posts in this thread on October 24th are hilarious. Bears fans certainly weren’t explaining how much they wanted to lose games and how valuable their 4th place schedule and 2nd pick were going to be. Same with 9/11 posts. Very cold takes…that appear to have been not so cold.
You're trying too hard. The Bears beat the hell out of NE, in NE, on primetime TV. People rightly called that out and gave the Bears props for the performance.
I assume you're talking about Dish saying the Bears were in the playoff race in the NFC. Which was true at the time. Though nobody thought then, or any time in the season, that they were a playoff team, even in a bad NFC.
Bears fans can be exciting by a dominating performance and good play from their franchise QB, but also not give a damn about losses as they build for the future. Its not that complicated. I also can't fathom why you care so much. Is Jimmy Butler a Bears fan? That would explain your obsessive devotion.
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Willie McGinest seems to have taken the Patriots' loss pretty hard.
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WithoutBias probably shouldn’t look at the posts in here from after the Packers week 1 loss to the Vikings.
“The Packers will be fine.”
“They’re still going to easily win the NFC North.”
Dude is absolutely obsessed with the Bears, it’s hilarious.
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You're trying too hard. The Bears beat the hell out of NE, in NE, on primetime TV. People rightly called that out and gave the Bears props for the performance.
I assume you're talking about Dish saying the Bears were in the playoff race in the NFC. Which was true at the time. Though nobody thought then, or any time in the season, that they were a playoff team, even in a bad NFC.
Bears fans can be exciting by a dominating performance and good play from their franchise QB, but also not give a damn about losses as they build for the future. Its not that complicated. I also can't fathom why you care so much. Is Jimmy Butler a Bears fan? That would explain your obsessive devotion.
JWags is of course right here, and what I said was true at the time. The Bears were 1 game out of the wild card, and held the tiebreaker over San Fran at the time I said “they were in the playoff hunt”. I mean, if at the time, almost halfway through the season, a team is a game out of the playoffs, I’d consider that “in the hunt”. And they did totally kick the Pats around the building that night. This doesn’t have to be so hard for some around here to comprehend.
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JWags is of course right here, and what I said was true at the time. The Bears were 1 game out of the wild card, and held the tiebreaker over San Fran at the time I said “they were in the playoff hunt”. I mean, if at the time, almost halfway through the season, a team is a game out of the playoffs, I’d consider that “in the hunt”. And they did totally kick the Pats around the building that night. This doesn’t have to be so hard for some around here to comprehend.
None of this should distract us from the Packers being trash, too.
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The posts in this thread on October 24th are hilarious. Bears fans certainly weren’t explaining how much they wanted to lose games and how valuable their 4th place schedule and 2nd pick were going to be. Same with 9/11 posts. Very cold takes…that appear to have been not so cold.
You got me!
I went back to 10/24 to see the posts you referenced. I played right into your hands. You "made me look".
Of course there were no such posts, a couple expressing surprise at the Bears win, that's it. And, of course, posts of kudos for trading Robert Quinn the very next day. Genuine satisfaction with unloading older talent.
You should lighten up, you are not a Bears fan, sit back and enjoy them losing. Theses ARE the good ol' days for Packer fans.
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It's the right take, so there should be little if any heat.
Not only does Belichick have a losing record sans Brady ... but Brady promptly won the Super Bowl sans Belichick. TB didn't need BB, but BB has yet to prove he doesn't need TB.
None of which means Belichick hasn't been one of the best coaches ever; it's all opinion anyway. I mean, those regarded as the most accomplished (a term I prefer to "best") coaches in history, regardless of sport, have always had lots of talent. Phil Jackson, Red Auerbach, Vince Lombardi, Chuck Noll, Bill Walsh, Toe Blake, Scotty Bowman, Casey Stengel, Joe McCarthy, etc etc etc ... tons of talent.
There's little question that Belichick is the most accomplished NFL coach of the Super Bowl era. He's got the most Super Bowl victories -- that's the ultimate accomplishment in his sport. GOAT? That's a matter of opinion.
I do not rank Belichick #1. I do not have any issue with anyone who does.
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None of this should distract us from the Packers being trash, too.
Yeah it’s manifesting itself with a lot of redirection of frustration around here.
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You're trying too hard. The Bears beat the hell out of NE, in NE, on primetime TV. People rightly called that out and gave the Bears props for the performance.
I assume you're talking about Dish saying the Bears were in the playoff race in the NFC. Which was true at the time. Though nobody thought then, or any time in the season, that they were a playoff team, even in a bad NFC.
Bears fans can be exciting by a dominating performance and good play from their franchise QB, but also not give a damn about losses as they build for the future. Its not that complicated. I also can't fathom why you care so much. Is Jimmy Butler a Bears fan? That would explain your obsessive devotion.
The proper response to those wins would’ve been, “HORRIBLE RESULT!”
We should’ve been more concerned with getting a top 2 pick and not concerned with what the Playoff outlook was. Winning games did nothing but hurt the Bears this year. 0-17 would’ve been great.
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Belichick accepted no blame for simply not having his QB take an effen knee and going to OT.
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Belichick accepted no blame for simply not having his QB take an effen knee and going to OT.
I have no issue with calling a simple running play there, cause who knows. The chances of a fumble that is returned for a TD on a basic inside run are near zero, FAR less than breaking that HB dive/stretch/counter into a TD run.
Now if he called or sanctioned a lateral drill, then there is tons of blame
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I think everyone pretty much agrees with the Bears' strategy in that the front office is saying "we are building to be successful in 2-3 years, and we are indifferent to the results in the meantime." I think the disagreement boils down to: after you accept the front office's decision to punt on near-term results, is the Bears future brighter if they go 4-13 instead of 8-9?
I'm in the camp that no, the Bears' future is not materially impacted by whether they win or lose these games. As a Dolphins fan, I had to deal with this exact issue during the 2019 tank for Tua year. Flores and Fitzmagic went on a meaningless heater, and I was in fan no man's land about whether winning those games was a good thing. That was even more pronounced because the front office's indifference to winning was in service of getting a specific QB, whereas the Bears debate is just about the value of picking 4-6 spots earlier with no particular draft target in mind.
My two cents is that a front office punting games is the hardest position to be in as a fan - its actually easier to root for your team to lose than to be told that the games don't matter. But fortunately in the NFL, the value of losing games just isn't significant enough to ever actually root against your team (e.g., Tua got hurt, slipped, and the Dolphins got him anyway, which never would have happened in the NBA). So just root for your team to win with the standing disclaimer that you know the front office isn't putting the players and coaches in the best position to succeed, in service of future success.
I take a very different tactic. While the Bears will have a high draft choice this year and probably next, don't expect them to spend a dime more than they absolutely have to until Arlington Heights is secured and under construction.
Assuming Arlington Heights opens in 2027 or 2028, look for the Bears to begin break-out spending in 2026. They'll build slowly and very gradually until then. As long as people show up at Daley's Dump on the Lakefront, they won't care!
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I take a very different tactic. While the Bears will have a high draft choice this year and probably next, don't expect them to spend a dime more than they absolutely have to until Arlington Heights is secured and under construction.
Assuming Arlington Heights opens in 2027 or 2028, look for the Bears to begin break-out spending in 2026. They'll build slowly and very gradually until then. As long as people show up at Daley's Dump on the Lakefront, they won't care!
The Bears haven't been shy to spend in free agency before. They are making money hand over fist already.
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The Bears haven't been shy to spend in free agency before. They are making money hand over fist already.
I agree with this.
Generally, I don't see spending money as a significant issue for any NFL team. Not like you see in other sports. Just MHO.
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I agree with this.
Generally, I don't see spending money as a significant issue for any NFL team. Not like you see in other sports. Just MHO.
I could see them prioritizing *flexibility* to be in a position to have lots of resources to make big moves in either FA or trading for vets with an Arlington Heights debut year in mind. E.g. sign/spend but with contracts set to expire or be easily voidable so they have big cap space and key pieces in place for the move.
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MLF wuz playin' 'gainst hiz friend. Mite bea a different deel if he hated da udder koach's gutz, aina?
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The Packers got a little momentum but ultimately the teams they should have beaten. They still need to beat 2 playoff caliber teams, and they still have one more against the Vikings.
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The Packers got a little momentum but ultimately the teams they should have beaten. They still need to beat 2 playoff caliber teams, and they still have one more against the Vikings.
I like them a lot this week in Miami, even coming off a short week. I think it'll be one of the better games on this week's slate.
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I have no issue with calling a simple running play there, cause who knows. The chances of a fumble that is returned for a TD on a basic inside run are near zero, FAR less than breaking that HB dive/stretch/counter into a TD run.
Odds of breaking a TD run there were extremely low. Take the knee and go to OT, and everybody isn't talking about Belichick's team suffering the humiliation of being victimized by one of the worst plays in the history of the sport.
The odds were long against the Pisarcik fumble/TD return, too. It happens. The Giants should have taken a knee there back before you were born.
Bottom line: For better or worse, coaching is a results business. The result of Belichick's decision to hand the ball to a dumb-ass was a crucial loss.
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Odds of breaking a TD run there were extremely low. Take the knee and go to OT, and everybody isn't talking about Belichick's team suffering the humiliation of being victimized by one of the worst plays in the history of the sport.
The odds were long against the Pisarcik fumble/TD return, too. It happens. The Giants should have taken a knee there back before you were born.
Bottom line: For better or worse, coaching is a results business. The result of Belichick's decision to hand the ball to a dumb-ass was a crucial loss.
Stevenson had 150 yards to that point. He was killing the Raiders on the ground and had broken a 35 yard gain for a TD 3 minutes before. Against a prevent defense from midfield, it wasn't a bad call at all. You're talking about it like it was a fumble on a draw play that was returned for a TD instead of a comedy of errors. Again, unless Belichick called a lateral play as it occurred, thats literally not in your consideration set. They don't do it if they were on their own 20/25.
The Miracle at the Meadowlands was late in the game that wasn't tied, inside the Giants 30, with the Eagles throwing everything at the LOS. Not even a remotely similar scenario.
Coaching is risk reward. You call that run, you have a 5% chance of breaking a TD, a 94.9999% chance of going to OT by any number of outcomes, and a .0001 (probably smaller chance) of your RB and WR going rogue and throwing the ball around like that.
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5% chance of a TD run? Hmm.
It’s OK Wags, we’ll agree to disagree
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Hmmmm, lack of defensive playmakers. Check.
Can't stop power running. Check.
Same old Lions. Check.
Improved, but not a playoff team. Check.
Detroit plays a base 4-2-5 and never put in a third linebacker while betting destroyed up the middle.
The worst thing a Lions fan can have is hope.
I never believed the hype.
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Hmmmm, lack of defensive playmakers. Check.
Can't stop power running. Check.
Same old Lions. Check.
Improved, but not a playoff team. Check.
Detroit plays a base 4-2-5 and never put in a third linebacker while betting destroyed up the middle.
The worst thing a Lions fan can have is hope.
I never believed the hype.
Packers fans think they can win a Super Bowl with this roster, so don’t feel bad
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You have to have hope or believe to feel bad.
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Hmmmm, lack of defensive playmakers. Check.
Can't stop power running. Check.
Same old Lions. Check.
Improved, but not a playoff team. Check.
Detroit plays a base 4-2-5 and never put in a third linebacker while betting destroyed up the middle.
The worst thing a Lions fan can have is hope.
I never believed the hype.
Lions made the Panthers' running attack look like the '72 Dolphins.
In the first half, it was 7-7, the Lions had stopped the Panthers and the Lions were doing everything they wanted on offense in taking the ball 80+ yards into the red zone. Goff was playing incredibly well and it looked like Detroit was about to go up 14-7. Then Goff and the center flubbed a routine snap, the Panthers recovered, Carolina went 90+ yards to take the lead ... and Detroit seemed to lose focus.
Crazy stuff. If the Panthers win their last two against Tampa and New Orleans -- teams they've already beaten -- they'll win the division at 8-9.
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Congratulations on a franchise best yardage total.
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Congratulations on a franchise best yardage total.
Mostly ... congratulations to my chipping game!
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Amazing, if Carolina wins out, they’ll be NFC South champions.
If I’m Dallas, I’d much rather go to Tampa.
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Vikings will lose 1st round of playoffs
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Maybe. They will be hosting, so I give them a puncher's chance. I really like their chances if it is a one possession game.
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I said this last week when Detroit was getting love that you are what your record is. Minnesota is going to be a 2 or 3 seed. Dallas will play the winner of the NFC south. Minnesota will host Washington, Seattle, Detroit, or Green Bay.
They could lose. But I think they win.
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Bears within striking distance of the #1 pick. :D
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One more Texans win, Bears lose out would get Chicago the first pick.
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One more Texans win, Bears lose out would get Chicago the first pick.
would they take Bryce Young?
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would they take Bryce Young?
Not a chance, and they likely trade out of it, IMO
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Raiders know Josh Jacobs is still on the team, right?
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Not a chance, and they likely trade out of it, IMO
For sure.
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I don’t know how Pakuni does it as a Raiders fan, every week (good or bad) is a wild roller coaster. There’s no team in the NFL that has this consistency of wildness to them.
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Raiders know Josh Jacobs is still on the team, right?
Davante has 3 games this year with 15 yards or less.
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Not a chance, and they likely trade out of it, IMO
Agreed. Serious draft capital.
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Broncos are just a disaster.
No idea how Hackett is still there.
And really not sure what they are gonna do about Russ.
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Broncos are just a disaster.
No idea how Hackett is still there.
And really not sure what they are gonna do about Russ.
Good thing they have all their draft capitol. Should be a quick rebuild and can easily replace Russell early in the draft.
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Good thing they have all their draft capitol. Should be a quick rebuild and can easily replace Russell early in the draft.
Capital
Need Murray to not get catches or a rare run in the second half. Close semifinal fantasy game for me going on rn. #pray
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Damn, Arizona - just needed a 7-yard out there to set up Prater for a make-able 60-yarder.
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One more Texans win, Bears lose out would get Chicago the first pick.
Bears are going to be set no matter what. You can stay and take your pick of Carter or Anderson, or trade back, recoup many years' of draft capital and still end up with an impact player (possibly still one of those two). The Colts would make an attractive trade partner
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Bears are going to be set no matter what. You can stay and take your pick of Carter or Anderson, or trade back, recoup many years' of draft capital and still end up with an impact player (possibly still one of those two). The Colts would make an attractive trade partner
you fool, the bears would be exactly just as set by going 500
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No idea how Hackett is still there.
He gone!
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He gone!
The Broncos head coaching position is so unappealing, John Elway is going to let a minority candidate have it.
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The Broncos head coaching position is so unappealing, John Elway is going to let a minority candidate have it.
Only problem is Elway is only a consultant for the team now. Not a decision maker.
Sean Payton or Jim Harbaugh. With Broncos defense, Wilson as a QB ( maybe a new offense coordinator will help) and a passionate fanbase, will be a good job.
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Only problem is Elway is only a consultant for the team now. Not a decision maker.
Sean Payton or Jim Harbaugh. With Broncos defense, Wilson as a QB ( maybe a new offense coordinator will help) and a passionate fanbase, will be a good job.
Wilson is toast. Also, unless Harbaugh wins a national title this year, he isn’t leaving Ann Arbor
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Wilson is toast. Also, unless Harbaugh wins a national title this year, he isn’t leaving Ann Arbor
Yeah and don't see Sean Payton signing up to deal with another past their prime QB.
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Yeah and don't see Sean Payton signing up to deal with another past their prime QB.
It’ll be interesting to see where he ends up. Assume Arizona opens up. Indy is open/ish. Houston? Doesn’t seem like a fit. Carolina? If they win out, hard to see Wilks not keeping the gig. I suppose if Dallas flames out, that’s a possible spot but none of those jobs scream his name
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It’ll be interesting to see where he ends up. Assume Arizona opens up. Indy is open/ish. Houston? Doesn’t seem like a fit. Carolina? If they win out, hard to see Wilks not keeping the gig. I suppose if Dallas flames out, that’s a possible spot but none of those jobs scream his name
Supposedly Payton has told people he has no interest in the Carolina job. And while Tepper's money could be persuasive, it's hard to believe the Saints would let him go to a division rival without demanding a lot of compensation -- and also hard to believe the Panthers would send a first-round draft pick or more to a division rival.
Also, judging by the talk around here, the Panthers would have to really play like shyte these last two games for Wilks to not get the gig.
If Dallas suffers a humiliating playoff loss -- such as in round 1 to the NFC South mediocrity -- I could see McCarthy getting canned and I would think that job actually does scream Payton's name. I would think Arizona could be appealing to him, too.
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Supposedly Payton has told people he has no interest in the Carolina job. And while Tepper's money could be persuasive, it's hard to believe the Saints would let him go to a division rival without demanding a lot of compensation -- and also hard to believe the Panthers would send a first-round draft pick or more to a division rival.
Also, judging by the talk around here, the Panthers would have to really play like shyte these last two games for Wilks to not get the gig.
If Dallas suffers a humiliating playoff loss -- such as in round 1 to the NFC South mediocrity -- I could see McCarthy getting canned and I would think that job actually does scream Payton's name. I would think Arizona could be appealing to him, too.
Dallas seems like the natural fit if things go sideways but I wonder if he wants to deal with the Joneses. He’d have to believe Kyler is a legit franchise QB to take Arizona.
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The Broncos head coaching position is so unappealing, John Elway is going to let a minority candidate have it.
Per Jeff Legwold (who knows 99% less about the NFL than GB Warrior)
"With the wealthiest ownership group in the NFL as well as a fan base passionate enough, even now, to have given the Broncos a home sellout streak that dates back to 1970, the Broncos' head-coaching role will be an attractive job."
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He’d have to believe Kyler is a legit franchise QB to take Arizona.
Yeah, I wouldn’t be sold at all he is. Under 6 feet and coming off a blown ACL now. A disappointment this year too.
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Still think Miami would be in play for Payton.
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That was a brutal hit.
A well deserved ejection.
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Tua’s stats pre/post concussion yesterday are pretty striking (no pun intended).
I have no idea if the outcome of that game yesterday changes or what, but that definitely should have been spotted. Seeing the replay and knowing the player has a recent history of concussions, he should have been out of the game.
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Gotta shut Tua down at this point
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Tua’s stats pre/post concussion yesterday are pretty striking (no pun intended).
I have no idea if the outcome of that game yesterday changes or what, but that definitely should have been spotted. Seeing the replay and knowing the player has a recent history of concussions, he should have been out of the game.
Darn, that sucks for Tua. He's had some brutal situations this season. I wish it didn't happen, obviously, but it helps explain why he looked so bad.
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Bears are going to be set no matter what. You can stay and take your pick of Carter or Anderson, or trade back, recoup many years' of draft capital and still end up with an impact player (possibly still one of those two). The Colts would make an attractive trade partner
One thing I think the Bears should entertain is buying draft picks, and I think Indianapolis is a great team to work with in that regard.
Matt Ryan’s deal is up after 2023, and he has a $10M roster bonus due 3/17. If the Bears took on Ryan’s contract in early March for a 2nd & 5th, and then released him before 3/17, everyone (Ryan loses $10M) wins. Indy simply loses two picks, it costs the Bears $18M in cap space they have to burn anyway.
For me, if the Bears trade down, whoever is at #4 would be the ideal trade partner to get Carter and get additional picks.
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Per Jeff Legwold (who knows 99% less about the NFL than GB Warrior)
"With the wealthiest ownership group in the NFL as well as a fan base passionate enough, even now, to have given the Broncos a home sellout streak that dates back to 1970, the Broncos' head-coaching role will be an attractive job."
So the writer paid to write about the Broncos is drumming up the Broncos open head coaching position? Shocking!
What makes the position attractive (other than selling out the stadium, which probably means the fanbase expects winning football, and given they’re one of the worst rosters in the league and don’t have their first or second round picks either of the next two years isn’t a great way to change that…)?
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I think the Bronco's were obligated to fire their coach when they get roasted by Patrick Squid live....
Funny: https://twitter.com/barstoolsports/status/1607134599842533376?s=20&t=B82zRzRe9Uo-vJ-rnv_Ehw (https://twitter.com/barstoolsports/status/1607134599842533376?s=20&t=B82zRzRe9Uo-vJ-rnv_Ehw)
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So the writer paid to write about the Broncos is drumming up the Broncos open head coaching position? Shocking!
What makes the position attractive (other than selling out the stadium, which probably means the fanbase expects winning football, and given they’re one of the worst rosters in the league and don’t have their first or second round picks either of the next two years isn’t a great way to change that…)?
And having a wealthy ownership group really doesn't mean much in the NFL because your limitation is the cap. Anyway, I still think Miami where Ross wanted him last year. I always thought McDaniel was just a cheap, one-year rental. He will be the fall guy for Tua playing with concussion issues.
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The Colts cleaned house after seven games, when they were 3-3-1. Under Saturday, the Colts have gone 1-7.
The current division leader is under .500.
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The Colts cleaned house after seven games, when they were 3-3-1. Under Saturday, the Colts have gone 1-7.
The current division leader is under .500.
Great result!
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And having a wealthy ownership group really doesn't mean much in the NFL because your limitation is the cap. Anyway, I still think Miami where Ross wanted him last year. I always thought McDaniel was just a cheap, one-year rental. He will be the fall guy for Tua playing with concussion issues.
I think that would be incredibly dumb, given what McDaniel has shown so far, but then again…it’s Stephen Ross.
Adding Hill helps tremendously, sure, but he’s completely remade that offense with average RBs and made Tua look way better than he actually is until the last few weeks.
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Panthers playoff tickets go on sale in about an hour.
Be patient, everybody, there are plenty available!
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The rumor about a month ago was that Payton was angling for the Chargers job. However, I don't see the Spanos dumping Staley after the making the playoffs.
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One thing I think the Bears should entertain is buying draft picks, and I think Indianapolis is a great team to work with in that regard.
Matt Ryan’s deal is up after 2023, and he has a $10M roster bonus due 3/17. If the Bears took on Ryan’s contract in early March for a 2nd & 5th, and then released him before 3/17, everyone (Ryan loses $10M) wins. Indy simply loses two picks, it costs the Bears $18M in cap space they have to burn anyway.
For me, if the Bears trade down, whoever is at #4 would be the ideal trade partner to get Carter and get additional picks.
Agree completely on buying picks with the cap space. It's a better option than overpaying mediocre talent in the free agent pool.
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So the writer paid to write about the Broncos is drumming up the Broncos open head coaching position? Shocking!
What makes the position attractive (other than selling out the stadium, which probably means the fanbase expects winning football, and given they’re one of the worst rosters in the league and don’t have their first or second round picks either of the next two years isn’t a great way to change that…)?
I did not know Legwold was a shill for the Broncos. I stand corrected.
I think the Broncos are an upper tier team in the league based upon history, fan support, ownership, facilities and a lot of former Broncos stay in Denver due to business opportunities. But I do agree the present state of the team is not great good.
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The rumor about a month ago was that Payton was angling for the Chargers job. However, I don't see the Spanos dumping Staley after the making the playoffs.
Yea their turnaround has been remarkable. They should be heavy favorites to win out and finish 11-6. Amazing that if they didn’t gift the Raiders two short field TDs in the 3rd quarter a couple weeks ago, they’d be on track for a 12 win season.
They’ve got a top 10 defense, he’s put the pieces in place to keep developing Herbert into a star (bringing in Lombardi as OC, getting Chase Daniel who is a great mentor backup), all while still learning to overcome his propensity for trying to outthink himself and be too cute.
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JJ Watt announces retirement.
During his first year of play with the Texans I remember Wade Phillips quote on Watt: "He is going to be a bust"
Was Wade channeling Mel Kiper on draft day? Was JJ that bad? No, no....it meant already as a rookie Phillips thought JJ would have a bust in the HOF. He was that good.
Best Texan player on Defense ever (Andre Johnson on offense).Next to Lawrence Taylor JJ's 5 year peak run was the best individual defensive play I witnessed in the last 55 years. The next best we will remember of him and why Houston will always love the guy was JJ's community and charity involvement. It was real and consistent. He started a fund for Hurricane Harvey with his own
$100 k and hoped it would be matched....it raised $41 million...the most by an internet funding campaign ever. Walter Payton award winner
We knew he gave it all here and as Texans were floundering, he was released after ten years to find a competitive team on his own. Cardinals were an interesting pick. Heck Texans helped Cards by sending D Hopkins there for a backup running back (Thanks Bill Obrien) Too bad he never got a Superbowl
Thanks for your star on and off the field...you did Pewaukee proud
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JJ Watt is a decent dude and very charitable, but I’m SHOCKED he took this retirement path and not a corny full year documentary, preferably with a Fort Minor soundtrack.
Incredible player at his peak, first ballot HOFer, but man JJ has always LOVED the JJ story and brand
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JJ Watt is a decent dude and very charitable, but I’m SHOCKED he took this retirement path and not a corny full year documentary, preferably with a Fort Minor soundtrack.
Incredible player at his peak, first ballot HOFer, but man JJ has always LOVED the JJ story and brand
That whole family can get shot to the moon
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JJ Watt is a decent dude and very charitable, but I’m SHOCKED he took this retirement path and not a corny full year documentary, preferably with a Fort Minor soundtrack.
Incredible player at his peak, first ballot HOFer, but man JJ has always LOVED the JJ story and brand
lol you're right
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Derek Carr as a Raider appears over
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Derek Carr as a Raider appears over
So if the Raiders cut Carr, he'd simply be a free agent and any team that wants to sign him would be starting over -- not bound by his current contract at all. Right?
It will be interesting to see what he'd fetch on the open market. He regressed this season, but he was pretty darn good in 2021, and he's only 31 years old.
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Carr to Giants?
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I wonder if Brady goes to Vegas next season.
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So if the Raiders cut Carr, he'd simply be a free agent and any team that wants to sign him would be starting over -- not bound by his current contract at all. Right?
