https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2022/jan/23/john-stocktons-refusal-to-comply-with-mask-mandate/
John Stockton refuses to wear a mask at Gonzaga games. Has tickets suspended. Claims that vaccines have killed "over 100" professional athletes.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 23, 2022, 10:40:55 AM
https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2022/jan/23/john-stocktons-refusal-to-comply-with-mask-mandate/
John Stockton refuses to wear a mask at Gonzaga games. Has tickets suspended. Claims that vaccines have killed "over 100" professional athletes.
Makes one wonder how some of these guys made it through college.
And this is HUGE news. Why didn't the reporter ask him to name some of the athletes who have died?
Exactly. List the hundred.
Sad. I always liked Stockton. I didn't know he was an ignorant dope and a liar.
Quote from: MU82 on January 23, 2022, 04:08:45 PM
Sad. I always liked Stockton. I didn't know he was an ignorant dope and a liar.
Even worse, he's an anti-vaxxer.
There's a lot of misinformation posted on this board regularly. Sad.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 23, 2022, 05:39:15 PM
There's a lot of misinformation posted on this board regularly. Sad.
Exactly - I remember one poster who insisted that our current inflation was transitory
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 23, 2022, 09:57:16 PM
Exactly - I remember one poster who insisted that our current inflation was transitory
You must have read enough of pace's posts to learn how to post disingenuously
Quote from: Jockey on January 23, 2022, 04:39:44 PM
Even worse, he's an anti-vaxxer.
There we go again, uninformed labeling. Being hesitant about one particular vaccine does not make one 'anti-vax'.
Quote from: statnik on January 24, 2022, 10:02:38 AM
Being hesitant about one particular vaccine does not make one 'anti-vax'.
But not being vaccinated at this point without a medical exemption does.
Quote from: rocky_warrior on January 24, 2022, 10:13:30 AM
But not being vaccinated at this point without a medical exemption does.
It doesn't, seems nuance is not one of your strengths. If you have had a case already and are young, not taking it certainly doesn't mean you're anti-vax.
Quote from: statnik on January 24, 2022, 10:32:39 AM
It doesn't, seems nuance is not one of your strengths. If you have had a case already and are young, not taking it certainly doesn't mean you're anti-vax.
Yeah Rocky, you're just not smart enough to grasp the nuance of not getting the vaccine.
Quote from: statnik on January 24, 2022, 10:32:39 AM
It doesn't, seems nuance is not one of your strengths.
And science and data aren't one of your strengths. Enjoy your "immunization"!
Please provide the proof for Stockton's assertion.
Btw I don't agree with Stockton that all of those soccer players died of the Vax, I agree that it is spreading misinformation, but I support him making his own decision to not take the vax since I do think there is a degree of vaccine side effect cover-ups going on.
Quote from: statnik on January 24, 2022, 11:55:46 AM
Btw I don't agree with Stockton that all of those soccer players died of the Vax, I agree that it is spreading misinformation, but I support him making his own decision to not take the vax since I do think there is a degree of vaccine side effect cover-ups going on.
Explain.
Quote from: statnik on January 24, 2022, 10:32:39 AM
It doesn't, seems nuance is not one of your strengths. If you have had a case already and are young, not taking it certainly doesn't mean you're anti-vax.
You're right.
It means that you don't care about the people around you.
How does getting vaxed protect those around you when its been shown that those vaccinated can still harbor the virus and spread it, hey?
Healthcare professional
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 24, 2022, 06:04:42 PM
How does getting vaxed protect those around you when its been shown that those vaccinated can still harbor the virus and spread it, hey?
If the unvaxxed would agree to not use hospital resources or scarce medications when their covid turns south, I wouldn't care less about who is vaccinated anymore.
Still waitin' on an answer two da question, hey?
#saynotomandates
Thankfully Fox Noise wasn't around back in the day to convince the feeble-minded that they should resist polio and smallpox vaccines.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 24, 2022, 08:00:03 PM
Still waitin' on an answer two da question, hey?
#saynotomandates
Because vaccinated people are proven to have less of a burden on the healthcare System. The vaccinated are foregoing healthcare to accommodate the unvaccinated so they can flood our hospitals.
Antivax infringes on my freedom (hashtag)
Quote from: TSmith34 on January 24, 2022, 08:19:16 PM
Thankfully Fox Noise wasn't around back in the day to convince the feeble-minded that they should resist polio and smallpox vaccines.
I'm fully vaxxed and boosted but comparing vaccines that prevented polio and smallpox with vaccines that don't prevent Covid is disingenuous.
Quote from: Jockey on January 23, 2022, 12:07:03 PM
And this is HUGE news. Why didn't the reporter ask him to name some of the athletes who have died?
Hadn't heard of this conspiracy theory, so had to look it up.
https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-coronavirus-sport/fact-check-list-of-108-fifa-soccer-players-is-not-proof-of-a-common-link-between-covid-19-vaccines-and-athlete-deaths-idUSL1N2T81NY
(https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-coronavirus-sport/fact-check-list-of-108-fifa-soccer-players-is-not-proof-of-a-common-link-between-covid-19-vaccines-and-athlete-deaths-idUSL1N2T81NY)
This might take the cake for how stupid you have to be to believe it.
Quote from: TSmith34 on January 24, 2022, 08:19:16 PM
Thankfully Fox Noise wasn't around back in the day to convince the feeble-minded that they should resist polio and smallpox vaccines.
And this from a healthcare professional?? You know small pox and polio vaccines actually prevented people from getting small pox and polio, right?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 24, 2022, 06:04:42 PM
How does getting vaxed protect those around you when its been shown that those vaccinated can still harbor the virus and spread it, hey?
Unvaxxed people show up at the hospital, delay surgeries of others. Hospital space is not infinite. They can't take on their normal caseload and then a huge pandemic on top of it. Getting vaxxed is lessening the chance that you don't take the hospital bed of your neighbor. Second, new variants will continue to emerge in unvaccinated people. The more people that are vaccinated, the less the chance that a new variant emerges.
Two things I've always wondered.
1. Do the experts on ancient aliens actually believe what they talk about?
2. Do the COVID hoax believers/anti-vaxxers on here and in the US actually believe what they post about, or talk about?
Frankly, the arguments on ancient aliens make more sense than some of the stuff certain posters post on here.
Quote from: MUDPT on January 24, 2022, 09:16:42 PM
Unvaxxed people show up at the hospital, delay surgeries of others. Hospital space is not infinite. They can't take on their normal caseload and then a huge pandemic on top of it. Getting vaxxed is lessening the chance that you don't take the hospital bed of your neighbor. Second, new variants will continue to emerge in unvaccinated people. The more people that are vaccinated, the less the chance that a new variant emerges.
If FD Joe would focus on anti-viral therapeutics and get them in the hands of symptomatic covid patients within 5 days of infection, the hospitals would not be overrun.
Of course, as of now these drugs are off patent and there is no big pharma money to be made. He campaigned on promising to "control the virus" and now says there is nothing the feds can do, hey?
#buffoon
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 25, 2022, 05:31:06 AM
If FD Joe would focus on anti-viral therapeutics and get them in the hands of symptomatic covid patients within 5 days of infection, the hospitals would not be overrun.
Of course, as of now these drugs are off patent and there is no big pharma money to be made. He campaigned on promising to "control the virus" and now says there is nothing the feds can do, hey?
#buffoon
Here's the thing with those though, most people don't seek care for their COVID symptoms until day 10 after infection. So you are asking health illiterate people, who are already skeptical, to get infected, show symptoms (between 2 and 5 days), and then seek care, maybe a week window? Sounds like a lot of time, but is actually really small in our health system.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 24, 2022, 08:49:42 PM
I'm fully vaxxed and boosted but comparing vaccines that prevented polio and smallpox with vaccines that don't prevent Covid is disingenuous.
Uhh. Why?
You're showing basic misunderstanding. The polio and smallpox vaccines prevented the diseases. Its been repeatedly shown that the covid vaccination merely lessens symptoms. This should be Vaccination 101 for any school administrator, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 25, 2022, 07:05:28 AM
You're showing basic misunderstanding. The polio and smallpox vaccines prevented the diseases. Its been repeatedly shown that the covid vaccination merely lessens symptoms. This should be Vaccination 101 for any school administrator, hey?
Yes, and the Covid vaccines prevent one from dying from the disease. See how that works?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 25, 2022, 07:05:28 AM
You're showing basic misunderstanding. The polio and smallpox vaccines prevented the diseases. Its been repeatedly shown that the covid vaccination merely lessens symptoms. This should be Vaccination 101 for any school administrator, hey?
Dramatically reduces hospitalizations and deaths. Pretty basic knowledge for a "medical professional" don't you think?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 25, 2022, 07:05:28 AM
You're showing basic misunderstanding. The polio and smallpox vaccines prevented the diseases. Its been repeatedly shown that the covid vaccination merely lessens symptoms. This should be Vaccination 101 for any school administrator, hey?
Polio vaccine took 23 years, smallpox took 150. COVID took approximately a year. To say it doesn't do enough is super disingenuous. It's like complaining MU only beat Nova by 3 points last week.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/keythingstoknow.html
QuoteCOVID-19 vaccines can reduce the risk of people spreading the virus that causes COVID-19
.
Hmm ...
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 25, 2022, 05:31:06 AM
If FD Joe would focus on anti-viral therapeutics and get them in the hands of symptomatic covid patients within 5 days of infection, the hospitals would not be overrun.
Of course, as of now these drugs are off patent and there is no big pharma money to be made. He campaigned on promising to "control the virus" and now says there is nothing the feds can do, hey?
#buffoon
and that my friends is the comment of the year right there-treat the f'ing disease!! that is what doctors are supposed to do. too many advocacies getting in the way of medicine. vaccines should be adjunctive
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 25, 2022, 09:06:18 AM
and that my friends is the comment of the year right there-treat the f'ing disease!! that is what doctors are supposed to do. too many advocacies getting in the way of medicine. vaccines should be adjunctive
Are we going to discuss the elephant in the room?
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 25, 2022, 09:06:18 AM
and that my friends is the comment of the year right there-treat the f'ing disease!! that is what doctors are supposed to do. too many advocacies getting in the way of medicine. vaccines should be adjunctive
I'm glad to see that shut up and dribble has migrated to fucking MDs.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 25, 2022, 09:06:18 AM
and that my friends is the comment of the year right there-treat the f'ing disease!! that is what doctors are supposed to do. too many advocacies getting in the way of medicine. vaccines should be adjunctive
WTF seriously? You are saying that taking a vaccine that prevents or lessens the severity of the disease should be supplemental to treatments for people who actually get the disease? Do you not realize that if people would just get vaccinated, their need for treatments becomes very close to zero?
You have said a lot of dumb things in this topic over the last two years. This may be the dumbest. Congrats.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 25, 2022, 09:06:18 AM
and that my friends is the comment of the year right there-treat the f'ing disease!! that is what doctors are supposed to do. too many advocacies getting in the way of medicine. vaccines should be adjunctive
This is why I don't brush. Dentists need to shut up and do their job
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 25, 2022, 09:49:42 AM
WTF seriously? You are saying that taking a vaccine that prevents or lessens the severity of the disease should be supplemental to treatments for people who actually get the disease? Do you not realize that if people would just get vaccinated, their need for treatments becomes very close to zero?
You have said a lot of dumb things in this topic over the last two years. This may be the dumbest. Congrats.
C'mon, man ... that is nowhere near roQQet's dumbest. Give him a little credit, please.
But it is interesting that the dentists are pushing "Horse de-wormer for everybody!" instead of the proven, life-saving vaccines that their god "invented."
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 24, 2022, 09:04:42 PM
And this from a healthcare professional?? You know small pox and polio vaccines actually prevented people from getting small pox and polio, right?
Like you, I am not a healthcare professional. And making a distinction between life-saving vaccines is only something you poor, brainwashed dopes could do to try to justify the anti-science idiocy you've been fed.
BTW, "healthcare professional" doesn't know smallpox is one word?
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 25, 2022, 09:06:18 AM
and that my friends is the comment of the year right there-treat the f'ing disease!! that is what doctors are supposed to do. too many advocacies getting in the way of medicine. vaccines should be adjunctive
Could you possibly get any stupider?
I know, "just wait 'til my next post!"
Quote from: MUBurrow on January 24, 2022, 06:33:51 PM
If the unvaxxed would agree to not use hospital resources or scarce medications when their covid turns south, I wouldn't care less about who is vaccinated anymore.
Don't you mean you would care less?
Quote from: Jay Bee on January 25, 2022, 10:46:59 AM
Don't you mean you would care less?
IRREGARDLESS!!
... yes. I meant it as a "I couldn't care less" but tripped over myself. :-X
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 25, 2022, 09:06:18 AM
and that my friends is the comment of the year right there-treat the f'ing disease!! that is what doctors are supposed to do. too many advocacies getting in the way of medicine. vaccines should be adjunctive
Lol.
Brushing teeth should be adjunctive
Safe sex should be adjunctive
Seatbelts should be adjunctive
Healthy weight, good nutrition, proper diet... All adjunctive
Lately I've just been dissolving horse dewormer in vodka and swishing/gargling with that. My teeth have never been cleaner!
Bonus, if you swallow you free from covid for life!
Quote from: MUBurrow on January 25, 2022, 11:27:02 AM
IRREGARDLESS!!
... yes. I meant it as a "I couldn't care less" but tripped over myself. :-X
You literally did that?
From the WaPo's Dana Milbank:
The weekend began with the March for Life. It ended with a march for death.
Anti-vaccine activists decided to piggyback on Friday's annual antiabortion march in the capital by having a "Defeat the Mandates" rally on Sunday. Combined, the two groups of (mostly) conservative activists engaged in a demonstration of mass inconsistency.
Friday's crowd invoked the mantra of the pro-life movement: "A child, not a choice." Sunday's proclaimed the mantra of the abortion rights movement to oppose vaccines: "My body, my choice."
Friday's crowd endorsed the most obtrusive of big-government mandates, laws telling women they can't make their own reproductive decisions. Sunday's argued that health decisions must be made by patient and doctor, not government.
Friday's crowd pleaded for the lives of the most vulnerable. Sunday's demanded the right to infect the most vulnerable by eschewing vaccines and masks in shared spaces.
It was enough to make one wonder: Does taking ivermectin cause people to lose their sense of irony?
I went on parental leave. Three months later, Fox is still killing its viewers.
https://www.mediamatters.org/fox-news/i-went-parental-leave-three-months-later-fox-still-killing-its-viewers
"COVID-19 killed roughly 130,000 Americans during my parental leave, which began in mid-October. With the omicron wave cresting as I returned on Monday, the seven-day rolling average exceeded 2,000 deaths a day. Those deaths are largely preventable: Death rates are staggeringly higher among those who have not taken the safe, free, remarkably effective vaccines against the virus that have been widely available to most people for months.
Vaccination could have been a unifying effort for the nation in which we came together to protect ourselves and each other from a pandemic that had already taken too many lives. But when I left, Fox News' prime-time hosts were waging a nighty assault against the campaign to get Americans vaccinated. I've been doing this for too long to expect the network's coverage to become more responsible in the interim. And it hasn't. But the moral depravity of Fox's effort to sabotage the vaccination campaign still takes my breath away. As the U.S. death toll approaches 900,000, the network's most popular figures continue to use their influence to talk their viewers out of taking the shots that could save their lives.
The drumbeat continues, as Fox's most powerful and influential figures sabotage the vaccination campaign and successfully dissuade their viewers from taking the shots that could save their lives.
Tucker Carlson, who is both the face of Fox and its most powerful force in shaping right-wing discourse and Republican politics, opened Monday's show by promoting Sunday's rally against vaccine mandates in Washington, D.C., which featured virulent speeches from notorious anti-vaxxers.
He then played a clip from Dr. Robert Malone, a vaccine scientist who frequently makes dubious claims about the COVID-19 vaccines on Fox and elsewhere, in which Malone said the vaccines are "leaky" with regard to the omicron variant, as they do not prevent infection or spread."
~~~
We can see in real time how effective this disinformation campaign is, as the resident dentists have moved from taking the vaccine to be anti-vaxxers and proponents of discredited farm remedies, all because of what they heard on Faux News.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 25, 2022, 07:05:28 AM
You're showing basic misunderstanding. The polio and smallpox vaccines prevented the diseases. Its been repeatedly shown that the covid vaccination merely lessens symptoms. This should be Vaccination 101 for any school administrator, hey?
Actually, for the most part, what you have stated is wrong, at the very least inaccurate.
Neither the polio or the smallpox vaccines prevented the disease by the metrics you are applying to the COVID vaccine.
For Polio, there are different forms of polio. The vaccine is ~80-90% effective against paralytic polio, but only 60-70% effective against other forms. These can be increased in terms of efficacy if you go through a complete series of 4 boosters, but even then your immunity will wane with increasing time.
Now these rates are based on symptomatic breakthrough infections. They weren't testing people like we are, so no idea on the rate of low symptom (not detected) or asymptomatic infections.
Polio vaccines were effective largely because Polio is not very infectious so it is going to be much more susceptible to eradication than something as infectious as COVID.
For smallpox, there is greater efficacy, ~95% of people have an immune response (5% have no response at all to vaccination), but the immunity also wanes after 3-5 years. It also relies on an active live infection (related virus), that was known to result in death for some individuals. The smallpox vaccine was effective in eradication, not because of its efficacy, but rather three other facts.
1) It was actually not that infectious.
2) It was not infectious until open sores were present, which was well after cases were diagnosed, so you could easily isolate people.
3) There were no other hosts besides humans. There was no additional animal reservoir.
COVID has animal hosts, it is infectious before symptoms/diagnosis occur, and unlike other diseases, we are actually testing people regularly, so weak symptomatic, or asymptomatic infections are identified, whereas they would not have been identified for Polio or smallpox.
So your attack on the difference in the COVID vaccine is invalid, and frankly wrong. Maybe vaccination 101 should be required for medical professionals.
Quote from: forgetful on January 25, 2022, 01:53:34 PM
Actually, for the most part, what you have stated is wrong, at the very least inaccurate.
Neither the polio or the smallpox vaccines prevented the disease by the metrics you are applying to the COVID vaccine.
For Polio, there are different forms of polio. The vaccine is ~80-90% effective against paralytic polio, but only 60-70% effective against other forms. These can be increased in terms of efficacy if you go through a complete series of 4 boosters, but even then your immunity will wane with increasing time.
Now these rates are based on symptomatic breakthrough infections. They weren't testing people like we are, so no idea on the rate of low symptom (not detected) or asymptomatic infections.
Polio vaccines were effective largely because Polio is not very infectious so it is going to be much more susceptible to eradication than something as infectious as COVID.
For smallpox, there is greater efficacy, ~95% of people have an immune response (5% have no response at all to vaccination), but the immunity also wanes after 3-5 years. It also relies on an active live infection (related virus), that was known to result in death for some individuals. The smallpox vaccine was effective in eradication, not because of its efficacy, but rather three other facts.
1) It was actually not that infectious.
2) It was not infectious until open sores were present, which was well after cases were diagnosed, so you could easily isolate people.
3) There were no other hosts besides humans. There was no additional animal reservoir.
COVID has animal hosts, it is infectious before symptoms/diagnosis occur, and unlike other diseases, we are actually testing people regularly, so weak symptomatic, or asymptomatic infections are identified, whereas they would not have been identified for Polio or smallpox.
So your attack on the difference in the COVID vaccine is invalid, and frankly wrong. Maybe vaccination 101 should be required for medical professionals.