It will be interesting to see what he'd fetch on the open market. He regressed this season, but he was pretty darn good in 2021, and he's only 31 years old.
Yep. And given that the Raiders owe him $116MM over the next 3 seasons, taking the $41MM hit to close out the rest of his guaranteed money isn’t a terrible outcome.
And I agree, he’s been a solid to very good QB throughout his career. Shocking that notable coaching cancer Josh McDaniels shows up and suddenly he regresses to his worst stats in 6+ years…
I wonder if Brady goes to Vegas next season.
God I’d love that. 46 year old Brady with no arm strength playing for McDaniels who has only poisoned QBs as a HC
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The Raiders are always fun. But if Brady goes to Vegas, he’ll have more luck at the casinos than on the field.
McDaniels should always have a job in the NFL. People love watching a train wreck.
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Yep. And given that the Raiders owe him $116MM over the next 3 seasons, taking the $41MM hit to close out the rest of his guaranteed money isn’t a terrible outcome.
And I agree, he’s been a solid to very good QB throughout his career. Shocking that notable coaching cancer Josh McDaniels shows up and suddenly he regresses to his worst stats in 6+ years…
God I’d love that. 46 year old Brady with no arm strength playing for McDaniels who has only poisoned QBs as a HC
As far as I'm concerned the salary cap is pure calvinball. It means everything and nothing simultaneously. You say hit of $41M, this writer says $5.6M. Who knows!
https://theathletic.com/4042142/2022/12/29/derek-carr-raiders-nfl-trade/
"The other part of that reality is that sitting Carr, who signed a three-year, $121.5 million contract last offseason, eliminates the risk of him getting injured, potentially ruining his trade value as well as putting the team on the hook for $40.4 million over the next two years due to injury guarantees in his contract. Instead, the Raiders can move on from a healthy Carr this offseason while incurring a minimal dead cap hit of about $5.6 million."
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JJ Watt is a decent dude and very charitable, but I’m SHOCKED he took this retirement path and not a corny full year documentary, preferably with a Fort Minor soundtrack.
Incredible player at his peak, first ballot HOFer, but man JJ has always LOVED the JJ story and brand
I'm still recovering from the year-long coach K farewell tour
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I wonder if Brady goes to Vegas next season.
Brady gets to play against a Panthers D on Sunday that just lost all-pro-level shutdown CB Jaycee Horn. They already were without starting CB Donte Jackson. Carolina will be trying to defend Godwin, Evans, Gage, Jones and Rudolph with a bunch of scrubs and/or guys playing out of position. Panthers even just dug 35-year-old Josh Norman out of mothballs -- he had been mopping floors in his mom's restaurant and hasn't played football in a year.
If Brady can't produce significant offense and a victory against that pathetic group of DBs, he should just effen retire.
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Brady gets to play against a Panthers D on Sunday that just lost all-pro-level shutdown CB Jaycee Horn. They already were without starting CB Donte Jackson. Carolina will be trying to defend Godwin, Evans, Gage, Jones and Rudolph with a bunch of scrubs and/or guys playing out of position. Panthers even just dug 35-year-old Josh Norman out of mothballs -- he had been mopping floors in his mom's restaurant and hasn't played football in a year.
If Brady can't produce significant offense and a victory against that pathetic group of DBs, he should just effen retire.
He was actually working at his coffee shop.
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He was actually working at his coffee shop.
Yea, also not sure why the dig on a dude who made $70MM in his career who is actually being active and productive in an humble unglamorous fashion after leaving the league.
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From the Charlotte Observer article after the signing:
Norman has gone from working at the Omni Coffee & Eggs restaurant his mother owns in Atlanta — where he has done everything from sweep the floors to make the coffee to meet with business partners — to signing with the Carolina franchise that made him a fifth-round draft pick in 2012 and turned him into a star during the Super Bowl season of 2015.
It was not meant as a "dig." It's a fact.
And every article I read called it his mother's coffee shop -- which is what it is, even if Norman bought it and gave it to her (I don't know if that's the case or not).
Norman was one of my favorite players on the 2015 Super Bowl team. He went on to less on-field success but he made a lot of money and he seems to still have a passion for football.
And yet I still think my take is valid:
The most accomplished QB in football history and a group of well-regarded receivers should be able to torch a secondary that's so depleted by injury that they were forced to bring back a guy who hasn't even taken part in an NFL practice for almost a full year.
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Yea, also not sure why the dig on a dude who made $70MM in his career who is actually being active and productive in an humble unglamorous fashion after leaving the league.
Erin Andrews has entered the chat.
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From the Charlotte Observer article after the signing:
Norman has gone from working at the Omni Coffee & Eggs restaurant his mother owns in Atlanta — where he has done everything from sweep the floors to make the coffee to meet with business partners — to signing with the Carolina franchise that made him a fifth-round draft pick in 2012 and turned him into a star during the Super Bowl season of 2015.
It was not meant as a "dig." It's a fact.
And every article I read called it his mother's coffee shop -- which is what it is, even if Norman bought it and gave it to her (I don't know if that's the case or not).
Norman was one of my favorite players on the 2015 Super Bowl team. He went on to less on-field success but he made a lot of money and he seems to still have a passion for football.
And yet I still think my take is valid:
The most accomplished QB in football history and a group of well-regarded receivers should be able to torch a secondary that's so depleted by injury that they were forced to bring back a guy who hasn't even taken part in an NFL practice for almost a full year.
He open a coffee shop near Cam Newton's spot in ATL as well. But even if you didn't mean it, highlighting the stereotypical lowest man on the totem pole grunt work instead of the fact that he was being a jack of all trades to help his mom while learning to open his new spot is just crappy phrasing. If you cant see the difference between "working at his mom's restaurant" and "mopping the floors", then you're purposefully being stubborn. Especially for someone who is supposedly one of your "favorites". Maybe you're just still a bit bitter he took the big money to leave Carolina for DC.
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Carr to Giants?
No. They are sticking with Daniel Jones.
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Kevin Warren would be a good hire by the Bears to be team president.
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He open a coffee shop near Cam Newton's spot in ATL as well. But even if you didn't mean it, highlighting the stereotypical lowest man on the totem pole grunt work instead of the fact that he was being a jack of all trades to help his mom while learning to open his new spot is just crappy phrasing. If you cant see the difference between "working at his mom's restaurant" and "mopping the floors", then you're purposefully being stubborn. Especially for someone who is supposedly one of your "favorites". Maybe you're just still a bit bitter he took the big money to leave Carolina for DC.
I went from "sweep the floors" in that Observer article to "mopping floors." It wasn't meant as a slight on him as a person, only a way to say that he hadn't been footballing -- kind of like saying Kurt Warner went from stocking shelves to the NFL.
But yes, you're right, it was very poorly worded, and I wish I hadn't said it the way I had.
I have absolutely no bitterness toward Josh Norman, who was one of my favorites. The Panthers gave him the franchise tag, and he was willing to return, but then the GM blindsided Norman by rescinding the tag. I do have negative feelings about the GM, Dave Gettleman; that was the first of his many foolish moves that ended up hurting a championship-level team.
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Kevin Warren would be a good hire by the Bears to be team president.
Agreed. Even though he did some good things there, I don't think the Big Ten and him were ever good fits.
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No. They are sticking with Daniel Jones.
Good.
I don't like the Giants. ;D
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Kevin Warren would be a good hire by the Bears to be team president.
A well educated, experienced and seasoned sports executive with tons of FO experience? Are we sure there isn't an accountant they could hire instead?
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Do not start Fields next week. The poor kid is going to get killed.
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That last play of the first half was atrocious by both Fields and Pringle.
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I take back what I said about the Bears drafting Carter or Anderson. Trade down enough to draft an entire OL
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Draft a QB at 2 and have your star RB be a RB.
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After the way this season has...uh..."developed," I am not sure if this coaching staff is any good either.
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Are the Colts going to seriously consider bringing Saturday back for the gig full time? They have been awful with him in place.
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This is definitely a Cabo/Cancun game by the Bears, which doesn’t speak well to the coaching staff. Losing is obviously fine, but some definite looks of giving up, which is no bueno.
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Imagine thinking Carson Wentz gives you a better shot at the playoffs
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Imagine thinking Carson Wentz gives you a better shot at the playoffs
I’ve turned that game on the game mix channel 3 times today, each time has been a Wentz interception, including a second ago.
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Imagine thinking Carson Wentz gives you a better shot at the playoffs
Wasn’t riverboat Ron mad earlier in the season for not getting enough credit for wanting Wentz? A laughably bad coaching decision.
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This is definitely a Cabo/Cancun game by the Bears, which doesn’t speak well to the coaching staff. Losing is obviously fine, but some definite looks of giving up, which is no bueno.
Lions have 500 yards of offense and the Bears offense is simply offensive
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I know Heineke was going through a rough stretch but he had a way bigger upside.
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Sorry, MU82
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The Dream, errr Process, is still alive.... I think the Texans will beat the Colts. Maybe the Bears will be 'on the clock' this time next week. :)
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I take back what I said about the Bears drafting Carter or Anderson. Trade down enough to draft an entire OL
As I've been saying since before the season, the Bears, by design, have very little NFL talent. A lot of the players on the team will not be in the NFL next year.
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Almost an epic catastrophe in Tampa.
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This is really bad by Ron Rivera.
https://twitter.com/scott7news/status/1609659037796139009?s=46&t=k4zeaVw1PKYIOgZPi5oUXg
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This is really bad by Ron Rivera.
https://twitter.com/scott7news/status/1609659037796139009?s=46&t=k4zeaVw1PKYIOgZPi5oUXg
Maye he thinks the Commanders are in the NBA, where everyone makes the playoffs.
That's right up there with Donovan McNabb not knowing games can end in a tie.
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This is really bad by Ron Rivera.
https://twitter.com/scott7news/status/1609659037796139009?s=46&t=k4zeaVw1PKYIOgZPi5oUXg
Even if Detroit and Green Bay tie?
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Jaire is playing big boy football today. Called for it and living up to it
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Sorry, MU82
Not happy, but not surprised. Woulda been hard to say they deserved being in the playoffs, though I would have taken it.
They have an interesting dilemma with Darnold, who actually played really well after he got his position back. The Panthers have a good OL now, and like a whole lot of QBs he's pretty good when he has time to pass. He won't get $18M/year from anyone (I don't think), but there will be interest and he won't have to stand in a bread line.
Almost an epic catastrophe in Tampa.
Frankly, that was one of the most amazing plays I've ever seen a punter make. Damn, the Panthers could have stolen that game right there!
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Vikes are who we thought they were, eh?
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Jets are not holding up their end.
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Jefferson has as many tackles as catches through 50 minutes.
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I take back what I said about the Bears drafting Carter or Anderson. Trade down enough to draft an entire OL
Tough dilemma. Carter can be a franchise building block at the most important position in Eberflus’ defense, but man, they need lots of players.
I think the decision will be based on what they do in free agency.
Also, Poles still hasn’t spoken publicly. Maybe he isn’t even sold on fields. Running QBs don’t win Super Bowls.
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It would be pretty unfair to put Det/GB into the Sunday night slot next week. That game needs to be played simultaneously with Seattle/LA.
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Tough dilemma. Carter can be a franchise building block at the most important position in Eberflus’ defense, but man, they need lots of players.
I think the decision will be based on what they do in free agency.
Also, Poles still hasn’t spoken publicly. Maybe he isn’t even sold on fields. Running QBs don’t win Super Bowls.
It is interesting that Poles didn’t draft Fields, and that certainly matters here. If Poles thinks Young or Stroud give the franchise a better long term outlook, I think he’d entertain anything, assuming he could get at least 2 firsts back for Fields.
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It is interesting that Poles didn’t draft Fields, and that certainly matters here. If Poles thinks Young or Stroud give the franchise a better long term outlook, I think he’d entertain anything, assuming he could get at least 2 firsts back for Fields.
Am I missing something? I’ve seen a fair number of Bear’s games this year and can’t imagine he’s worth multiple first round picks.
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It appears the best QB in division led his team to 3 wins while QBs 2-4 (or is Nathan Pieterman 2?) are in the Playoffs (not sure how we’re ranking Goff, Rodgers, and Cousins, just know they’re not one!) and playing each other to make the playoffs.
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As I've been saying since before the season, the Bears, by design, have very little NFL talent. A lot of the players on the team will not be in the NFL next year.
[/quote
Trash
When you said the Bears would only win 3 games (I think after they beat SF in week 1) I thought you were way off (thought 6 was more likely) and said so. But when they lose next week your prediction will be dead on. Nice call!
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A well educated, experienced and seasoned sports executive with tons of FO experience? Are we sure there isn't an accountant they could hire instead?
LOL. Does Ted Phillips have a son or daughter who needs a job?
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It appears the best QB in division led his team to 3 wins while QBs 2-4 (or is Nathan Pieterman 2?) are in the Playoffs (not sure how we’re ranking Goff, Rodgers, and Cousins, just know they’re not one!) and playing each other to make the playoffs.
That QB went 7-21 for 75 yards in a game where situations dictated throwing early and often against a bad defense.
There is a dearth of talent around him, but there is no universe in which Fields is the best, 2nd best, or 3rd best QB in the division right now. Best athlete and perhaps 2nd most difficult to game plan against.
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That QB went 7-21 for 75 yards in a game where situations dictated throwing early and often against a bad defense.
There is a dearth of talent around him, but there is no universe in which Fields is the best, 2nd best, or 3rd best QB in the division right now. Best athlete and perhaps 2nd most difficult to game plan against.
Wades was being funny. Nobody ever said Fields was the best in the division (maybe has the potential). And the Packers and Lions are not in the playoffs. The whole post should have been in teal.
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Wades was being funny. Nobody ever said Fields was the best in the division (maybe has the potential). And the Packers and Lions are not in the playoffs. The whole post should have been in teal.
Nope, there were definitely posts about the Bears having the best quarterback in the division.
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Nope, there were definitely posts about the Bears having the best quarterback in the division.
Ok. I'll take your word for it. This is an internet fan board so anything and everything is possible.
I will say in Fields' defense, even Mahomes could not take this Bears team to the playoffs, so using the playoffs as a barometer of QB play is not always the best.
If you were to "redraft" the divisional QB for next year, where would you take Fields?
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Ok. I'll take your word for it. This is an internet fan board so anything and everything is possible.
I will say in Fields' defense, even Mahomes could not take this Bears team to the playoffs, so using the playoffs as a barometer of QB play is not always the best.
If you were to "redraft" the divisional QB for next year, where would you take Fields?
https://twitter.com/MichaelDavSmith/status/1136709172446269444?t=y83fh0fKrOFu4DqQSjzCkg&s=19 (https://twitter.com/MichaelDavSmith/status/1136709172446269444?t=y83fh0fKrOFu4DqQSjzCkg&s=19)
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https://twitter.com/MichaelDavSmith/status/1136709172446269444?t=y83fh0fKrOFu4DqQSjzCkg&s=19 (https://twitter.com/MichaelDavSmith/status/1136709172446269444?t=y83fh0fKrOFu4DqQSjzCkg&s=19)
That is some funny stuff. What an idiot. Even after he threw 5 or 6 TDs in that one game, that would be a dumb hot take.
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I made the comment about Fields and with context at the time I said it, the Bears were in a 5 game stretch where their offense was third in the league for offensive points scored. Fields was the fourth highest rated QB in the NFL during that stretch and clearly at that time progressing. He is/was the youngest and most athletic QB in the division, and I made the comment that I’d remove contract status, but if we’re going full throttle here, obviously Fields currently has the best contract. And the rest of the division QB’s are…ok? It’s funny because the now #1 QB in the division (Goff) is the least likely to be back with his team next year. Not to get lost in this Packers run, but Rodgers statistically is meh, 25th in yards per attempt, interceptions way up, they’re winning with him more than because of him. Cousins is Cousins, if you like him over the other 3 QB’s, cool?
I still think the Packers will be fine and they’ll win the North 😉
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Justin Fields is definitely the best wildcat QB in the NFL. Can't imagine he'll have a long career given the number of hits he's taking.
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I've said it here before - a running QB has never won a SB.
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Justin Fields is definitely the best wildcat QB in the NFL.
That and $5 will get you a cup of coffee.
It is clear he is making progress. We he continue to do so? I don't think there is reason to believe he will not. I'd feel better moving forward with him as opposed to Jones with the Giants. But I'd feel better with about 10 other QBs than Fields.
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I've said it here before - a running QB has never won a SB.
And you were wrong before. Steve Young is widely considered one of the best running QBs in NFL history.
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Goff will be back.
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I've said it here before - a running QB has never won a SB.
Do you consider Josh Allen, Jalen Hurts, and Lamar Jackson the "running QBs" in this year's playoffs?
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Goff will be back.
If I had to guess, I’d guess he’d be back, but by no means financially is it a slam dunk. His restructuring was set up to allow Detroit to walk away fairly cleanly after 2022. They could draft a QB at 4, cut Goff, and net $13.5 million in cap space in 2023 and also frees up $20 million in 2024.
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Detroit has plenty of cap space. 5 picks in the top 80. He is one of the few players on the roster with a lot of playoff experience. And, when the rest of the offensive skill players have been healthy, he has been very good. Every one is raving about Ben Johnson as the offensive coordinator. Goff sat down with him as soon as he got the job and they put together the offense together, based on how Goff sees the game and what he likes to do. He is no longer seen as the bridge quarterback. And since, regardless of what happens against GB, Detroit looks to be a threat in 23-24, I cannot see them casting him aside for a rookie. And I don't think they can do better for less in the FA market.
He cannot put a team on his back and will them to victory. And I have my doubts about him in cold weather after the Carolina game. But compared to the alternatives out there, or sacrificing next season to bring in a rookie, I think Goff returns.
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And you were wrong before. Steve Young is widely considered one of the best running QBs in NFL history.
Young was not a running QB. He was a passer who ran when he needed to. To put him in the same category as Fields, Jackson, or Vick is just silly. It’s like calling Aaron Rodgers. Running QBs.
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Semantics.
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One thing the Lions can do is really take advantage of the 2024 draft (Williams, Maye). Depending on how things shake out, if the Colts or Panthers wanted to trade up, and you can extract a 2024 1st & 2nd (or 3rd) as part of trading down this year, that’s a lot of ammo for what should be a really good top of the 2024 draft.
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Young was not a running QB. He was a passer who ran when he needed to. To put him in the same category as Fields, Jackson, or Vick is just silly. It’s like calling Aaron Rodgers. Running QBs.
I guess if you tighten the definition enough, you will eventually be right.
But if you Google “best running quarterbacks in NFL history,” Steve Young is on that list.
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Packers/Lions game flexed to SNF.
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Well I was wrong about Packers not being on Sunday night. If I’m Seattle, I am pissed. If they win, Detroit has lost a bunch of motivation.
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Well I was wrong about Packers not being on Sunday night. If I’m Seattle, I am pissed. If they win, Detroit has lost a bunch of motivation.
Money vs competitive fairness? Money wins every time in every sport, pro or college.
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Well I was wrong about Packers not being on Sunday night. If I’m Seattle, I am pissed. If they win, Detroit has lost a bunch of motivation.
Maybe. Keeping GB out of the playoffs should be a lot of motivation for a team preaching culture
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Lions are pushing the 'AR disrespected us' schtick.
https://www.mlive.com/lions/2023/01/lions-irked-by-aaron-rodgers-smack-talk-heading-into-titanic-finale-vs-packers.html
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Maybe. Keeping GB out of the playoffs should be a lot of motivation for a team preaching culture
They’d rather make the playoffs.
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They’d rather make the playoffs.
Gotta win either way. You could be right. They could come out flat and dejected, wouldn’t be a terrible surprise
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In recent seasons the NFL has scheduled games like those two in the same time slot, citing competitive equality. Oh well.
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I guess the only other option would have been Ravens and Bengals playing for a division title if Cincinnati loses tonight. But I guess that’s not as compelling.
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I guess if you tighten the definition enough, you will eventually be right.
But if you Google “best running quarterbacks in NFL history,” Steve Young is on that list.
A lot of it is perception. In Young’s best years running, I bet he didn’t even average 10 yards a game more than Rodgers in his best years.
Young did have a knack for making some nice runs in big games, though, so I understand why he is considered a running QB.
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In recent seasons the NFL has scheduled games like those two in the same time slot, citing competitive equality. Oh well.
Do the Saturday night games do decent numbers compared to Sunday night? I was hoping they would have the Packers on Saturday late and the AFC South Championship on SNF. I know that would be less of a draw market wise, but it would be more fair (if the packers win and render the LA-Sea game useless who really cares). Probably more wishful thinking because going to a Saturday night game would have been *chefs kiss*
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Jacksonville has a legit gripe with having to play Saturday. Titans will have had extended rest, the least they could have done is give the Jags standard rest.
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I guess if you tighten the definition enough, you will eventually be right.
But if you Google “best running quarterbacks in NFL history,” Steve Young is on that list.
Steve Young was a really good runner, as his 5.9 yards per carry, 4,239 career rushing yards and 43 rushing TDs attest. But he ran infrequently and only averaged 25.1 rushing yards per game.
Conclusion: so great runner, even better passer. In his era, he was certainly a “running QB”. By today’s standards? He’s not.
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Steve Young was a really good runner, as his 5.9 yards per carry, 4,239 career rushing yards and 43 rushing TDs attest. But he ran infrequently and only averaged 25.1 rushing yards per game.
Conclusion: so great runner, even better passer. In his era, he was certainly a “running QB”. By today’s standards? He’s not.
Well then if we are only going by “today’s standards,” it makes Jockey’s statement rather meaningless.
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Man, this is a rough scene in Cincy. Prayers up for Hamlin, damn.
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No bueno.
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CPR was applied. The reactions from players was surreal.
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I don’t know how anyone on that field can be asked to continue after witnessing that. Those poor players and coaches
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A heartbreaking moment in sports. At a loss of words.
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Yeah, exactly what Rico said. How the hell do you keep playing?
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Wow....just turned it on. Did he just collapse? Awful.
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Last time I saw CPR on the field was Reggie Brown for the Lions in 1997. I saw it on a basketball court during a G league game about 4 years ago. Done it a couple hundred times.
Rapid CPR and application of an AED is his best hope.
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A real concern is with the loss of focus/emotion, someone else gets hurt.
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Last time I saw CPR on the field was Reggie Brown for the Lions in 1997. I saw it on a basketball court during a G league game about 4 years ago. Done it a couple hundred times.
Rapid CPR and application of an AED is his best hope.
Someone collapsed in a group I was playing pickup basketball with maybe 4 or so years ago now. Got the AED hooked up, did compressions, came to after the 2nd shock. Didn’t know why he had people standing over him. Ended up having multiple bypass surgery. Was back playing a year later. One of the most traumatic things I’ve ever witnessed. We obviously stopped playing for the rest of that night. Don’t think I got any sleep.
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I can't imagine they'll play this game tonight.
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Just call it a tie.
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Last time I saw CPR on the field was Reggie Brown for the Lions in 1997. I saw it on a basketball court during a G league game about 4 years ago. Done it a couple hundred times.
Rapid CPR and application of an AED is his best hope.
That was an impactful blow to the chest he took. The collapse was so scary. Think the NFL has to officially cancel the game and am sure they will shortly
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That was an impactful blow to the chest he took. The collapse was so scary. Think the NFL has to officially cancel the game and am sure they will shortly
Wow. That was truly terrifying. Horrible.
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The fact that it was a blow to the chest (we think), along with his youth and conditioning, is the best reason for hope.
Prayers up.
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Impactful blow to the chest like that.
As a multi-year Emergency medical professional. My first concern with how he went down, and seeing similar events… I’m really worried about his aorta and carotid arteries. Ie: rupture, dissection.
A sudden stop of blood flow to the brain heart and lungs will knock you out like that.
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Yes, the ruptured aorta is the big fear.
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Twitter reporting he “has a pulse but is not breathing on his own.”
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Read on Twitter, he has a pulse, but not breathing on his own, for what it’s worth.
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Impactful blow to the chest like that.
As a multi-year Emergency medical professional. My first concern with how he went down, and seeing similar events… I’m really worried about his aorta and carotid arteries. Ie: rupture, dissection.
A sudden stop of blood flow to the brain heart and lungs will knock you out like that.
Agree. Hopefully not aortic in nature, he would probably not make it.
CPR and shocking not good, especially that length of time without transport.
CPR and shocking in front of teammates is just a mental issue that will last forever in their memories.
No way this game goes on.
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Friends, don't get hung up on twitter, please. An ounce of patience for something official.
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Friends, don't get hung up on twitter, please. An ounce of patience for something official.
I mean, it’s all over the place on that platform.
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Friends, don't get hung up on twitter, please. An ounce of patience for something official.
Correct. Like all situations, misinformation flows quickly on social media
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I’m praying that the delay in calling off the game could be a good sign, looking for any silver lining.
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I don't know the protocols in Cincinnati. I know our protocols are that we never transport without a pulse.
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I don't know the protocols in Cincinnati. I know our protocols are that we never transport without a pulse.
Updates from local Cincy. https://twitter.com/FOX19Joe/status/1610098849636388870?t=hGYVH3vJHgNzG4542_AEeQ&s=19 (https://twitter.com/FOX19Joe/status/1610098849636388870?t=hGYVH3vJHgNzG4542_AEeQ&s=19)
This game needs to be called. It is unsafe and unfair to continue.
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Teammates stand around a player like that to keep the cameras off the injured player.
Same thing as when Christian Eriksen had cardiac arrest playing for Denmark in the Euros.
Prayers up.
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I’m praying that the delay in calling off the game could be a good sign, looking for any silver lining.
It doesn't sound like they know anything Goose.
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What, exactly, is the NFL waiting for?
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Call it already. Make it a tie, it’s really that simple.
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Call it already. Make it a tie, it’s really that simple.