Thanks for your interesting perspective and analysis...instead of more partisan mocking and crap flinging. This was great 👍🏼
It isn't partisan for me. I have ended a 27 year friendship with the most liberal (campaigned for Bernie, thinks he sold out) person I know over Ivermectin. He has gone down some internet rabbit holes before but this was of a different magnitude. He went so far left he kind of looped around into far right. Drove his electric car to DC for the rally Sunday.
So, to me, not political.
Quote from: forgetful on January 25, 2022, 01:53:34 PM
So your attack on the difference in the COVID vaccine is invalid, and frankly wrong. Maybe vaccination 101 should be required for medical professionals.
And dentists
Stop he's already dead.gif
Quote from: forgetful on January 25, 2022, 01:53:34 PM
Actually, for the most part, what you have stated is wrong, at the very least inaccurate.
Neither the polio or the smallpox vaccines prevented the disease by the metrics you are applying to the COVID vaccine.
For Polio, there are different forms of polio. The vaccine is ~80-90% effective against paralytic polio, but only 60-70% effective against other forms. These can be increased in terms of efficacy if you go through a complete series of 4 boosters, but even then your immunity will wane with increasing time.
Now these rates are based on symptomatic breakthrough infections. They weren't testing people like we are, so no idea on the rate of low symptom (not detected) or asymptomatic infections.
Polio vaccines were effective largely because Polio is not very infectious so it is going to be much more susceptible to eradication than something as infectious as COVID.
For smallpox, there is greater efficacy, ~95% of people have an immune response (5% have no response at all to vaccination), but the immunity also wanes after 3-5 years. It also relies on an active live infection (related virus), that was known to result in death for some individuals. The smallpox vaccine was effective in eradication, not because of its efficacy, but rather three other facts.
1) It was actually not that infectious.
2) It was not infectious until open sores were present, which was well after cases were diagnosed, so you could easily isolate people.
3) There were no other hosts besides humans. There was no additional animal reservoir.
COVID has animal hosts, it is infectious before symptoms/diagnosis occur, and unlike other diseases, we are actually testing people regularly, so weak symptomatic, or asymptomatic infections are identified, whereas they would not have been identified for Polio or smallpox.
So your attack on the difference in the COVID vaccine is invalid, and frankly wrong. Maybe vaccination 101 should be required for medical professionals.
(https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/553/026/1ea.gif)
Quote from: forgetful on January 25, 2022, 01:53:34 PM
Actually, for the most part, what you have stated is wrong, at the very least inaccurate.
Neither the polio or the smallpox vaccines prevented the disease by the metrics you are applying to the COVID vaccine.
For Polio, there are different forms of polio. The vaccine is ~80-90% effective against paralytic polio, but only 60-70% effective against other forms. These can be increased in terms of efficacy if you go through a complete series of 4 boosters, but even then your immunity will wane with increasing time.
Now these rates are based on symptomatic breakthrough infections. They weren't testing people like we are, so no idea on the rate of low symptom (not detected) or asymptomatic infections.
Polio vaccines were effective largely because Polio is not very infectious so it is going to be much more susceptible to eradication than something as infectious as COVID.
For smallpox, there is greater efficacy, ~95% of people have an immune response (5% have no response at all to vaccination), but the immunity also wanes after 3-5 years. It also relies on an active live infection (related virus), that was known to result in death for some individuals. The smallpox vaccine was effective in eradication, not because of its efficacy, but rather three other facts.
1) It was actually not that infectious.
2) It was not infectious until open sores were present, which was well after cases were diagnosed, so you could easily isolate people.
3) There were no other hosts besides humans. There was no additional animal reservoir.
COVID has animal hosts, it is infectious before symptoms/diagnosis occur, and unlike other diseases, we are actually testing people regularly, so weak symptomatic, or asymptomatic infections are identified, whereas they would not have been identified for Polio or smallpox.
So your attack on the difference in the COVID vaccine is invalid, and frankly wrong. Maybe vaccination 101 should be required for medical professionals.
Outstanding insight. Very appreciated.
Quote from: forgetful on January 25, 2022, 01:53:34 PM
For smallpox, there is greater efficacy, ~95% of people have an immune response (5% have no response at all to vaccination), but the immunity also wanes after 3-5 years. It also relies on an active live infection (related virus), that was known to result in death for some individuals.
The smallpox vaccine sounds pretty unpleasant. I have seen scars from it but never gave that much thought. Quite frankly, I'd rather 100 COVID shots than one of these. Lesions on genitalia? No thank you.
https://www.health.ny.gov/publications/7022/
If the vaccination is successful, a red and itchy bump develops at the vaccine site in three or four days. In the first week, the bump becomes a large blister, fills with pus, and begins to drain.
During the second week, the blister begins to dry up and a scab forms. The scab falls off in the third week, leaving a small scar.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1069029/
Inadvertent inoculation is the most common adverse event associated with smallpox vaccination. It occurred at a rate of 529 per million vaccinations in a 1968 study.20 Inadvertent or accidental inoculation usually occurs when a person transfers the vaccinia virus from the vaccination site to another location on their body, usually the eyes, mouth, nose, or genitalia.20,22 Most lesions resolve without therapy, but vaccinia immune globulin (VIG) may be useful for difficult lesions.
https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/coronavirus-covid-19-update-fda-limits-use-certain-monoclonal-antibodies-treat-covid-19-due-omicron
In light of the most recent information and data available, today, the FDA revised the authorizations for two monoclonal antibody treatments – bamlanivimab and etesevimab (administered together) and REGEN-COV (casirivimab and imdevimab) – to limit their use to only when the patient is likely to have been infected with or exposed to a variant that is susceptible to these treatments.
Based on Centers for Disease Control and Prevention data, the omicron variant of SARS-CoV-2 is estimated to account for more than 99% of cases in the United States as of Jan. 15. Therefore, it's highly unlikely that COVID-19 patients seeking care in the U.S. at this time are infected with a variant other than omicron, and these treatments are not authorized to be used at this time. This avoids exposing patients to side effects, such as injection site reactions or allergic reactions, which can be potentially serious, from specific treatment agents that are not expected to provide benefit to patients who have been infected with or exposed to the omicron variant.
TLDR: Monoclonal Antibodies don't work well enough on Omicron at the moment.
Neil Young is a wuss
Quote from: Jay Bee on January 26, 2022, 03:12:59 PM
Neil Young is a wuss
Says the guy who said this.
Quote from: Jay Bee on January 26, 2022, 01:38:10 PM
If they put a chicken on the court, I will not attend games.
Quote from: Jay Bee on January 26, 2022, 06:02:33 PM
Bruh. Look at your username.
Fluffer the Blowjob Man?
Edit: so, so glad the scoop filter doesnt auto change "blowjob".
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on January 26, 2022, 10:45:21 PM
Fluffer the Blowjob Man?
Edit: so, so glad the scoop filter doesnt auto change "blowjob".
Sir this is a Christian Minecraft server
Decidedly strange turn in this topic.
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on January 26, 2022, 10:45:21 PM
Fluffer the Blowjob Man?
Edit: so, so glad the scoop filter doesnt auto change "blowjob".
Classy as always, rocket.
Quote from: Jockey on January 27, 2022, 11:10:41 AM
Classy as always, rocket.
You quoted Ziggy, not Rocket.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 27, 2022, 08:06:49 PM
You quoted Ziggy, not Rocket.
I know that. But they are interchangeable.
Line up y'all, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 28, 2022, 04:22:55 AM
Line up y'all, hey?
I don't think you want me to start posting all the L's of the unvaccinated at the hospital begging for help as they die.
Walk it back, old man.
"Healthcare professional" spreads anti-vax memes. JFC. And the funny thing is, you lined up for the vax early, but now, after Fox ramped up their anti-vax propaganda, your weak mind has soaked it up like a sponge.
If you'd like us to start posting actual, real pictures of the unvaccinated suffering horribly as they die rather than stupid rightwing memes just say so.
Just follow the science, dude. The truth will set you free, aina?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 28, 2022, 04:22:55 AM
Line up y'all, hey?
Why are you doxxing Jockey and TSmith?
BTW, you boys should get your junk examined, that don't look too good.
O/U on locking of this thread is set at 10:45AM CST
Feel free to move this post to the gambling thread
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 28, 2022, 08:25:06 AM
Just follow the science, dude. The truth will set you free, aina?
Like the science about smallpox and polio vaccines?
Don't you have anything better to do like VP in' and such, hey?
Maybe you could find yourself a Khan Academy course on Vaccines 101.
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on January 28, 2022, 06:19:15 AM
I don't think you want me to start posting all the L's of the unvaccinated at the hospital begging for help as they die.
Walk it back, old man.
https://www.sorryantivaxxer.com/
Robert Lamay, 50, Naches, WA, Ex-State Trooper, Anti-vaxxer, dead from COVID
UPDATE(1/28/22): Robert who quit his job rather than get vaccinated is dead from COVID.
Quote from: pbiflyer on January 28, 2022, 05:22:29 PM
https://www.sorryantivaxxer.com/
Robert Lamay, 50, Naches, WA, Ex-State Trooper, Anti-vaxxer, dead from COVID
UPDATE(1/28/22): Robert who quit his job rather than get vaccinated is dead from COVID.
We look at him as just another dead idiot.
They look at him as owning the Libs.
willfully chose death.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_RoGZHx0Ik&t=1s
He took a stand for his rights!
And now he is at eternal rest.
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/robert-lamay-gov-jay-inslee-vaccine-mandates-covid-19-washington_n_61f4d1d4e4b04f9a12bd8084
Unfortunately, on their way to eternal rest, many of the ignorant and/or selfish anti-vaxxers take up ICU hospital beds and ventilators that could have gone to those whose adverse health situations aren't due to them having made political decisions.
An anti-vaxxer who ends up in the ICU is akin to a drunk making the "personal choice" to get behind the wheel and step on the gas; he or she often isn't the only one who suffers the consequences of his or her ignorant and/or selfish choice.
From the AP: Pope Francis says freedom from fake vaccine information is "a human right."
Pope Francis denounced on Friday the "distortion of reality based on fear" that has ripped across the world during the coronavirus pandemic, but also called for compassion, urging journalists to help those misled by coronavirus-related misinformation and fake news to better understand the scientific facts.
"We can hardly fail to see that these days, in addition to the pandemic, an 'infodemic' is spreading: A distortion of reality based on fear, which in our global society leads to an explosion of commentary on falsified if not invented news," the leader of the world's Catholics said.
Meeting with members of the International Catholic Media Consortium – a fact-checking network that aims to combat misinformation about COVID-19 – the Pope said being fully informed by scientific data was a human right.
"To be properly informed, to be helped to understand situations based on scientific data and not fake news, is a human right. Correct information must be ensured above all to those who are less equipped, to the weakest and to those who are most vulnerable."
Francis, 85, received the Pfizer-BioNTech coronavirus shot last year and has been vocal about the importance of vaccines.
Still waitin' on unbiased, truthful leadership from the press, Fr. Fauci, and FD Joe, hey?
#fearandcontrol
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 30, 2022, 03:23:05 PM
Still waitin' on unbiased, truthful leadership from the press, Fr. Fauci, and FD Joe, hey?
Your pope prays for you to find a way to overcome your ignorance, nu?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 30, 2022, 03:23:05 PM
#fearandcontrol
MARQUETTE IS A BATTLE ZONE! THE SCHOOL IS DOOMED! RUN FOR YOUR LIVES!
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 30, 2022, 03:23:05 PM
Still waitin' on unbiased, truthful leadership from the press, Fr. Fauci, and FD Joe, hey?
#fearandcontrol
Still waiting for you to pass your Vaccines 101 course
"Unfortunately, on their way to eternal rest, many of the ignorant and/or selfish anti-vaxxers take up ICU hospital beds and ventilators that could have gone to those whose adverse health situations aren't due to them having made political decisions"
this is NOT why people who choose not to be vaccinated. remember it was YOUR people who initially said NO to the vaccine for POLITICAL purposes only.
" if Donald Trump tells us that we should take it. I'm not taking it." km
" I don't trust Donald Trump. And at this moment, the American people can't either," jb
today, the reasons to remain unvaccinated are multifaceted-religious grounds and the yet to be determined latent long term affects being the 2 most common. i do not recall anyone saying, i'm not taking the vaccine because jb is in office or because jb tells us to get the vaccine, then i'm not getting it...
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 30, 2022, 08:05:04 PM
"Unfortunately, on their way to eternal rest, many of the ignorant and/or selfish anti-vaxxers take up ICU hospital beds and ventilators that could have gone to those whose adverse health situations aren't due to them having made political decisions"
this is NOT why people who choose not to be vaccinated. remember it was YOUR people who initially said NO to the vaccine for POLITICAL purposes only.
" if Donald Trump tells us that we should take it. I'm not taking it." km
" I don't trust Donald Trump. And at this moment, the American people can't either," jb
today, the reasons to remain unvaccinated are multifaceted-religious grounds and the yet to be determined latent long term affects being the 2 most common. i do not recall anyone saying, i'm not taking the vaccine because jb is in office or because jb tells us to get the vaccine, then i'm not getting it...
Own the libs ... and die. Nice combo!
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 30, 2022, 08:05:04 PM
"Unfortunately, on their way to eternal rest, many of the ignorant and/or selfish anti-vaxxers take up ICU hospital beds and ventilators that could have gone to those whose adverse health situations aren't due to them having made political decisions"
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 30, 2022, 08:05:04 PM
this is NOT why people who choose not to be vaccinated.
FALSE
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 30, 2022, 08:05:04 PM
remember it was YOUR people who initially said NO to the vaccine for POLITICAL purposes only.
FALSE
" if Donald Trump tells us that we should take it. I'm not taking it." km
" I don't trust Donald Trump. And at this moment, the American people can't either," jb
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 30, 2022, 08:05:04 PM
today, the reasons to remain unvaccinated are multifaceted-religious grounds and the yet to be determined latent long term affects being the 2 most common. i do not recall anyone saying, i'm not taking the vaccine because jb is in office or because jb tells us to get the vaccine, then i'm not getting it...
CLUELESS
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on January 30, 2022, 08:05:04 PM
"Unfortunately, on their way to eternal rest, many of the ignorant and/or selfish anti-vaxxers take up ICU hospital beds and ventilators that could have gone to those whose adverse health situations aren't due to them having made political decisions"
this is NOT why people who choose not to be vaccinated. remember it was YOUR people who initially said NO to the vaccine for POLITICAL purposes only.
" if Donald Trump tells us that we should take it. I'm not taking it." km
" I don't trust Donald Trump. And at this moment, the American people can't either," jb
today, the reasons to remain unvaccinated are multifaceted-religious grounds and the yet to be determined latent long term affects being the 2 most common. i do not recall anyone saying, i'm not taking the vaccine because jb is in office or because jb tells us to get the vaccine, then i'm not getting it...
Right on. Why wouldn't it make sense that if a lot of people didn't trust Trump and his quick response to authorize vaccines, they wouldn't trust Biden, Fauci and company touting said vaccines. It was doomed to be political from the start.
Quote from: statnik on January 31, 2022, 10:04:04 AM
Right on. Why wouldn't it make sense that if a lot of people didn't trust Trump and his quick response to authorize vaccines, they wouldn't trust Biden, Fauci and company touting said vaccines. It was doomed to be political from the start.
I dunno, maybe because as they all stated at the time, they wanted the FDA and CDC to confirm that the vaccines were safe rather than take Trump's advice? This has been pointed out time and time again yet the rightwing recycles the lie endlessly.
Kinda looks like excellent judgement, too, given Trump suggested injecting disinfectants might be a good idea to research.
Data continues to be quite consistent. Unvaxxed ~12x more likely to die than double vaxxed, ~70x more likely to die than vaxxed and boosted.
Please proceed, anti-vaxxers.
(https://images2.imgbox.com/eb/aa/ODDVXBJe_o.png) (https://imgbox.com/ODDVXBJe)
Quote from: TSmith34 on January 31, 2022, 10:19:57 AM
I dunno, maybe because as they all stated at the time, they wanted the FDA and CDC to confirm that the vaccines were safe rather than take Trump's advice? This has been pointed out time and time again yet the rightwing recycles the lie endlessly.
Kinda looks like excellent judgement, too, given Trump suggested injecting disinfectants might be a good idea to research.
These people continue to show complete ignorance. They would take the word of someone without a single minute of scientific or medical training without question. They also refuse to take advice from thousands of scientist and medical professionals with tens of thousands of years of training and study.
They are the very definition of fools.
Quote from: Jockey on January 31, 2022, 11:53:58 AM
These people continue to show complete ignorance. They would take the word of someone without a single minute of scientific or medical training without question. They also refuse to take advice from thousands of scientist and medical professionals with tens of thousands of years of training and study.
They are the very definition of fools.
Like this?
Cop, interviewed by Laura Ingraham, who was fired for refusing vaccine dies
https://www.yahoo.com/now/laura-ingraham-interview-policeman-fired-174856139.html
Video is resurfacing of an interview between Fox News host Laura Ingraham and Robert LaMay, a former Washington state trooper who went viral for refusing the agency's vaccine mandate, after Mr LaMay died of Covid on Friday.
In the clip, the host appears sympathetic to Mr LaMay, who describes feeling called by God to speak out against vaccine mandates. "A sleeping giant, we hope that's what's happened here, we've awakened it slowly but surely," Ms Ingraham says to end the interview.
According to Chris Hayes, his death has not been mentioned on Fox News.
Quote from: pbiflyer on January 31, 2022, 08:37:00 PM
Like this?
Cop, interviewed by Laura Ingraham, who was fired for refusing vaccine dies
https://www.yahoo.com/now/laura-ingraham-interview-policeman-fired-174856139.html
Video is resurfacing of an interview between Fox News host Laura Ingraham and Robert LaMay, a former Washington state trooper who went viral for refusing the agency's vaccine mandate, after Mr LaMay died of Covid on Friday.
In the clip, the host appears sympathetic to Mr LaMay, who describes feeling called by God to speak out against vaccine mandates. "A sleeping giant, we hope that's what's happened here, we've awakened it slowly but surely," Ms Ingraham says to end the interview.
According to Chris Hayes, his death has not been mentioned on Fox News.
(https://giphy.com/gifs/SheetsGiggles-jerry-seinfeld-a-shame-USnfWeCOHTHB3WX0aY)
(https://y.yarn.co/c987955a-e23f-4e90-b9dc-5c30a06bc976_text.gif)
Quote from: statnik link=topic=62855.msg1414916#msg1414916 date=1643It was doomed to be political from the start.
/quote]
If Trump had just shut his mouth and rolled up his sleeve on live TV and showed everyone that getting the vaccine wasn't a big deal, I suspect none of these right wing idiots would have thought twice about it. He made it political.
An Italian priest refused to get vaccinated, claiming the vaccine was made with aborted embryos.
You'll never guess what happened next.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/anti-vax-priest-don-paolo-romeo-who-claimed-vaccines-contain-aborted-embryos-dies-of-covid?ref=home
That's OK, Pak. He's in a better place now.
We don't particularly care if you get sick or even if you die. What's most important is that we "own" all the "woke" people who are for stoopid stuff like vaccines and health care ...
Why an Arizona County Turned Down $1.9 Million in Covid Relief: Two Republican supervisors voted to reject the federal money, frustrating health care workers in rural Cochise County.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/11/us/covid-relief-funds.html?campaign_id=9&emc=edit_nn_20220212&instance_id=52992&nl=the-morning®i_id=108420427&segment_id=82522&te=1&user_id=d36dcf821462fdd16ec3636710a855fa
The $1.9 million in pandemic aid would have gone a long way in Cochise County, a rural borderland where a winter of infections swamped hospitals. There was money for tracking cases. Testing in remote ranching towns. Funds fortifying the Arizona county's strained health department.
But the county's Republican-controlled board of supervisors stunned many residents and health care workers by voting last month to reject the federal money, becoming one of the rare places in America to turn down Covid-19 assistance from Washington.
"We're done," said Peggy Judd, one of two Republican supervisors who voted against accepting the money. "We're treating it like the common cold."
The vote transformed what would usually be a rote line on a government agenda into an emotional flashpoint in this county of 125,000 people where life is shaped by the southwestern border, rhythms of ranching and, now, a pandemic that has killed 522 residents.
To conservatives, rejecting the money felt like a high-desert declaration of independence, even if their rural county does rely on a host of other federal spending and jobs provided by the Fort Huachuca Army base.
Doctors and hospital officials, generally reluctant to plunge into divisive debates in their largely conservative county, started speaking out after they saw news of the 2-1 vote in The Herald/Review, the local newspaper. Some criticized the supervisors for reinforcing local vaccine resistance with a welter of anti-vaccine misinformation.
"It's insanity," said Dr. Cristian Laguillo, who has been treating a crush of Covid-19 patients at Copper Queen Community Hospital in the old copper-mining town of Bisbee. "It was a decision made without thought, without care. That's maddening."
Since there are few intensive-care beds in the county, doctors said they were spending hours on the phone pleading with crowded hospitals in Utah, Texas or Phoenix to take patients too sick to stay in Cochise County.
The Cochise supervisors who voted against the $1.9 million have raised doubts about the safety and reliability of the vaccines, despite no evidence. Ms. Judd said she and her family had recovered from Covid-19 in November after drinking orange juice spiked with ivermectin, a drug commonly used to treat animal parasites that has become a go-to remedy for vaccine opponents. She said she and her family remain unvaccinated.
"We're those people," she said in a telephone interview, coughing occasionally — a lingering sign of the infection.
The other Cochise supervisor who voted against the money, Tom Crosby, compared Covid-19 vaccines to Agent Orange, the cancer-causing herbicide that killed and maimed hundreds of thousands during the Vietnam War. He said he wanted "to get the county out of the vaccine business."
Hey?
https://twitter.com/hollandcourtney/status/1491996868829614081?s=20&t=wJSBW_VvMxnaJSd5DjHXiw
Quote from: 4everwarriors on February 12, 2022, 09:58:02 AM
Hey?
https://twitter.com/hollandcourtney/status/1491996868829614081?s=20&t=wJSBW_VvMxnaJSd5DjHXiw
They'd also burst out into a cheer if you told them the only thing they'd ever have to eat again is ice cream. They could have it for breakfast, lunch and dinner. Yay!
Seriously, we're all glad that omicron has wound down enough for school districts to make these kinds of decisions. If there were less vaccine misinformation out there, districts would have been able to do this sooner.
Quote from: MU82 on February 12, 2022, 11:16:43 AM
They'd also burst out into a cheer if you told them the only thing they'd ever have to eat again is ice cream. They could have it for breakfast, lunch and dinner. Yay!
Seriously, we're all glad that omicron has wound down enough for school districts to make these kinds of decisions. If there were less vaccine misinformation out there, districts would have been able to do this sooner.
Yet, I've got neighbors who are confident that their kids have ZERO problems with wearing masks and that some even like them. I think what happened in Vegas, that didn't stay in Vegas, is probably representative of how kids truly feel about masks.
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on February 12, 2022, 11:51:51 AM
Yet, I've got neighbors who are confident that their kids have ZERO problems with wearing masks and that some even like them. I think what happened in Vegas, that didn't stay in Vegas, is probably representative of how kids truly feel about masks.
"Hey guys let's give a big cheer when we take off the masks."
So they do it.
I have no idea how much kids mind wearing masks. My guess is that some do and some don't. But of course conservative Twitter laps this stuff up...and Scoopers fall for it.
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on February 12, 2022, 11:51:51 AM
Yet, I've got neighbors who are confident that their kids have ZERO problems with wearing masks and that some even like them. I think what happened in Vegas, that didn't stay in Vegas, is probably representative of how kids truly feel about masks.
Most kids take their parents stance on masks and adopt it.
If their parents advocate for masks, and make them aware of why they are doing it. They are fine/ok with masks.
If their parents act like masks are part of a giant hoax designed to take away their freedoms, they are defiant and don't like mask usage.
Model resilience, raise resilient kids. Model Karen, raise Karen kids.
Quote from: tower912 on February 12, 2022, 01:33:06 PM
Model resilience, raise resilient kids. Model Karen, raise Karen kids.
LOL..yep.
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on February 12, 2022, 11:51:51 AM
Yet, I've got neighbors who are confident that their kids have ZERO problems with wearing masks and that some even like them. I think what happened in Vegas, that didn't stay in Vegas, is probably representative of how kids truly feel about masks.
My grandkids wear their masks at preschool when they're told to, and don't wear them when they don't have to.
They also clean up their crayons when told to, and make a mess when they're allowed to.
They parrot adults.
A long-time anti-vaxxer, who had fully bought into all the BS surrounding the "personal choice," almost lost his pregnant wife and the son she was carrying. Now he's vaccinated, and he tells friends and relatives to get the jab.
"When you sit there and you see your wife on life support because of covid, you throw out politics," he said later. "None of that matters anymore."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2022/02/14/unvaccinated-pregnant-mom-covid-strokes-texas/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F360d3bd%2F620bdf8d9d2fda34e792a37e%2F5f8d147cae7e8a56e5b732a4%2F8%2F74%2F620bdf8d9d2fda34e792a37e
My mom's neighbor just told a story of one his anti-vaxxer friends. The friend is paralyzed and uses a wheelchair. Anti-vaxxer's brother called and there was no response, so he called the police to check on him and his girlfriend. Police had to break in. The girlfriend was dead from COVID and the guy was in a coma. 3 weeks oi the ICU and on a ventilator and somehow managed to survive. He can't talk now and is in therapy to maybe regain speaking ability again.
That sure showed 'em!
Quote from: MU Fan in Connecticut on February 15, 2022, 02:07:39 PM
My mom's neighbor just told a story of one his anti-vaxxer friends. The friend is paralyzed and uses a wheelchair. Anti-vaxxer's brother called and there was no response, so he called the police to check on him and his girlfriend. Police had to break in. The girlfriend was dead from COVID and the guy was in a coma. 3 weeks oi the ICU and on a ventilator and somehow managed to survive. He can't talk now and is in therapy to maybe regain speaking ability again.
That sure showed 'em!
Truly owned all those who believe in vaccines.
I just hope his personal choice didn't prevent somebody who was sick with something other than "Freedom!" from getting an ICU bed and/or ventilator.
One of my son's long time classmate had anti vaxxers parents. Dad was a race car driver so limited life insurance. Dad spent 2 months on a vent, huge medical bills, dad has died. Mom still refused vax while dad was on vent. Now she has Covid with co-morbidities. Kid will be penniless and maybe an orphan, but hey the parents owned the libs!
Quote from: pbiflyer on February 15, 2022, 10:20:09 PM
One of my son's long time classmate had anti vaxxers parents. Dad was a race car driver so limited life insurance. Dad spent 2 months on a vent, huge medical bills, dad has died. Mom still refused vax while dad was on vent. Now she has Covid with co-morbidities. Kid will be penniless and maybe an orphan, but hey the parents owned the libs!
I blame Biden.
Please proceed anti-vaxxers
(https://images2.imgbox.com/d2/ee/JTJDawJX_o.jpg) (https://imgbox.com/JTJDawJX)
What are you implying? That Trump voters are old, fat, have more co-morbidities, and are more likely to die than non-Trump voters?
Unvaccinated are more likely to die from COVID than vaccinated. Currently, Trump voters are more likely to be unvaccinated than Biden voters. The math is pretty simple.
Quote from: tower912 on February 18, 2022, 08:51:14 AM
Unvaccinated are more likely to die from COVID than vaccinated. Currently, Trump voters are more likely to be unvaccinated than Biden voters. The math is pretty simple.
Trump voters are also older than Biden voters.
Your point?
My point is that there are other factors besides vaccination rate that explains the chart.
From the NYT:
Ocean County, in central New Jersey, is a mixture of beach towns like Barnegat Light and exurban towns like Toms River and Lakewood. Household income in the county exceeds the U.S. average.
Yet Ocean County is among the least vaccinated places in the Northeast. Only 53 percent of residents have received at least two doses of a Covid-19 vaccine (or one dose of Johnson & Johnson). Only 26 percent have received a booster shot.
The large number of unvaccinated residents in Ocean County has led to a horrific amount of Covid illness and death. Nearly one out of every 200 residents has died from the virus. That is worse than the toll in Mississippi, the U.S. state with the largest amount of Covid death per capita, and worse than in any country except for Peru.
What explains the vaccine skepticism in Ocean County? Politics, above all. The county is heavily Republican. Donald Trump won it by almost 30 percentage points in 2020, and many Republicans — including those who are older than 65 and vulnerable to severe Covid illness — are skeptical of the vaccines.
But at least they got to own the libs ... and at least they didn't die from (make-believe) illnesses brought about by the vaccines themselves.
Quote from: BrewCity83 on February 18, 2022, 09:07:57 AM
My point is that there are other factors besides vaccination rate that explains the chart.
no there aren't. Old and fat people are also protected by the vaccine. to imply they aren't is dishonest.
Quote from: BrewCity83 on February 18, 2022, 09:07:57 AM
My point is that there are other factors besides vaccination rate that explains the chart.
The chart specifically tracks vaccinated v unvaccinated.
Quote from: BrewCity83 on February 18, 2022, 08:46:57 AM
What are you implying? That Trump voters are old, fat, have more co-morbidities, and are more likely to die than non-Trump voters?
Implying? It's data. There is no need to imply anything, the data is pretty dramatic.
If Trump voters are old, fat, and have more co-morbidities as you say, seems like they would benefit most from getting vaccinated, no? Why is it, do you think, that Fox Snooze and 1,500 AM radio yakkers (and several dentist Buffons) are telling them not to get a free, life saving treatment?
Quote from: tower912 on February 18, 2022, 09:42:48 AM
The chart specifically tracks vaccinated v unvaccinated.
No, it actually doesn't track vaccinated v unvaccinated. It displays when vaccines were made available.
Quote from: BrewCity83 on February 18, 2022, 10:21:11 AM
No, it actually doesn't track vaccinated v unvaccinated. It displays when vaccines were made available.
Minor detail.
It shows the per capita death rate in counties relative to the percentage of votes Trump got in that county. 5 different lines, color coded based on percentage of Trump votes in a county. Then it shows death rate over time. The counties with the highest % of Trump voters have the highest death rates per capita.
You ate trying to add in age as a factor. OK. I am more interested in the correlation between Trump voters and vaccination rates.
Quote from: BrewCity83 on February 18, 2022, 10:21:11 AM
No, it actually doesn't track vaccinated v unvaccinated. It displays when vaccines were made available.
You're right. But to your larger point the red counties were tracking similarly to the rest before April 2021 when vaccines became widely available. But the difference has grown significantly since then. So while Trump voters have more co-morbidities or are less likely to take mitigation seriously, the lack of vaccinations seem to be a greater factor.
Quote from: pacearrow02 on February 18, 2022, 10:32:24 AM
Minor detail.
I mean it was completely unintentional, but you're actually right! Congrats!
Quote from: tower912 on February 18, 2022, 10:36:27 AM
You ate trying to add in age as a factor. OK. I am more interested in the correlation between Trump voters and vaccination rates.
Second chart here shows vax status by party affiliation: https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/dashboard/kff-covid-19-vaccine-monitor-dashboard/
I'd previously posted the third chart at that link as well showing the unvaccinated are less educated and more republican, i.e., Trump voters.
Please proceed, anti-vaxxers:
Who is dying of COVID amid omicron surge and widespread vaccine availability?
Recent CDC data shows unvaccinated people are 20 times more likely to die.
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/dying-covid-unvaccinated/story?id=82834971
"With around 60% of Americans fully vaccinated during the most recent wave, daily deaths from omicron are still relatively high, which begs the question: Who is dying of COVID-19 when there is such strong vaccination coverage?
Infectious disease doctors say it is still mainly unvaccinated people, most of whom are in their 30s and 40s with no underlying health issues, who are dying.
Data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention shows that during the first week of December -- when the omicron variant began taking hold -- unvaccinated people were dying at a rate of 9 per 100,000.
By comparison, fully vaccinated people were dying at a rate of 0.4 per 100,000, meaning unvaccinated people were 20 times more likely to die of the virus, according to an ABC News analysis. State-level data, from California to Mississippi, shows similar results."
(https://images2.imgbox.com/ab/96/MPWgBM42_o.jpg) (https://imgbox.com/MPWgBM42)
Quote from: TSmith34 on February 21, 2022, 04:25:02 PM
Please proceed, anti-vaxxers:
Who is dying of COVID amid omicron surge and widespread vaccine availability?
Recent CDC data shows unvaccinated people are 20 times more likely to die.
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/dying-covid-unvaccinated/story?id=82834971
"With around 60% of Americans fully vaccinated during the most recent wave, daily deaths from omicron are still relatively high, which begs the question: Who is dying of COVID-19 when there is such strong vaccination coverage?
Infectious disease doctors say it is still mainly unvaccinated people, most of whom are in their 30s and 40s with no underlying health issues, who are dying.
Data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention shows that during the first week of December -- when the omicron variant began taking hold -- unvaccinated people were dying at a rate of 9 per 100,000.
By comparison, fully vaccinated people were dying at a rate of 0.4 per 100,000, meaning unvaccinated people were 20 times more likely to die of the virus, according to an ABC News analysis. State-level data, from California to Mississippi, shows similar results."
(https://images2.imgbox.com/ab/96/MPWgBM42_o.jpg) (https://imgbox.com/MPWgBM42)
Even with horse de-wormer available?
Misinformation. Not reporting all the data seems to fit the definition. Don't give all the data because it might be misinterpreted, the CDC said.
So if the data for 18-49 year olds was included, a bunch of people might not have gotten the boosters, because the data showed they didn't need it.
Science, huh?
https://news.yahoo.com/cdc-isnt-publishing-large-portions-124915536.html
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on February 21, 2022, 06:28:24 PM
Misinformation. Not reporting all the data seems to fit the definition. Don't give all the data because it might be misinterpreted, the CDC said.
So if the data for 18-49 year olds was included, a bunch of people might not have gotten the boosters, because the data showed they didn't need it.
Science, huh?
https://news.yahoo.com/cdc-isnt-publishing-large-portions-124915536.html
it's going to be a drip...drip...drip of the "rest of the story" remember when we were told it wasn't a chinese virus or it wasn't from a lab, or it wasn't from wuhan, it might have been from OUR military?
then we were told natural immunity wasn't as good as the vaccine
then we were told masks were needed, no 2 masks, wait, 3...
next up, the side effects of the different vaccines-kinda like the disclaimers mentioned after all those drug commercials. it's going to turn up that many people have actual medical histories showing the vaccine to be contraindicated for verified reasons. you wouldn't give blood thinners to someone with a bleeding disorder, ulcers, NSAIDS in patients with kidney disorders, etc
Bottom line is we've all been played. The government, Fr. Fauci, big pharma, CDC, etc. have fooked with people's lives over the past 2 years. Put businesses out of business, jobs lost, created hardships and agony beyond measure. For what? Simply power and money were the driving forces.
We're all in this together...bullchit, aina?
I doubt anyone that got a booster regrets it.
I doubt anyone that didn't get a booster was going to get one regardless of data.
Vaccinate as much as you want - or not. Just don't cry if you're unvaccinated and end up with a severe case of covid.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on February 21, 2022, 07:53:08 PM
Bottom line is we've all been played. The government, Fr. Fauci, big pharma, CDC, etc. have fooked with people's lives over the past 2 years. Put businesses out of business, jobs lost, created hardships and agony beyond measure. For what? Simply power and money were the driving forces.
We're all in this together...bullchit, aina?
OK, Alex.
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on February 21, 2022, 06:28:24 PM
Misinformation. Not reporting all the data seems to fit the definition. Don't give all the data because it might be misinterpreted, the CDC said.
So if the data for 18-49 year olds was included, a bunch of people might not have gotten the boosters, because the data showed they didn't need it.
Science, huh?
https://news.yahoo.com/cdc-isnt-publishing-large-portions-124915536.html
Getting the booster improves your chances of avoiding a severe case (hospitalization and/or death) no matter what age you are...so I have no idea what point you are trying to make here.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on February 21, 2022, 07:53:08 PM
Bottom line is we've all been played. The government, Fr. Fauci, big pharma, CDC, etc. have fooked with people's lives over the past 2 years. Put businesses out of business, jobs lost, created hardships and agony beyond measure. For what? Simply power and money were the driving forces.
We're all in this together...bullchit, aina?
I wholeheartedly support your decision not to get boosted.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on February 21, 2022, 06:45:39 PM
Where are the studies on HCQ and ivermectin that you said "would bring us to our knees"??
Quote from: TSmith34 on February 21, 2022, 09:15:36 PM
Getting the booster improves your chances of avoiding a severe case (hospitalization and/or death) no matter what age you are...so I have no idea what point you are trying to make here.
Damn, you can be obtuse.
The point is that the data (science) showed it made no difference. And they intentionally excluded that data. If it makes no difference, then (1) why exclude the data, and (b) why get the booster?
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on February 21, 2022, 09:49:03 PM
Damn, you can be obtuse.
The point is that the data (science) showed it made no difference. And they intentionally excluded that data. If it makes no difference, then (1) why exclude the data, and (b) why get the booster?
Only it didn't "make no difference". Per the article:
"When the CDC published the first significant data two weeks ago on the effectiveness of boosters in adults younger than 65, it left out the numbers for a huge portion of that population: 18- to 49-year-olds, the group the data showed was
least likely to benefit from extra shots, because the first two doses already left them well-protected."
Least likely doesn't mean no benefit.
But, just like the dentists, I fully support your choice not to get boosters.
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on February 21, 2022, 09:49:03 PM
Damn, you can be obtuse.
Pakuni has never been wrong in his life. It's amazing his power.
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on February 21, 2022, 11:10:09 PM
Pakuni has never been wrong in his life. It's amazing his power.
But you replied to lighthouse, who replied to tsmith.
So I guess pakuni has "appropriate use of the quote function" on you
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 21, 2022, 11:22:36 PM
But you replied to lighthouse, who replied to tsmith.
So I guess pakuni has "appropriate use of the quote function" on you
Tsmith is as obtuse as pakuni. 2 self centered asshats.
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 21, 2022, 08:37:28 PM
Vaccinate as much as you want - or not. Just don't cry if you're unvaccinated and end up with a severe case of covid.
I think this is the most reasonable thing anyone has said on Scoop in history of Scoop.
You, sir, are awarded control over Scoopdom and shall be the one to forever get to choose the coveted "Stud o' the Game".
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on February 22, 2022, 01:04:47 AM
Tsmith is as obtuse as pakuni. 2 self centered asshats.
Should I be flattered or creeped out that ZFB obsesses over me only slightly less than his complete Hannah Montana DVD collection?
(She's Miley now, Ziggy. It's time to move on.)
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on February 22, 2022, 01:04:47 AM
Tsmith is as obtuse as pakuni. 2 self centered asshats.