League office going through the lawyers first and advertising folks second
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The NFL leadership is showing a lack of leadership and respect to their players. I think their lack of compassion is disgusting.
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League office going through the lawyers first and advertising folks second
You’re not wrong here either.
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The 30 for 30 on Hank Gathers was well done. But hopefully we don’t need one for this. Keyante Johnson collapsed at Florida, was out for years, and is now really good for Kansas State. Hopefully that’s closer to this story.
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What, exactly, is the NFL waiting for?
It took way longer than it should have.
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It’s amazing that the NFL earlier was like “ok, ambulance is gone, you guys have 5 minutes to get loose”.
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Intubated and in critical condition.
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League office going through the advertising folks first and lawyers second
FIFY
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It’s amazing that the NFL earlier was like “ok, ambulance is gone, you guys have 5 minutes to get loose”.
That's seriously messed up.
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I guess if you tighten the definition enough, you will eventually be right.
But if you Google “best running quarterbacks in NFL history,” Steve Young is on that list.
He's on the list because he was the best running qb of his time. A running QB in the 90s is very different than a running QB today.
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The NFL didn’t decide to cancel/suspend this game, the players did
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It’s amazing that the NFL earlier was like “ok, ambulance is gone, you guys have 5 minutes to get loose”.
The NFLPA reps need to have that emblazoned on their shirts in the next round of negotiations.
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Update from his agent.
https://mobile.twitter.com/jordonr/status/1610117943454568451
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I know it's informed partly by his intimate personal healthy history, but Ryan Clark has been excellent in navigating this.
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I know it's informed partly by his intimate personal healthy history, but Ryan Clark has been excellent in navigating this.
I've only been watching since he and SVP took over and they're doing exceptional work.
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I share this only for context.
When I worked for the Bears (23 years ago), one of my duties on game days was if a player from the Bears was injured badly, I had to go into the stands and find the players significant other(s) and escort them to the locker room area. I remember Bobby Engram tore his ACL, and I had to find his wife and two kids in the player’s seating section, and get them out of there. Mrs. Engram was distraught and his kids were like 4 & 2.
Nowhere near the level of what happened tonight, I just can’t imagine Hamlin’s mother coming out of the crowd, probably not knowing what was exactly going on, just impossible to comprehend.
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They have to declare this a no contest or a tie. The Bills aren’t likely to be ready mentally to play next Sunday, though they will have to barring this doesn’t take a more tragic turn. Trying to manipulate the schedule at this point doesn’t make any sense.
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The Panthers switched from grass to artificial turf for this season, and players from both the Panthers and the Lions said the surface was hard as concrete on Dec. 24, when game-time temperature was about 20 degrees.
There were numerous injuries for both teams, and the NFLPA reportedly has filed a grievance against the Panthers.
The move to artificial turf was made to save money because the stadium, which rarely held anything except for 10 Panthers games a year, now hosts an MLS team and many concerts/events. Panthers owner Dave Tepper is the NFL's second-richest owner. Several Carolina players, who have never before publicly criticized Tepper over anything, have forcefully told him that the field should be grass again.
Given the enormous investment Tepper has made in his players, the cost of maintaining a grass field would seem to be comparative pocket change for a multi-billionaire. Especially one who claims to put players' health above all else.
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I think part of the problem is that the field was not designed to be played on in 20 degree temperatures. Honestly, how often does that happen in Carolina? So, a weather scenario that had not been planned for happened and the field was a nightmare. Pretty straightforward.
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They have to declare this a no contest or a tie. The Bills aren’t likely to be ready mentally to play next Sunday, though they will have to barring this doesn’t take a more tragic turn. Trying to manipulate the schedule at this point doesn’t make any sense.
It seems virtually impossible for multiple reasons for this game to ever be concluded. Even removing the mental/emotional considerations (which are #1 here), there’s zero dates/time to make a conclusion work logistically. You’re absolutely right, I don’t know how the Bills focus on prep for their game with the Patriots in five days, let alone find time to go back to Cincinnati.
Unless I’m missing a small vocal minority, it seems near unanimous to just call it a tie.
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It seems virtually impossible for multiple reasons for this game to ever be concluded. Even removing the mental/emotional considerations (which are #1 here), there’s zero dates/time to make a conclusion work logistically. You’re absolutely right, I don’t know how the Bills focus on prep for their game with the Patriots in five days, let alone find time to go back to Cincinnati.
Unless I’m missing a small vocal minority, it seems near unanimous to just call it a tie.
If you call a tie, it gives the division to the Bengals. I'm guessing they call it no contest and next week is for the AFC North.
They'll have to figure out tiebreakers for the one seed, but that's far and away better than trying to force this game
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If you call a tie, it gives the division to the Bengals. I'm guessing they call it no contest and next week is for the AFC North.
They'll have to figure out tiebreakers for the one seed, but that's far and away better than trying to force this game
Ahh, you’re right, that’s my bad. Good call.
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I think part of the problem is that the field was not designed to be played on in 20 degree temperatures. Honestly, how often does that happen in Carolina? So, a weather scenario that had not been planned for happened and the field was a nightmare. Pretty straightforward.
We get 30 and under fairly often. And players were complaining about this turf well before that game. That game just really put the exclamation point on it.
If all the owner cares about is money, fine. Be honest, and don't say you actually prioritize the health of your players.
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If you call a tie, it gives the division to the Bengals. I'm guessing they call it no contest and next week is for the AFC North.
They'll have to figure out tiebreakers for the one seed, but that's far and away better than trying to force this game
And I bet if you polled the coaches and players from all the other teams impacted negatively by a "no contest" decision, they would be unanimously supportive.
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This is why I said there are no good answers. Last night's game had seeding implications. All answers have implications and downsides.
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We get 30 and under fairly often. And players were complaining about this turf well before that game. That game just really put the exclamation point on it.
If all the owner cares about is money, fine. Be honest, and don't say you actually prioritize the health of your players.
I'm also old enough to remember when owners were cheap for not installing field turf, and were putting players at risk by holding games on grass fields that were ripped up from torrential rains or high school championships. The backlash against field turf has been pretty sudden, and it may be correct, but blaming this solely on money is a "when you're a hammer everything looks like a nail" reaction.
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The more I think about it, the NFL should postpone week 18 by a week, and do away with the bye week between the conference championship games and the Super Bowl.
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I'm also old enough to remember when owners were cheap for not installing field turf, and were putting players at risk by holding games on grass fields that were ripped up from torrential rains or high school championships. The backlash against field turf has been pretty sudden, and it may be correct, but blaming this solely on money is a "when you're a hammer everything looks like a nail" reaction.
Soldier Field has been bad, whether artificial or natural. Plenty of other grass fields have been very good, from Lambeau up north to most of the warm-weather sites.
In Charlotte, we have advantages of moderate climate, no drought conditions, etc. There was never a problem maintaining the grass field for decades. Adding a couple dozen soccer games and a few other events a year shouldn't change that (as long as monster trucks and the like aren't among them); it would just make it somewhat more expensive. Tepper obviously has the money to do it.
The players -- guys who have played on both the grass before this season and now the artificial stuff -- are begging for the return to grass. They are saying that injuries are worse and recovery time is longer. McCaffrey, who was never a "rock the boat" guy, also said it before he was traded. Value your players; go back to grass.
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Soldier Field has been bad, whether artificial or natural. Plenty of other grass fields have been very good, from Lambeau up north to most of the warm-weather sites.
In Charlotte, we have advantages of moderate climate, no drought conditions, etc. There was never a problem maintaining the grass field for decades. Adding a couple dozen soccer games and a few other events a year shouldn't change that (as long as monster trucks and the like aren't among them); it would just make it somewhat more expensive. Tepper obviously has the money to do it.
The players -- guys who have played on both the grass before this season and now the artificial stuff -- are begging for the return to grass. They are saying that injuries are worse and recovery time is longer. McCaffrey, who was never a "rock the boat" guy, also said it before he was traded. Value your players; go back to grass.
Justin Jefferson on line 1 for you.
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Justin Jefferson on line 1 for you.
Only the parts the Packers watered down were bad.
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It seems virtually impossible for multiple reasons for this game to ever be concluded. Even removing the mental/emotional considerations (which are #1 here), there’s zero dates/time to make a conclusion work logistically. You’re absolutely right, I don’t know how the Bills focus on prep for their game with the Patriots in five days, let alone find time to go back to Cincinnati.
Unless I’m missing a small vocal minority, it seems near unanimous to just call it a tie.
The solution, if they really want one, is to move the start of the playoffs back a week, play this game on Jan. 15 and eliminate the Sunday off before the Super Bowl, i.e. the Pro Bowl week.
Edit: I see you later suggested this.
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The solution, if they really want one, is to move the start of the playoffs back a week, play this game on Jan. 15 and eliminate the Sunday off before the Super Bowl, i.e. the Pro Bowl week.
Edit: I see you later suggested this.
Do we know if all of the venues would be available?
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Do we know if all of the venues would be available?
I really, really doubt they are going to change the schedule up. The NFL likes the two weeks in between the conference championship games and the Super Bowl. (ETA on how long this prediction will be wrong?)
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The solution, if they really want one, is to move the start of the playoffs back a week, play this game on Jan. 15 and eliminate the Sunday off before the Super Bowl, i.e. the Pro Bowl week.
Edit: I see you later suggested this.
I've read they actually really need two weeks to prep everything for the Superbowl.
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I've read they actually really need two weeks to prep everything for the Superbowl.
I think they want/prefer it, but they don't need it. Both the 2002 and 2003 Super Bowls were played a week after the conference championship games.
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I've read they actually really need two weeks to prep everything for the Superbowl.
In the city/at the field? Because Glendale will not be hosting a conference championship game this year, so they'll be able to start preparing a week from yesterday.
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Panthers owner has already spoken to Harbaugh about the team's coaching vacancy, Charlotte Observer reports.
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Panthers owner has already spoken to Harbaugh about the team's coaching vacancy, Charlotte Observer reports.
Him and the Denver Broncos owner.
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Him and the Denver Broncos owner.
Does he get the Wal-Mart employee discount? Could set him up with tan Dockers for life.
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In the city/at the field? Because Glendale will not be hosting a conference championship game this year, so they'll be able to start preparing a week from yesterday.
Also no Pro Bowl that really needs dedicated attention
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Panthers owner has already spoken to Harbaugh about the team's coaching vacancy, Charlotte Observer reports.
Maybea he kan higher his BIL two. Dude kneeds a patchek two, aina?
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Have to think that at this point, the NFL intends on concluding Bills/Bengals.
I know this may sound crappy to say, but I honestly think a big part of the reason is that Bills/Bengals is the final game of fantasy/best ball seasons.
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Have to think that at this point, the NFL intends on concluding Bills/Bengals.
I know this may sound crappy to say, but I honestly think a big part of the reason is that Bills/Bengals is the final game of fantasy/best ball seasons.
They’re going to have to announce something today right?
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They’re going to have to announce something today right?
They have to wait for their lawyers to chart their course first.
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Harbaugh says he's staying at Michigan ... I think?
https://twitter.com/UMichFootball/status/1611106003478802437
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Harbaugh says he's staying at Michigan ... I think?
https://twitter.com/UMichFootball/status/1611106003478802437
What a bizarre statement.
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Yeah that statement is basically equivalent to the ones that GMs/Owners give about coaches people want fired as a voice of confidence.
Hes here for now. But when those jobs truly open up at seasons end, hes more than open to be wowed.
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What a bizarre statement.
It’s what he’s always said. FWIW, he finally has an agent and given the rising salaries for coaches in the Big Ten and the fact he took a pay cut after 2020 and well, a picture emerges
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Harbaugh says he's staying at Michigan ... I think?
https://twitter.com/UMichFootball/status/1611106003478802437
"It'll cost you!"
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It’s what he’s always said. FWIW, he finally has an agent and given the rising salaries for coaches in the Big Ten and the fact he took a pay cut after 2020 and well, a picture emerges
Yea, I mean, I don't entirely blame him. There are 2 coaches in his own conference making more than $2MM a season than he does, and they both happen to be his arch rivals that he soundly THUMPED this year. And one is Mel Tucker who got an absurd contract in no small part to beating Michigan last year.
He absorbed all the criticism from 2017-2020, and created a beast. in 15 seasons before Harbaugh, Michigan had 4 10 win seasons, Harbaugh now has 5. They had 2 11 win seasons in 20 years. He's had them back to back.
Let him angle for the cash, he deserves it.
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Yea, I mean, I don't entirely blame him. There are 2 coaches in his own conference making more than $2MM a season than he does, and they both happen to be his arch rivals that he soundly THUMPED this year. And one is Mel Tucker who got an absurd contract in no small part to beating Michigan last year.
He absorbed all the criticism from 2017-2020, and created a beast. in 15 seasons before Harbaugh, Michigan had 4 10 win seasons, Harbaugh now has 5. They had 2 11 win seasons in 20 years. He's had them back to back.
Let him angle for the cash, he deserves it.
I do not disagree
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If you hate the NFL game, you're about to hate the NFL marketing https://twitter.com/MikeGarafolo/status/1611072050466013185?t=Jz48NbTDNK7PTd1Tecz-HQ&s=19 (https://twitter.com/MikeGarafolo/status/1611072050466013185?t=Jz48NbTDNK7PTd1Tecz-HQ&s=19)
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This seems complex but will make sense by Sunday I guess.
https://twitter.com/nfl345/status/1611184290896965632?s=46&t=66JzHHSuSzQrH5WCznrTww
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This seems complex but will make sense by Sunday I guess.
https://twitter.com/nfl345/status/1611184290896965632?s=46&t=66JzHHSuSzQrH5WCznrTww
Probably about the fairest thing you could do.
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I really wonder if the NFL can get 24 owners to vote “yes” tomorrow. Bengals are already on record as a “no” vote for tomorrow. I can’t see the Rooney’s, Hunt’s, Mara’s, McCaskey’s as “yes” votes, but who knows.
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If you hate the NFL game, you're about to hate the NFL marketing https://twitter.com/MikeGarafolo/status/1611072050466013185?t=Jz48NbTDNK7PTd1Tecz-HQ&s=19 (https://twitter.com/MikeGarafolo/status/1611072050466013185?t=Jz48NbTDNK7PTd1Tecz-HQ&s=19)
That was a direct quote from the UC hospital press conference. That was the Doctor's response to Hamlin. Garafolo is summarizing the press conference given by the doctors, and that was the beginning.
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I really wonder if the NFL can get 24 owners to vote “yes” tomorrow. Bengals are already on record as a “no” vote for tomorrow. I can’t see the Rooney’s, Hunt’s, Mara’s, McCaskey’s as “yes” votes, but who knows.
I would guess this has been pretty well vetted. And the obvious response for me would be...what's the alternative? The NFL is making the best out of a pretty terrible situation here.
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Bizarro World:
The top three QBs in passer rating the last 6 weeks: Jared Goff, Brock Purdy and Sam Darnold.
A guy who was considered expendable; Mr. Irrelevant; and arguably the worst QB in the NFL the previous 4 years.
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Rumors that McDaniel could be out in Miami if they don't make the playoffs, presumably cause Ross wants to target Sean Payton and Brady.
Now I don't expect anything smart from Ross and see why someone wants Payton, but I can't imagine the infatuation with a 46 year old Brady enough to upset the apple cart.
The only QB criteria that Brady ranks in the top 10 in is yards and completions...because he has 50 more attempts than second on the list and 100 more attempts than someone like Mahomes who is 4th in attempts. 5th in attempts is Burrow and he's 150 attempts lower than Brady.
Brady's rating is barely top 20, right next to Heinecke, and his QBR is lower than guys like Carr and Mariota who got benched. And interesting for a team with Waddle and Hill, Brady's yards per attempt and yards per completion are in the bottom 3 in the league. He's not the guy to get the ball to guys stretching the field. Its not 2012 anymore
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That was a direct quote from the UC hospital press conference. That was the Doctor's response to Hamlin. Garafolo is summarizing the press conference given by the doctors, and that was the beginning.
I understand what he's doing. I'm telling you the NFL is going to market the crap out of a player who loves the game so much that his first words after almost dying on the field is around whether the Bills won. #footballfamily
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I would guess this has been pretty well vetted. And the obvious response for me would be...what's the alternative? The NFL is making the best out of a pretty terrible situation here.
I nominate Jim Jordan to decide the outcome
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I nominate Jim Jordan to decide the outcome
::) ::) ::)
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I understand what he's doing. I'm telling you the NFL is going to market the crap out of a player who loves the game so much that his first words after almost dying on the field is around whether the Bills won. #footballfamily
Which would be funny, because I read that the docs' response and releasing that info as a direct shot across the bow against that kind of thing.
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Rumors that McDaniel could be out in Miami if they don't make the playoffs, presumably cause Ross wants to target Sean Payton and Brady.
Now I don't expect anything smart from Ross and see why someone wants Payton, but I can't imagine the infatuation with a 46 year old Brady enough to upset the apple cart.
The only QB criteria that Brady ranks in the top 10 in is yards and completions...because he has 50 more attempts than second on the list and 100 more attempts than someone like Mahomes who is 4th in attempts. 5th in attempts is Burrow and he's 150 attempts lower than Brady.
Brady's rating is barely top 20, right next to Heinecke, and his QBR is lower than guys like Carr and Mariota who got benched. And interesting for a team with Waddle and Hill, Brady's yards per attempt and yards per completion are in the bottom 3 in the league. He's not the guy to get the ball to guys stretching the field. Its not 2012 anymore
I dislike Brady as well, but the WR situation in Miami is much better than it is in Tampa.
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I dislike Brady as well, but the WR situation in Miami is much better than it is in Tampa.
Much better? I don't know about that. Mike Evans has been a 1000 yard reciever every year he's been in the league and been a top 10 TD reception guy the last 4-5 years. He had 1500 yards with f-ing Jameis before Brady arrived. And Godwin is a top 5 2nd WR. The only teams with comparable WR pairs over the last few years are probably the Rams, now the Bengals, and the Seahawks, maybe the Chargers when Mike Williams is cooking.
The Dolphins obviously are there with Hill and Waddle. But Cedrick Wilson is no more special than Russel Gage or Julio Jones' corpse. And like I mentioned in my post, Hill's biggest weapon is his speed and I don't see Brady having the arm to be throwing 35-40 yard dimes with regularity when he springs free. You can only hit so many cross routes with him when there is no threat of him getting behind you.
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Get ready for the playoffs to change permanently, perhaps as early as next year.
They’re going to go to 8 teams in each conference (more inventory = more cash), and the conference title games are going to be played as stand alone games on different days, at neutral sites (Vegas will 100% be in the rotation).
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Get ready for the playoffs to change permanently, perhaps as early as next year.
They’re going to go to 8 teams in each conference (more inventory = more cash), and the conference title games are going to be played as stand alone games on different days, at neutral sites (Vegas will 100% be in the rotation).
Barf
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C'mon, take the money and run,
whoo whoo whooooo
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It feels that greatly devalues the regular season. Not as much of a reason to fight for the one seed. No incentives of byes.
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It feels that greatly devalues the regular season. Not as much of a reason to fight for the one seed. No incentives of byes.
Devaluing the regular season has occurred in all sports because the people that run them know the eyeballs will be there regardless - and even more will watch the playoffs.
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Get ready for the playoffs to change permanently, perhaps as early as next year.
They’re going to go to 8 teams in each conference (more inventory = more cash), and the conference title games are going to be played as stand alone games on different days, at neutral sites (Vegas will 100% be in the rotation).
That sounds like a report from The Onion.
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If I had to guess, total guess, they’d let the 1 seeds pick their wild card round opponent, and then re-seed each round there after. That would be the carrot for finishing first in conference (maybe).
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Glad to see the Bears are protecting Fields.
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Very silly start from Jacksonville so far, messing around is going to cost them the division.
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Stiff arm by Derrick Henry was impressive .
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Very silly start from Jacksonville so far, messing around is going to cost them the division.
Pedersen can’t help himself.
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That fumble was really really close to a pass.
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That fumble was really really close to a pass.
“Thanks, John.”
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Wow. Buffalo returns opening kick for TD.
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Couldn’t ask for a better start, Texans up 10-0, Bears down 6.
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Funny that Boyle comes in as Texans pick 6 happened a minute before.
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Funny that Boyle comes in as Texans pick 6 happened a minute before.
Boyle/Peterman, doesn’t matter. They should have let Butkus play qb today
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Lots of things could happen today but the worst that to happen today is the saints wearing black jerseys with white pants. What an awful look.
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Lots of things could happen today but the worst that to happen today is the saints wearing black jerseys with white pants. What an awful look.
1980s look.
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1980s look.
80's fashion should never come. back
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Texans telling the Bears “not so fast”
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Texans telling the Bears “not so fast”
Lovie giveth, Lovie taketh away
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I think the McNair family got a headset and told Davis Mills “just wildly fling it to whoever”.
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I don’t think the Texans will score here, but I’d be very curious to see what Lovie would do on the point after.
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I don’t think the Texans will score here, but I’d be very curious to see what Lovie would do on the point after.
Take a knee
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OMG
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OMG
Truly incredible!
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!!!!!!!
(Still time left though)
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GREAT RESULTS!
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Bears' plan coming together nicely. :D
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GREAT RESULTS!
Man, great position to be in. Texans going QB seems certain. Can get a ransom at 1 or stay put. Great opportunity to speed up the rebuild
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I will say, the Bears traded the 32nd pick for Claypool, which I disliked at the time, and hate even more now.
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GREAT RESULTS!
lol your qb is a running back why are you cheering losses I’m not panicking about GB’s demise
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I will say, the Bears traded the 32nd pick for Claypool, which I disliked at the time, and hate even more now.
Do the Bears get the #1 pick??
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lol your qb is a running back why are you cheering losses I’m not panicking about GB’s demise
I mean, did GB win the division?
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I mean, did GB win the division?
The Packers won the transitory division last week
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Who will the Bears take #1?
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Who will the Bears take #1?
They’ll trade out
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This is incredibly on-brand. Respect.
https://twitter.com/jon_greenberg/status/1612204826095456257?t=hFWpx4TkF-20qNEaPD9phg&s=19 (https://twitter.com/jon_greenberg/status/1612204826095456257?t=hFWpx4TkF-20qNEaPD9phg&s=19)
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Today, for the first time all season, I was rooting for the Panthers to lose. They screwed that up by beating the Saints 10-7 in a horrible game, and they dropped several draft spots in the process.
So my guys were just bad enough to fail to win the worst division in the league but not bad enough to get a high draft pick.
Woo-hoo.
To all those whose teams made the playoffs, congrats. And (I guess) congrats to Bear fans, too.
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Congratulations to Bears fans for having the most exciting day in the recent history of the franchise!
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Congratulations to Bears fans for having the most exciting day in the recent history of the franchise!
Thanks! 👍
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Thanks! 👍
Just imagine how much better it’ll be if the Lions keep the Packers out of the Playoffs tonight…🤯. Can you say better than a Super Bowl?!
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A bit of a problem, though.
To get the #1 pick, you need to be the worst team in football. Chicago is clearly that team. The QB is an unknown commodity. Is he just a runner or can he start hitting open receivers (not that the Bears have many of those)?
They need to add 5-6 quality players on offense. Then you have the worst defense in football to try and re-build. They won't be the worst team in the NFL next year but they will be closer to that than to the best team.
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Just imagine how much better it’ll be if the Lions keep the Packers out of the Playoffs tonight…🤯. Can you say better than a Super Bowl?!
I think you have me confused with a meatball fan, someone who is generally more concerned with an opponent than their own team.
Oh, I see what I did there.
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Remember this GM didn’t draft Fields either. And if they believe that Bryce Young, my guess is they would see what the market is like for Fields.
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A bit of a problem, though.
To get the #1 pick, you need to be the worst team in football. Chicago is clearly that team. The QB is an unknown commodity. Is he just a runner or can he start hitting open receivers (not that the Bears have many of those)?
They need to add 5-6 quality players on offense. Then you have the worst defense in football to try and re-build. They won't be the worst team in the NFL next year but they will be closer to that than to the best team.
Which brings up an intriguing option... Do you trade Fields for a ransom & start the rookie QB salary cap clock all over again with #1? Would put the new QB's developmental timeline in line with the rest of the team's.
I like Fields and think he's worth building around, but that's something that should definitely be considered
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A bit of a problem, though.
To get the #1 pick, you need to be the worst team in football. Chicago is clearly that team. The QB is an unknown commodity. Is he just a runner or can he start hitting open receivers (not that the Bears have many of those)?
They need to add 5-6 quality players on offense. Then you have the worst defense in football to try and re-build. They won't be the worst team in the NFL next year but they will be closer to that than to the best team.
If you think Caleb Williams is the next big thing, it’s not bad to be bad in 2024. Your point is very valid though, they are many players away.
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Remember this GM didn’t draft Fields either. And if they believe that Bryce Young, my guess is they would see what the market is like for Fields.
This, too, is an option. Lots of teams desperate for QBs.
Bears are in a great position at the moment. Can they maximize it? That is the question
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If you think Caleb Williams is the next big thing, it’s not bad to be bad in 2024. Your point is very valid though, they are many players away.
So THAT was the long game. Have your “dude” lose a bunch of games to get the #1 overall pick…to have MORE great results! next year so you can get your “dude’s” replacement at the top of NEXT year’s draft.
I think you have me confused with a meatball fan, someone who is generally more concerned with an opponent than their own team.
Oh, I see what I did there.
Yeah, you haven’t been saying anything about the Packers and how they’ve been worse off winning games and should be playing Love all year long!
And haven’t been worrying about the Texans and what they’re doing all year long, and celebrating their great result today!
Nope. Not you. Only concerned about your team!
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Actually Dish is about as level-headed a fan as there is. I think his joy over this season is misplaced but that’s not because he’s a meathead Bears’ fan.
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OMG
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That was a wild final minute. A tie does Seattle no good...unless Green Bay and Detroit tie.