I continue to be very, very concerned about your opinion
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on February 21, 2022, 11:10:09 PM
Pakuni has never been wrong in his life. It's amazing his power.
"I don't like your facts, so lemme call you some names"
Quote from: Pakuni on February 22, 2022, 08:15:37 AM
Should I be flattered or creeped out that ZFB obsesses over me only slightly less than his complete Hannah Montana DVD collection?
(She's Miley now, Ziggy. It's time to move on.)
His entire 'persona' around here is poor attempts at jokes, defending weirdos, name calling, and adding nothing of value to every conversation.
Fox News' Neil Cavuto just survived a severe bout with Covid. He said that if he hadn't been vaccinated, he'd almost surely be dead.
I am glad he has recovered, and I appreciate that he has been the network's most vocal proponent of the life-saving vaccines while repeatedly shooting down conspiracy theories and misinformation.
Quote from: MU82 on February 22, 2022, 12:36:17 PM
Fox News' Neil Cavuto just survived a severe bout with Covid. He said that if he hadn't been vaccinated, he'd almost surely be dead.
And if he didn't have MS, had cancer, gotten pneumonia, etc., probably a non-issue.
But let's vax healthy 8 year olds, hey
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on February 22, 2022, 12:35:44 PM
His entire 'persona' around here is poor attempts at jokes, defending weirdos, name calling, and adding nothing of value to every conversation.
Pot and kettle, homeslice.
Quote from: Jay Bee on February 22, 2022, 01:40:42 PM
But let's vax healthy 8 year olds, hey
We literally do that all the time.
It's one of the reasons they're healthy.
Measles, mumps, polio, chicken pox, small pox, rubella.
As an adult, tetanus, hepatitis series,
shingles, annual flu shots. Ain't no thing.
I assume I will get a combination flu/COVID shot for the foreseeable future.
Quote from: Jay Bee on February 22, 2022, 01:40:42 PM
And if he didn't have MS, had cancer, gotten pneumonia, etc., probably a non-issue.
But let's vax healthy 8 year olds, hey
Yes, JB, let's give the vaccine to everybody who has been approved to take it after untold amount of research has deemed it safe and effective.
And yes, Cavuto is immunocompromised. Thankfully, he isn't also stoopid.
Sadly, Covid has been an "issue" to far too many seemingly healthy people who have died unnecessarily or gotten seriously ill because they fell prey to misinformation. Sadder still is that they occupied ICU beds that weren't available for others, thereby harming their fellow human beings.
Again, I'm glad that an intelligent person with a platform, such as Cavuto, has been an outspoken advocate of these life-saving vaccines.
Quote from: MU82 on February 22, 2022, 02:26:48 PM
Yes, JB, let's give the vaccine to everybody who has been approved to take it after untold amount of research has deemed it safe and effective.
And yes, Cavuto is immunocompromised. Thankfully, he isn't also stoopid.
Sadly, Covid has been an "issue" to far too many seemingly healthy people who have died unnecessarily or gotten seriously ill because they fell prey to misinformation. Sadder still is that they occupied ICU beds that weren't available for others, thereby harming their fellow human beings.
Again, I'm glad that an intelligent person with a platform, such as Cavuto, has been an outspoken advocate of these life-saving vaccines.
Thank goodness that if you survive, there aren't any long term side effects......
People with Covid-19 may face long-term cardiovascular complications, study says
https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/22/health/covid-cardiovascular-complications/index.html
As the Covid-19 pandemic enters its third year, scientists are finding that the coronavirus has far-reaching effects on health beyond the acute phase of illness. One recent study has found that people with Covid-19 are at an increased risk for cardiovascular diseases for at least a year after recovery.
Dexter Akanno had COVID which led to myocarditis last season. Still working on his conditioning. Young, healthy. No vaccines available when he caught it.
https://www.oregonlive.com/beavers/2022/02/oregon-state-guard-dexter-akanno-finds-joy-in-making-food-runs-for-homeless-everybody-has-a-story.html
https://mobile.twitter.com/NPR/status/1496300023755120643
Science is settled. Keep poking away
Hundreds of thousands of people suffer from "long Covid" -- debilitating problems long after the Covid symptoms are gone. My wife works with an RN who, 6 months after having "recovered" from Covid, was still suffering from horrific migraines and painful joints.
It's one reason why many infectious-disease experts have said it's NOT smart to try to get Covid so you can "get it over with." Because you might not get it over with. That's especially true for the unvaccinated.
And one is significantly more likely to get heart problems (and other problems) from Covid than one is from the vaccine, despite what the Misinformation Society would have people believe.
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on February 22, 2022, 01:49:39 PM
Pot and kettle, homeslice.
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight, because it's even remotely close.
Quote from: pacearrow02 on February 22, 2022, 09:23:35 PM
https://mobile.twitter.com/NPR/status/1496300023755120643
Science is settled. Keep poking away
So far, yes. Viruses evolve and we learn new things every day.
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on February 22, 2022, 12:35:44 PM
His entire 'persona' around here is poor attempts at jokes, defending weirdos, name calling, and adding nothing of value to every conversation.
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on February 22, 2022, 12:34:00 PM
"I don't like your facts, so lemme call you some names"
What are the effects of covid 20 years after infection?
What are the effects of the "vaccine" 20 years after injection?
If you choose to take the "vaccine" that until recently would never have been called a vaccine. You are taking both risks. Since as the Queen just showed us, even with 3 boosters you are still likely going to get covid.
Imagine waking up every day with a brain that thinks that all possible outcomes to every uncertain situation are equally likely. What a terrifying, chaotic place the world must seem. That doesn't make me angry, I pity it.
Quote from: thomaskyle on February 23, 2022, 09:03:23 AM
What are the effects of covid 20 years after infection?
What are the effects of the "vaccine" 20 years after injection?
If you choose to take the "vaccine" that until recently would never have been called a vaccine. You are taking both risks. Since as the Queen just showed us, even with 3 boosters you are still likely going to get covid.
We know that not getting vaccinated increases your chance of dying by 15x.
Quote from: thomaskyle on February 23, 2022, 09:03:23 AM
What are the effects of covid 20 years after infection?
What are the effects of the "vaccine" 20 years after injection?
If you choose to take the "vaccine" that until recently would never have been called a vaccine. You are taking both risks. Since as the Queen just showed us, even with 3 boosters you are still likely going to get covid.
Not sure why I'm bothering with this question. How would this have not been called a "vaccine" (not sure why we are using quotes there) until recently?
Quote from: tower912 on February 23, 2022, 10:24:30 AM
We know that not getting vaccinated increases your chance of dying by 15x.
actually based on reports out of the CDC this week about not reporting data from 18-49 year olds at all. We in fact do not know this.
We do. You choose to ignore it on your rabbit hole.
Quote from: tower912 on February 23, 2022, 10:31:18 AM
We do. You choose to ignore it on your rabbit hole.
ummm... good one... i guess.
A guy in Charlotte got killed a few weeks ago while walking on the sidewalk. Some drunk ass-hat in an SUV jumped the curb and mowed the poor guy down.
That proves it's always dangerous walking on sidewalks, so everybody might as well walk in the middle of the street.
Quote from: thomaskyle on February 23, 2022, 10:30:02 AM
actually based on reports out of the CDC this week about not reporting data from 18-49 year olds at all. We in fact do not know this.
The information the CDC hasn't published had nothing to do with deaths of vaccinated vs unvaccinated.
It was concerning vaccinated and boosted vs vaccinated and not boosted.
Nice try, though.
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on February 23, 2022, 07:17:50 AM
Do we really want to curate each other's posts, my dude?
They're not all bangers, but I'd put my catalog up against yours here any day.
Quote from: MUBurrow on February 23, 2022, 09:18:33 AM
Imagine waking up every day with a brain that thinks that all possible outcomes to every uncertain situation are equally likely. What a terrifying, chaotic place the world must seem. That doesn't make me angry, I pity it.
YUP.
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on February 23, 2022, 04:56:20 PM
Do we really want to curate each other's posts, my dude?
They're not all bangers, but I'd put my catalog up against yours here any day.
Would you say you celebrate your entire catalog?
(https://i.imgur.com/UBubRQP.jpg)
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on February 23, 2022, 04:56:20 PM
Do we really want to curate each other's posts, my dude?
They're not all bangers, but I'd put my catalog up against yours here any day.
I'm Dean Martin.
You're Jeff Dunham.
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on February 24, 2022, 11:47:17 AM
I'm Dean Martin.
You're Jeff Dunham.
You sir, are an pretty boy for this one.
I shall never forgive nor forget.
:-[
https://mobile.twitter.com/EWoodhouse7/status/1496878150831284237
Quote from: pacearrow02 on February 24, 2022, 07:31:19 PM
https://mobile.twitter.com/EWoodhouse7/status/1496878150831284237
So what in the world makes you believe the source of this information?
Quote from: Skatastrophy on February 24, 2022, 07:34:57 PM
So what in the world makes you believe the source of this information?
He doesn't believe it. He doesn't need to. He's a troll.
Quote from: Skatastrophy on February 24, 2022, 07:34:57 PM
So what in the world makes you believe the source of this information?
Comes right from the hospital's Covid dashboard
Quote from: pacearrow02 on February 24, 2022, 07:52:26 PM
Comes right from the hospital's Covid dashboard
Could you provide a link to the hospital's covid dashboard. I searched, and couldn't find it. Twitter isn't a hospital's covid dashboard.
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 24, 2022, 08:06:21 PM
Could you provide a link to the hospital's covid dashboard. I searched, and couldn't find it. Twitter isn't a hospital's covid dashboard.
It says it's from their internal dashboard. Literally impossible to find the source. It's "leaked" on twitter though, so it must be real.
Quote from: pacearrow02 on February 24, 2022, 07:31:19 PM
https://mobile.twitter.com/EWoodhouse7/status/1496878150831284237
Since 10am this morning, 97 Retweets, 5 Quote Tweets 293 Likes.
Where do you find people like this? And worse, why do you waste your time with them?
Emma Woodhouse 😁@EWoodhouse7Here for the COVID-19 data discussion | #RationalGround | http://woodhouse.substack.com | Torn btw Ravenclaw & Gryffindor | I'm NOT on Facebook
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on February 24, 2022, 09:25:28 PM
Since 10am this morning, 97 Retweets, 5 Quote Tweets 293 Likes.
Where do you find people like this? And worse, why do you waste your time with them?
Emma Woodhouse 😁@EWoodhouse7Here for the COVID-19 data discussion | #RationalGround | http://woodhouse.substack.com | Torn btw Ravenclaw & Gryffindor | I'm NOT on Facebook
NOT on Facebook, apparently.
Stop it guys.
That's EMMA Woodhouse from the famous Covid-Expert Woodhouses!
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on February 24, 2022, 09:25:28 PM
#RationalGround
Well, since we're using twitter as authoritative:
https://twitter.com/gorskon/status/1437525658087747584
https://twitter.com/thereal_truther/status/1386352972322377728
Emma Woodhouse? The heroine from the Jane Austen novel Emma?
Mr. Knightley would not approve of her being on Twitter.
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 24, 2022, 11:01:53 PM
Well, since we're using twitter as authoritative:
https://twitter.com/gorskon/status/1437525658087747584
https://twitter.com/thereal_truther/status/1386352972322377728
Lol
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 24, 2022, 11:01:53 PM
Well, since we're using twitter as authoritative:
https://twitter.com/gorskon/status/1437525658087747584
https://twitter.com/thereal_truther/status/1386352972322377728
Oh wow.
Who takes more L's? Pacearrow or Georgetown?
Quote from: pacearrow02 on February 24, 2022, 07:31:19 PM
https://mobile.twitter.com/EWoodhouse7/status/1496878150831284237
In a high vaccinated area (like Chicago), a large number of COVID patients will also be vaccinated, because of math.
Quote from: MUDPT on February 25, 2022, 07:43:56 AM
In a high vaccinated area (like Chicago), a large number of COVID patients will also be vaccinated, because of math.
I was thinking/wondering the same thing. FWIW, the hospital is located in Park Ridge which includes two zip codes 60016 and 60068. Per the IL Dept of Public Health, those have vax rates of 80.29% with one dose and 73.87% with one, and 86.38% and 80.02% respectively. Looking at those numbers, even taking cheeks' data at face value, doesn't that actually argue IN FAVOR of vaccination effectiveness vs severe illness?
Seriously folks, the troll doesn't care about wins and losses, he isn't here to share facts, he is here strictly to troll and spread disinformation. The only response any post of his deserves is:
(https://www.paws.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/stellar-sea-lion-938424_1280.jpg)
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/28/health/pfizer-vaccine-kids.html?referringSource=articleShare
Science is settled folks
Quote from: pacearrow02 on February 28, 2022, 07:34:46 PM
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/28/health/pfizer-vaccine-kids.html?referringSource=articleShare
Science is settled folks
Agreed
> It still prevents severe illness in the children
Seems straightforward eh? No?
> Still, he and other public health experts said they recommend the shot for children given the protection against severe disease shown even in the new data set.
Man, seems like science is settled.
>There have been at least 851 deaths involving Covid-19 in children under 17, and nearly 7,000 cases of multisystem inflammatory syndrome in children, a rare but serious condition associated with Covid. More children were hospitalized during the Omicron surge than at any other point in the pandemic.
Seems important to get kids vaccinated ASAP, thanks for the link
https://mobile.twitter.com/covid_clarity/status/1498360349975842821
Follow the science!!
https://mobile.twitter.com/DrGuru_/status/1498373894142676995
(https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/15116056/2020/08/sealion1.jpg)
Quote from: Skatastrophy on February 28, 2022, 07:42:30 PM
Agreed
> It still prevents severe illness in the children
Seems straightforward eh? No?
> Still, he and other public health experts said they recommend the shot for children given the protection against severe disease shown even in the new data set.
Man, seems like science is settled.
>There have been at least 851 deaths involving Covid-19 in children under 17, and nearly 7,000 cases of multisystem inflammatory syndrome in children, a rare but serious condition associated with Covid. More children were hospitalized during the Omicron surge than at any other point in the pandemic.
Seems important to get kids vaccinated ASAP, thanks for the link
In a month it went from 68% effective to 12% effective at preventing infection. Even if there is some protection from the rare severe disease in children, that's flat out awful.
Quote from: statnik on March 01, 2022, 12:28:42 PM
In a month it went from 68% effective to 12% effective at preventing infection. Even if there is some protection from the rare severe disease in children, that's flat out awful.
You might wanna read beyond the headline on that one
Why start now.
Quote from: statnik on March 01, 2022, 12:28:42 PM
In a month it went from 68% effective to 12% effective at preventing infection. Even if there is some protection from the rare severe disease in children, that's flat out awful.
Keeping kids out of hospitals is flat-out awful. 10-4 good buddy.
Quote from: Skatastrophy on March 01, 2022, 02:28:17 PM
Keeping kids out of hospitals is flat-out awful. 10-4 good buddy.
Strange stance to take, isn't it?
Quote from: Skatastrophy on March 01, 2022, 02:28:17 PM
Keeping kids out of hospitals is flat-out awful. 10-4 good buddy.
Barely making a dent in them getting sick at all (given how long COVID is a thing) should be important too and it is awful at preventing that.
Quote from: statnik on March 01, 2022, 04:37:34 PM
Barely making a dent in them getting sick at all (given how long COVID is a thing) should be important too and it is awful at preventing that.
Dumb. But not unexpected.
Quote from: TSmith34 on March 01, 2022, 05:09:04 PM
Dumb. But not unexpected.
Do you dispute that it was down to 12% effectiveness at the height of Omicron? Unless you have rock solid studies that the vaccines also prevent long COVID in children I stand by my statement that it's a pretty awful 'vaccine' by typical vaccine standards.
Quote from: statnik on March 01, 2022, 05:31:26 PM
Do you dispute that it was down to 12% effectiveness at the height of Omicron? Unless you have rock solid studies that the vaccines also prevent long COVID in children I stand by my statement that it's a pretty awful 'vaccine' by typical vaccine standards.
Sorry that is only preventing them from getting very sick/hospitalized/dying. Awful vaccine.
https://mobile.twitter.com/DefiantLs/status/1498745144237076480/photo/1
Quote from: pacearrow02 on March 01, 2022, 10:43:13 PM
https://mobile.twitter.com/DefiantLs/status/1498745144237076480/photo/1
One of the best accounts on Twitter. ;D
Is replying to one's own posts using sock puppet accounts a sign of mental illness?
Asking for a friend.
Might want to read beyond the headline on that one
Quote from: pacearrow02 on February 28, 2022, 07:34:46 PM
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/28/health/pfizer-vaccine-kids.html?referringSource=articleShare
Science is settled folks
I read the study. The confidence intervals are wild. Not sure that those are the conclusions that I would have come up with.
Perhaps the first recorded case of mass vaccine misinformation (from the NYT, with info from a Ken Burns documentary) ...
As smallpox was sweeping through Philadelphia in 1736, Benjamin Franklin and his wife, Deborah, initially decided not to inoculate their 4-year-old son Francis, known as Franky. The boy was sick with a cold and the Franklins worried that his body would not be able to handle the side effects of inoculation. Soon, though, Franky contracted smallpox and died.
"This is the great tragedy of Franklin's life," Burns told me. "Deborah and Benjamin Franklin were just beset by this mistake they made even though it was completely understandable." (Burns has just posted a six-minute "extra" film clip about Franky and inoculation, and it's powerful. Next month, PBS will air Burns's new documentary, "Benjamin Franklin.")
When rumors spread in Philadelphia that Franky had died from the inoculation rather than the disease itself, Franklin took the painful step of writing the true story in his newspaper, The Pennsylvania Gazette. In the years that followed, he tried to persuade others to avoid his family's fate.
"Surely parents will no longer refuse to accept and thankfully use a discovery God in his mercy has been pleased to bless mankind with," Franklin wrote, in a pro-inoculation pamphlet. "For the loss of one in 10 thereby is not merely the loss of so many persons, but the accumulated loss of all the children and children's children the deceased might have had, multiplied by successive generations."
In the U.S. today, the death toll from Covid has exceeded 950,000, and many of those deaths occurred after vaccines were available. It is a tragic pattern that's consistent with history: Vaccination tends to be both counterintuitive and highly effective.
Misinformation Gov. Ron DeSantis says children shouldn't get vaccinated.
But what do you expect from a governor who last week publicly bullied high school kids for choosing to wear masks?
C'mon man! Tyme ta change yo shtick. Didn't ya get da email? Covid's over and da next crisis iz a big kountry invadin' a little kountry, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 08, 2022, 11:50:27 AM
C'mon man! Tyme ta change yo shtick. Didn't ya get da email? Covid's over and da next crisis iz a big kountry invadin' a little kountry, hey?
OK, Alex.
Russia's Anti-Vaccine Propaganda is Tantamount to a Declaration of War
https://medecon.org/russias-anti-vaccine-propaganda-is-tantamount-to-a-declaration-of-war/
"Moreover, the source of much of the misinformation about vaccines comes from an unobvious source: the Russian government's propaganda apparatus, which cultivates and exploits foreign anti-vaccine "useful idiots," [ED: He misspelled Scoop Dentists] causing palpable harm to Americans and citizens of other Western countries.
As I've previously described, Russia regularly conducts health-related disinformation and propaganda campaigns intended to humiliate or disparage the country's foreign enemies. In the 1980s, the Soviet Union concocted an elaborate disinformation scheme to blame the appearance of HIV and AIDS on U.S. military research. They first planted the story in a sympathetic Indian newspaper, then followed it up with other fake stories that cited the initial report.