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That was a wild final minute. A tie does Seattle no good...unless Green Bay and Detroit tie.
Between the Dolphins, Steelers, Patriots & Seahawks, the teams playing for that last spot are making a great case for expanding the playoffs, lol.
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That was a wild final minute. A tie does Seattle no good...unless Green Bay and Detroit tie.
Man, Baker had Jefferson wide open. Crazy last 5 minutes or so.
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As a Bears fan, I don't think I find joy in the season, but I do appreciate a plan to make the team better and they are executing the early and easiest steps well. Considering how the last management team left the franchise, this is the best plan and 3-14 is much better than 6-11 for a rebuild.
This could be fun for Bears fans; 1st pick in most rounds of the draft and $110M+ cap space.
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Man, Baker had Jefferson wide open. Crazy last 5 minutes or so.
What the hell was Diggs doing?!? He could have turned that up field instead of taunting. What a bunch of dumb football
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I think they are better than last year. However, they have only played adequate defense for one half in two games. They certainly have the weapons on offense. I doubt, though, that they can win a game where they score in the low 20's. I just don't see the run stoppers or playmakers at linebacker or safety.
So, improved, but I am not thinking playoffs
Bump
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Bump
They had a good season, regardless. Disappointing finish but showed a lot more than previous Lions teams. Big off-season. Number 6 pick helps, have to be smart in free agency
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Man, Baker had Jefferson wide open. Crazy last 5 minutes or so.
Baker showed why he is nothing more than a backup QB - if that.
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What the hell was Diggs doing?!? He could have turned that up field instead of taunting. What a bunch of dumb football
Yeah, watching it live, it made no sense why he immediately ran out of bounds. I think he did that just simply to taunt. He had at least five-ten yards to run upfield, his momentum certainly didn’t force him out. Really dumb (even with them winning).
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Spent most of the Lions game with flu like symptoms and I can't think of a more symbiotic way to end this season
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I hate division opponents meeting in the wild card round (already seen it twice), Packers (obviously Lions) would have been far more interesting than Seattle going to Santa Clara next weekend.
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I hate division opponents meeting in the wild card round (already seen it twice), Packers (obviously Lions) would have been far more interesting than Seattle going to Santa Clara next weekend.
Packers at 9ers would’ve been a boring blowout.
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Lovie out in Houston. But somehow GM Cesario is still around. Is he hiring his third head coach in as many seasons?
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Lovie out in Houston. But somehow GM Cesario is still around. Is he hiring his third head coach in as many seasons?
Yeah, made no sense Cesario is sticking around.
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Lovie out in Houston. But somehow GM Cesario is still around. Is he hiring his third head coach in as many seasons?
Third times a charm?
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lol your qb is a running back why are you cheering losses I’m not panicking about GB’s demise
Never seen a RB complete 66% of their passes over a 12 week span.
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Remember this GM didn’t draft Fields either. And if they believe that Bryce Young, my guess is they would see what the market is like for Fields.
The Bears aren't trading Fields to start over again.
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The Bears aren't trading Fields to start over again.
If they believe in Fields, that’s fine. But if they aren’t sure, not drafting some because they don’t want to start over is a bad reason.
But my guess is you mean they believe in Fields. And you are probably right.
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Bears 4th place schedule looks tougher than Packers 3rd place schedule to me.
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Bears 4th place schedule looks tougher than Packers 3rd place schedule to me.
The only differences are Bears have Browns, Cardinals and Commanders while the Packers have Steelers, Rams and Giants.
I would take the Bears' but it's not a slam dunk.
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If they believe in Fields, that’s fine. But if they aren’t sure, not drafting some because they don’t want to start over is a bad reason.
But my guess is you mean they believe in Fields. And you are probably right.
I do think they believe in Fields. Obviously he has more work to do and improvements to make. You clearly listen if someone makes you a "godfather" type of offer but I'm confident they won't be shopping him. I also don't think the QBs at the top of this year's draft are the kind of prospects where you'd actually consider trading Fields and drafting one of them.
At this point, I just think the "trade Fields and draft another young, unproven QB" talk is absurd.
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I do think they believe in Fields. Obviously he has more work to do and improvements to make. You clearly listen if someone makes you a "godfather" type of offer but I'm confident they won't be shopping him. I also don't think the QBs at the top of this year's draft are the kind of prospects where you'd actually consider trading Fields and drafting one of them.
At this point, I just think the "trade Fields and draft another young, unproven QB" talk is absurd.
Yea i agree. Even though I'm a big fan of Fields potential, I just don't see the top guys this year as generational.
Stroud is very good but he's played with insane receivers like Fields did at OSU, was a bit more accurate but not remarkable so, and regressed this year compared to last year with some of his decision making. He's also decidedly less mobile both in the pocket and especially out of it.
Young is electric, but you don't jettison someone like Fields for a 5'10 super thin QB. I worry about his durability. Also, compared to other undersized QBs who had success, Young is pretty slow of foot.
But plenty of teams desperately need a QB, here's hoping for a haul.
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Yea i agree. Even though I'm a big fan of Fields potential, I just don't see the top guys this year as generational.
Stroud is very good but he's played with insane receivers like Fields did at OSU, was a bit more accurate but not remarkable so, and regressed this year compared to last year with some of his decision making. He's also decidedly less mobile both in the pocket and especially out of it.
Young is electric, but you don't jettison someone like Fields for a 5'10 super thin QB. I worry about his durability. Also, compared to other undersized QBs who had success, Young is pretty slow of foot.
But plenty of teams desperately need a QB, here's hoping for a haul.
I love, love, love Bryce Young. He has preternatural football instincts and plenty of arm talent to take advantage of it. But you're dead on about the size/durability issues. He's mostly managed to avoid big hits in college due to his pocket presence (his injury this year came when he tried to extend a play outside the pocket rather than throw the ball away), but he doesn't have the Lamar-like athleticism to make that a sure thing in the pros. If he were a few inches taller, we'd be talking about him the way we talked about Lawrence and Luck, but he's not. He's still the top QB prospect, but one that carries some risk.
The guy I'm really interested in is Levis. He's the Honorary Josh Allen Boom or Bust of the 2023 draft. He has all the tools to be great, but often didn't perform like the sum of his parts at Kentucky. Some team in the top 10 is going to be very happy in about three years, or back to picking in the top 10.
As for the Bears, they're not really doing their job if they're not taking offers for Fields along with the #1 pick. Doesn't mean they should move Fields, but it should be on the table. Let's not forget, their GM was in KC when they traded multiple firsts to move up for a QB (Mahomes) when they already had a Pro Bowl QB (Smith) coming off a 12-4 season.
In hindsight, that move looks obvious, but it was questioned at the time.
My point being, don't assume the Bears won't draft a QB because they already have a QB. If Poles sees Young as an elite franchise guy, he could draft him and move Fields.
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I love, love, love Bryce Young. He has preternatural football instincts and plenty of arm talent to take advantage of it. But you're dead on about the size/durability issues. He's mostly managed to avoid big hits in college due to his pocket presence (his injury this year came when he tried to extend a play outside the pocket rather than throw the ball away), but he doesn't have the Lamar-like athleticism to make that a sure thing in the pros. If he were a few inches taller, we'd be talking about him the way we talked about Lawrence and Luck, but he's not. He's still the top QB prospect, but one that carries some risk.
The guy I'm really interested in is Levis. He's the Honorary Josh Allen Boom or Bust of the 2023 draft. He has all the tools to be great, but often didn't perform like the sum of his parts at Kentucky. Some team in the top 10 is going to be very happy in about three years, or back to picking in the top 10.
As for the Bears, they're not really doing their job if they're not taking offers for Fields along with the #1 pick. Doesn't mean they should move Fields, but it should be on the table. Let's not forget, their GM was in KC when they traded multiple firsts to move up for a QB (Mahomes) when they already had a Pro Bowl QB (Smith) coming off a 12-4 season.
In hindsight, that move looks obvious, but it was questioned at the time.
My point being, don't assume the Bears won't draft a QB because they already have a QB. If Poles sees Young as an elite franchise guy, he could draft him and move Fields.
Agreed, if he had Kyler or even Russell Wilson wheels, it would be a different story too. Though I too still really like his potential.
I think the difference is Smith was literally a decade older than Fields when they traded up for Mahomes. But agreed, Poles needs to listen to any and all offers, regardless of choice.
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I love, love, love Bryce Young. He has preternatural football instincts and plenty of arm talent to take advantage of it. But you're dead on about the size/durability issues. He's mostly managed to avoid big hits in college due to his pocket presence (his injury this year came when he tried to extend a play outside the pocket rather than throw the ball away), but he doesn't have the Lamar-like athleticism to make that a sure thing in the pros. If he were a few inches taller, we'd be talking about him the way we talked about Lawrence and Luck, but he's not. He's still the top QB prospect, but one that carries some risk.
The guy I'm really interested in is Levis. He's the Honorary Josh Allen Boom or Bust of the 2023 draft. He has all the tools to be great, but often didn't perform like the sum of his parts at Kentucky. Some team in the top 10 is going to be very happy in about three years, or back to picking in the top 10.
As for the Bears, they're not really doing their job if they're not taking offers for Fields along with the #1 pick. Doesn't mean they should move Fields, but it should be on the table. Let's not forget, their GM was in KC when they traded multiple firsts to move up for a QB (Mahomes) when they already had a Pro Bowl QB (Smith) coming off a 12-4 season.
In hindsight, that move looks obvious, but it was questioned at the time.
My point being, don't assume the Bears won't draft a QB because they already have a QB. If Poles sees Young as an elite franchise guy, he could draft him and move Fields.
Stop giving intelligent, well thought out, nuanced takes.
(I completely agree on your assessment of Young).
The real interesting thing, obviously hypothetical, is if Williams or Maye were in this year’s draft. If I’m the Bears, any trade I make, I want someone’s #1 next year as part of the trade. What would be of interest to me is if the Bears traded with the Colts at 4, would the Bears entertain trading back again, for a team looking at Stroud or Levis at 4.
I think they should and will build around Fields. Considering he progressed significantly, with a garbage offense around him, it’s exciting to see what he can do in year 3 (usually the biggest year in a QB’s development). That said, if he doesn’t continue to progress, or suffers a catastrophic injury, if you have two or three first round picks in 2024 with Williams and Maye available, that’s a good position to be in.
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Packers at 9ers would’ve been a boring blowout.
Best matchup won't even be played
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No surprise (and probably a year too late), but Kliff has been kanned.
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Stop giving intelligent, well thought out, nuanced takes.
(I completely agree on your assessment of Young).
The real interesting thing, obviously hypothetical, is if Williams or Maye were in this year’s draft. If I’m the Bears, any trade I make, I want someone’s #1 next year as part of the trade. What would be of interest to me is if the Bears traded with the Colts at 4, would the Bears entertain trading back again, for a team looking at Stroud or Levis at 4.
I think they should and will build around Fields. Considering he progressed significantly, with a garbage offense around him, it’s exciting to see what he can do in year 3 (usually the biggest year in a QB’s development). That said, if he doesn’t continue to progress, or suffers a catastrophic injury, if you have two or three first round picks in 2024 with Williams and Maye available, that’s a good position to be in.
I'm hoping the Bears can trade back, stay within the top 5, plus get a 2023 2nd and a 2024 1st, at minimum. We'll see if that's way too optimistic on my part.
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Never expected to see my Giants in the playoffs. Have a chance to beat the Vikings.
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Never expected to see my Giants in the playoffs. Have a chance to beat the Vikings.
I think people will be a little too quick to call B.S. on the Vikings in this game. Vikings are not winning the NFC and I think will all but certainly get bounced next weekend. BUT. I do think they'll take it to the Giants. Give me MN -3 all day.
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I think people will be a little too quick to call B.S. on the Vikings in this game. Vikings are not winning the NFC and I think will all but certainly get bounced next weekend. BUT. I do think they'll take it to the Giants. Give me MN -3 all day.
It'll be dark outside by the time the second half rolls around.
Betting on Kirk After Dark is a dangerous game.
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It'll be dark outside by the time the second half rolls around.
Betting on Kirk After Dark is a dangerous game.
FTFY
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I'm hoping the Bears can trade back, stay within the top 5, plus get a 2023 2nd and a 2024 1st, at minimum. We'll see if that's way too optimistic on my part.
I think ideal would be move back within top 4/5 then move back again around 12-15
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I think ideal would be move back within top 4/5 then move back again around 12-15
Ehh, depends. If they can move back to 5 and still get Will Anderson or Jalen Carter, then you snap them up. Adding a first rounder in 2024 plus multiple other picks and still getting a defensive talent like that would be a coup.
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Ehh, depends. If they can move back to 5 and still get Will Anderson or Jalen Carter, then you snap them up. Adding a first rounder in 2024 plus multiple other picks and still getting a defensive talent like that would be a coup.
I really think Young and Levis go 1-2. If the 3 or 4 team in the draft needs a QB (very likely), Carter or Anderson will be there at #5.
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Ehh, depends. If they can move back to 5 and still get Will Anderson or Jalen Carter, then you snap them up. Adding a first rounder in 2024 plus multiple other picks and still getting a defensive talent like that would be a coup.
Ya I don't hate that.
I just wonder if the team has enough holes to value more picks. Maybe get a haul for #1 before the draft and then potentially another haul for 4/5 if another team really wants Carter/Anderson
At least that's how I do it in Madden ;D
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https://twitter.com/CFCBears/status/1612198207190089728
I post this as someone who completely understands and endorses the value of getting higher draft picks. Still made me chuckle
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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35393227/how-bills-bengals-led-way-damar-hamlin-collapsed
Not surprised the teams were the catalyst for the cancellation. Some pointed comments about Troy Vincent here
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https://twitter.com/CFCBears/status/1612198207190089728
I post this as someone who completely understands and endorses the value of getting higher draft picks. Still made me chuckle
This Bears fan thought that was super funny. Thanks for posting.
When you dedicate to the tank and rebuild process, this is the best case scenario.
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From The Athletic's "The Pulse" email newsletter:
The Patriots, despite having a chance at the playoffs in the season’s final week, had a bad year. Tom Brady is long gone. Trusted assistants are, too. It’s time to ask: Is this Bill Belichick’s undoing?
Chad Graff has a great story that goes inside the Pats’ collapse. A couple key takeaways:
When Josh McDaniels left his offensive coordinator post to take the Raiders’ job, Belichick decided to hire Matt Patricia…who’d been the Patriots defensive coordinator from 2012-17. Does it surprise you to learn the offense wasn’t good this year?
The brain drain — and Belichick’s stubbornness — made for misery. Mac Jones regressed, to the point where Bailey Zappe, the fourth-round pick, looked better than Jones, the intended franchise QB.
Belichick, 70, is 25-25 in his last 50 regular-season games. He plans to return next year, but the Patriots’ outlook has never been murkier.
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Even in Brady's final year there in 2019 they looked done when losing to Tennessee in the playoffs. Continuing to rely on lifetime assistants, including two of his children, isn't really working. I know this is hard to do, but if I were Kraft I would suggest that he make this upcoming year his last and then just start over.
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https://twitter.com/CFCBears/status/1612198207190089728
I post this as someone who completely understands and endorses the value of getting higher draft picks. Still made me chuckle
That meme is always hilarious to me. And it works well here, I'm all for it.
Even in Brady's final year there in 2019 they looked done when losing to Tennessee in the playoffs. Continuing to rely on lifetime assistants, including two of his children, isn't really working. I know this is hard to do, but if I were Kraft I would suggest that he make this upcoming year his last and then just start over.
Yep. People keep rushing to the natural Brady comparisons without focusing on the personnel disaster in the coaches room which is what has truly been his undoing. Its amusing that someone who was always so ruthless about roster turnover and changes when a player, even a good one, didn't fit the plan for the next year has completely ignored that with his coaching staff to extreme detriment.
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Good for Roquan getting paid. I wouldn’t have given a LB that much guaranteed, but he bet on himself and got the bag and then some.
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Good for Roquan getting paid. I wouldn’t have given a LB that much guaranteed, but he bet on himself and got the bag and then some.
Agreed. I know multiple people with first hand relationships/extended interactions with him (none of whom are Bears fans) that readily testify to him being a great guy, in addition to a promising young talent. Happy that got past some of his personal issues and earned a well deserved pay day from a great organization.
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More smoke about Sean McVay leaving the Rams (for TV?).
@JFowlerESPN
#Rams coach Sean McVay, whose future is in limbo, has permitted his coaching staff to search for other jobs without resistance, per sources. McVay said in a staff meeting that he doesn’t know what he will do next year and won’t block those who want to explore opportunities
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More smoke about Sean McVay leaving the Rams (for TV?).
@JFowlerESPN
#Rams coach Sean McVay, whose future is in limbo, has permitted his coaching staff to search for other jobs without resistance, per sources. McVay said in a staff meeting that he doesn’t know what he will do next year and won’t block those who want to explore opportunities
Yea, he's gone. He doesn't want to be part of a massive extended rebuild. I see him pulling a Gruden and going to TV and relaxing for a couple years till a perfect scenario surfaces, now that he has his SB cache.
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Yea, he's gone. He doesn't want to be part of a massive extended rebuild. I see him pulling a Gruden and going to TV and relaxing for a couple years till a perfect scenario surfaces, now that he has his SB cache.
Agree. There's no downside for him. His value will only increase in the booth.
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From The Athletic's "The Pulse" email newsletter:
The Patriots, despite having a chance at the playoffs in the season’s final week, had a bad year. Tom Brady is long gone. Trusted assistants are, too. It’s time to ask: Is this Bill Belichick’s undoing?
Chad Graff has a great story that goes inside the Pats’ collapse. A couple key takeaways:
When Josh McDaniels left his offensive coordinator post to take the Raiders’ job, Belichick decided to hire Matt Patricia…who’d been the Patriots defensive coordinator from 2012-17. Does it surprise you to learn the offense wasn’t good this year?
The brain drain — and Belichick’s stubbornness — made for misery. Mac Jones regressed, to the point where Bailey Zappe, the fourth-round pick, looked better than Jones, the intended franchise QB.
Belichick, 70, is 25-25 in his last 50 regular-season games. He plans to return next year, but the Patriots’ outlook has never been murkier.
The nepotism or adjacent on the staff has finally caught up with them now that they don't have the talent, specifically on the offense. They need some ingenuity and outside perspective.
Their defense is still very good, though, so they can still be dangerous with slightly better offensive talent and significantly better coaching there.
The problem they will run into is they don't have the QB that will significantly raise their ceiling.
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Looks like Kevin Warren is leaving the Big Ten to join the Bears. I think this is a move that both the B10 and the Bears are happy about. (I might be exaggerating the conference's joy, but he definitely had a rough start to his tenure.)
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NFL selecting Atlanta as the neutral site AFC championship site is lame (if the game needs to be played at a neutral site).
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NFL selecting Atlanta as the neutral site AFC championship site is lame (if the game needs to be played at a neutral site).
Shoulda been Nashville. Roughly equidistant, outside but moderately temperate, give the folks a party.
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Shoulda been Nashville. Roughly equidistant, outside but moderately temperate, give the folks a party.
That’s not a bad call. I thought Pittsburgh would have been cool.
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I knew they weren't going to put it outside. I kinda thought they would select Indianapolis cause its about halfway between. But my guess is that one of the reasons they chose Atlanta was because it's pretty easy to get to.
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I knew they weren't going to put it outside. I kinda thought they would select Indianapolis cause its about halfway between. But my guess is that one of the reasons they chose Atlanta was because it's pretty easy to get to.
I think Indy didn’t want it.
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I think Indy didn’t want it.
Well, yeah, I guess that is an assumption I shouldn't have made.
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Am I being overly cynical if I view the Broncos interviewing David Shaw at the same time they received permission to interview Sean Payton as pretty regressive?
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Am I being overly cynical if I view the Broncos interviewing David Shaw at the same time they received permission to interview Sean Payton as pretty regressive?
Regressive in what way?
That being said, I don't know how anyone in the NFL who watched how Stanford played the last decade would be interesting in one of the most conservative gunshy coaches of the 21st century.
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It just seems like a brazen Rooney Rule interview. There are a bunch of good minority candidates this cycle but most have teams still playing and may be tough to interview right now - Eric Bieniemy, Demeco Ryans, Leslie Frazier. Calling David Shaw in quick before bringing in Sean Payton feels like something you do if you know you want to have an agreement with Payton before the end of his interview.
As an aside - I don't even mean this entirely as a criticism of just the Broncos, it also speaks to the worst consequences of the Rooney Rule. But for some reason David Shaw seems like a "oh come on" interview.
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It just seems like a brazen Rooney Rule interview. There are a bunch of good minority candidates this cycle but most have teams still playing and may be tough to interview right now - Eric Bieniemy, Demeco Ryans, Leslie Frazier. Calling David Shaw in quick before bringing in Sean Payton feels like something you do if you know you want to have an agreement with Payton before the end of his interview.
As an aside - I don't even mean this entirely as a criticism of just the Broncos, it also speaks to the worst consequences of the Rooney Rule. But for some reason David Shaw seems like a "oh come on" interview.
Fair play, that I can agree with. Except for Bieniemy being a good candidate.
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I'm hoping that if the Panthers don't keep Steve Wilks they hire Demeco Ryans. He seems like a real player's coach and a dynamic leader, and he sure has done a wonderful job with the Niners' D. Hard to believe he won't have a head-coaching gig somewhere next season.
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I'm hoping that if the Panthers don't keep Steve Wilks they hire Demeco Ryans. He seems like a real player's coach and a dynamic leader, and he sure has done a wonderful job with the Niners' D. Hard to believe he won't have a head-coaching gig somewhere next season.
It’s not that hard to believe
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NFL selecting Atlanta as the neutral site AFC championship site is lame (if the game needs to be played at a neutral site).
It'll be nice for fans to finally see what the inside of the Mercedes-Benz Stadium looks like
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It'll be nice for fans to finally see what the inside of the Mercedes-Benz Stadium looks like
The more I think about it, they should have picked Lambeau, that would have been pretty awesome.
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It’s not that hard to believe
Ha. I get what you're saying, but he's a very hot name. I think he'll be an NFL head coach within a couple months.
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Rooting for Trevor Lawrence to win this weekend and bring some respect to Duval
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Rooting for Trevor Lawrence to win this weekend and bring some respect to Duval
Only if they bring back the guy who played the national anthem last week. As Duval as Duval can be.
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT4yZmH1JBmVTYSCV0qX6xkkdFdaJ-Kdb7JnA&usqp=CAU)
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Only if they bring back the guy who played the national anthem last week. As Duval as Duval can be.
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT4yZmH1JBmVTYSCV0qX6xkkdFdaJ-Kdb7JnA&usqp=CAU)
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zBU3J5XsiXI
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Happy Perfect Season Day, everybody.
50 years ago today, the Miami Dolphins beat Washington in SB7 to complete the only undefeated, untied, championship season in the history of North American professional sports.
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Happy Perfect Season Day, everybody.
50 years ago today, the Miami Dolphins beat Washington in SB7 to complete the only undefeated, untied, championship season in the history of North American professional sports.
And they’ve been insufferable ever since.
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And they’ve been insufferable ever since.
True. But don't worry ... they'll all be gone in the not-too-distant future.
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And da Stuper Bowl iz now a month later. Pity, aina?
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And da Stuper Bowl iz now a month later. Pity, aina?
I agree with this analysis
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Lol. Kliff takes his buy out and buys a one way ticket to Thailand.
https://twitter.com/bobrack/status/1614347085247315968?s=46&t=rkPeOdC6zMAyujGAh5rmOA
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There is something to be said about not having to watch the 49ers do this to the Packers again
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Lol. Kliff takes his buy out and buys a one way ticket to Thailand.
https://twitter.com/bobrack/status/1614347085247315968?s=46&t=rkPeOdC6zMAyujGAh5rmOA
Sounds healthy. Go decompress for a while.
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Lol. Kliff takes his buy out and buys a one way ticket to Thailand.
https://twitter.com/bobrack/status/1614347085247315968?s=46&t=rkPeOdC6zMAyujGAh5rmOA
Guy is the definition of failing upwards
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Guy is the definition of failing upwards
Isn’t it great?
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That could be the decider.
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If you're the 49ers, what do you do with Purdy after this year?
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Keep him. He is on a rookie deal.
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Peddle 'im two da Pack, aina?
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Peddle 'im two da Pack, aina?
Packers should see if the Niners are dumb enough to include him in a deal for Rodgers
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Packers should see if the Niners are dumb enough to include him in a deal for Rodgers
Toss inn Love two, hey?
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Guy is the definition of failing upwards
As crazy as it is, I actually see what Arizona was trying to do. Kingsbury is an offenseive guru and QB developer. And he still did that at TTU, he had top 25 offenses 5 of his 6 years there, top 5 the last 2 years of Mahomes. He just could work with a DC to create a reasonable defense, in addition to the struggles of a defense playing with that kind of offense working quickly. He was gonna be the OC at USC before Arizona called, so it’s not like he lost all luster from a miserable failure.
So you bring in a offensive mind with a track record of developing star QBs right as you are going to draft a QB #1 overall. Figure your GM can do more about a DC and defensive talent than a college HC with full autonomy. Given the way the league was going, it was worth a shot. And he wasn’t TERRIBLE, just a bit out of his depth. People make it like he was some buffoon he was never any good and then got the Cards job and tanked immediately, he’s not Jeff Saturday. I think he’s better off going back to college and he’ll have his pick of literally any good OC opening once he does
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Toss inn Love two, hey?
Start with Rodgers and see if they’ll take love, too, but you have to get rid of 12 first
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The 49ers didn’t really want Garoppolo this year, but couldn’t find a trade with anyone. He had a good year and they’re are so many QB needy teams. I think very likely he gets traded this offseason.
Then Purdy is a fallback if Lance can’t play or injured again, or both.
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The 49ers didn’t really want Garoppolo this year, but couldn’t find a trade with anyone. He had a good year and they’re are so many QB needy teams. I think very likely he gets traded this offseason.
Then Purdy is a fallback if Lance can’t play or injured again, or both.
I think Jimmy G is a FA
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I think Jimmy G is a FA
Oh, didn’t know that. Even simpler solution what you do with Purdy then. Let him walk.
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Oh, didn’t know that. Even simpler solution what you do with Purdy then. Let him walk.
He gawn. He bought his way out of SF. Lower salary this year in exchange for FA.
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So interesting watching Herbert & Lawrence play QB, they seem to actually actively scan the field to find an open receiver...
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So interesting watching Herbert & Lawrence play QB, they seem to actually actively scan the field to find an open receiver...
Lawrence is good at finding Chargers so far
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Trevor getting an education in this game.
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So interesting watching Herbert & Lawrence play QB, they seem to actually actively scan the field to find an open receiver...
Sure picked a poor game to try and take a pot shot at Fields.
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What's the record for most thrown interceptions in a game?
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What's the record for most thrown interceptions in a game?
Trevor has 4 completions and 4 interceptions so far. Crazy.
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Getting worse.
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So interesting watching Herbert & Lawrence play QB, they seem to actually actively scan the field to find an open receiver...
Whoa boy, this is as cold a take as I’ve seen on this board, yikes.
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Lawrence is good at finding Chargers so far
5:05.
Well done in this case.
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Lawrence’s first half EPA was -25.2. That’s really hard to achieve.
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I’d still take Lawrence going forward.
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As bad as Lawrence was in the first half, the Chargers can still Charger this game.
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What's the record for most thrown interceptions in a game?
I know Favre had 6 against the Rams in the playoffs.
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I know Favre had 6 against the Rams in the playoffs.
and to this day, Dodds says the 6 interceptions was not the reason they lost the game.
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and to this day, Dodds says the 6 interceptions was not the reason they lost the game.
Of course...
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Dumb play by Jags on defensive celebration after sack.
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Loved the two point play by Trevor.
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Al & Tony really bringing a ton of enthusiasm.
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Al & Tony really bringing a ton of enthusiasm.
I just don’t get why they haul Al out of mothballs for this.
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Brandon Staley stinks.
Bump.
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The Charges have fired Brandon Staley.
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Sean Payton should be the next Charger coach.
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Fireworks going off in Duval
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The Bosa neutral zone infraction was, to me, absolutely the turning point in that game.
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Sean Payton should be the next Charger coach.
I'm sure he was cheering hard for the Jags to make the comeback.
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I put half a unit on the Jaguars ML at half as a joke.
Now wishing I woulda put a full unit down.
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Wow.
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Listening to Trevor Lawrence post game press conference. What a breadth of fresh air that kid is. Happy for him and his team.
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I turned it off! LOL.
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I turned it off! LOL.
I did, too. My wife and I watched some other stuff, we got a call from our son/grandkids, and I did a little financial work on the computer. Sat back down and flipped on the game ... and the Jags just scored to make it 30-26.
Then came the penalty on the idiot Bosa, the 2-point conversion, the Chargers getting stopped, and the Jags winning. So I caught it just in time to see the wild ending, but I had to watch the start of Sportscenter to see what had transpired between 24-0 (when I turned it off) to 30-20.
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Chargers should fire Staley. Not that they can’t come back from a loss like that but his track record so far is interesting. I wonder if the locker room wouldn’t like a new voice, even though the players should be held accountable, too.
If I’m Sean Payton, I’m going into a holding pattern
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Of the teams that could potentially land Payton, the Chargers by far have the best quarterback situation. Even better than Dallas IMO.
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Of the teams that could potentially land Payton, the Chargers by far have the best quarterback situation. Even better than Dallas IMO.
I think Herbert is much better than Dak and with Payton would be even better.
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The Chargers also are already good, and thus sacrificing a high draft pick or two for Payton wouldn't handcuff them.
Just a word of caution about the Payton hype, though: Since winning the SB after the 2009 season, Payton made it to the NFC title game only once, and he lost that. Other than the SB season, he is 6-8 in the playoffs.
In that respect, he's kind of been the coaching version of Aaron Rodgers -- his teams are almost always highly competitive, so they always have a chance of winning it all. They just don't do it when the lights shine the brightest.
Having said that, yes of course I'd want him to coach my team.
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The Chargers also are already good, and thus sacrificing a high draft pick or two for Payton wouldn't handcuff them.
Just a word of caution about the Payton hype, though: Since winning the SB after the 2009 season, Payton made it to the NFC title game only once, and he lost that. Other than the SB season, he is 6-8 in the playoffs.
In that respect, he's kind of been the coaching version of Aaron Rodgers -- his teams are almost always highly competitive, so they always have a chance of winning it all. They just don't do it when the lights shine the brightest.
Having said that, yes of course I'd want him to coach my team.
Those are valid points about Payton that often seem to be ignored in these discussions.
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I had the Jags at +2.5. That was a sweat.
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Pretty sure ewe wur brownin' out yo Haggars at halftyme, doe, hey?
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I had the Jags at +2.5. That was a sweat.
I had the ML. Wrote it off early.
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Pretty sure ewe wur brownin' out yo Haggars at halftyme, doe, hey?
No, at that point I was sure the game was out of reach and had given up. Luckily Trevor and the Jags didn't.
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WTF are the Bills doing?
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WTF are the Bills doing?
Losing
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When I left the bar where we were watching the Marquette game, Buffalo was up 14-0. I just assumed it would be 38-13 or something.
But when you assume ...
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Chargers should fire Staley. Not that they can’t come back from a loss like that but his track record so far is interesting. I wonder if the locker room wouldn’t like a new voice, even though the players should be held accountable, too.
If I’m Sean Payton, I’m going into a holding pattern
So what’s weird about Staley, is I saw a tweet about how the Chargers kicked on 4th and short multiple times yesterday that they went for nearly 100% of the time in that situation last season. So even more than just blowing a big lead, for me, if he’s lost his edge or confidence in the analytics angles that lead him to being successful, it’s time to move on and not waste your young star QB.
Those are valid points about Payton that often seem to be ignored in these discussions.
I was talking to a Saints fans recently about what changed, and we were discussing the Payton/Carmichael Jr HC/OC combo may have gotten stale and/or figured out by the league. Beyond just Brees aging, you had a high powered offense that reloaded weapons at RB and WR that was held to 20ish points, including OT, in each of their playoff losses. After scoring heaps of points in the regular season.
Also, FWIW, if not for one of the worst no calls in recent NFL history, that lead to a complete rule change, Payton makes another SB in 2018.
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Also, FWIW, if not for one of the worst no calls in recent NFL history, that lead to a complete rule change, Payton makes another SB in 2018.
True. Good point.
But still an underperformer in the postseason.
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How do you not get that play in?
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How do you not get that play in?
That one was on the coach. He was talking to the QB with 31 seconds left and took the full 16 seconds talking till the mic turns off. Then it took 8-9 seconds for the QB to call the play on the huddle.
This was a rookie inexperienced QB. Gotta give him time to call the play and run it.
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What would be the results of Payton coaching Aaron Rodgers?
The Chargers also are already good, and thus sacrificing a high draft pick or two for Payton wouldn't handcuff them.
Just a word of caution about the Payton hype, though: Since winning the SB after the 2009 season, Payton made it to the NFC title game only once, and he lost that. Other than the SB season, he is 6-8 in the playoffs.
In that respect, he's kind of been the coaching version of Aaron Rodgers -- his teams are almost always highly competitive, so they always have a chance of winning it all. They just don't do it when the lights shine the brightest.
Having said that, yes of course I'd want him to coach my team.
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I think the Packers win another Super Bowl if Nick Collins stayed healthy.
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I think the Packers win another Super Bowl if Nick Collins stayed healthy.
Secondary post-2010 was always an adventure
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And DOWN go the Chokings!
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Good decision there by Kirk.
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And DOWN go the Chokings!
Is anyone surprised?
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Vikings will lose 1st round of playoffs
;D Nice fart in the wind season Minnesota !
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Minnesotan here.
Shocked the Vikings lost .. shocked!
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Lions division moving forward
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Vikings swore they got all their regression out of the way in the Packer game
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LOL Vikings
Meh, Detroit beat them both.
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;D Nice fart in the wind season Minnesota !
When almost every game goes down to the wire, you probably aren't gonna win them all. Except the Vikings did. Until they didn't.
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Trevor Lawrence celebrated the win at Waffle House
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/01/15/jaguars-quarterback-trevor-lawrence-celebrates-epic-comeback-win-at-waffle-house/
I love this kid.
He is definitely in the right place in Duval
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https://twitter.com/Giants/status/1614786965630750720?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1614786965630750720%7Ctwgr%5Ec509e6d9cb667c87ba64a8e2666f536f2d48669a%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn.espn.com%2Fcore%2Fstandalone%2Fwebview%3Fpartial%3Darticleappsrc%3Dsclang%3Denregion%3Dusplatform%3Dios
This is well done.
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That was an awesome TD
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Crazy weekend of football!
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Couple of things on that TD:
Tirico’s call >>>>>>> Al Michaels yesterday
The officials on that play were ungodly slow. If you watch the replay, no official can stay within 15 yards of a lineman running downfield.
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This clock management. Woof.
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This clock management. Woof.
Couldn’t have been much worse.
But at least Harbaugh has an extra time-out to take into next season!
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I went 1 for 1 yesterday: MU lost a close one Giants win by a TD and each team still gets to play another day.
https://nypost.com/2023/01/15/super-bowl-run-now-in-play-with-giants-getting-better-and-better/
As a Giants fan even I think this is over the top. The Eagles are damn good and I would be shocked at a win next week.
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“We choked." -- Chargers defensive lineman Kyle Van Noy
It's obvious they did, but it's still refreshing to hear the admission from an athlete.
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Ryan Jensen activated for Bucs. Key development for Brady as his offensive line has sucked all year .
https://www.joebucsfan.com/2023/01/ryan-jensen-activated/#more-315522
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Uh.....the Cowboys' kicker is now 0-3 in in extra points. None were blocked or close. Is this a record?
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Uh.....the Cowboys' kicker is now 0-3 in in extra points. None were blocked or close. Is this a record?
He also missed one last week.
If I’m the Cowboys’ player personnel director, I’m on the phone right now with the agents of a few kickers.
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OMG!!!
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Aikman: “They might be looking for another kicker.”
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Can’t wait for the Raiders to pay Brady $75 million next season.
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Can’t wait for the Raiders to pay Brady $75 million next season.
Nah, the Raiders are saving their money to trade for Rodgers.
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Brady needs to find a better team next season.
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Brady needs to find a better team next season.
He would. In a tv booth
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Brady is going to need a stellar OL and defense to succeed - like he did two years ago. Not sure where he is going to find that in a place that doesn't already have a quarterback. But he looked old last night.
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In the Super Bowl era, the Vikings became the first team ever in either the regular season or postseason to complete at least 80% of their passes with no turnover or sacks and lose the football game. Until now teams were 47-0.
SKOL?
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Brady is going to need a stellar OL and defense to succeed - like he did two years ago. Not sure where he is going to find that in a place that doesn't already have a quarterback. But he looked old last night.
He has looked old all season. He had a few Bradyesque 4th-quarter comebacks, leading some observers to scream about his greatness still being there. But most of those comebacks were necessary because he was horrible in the first 2-3 quarters.
Brady obviously still has the ability to engineer a couple drives in a game if everything is going well, but he no longer can play well for anything close to a full game. Which shouldn't exactly be stunning, given that he's 95 years old.
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I trust what you are saying MU82. Yesterday was pretty much the first time I watched him play extensively all season. I understand his greatness, but the narratives around it just get so over-the-top and hard to bear after awhile.
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I trust what you are saying MU82. Yesterday was pretty much the first time I watched him play extensively all season. I understand his greatness, but the narratives around it just get so over-the-top and hard to bear after awhile.
Brady will retire, get his exwife back, have some makeup you know what, then unretire again.
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Nah, he's got young stuff now like Rodgers. You go boy, aina?
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I trust what you are saying MU82. Yesterday was pretty much the first time I watched him play extensively all season. I understand his greatness, but the narratives around it just get so over-the-top and hard to bear after awhile.
Totally agree. We were saying it before, a few weeks ago, and I cited some stats about how he's been in the lowest tiers of all starting QBs this year stat wise. Its one thing to go after a former MVP who is in his late 30s, like Rodgers, and say maybe it was just a bad year. But Brady is literally nearing 50 and has been mediocre even before he was awful last night. Trading anything for him right now, or allocating a big salary, even for a year, is football malpractice.
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Trading anything for him right now, or allocating a big salary, even for a year, is football malpractice.
Agree, Wags. And yet multiple reports indicate the Raiders seem willing to do just that.
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Agree, Wags. And yet multiple reports indicate the Raiders seem willing to do just that.
He's a free agent, so nobody is trading for him.
It's all speculation at this point, but Raiders beat writers don't think they're terribly interested.
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Brandon Staley found his fall guy.
@TomPelissero
The #Chargers fired offensive coordinator Joe Lombardi, sources tell me and @RapSheet.
A big move by Brandon Staley, who should have candidates lining up for a chance to work with Justin Herbert.
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He's a free agent, so nobody is trading for him.
It's all speculation at this point, but Raiders beat writers don't think they're terribly interested.
True about no trade being necessary. And for the Raiders' sake, I hope their beat writers' sources are correct here.
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Ben Johnson staying in Detroit as the OC.
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Ben Johnson staying in Detroit as the OC.
He supposedly was high on the Panthers’ list.
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Brandon Staley found his fall guy.
@TomPelissero
The #Chargers fired offensive coordinator Joe Lombardi, sources tell me and @RapSheet.
A big move by Brandon Staley, who should have candidates lining up for a chance to work with Justin Herbert.
So is it a d!ck move or cool guy move to fire your OC right before you, yourself are fired? I mean, is he doing Lombardi a solid here?
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GO GIANTS!
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So is it a d!ck move or cool guy move to fire your OC right before you, yourself are fired? I mean, is he doing Lombardi a solid here?
(https://cdn.pastemagazine.com/www/articles/2021/02/04/monty-python-quotes-inline-1.jpg)
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So is it a d!ck move or cool guy move to fire your OC right before you, yourself are fired? I mean, is he doing Lombardi a solid here?
To be fair, Lombardi was criticized a lot during the season. Not like he's a completely unfair scapegoat. And Staley is a DC by trade, so its not like he was largely responsible for an offensive system and he's just sacrificing an underling.
Also, maybe Chargers brass told Staley that some personnel needed to change or he was done, so he made this move. Aka the anti-Wojo. Surely won't have a shortage of good candidates eager to work with Herbert, a pair of stud WRs in their prime, and a really good compliment of RBs
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To be fair, they probably shouldn't have hired Lombardi in the first place. He was pretty poor in his first go around as an OC with the Lions.
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To be fair, offensive playcalling/scheme isn't why the Chargers disappointed yet again.
Frequent bad decisions by the head coach, on the other hand ...
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To be fair, he ain't no Vince Lombardi.
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To be fair, offensive playcalling/scheme isn't why the Chargers disappointed yet again.
Frequent bad decisions by the head coach, on the other hand ...
The head coach isn't going to fire himself.
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The head coach isn't going to fire himself.
You don't say.
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This is pretty interesting.
@BruceFeldmanCFB
The average star rating of the defensive players on the NFL All-Pro team is 4.5 stars. On offense, it’s just 2.0. I asked some of the sharpest minds in the NFL and college football worlds why they think there’s such a disparity in the evaluation game:
https://theathletic.com/4105045/2023/01/19/college-football-recruiting-star-system-disparity-nfl/
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Bucs fire Byron Leftwich and much of the offensive staff.
Ravens OC Greg Roman resigns.
Rough offseason for offensive coordinators. Now openings with Baltimore, Tampa, Chargers, Tennessee, Rams, Jets and Patriots (O'Brien?).
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Bucs fire Byron Leftwich and much of the offensive staff.
Ravens OC Greg Roman resigns.
Rough offseason for offensive coordinators. Now openings with Baltimore, Tampa, Chargers, Tennessee, Rams, Jets and Patriots (O'Brien?).
Lot of openings for what candidates? Curious who is moving up in the world
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It will be a shuffle. There aren't that many up and coming geniuses out there.
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Lot of openings for what candidates? Curious who is moving up in the world
Guys that will be fired after the 2023 or 2024 season.
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Lot of openings for what candidates? Curious who is moving up in the world
Go for it.
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Did the Eagles break the rules?
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/eagles-jake-elliott-pushes-back-cheating-allegations-completely-legal
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Did the Eagles break the rules?
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/eagles-jake-elliott-pushes-back-cheating-allegations-completely-legal
The Cowboys' kicker should do the same on extra points.
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This is pretty interesting.
@BruceFeldmanCFB
The average star rating of the defensive players on the NFL All-Pro team is 4.5 stars. On offense, it’s just 2.0. I asked some of the sharpest minds in the NFL and college football worlds why they think there’s such a disparity in the evaluation game:
https://theathletic.com/4105045/2023/01/19/college-football-recruiting-star-system-disparity-nfl/
Really interesting stuff. Going into the article, I was thinking of some of the nature of non-BIG TIME HS FB. You see a lot of college star players at any number of positions who played QB in HS. Why? Cause thats often where you put the best athlete from an early age. So you have these WR, TE, RB, DB, LB types who are set up to be a star at that position size/skill/ability wise who played QB all growing up. So they need to learn/adapt at the college level with proper coaching and then they explode ability wise.
They mention Travis Kelce. He was a QB in HS. His older brother is one of the best centers of the last 20 years and he played RB in HS and walked on as a RB. They are far from alone.
That I think also aligns with scheme too. Talented HS WRs playing in option or run heavy offenses. A QB with nobody to throw to. Or just playing in a non-heavily scouted area like they say. It makes a ton of sense.
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Remember when the Bears offered a higher draft pick just to prevent the Packers from getting Chase Claypool? That worked out well for them.
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Remember when the Bears offered a higher draft pick just to prevent the Packers from getting Chase Claypool? That worked out well for them.
A 1st round pick for a stiff. Ryan Pace is smiling somewhere.
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A 1st round pick for a stiff. Ryan Pace is smiling somewhere.
Not a first round pick.
I have no idea of he will be decent but did you see any of the Bears games? Randy Moss and Jerry Rice would have looked like crap in the Bears offense. They stuffed the roster with XFL talent so they could lose games.
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https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.si.com/.amp/nfl/2022/11/01/packers-offer-chase-claypool-steelers-bears-trade
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Right. The Packers GM isn’t great. This just reinforces the Bears made a bad deal.
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Speaking of Bears trades, I think the Roquan deal that a lot of Bears fans here liked looks worse in hindsight.
He's a guy they could have built their defense around for the next 4-5 years, and they easily could have afforded what he got from Baltimore and still had the most cap space in the league heading into the offseason.
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Right. The Packers GM isn’t great. This just reinforces the Bears made a bad deal.
5 years to judge?
But honestly, why is this being discussed right now?
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5 years to judge?
But honestly, why is this being discussed right now?
IDK, I didn't bring it up.
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Speaking of Bears trades, I think the Roquan deal that a lot of Bears fans here liked looks worse in hindsight.
He's a guy they could have built their defense around for the next 4-5 years, and they easily could have afforded what he got from Baltimore and still had the most cap space in the league heading into the offseason.
What if the new GM and coach, who didn't draft him, don't think he or his position is worth that allocation of resources?
Personally, I don't think that trade is any different today than it was when it happened
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IDK, I didn't bring it up.
Ya.
My question was more broad despite quoting you
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Not a first round pick.
I have no idea of he will be decent but did you see any of the Bears games? Randy Moss and Jerry Rice would have looked like crap in the Bears offense. They stuffed the roster with XFL talent so they could lose games.
32nd pick.
That is a 1st rounder in every other year.
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Speaking of Bears trades, I think the Roquan deal that a lot of Bears fans here liked looks worse in hindsight.
He's a guy they could have built their defense around for the next 4-5 years, and they easily could have afforded what he got from Baltimore and still had the most cap space in the league heading into the offseason.
As a Bears fan, I still like the trade. I don't know if you build a defense around an OLB. But I could be in the minority.
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32nd pick.
That is a 1st rounder in every other year.
::)
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5 years to judge?
But honestly, why is this being discussed right now?
Poor bias was trying to contribute something.
Fail.
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Poor bias was trying to contribute something.
Fail.
The beacon of valuable insights to this board has spoken.
Lol.
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What if the new GM and coach, who didn't draft him, don't think he or his position is worth that allocation of resources?
Personally, I don't think that trade is any different today than it was when it happened
I'd be very surprised to learn that a coach who saw the difference Darius (now Shaquille) Leonard can make in his scheme would downgrade the value of an elite, three-down linebacker.
And yeah, Poles may very well not believe an off-ball LB is worth those resources. That doesn't make his decision a good one. The same guy thought dealing a 2nd for Chase Claypool was a good idea.
The Ravens seem to disagree, and that's a front office that doesn't miss often.
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I'd be very surprised to learn that a coach who saw the difference Darius (now Shaquille) Leonard can make in his scheme would downgrade the value of an elite, three-down linebacker.
And yeah, Poles may very well not believe an off-ball LB is worth those resources. That doesn't make his decision a good one. The same guy thought dealing a 2nd for Chase Claypool was a good idea.
The Ravens seem to disagree, and that's a front office that doesn't miss often.
Sometimes both teams get what they want from a trade. Both win.
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The beacon of valuable insights to this board has spoken.
Lol.
11:06.
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Bears give up #32 for a stiff at WR.
Bears get a pick in the low 50s for a pro bowl LB.
Poles is going to get LOTS of calls.
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Bears give up #32 for a stiff at WR.
Bears get a pick in the low 50s for a pro bowl LB.
Poles is going to get LOTS of calls.
The context of these trades is rather important. But, *shrugs*
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Tony Dungy has had an interesting week.
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The context of these trades is rather important. But, *shrugs*
If by context with the Roquan deal, you mean "We're in full rebuild mode and don't believe a $100 million off-ball linebacker is a good fit for that rebuild, so let's get what we can for him," then sure. I disagree, but yeah, there's a thought pattern there.
What's the context on the Claypool deal? If you're in full rebuild mode and tanking the season, why dump a high second-round pick (the highest, it turns out) for a "help the team now" player whose 1.5 seasons from free agency? And when a team that doesn't miss on wide receiver evaluations is willing to dump a wide receiver, why blow past that red flag and pay such a high price?
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I am glad the Lions were able to pawn off Hockenson on the Vikings. Capable replacements on the roster, more picks.
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The context of these trades is rather important. But, *shrugs*
Of course it is.
One was desperation. The other was getting rid of a guy they didn't want to deal with when every team in the League knew they wanted to dump him.
Lotsa calls.
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Bears give up #32 for a stiff at WR.
Bears get a pick in the low 50s for a pro bowl LB.
Poles is going to get LOTS of calls.
We're calling Claypool a "stiff" now? 3rd among rookies in yards his first year, despite being the distinct #2 option in Pittsburgh (the 2 above him, Lamb and Jefferson, are both arguably top 5 WRs in the league). Then equaled that yardage last year despite missing a game and having a noodle armed ancient Big Ben at QB. He didn't have a good 7 games in Chicago, but nobody did at WR.
I didn't love the trade and thought a 2nd was too much to give up for him, even without the 1.5 year till FA situation, but calling him a stiff just makes you look dramatic at best, snarkily biased at worst. Claypool from 2020-2021, who you would assume was being traded for considering no major injuries or loss of ability, is the 3rd or 4th best WR in the NFC North, behind Jefferson and St Brown, depending how you feel about a mid 30s Thielen who has lost a step.
But again, if it was a 3rd or 4th, I would like it more, and will be baffled more by it if he leaves next summer.
And when a team that doesn't miss on wide receiver evaluations is willing to dump a wide receiver, why blow past that red flag and pay such a high price?
I didn't see it as a big red flag as much as an embarrassment of riches/fit. I think Claypool had really good chemistry with Big Ben, but Pickett clicked more with Johnson and Pickens, the latter of whom has an insane ceiling and is on a rookie deal for 3 more years.
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We're calling Claypool a "stiff" now? 3rd among rookies in yards his first year, despite being the distinct #2 option in Pittsburgh (the 2 above him, Lamb and Jefferson, are both arguably top 5 WRs in the league). Then equaled that yardage last year despite missing a game and having a noodle armed ancient Big Ben at QB. He didn't have a good 7 games in Chicago, but nobody did at WR.
I didn't love the trade and thought a 2nd was too much to give up for him, even without the 1.5 year till FA situation, but calling him a stiff just makes you look dramatic at best, snarkily biased at worst. Claypool from 2020-2021, who you would assume was being traded for considering no major injuries or loss of ability, is the 3rd or 4th best WR in the NFC North, behind Jefferson and St Brown, depending how you feel about a mid 30s Thielen who has lost a step.
42 catches for 450 yards and 0 TDs does not equal the 3rd or 4th best WR in the NFC North. Especially on a team that had no other WR to catch the ball.
I think any GM worth his salt would take St. Brown, Williams, Chark, Jefferson, and Watson ahead of Chase. Claypool right now is in a group with Mooney, Thielen, Osborne, Lazard, and Doubs.
Can he get back to the promise he showed as a rookie? We'll find out this year.
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What's the context on the Claypool deal? If you're in full rebuild mode and tanking the season, why dump a high second-round pick (the highest, it turns out) for a "help the team now" player whose 1.5 seasons from free agency? And when a team that doesn't miss on wide receiver evaluations is willing to dump a wide receiver, why blow past that red flag and pay such a high price?
You win the Bears and Packers are idiots for one trying to get him and one actually getting the guy for a second round pick.