A study published by academics in 2018, "Weaponized Health Communication: Twitter Bots and Russian Trolls Amplify the Vaccine Debate," found that thousands of Russian social media accounts were spreading anti-vaccine messaging. From an examination of almost two million tweets posted between 2014 and 2017, the researchers found that Russian troll accounts were significantly more likely to tweet about vaccination than were Twitter users generally. They noted that Russian tweets like, "Apparently only the elite get 'clean' #vaccines. And what do we, normal ppl, get?!" seem intended to exacerbate socioeconomic tensions in the United States."
Quote from: TSmith34 on April 14, 2022, 10:00:20 AM
Russia's Anti-Vaccine Propaganda is Tantamount to a Declaration of War
https://medecon.org/russias-anti-vaccine-propaganda-is-tantamount-to-a-declaration-of-war/
"Moreover, the source of much of the misinformation about vaccines comes from an unobvious source: the Russian government's propaganda apparatus, which cultivates and exploits foreign anti-vaccine "useful idiots," [ED: He misspelled Scoop Dentists] causing palpable harm to Americans and citizens of other Western countries.
As I've previously described, Russia regularly conducts health-related disinformation and propaganda campaigns intended to humiliate or disparage the country's foreign enemies. In the 1980s, the Soviet Union concocted an elaborate disinformation scheme to blame the appearance of HIV and AIDS on U.S. military research. They first planted the story in a sympathetic Indian newspaper, then followed it up with other fake stories that cited the initial report.
A study published by academics in 2018, "Weaponized Health Communication: Twitter Bots and Russian Trolls Amplify the Vaccine Debate," found that thousands of Russian social media accounts were spreading anti-vaccine messaging. From an examination of almost two million tweets posted between 2014 and 2017, the researchers found that Russian troll accounts were significantly more likely to tweet about vaccination than were Twitter users generally. They noted that Russian tweets like, "Apparently only the elite get 'clean' #vaccines. And what do we, normal ppl, get?!" seem intended to exacerbate socioeconomic tensions in the United States."
There are plenty of Rockets and 4evers around who bow to anything Putin does or says. But then, they are just following in the footsteps of their hero.
Here ya goe, hey?
Quote from: Jockey on April 15, 2022, 04:48:07 PM
There are plenty of Rockets and 4evers around who bow to anything Putin does or says. But then, they are just following in the footsteps of their hero.
You guys haven't gotten the nod to go from diapers to training pants yet I see maybe someday, when you get older, you'll be able to make big people decisions. Until then, better to just sit and listen
As you return to diapers and pureed food.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on April 15, 2022, 04:59:53 PM
You guys haven't gotten the nod to go from diapers to training pants yet I see maybe someday, when you get older, you'll be able to make big people decisions. Until then, better to just sit and listen
I am still sitting and waiting to listen to the studies you promised last October on HCQ and ivermectin that you said would have us "bowing down". Got a link to those?
Quote from: TSmith34 on April 15, 2022, 08:58:53 PM
I am still sitting and waiting to listen to the studies you promised last October on HCQ and ivermectin that you said would have us "bowing down". Got a link to those?
[/quote
Yawn...ya see sniff, sometimes ya have to do a little independent thinking, listening to all sides, sometimes listening to people who've been censored by your people wondering what they are trying to hide. You guys crapped all over so much info from the beginning before even knowing anything about it. Everything doesn't need to be " double blind studies" think outside the box for a change.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7534595/
https://www.palmerfoundation.com.au/new-study-reveals-success-of-hydroxychloroquine-as-covid-treatment/
You know what else didn't work, lockdowns and ventilators were not a one size fit all treatment
https://journals.lww.com/americantherapeutics/fulltext/2021/08000/ivermectin_for_prevention_and_treatment_of.7.aspx
For Gods sake,you smart guys are the ones who put us in this schiff hole and we're supposed to listen to you?
Rocket, I am not going to go through the effort of fixing your post because you apparently can't quote correctly.
But the Palmer Foundation study from June was subsequently shown to be wrong by the Australian government.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/oct/09/clive-palmer-asked-for-name-and-logo-of-his-foundation-on-33m-doses-of-donated-hydroxychloroquine
The American Journal of Therapeutics Study was shown to be wrong almost immediately after it was published.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34994351/
But I don't know why I keep doing this. You have shown no ability to learn or conquer the biases you have. Pretty sad for a health care professional.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on April 15, 2022, 10:14:39 PM
Quote from: TSmith34 on April 15, 2022, 08:58:53 PM
I am still sitting and waiting to listen to the studies you promised last October on HCQ and ivermectin that you said would have us "bowing down". Got a link to those?
Yawn...ya see sniff, sometimes ya have to do a little independent thinking, listening to all sides, sometimes listening to people who've been censored by your people wondering what they are trying to hide. You guys crapped all over so much info from the beginning before even knowing anything about it. Everything doesn't need to be " double blind studies" think outside the box for a change.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7534595/
https://www.palmerfoundation.com.au/new-study-reveals-success-of-hydroxychloroquine-as-covid-treatment/
You know what else didn't work, lockdowns and ventilators were not a one size fit all treatment
https://journals.lww.com/americantherapeutics/fulltext/2021/08000/ivermectin_for_prevention_and_treatment_of.7.aspx
For Gods sake,you smart guys are the ones who put us in this schiff hole and we're supposed to listen to you?
So two failed studies, huh? That's what you're going to provide as proof? With a side of paranoia.
"Healthcare" "professional" reveals actual scientific studies aren't needed, just magical thinking.
https://www.theepochtimes.com/fda-and-pfizer-knew-covid-shot-caused-immunosuppression_4404366.html
Interesting read.
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on April 17, 2022, 09:02:43 AM
https://www.theepochtimes.com/fda-and-pfizer-knew-covid-shot-caused-immunosuppression_4404366.html
Interesting read.
This won't end well.
Imagine treating the epoch times as a good source of information, with such sources as:
* The Naked Emperor on Substack
* The Defender
* Daily Expose
* VAERS
Literally lol
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on April 17, 2022, 09:02:43 AM
https://www.theepochtimes.com/fda-and-pfizer-knew-covid-shot-caused-immunosuppression_4404366.html
Interesting read.
You definitely put that link in the right thread
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on April 17, 2022, 09:02:43 AM
https://www.theepochtimes.com/fda-and-pfizer-knew-covid-shot-caused-immunosuppression_4404366.html
Interesting read.
No. It isn't.
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on April 17, 2022, 09:02:43 AM
https://www.theepochtimes.com/fda-and-pfizer-knew-covid-shot-caused-immunosuppression_4404366.html
Interesting read.
Thank you for providing proof that vaccine misinformation continues.
Eye-opening article about a once-vaccine-denying police officer who almost died from COVID-19 but now has become an evangelist for Covid vaccines:
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/26/nyregion/police-vaccine-nj.html?campaign_id=9&emc=edit_nn_20220426&instance_id=59467&nl=the-morning®i_id=108420427&segment_id=90264&te=1&user_id=d36dcf821462fdd16ec3636710a855fa
In addition to the officer's personal story, the article includes this:
Though police work inherently carries with it the possibility of violent or lethal encounters, for the last two years Covid-19 has been the leading cause of death for law enforcement officers in the United States.
When Covid vaccines were first offered in December 2020, law enforcement officers — frontline workers who, like doctors and nurses, are required to interact closely with people in crisis — were prioritized for shots that have since been proven to significantly lower the risk of serious illness and death.
But over the next year, as some police unions tried to block vaccine mandates, at least 301 police, sheriff and correction officers died of complications from Covid-19, according to the National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial, a nonprofit that tracks line-of-duty fatalities. Since January, Covid has continued to outpace other top causes of line-of-duty deaths.
"It's not just a little bit above firearm fatalities and traffic fatalities," said Troy Anderson, a retired Connecticut State Police sergeant who is now director of safety and wellness for the memorial. "It's heads and shoulders above."
"It's unthinkable that we're still in this place," he added. ...
Many of the nation's largest police departments, including Los Angeles, New York and Newark, have required employees to be vaccinated. Correction officers in New Jersey also have been ordered to get shots or risk being fired.
In Newark, New Jersey's largest city, nine police employees have died of Covid-19. But there have been no Covid fatalities since the city's vaccination mandate was implemented in September after an unsuccessful legal challenge by the police and fire unions.
Thank goodness for vaccine mandates. I'm sure that anybody who believes blue lives matter would agree.
Ahhhh, good. Republican politicians are now trying to legislate their idiocy to override medical science. This must be that small government philosophy they talk about.
Ohio doctors could soon be required to promote ivermectin to treat COVID-19 (//http://)
COLUMBUS, Ohio — A new bill proposed by House Republicans would require boards of health to "promote and increase distribution" of drugs, such as ivermectin, to combat COVID-19. Health professionals who don't do this would be penalized.
The four main drugs that the bill includes are ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, azithromycin and budesonide. Each is an unapproved method to combat COVID-19. The bill's language also requires doctors to promote and increase distribution of any other drug or therapy that "may be proven effective or deemed beneficial" by the patient's "treating health care professional in consultation with the patient or patient's legally authorized representative."
"More options, better health care," Ferguson said. "That's what people are always looking for in the healthcare space."
Although doctors say options are important, there's a difference between a drug proven to work and one that isn't.
"There's absolutely no benefit from ivermectin," said Dr. Donald Dumford, medical director for infection prevention at Cleveland Clinic Akron General Medical Center. "If you would take ivermectin or take a sugar pill and you're hoping to prevent COVID, you're going to get just as much of an effect out of that sugar pill."
Studies like the New England Medical Journal's show that the anti-parasitic is not at all effective in reducing the risk of hospitalizations, Dumford said.
"If it doesn't work, it doesn't work," Ferguson said. "That's the whole concept of 'Right to Try.' Let's give people the ability to have that, so at least they can look back and say, 'I did everything that I thought that I could for my own health care.'"
Even though the vaccine is FDA-approved and is credited by doctors as saving millions of lives, it's only a year old, Ferguson said. When asked what he would say to people who ask why health departments should promote and increase distribution of a drug that is proven to be ineffective, the Republican said there is too much unknown. [Ed: Moron]
It is like a contest to see who can be dumbest. Pass a law requiring medical professionals advocate snake oil.
They should go all in and force doctors to promote cigarettes.
Bad news, guys. The COVID vaccine might give you AIDS.
https://wisconsinexaminer.com/brief/in-interview-sen-johnson-says-it-may-be-true-that-covid-vaccines-cause-aids/
Quote from: Pakuni on May 03, 2022, 03:27:57 PM
Bad news, guys. The COVID vaccine might give you AIDS.
https://wisconsinexaminer.com/brief/in-interview-sen-johnson-says-it-may-be-true-that-covid-vaccines-cause-aids/
He must hang with the same doctors as Roqkkket
Taking the lead in the willfully stupid contest ...
Quote from: Pakuni on May 03, 2022, 03:27:57 PM
Bad news, guys. The COVID vaccine might give you AIDS.
https://wisconsinexaminer.com/brief/in-interview-sen-johnson-says-it-may-be-true-that-covid-vaccines-cause-aids/
If you had told me this was an actual article, I would have assumed the onion.
The good news in that ivermectin is just as effective in treating the vaccine-induced AIDS as it in treating COVID...so much so, in fact, that no one treated with ivermectin has died from vaccine-induced AIDS.
you just wait ....... stuff's gonna come out / and you buffon "experts" will look even stoopider than you already do
https://mobile.twitter.com/kerpen/status/1523675100247203841
Quote from: MU82 on May 03, 2022, 09:20:21 PM
you just wait ....... stuff's gonna come out / and you buffon "experts" will look even stoopider than you already do
Dude, fast forward to 2022. Elect a clown...expect a circus, aina?
Exactly what I said in 2016. One of my best predictions ever.
Quote from: pacearrow02 on May 09, 2022, 02:23:40 PM
https://mobile.twitter.com/kerpen/status/1523675100247203841
I wore a normal barrier/ surgical mask in 50% of my COVID rooms from April 2020 to November 2020, with no adverse events, before the CDC went to airborne transmission. Masks work, not 100% efficacy, but they work.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on May 09, 2022, 06:56:58 PM
Dude, fast forward to 2022. Elect a clown...expect a circus, aina?
The circus is STILL going on from when your clown was elected. One of his 87 defense secretaries just told 60 Minutes that your god wanted to shoot missiles into Mexico and to call in the military to shoot protesters.
I expect the circus to continue well past when your god dies. He'll find a way to grift the easily conned sheeple even from his grave.
Anyone who voted for this Buffoon deserves the current clusterfook. Don't say ya weren't warned. Unfortunately, the rest of us have to suffer along with y'all too, aina?
That is how we felt 2016-2020.
How's FD Joe and Buffoon2 workin' out for ya, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on May 10, 2022, 05:45:05 AM
How's FD Joe and Buffoon2 workin' out for ya, hey?
Don't care for the administration. One of my top three agenda requirements is a robust transportation plan. We have that for the first time since 2015.
Biden is who he has always been. So is Trump.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on May 10, 2022, 05:45:05 AM
How's FD Joe and Buffoon2 workin' out for ya, hey?
I'm good for the most part. Thanks.
Quote from: MU82 on May 09, 2022, 11:19:22 PM
The circus is STILL going on from when your clown was elected. One of his 87 defense secretaries just told 60 Minutes that your god wanted to shoot missiles into Mexico and to call in the military to shoot protesters.
I expect the circus to continue well past when your god dies. He'll find a way to grift the easily conned sheeple even from his grave.
Shooting missiles into Mexico and shooting protesters are just fine, because well, we all know why.
Quote from: Clarissa on May 10, 2022, 06:26:06 AM
I'm good for the most part. Thanks.
I'll check back with ya in a couple months. Gas prices should near $6.00/gal by then along huge increases in food prices and all the trickle down effects in full force. Don't fear, relief should begin shorty after the mid-terms when, at least, the Buffoon will be neutered, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on May 10, 2022, 07:29:41 AM
I'll check back with ya in a couple months. Gas prices should near $6.00/gal by then along huge increases in food prices and all the trickle down effects in full force. Don't fear, relief should begin shorty after the mid-terms when, at least, the Buffoon will be neutered, hey?
Biden really has nothing to do with inflation. Presidents in general are given way too much credit for economic performance.
I'm just glad we have someone who seemingly cares about all Americans, not just the ones that make him look good or will grovel for his approval, and isn't an international embarrassment.
Really? Chit man, do you actually believe what you wrote? All he is capable of caring about is the title of "President" and loading his pockets full of greenbacks. Obama's running this country, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on May 10, 2022, 07:48:19 AM
Really? Chit man, do you actually believe what you wrote? All he is capable of caring about is the title of "President" and loading his pockets full of greenbacks. Obama's running this country, hey?
The irony of this statement is amazing considering who you voted for in the last election. Honestly, I am floored that you are so blinded by this.
I needed a good laugh this morning, doc! Thanks! Lay off the nitrous, aina?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on May 10, 2022, 07:48:19 AM
Really? Chit man, do you actually believe what you wrote? All he is capable of caring about is the title of "President" and loading his pockets full of greenbacks. Obama's running this country, hey?
This is fucking awesome roqqet!
Criticism of Biden and his performance/policies is totally merited, IMO. I get it, I'm far from pleased with a lot of things.
But to counter that with "don't you with we still had Trump" or some sentiment that a continuation of the previous admin is so markedly better is just baffling to me.
Its like getting pneumonia whilst in recovery from successful cancer surgery. It sucks and you shouldn't have to get over pneumonia too, but you're not wishing you didn't have that surgery...
Biden can certainly be criticized. As I said in that other thread before it was locked, he is who he has always been. He is an average politician who has been around forever and done things I like and things I don't like.
I stan for Javelin Joe.
Quote from: JWags85 on May 10, 2022, 11:51:23 AM
Criticism of Biden and his performance/policies is totally merited, IMO. I get it, I'm far from pleased with a lot of things.
But to counter that with "don't you with we still had Trump" or some sentiment that a continuation of the previous admin is so markedly better is just baffling to me.
Its like getting pneumonia whilst in recovery from successful cancer surgery. It sucks and you shouldn't have to get over pneumonia too, but you're not wishing you didn't have that surgery...
Do you believe Obama is actually running the country?
Quote from: jesmu84 on May 10, 2022, 04:56:15 PM
Do you believe Obama is actually running the country?
He doesn't have the time. He's too busy leading all the cannibal pedophiles who gather for daily meetings at Comet Ping Pong.
Quote from: jesmu84 on May 10, 2022, 04:56:15 PM
Do you believe Obama is actually running the country?
Where did I say that?
Quote from: JWags85 on May 10, 2022, 05:26:49 PM
Where did I say that?
You didn't. That's why I asked the question
"I'm just glad we have someone who seemingly cares about all Americans, not just the ones that make him look good or will grovel for his approval, and isn't an international embarrassment."
i really thought you were a little bit more aware then this sully...must be the university water err sompin cuz my nephews came home from school with the same delirium, dizziness and confusion symptoms. "international embarrassment"?? you get a chance to see australia's version of snl? saudi arabia had a good one too. for those of you in rio linda, it's stuff our comedians won't do for fear of having those abortion terrorists and/or will smith coming to their shows
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 10, 2022, 07:19:48 PM
"I'm just glad we have someone who seemingly cares about all Americans, not just the ones that make him look good or will grovel for his approval, and isn't an international embarrassment."
i really thought you were a little bit more aware then this sully...must be the university water err sompin cuz my nephews came home from school with the same delirium, dizziness and confusion symptoms. "international embarrassment"?? you get a chance to see australia's version of snl? saudi arabia had a good one too. for those of you in rio linda, it's stuff our comedians won't do for fear of having those abortion terrorists and/or will smith coming to their shows
9 of 10
I've contacted your children for your well-being
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 10, 2022, 07:19:48 PM
"I'm just glad we have someone who seemingly cares about all Americans, not just the ones that make him look good or will grovel for his approval, and isn't an international embarrassment."
i really thought you were a little bit more aware then this sully...must be the university water err sompin cuz my nephews came home from school with the same delirium, dizziness and confusion symptoms. "international embarrassment"?? you get a chance to see australia's version of snl? saudi arabia had a good one too. for those of you in rio linda, it's stuff our comedians won't do for fear of having those abortion terrorists and/or will smith coming to their shows
(https://gifimage.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/baffled-gif-6.gif)
pay attention to tiktok my friends
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 10, 2022, 10:37:44 PM
pay attention to tiktok my friends
The CCP data collection and propaganda tool?
Anybody else, I would have assumed the teal was implied. Alas....
Quote from: jesmu84 on May 10, 2022, 06:17:27 PM
You didn't. That's why I asked the question
Of course not...
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 10, 2022, 10:37:44 PM
pay attention to tiktok my friends
Put this in the hall of fame
I leave tiktok to my kids.
The unfortunate thing about TikTok is that is spreads information to its users like wildfire.
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on May 11, 2022, 12:39:17 PM
The unfortunate thing about TikTok is that is spreads information to its users like wildfire.
The scope is truly remarkable.
If you have over 100K IG followers, you're likely somebody of note, however silly it may be. Usually in the non-social media realm that spiked your followers, or you worked really hard to cultivate followers.
TikTok? Countless people with 1M++ followers who are literal nobodies or average college students. My sister jokingly made a TikTok for her dog, posted pretty regularly for a few weeks. Used popular sounds and hashtags and the account have close to a quarter million followers before she got bored with it. Its absolutely nuts.