I think the Bears offense this year was too bad to fairly evaluate any WR, so I'll take a wait as see approach.
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You win the Bears and Packers are idiots for one trying to get him and one actually getting the guy for a second round pick.
I think the Bears offense this year was too bad to fairly evaluate any WR, so I'll take a wait as see approach.
Kinda like Bears fans did with Trubisky.
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The Claypool trade was terrible, the Roquan trade was fine, there’s no reason for the worst record team in the NFL to give $100 M to an off ball linebacker.
Big offseason for Poles, people here are more than right to question his moves (again, I’m fine with the Roquan trade). People do forget Poles also got a 4th rounder for (and cleared cap room) for the corpse of Robert Quinn (who did nothing in Philly).
Wait to see this offseason.
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Tony Dungy has had an interesting week.
Marquette's own Nancy Armour calls out Dungy in a great column:
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/columnist/nancy-armour/2023/01/19/tony-dungy-bigotry-vulnerable-transgender-kids-risk/11085306002/
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Marquette's own Nancy Armour calls out Dungy in a great column:
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/columnist/nancy-armour/2023/01/19/tony-dungy-bigotry-vulnerable-transgender-kids-risk/11085306002/
Racist
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What bothers me most about Christians like Dungy isn't that they believe homosexuality is a sin, it's that they oftentimes don't give members of the LGTBQ community the respect and dignity that Jesus commanded of all Christians.
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What bothers me most about Christians like Dungy isn't that they believe homosexuality is a sin, it's that they oftentimes don't give members of the LGTBQ community the respect and dignity that Jesus commanded of all Christians.
The repeated litter box stuff is just so boomer
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The repeated litter box stuff is just so boomer
What does that even mean?
Virtually every litter box reference is right-wing related. It is unrelated to age.
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I think what he means is that it is generally boomers who pass along all sorts of false stuff they read on social media regardless of one's political leanings.
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What does that even mean?
Virtually every litter box reference is right-wing related. It is unrelated to age.
Correct, but I was referring to what Sultan said.
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F@ck. Mahomes just took a bad hit
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Tony Romo: “Leslie Frazier should get more looks as a head coach.”
Cincinnati proceeds to score easily on their first two drives…
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This has been an a$$ kicking on the line of scrimmage.
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Hot take, Bills should have fired McDermott and kept Daboll.
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There is A LOT of pregame Maher drama going on in Santa Clara right now. Never seen anything like this.
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Cincinnati kicked the living crap out of Buffalo.
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Cincinnati kicked the living crap out of Buffalo.
Great game plan. Stuck without 3 starters on OL, they decided to run the ball. Most backups are decent run blockers. They are backups based on their pass blocking.
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FS1 has reruns of the Westminster Dog Show up against the NFL football games . Good counter programming lol
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FS1 has reruns of the Westminster Dog Show up against the NFL football games . Good counter programming lol
Show dogs are delicious when grilled.
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Maher’s first extra point attempt:
Another hot mess.
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I believe Robbie Gould has never missed a kick in the playoffs.
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Shanahan getting outcoached by McCarthy?
I guess Kyle ain’t all that. Lucky for him, the Boys got Dak and Maher.
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Most exciting player in the NFL makes a chip shot to knot it at 9.
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We're gonna need to have some conversations on Dak this offseason
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4 best teams advance to conference championship games.
As a fan who wants the best games possible, I hope Mahomes can recover enough to be Mahomes-ish.
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We're gonna need to have some conversations on Dak this offseason
Turns out he was good on Monday because he played a bad team.
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4 best teams advance to conference championship games.
As a fan who wants the best games possible, I hope Mahomes can recover enough to be Mahomes-ish.
Cincy vs Buffalo was the actual Superbowl this year....
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Cincy vs Buffalo was the actual Superbowl this year....
We'll agree to disagree.
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We'll agree to disagree.
Buffalo is missing something. Not sure if it’s the coach but something feels like it’s missing there. Secondary was depleted but Cincinnati imposed their will against them and Miami would have beaten them if they had a QB
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Buffalo is missing something. Not sure if it’s the coach but something feels like it’s missing there. Secondary was depleted but Cincinnati imposed their will against them and Miami would have beaten them if they had a QB
For one thing, Buffalo's pass rush all but vanished after Von Miller got hurt. That, combined with their problems in the secondary, has made them easy pickin's for great QBs. For another, Allen did not get better this season and, arguably, regressed a little. He made boneheaded mistakes in several games, mistakes unbefitting a QB of his talent. He also took a beating, as Buffalo used him as a runner a lot down the stretch.
You might be right about the coaching, too. I sure hope the Panthers do better than the Bills' OC.
I feel comfortable saying the best 4 teams reached the conference title games. There is no legit argument for Buffalo being better than KC (with a healthy-ish Mahomes), Philly or San Fran. And given the way Cinci is playing, including yesterday, not better than the Bengals either.
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For one thing, Buffalo's pass rush all but vanished after Von Miller got hurt. That, combined with their problems in the secondary, has made them easy pickin's for great QBs. For another, Allen did not get better this season and, arguably, regressed a little. He made boneheaded mistakes in several games, mistakes unbefitting a QB of his talent. He also took a beating, as Buffalo used him as a runner a lot down the stretch.
You might be right about the coaching, too. I sure hope the Panthers do better than the Bills' OC.
I feel comfortable saying the best 4 teams reached the conference title games. There is no legit argument for Buffalo being better than KC (with a healthy-ish Mahomes), Philly or San Fran. And given the way Cinci is playing, including yesterday, not better than the Bengals either.
I think Ken Dorsey is fine. We might be underestimating the impact Allen’s injury had on him but I agree they used his legs too much down the stretch.
Miller is a great player but if your defense solely relies on him at this point, your roster has other holes
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I feel comfortable saying the best 4 teams reached the conference title games. There is no legit argument for Buffalo being better than KC (with a healthy-ish Mahomes), Philly or San Fran. And given the way Cinci is playing, including yesterday, not better than the Bengals either.
What about the Lions?
Seriously, though, I agree.
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Hot take, Bills should have fired McDermott and kept Daboll.
Whether or not firing McDermott was a realistic option, I agree Daboll is far more valuable to a franchise than McDermott. He strikes me more as the head administrator type of coach, which is great when you have have two head coaches as your coordinators. But as the cap restrictions and coach attrition hits the Bills, I don't think McDermott is going to flourish in the way that say, guys like Andy Reid or Kyle Shanahan have.
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The Cowboys streak of 27 seasons without reaching the conference championship game is pretty amazing to me. It's not like they have been bad either. The Jets and Jags have been to three championship games EACH since the Cowboys were last in one.
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I think Ken Dorsey is fine. We might be underestimating the impact Allen’s injury had on him but I agree they used his legs too much down the stretch.
Miller is a great player but if your defense solely relies on him at this point, your roster has other holes
Dorsey's fine right where he is! And good point about the Bills' D.
The Cowboys streak of 27 seasons without reaching the conference championship game is pretty amazing to me. It's not like they have been bad either. The Jets and Jags have been to three championship games EACH since the Cowboys were last in one.
Yeah, you're right. That is freakin' incredible.
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The Cowboys streak of 27 seasons without reaching the conference championship game is pretty amazing to me. It's not like they have been bad either. The Jets and Jags have been to three championship games EACH since the Cowboys were last in one.
Lions fan laughs.
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The Cowboys streak of 27 seasons without reaching the conference championship game is pretty amazing to me. It's not like they have been bad either. The Jets and Jags have been to three championship games EACH since the Cowboys were last in one.
There is one common denominator during this period.
Jerry Jones is the worst GM in the league. I'm talking, of course, on the football side of GM'ing. He is great on the money making side.
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There is one common denominator during this period.
Jerry Jones is the worst GM in the league. I'm talking, of course, on the football side of GM'ing. He is great on the money making side.
Nah.
He hasn't been the best, but worst?
His team has made the playoffs five of the last 10 years, and has the 8th most wins in the league since 2010. He's got a respectable draft record, landing several all-pro talents (Martin, Diggs, Parsons, Frederick, Smith, Diggs) over the past decade while rarely picking in the top 10.
If you think his record of accomplishment is worse than the Dave Gettlemans and Steve Keims of the world, I'm not sure what to tell you.
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We're gonna need to have some conversations on Dak this offseason
Dak is just the absolute nightmare for an NFL team. Signs a big money deal...and IMMEDIATELY regresses across the board.
Add to that paying significant money to an RB who isn't much better, if at all, than his backup.
At least they have one of the best WRs in the NFL for another year on a rookie deal.
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Nah.
He hasn't been the best, but worst?
His team has made the playoffs five of the last 10 years, and has the 8th most wins in the league since 2010. He's got a respectable draft record, landing several all-pro talents (Martin, Diggs, Parsons, Frederick, Smith, Diggs) over the past decade while rarely picking in the top 10.
If you think his record of accomplishment is worse than the Dave Gettlemans and Steve Keims of the world, I'm not sure what to tell you.
Taken in total, I think he ha been awful. As bad as any GM in the league. He would have been fired long ago by every single team except the one he owns.
Every team drafts great players on occasion. What other GM would have stuck with Jason Garrett for so long? Hire Mike McCarthy? Given the huge contract to Cutler..., I mean Dak? Spent huge $$$ for what is now basically a backup RB?
The Cowboys haven't been in a conference final in forever because of Jones. And the times they got there early in Jones tenure were in spite of him. Jimmy Johnson got them there and Jones couldn't stand someone else getting credit.
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Dak is just the absolute nightmare for an NFL team. Signs a big money deal...and IMMEDIATELY regresses across the board.
Add to that paying significant money to an RB who isn't much better, if at all, than his backup.
Ah..., you beat me to it on these comments.
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Jones has gotten a lot better in the drafting part of the job over the last few years, mostly because I think his son is stepping in more to stop him from making bad decisions.
But ten seasons of Jason Garrett was a poor, poor GM decision. Remember when he had three seasons in a row that they were heading into the final month of the season in control of their playoff destiny, only to finish poorly, end at 8-8 and miss out?
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The Cowboys streak of 27 seasons without reaching the conference championship game is pretty amazing to me. It's not like they have been bad either. The Jets and Jags have been to three championship games EACH since the Cowboys were last in one.
My favorite stat of the year is that no head coach has won the super bowl with two different teams.
Jerry Jones expecting Mike McCarthy to be the first is the highest order of hilarity.
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My favorite coaching stat is that no Lions head coach has ever gone on to be the head coach of another NFL team.
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My favorite coaching stat is that no Lions head coach has ever gone on to be the head coach of another NFL team.
My least favorite coaching stat is that a team has given an 0-16 defensive coordinator a second job as defensive coordinator.
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My least favorite coaching stat is that a team has given an 0-16 defensive coordinator a second job as defensive coordinator.
And keeping him on after a bad year.
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My favorite coaching stat is that no Lions head coach has ever gone on to be the head coach of another NFL team.
Once a Lion, always only a Lion
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I thought Caldwell might break that streak. Not yet. The other likely candidate is Jim Schwartz.
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https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/01/25/aaron-rodgers-links-his-current-villain-status-to-big-pharma/
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Dak is just the absolute nightmare for an NFL team. Signs a big money deal...and IMMEDIATELY regresses across the board.
Add to that paying significant money to an RB who isn't much better, if at all, than his backup.
At least they have one of the best WRs in the NFL for another year on a rookie deal.
In truth, both contracts were moronic at the time. Dak never really showed the fundamentals of an elite QB. They paid him well beyond his worth. I really don't think he regressed; he continues to play to his talent level.
Same with Elliot. He was a good every down back, but not elite. Don't overpay RBs in the current format of the league.
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Panthers hiring Frank Reich, which is ... interesting?
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Panthers hiring Frank Reich, which is ... interesting?
Their coaching search in 2026 will be something
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Trying to stay open-minded and optimistic, which is my M.O. as a fan (and in life).
Not easy here. Reich wasn't one of my top choices.
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Trying to stay open-minded and optimistic, which is my M.O. as a fan (and in life).
Not easy here. Reich wasn't one of my top choices.
I don't know much about Reich, but he went to the playoffs with Jacoby Brissett and Phillip Rivers, and finished one game out with Carson Wentz.
There are worse choices for a team that's lacking at QB.
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I don't know much about Reich, but he went to the playoffs with Jacoby Brissett and Phillip Rivers, and finished one game out with Carson Wentz.
There are worse choices for a team that's lacking at QB.
He didn't go to the playoffs with Brissett. Unless you're talking about 2018, when Brissett backed up Andrew Luck.
He did go to the playoffs as a wild card with Phil Rivers, but so did Norv Turner, Anthony Lynn and Mike McCoy. Rivers is a HOF quarterback, after all, and he played reasonably well his one year in Indy, when they benefited from one of the league's softest schedules.
As for the Wentz year, you're burying the lead. Needing a win to secure the playoffs, the Colts lost a home game to the Raiders and then decided not to show up in week 18 and got blown out by the league's worst team.
I don't know that Reich is a bad coach. But I wouldn't be excited if I were 82 or any other Panthers fan. Nothing he's done screams that he deserves another chance this soon.
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He didn't go to the playoffs with Brissett. Unless you're talking about 2018, when Brissett backed up Andrew Luck.
He did go to the playoffs as a wild card with Phil Rivers, but so did Norv Turner, Anthony Lynn and Mike McCoy. Rivers is a HOF quarterback, after all, and he played reasonably well his one year in Indy, when they benefited from one of the league's softest schedules.
As for the Wentz year, you're burying the lead. Needing a win to secure the playoffs, the Colts lost a home game to the Raiders and then decided not to show up in week 18 and got blown out by the league's worst team.
I don't know that Reich is a bad coach. But I wouldn't be excited if I were 82 or any other Panthers fan. Nothing he's done screams that he deserves another chance this soon.
He wasn't terrible in Indy, but him getting hired in and of itself was kind of a reach IMO. His coaching career was kind of terrible up till that point.
QB coach then demoted to WR coach in Indy, fired with everyone after they went 2-14.
WR coach in Arizona, not retained after a 5-11 season where the HC was fired.
QB coach in SD, promoted to OC after Wisenhunt who brought him along left and chose not to make him the OC, instead chose the TE coach. Reich fired after 2 seasons in which the offense stunk and were last in rushing.
Lands on his feet in Philly. First season doesn't even half a top 15 offense. Second season, a very good offense, but due to a top 5 rushing offense. The passing offense for a QB/WR coach in the OC role was outside the top 10. But they won the SB so suddenly he was anointed.
I get when amazing coordinators get picked for second chances soon after failing as HC. But thats not Reich.
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Y’all are really getting me psyched for next season.
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Yeah there have been plenty of examples where NFL coaches are fired and meet success at their next gig. But those guys (think Schottenheimer, Reid, Reeves, Carroll) usually have SOMETHING that they have done that leads you to believe they can do that. They either won as head coaches and had their teams fall apart around them (Reid) or they went back to be successful coordinators (Carroll...who of course also had success at USC.)
Reich doesn't fit that profile. Wags brought up Whisenhunt in a different context, but that seems like a better comp for a guy like Reich. Which doesn't look good for MU82 and the Panthers.
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Yeah there have been plenty of examples where NFL coaches are fired and meet success at their next gig. But those guys (think Schottenheimer, Reid, Reeves, Carroll) usually have SOMETHING that they have done that leads you to believe they can do that. They either won as head coaches and had their teams fall apart around them (Reid) or they went back to be successful coordinators (Carroll...who of course also had success at USC.)
Reich doesn't fit that profile. Wags brought up Whisenhunt in a different context, but that seems like a better comp for a guy like Reich. Which doesn't look good for MU82 and the Panthers.
I'll always have the 2015 season.
Until the Super Bowl.
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Yeah there have been plenty of examples where NFL coaches are fired and meet success at their next gig. But those guys (think Schottenheimer, Reid, Reeves, Carroll) usually have SOMETHING that they have done that leads you to believe they can do that. They either won as head coaches and had their teams fall apart around them (Reid) or they went back to be successful coordinators (Carroll...who of course also had success at USC.)
Reich doesn't fit that profile. Wags brought up Whisenhunt in a different context, but that seems like a better comp for a guy like Reich. Which doesn't look good for MU82 and the Panthers.
Also, Belichick did ok after getting fired from the Browns.
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He didn't go to the playoffs with Brissett. Unless you're talking about 2018, when Brissett backed up Andrew Luck.
He did go to the playoffs as a wild card with Phil Rivers, but so did Norv Turner, Anthony Lynn and Mike McCoy. Rivers is a HOF quarterback, after all, and he played reasonably well his one year in Indy, when they benefited from one of the league's softest schedules.
As for the Wentz year, you're burying the lead. Needing a win to secure the playoffs, the Colts lost a home game to the Raiders and then decided not to show up in week 18 and got blown out by the league's worst team.
I don't know that Reich is a bad coach. But I wouldn't be excited if I were 82 or any other Panthers fan. Nothing he's done screams that he deserves another chance this soon.
You’re right. I mixed up 2018 and 2019.
Which means he went to the playoffs with Luck and Rivers. Less impressive.
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Anita Baker??? 😬😬😬
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Shanahan needed to challenge that. It was fourth down, a huge play, and the only thing Shanahan would've been risking was a first-half time out.
It was obvious when Smith got up that he thought the play might be reversed if challenged.
Bad coaching cost the 49ers a 7-0 deficit.
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Shanahan needed to challenge that. It was fourth down, a huge play, and the only thing Shanahan would've been risking was a first-half time out.
It was obvious when Smith got up that he thought the play might be reversed if challenged.
Bad coaching cost the 49ers a 7-0 deficit.
Was it a catch or not?
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Shanahan needed to challenge that. It was fourth down, a huge play, and the only thing Shanahan would've been risking was a first-half time out.
It was obvious when Smith got up that he thought the play might be reversed if challenged.
Bad coaching cost the 49ers a 7-0 deficit.
That’s not the only thing he was risking. If he would have been wrong he’d only have one left the rest of the game. But he should have challenged.
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That’s not the only thing he was risking. If he would have been wrong he’d only have one left the rest of the game. But he should have challenged.
Yes, thanks for the correction.
Was it a catch or not?
Yes, on reverse angle the ball was clearly out when Smith hit the ground.
And then Sirianni does challenge the Purdy fumble and Philly's in business again. Also, looks like Purdy banged up on the play.
Rough start for the Niners.
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This game is over
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Congrats to the eagles on making the super bowl.
Refs gotta do better
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Josh Johnson is still around huh?
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Rough start for the NFL here.
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Rough start for the NFL here.
People gamble with real money on sports
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Josh Johnson is still around huh?
His 13th team! That's gotta a record or damn close to it.
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49ers defense thinks they can win this. Field position and field goals?
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Niners are going to win this game.
Fox and the NFL are having a really bad afternoon as well.
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Looks to me that Purdy hurt his elbow when it hit the guys helmet. I don’t think that was ever even mentioned.
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Defensive penalties and a bum turnover will end up killing the Niners. Their defense was controlling this game, until it wasn’t here late in the 2nd quarter.
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On the Johnson fumbled snap, both Niners tackles false start.
No penalty called.
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Not sure I understand how Purdy can come back in now, but couldn’t earlier.
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Not sure I understand how Purdy can come back in now, but couldn’t earlier.
Only need one arm to handoff
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Only need one arm to handoff
You’re not wrong, but running wildcat with CMC has to be a better option. Eagles probably didn’t prepare for it, you at least give yourself a chance. With Purdy in there, might as well put 11 in the box.
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Nightmare scenario for the Niners. They had a great chance to win this game with Purdy. Oh well.
And I agree that McCaffrey would be a better choice than Purdy if Purdy can't throw the ball.
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You’re not wrong, but running wildcat with CMC has to be a better option. Eagles probably didn’t prepare for it, you at least give yourself a chance. With Purdy in there, might as well put 11 in the box.
Niners have no chance either way. Game was over as soon as Purdy got hurt. Niners weren't going to shut the Eagles out and/or turn them over enough to win.
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If it was a nerve it could take time for feeling to return.
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Nightmare scenario for the Niners. They had a great chance to win this game with Purdy. Oh well.
And I agree that McCaffrey would be a better choice than Purdy if Purdy can't throw the ball.
"Great chance" seems a bit strong. They were down 7-0 on the road with a rookie QB who they already were struggling to protect when he got hurt.
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"Great chance" seems a bit strong. They were down 7-0 on the road with a rookie QB who they already were struggling to protect when he got hurt.
Niners defense held after the Purdy fumble and they then tied it 7-7 behind McCaffrey on their next drive. The defense was starting to play better. But maybe they wouldn't have done as well if Purdy hadn't gotten hurt?
I don't want to get into a classic Scoop semantics battle, so I'll give you the last word if you want.
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I really like Olsen as a commentator
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For a multitude of reasons, this game has been embarrassing for the NFL.
Also if you had Miles Sanders over rush prop…woof. I had the under, borderline miracle.
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Lol. Now CBS screws up replays and the Chiefs waste a challenge.
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Chiefs are looking very strong
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Cowboys news dump of firing Kellen Moore during this AFC title game.
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Cowboys news dump of firing Kellen Moore during this AFC title game.
He got a head-coaching interview with the Panthers and I think a couple other teams.
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That touchdown pass from Burrow was a thing of beauty
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Dumb challenge.
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Incredible throw there by Mahomes.
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Mahomes v burrow = Jordan v Drexler?
Gtfo Tony
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Mahomes v burrow = Jordan v Drexler?
Gtfo Tony
I agree with this analysis
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Strange play call there from Cincy.
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Wow! That was gutsy.
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Drexler wouldn't have gone for it there
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Fun game.
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The only thing that would make this better is if it were being played indoors at a neutral site. 🙄🙄🙄
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“I don’t think they’re going to go for it here Jim!”
(Bengals immediately go for it)
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WTF was that call?
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NFL not showing well today. That was insane.
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This crap is unbelievable. What a clown show by the NFL all day today. Embarrassing.
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Ugh what a travesty.
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Ball don't lie.
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It ultimately did cost Cincy a timeout they otherwise wouldn’t have used.
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Very questionable penalty there.
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Was that intentional grounding or a make-up call? I suppose it doesn't matter now.
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To miss out on a return to the super bowl because you were dumb.
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That Cimcy player should be cut immediately. Incredible.
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I mean, why touch him?
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Ugh that's lame as hell.
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Ugh that's lame as hell.
That's on the Cincy player. Can't happen.
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Ossai had a hell of a game, too.
What a way to lose.
Hell of a game by Chris Jones, and incredible performance by the best QB in football.
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I always tell my wife - more close games are decided by losing plays than winning plays.
This was just one more example.
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Man, that’s such a brutal way to go out, what a mistake.
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“I don’t think we have any cigars, but we’re going to the Super Bowl.”
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https://twitter.com/WillBrinson/status/1619893337074405376?t=gSLb1gbaW8zRen16HfJFCw&s=19
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That's on the Cincy player. Can't happen.
Oh sure, I agree. But its hard to imagine a way to make me feel more deflated as a fan going into the super bowl. Bush league officiating and organization all day, some real questionable calls favoring KC before that point, and then to end like that. Just feels kinda gross.
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https://twitter.com/WillBrinson/status/1619893337074405376?t=gSLb1gbaW8zRen16HfJFCw&s=19
I feel gross defending NFL officials here, but you can find a missed holding call on every play. And the second they start calling them, everyone is up in arms about all the flags.
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From this angle it's even worse.
https://twitter.com/SharpFootball/status/1619893747881488387?s=20&t=tYv9GMwS4GnSS8uviDF6lw
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I feel gross defending NFL officials here, but you can find a missed holding call on every play. And the second they start calling them, everyone is up in arms about all the flags.
Can you find a block in the back on every punt return? Cause they missed that as well.
I always thought holding was not called if it didn't directly effect the play. In this situation, it allowed mahomes to get out of the pocket.
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Can you find a block in the back on every punt return? Cause they missed that as well.
I always thought holding was not called if it didn't directly effect the play. In this situation, it allowed mahomes to get out of the pocket.
Probably.
Just glad they didn't miss this vicious taunt.
https://twitter.com/Rate_the_Refs/status/1619879910897745920?s=20&t=xSQMY3xZ8G6TLh6Sy6Wdnw
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(https://i.imgflip.com/1quolb.gif)
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Oh sure, I agree. But its hard to imagine a way to make me feel more deflated as a fan going into the super bowl. Bush league officiating and organization all day, some real questionable calls favoring KC before that point, and then to end like that. Just feels kinda gross.
I know very little about football but I did feel the penalties were skewed against Cincy.
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GB that's perfect.
Early super bowl lines are Eagles by 1 - my guess is the sharps will push that to a field goal and then the public will reel it back in before kickoff.
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Ossai had a hell of a game, too.
What a way to lose.
Hell of a game by Chris Jones, and incredible performance by the best QB in football.
Yeah, Burrow was pretty good.
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Yeah, Burrow was pretty good.
Pretty funny, Len.
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GB that's perfect.
Early super bowl lines are Eagles by 1 - my guess is the sharps will push that to a field goal and then the public will reel it back in before kickoff.
I see it at -2.5 already
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The under is 11-1 in Carl Cheffers last 12 playoff games.
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Ossai had a hell of a game, too.
What a way to lose.
Hell of a game by Chris Jones, and incredible performance by the best QB in football.
Wasn't a big fan of Mahomes when he entered the league, seemed arrogant to me.
Now a huge fan. Seems like a legitimately decent guy, unbelievable QB, and tons of heart.
No way he would have played if this was a regular season game, gutsy performance and when it mattered he gave it everything he could.
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I find myself feeling a little sorry for Joseph Ossai.
It was a stupid and costly play, but it's not as if Mahomes was 10 feet out of bounds, and it's not as if Ossai crushed Mahomes or hit the QB in the head.
It was a dumb play, and it was the right call, but it's tough when an athlete now has to hear about one mistake for the rest of his career, or even the rest of his life.