Quote from: JWags85 on May 11, 2022, 04:57:27 PM
The scope is truly remarkable.
If you have over 100K IG followers, you're likely somebody of note, however silly it may be. Usually in the non-social media realm that spiked your followers, or you worked really hard to cultivate followers.
TikTok? Countless people with 1M++ followers who are literal nobodies or average college students. My sister jokingly made a TikTok for her dog, posted pretty regularly for a few weeks. Used popular sounds and hashtags and the account have close to a quarter million followers before she got bored with it. Its absolutely nuts.
Agreed. And it is consumed and forgotten in less than 24 hours, so trying to police disinformation is totally impossible. And it preys on humans with short attention spans.
If I were creating the perfect propaganda distribution system.
Quote from: JWags85 on May 11, 2022, 04:57:27 PM
The scope is truly remarkable.
If you have over 100K IG followers, you're likely somebody of note, however silly it may be. Usually in the non-social media realm that spiked your followers, or you worked really hard to cultivate followers.
TikTok? Countless people with 1M++ followers who are literal nobodies or average college students. My sister jokingly made a TikTok for her dog, posted pretty regularly for a few weeks. Used popular sounds and hashtags and the account have close to a quarter million followers before she got bored with it. Its absolutely nuts.
Agreed, engagement on TikTok is insane as well. I've had to get familiar with it for work and the algorithm is much better than Instagram. They do an incredible job of showing you videos you want to see and share with your friends. I can see how it'd be a problem if certain topics were trending. There's been a history of this.
Maybe your sister just has zero interest in doing this at all and may very well be aware of it already, but with an animal account of that size she's sitting on a pretty easily doable six figures a year. In any case, the opportunities TikTok presents shouldn't be understated or dismissed. I have a few who have capitalized tremendously on it, but like anything worthwhile it comes with it's own challenges and stress.
I follow a lot of broads in tik tok who have giant cans
Quote from: Uncle Rico on May 11, 2022, 06:14:19 PM
I follow a lot of broads in tik tok who have giant cans
They making chili or soup? Or a good sauce?
Meatpackers hyped 'baseless' shortage to keep plants open amid covid
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2022/05/12/meatpackers-covid-deaths-trump-industry/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F36d23a8%2F627d2edb956121755a7547bb%2F5f8d147cae7e8a56e5b732a4%2F10%2F72%2F627d2edb956121755a7547bb
The biggest players in the U.S. meat industry pressed "baseless" claims of beef and pork shortages early in the pandemic to persuade the Trump White House to keep processing plants running, disregarding the coronavirus risks that eventually killed at least 269 workers, according to a special House committee investigating the nation's pandemic response.
In a report released Thursday, the committee alleges that Tyson Foods's legal team prepared a draft with input from other companies that became the basis for an executive order to keep the plants open that the Trump administration issued in April 2020, making it difficult for workers to stay home.
"Meatpacking companies knew the risk posed by the coronavirus to their workers and knew it wasn't a risk that the country needed them to take," according to the report by the select subcommittee on the coronavirus crisis. "They nonetheless lobbied aggressively — successfully enlisting [the U.S. Agriculture Department] as a close collaborator in their efforts — to keep workers on the job in unsafe conditions, to ensure state and local health authorities were powerless to mandate otherwise, and to be protected against legal liability for the harms that would result."
Getting back to the actual topic of the thread, last night's White House Twitter Account tweeted, "When President Biden took office, millions were unemployed and there was no vaccine available."
600,000 dead on his watch. Handed 2 vaccines, hey?
#Buffoon
Quote from: 4everwarriors on May 13, 2022, 12:04:09 PM
Handed 2 vaccines, hey?
If only the easily conned cultists who worship at the altar of twin gods Trump and Tucker had actually gotten vaccinated, deaths and hospitalizations would have been hundreds of thousands lower.
And if only your main god had followed the pandemic playbook he was handed and then didn't pretend a killer virus was the flu, the whole situation would have been a bazillion times better.
But you already knew that, being that you're a health-care professional, nu?
Quote from: Lighthouse 84 on May 13, 2022, 11:57:10 AM
Getting back to the actual topic of the thread, last night's White House Twitter Account tweeted, "When President Biden took office, millions were unemployed and there was no vaccine available."
That's just stoopid. They're getting slammed bigly for it, and deservedly so.
I guess those that taken ivermectin to treat covid aren't full of crap.
https://twitter.com/BagdMilkSoWhat/status/1526178436619718658?s=20&t=TEfUNYZsQ18sQDcZH-rTLg
Quote from: pbiflyer on May 16, 2022, 01:52:26 PM
I guess those that taken ivermectin to treat covid aren't full of crap.
https://twitter.com/BagdMilkSoWhat/status/1526178436619718658?s=20&t=TEfUNYZsQ18sQDcZH-rTLg
You're sh!ttin' me!
The jokes just keep writing themselves.
Quote from: pbiflyer on May 16, 2022, 01:52:26 PM
I guess those that taken ivermectin to treat covid aren't full of crap.
https://twitter.com/BagdMilkSoWhat/status/1526178436619718658?s=20&t=TEfUNYZsQ18sQDcZH-rTLg
That's horse crap.
Quote from: pbiflyer on May 16, 2022, 01:52:26 PM
I guess those that taken ivermectin to treat covid aren't full of crap.
https://twitter.com/BagdMilkSoWhat/status/1526178436619718658?s=20&t=TEfUNYZsQ18sQDcZH-rTLg
You laugh now but just wait
Might as well drop this here:
MELBOURNE, Australia — If the United States had the same COVID death rate as Australia, about 900,000 lives would have been saved.
Damien Cave
Mon, May 16, 2022, 7:00 AM
A bar at St. Kilda Beach in Melbourne, Australia, March 27, 2022. (Asanka Brendon Ratnayake/The New York Times)
A bar at St. Kilda Beach in Melbourne, Australia, March 27, 2022. (Asanka Brendon Ratnayake/The New York Times)
MELBOURNE, Australia — If the United States had the same COVID death rate as Australia, about 900,000 lives would have been saved.
For many Americans, imagining what might have been will be painful. But especially now, at the milestone of 1 million deaths in the United States, the nations that did a better job of keeping people alive show what Americans could have done differently and what might still need to change.
Australia offers perhaps the sharpest comparisons with the American experience. Both countries are English-speaking democracies with similar demographic profiles. In Australia and in the United States, the median age is 38. Roughly 86% of Australians live in urban areas, compared with 83% of Americans.
Yet Australia's COVID death rate sits at one-tenth of America's, putting the nation of 25 million people (with around 7,500 deaths) near the top of global rankings in the protection of life.
Australia's location in the distant Pacific is often cited as the cause for its relative COVID success. That, however, does not fully explain the difference in outcomes between the two countries, since Australia has long been, like the United States, highly connected to the world through trade, tourism and immigration. In 2019, 9.5 million international tourists came to Australia.
So what went right in Australia and wrong in the United States?
It looks obvious: Australia restricted travel and personal interaction until vaccinations were widely available, then maximized vaccine uptake, prioritizing people who were most vulnerable before gradually opening up the country again.
From one outbreak to another, there were also some mistakes. And with omicron and eased restrictions, deaths have increased.
But Australia's COVID playbook produced results because of something more easily felt than analyzed at a news conference. Dozens of interviews, along with survey data and scientific studies from around the world, point to a lifesaving trait that Australians displayed from the top of government to the hospital floor and that Americans have shown they lack: trust, in science and institutions, but especially in one another.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/australia-saved-thousands-lives-while-120039853.html
Quote from: Uncle Rico on May 16, 2022, 05:03:37 PM
You laugh now but just wait
as i've been trying to tell ya'll-ivermectin with other drugs(multi drug therapy) has been proven to be effective against covid. problem, people like you who laugh it off, label people like me crazy and minimize the schiff out of anyone or anything that is said about it. it is criticism such as this which prohibits many times, good debate or studies showing the efficacy of something otherwise shouted down to be "snake oil". there have been multiple multidrug therapies developed and hopefully more to come. i realize some here with science backgrounds are waiting for these double-blind studies etc, but those, although boosting the credibility in some eyes, are not always all they are cracked up to be. also, as covid evolved so rapidly, we were not afforded the time it takes to complete studies as such. these studies that have been able to see the light of day and slip thru the "alphabet soup" of the internet have shown to be very effective improving O2 saturation and preventing deaths in those acutely infected preventing hospitalizations and death. and no, they haven't been widely reported by msm...surprise. probably b/c it's too complicated for their audience
here are just 2 examples i've been following-
1) ivermectin, doxycycline, zinc, vitamins D & C
2) ivermectin, azithromycin, monteluklast and acetylsalicylic acid
https://www.futuremedicine.com/doi/10.2217/fmb-2022-0014
https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(21)00100-4/pdf
go ahead and beat them up, but if i'm sick with this thing, i'm calling a doc who knows how to and is allowed to administer this regimen
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 16, 2022, 07:45:31 PM
as i've been trying to tell ya'll-ivermectin with other drugs(multi drug therapy) has been proven to be effective against covid. problem, people like you who laugh it off, label people like me crazy and minimize the schiff out of anyone or anything that is said about it. it is criticism such as this which prohibits many times, good debate or studies showing the efficacy of something otherwise shouted down to be "snake oil". there have been multiple multidrug therapies developed and hopefully more to come. i realize some here with science backgrounds are waiting for these double-blind studies etc, but those, although boosting the credibility in some eyes, are not always all they are cracked up to be. also, as covid evolved so rapidly, we were not afforded the time it takes to complete studies as such. these studies that have been able to see the light of day and slip thru the "alphabet soup" of the internet have shown to be very effective improving O2 saturation and preventing deaths in those acutely infected preventing hospitalizations and death. and no, they haven't been widely reported by msm...surprise. probably b/c it's too complicated for their audience
here are just 2 examples i've been following-
1) ivermectin, doxycycline, zinc, vitamins D & C
2) ivermectin, azithromycin, monteluklast and acetylsalicylic acid
https://www.futuremedicine.com/doi/10.2217/fmb-2022-0014
https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(21)00100-4/pdf
go ahead and beat them up, but if i'm sick with this thing, i'm calling a doc who knows how to and is allowed to administer this regimen
Solid 9 out of 10. Hit a lot of your specialties. Very impressive work.
Study: Two-thirds of people who took ivermectin have long-term health issues as a result.
roqqet: "See? I told you guys it worked."
Quote from: tower912 on May 16, 2022, 03:27:13 PM
The jokes just keep writing themselves.
You do realize this was not a real thing but indeed a joke right?
Wasn't sure if pbi posted it in the misinformation thread sincerely because it was a made up screenshot (thus misinformation) and wanted to poke fun at people to get a laugh at the same time or if he too was also fooled thinking it was real?
Confirmation bias can be a powerful thing.....or so I've been told.
Ok, so Pace and rocket still on the horse dewormer train. got it. Take all you can get boys!
you're missing the point once again here rock and all you're doing is rousing your crowd. you guys have such a bias that it works detrimentally against ALL new information coming. some of this information could actually prove to benefit many, possibly even save their lives. if that's how you guys operate, God help us all.
does it work for everyone? probably not, but does the vaccine(s) double, triple vax work for all? did they willfully report all the side effects of the vaccines?
some of these other drugs have been shot down before they were even given a chance. the doctors who think outside the box found that when given in combinations with other adjuncts(vitamins, zinc, z-pak, etc) at varying levels in patients with differing viral loads have benefited. isn't this a better potential scenario opposed to those that have unnecessarily suffered, taken up hospital beds and/or died? that's a question that has not allowed to be answered because the advocates have controlled the narrative. how they sleep at night escapes me. you short minded fools continue to refer to ivermectin as "horse dewormer"? you do realize there are treatment guidelines, indications and dosage guidelines for humans, right? the original purpose of acetylsalicylic acid was pain relief, fever reducer and anti-inflammatory. a very useful "side effect" became evident-blood thinning
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 17, 2022, 06:02:39 AM
you're missing the point once again here rock and all you're doing is rousing your crowd. you guys have such a bias that it works detrimentally against ALL new information coming. some of this information could actually prove to benefit many, possibly even save their lives. if that's how you guys operate, God help us all.
does it work for everyone? probably not, but does the vaccine(s) double, triple vax work for all? did they willfully report all the side effects of the vaccines?
some of these other drugs have been shot down before they were even given a chance. the doctors who think outside the box found that when given in combinations with other adjuncts(vitamins, zinc, z-pak, etc) at varying levels in patients with differing viral loads have benefited. isn't this a better potential scenario opposed to those that have unnecessarily suffered, taken up hospital beds and/or died? that's a question that has not allowed to be answered because the advocates have controlled the narrative. how they sleep at night escapes me. you short minded fools continue to refer to ivermectin as "horse dewormer"? you do realize there are treatment guidelines, indications and dosage guidelines for humans, right? the original purpose of acetylsalicylic acid was pain relief, fever reducer and anti-inflammatory. a very useful "side effect" became evident-blood thinning
It all makes sense now. You're a talking horse
Free country, free choice, but if I start experiencing symptoms of the coco, first call to my doctor is to get paxlovid.
roqqet: You guys are so biased you ignore all new information
Scientific Community: Ever single trial run shows that ivermectin has no positive effect against COVID
roqqet: It's a conspiracy! Findings are being suppressed! Besides, scientific studies aren't really needed.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 17, 2022, 06:02:39 AM
you're missing the point once again here rock and all you're doing is rousing your crowd. you guys have such a bias that it works detrimentally against ALL new information coming. some of this information could actually prove to benefit many, possibly even save their lives. if that's how you guys operate, God help us all.
does it work for everyone? probably not, but does the vaccine(s) double, triple vax work for all? did they willfully report all the side effects of the vaccines?
some of these other drugs have been shot down before they were even given a chance. the doctors who think outside the box found that when given in combinations with other adjuncts(vitamins, zinc, z-pak, etc) at varying levels in patients with differing viral loads have benefited. isn't this a better potential scenario opposed to those that have unnecessarily suffered, taken up hospital beds and/or died? that's a question that has not allowed to be answered because the advocates have controlled the narrative. how they sleep at night escapes me. you short minded fools continue to refer to ivermectin as "horse dewormer"? you do realize there are treatment guidelines, indications and dosage guidelines for humans, right? the original purpose of acetylsalicylic acid was pain relief, fever reducer and anti-inflammatory. a very useful "side effect" became evident-blood thinning
1st: Yes, you're right, WE'RE the ones with the bias.
2nd: All Information Matters... shocking.
3rd: This hokum has been studied at length and there is no value to it.
I'm sorry you've tied your personality to a bunch of quacks, but it's probably time to accept that you've been misled. No one here need you to apologize, but for the love of God, just stop defending it.
Use of Paxlovid, the oral antiviral developed by Pfizer (NYSE:PFE), has increased 315% over the past four weeks, the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services announced on Tuesday.
According to a senior health official, nearly 115,000 Paxlovid courses were dispensed during the first week of May. A total of 668,954 courses out of over two million doses ordered by pharmacies were administered, Reuters reported.
The department continues to increase the accessibility to the drug after the FDA authorized it in December for high-risk adults with COVID-19 who are more susceptible to the severe form of the disease .
"In recent weeks we've gone from 20,000 sites with Paxlovid to approximately 35,000 and we'll keep working to increase availability," the official told reports.
https://seekingalpha.com/news/3840191-pfizer-covid-19-antiviral-use-jumps-over-300-us-health-department?mailingid=27747714&messageid=2900&serial=27747714.27081&utm_campaign=rta-stock-news&utm_content=link-1&utm_medium=email&utm_source=seeking_alpha&utm_term=27747714.27081
Well, it's no horse de-wormer, but it'll have to do.
when a taxi cab driver and a "journalist" and a whatever the hell he is laughs off your posts, ya know you're on the right track
cost of paxlovid~$18/pill
treat mild to moderate cases
cost of ivermectin~ $3/pill
treats moderate to severe cases-you know, saves lives and keeps hospitals clear
the the the that's all fokes
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 17, 2022, 05:03:40 PM
when a taxi cab driver and a "journalist" and a whatever the hell he is laughs off your posts, ya know you're on the right track
cost of paxlovid~$18/pill
treat mild to moderate cases
cost of ivermectin~ $3/pill
treats moderate to severe cases-you know, saves lives and keeps hospitals clear
the the the that's all fokes
Source?
And remember, Facebook is not a source.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 17, 2022, 05:03:40 PM
when a taxi cab driver and a "journalist" and a whatever the hell he is laughs off your posts, ya know you're on the right track
cost of paxlovid~$18/pill
treat mild to moderate cases
cost of ivermectin~ $3/pill
treats moderate to severe cases-you know, saves lives and keeps hospitals clear
the the the that's all fokes
Hasn't most the research said ivermectin with other drugs can be effective? Which begs the question of whether it would be just as effective without the ivermectin. But doesn't that change your math?
Quote from: tower912 on May 17, 2022, 05:14:32 PM
And remember, Facebook is not a source.
Would love to know the sourcing you used to verify that ivermectin pooping your pants story? Facebook, Twitter...
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 17, 2022, 06:02:39 AM
you're missing the point once again here rock and all you're doing is rousing your crowd. you guys have such a bias that it works detrimentally against ALL new information coming. some of this information could actually prove to benefit many, possibly even save their lives. if that's how you guys operate, God help us all.
does it work for everyone? probably not, but does the vaccine(s) double, triple vax work for all? did they willfully report all the side effects of the vaccines?
some of these other drugs have been shot down before they were even given a chance. the doctors who think outside the box found that when given in combinations with other adjuncts(vitamins, zinc, z-pak, etc) at varying levels in patients with differing viral loads have benefited. isn't this a better potential scenario opposed to those that have unnecessarily suffered, taken up hospital beds and/or died? that's a question that has not allowed to be answered because the advocates have controlled the narrative. how they sleep at night escapes me. you short minded fools continue to refer to ivermectin as "horse dewormer"? you do realize there are treatment guidelines, indications and dosage guidelines for humans, right? the original purpose of acetylsalicylic acid was pain relief, fever reducer and anti-inflammatory. a very useful "side effect" became evident-blood thinning
With all due respect Rocket, this is false. They have been extensively, and rigorously tested. They just show no efficacy.
Most of the doctors that were peddling these "cures" did so for financial purposes. They did a 5 minute phone/zoom screen, zero tests to even confirm COVID, and prescribed them a cocktail. Charged them a good chunk of cash for the phone/zoom screen and made a small fortune.
Many of them were scam artists. There were other doctors that legitimately bought into the hoopla and were trying to help their patients, but were also just victims of a scam.
I'd love for them to have worked. And in the very very early days there were some suggestions they could work, but actual trials quickly showed that wasn't the case. It is time that people put this to rest, it is now just likely to harm people.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 17, 2022, 05:03:40 PM
when a taxi cab driver and a "journalist" and a whatever the hell he is laughs off your posts, ya know you're on the right track
cost of paxlovid~$18/pill
treat mild to moderate cases
cost of ivermectin~ $3/pill
treats moderate to severe cases-you know, saves lives and keeps hospitals clear
the the the that's all fokes
when a "health care professional" pushes horse de-wormer, which has been discredited by actual health care professionals, ya know you're on the right track
cost of ivermectin - $3/pill
cost of bleach - 50 cents/cup
the choice of orange-hued buffons, and keeps hospitals clear because everybody who takes it dies quickly
duck season wabbit season fokes
Quote from: pacearrow02 on May 17, 2022, 08:30:49 PM
Would love to know the sourcing you used to verify that ivermectin pooping your pants story? Facebook, Twitter...