He looked inconsolable on the bench, one of the lasting memories from the post-game stuff shown on TV. Later in the locker room, he answered question after question from media, taking full responsibility; many others would have hid in the trainer's room.
It's kind of like the Webber time-out or Norwood's missed kick in the Super Bowl. If Ossai is good enough he'll overcome it, and he'll learn to shrug off the references. But to have one miscue follow you is brutal.
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Great hire by the Phins.
https://sports.yahoo.com/vic-fangio-joins-dolphins-as-their-new-dc-becomes-the-nfls-highest-paid-coordinator-193424845.html
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Great hire by the Phins.
https://sports.yahoo.com/vic-fangio-joins-dolphins-as-their-new-dc-becomes-the-nfls-highest-paid-coordinator-193424845.html
Suckers.
We got Joe Barry Carroll. Take that Dolphins fans!!!
GB is not a serious football team.
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Billionaire Battle: Ross outbids Tepper for Fangio.
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I find myself feeling a little sorry for Joseph Ossai.
It was a stupid and costly play, but it's not as if Mahomes was 10 feet out of bounds, and it's not as if Ossai crushed Mahomes or hit the QB in the head.
It was a dumb play, and it was the right call, but it's tough when an athlete now has to hear about one mistake for the rest of his career, or even the rest of his life.
He looked inconsolable on the bench, one of the lasting memories from the post-game stuff shown on TV. Later in the locker room, he answered question after question from media, taking full responsibility; many others would have hid in the trainer's room.
It's kind of like the Webber time-out or Norwood's missed kick in the Super Bowl. If Ossai is good enough he'll overcome it, and he'll learn to shrug off the references. But to have one miscue follow you is brutal.
Yup. Correct call and a dumb play. But it wasnt all time incompetence.
Also, no way to know how the rest plays out. Butker probably in that weather doesnt make it from 60 but hes got the leg. And worst case for KC was it was just going to OT.
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Yup. Correct call and a dumb play. But it wasnt all time incompetence.
Also, no way to know how the rest plays out. Butker probably in that weather doesnt make it from 60 but hes got the leg. And worst case for KC was it was just going to OT.
I'm reminded of a (much less consequential) game between the Browns and the Chiefs where a Browns player pulled off and threw his helmet in celebration thinking the game was over but got flagged because the play was still going. KC got to kick a field goal with 0:00 on the clock to win the game.
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Yup. Correct call and a dumb play. But it wasnt all time incompetence.
Also, no way to know how the rest plays out. Butker probably in that weather doesnt make it from 60 but hes got the leg. And worst case for KC was it was just going to OT.
I think they would have gone for a hail mary there. That 45 yarder would not have gone another 15 yards.
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I'm reminded of a (much less consequential) game between the Browns and the Chiefs where a Browns player pulled off and threw his helmet in celebration thinking the game was over but got flagged because the play was still going. KC got to kick a field goal with 0:00 on the clock to win the game.
The infamous Dwayne Rudd play.
(https://i.imgur.com/t88iP3O.gif)
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Brock Purdy tore his UCL
https://twitter.com/tompelissero/status/1620181317978832899?s=46&t=KoZpYohLUYXlqwCjYQR7dQ
No word on what kind of brace he was wearing at Jimmy John’s
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They still had 8 seconds left. They would've tried one throw to the sideline to pick up 7-10 yards. Who knows whether they would've completed that.
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The Empire struck a dagger into the heart of every Giants fan. It is worse than serving Budweiser at the FF.
https://nypost.com/2023/01/29/empire-state-buildings-eagles-salute-is-a-stunning-betrayal/
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Kellen Moore. Not good enough to be the Dallas OC. Good enough to be the Chargers OC.
One team's trash....
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Kayvon Thibodeux vs Joe Staley vs Lawrence Tynes vs Joe Staley vs Michael Strahan is the best Twitter beef of 2023 so far.
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The Empire struck a dagger into the heart of every Giants fan. It is worse than serving Budweiser at the FF.
https://nypost.com/2023/01/29/empire-state-buildings-eagles-salute-is-a-stunning-betrayal/
I don't like the Giants, but I have to ask....WTF?
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Seriously no Romo discussion?
https://news.yahoo.com/did-tony-romo-nearly-n-234342885.html (https://news.yahoo.com/did-tony-romo-nearly-n-234342885.html)
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I thought this was going to about how Romo has regressed as an analyst.
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I thought this was going to about how Romo has regressed as an analyst.
that too - lots of other goofy Romo commentary also being called out...
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I thought this was going to about how Romo has regressed as an analyst.
He was never that great to begin with. He took advantage of directly replacing Phil Simms who was brutal.
Compared to Phil Simms and others of that ilk, he's good. Compared to say Greg Olsen, Tony leaves a lot to be desired.
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Seriously no Romo discussion?
https://news.yahoo.com/did-tony-romo-nearly-n-234342885.html (https://news.yahoo.com/did-tony-romo-nearly-n-234342885.html)
I honestly believe he was gonna say “nickel backs” and changed his mind cause it didn’t make sense.
I thought this was going to about how Romo has regressed as an analyst.
He was never that great to begin with. He took advantage of directly replacing Phil Simms who was brutal..
I don’t agree with that, he’s definitely regressed. His best ability was literal analysis. Calling out play predictions, tendencies, showing the ability that made him a really good pro, on the fly. But he was told to scale that back, reign in his enthusiasm and analysis, dumb it down a bit, and he’s FAR less good like that and just has become cliched. It’s unfortunate. Olsen is far more natural at the blend of the two, and he’s best in class for me right now.
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He was never that great to begin with. He took advantage of directly replacing Phil Simms who was brutal.
Compared to Phil Simms and others of that ilk, he's good. Compared to say Greg Olsen, Tony leaves a lot to be desired.
Huh.
I think Olson is terrible, as does everyone I've heard discuss him.
He's just keeping Tom Brady's sent warm anyhow.
Edit: Terrible is probably strong. How about mediocre.
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I honestly believe he was gonna say “nickel backs” and changed his mind cause it didn’t make sense.
Could be. Also could have been about to say the N-word. Only he knows. If he was, he at least stopped himself so while funny, ultimately a nothingburger
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I don’t agree with that, he’s definitely regressed. His best ability was literal analysis. Calling out play predictions, tendencies, showing the ability that made him a really good pro, on the fly. But he was told to scale that back, reign in his enthusiasm and analysis, dumb it down a bit, and he’s FAR less good like that and just has become cliched. It’s unfortunate. Olsen is far more natural at the blend of the two, and he’s best in class for me right now.
I agree with every word of this. Couldn't have said it better
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Yeah I love Olson. Not sure the pairing with Burkhart is the best but perhaps I just have to listen to them more. I know Buck and Troy get a lot of crap but they are really good. It just shows how hard it is to replace these guys.
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Wasn't Fox gonna pay Brady hundreds of millions of dollars to be their lead analyst?
How many viewers do they think Brady would bring that don't already watch? Would Brady actually be better than Olsen? I'd say highly unlikely.
It seems more like trophy collecting than trying to make the viewing experience better for the audience.
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Tyler Huntley, AFC Pro Bowl QB.
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DeMeco Ryan’s gets six years in Houston, that’s a lot of years.
Sean Payton to Denver, which is something.
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DeMeco Ryan’s gets six years in Houston, that’s a lot of years.
Sean Payton to Denver, which is something.
This will sit well with Payton's ego.
Ian Rapoport @RapSheet
Unbelievable: The #Broncos spent today trying to hire DeMeco Ryans AGAIN today before he recommitted to the #Texans, sources say. When he agreed to terms with the Texans, they moved and finalized Sean Payton.
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Saints are getting Denver’s pick at 29 (via SF from Miami), Denver’s 2024 2nd. They are sending back to Denver a 2023 third round pick.
Highway robbery, Denver loves overpaying for past their prime assets.
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This will sit well with Payton's ego.
Ian Rapoport @RapSheet
Unbelievable: The #Broncos spent today trying to hire DeMeco Ryans AGAIN today before he recommitted to the #Texans, sources say. When he agreed to terms with the Texans, they moved and finalized Sean Payton.
Yeah, the Denver coaching search was something. No deal officially official yet with Payton either.
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LOL, new owners with money to burn panicking...
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Yeah, the Denver coaching search was something. No deal officially official yet with Payton either.
The guy who hired Nathaniel Hackett, gave Randy Gregory $28 million, then swung the Russell Wilson deal ran a questionable coaching search?
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The guy who hired Nathaniel Hackett, gave Randy Gregory $28 million, then swung the Russell Wilson deal ran a questionable coaching search?
Surprised Payton took the gig. I’d have waited another cycle to see how things shook out. Denver has no draft capital and a terrible roster. If he was worried about not being included in the next cycle, that was silly. Bill Cowher was in the cycle for a decade at least after he retired
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Surprised Payton took the gig. I’d have waited another cycle to see how things shook out. Denver has no draft capital and a terrible roster. If he was worried about not being included in the next cycle, that was silly. Bill Cowher was in the cycle for a decade at least after he retired
Payton is a legit good coach, of course, but if Russell Wilson is as cooked as it appeared, that team is going nowhere fast. They have some quality pieces on defense (Surtain is the NFL's CB1, in my opinion), but the offensive line is bad and the receiving group has underperformed. As you say, they're light on draft capital and as of the moment, they only have $9 million in cap space for next year (though that I'm sure can change).
I guess Sean likes a challenge. Or really hates the prospect of working for Jerry Jones.
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Tyler Huntley, AFC Pro Bowl QB.
Derek Card, benched for poor performance, is a pro bowler as well. Name an All-NFL team and call it a day.
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Derek Card, benched for poor performance, is a pro bowler as well. Name an All-NFL team and call it a day.
While I agree the Pro Bowl is a joke, Carr was more benched cause McDaniels is a moron. He is an upgrade for more than half the league. Short of the Colts/Texans in a position to get a top QB pick, a bunch of teams should be interested. Carolina, the Jets, Washington, Titans depending how they feel about Willis, Seahawks, maybe the Lions, maybe even GB. He threw for 4800 yards last year and had a QB rating of 102 on 27 TDs to 9 picks the year before that. He’s only 31, he didn’t suddenly forget how to be a QB. Feels like Alex Smith 2.0 in a new environment
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While I agree the Pro Bowl is a joke, Carr was more benched cause McDaniels is a moron. He is an upgrade for more than half the league. Short of the Colts/Texans in a position to get a top QB pick, a bunch of teams should be interested. Carolina, the Jets, Washington, Titans depending how they feel about Willis, Seahawks, maybe the Lions, maybe even GB. He threw for 4800 yards last year and had a QB rating of 102 on 27 TDs to 9 picks the year before that. He’s only 31, he didn’t suddenly forget how to be a QB. Feels like Alex Smith 2.0 in a new environment
McDaniels may be a moron, but Carr earned his benching. He was bad this year, and really bad down the stretch. In his last four starts, he never completed better 55% of his passes, posted QB ratings of 89.6, 36.9, 86.6 and 42.1, and threw 7 INTs (vs 6 TDs).
The fact Jarrett Stidham (!) came in the next week and threw for 365 yards and 3 TDs against the league's top defense is a pretty strong indication it wasn't a coaching, playcalling or supporting cast problem.
Carr may very well bounce back with a new team next year, but he was poor in 2022.
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Tom Brady retires "for good."
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Tom Brady retires "for good."
Luckily for Packers fans, Mahomes is around for everyone to get mad at when people say he’s the best qb in the world, so this isn’t that big of a deal anymore
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Tom Brady retires "for good."
Better than retiring "for evil."
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Here is Brady’s announcement . Short and to the point .
https://www.instagram.com/p/CoHvvZ_ux6e/
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Tom Brady retires "for good."
More time ta just hang out at da crib, aina?
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NY Times lead:
Tom Brady, one of the world’s most decorated professional athletes and widely viewed as the greatest player in N.F.L. history, announced Wednesday that he would retire. For good this time.
Is Brady actually "the greatest player in NFL history"? I'd certainly say he is the most accomplished player ever, and almost surely the best QB ever, but I don't know about the greatest player ever. One could argue that a whole lot of players were superior athletes who accomplished amazing things but simply weren't in a position to win as much -- Jim Brown, Walter Payton, Lawrence Taylor and Reggie White immediately spring to mind, and I sure there are others.
I guess it's one of those semantics things. And given that he won 7 Super Bowls, has just about every passing record possible, and played at a very high level for 23 years, I wouldn't try to claim he's not the greatest ever.
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He might be the most winning player in NFL history. I think football is the toughest to call someone the greatest due to how different each of the positions are and how interdependent they are on other phases.
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He is the best player at the most important position. I feel comfortable calling him the best ever player.
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He is the best player at the most important position. I feel comfortable calling him the best ever player.
Well, you are the Sultan of Semantics!
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Payton is a legit good coach, of course, but if Russell Wilson is as cooked as it appeared, that team is going nowhere fast. They have some quality pieces on defense (Surtain is the NFL's CB1, in my opinion), but the offensive line is bad and the receiving group has underperformed. As you say, they're light on draft capital and as of the moment, they only have $9 million in cap space for next year (though that I'm sure can change).
I guess Sean likes a challenge. Or really hates the prospect of working for Jerry Jones.
He worked for Jones previously, so there's your answer.
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Tom Brady retires "for good."
Absolutely amazing story of a man who was willing to trade his marriage, family, and possibly his health to play in a single playoff game.
Should be made into a movie.
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NY Times lead:
Tom Brady, one of the world’s most decorated professional athletes and widely viewed as the greatest player in N.F.L. history, announced Wednesday that he would retire. For good this time.
Is Brady actually "the greatest player in NFL history"? I'd certainly say he is the most accomplished player ever, and almost surely the best QB ever, but I don't know about the greatest player ever. One could argue that a whole lot of players were superior athletes who accomplished amazing things but simply weren't in a position to win as much -- Jim Brown, Walter Payton, Lawrence Taylor and Reggie White immediately spring to mind, and I sure there are others.
I guess it's one of those semantics things. And given that he won 7 Super Bowls, has just about every passing record possible, and played at a very high level for 23 years, I wouldn't try to claim he's not the greatest ever.
Bo Jackson is the greatest football player of all time. I firmly believe this.
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NY Times lead:
Tom Brady, one of the world’s most decorated professional athletes and widely viewed as the greatest player in N.F.L. history, announced Wednesday that he would retire. For good this time.
Is Brady actually "the greatest player in NFL history"? I'd certainly say he is the most accomplished player ever, and almost surely the best QB ever, but I don't know about the greatest player ever. One could argue that a whole lot of players were superior athletes who accomplished amazing things but simply weren't in a position to win as much -- Jim Brown, Walter Payton, Lawrence Taylor and Reggie White immediately spring to mind, and I sure there are others.
I guess it's one of those semantics things. And given that he won 7 Super Bowls, has just about every passing record possible, and played at a very high level for 23 years, I wouldn't try to claim he's not the greatest ever.
In my view , Brady is the greatest player in NFL History. Sustained excellence at the premium position in a violent sport, over 23 years, is a monumental achievement. Going into this past season, he was voted by his NFL Peers as the Number 1 ranked player in the NFL. That is quite a statement for any player , much less someone 45. Brady was a flat out winner .
I am also glad Brady is bowing out now and not becoming like Johnny Unitas, Willie Mays , Hank Aaron or other all time greats who hung on a couple years too long.
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In my view , Brady is the greatest player in NFL History. Sustained excellence at the premium position in a violent sport, over 23 years, is a monumental achievement. Going into this past season, he was voted by his NFL Peers as the Number 1 ranked player in the NFL. That is quite a statement for any player , much less someone 45. Brady was a flat out winner .
I am also glad Brady is bowing out now and not becoming like Johnny Unitas, Willie Mays , Hank Aaron or other all time greats who hung on a couple years too long.
Reasonable take, 9-9-9.
I'm sticking with Don Majkowski, but Brady is way up there!
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In my view , Brady is the greatest player in NFL History. Sustained excellence at the premium position in a violent sport, over 23 years, is a monumental achievement. Going into this past season, he was voted by his NFL Peers as the Number 1 ranked player in the NFL. That is quite a statement for any player , much less someone 45. Brady was a flat out winner .
Was that vote done by his peers in Tampa? Cause ranking someone who wasn't even top 5 at his position in any meaningful category other than yards because he threw 50 times more than anyone else and hadn't won an MVP in 5 years...when a QB did every year in that span, is media puff nonsense.
If you polled the NFL offices and said you could choose one player on your team for 2022, nobody is choosing Brady over Mahomes, Aaron Donald, or TJ Watt, among others.
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Asking those with legal expertise in here, the news about Eagles OL Josh Sills today, how coincidental is it that charges were reported and pushed forward in the days following their SB berth? I'm not at all saying its a cash grab (especially for a nobody OL with hardly any playing time) or anything of that regard, its just interesting that a 3.5 year old incident began moving forward now. Does hoping it gets more attention, given the Eagles situation, play into it? Regardless, the testimony and descriptions are gross.
"Fun" fact, Sills hometown in Nowhereville, Ohio is also the hometown of Dom Capers.
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Asking those with legal expertise in here, the news about Eagles OL Josh Sills today, how coincidental is it that charges were reported and pushed forward in the days following their SB berth? I'm not at all saying its a cash grab (especially for a nobody OL with hardly any playing time) or anything of that regard, its just interesting that a 3.5 year old incident began moving forward now. Does hoping it gets more attention, given the Eagles situation, play into it? Regardless, the testimony and descriptions are gross.
"Fun" fact, Sills hometown in Nowhereville, Ohio is also the hometown of Dom Capers.
According to a CNN story:
The Ohio AG’s office said the alleged 2019 rape was immediately reported and an investigation by the Guernsey County Sheriff’s office subsequently ensued.
Also, it's my understanding that this came via grand jury indictment, so it's likely been in the works for weeks. Could the Ohio AG have rushed the indictment the past couple of days to garner himself some extra publicity? Perhaps. He does seem like a clown and he hasn't won himself many female fans in recent months. But that's pretty cynical.
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Was that vote done by his peers in Tampa? Cause ranking someone who wasn't even top 5 at his position in any meaningful category other than yards because he threw 50 times more than anyone else and hadn't won an MVP in 5 years...when a QB did every year in that span, is media puff nonsense.
If you polled the NFL offices and said you could choose one player on your team for 2022, nobody is choosing Brady over Mahomes, Aaron Donald, or TJ Watt, among others.
Here is the actual poll. Done by the NFL every year. Players vote.
https://www.nfl.com/news/top-100-players-of-2022-nos-10-1-tom-brady-no-1-one-more-time
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I'm no huge fan of Brady and don't have him #1 of all time, but even I can say that the discussions, Ive heard on the radio and seen on social media, with him and Jeter are preposterous. Jeter isn't the best SS of his generation, much less of all time. Hell, there is another HOF Yankees SS who has lead the Yankees to more titles AND won an MVP.
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Trivia . Brady was the last Montreal Expo Draft Pick Active in Professional Sports.
https://nypost.com/2023/02/01/tom-brady-leaves-nfl-as-last-montreal-expos-pick-to-retire/
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I'm no huge fan of Brady and don't have him #1 of all time, but even I can say that the discussions, Ive heard on the radio and seen on social media, with him and Jeter are preposterous. Jeter isn't the best SS of his generation, much less of all time. Hell, there is another HOF Yankees SS who has lead the Yankees to more titles AND won an MVP.
Are there really people claiming that Derek Jeter is the best baseball player ever or the best Yankee ever?
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Are there really people claiming that Derek Jeter is the best baseball player ever or the best Yankee ever?
Derek Jeter would not even be in the top 20 all time Yankees .
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Not surprisingly, Olsen is handling the impending arrival of Brady with class, honesty and pragmatism. Here's what he told The Athletic:
“From the very beginning, I understand the landscape. Again, it’s not a matter of liking it. It’s not a matter of, ‘Oh man, I’m so happy for Tom. He’s going to do great.’ It’s a matter of just being realistic and understanding that when Tom Brady agrees to potentially be your No. 1 analyst and sit in the booth and all that he brings in with his reputation and whatnot, I get it. To expect someone to not go that route seems pretty delusional. I always try to be very honest with myself, and I always feel I need to be honest with my situations because if not, you’re really setting yourself up for disappointment. I know what I signed up for.
“I knew this year was going to be a weird year because I was going to answer this question every single time. I’ve said this to Kevin. (Fox play-by-play guy Kevin Burkhardt.) My only option right now to make a career out of this is to be good. That’s it. I didn’t play quarterback. I didn’t play for the Dallas Cowboys. I don’t have a gold jacket on. I didn’t play in New York City. The only way I can do this is if I’m good. Whether that’s good enough in the long run, I don’t know. All I can control is going out there and having fun and giving a fun broadcast.
“In regard to Tom, if he comes in and he takes it, I get it. I don’t ask anyone to feel bad for me. And I’m not going to feel bad for myself. Will I be disappointed? Would I rather sit next to Kevin for the next 20 years? Of course. I’m not going to sit here and sound stupid and be like, ‘You know, just doing this for one year was plenty.’ Like, no, screw that. I’d like to do this for 20 years. I’d like to call 10 Super Bowls. Whether that happens or not, I don’t know. I don’t control it. But the second I spend all my energy worrying about what Tom does and worrying about my job security and who’s going to be in my seat, then I’m not going to be very effective. I just don’t know how else to describe it. I’ve come to grips with it, and I’m going to make it hard as hell on them to try to replace me.”
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Impossible to not like Greg Olsen. G-Reg from the 7th Floor Crew has turned into the benchmark for class, making the most of your station, and what a pro can be.
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A guy being promoted to the top with no prior experience or success?
We used to have a meritocracy in this country
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Not surprisingly, Olsen is handling the impending arrival of Brady with class, honesty and pragmatism. Here's what he told The Athletic:
“From the very beginning, I understand the landscape. Again, it’s not a matter of liking it. It’s not a matter of, ‘Oh man, I’m so happy for Tom. He’s going to do great.’ It’s a matter of just being realistic and understanding that when Tom Brady agrees to potentially be your No. 1 analyst and sit in the booth and all that he brings in with his reputation and whatnot, I get it. To expect someone to not go that route seems pretty delusional. I always try to be very honest with myself, and I always feel I need to be honest with my situations because if not, you’re really setting yourself up for disappointment. I know what I signed up for.
“I knew this year was going to be a weird year because I was going to answer this question every single time. I’ve said this to Kevin. (Fox play-by-play guy Kevin Burkhardt.) My only option right now to make a career out of this is to be good. That’s it. I didn’t play quarterback. I didn’t play for the Dallas Cowboys. I don’t have a gold jacket on. I didn’t play in New York City. The only way I can do this is if I’m good. Whether that’s good enough in the long run, I don’t know. All I can control is going out there and having fun and giving a fun broadcast.
“In regard to Tom, if he comes in and he takes it, I get it. I don’t ask anyone to feel bad for me. And I’m not going to feel bad for myself. Will I be disappointed? Would I rather sit next to Kevin for the next 20 years? Of course. I’m not going to sit here and sound stupid and be like, ‘You know, just doing this for one year was plenty.’ Like, no, screw that. I’d like to do this for 20 years. I’d like to call 10 Super Bowls. Whether that happens or not, I don’t know. I don’t control it. But the second I spend all my energy worrying about what Tom does and worrying about my job security and who’s going to be in my seat, then I’m not going to be very effective. I just don’t know how else to describe it. I’ve come to grips with it, and I’m going to make it hard as hell on them to try to replace me.”
Incredibly graceful and emotionally mature.
But he's getting done dirty.
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A guy being promoted to the top with no prior experience or success?
We used to have a meritocracy in this country
No we didn't.
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Incredibly graceful and emotionally mature.
But he's getting done dirty.
Not really. This is exactly what he signed up for.
So much so, that he included in his Fox contract a clause that allows him to bolt to another network if offered a spot in their #1 booth.
Don't cry for G-Reg.
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Incredibly graceful and emotionally mature.
But he's getting done dirty.
Even more so cause not only was Olsen known as a good interview and media soundbite guy as a player (which Brady never has been, Olsen is natural and charming, Brady has always been measured and robotic), Olsen started doing commentary work on bye weeks his last couple of years. He was both auditioning and practicing for the gig. And then excelled once he started. And Brady is just falling into it.
I said it when it was announced, but the deal/position always seemed weird. If they gave that contract to Peyton Manning before retired, I would have got it. Someone like Richard Sherman, again could understand it. Brady just always seemed weird to anoint as the next big color commentator.
Not really. This is exactly what he signed up for.
So much so, that he included in his Fox contract a clause that allows him to bolt to another network if offered a spot in their #1 booth.
Don't cry for G-Reg.
Coincidentally said by the only person here who thinks Olsen sucks. 8-)
That contract is just savvy for anyone with commentator aspirations. Nobody is crying for him, he'll be just fine. Just pointing out the obvious that an accomplished broadcaster with a great track record is being demoted for someone who has exhibited nothing to hint that he'll be good at the gig other than being really good at football.
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No we didn't.
Actually we did have a meritocracy, but the only ones who were able to get the education and/or experience to qualify were white Christian males.
Cue the All in the Family theme song.
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Derek Jeter would not even be in the top 20 all time Yankees .
Top herpes spreader of all time
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That contract is just savvy for anyone with commentator aspirations. Nobody is crying for him, he'll be just fine. Just pointing out the obvious that an accomplished broadcaster with a great track record is being demoted for someone who has exhibited nothing to hint that he'll be good at the gig other than being really good at football.
The irony here is that Olson was promoted to the #1 booth only because Brady un-retired. Brady's not stealing his job. It was Brady's job already. Greg was only keeping the seat warm.
And he was promoted to the #1 booth with only a year's experience. It's not like he grinded his way to the top. He was allowed to pass over plenty of more experienced and accomplished commentators because of who he was.