The onion
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 17, 2022, 06:02:39 AM
you're missing the point once again here rock and all you're doing is rousing your crowd. you guys have such a bias that it works detrimentally against ALL new information coming. some of this information could actually prove to benefit many, possibly even save their lives. if that's how you guys operate, God help us all.
does it work for everyone? probably not, but does the vaccine(s) double, triple vax work for all? did they willfully report all the side effects of the vaccines?
some of these other drugs have been shot down before they were even given a chance. the doctors who think outside the box found that when given in combinations with other adjuncts(vitamins, zinc, z-pak, etc) at varying levels in patients with differing viral loads have benefited. isn't this a better potential scenario opposed to those that have unnecessarily suffered, taken up hospital beds and/or died? that's a question that has not allowed to be answered because the advocates have controlled the narrative. how they sleep at night escapes me. you short minded fools continue to refer to ivermectin as "horse dewormer"? you do realize there are treatment guidelines, indications and dosage guidelines for humans, right? the original purpose of acetylsalicylic acid was pain relief, fever reducer and anti-inflammatory. a very useful "side effect" became evident-blood thinning
Here's my bias. When I walked into one of the 300+ COVID patient rooms I've been in, I saw lots of Remdesivir and Dexamethasone. No Ivermectin. My "bias" is that I'm working with hospitalists, pharmacists and pulmonologists who know way more about then I do. So I trust them. And then they have to deal with family members who want all of these other treatments which don't work. It takes precious time to deal with all of it.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on May 17, 2022, 05:03:40 PM
when a taxi cab driver and a "journalist" and a whatever the hell he is laughs off your posts, ya know you're on the right track
cost of paxlovid~$18/pill
treat mild to moderate cases
cost of ivermectin~ $3/pill
treats moderate to severe cases-you know, saves lives and keeps hospitals clear
the the the that's all fokes
I see I have triggered you. Again, they should revoke your license for your medical quack advice you continue to espouse.
Quote from: MUDPT on May 18, 2022, 09:23:06 AM
Here's my bias. When I walked into one of the 300+ COVID patient rooms I've been in, I saw lots of Remdesivir and Dexamethasone. No Ivermectin. My "bias" is that I'm working with hospitalists, pharmacists and pulmonologists who know way more about then I do. So I trust them. And then they have to deal with family members who want all of these other treatments which don't work. It takes precious time to deal with all of it.
So we're supposed to believe a doctor like you and others who have made studying these things their lives' work when we could be believing interwebs guys who use ALM in their screen names, Fox News "talent," Aaron Rodgers and Alex Jones? What a ridiculous take.
Yet another anti-vax talking point debunked.
https://twitter.com/sciam/status/1530911796315529216?s=21&t=vHXNwOm4kKSjSPUusS5hRA
From the NYT's David Leonhardt:
One of the defining characteristics of the pandemic's early stages was its disproportionate toll on Black and Latino Americans.
But these large racial gaps in vaccination have not continued — and as a result, neither have the gaps in Covid death rates.
Instead, Covid's racial gaps have narrowed and, more recently, even flipped. Over the past year, the Covid death rate for white Americans has been 14 percent higher than the rate for Black Americans and 72 percent higher than the Latino rate, according to the latest C.D.C. data.
The successful part of the story is the rapid increase in vaccination among Black and Latino Americans since last year. Today, the vaccination rate for both groups is slightly higher than it is for white Americans, according to the Kaiser Family Foundation's surveys. That has happened thanks to intense outreach efforts by medical workers, community organizers and others.
The narrowing of Covid's gaps does involve some bad news: The share of white Americans who have received a Covid vaccine shot has barely budged since last summer.
The main culprit is politics. Only about 60 percent of Republican adults are vaccinated, compared with about 75 percent of independents and more than 90 percent of Democrats, according to Kaiser. And Republicans are both disproportionately white and older. Together, these facts help explain why the white death rate has recently been higher than the Asian, Black or Latino rate.
In heavily conservative, white communities, leaders have not done as good a job explaining the vaccine's benefits — and Covid's risks — as leaders in Black and Latino communities. Instead, many conservative media figures, politicians, clergy members and others have amplified false or misleading information about the vaccines. Millions of Americans, in turn, have chosen not to receive a lifesaving shot. Some have paid with their lives.
Quote from: forgetful on May 17, 2022, 08:59:21 PM
With all due respect Rocket
Winner, winner. Chicken dinner!!
Funniest post of the week.
Ivermectin doesn't lower hospitalization or death risk from COVID, study finds
https://seekingalpha.com/news/3848165-ivermectin-doesnt-lower-hospitalization-or-death-risk-from-covid-study-says?mailingid=28042808&messageid=2900&serial=28042808.2110&utm_campaign=rta-stock-news&utm_content=link-1&utm_medium=email&utm_source=seeking_alpha&utm_term=28042808.2110
A placebo-controlled study of nearly 1600 individuals found that the antiparasitic medicine ivermectin does not lower the incidence of hospitalization or death from COVID-19.
The results, published on medRxiv and yet to be peer reviewed, found that ivermectin taken for three days led to a shortening of symptoms of less than one day.
About half of the participants had received at least two COVID vaccine doses.
Researchers noted that subgroup analyses and the data suggest examining ivermectin in a higher dose and for a longer duration.
Ivermectin is not authorized or approved by the U.S. FDA as a COVID treatment.
Authorized or approved COVID treatments include Pfizer's (NYSE:PFE) Paxlovid, Merck's (NYSE:MRK) Lagevrio (molnupiravir), Gilead Sciences' (NASDAQ:GILD) Veklury (remdesivir), Eli Lilly's (NYSE:LLY) bebtelovimab, and AstraZeneca's (AZN) Evusheld.
A study of 3.5K patients published in late March in the New England Journal of Medicine also found that ivermectin didn't lower hospitalization risk.
Put this under the "Well, duh!" file.
Horse de-wormers are for de-worming horses.
Keep Fr. Fauci in your thoughts, for he tested positive for the chit, hey?
A good man who has worked hard for the good of our country. I trust vaccines will keep his symptoms mild and manageable.
Quote from: tower912 on June 15, 2022, 04:15:09 PM
A good man who has worked hard for the good of our country. I trust vaccines will keep his symptoms mild and manageable.
Did you raise your nose and sniff whilst you typed this?
Talk about dropping bags, aina?
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on June 15, 2022, 06:19:41 PM
Did you raise your nose and sniff whilst you typed this?
Nah. Just ran out the door on yet another unvaccinated soul trying to die.
Hoo boy ....
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/justice-thomas-cites-debunked-claim-covid-vaccines-are-made-cells-abor-rcna36156
Quote from: Pakuni on June 30, 2022, 06:42:29 PM
Hoo boy ....
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/justice-thomas-cites-debunked-claim-covid-vaccines-are-made-cells-abor-rcna36156
Yup, that guy is on the supreme court
Quote from: Pakuni on June 30, 2022, 06:42:29 PM
Hoo boy ....
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/justice-thomas-cites-debunked-claim-covid-vaccines-are-made-cells-abor-rcna36156
I think the headline is wrong. From the article, bolded for emphasis.
"Thomas, citing the plaintiffs, wrote that the health care workers "object" to the state's vaccine mandate "on religious grounds to all available COVID–19 vaccines because
they were developed using cell lines derived from aborted children."
Pfizer and Moderna used fetal cell lines early in their Covid vaccine development to test the efficacy of their formulas, as other vaccines have in the past. The fetal tissue used in these processes came from elective abortions that happened decades ago. But the cells have since replicated many times, so none of the original tissue is involved in the making of modern vaccines."
So isn't he right? They were developed from cell LINES derived from aborted children.
Unforgivably stupid.
Quote from: tower912 on June 30, 2022, 07:35:16 PM
Unforgivably stupid.
But Thomas was right?
Not in his ruling, but his assertion about the origin of the cell lines.
Quote from: User Name #251 on June 30, 2022, 08:14:52 PM
But Thomas was right?
Not in his ruling, but his assertion about the origin of the cell lines.
Only if you use really broad definition of "developed," one that the scientists themselves don't use.
Neither Pfizer or Moderna used cell lines that originated from aborted fetus to create their vaccines. The vaccines were developed. i.e. produced, without those cell lines.
Those cell lines were used as part of the testing of the vaccines, after they were created.
Now, if you want to argue that testing = developed ... well, OK. But that's not how the scientists would describe "Developed" and it's worth noting that even the Vatican and U.S, Conference of Bishops distinguish between Moderna/Pfizer and Johnson & Johnson, which was developed, i.e. produced, with fetal cell lines.
Quote from: Pakuni on June 30, 2022, 08:41:00 PM
Only if you use really broad definition of "developed," one that the scientists themselves don't use.
Neither Pfizer or Moderna used cell lines that originated from aborted fetus to create their vaccines. The vaccines were developed. i.e. produced, without those cell lines.
Those cell lines were used as part of the testing of the vaccines, after they were created.
Now, if you want to argue that testing = developed ... well, OK. But that's not how the scientists would describe "Developed" and it's worth noting that even the Vatican and U.S, Conference of Bishops distinguish between Moderna/Pfizer and Johnson & Johnson, which was developed, i.e. produced, with fetal cell lines.
Thank you for the explanation.
Quote from: User Name #251 on June 30, 2022, 08:43:05 PM
Thank you for the explanation.
One caveat.... this is based on what I've read, and there are likely much smarter people here who can speak to it.
Quote from: Pakuni on June 30, 2022, 08:52:31 PM
One caveat.... this is based on what I've read, and there are likely much smarter people here who can speak to it.
Your assessment and description is correct.
The vaccines were not developed using/from cell lines. They were tested with cell lines.
The same is true for the majority of drugs an individual takes. Odds are, at some point, testing used similar cell lines.
As a follow up. Those with issues regarding the COVID vaccine because of the use of cells from an aborted fetus (note: we do not know if it was a miscarriage or elective abortion), should also avoid the following medications.
Acetaminophen
Ibuprofen
Aspirin
Naproxen
Claritin
essentially every cough medicine found over the counter
Benadryl
Not to mention the following drugs popular amongst the antivax crowd.
Hydroxychloroquine
Ivermectin
Azithromycin
And a massive list of others. So if they are avoiding the vaccine, because of religious reasons, they better be avoiding all of the above too (note: some of these drugs predate the cell line, but were nonetheless tested on them later).
So sad, da Buffoon has da chit. Eye hope he'll bea ok, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on July 21, 2022, 09:52:26 AM
So sad, da Buffoon has da chit. Eye hope he'll bea ok, hey?
TFG has it again?
How kan dat bea? He sed a yeer ago dat does vaccinated kant get da chit. Heer he's xtra kareful and everythin'. Hope he's okay, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on July 30, 2022, 02:41:08 PM
How kan dat bea? He sed a yeer ago dat does vaccinated kant get da chit. Heer he's xtra kareful and everythin'. Hope he's okay, hey?
Paxlovid rebound is happening a lot. All of this is happening because we are combatting a virus that is less than 3 years old. It's amazing that we even have vaccines and anti-virals for it already.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on July 30, 2022, 02:41:08 PM
How kan dat bea? He sed a yeer ago dat does vaccinated kant get da chit. Heer he's xtra kareful and everythin'. Hope he's okay, hey?
It's unfair to use his own words: I know when I got it despite three shots I wasn't asking how it happened since I was told by my leaders I wouldn't COVID.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/biden-if-vaccinated-wont-get-covid/
BIDEN: Well, the virus — look, it's real simple. We have a pandemic for those who haven't gotten a vaccination. It's that basic, that simple. Ten thousand people have recently died; 9,950 of them, thereabouts, are people who hadn't been vaccinated.
This is a simple, basic proposition. If you're vaccinated, you're not going to be hospitalized, you're not going to be in an ICU unit, and you are not going to die.
[...]
But, again, one last thing. We don't talk enough to you about this, I don't think. One last thing that's really important is, we're not in the position where we think that any virus, including the Delta virus, which is much more transmissible and more deadly in terms of unvaccinated people, the — the various shots that people are getting now cover that. You're OK. You're not going to — you're not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations.
Quote from: Billy Hoyle on July 31, 2022, 10:57:09 PM
It's unfair to use his own words: I know when I got it despite three shots I wasn't asking how it happened since I was told by my leaders I wouldn't COVID.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/biden-if-vaccinated-wont-get-covid/
BIDEN: Well, the virus — look, it's real simple. We have a pandemic for those who haven't gotten a vaccination. It's that basic, that simple. Ten thousand people have recently died; 9,950 of them, thereabouts, are people who hadn't been vaccinated.
This is a simple, basic proposition. If you're vaccinated, you're not going to be hospitalized, you're not going to be in an ICU unit, and you are not going to die.
[...]
But, again, one last thing. We don't talk enough to you about this, I don't think. One last thing that's really important is, we're not in the position where we think that any virus, including the Delta virus, which is much more transmissible and more deadly in terms of unvaccinated people, the — the various shots that people are getting now cover that. You're OK. You're not going to — you're not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations.
Clearly he overstated it because it was stated many times it wasn't 100% effective. Also this..
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/united-states-rates-of-covid-19-deaths-by-vaccination-status?time=2021-12-04..2022-04-09&country=~All+ages
Maebea he misreddit, aina?
#freerocket2022
They said this variant, which didn't exist when the vaccines were created, could avoid the vaccines. It did. Variants and timing.
I caught the original omicron variant over Christmas. My second time having it. I had received my third shot in early October, prior to the omicron variant, which became prevalent through November and December. My wife and my dad both got their third shots in early December. CDC said the effectiveness of the third booster wore off after 10 weeks against omicron.
On Christmas day, we had guests in our house for the first time since it all started. They brought omicron as a gift. I caught it, but it was mild. I was at the end of the 10 week window. My wife and dad, both at 3 weeks, spent the exact same amount of time in the exact same proximity to our guests and did not catch it.
So, in my case, the CDC was precisely right about vaccine effectiveness and timing with variants.
So, I trust them when they say this latest variant eludes the vaccines.
Quote from: tower912 on August 01, 2022, 05:47:12 AM
They said this variant, which didn't exist when the vaccines were created, could avoid the vaccines. It did. Variants and timing.
I caught the original omicron variant over Christmas. My second time having it. I had received my third shot in early October, prior to the omicron variant, which became prevalent through November and December. My wife and my dad both got their third shots in early December. CDC said the effectiveness of the third booster wore off after 10 weeks against omicron.
On Christmas day, we had guests in our house for the first time since it all started. The brought omicron as a gift. I caught it, but it was mild. I was at the end if the 10 week window. My wife and dad, both at 3 weeks, spent the exact same amount of time in the exact same proximity to our guests and did not catch it.
So, in my case, the CDC was precisely right about vaccine effectiveness and timing with variants.
So, I trust them when they say this latest variant eludes the vaccines.
Yep yep.
Despite the relatively mild nature of this variant, there is still a difference in death rates between vaccinated and unvaccinated.
I'm vaxed and boosted. Got the booster in December.
I had what has to be this variant in late June. I had a very mild case and still managed to business travel in Europe. (I had no choice as it arrived the day after arriving.
Mu wife tested positive the day before I left.) Thank goodness I was not wiped out tired as part of the mild case. Sounds like the vax/boost worked just wine.
Quote from: tower912 on August 01, 2022, 05:47:12 AM
They said this variant, which didn't exist when the vaccines were created, could avoid the vaccines. It did. Variants and timing.
I caught the original omicron variant over Christmas. My second time having it. I had received my third shot in early October, prior to the omicron variant, which became prevalent through November and December. My wife and my dad both got their third shots in early December. CDC said the effectiveness of the third booster wore off after 10 weeks against omicron.
On Christmas day, we had guests in our house for the first time since it all started. They brought omicron as a gift. I caught it, but it was mild. I was at the end of the 10 week window. My wife and dad, both at 3 weeks, spent the exact same amount of time in the exact same proximity to our guests and did not catch it.
So, in my case, the CDC was precisely right about vaccine effectiveness and timing with variants.
So, I trust them when they say this latest variant eludes the vaccines.
Yes, the new omicron sub-variant does not care how many times you were boosted, or how many times you had COVID before, it can and will still infect you.
These escape variants exist because: 1) We cannot vaccinate the entire world fast enough. 2) Some idiots refuse to get the vaccine because of politics.
Why should Djokovic be banned from entering the USA and the illegal, unvaccinated can just walk across the US/Mexican border, hey?
#freerocket2022
Quote from: 4everwarriors on August 01, 2022, 07:02:39 PM
Why should Djokovic be banned from entering the USA and the illegal, unvaccinated can just walk across the US/Mexican border, hey?
#freerocket2022
Maybe his team should join a caravan
Quote from: JWags85 on August 01, 2022, 07:11:18 PM
Maybe his team should join a caravan
🚨🚨🚨CARAVAN ALERT🚨🚨🚨
Sorry if y'all can't admit to the hypocrisy in this, then y'all are blinded by donkey chit, aina?
#freerocket2022
Quote from: 4everwarriors on August 01, 2022, 07:22:19 PM
Sorry if y'all can't admit to the hypocrisy in this, then y'all are blinded by donkey chit, aina?
#freerocket2022
He's free to try to illegally cross the border and face any legal proceedings that would result. Pretty sure he isn't going to be playing in any tournaments after illegally entering the US, and without approval to work.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on August 01, 2022, 07:22:19 PM
Sorry if y'all can't admit to the hypocrisy in this, then y'all are blinded by donkey chit, aina?
#freerocket2022
He should get vaccinated. It's not complicated. Keep up the martyrdom!
Quote from: 4everwarriors on August 01, 2022, 07:22:19 PM
Sorry if y'all can't admit to the hypocrisy in this, then y'all are blinded by donkey chit, aina?
Do you not understand the definition of hypocrisy or something? Because no one here seems to be advocating for undocumented immigrants to be able to enter the country unvaccinated.
Quote from: Uncle Rico on August 01, 2022, 07:11:45 PM
🚨🚨🚨CARAVAN ALERT🚨🚨🚨
And the caravan is on its way
We won't see the mighty Djoker play
All because he refused the shot
Now he has to mule some pot
La, la, la, la
La, la la
(With all due respects to Van the Man)
Quote from: Sultan Sultanberger on August 01, 2022, 07:52:41 PM
Do you not understand the definition of hypocrisy or something? Because no one here seems to be advocating for undocumented immigrants to be able to enter the country unvaccinated.
No one seems to give a chit. It's happening by the thousands. I call that hypocrisy. What do you call it, hey?
#freerocket2022
Quote from: 4everwarriors on August 01, 2022, 08:00:15 PM
No one seems to give a chit. It's happening by the thousands. I call that hypocrisy. What do you call it, hey?
#freerocket2022
What does that have to do with vaccine misinformation and Djoker not taking the vaccine. Keep up the martyrdom!
Quote from: 4everwarriors on August 01, 2022, 08:00:15 PM
No one seems to give a chit. It's happening by the thousands. I call that hypocrisy. What do you call it, hey?
#freerocket2022
Yeah, you don't understand what hypocrisy is. Thanks for the confirmation.
Quote from: Sultan Sultanberger on August 01, 2022, 08:08:56 PM
Yeah, you don't understand what hypocrisy is. Thanks for the confirmation.
You whiffed on the new name - Sulty McSultanberger has a much nicer ring to it.
Quote from: Sultan Sultanberger on August 01, 2022, 08:08:56 PM
Yeah, you don't understand what hypocrisy is. Thanks for the confirmation.