As for Brady, the idea that a guy who became the GOAT over a 23-year career largely because of his football IQ, famed preparation and virtually unmatched competitiveness has "exhibited nothing to hint" that he can provide intelligent football commentary is silly. He's one of the smartest players of all time. I suspect he knows a thing or two. Does that guarantee he'll be a success in the booth? No. But I wouldn't bet against him.
Food for thought:
https://awfulannouncing.com/nfl/the-2022-nfl-announcer-rankings.html
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Actually we did have a meritocracy, but the only ones who were able to get the education and/or experience to qualify were white Christian males.
Cue the All in the Family theme song.
By definition not a meritocracy then 8-)
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As for Brady, the idea that a guy who became the GOAT over a 23-year career largely because of his football IQ, famed preparation and virtually unmatched competitiveness has "exhibited nothing to hint" that he can provide intelligent football commentary is silly. He's one of the smartest players of all time. I suspect he knows a thing or two. Does that guarantee he'll be a success in the booth? No. But I wouldn't bet against him.
There are hundreds of guys you can say that about. I dont think unmatched competitiveness is really going to play into it.
Look at Drew Brees. Another guy who I feel is a far more natural communicator than Brady, also a HOF QB with insane work ethic, preparation, and football IQ. His appearances on TV have been awful and awkward.
I don't doubt Brady's intelligence or knowledge, but I wouldn't put him anywhere near the top of the list of current or recently retired NFL players who will be great commentators.
The irony here is that Olson was promoted to the #1 booth only because Brady un-retired. Brady's not stealing his job. It was Brady's job already. Greg was only keeping the seat warm.
And he was promoted to the #1 booth with only a year's experience. It's not like he grinded his way to the top. He was allowed to pass over plenty of more experienced and accomplished commentators because of who he was.
As for Brady, the idea that a guy who became the GOAT over a 23-year career largely because of his football IQ, famed preparation and virtually unmatched competitiveness has "exhibited nothing to hint" that he can provide intelligent football commentary is silly. He's one of the smartest players of all time. I suspect he knows a thing or two. Does that guarantee he'll be a success in the booth? No. But I wouldn't bet against him.
Food for thought:
https://awfulannouncing.com/nfl/the-2022-nfl-announcer-rankings.html
So he came in behind the arguable #1 NFL announcing team (Buck and Aikman), Nantz and Romo, the guy who has been doing MNF for 15 years whose new partner is another legendary PBP guy, and 2 teams with insane PBP guys (one being a top 3 in the game in Harlan and the other being the most underrated around in Eagle) with color guys who are entirely replaceable. Not sure this is making the point you think it is. I was expecting them to be 10th or worse if Olsen is "terrible". If you put Olsen with Eagle or Harlan, he's in the top 4.
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Top herpes spreader of all time
Actually, JJ Hardy beat him in that
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There are hundreds of guys you can say that about.
There are hundreds of guys who became the GOAT because of their preparation and IQ?
I don't doubt Brady's intelligence or knowledge, but I wouldn't put him anywhere near the top of the list of current or recently retired NFL players who will be great commentators.
Who would be atop that list, and why?
So he came in behind the arguable #1 NFL announcing team (Buck and Aikman), Nantz and Romo, the guy who has been doing MNF for 15 years whose new partner is another legendary PBP guy, and 2 teams with insane PBP guys (one being a top 3 in the game in Harlan and the other being the most underrated around in Eagle) with color guys who are entirely replaceable. Not sure this is making the point you think it is. I was expecting them to be 10th or worse if Olsen is "terrible". If you put Olsen with Eagle or Harlan, he's in the top 4.
I'm not sure what point you think I was making. I was just pointing out that Olson isn't as widely viewed as among the best out there. He's fine. Him being bumped by Brady isn't some Shakespearian tragedy.
And again, where was all the wailing when Olson got promoted to the #1 team above more experienced and accomplished commentators a year ago?
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There are hundreds of guys who became the GOAT because of their preparation and IQ?
Who would be atop that list, and why?
I'm not sure what point you think I was making. I was just pointing out that Olson isn't as widely viewed as among the best out there. He's fine. Him being bumped by Brady isn't some Shakespearian tragedy.
And again, where was all the wailing when Olson got promoted to the #1 team above more experienced and accomplished commentators a year ago?
Brady’s quick decision making skills and correct choices made him one of the greatest QBs of all-time. It’s an incredibly important skill for QBs
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I used to work for ESPN and anytime they thought about bringing in someone new to call in the booth, we used to run mock game calls for them. Basically tryouts where an entire random game is played out and the person does their calls as they would. There's no effing way Fox invested hundreds of millions of dollars into Brady in the booth if they weren't absolutely assured he can do a great job.
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I used to work for ESPN and anytime they thought about bringing in someone new to call in the booth, we used to run mock game calls for them. Basically tryouts. There's no effing way Fox invested hundreds of millions of dollars into Brady in the booth if they weren't absolutely assured he can do a great job.
You know, I am not really sure about this. I think between Tony Romo's rapid emergence, plus needing something big to replace Buck and Aikman, Fox threw a bunch of money at him to make sure he didn't head elsewhere. Did they put him through *something?* Probably yes. But my guess is that they weren't "absolutely assured he can do a great job." Was NBC sure about Brees? ESPN and Witten?
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There are hundreds of guys who became the GOAT because of their preparation and IQ?
There are hundreds of current and former NFL players that have intense preparation and high football IQs. Brady has a lot of great intangibles, physical tools, and was in a fantastic system with great and consistent coaching that made him worthy of GOAT conversation. I don't think he has a work ethic or football IQ that would be rare to find elsewhere. That sounds like the same people who said Tebow would be an NFL starting QB/star cause he works so much harder and wants it so much more than anyone else.
Like Rico said, the things that made him an incredible QB and separated him from other merely great QBs are football skills, not that would necessarily make him succeed as announcer.
Who would be atop that list, and why?
He's not my cup of tea, but JJ Watt. Aaron Jones. Larry Fitzgerald.
Again, Ive just never found Brady to be among the more personable, engaging, or charismatic NFL stars.
I'm not sure what point you think I was making. I was just pointing out that Olson isn't as widely viewed as among the best out there. He's fine. Him being bumped by Brady isn't some Shakespearian tragedy.
And again, where was all the wailing when Olson got promoted to the #1 team above more experienced and accomplished commentators a year ago?
By your own "evidence" he was near on a list with a bunch of guys with Emmys and a decade plus of experience on top network teams (Collinsworth, Aikman), the recent golden boy of commentary (Romo), or the partners of elite PBP guys (if you think either Trent Green or Charles Davis is worth of a top spot on their own, well...) despite just 2 full seasons. Thats viewed as pretty damn good IMO.
And if you can't see the difference between someone being promoted to the #1 team after multiple years of broadcasting versus someone coming in cold to the #1 spot, then you're just being difficult. And again, you're making it out to be some dramatic wailing and gnashing of teeth. All anyone has said was he got done a little dirty after performing really well the last 2 years. Its not a scandal. He'll be fine, nobody is going to dwell on it for years. And if Brady stinks, then everything will work itself out eventually.
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You know, I am not really sure about this. I think between Tony Romo's rapid emergence, plus needing something big to replace Buck and Aikman, Fox threw a bunch of money at him to make sure he didn't head elsewhere. Did they put him through *something?* Probably yes. But my guess is that they weren't "absolutely assured he can do a great job." Was NBC sure about Brees? ESPN and Witten?
It's worth remembering that Brady's deal with Fox extends beyond the booth. They're not paying him nearly $40 million a year just to analyze football games. He's going to be an "ambassador," making appearances on behalf of the network, schmoozing with major clients and probably even appearing in other programming (This week on "911: Lone Star," special guest star Tom Brady rescues puppies from a fire).
It's like an enormous NIL deal.
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There are hundreds of current and former NFL players that have intense preparation and high football IQs. Brady has a lot of great intangibles, physical tools, and was in a fantastic system with great and consistent coaching that made him worthy of GOAT conversation.
Tom Brady, System Quarterback
Two days ago you called the guy who designed the system during Brady's best seasons "a moron."
I don't think he has a work ethic or football IQ that would be rare to find elsewhere.
His teammates, coaches and opponents would beg to differ.
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An arrest warrant was issued for Bengals running back Joe Mixon on Thursday afternoon after he allegedly pointed a gun at a woman in downtown Cincinnati last month, according to multiple reports.
According to the warrant, obtained by WCPO’s Evan Millward, police said Mixon pointed a gun at a woman on Jan. 21 and said, “You should be popped in the face, I should shoot you, the police [can't] get me.”
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/arrest-warrant-issued-for-bengals-rb-joe-mixon-after-he-allegedly-pointed-gun-at-woman-in-cincinnati-235030320.html
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And now Mixon's agent is saying the charge will be dropped tomorrow.
Weird.
https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1621314910339698688?s=20&t=BLfjNWDTfDdP2-zCVW_4jg
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It's so sad what's happened to Tony Romo.
He's become a louder Phil Simms
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And now Mixon's agent is saying the charge will be dropped tomorrow.
Weird.
https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1621314910339698688?s=20&t=BLfjNWDTfDdP2-zCVW_4jg
And Chris Beard’s fiancé said it was her fault she got choked. This wouldn’t be the first time Mixon is in trouble for actions toward a woman.
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Tom Brady, System Quarterback
Two days ago you called the guy who designed the system during Brady's best seasons "a moron."
Saying things/implying arguments like that were made to make me and others look like simpleton idiots is disingenuous and cheap. You're better than that. Even the greatest QBs will have more success in a great system than a garbage one.
And I would say it again. McDaniels as an OC in the mid 2000s and early 2010s was brilliant. As a HC, he's a moron and pretty awful leader. Id also argue a lot of the bloom was off his rose as a OC even before he left NE for the second time.
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Saying things/implying arguments like that were made to make me and others look like simpleton idiots is disingenuous and cheap. You're better than that. Even the greatest QBs will have more success in a great system than a garbage one.
And I would say it again. McDaniels as an OC in the mid 2000s and early 2010s was brilliant. As a HC, he's a moron and pretty awful leader. Id also argue a lot of the bloom was off his rose as a OC even before he left NE for the second time.
Correct. You can't throw Tom Brady on the Bears and they're instantly a playoff team without changing a ton of other things.
They system Brady played in was tailored to his strengths and relied on his abilities to make great decisions... which he did all the time.
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No NFL player has won MVP and the Super Bowl in the same season since Kurt Warner in 1999.
Patrick Mahomes got 2022 MVP hardware last night.
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No NFL player has won MVP and the Super Bowl in the same season since Kurt Warner in 1999.
Patrick Mahomes got 2022 MVP hardware last night.
It should just be renamed MVQB since only two non QBs have won it in the last two decades.
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It should just be renamed MVQB since only two non QBs have won it in the last two decades.
You won't get any argument out of me. But that doesn't change the fact I stated.
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You won't get any argument out of me. But that doesn't change the fact I stated.
Nobody said it did.
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This NYT graphic perfectly illustrates why networks are willing to pay ever more bazillions for NFL broadcast rights:
(https://ecp.yusercontent.com/mail?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstatic01.nyt.com%2Fimages%2F2023%2F02%2F10%2Fbriefing%2FoakImage-1676054592388%2FoakImage-1676054592388-articleLarge-v2.png&t=1676209814&ymreqid=3c8d0d78-3338-e941-1c12-810871019600&sig=H1U046pidZvNnM7Hs786gA--~D)
And not only are people watching NFL games more than any other TV programming, but live-sports viewers usually sit through most commercials, too.
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Shane Steichen is your new Indianapolis Colts head coach.
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This NYT graphic perfectly illustrates why networks are willing to pay ever more bazillions for NFL broadcast rights:
(https://ecp.yusercontent.com/mail?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstatic01.nyt.com%2Fimages%2F2023%2F02%2F10%2Fbriefing%2FoakImage-1676054592388%2FoakImage-1676054592388-articleLarge-v2.png&t=1676209814&ymreqid=3c8d0d78-3338-e941-1c12-810871019600&sig=H1U046pidZvNnM7Hs786gA--~D)
And not only are people watching NFL games more than any other TV programming, but live-sports viewers usually sit through most commercials, too.
I’m consistently amazed by and underestimate the number of people I know who will consume anything NFL. I mean, take yesterday, I know plenty of people that get hyped for the Super Bowl in a way approaching how pumped I would be if the Bears were playing, and they didn’t have their team in the game. Same kind of people who plan their Sundays around watching the NFL, not just their specific team
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I’m consistently amazed by and underestimate the number of people I know who will consume anything NFL. I mean, take yesterday, I know plenty of people that get hyped for the Super Bowl in a way approaching how pumped I would be if the Bears were playing, and they didn’t have their team in the game. Same kind of people who plan their Sundays around watching the NFL, not just their specific team
Gambling.
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Gambling.
Including fantasy football. It has always been a form of gambling -- even way back when I played FF (and Sammy Baugh was my QB), we had an annual fee (which was a wager) and the champion got a prize (which was the payoff on the wager) -- but now it's big-time gambling and nobody tries to pretend it isn't anymore.
But to Wags' point, I know a lot of people who never place a bet but they are in front of their TV for 6-10 hours every Sunday watching football. As well as Thursdays and Mondays.
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Bo Jackson is the greatest football player of all time. I firmly believe this.
He was a hell of a baseball player. Greatest arm i have ever seen by far. And when he ran to first he looked like a tank that moved like Usain Bolt.
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He was a hell of a baseball player. Greatest arm i have ever seen by far. And when he ran to first he looked like a tank that moved like Usain Bolt.
He was/is a very nice guy too. I met him in a club in Chicago when he was with the Sox, early 90's, and he was very pleasant to this snot nosed 22 year old. We were both just hanging out and he started talking to me. Could not have been nicer.
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But to Wags' point, I know a lot of people who never place a bet but they are in front of their TV for 6-10 hours every Sunday watching football. As well as Thursdays and Mondays.
Yep. Most of the people I referenced don't gamble and at least 2 of them gave up FF. Its wild.
He was/is a very nice guy too. I met him in a club in Chicago when he was with the Sox, early 90's, and he was very pleasant to this snot nosed 22 year old. We were both just hanging out and he started talking to me. Could not have been nicer.
My friend's husband grew up down the street from him in the Western Chicago burbs. His father actually has been business partners with Bo on a few sports facility related things over the years. And he's the nicest most unassuming guy. You'd never know who he was (other than assuming he was an athlete due to his sheer size). Great dude
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Bo came to Madison last summer to open up a city owned 9 hole golf course, because he was friends with someone involved with the project. That's just when he is.
We tried to get him to come to our softball game that night, through another contact but it didn't work out. 😁
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I will absolutely have money on the Cardinals to finish with the worst record in 2023. That Gannon hiring is going to be a total disaster.
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I will absolutely have money on the Cardinals to finish with the worst record in 2023. That Gannon hiring is going to be a total disaster.
Hiring a DC 2 days after his defense got pantsed terribly in the Super Bowl is certainly a move
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Hiring a DC 2 days after his defense got pantsed terribly in the Super Bowl is certainly a move
There are some people that cover the league that swear he’s the next big thing in coaching
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Hiring a DC 2 days after his defense got pantsed terribly in the Super Bowl is certainly a move
I mean, Robert Salah seems OK.
In reality, not many DCs haven't been pantsed by Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes the past five years.
No idea whether Gannon will make a good HC or not, but teams that make big decisions bases on 30 minutes of football usually come to regret them.
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I mean, Robert Salah seems OK.
In reality, not many DCs haven't been pantsed by Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes the past five years.
No idea whether Gannon will make a good HC or not, but teams that make big decisions bases on 30 minutes of football usually come to regret them.
a
Saleh spent a decade coaching with the amazing Seattle defenses, then further with Gus Bradley, and then was a really good DC in SF for 3-4 years. Gannon is 4 seasons removed from being an assistant position coach, didn’t have a particularly great defense last year, and then the Super Bowl, which was criticized far more, IMO, than Saleh’s defense in SB54. Bad setback on a long developing bright career versus a huge blunder in an otherwise brief career.
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What are Gannon's organizational skills? How is he as a motivator? What kind of ego-manager is he? Is he a good communicator? Will he fill his staff with excellent coaches? Can he get all of the players, on both offense and defense, to buy into what he and the coordinators are selling?
I don't know squat about Gannon, but that's the kind of stuff that will determine whether or not he succeeds.
That, and obviously if there's enough talent.
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Panthers signing Caldwell to help Reich is a good move.
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Panthers signing Caldwell to help Reich is a good move.
Agree, he is bound to be an asset. Given Caldwell's record in Detroit, it's pretty stunning that he couldn't get a head-coaching gig.
Actually, not stunning at all given the color of his skin, so never mind.
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Agree, he is bound to be an asset. Given Caldwell's record in Detroit, it's pretty stunning that he couldn't get a head-coaching gig.
Actually, not stunning at all given the color of his skin, so never mind.
🙄🙄🙄
His record the last three years in Detroit was completely mediocre. He was in his early 60s at the time as well.
The only white coach I can think of who got another head gig after being fired twice is Pete Carroll. But he had his USC success in between.
Don’t get me wrong. I think the NFL has an obvious racial problem. But Jim Caldwell isn’t a great example of that.
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🙄🙄🙄
His record the last three years in Detroit was completely mediocre. He was in his early 60s at the time as well.
The only white coach I can think of who got another head gig after being fired twice is Pete Carroll. But he had his USC success in between.
Don’t get me wrong. I think the NFL has an obvious racial problem. But Jim Caldwell isn’t a great example of that.
Only the Texans made a woke mob hire this cycle
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a
Saleh spent a decade coaching with the amazing Seattle defenses, then further with Gus Bradley, and then was a really good DC in SF for 3-4 years. Gannon is 4 seasons removed from being an assistant position coach, didn’t have a particularly great defense last year, and then the Super Bowl, which was criticized far more, IMO, than Saleh’s defense in SB54. Bad setback on a long developing bright career versus a huge blunder in an otherwise brief career.
Didn't have a particularly great defense last year? The Eagles ranked 8th in points allowed and 2nd in yards allowed, and registered the 3rd most sacks in NFL history. That's pretty good.
Again, I have no idea how Gannon fares as a head coach, but I do think you're downplaying his credentials a bit. He spent four seasons under Mike Zimmer in Minnesota, and give me Zimmer as a defensive coach over Gus Bradley 10 times out of 10. Then he spent two years under Matt Eberflus in Indy. While the jury is very much out on Eberflus as a HC, he was a very solid coordinator. And then he took two years to build one of the league's top Ds in Philly.
Yes, the Eagles D got torched in the second half Sunday. So did Saleh's in Super Bowl LIV. Niners went into the 4th quarter with a 10-point lead and gave up 21 points in a little more than 6 minutes to squander the game.
I don't say this to knock Saleh, just to point out that Reid and Mahomes have gotten the better of a lot of quality DCs in big moments.
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Caldwell got fired in Detroit because Quinn wanted Patricia. He was another call that only happens to the Lions (Golden Tate game winning touchdown against Atlanta followed by 10 second runoff ending the game) away from making the playoffs his final year.
Amazing how the wheels of fate turn.
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Didn't have a particularly great defense last year? The Eagles ranked 8th in points allowed and 2nd in yards allowed, and registered the 3rd most sacks in NFL history. That's pretty good.
FWIW I was referring to the 21-22 season, not the season that just completed.
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A little birdie tells me the Bears are closing on Arlington Park today.
#donedeal
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A little birdie tells me the Bears are closing on Arlington Park today.
#donedeal
What does the little bird say about the Bears trading Fields? Hearing more buzz about it lately. (maybe NFL guys looking for offseason content?)
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What does the little bird say about the Bears trading Fields? Hearing more buzz about it lately. (maybe NFL guys looking for offseason content?)
Little bird doesn't work in the Bears personnel department.
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Why would you trade your 23 year old dude?
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Why would you trade your 23 year old dude?
1. You don't believe he can develop well enough as a passer to be a Super Bowl-winning QB
2. His trade value may never be higher
3. You believe a QB available in this draft can be a Super Bowl-winning QB and you're in perfect position to land him
I don't know if 1 or 3 are true, but if they are, then it makes sense to trade him.
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Why would you trade your 23 year old dude?
You might, if you truly believe one of the QBs in this class are the next Burrow or Mahomes.
You might, if a QB needy team offers a better package than you get for the 1st overall pick.
I don’t think he’s available but they’d be foolish not to listen at this juncture
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You might, if you truly believe one of the QBs in this class are the next Burrow or Mahomes.
You might, if a QB needy team offers a better package than you get for the 1st overall pick.
I don’t think he’s available but they’d be foolish not to listen at this juncture
This.
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I think wades is being sarcastic considering the praise he was receiving here early this past season.
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This.
They’re in a great position with regards to this years draft. It’s probably front office malfeasance to hold onto the pick and Fields. Either way, the Poles era will be defined by what happens in this draft
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Little bird doesn't work in the Bears personnel department.
Kaplan broke this story this past weekend. Is he your birdie?
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Kaplan broke this story this past weekend. Is he your birdie?
His breaking story this weekend was that Arlington Park employees were told they had to be out of their offices Tuesday and that the Bears would close "sooner than the end of March."
So, to answer your question, no.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9W4QasiY_Lw&feature=youtu.be
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His breaking story this weekend was that Arlington Park employees were told they had to be out of their offices Tuesday and that the Bears would close "sooner than the end of March."
So, to answer your question, no.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9W4QasiY_Lw&feature=youtu.be
With the implication that when you have to vacate the property it means it is closing, which it just did today.
Who about a real scoop from your source? How is this being funded?
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With the implication that when you have to vacate the property it means it is closing, which it just did today.
Who about a real scoop from your source? How is this being funded?
My source doesn't take Scoop requests.
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My source doesn't take Scoop requests.
Yet you are Mr. Scoop? Confused
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Yet you are Mr. Scoop? Confused
Pakuni knows everything.
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Yet you are Mr. Scoop? Confused
Yes, you are.
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Bob McGinn, who has covered the Packers for decades, said in a podcast with Tyler Dunne of GoLongTD.com that the team is ready to move on from Rodgers.
“They are done with Rodgers,” McGinn said, citing his own instincts, his knowledge of the league, and “discussions with someone who [has] first-hand knowledge” of the Packers. “He’s not coming back. I mean, they’re disgusted with him, and they’re done with him. And they’re moving on.”
He also said that Love will be the starter even if Aaron comes back.
I know McGinn is not linked in like he used to be. Is he just trying to be relevant again or is he on to something.
I was one of the few here who said Rodgers would remain last time they had this issue. This time even before reading McGinn’s comments, I thought at best it was 50/50.
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I think the subpar year from Rodgers and the team overall has given them the cover to move on. I think most fans are ready.
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Bob McGinn, who has covered the Packers for decades, said in a podcast with Tyler Dunne of GoLongTD.com that the team is ready to move on from Rodgers.
“They are done with Rodgers,” McGinn said, citing his own instincts, his knowledge of the league, and “discussions with someone who [has] first-hand knowledge” of the Packers. “He’s not coming back. I mean, they’re disgusted with him, and they’re done with him. And they’re moving on.”
He also said that Love will be the starter even if Aaron comes back.
I know McGinn is not linked in like he used to be. Is he just trying to be relevant again or is he on to something.
I was one of the few here who said Rodgers would remain last time they had this issue. This time even before reading McGinn’s comments, I thought at best it was 50/50.
Bob McGinn is washed but c'mon. Mike Hunt could have put 2 and 2 together. It is time at every level. Everyone is ready.
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McGinn is 100% correct. The team is more than ready to move on and Rodgers knows this. He knows he’s done in GB.
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Bob McGinn, who has covered the Packers for decades, said in a podcast with Tyler Dunne of GoLongTD.com that the team is ready to move on from Rodgers.
“They are done with Rodgers,” McGinn said, citing his own instincts, his knowledge of the league, and “discussions with someone who [has] first-hand knowledge” of the Packers. “He’s not coming back. I mean, they’re disgusted with him, and they’re done with him. And they’re moving on.”
He also said that Love will be the starter even if Aaron comes back.
I know McGinn is not linked in like he used to be. Is he just trying to be relevant again or is he on to something.
I was one of the few here who said Rodgers would remain last time they had this issue. This time even before reading McGinn’s comments, I thought at best it was 50/50.
In a past existence, I had some contact with a JS guy and he swore no one was more professional and well-connected than McGinn. Still, saying GB would make 12 a backup if he were to return is bananas insane. Do I believe they’d like him to ask for a trade? Yes, 100% but he isn’t coming back to be a backup nor would they make him a backup.
Side note, Michael Hunt’s professionalism was not as respected 😂
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In a past existence, I had some contact with a JS guy and he swore no one was more professional and well-connected than McGinn. Still, saying GB would make 12 a backup if he were to return is bananas insane. Do I believe they’d like him to ask for a trade? Yes, 100% but he isn’t coming back to be a backup nor would they make him a backup.
Side note, Michael Hunt’s professionalism was not as respected 😂
Agreed. If he thinks Rodgers will be a backup I have to wonder if he thinks a football field is 80 Yds long.
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Side note, Michael Hunt’s professionalism was not as respected 😂
I sat 2 rows in front of Hunt on a flight back to MKE a few years ago. Weekday flight, so he was traveling for work, and he was one of the most slovenly people I’ve ever seen on a flight. Stained t shirt, shorts (on a high 40s fall day) despite not coming or arriving at a warm weather area, and beyond disheveled. He also sat in the aisle and refused to move an inch for anyone getting in or out of the inner seats. So not surprising at all.
In other news, good for Eric Bieniemy. Gonna have the chance to truly be the man out in front of an offense. He’s got some great WRs and an intriguing weapon at TE. Hopefully it can put some of the annual kerfuffle around his not getting a HC to rest, either way. We all know the NFL has a HC diversity issue, but much like 70 year old Jim Caldwell, there are much better examples to build that argument around than Bieniemy.