You want to fight over the definition of a word rather than address substance/science. In what universe is public health better served by denying work to a young, healthy, daily testing world class athlete while allowing tens of thousands (hundreds of thousands?) of illegals to pour into the country untested and unvaccinated? Maybe that doesn't meet your definition of hypocrisy but how about anti science bat sh!t crazy?
Quote from: Lennys Tap on August 02, 2022, 08:44:34 AM
You want to fight over the definition of a word rather than address substance/science. In what universe is public health better served by denying work to a young, healthy, daily testing world class athlete while allowing tens of thousands (hundreds of thousands?) of illegals to pour into the country untested and unvaccinated? Maybe that doesn't meet your definition of hypocrisy but how about anti science bat sh!t crazy?
I don't care if Djoker can enter the country to play in the US Open. If the US changed their rules in that regard, you wouldn't hear a peep out of me.
I don't care one iota about the undocumented immigrant "problem." IMO it would be better for the country and the economy to accept more immigrants because historically population growth is a good indicator of economic growth. I think we should invite more in and give them access to our public schools and services. This would benefit the country greatly.
And I don't care if they are vaccinated or not, but I would certainly highly encourage them to get vaccinated as part of this process.
Does that address the substance/science enough for you?
Quote from: Sultan Sultanberger on August 02, 2022, 08:52:42 AM
I don't care if Djoker can enter the country to play in the US Open. If the US changed their rules in that regard, you wouldn't hear a peep out of me.
I don't care one iota about the undocumented immigrant "problem." IMO it would be better for the country and the economy to accept more immigrants because historically population growth is a good indicator of economic growth. I think we should invite more in and give them access to our public schools and services. This would benefit the country greatly.
And I don't care if they are vaccinated or not, but I would certainly highly encourage them to get vaccinated as part of this process.
Does that address the substance/science enough for you?
No
Quote from: forgetful on August 01, 2022, 06:46:15 PM
Yes, the new omicron sub-variant does not care how many times you were boosted, or how many times you had COVID before, it can and will still infect you.
These escape variants exist because: 1) We cannot vaccinate the entire world fast enough. 2) Some idiots refuse to get the vaccine because of politics.
Asking because I don't know. For your second point, would we be in the same scenario even if everyone was vaccinated? I thought this was kind of the natural progression of the virus as it tries to survive. More contagious, but less severe as we work our way toward the normal cold/flu type of illness.
Did the low vaccination rate prolong the amount of time it's taking to get to that point?
Quote from: cheebs09 on August 02, 2022, 12:02:03 PM
Asking because I don't know. For your second point, would we be in the same scenario even if everyone was vaccinated? I thought this was kind of the natural progression of the virus as it tries to survive. More contagious, but less severe as we work our way toward the normal cold/flu type of illness.
Did the low vaccination rate prolong the amount of time it's taking to get to that point?
Not speaking to the direct science of vaccination and spread, but I do think people overweight the US's vaccine status as it relates to the spread of COVID globally. Ive heard various first hand experiences, as well as experienced myself, all nature of absurd vaccine rule breaking in large population centers in countries all over, developed and otherwise.
My controller just returned from Indonesia and was telling me a bunch of vaccine mandatory stuff is a joke. He saw first hand, both at malls and other facilities, as well as at the damn airport, people flashing their phone home screen to the person checking your proof of vaccine, and being waved through. Other people scanned their QR code, it flashed red for outdated or missing vaccine, and they were ushered through. Similar stuff in India.
The US should be better for any myriad number of reasons, both during the height of COVID and now. But I hesitate to blame, too heavily, the less than 50MM US Adults for the global variant situation.
Quote from: cheebs09 on August 02, 2022, 12:02:03 PM
Asking because I don't know. For your second point, would we be in the same scenario even if everyone was vaccinated? I thought this was kind of the natural progression of the virus as it tries to survive. More contagious, but less severe as we work our way toward the normal cold/flu type of illness.
Did the low vaccination rate prolong the amount of time it's taking to get to that point?
Yes. Vaccinated people spread the virus at rates less then unvaccinated. The virus mutates as it infects more people. If literally everyone is vaccinated, the virus would still be spreading but at rates way less and less likely to mutate further.
Quote from: cheebs09 on August 02, 2022, 12:02:03 PM
Asking because I don't know. For your second point, would we be in the same scenario even if everyone was vaccinated? I thought this was kind of the natural progression of the virus as it tries to survive. More contagious, but less severe as we work our way toward the normal cold/flu type of illness.
Did the low vaccination rate prolong the amount of time it's taking to get to that point?
MUDPT already addressed much of this. Just wanted to add that the idea that viruses mutate to be less severe is not really true.
They mutate in general, it is a random process. Natural selection leads to a higher likelihood of surviving mutants that escape the immune system and spread more rapidly. Those mutations could make it more severe, or less severe. We've been fortunate that omicron variants have been less severe (but Delta was actually more severe), but it is not a natural trend.
Quote from: forgetful on August 02, 2022, 06:39:41 PM
MUDPT already addressed much of this. Just wanted to add that the idea that viruses mutate to be less severe is not really true.
They mutate in general, it is a random process. Natural selection leads to a higher likelihood of surviving mutants that escape the immune system and spread more rapidly. Those mutations could make it more severe, or less severe. We've been fortunate that omicron variants have been less severe (but Delta was actually more severe), but it is not a natural trend.
Appreciate the info forgetful and MUDPT!
More misinformation 🧐
See attached.
Would we be against using some of the discretionary funds attached to the recently passed bills for the vaccine injured?
::)
I have a coworker who has lost control over her motor skills and shows no signs of improving...she can barely walk. These effects showed up less than a week after first shot... The vaccine injured do exist and there should be help available... no question.
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 12, 2022, 09:28:51 PM
I have a coworker who has lost control over her motor skills and shows no signs of improving...she can barely walk. These effects showed up less than a week after first shot... The vaccine injured do exist and there should be help available... no question.
"I (supposedly) have an anecdotal story that proves my point even though I have no evidence that it does."
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 12, 2022, 09:28:51 PM
I have a coworker who has lost control over her motor skills and shows no signs of improving...she can barely walk. These effects showed up less than a week after first shot... The vaccine injured do exist and there should be help available... no question.
You have scales covering your eyes... so you believe there are no individuals suffering from serious adverse events from the mRNA vaccines?... none... it's all imaginary? Very interesting if so.
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 13, 2022, 07:57:14 PM
You have scales covering your eyes... so you believe there are no individuals suffering from serious adverse events from the mRNA vaccines?... none... it's all imaginary? Very interesting if so.
Lol. Can't even quote the right post.
Regardless I never said what you are claiming.
Quote from: Sultan Sultanberger on August 13, 2022, 08:24:53 PM
Lol. Can't even quote the right post.
Regardless I never said what you are claiming.
Hope I got the correct quote this time, lol.
You know, Sultan. You're a pretty passive aggressive dude. Yes, I assumed you gender even though that behavior trends female. So opine for a moment please. Could you find it reasonable for our Federal and some State governments to provide medical assistance to the mRNA vaccine injured? The previous and current administrations, with the recommendation from the CDC and with FDA approval, both pushed their constituents to vaccinate for the greater good. For many of these individuals, they'll be living with these effects for the rest of their life.... think burn pits.
I don't think this is unreasonable... but I guess that would mean a large portion of our bureaucratic establishment would need to admit to some not-so-comfortable truths about not only these vaccines but their policies.
Something similar to this fella;
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-man-vaccine-injury-payout-1.6472636
Who knows... maybe this could spur some unity in a currently divided country.
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 14, 2022, 09:16:45 AM
Hope I got the correct quote this time, lol.
You know, Sultan. You're a pretty passive aggressive dude. Yes, I assumed you gender even though that behavior trends female. So opine for a moment please. Could you find it reasonable for our Federal and some State governments to provide medical assistance to the mRNA vaccine injured? The previous and current administrations, with the recommendation from the CDC and with FDA approval, both pushed their constituents to vaccinate for the greater good. For many of these individuals, they'll be living with these effects for the rest of their life.... think burn pits.
I don't think this is unreasonable... but I guess that would mean a large portion of our bureaucratic establishment would need to admit to some not-so-comfortable truths about not only these vaccines but their policies.
Something similar to this fella;
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-man-vaccine-injury-payout-1.6472636
Who knows... maybe this could spur some unity in a currently divided country.
I think they should receive no more assistance than anyone else who has negative reactions to vaccines.
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 12, 2022, 08:13:34 PM
More misinformation 🧐
See attached.
Would we be against using some of the discretionary funds attached to the recently passed bills for the vaccine injured?
You need to read that article again. It doesn't prove what you think it does.
Quote from: Sultan Sultanberger on August 14, 2022, 09:33:35 AM
I think they should receive no more assistance than anyone else who has negative reactions to vaccines.
I would agree if these mRNA and other COVID-19 vaccines weren't in circulation under an EUA. It's my personal opinion that this is a significant difference between these two categories of vaccines.
Quote from: MUDPT on August 14, 2022, 09:48:15 PM
You need to read that article again. It doesn't prove what you think it does.
Mind reader? I'm not thinking it 'proves' anything. It's just data. We can make our own conclusions with reference to the authors'... which can differ, of course.
I'll admit, I'm not a cardiologist (let alone a rocket surgeon), but brushing off any of the carditises, even when recovered w/in 14 days of the onset of symptoms, as being insignificant and not something seriously worth monitoring moving forward would be short sighted. Are the any cardiologist MU grads willing to interject and ease my mind that having one of the carditis diagnosis is no big deal once the symptoms recede? If so, that's great, but I wouldn't think it would be. ~4.5 % of these teenagers were subject to a carditis... much higher rate than any deaths in these age groups from any version of this virus... the risk calculus here does not support vaccinating our yute (my opinion)... but this should be a personal choice anyway so we can make that decision for ourselves, or you would think so anyway.
Another anecdote if you please.. I have an 84 year old mother who is overweight and a two-time cancer survivor... has a pacemaker and just had a Watchmen implanted in her heart. We have her juiced to the roof and will likely continue to keep her that way. It only makes sense for her as she is in a very high risk demographic both in age and health.
I hope our federal and state health agencies can be a bit more dynamic in how they approach this virus moving forward. With the recent changes in the CDC's recommendations concerning the unvaxxed with antibodies, i think we are getting there... One size does not fit all.
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 15, 2022, 04:43:55 PM
I would agree if these mRNA and other COVID-19 vaccines weren't in circulation under an EUA. It's my personal opinion that this is a significant difference between these two categories of vaccines.
I disagree.
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 15, 2022, 05:30:28 PM
Mind reader? I'm not thinking it 'proves' anything. It's just data. We can make our own conclusions with reference to the authors'... which can differ, of course.
I'll admit, I'm not a cardiologist (let alone a rocket surgeon), but brushing off any of the carditises, even when recovered w/in 14 days of the onset of symptoms, as being insignificant and not something seriously worth monitoring moving forward would be short sighted. Are the any cardiologist MU grads willing to interject and ease my mind that having one of the carditis diagnosis is no big deal once the symptoms recede? If so, that's great, but I wouldn't think it would be. ~4.5 % of these teenagers were subject to a carditis... much higher rate than any deaths in these age groups from any version of this virus... the risk calculus here does not support vaccinating our yute (my opinion)... but this should be a personal choice anyway so we can make that decision for ourselves, or you would think so anyway.
Another anecdote if you please.. I have an 84 year old mother who is overweight and a two-time cancer survivor... has a pacemaker and just had a Watchmen implanted in her heart. We have her juiced to the roof and will likely continue to keep her that way. It only makes sense for her as she is in a very high risk demographic both in age and health.
I hope our federal and state health agencies can be a bit more dynamic in how they approach this virus moving forward. With the recent changes in the CDC's recommendations concerning the unvaxxed with antibodies, i think we are getting there... One size does not fit all.
Here is what you should interpret from the data. Tachycardia, shortness of breath, palpitation and chest pain are all subjective symptoms. They don't mean crap in 18 year old boys. Tachycardia and palpitation could literally happen when the hot tech puts the EKG sticker in your lower abdominal area, again in 18 year old boys. You are more likely to get any cardiac symptoms from unvaccinated COVID than from a vaccine. It's been proven in study after study.
Here's some anecdotal evidence for you. I've been in 350ish COVID patient rooms in 2.5 years. I can't think of more than a couple who have died from COVID after being vaccinated. Compared to the 20-30 that died pre vaccination. It's no contest. Vaccines work.
Quote from: MUDPT on August 15, 2022, 10:33:52 PM
Here is what you should interpret from the data. Tachycardia, shortness of breath, palpitation and chest pain are all subjective symptoms. They don't mean crap in 18 year old boys. Tachycardia and palpitation could literally happen when the hot tech puts the EKG sticker in your lower abdominal area, again in 18 year old boys. You are more likely to get any cardiac symptoms from unvaccinated COVID than from a vaccine. It's been proven in study after study.
Here's some anecdotal evidence for you. I've been in 350ish COVID patient rooms in 2.5 years. I can't think of more than a couple who have died from COVID after being vaccinated. Compared to the 20-30 that died pre vaccination. It's no contest. Vaccines work.
Take a listen to this commentary on said article; https://youtu.be/8ghdyIRg748. I think I'll take his interpretation over yours. Sure, the vaccine(s) are appropriate for certain demographics but the risk shouldn't out weight the benefits. You misunderstand me, I'm not saying don't vaccinate, I'm saying don't do any unnecessary harm. How many of the 20-30 that died were healthy teenage boys?
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 16, 2022, 08:46:11 AM
Take a listen to this commentary on said article; https://youtu.be/8ghdyIRg748. I think I'll take his interpretation over yours. Sure, the vaccine(s) are appropriate for certain demographics but the risk shouldn't out weight the benefits. You misunderstand me, I'm not saying don't vaccinate, I'm saying don't do any unnecessary harm. How many of the 20-30 that died were healthy teenage boys?
Yes, you certainly are following a credible source:
https://vinayprasadmdmph.substack.com/p/how-democracy-ends
https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/vinay-prasad-public-healths-mistruth-problem/
Congrats on your mind turning to mush.
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 16, 2022, 08:46:11 AM
Take a listen to this commentary on said article; https://youtu.be/8ghdyIRg748. I think I'll take his interpretation over yours. Sure, the vaccine(s) are appropriate for certain demographics but the risk shouldn't out weight the benefits. You misunderstand me, I'm not saying don't vaccinate, I'm saying don't do any unnecessary harm. How many of the 20-30 that died were healthy teenage boys?
Actual doctor from Marquette being ignored for some charlatan on YouTube that makes money from your views.
Interesting way to tell the world you're a dolt.
Same old posters descending into name calling and character assassination. That's all Sultanx's links are and a pattern come to be expected from Hards.... A Dr. in PT vs. an MD MPH (a hematologist-oncologist and Associate Professor in the Department of Epidemiology and Biostatistics at the University of California San Francisco)? I shouldn't expect any less from scoopers... such a high bar here. C'est la vie.
Credit to MUDPT for not descending to such base levels. Thanks for that.
The counterargument being 'Same old posters using unreliable sources. '
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 16, 2022, 11:45:09 AM
Same old posters descending into name calling and character assassination. That's all Sultanx's links are and a pattern come to be expected from Hards.... A Dr. in PT vs. an MD MPH (a hematologist-oncologist and Associate Professor in the Department of Epidemiology and Biostatistics at the University of California San Francisco)? I shouldn't expect any less from scoopers... such a high bar here. C'est la vie.
Credit to MUDPT for not descending to such base levels. Thanks for that.
Vinay wants an RCT for a COVID vaccine, which any MU graduate should tell you is highly, highly unethical.
You are correct that I'm not an MD. I guarantee you, I've had more COVID interactions than Dr. Prasad. It's easy to pontificate from behind your laptop, than try and get a patient with a tube stuck down their throat (because they have COVID), to sit up on the side of the bed for just 5 minutes.
Quote from: tower912 on August 16, 2022, 11:55:48 AM
The counterargument being 'Same old posters using unreliable sources. '
Yep. I've lost patience for people spreading misinformation. Shameful.
Ah huh, hey?
Since this and the school one seem to be the only two active threads, I will leave this here.
Due to a variety of reasons, I visited several medical facilities lately including specialists, general, diagnostic centers, hospital, and physical rehab facilities. All required masks.....except the dentist.
Quote from: pbiflyer on August 17, 2022, 08:09:18 AM
Since this and the school one seem to be the only two active threads, I will leave this here.
Due to a variety of reasons, I visited several medical facilities lately including specialists, general, diagnostic centers, hospital, and physical rehab facilities. All required masks.....except the dentist.
That's why we have a dental crime report thread
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 16, 2022, 11:45:09 AM
Same old posters descending into name calling and character assassination. That's all Sultanx's links are and a pattern come to be expected from Hards.... A Dr. in PT vs. an MD MPH (a hematologist-oncologist and Associate Professor in the Department of Epidemiology and Biostatistics at the University of California San Francisco)? I shouldn't expect any less from scoopers... such a high bar here. C'est la vie.
Credit to MUDPT for not descending to such base levels. Thanks for that.
You're a dolt if you think that all of the 'information' you're posting hasn't been discussed on this board ad nauseum.
I'll treat people who are, "just asking questions" as the disingenuous person that they are. I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on August 17, 2022, 05:18:31 PM
You're a dolt if you think that all of the 'information' you're posting hasn't been discussed on this board ad nauseum.
I'll treat people who are, "just asking questions" as the disingenuous person that they are. I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings.
sealion.jpg
Good news for the anti-vaxxers -- polio is back!
Ah, there's nothing like the classic hits!
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 12, 2022, 08:13:34 PM
More misinformation 🧐
See attached.
Would we be against using some of the discretionary funds attached to the recently passed bills for the vaccine injured?
Hey, would you care to comment on this?
https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-study-vaccine-adolescents-897355749269?utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=APFactCheck&utm_campaign=SocialFlow
Quote from: MUDPT on August 19, 2022, 07:36:38 AM
Hey, would you care to comment on this?
https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-study-vaccine-adolescents-897355749269?utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=APFactCheck&utm_campaign=SocialFlow
Don't worry. He ran away.
Quote from: MUDPT on August 19, 2022, 07:36:38 AM
Hey, would you care to comment on this?
https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-study-vaccine-adolescents-897355749269?utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=APFactCheck&utm_campaign=SocialFlow
It's weird that one side in this debate--and really, a semi-miraculous life-saving vaccine shouldn't even be a debate at all except that same one side inexplicably decided to make it part of their culture wars--constantly needs to lie about the facts. In this case it was "merely" a misrepresentation, but in other cases it was wholesale faking of data to pretend that horse de-wormer was effective.
It's even weirder that that same one side is completely OK with the constant lies.
Character revealed.
The vaccine is not worse than the virus, Chapter 834 ...
A study published this week in the journal Lancet Psychiatry showed increased risks of some brain disorders two years after infection with the coronavirus, shedding new light on the long-term neurological and psychiatric aspects of the virus.
The analysis, conducted by researchers at the University of Oxford and drawing on health records data from more than 1 million people around the world, found that while the risks of many common psychiatric disorders returned to normal within a couple of months, people remained at increased risk for dementia, epilepsy, psychosis and cognitive deficit (or brain fog) two years after contracting covid. Adults appeared to be at particular risk of lasting brain fog, a common complaint among coronavirus survivors.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2022/08/19/long-covid-brain-effects/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F37b3cfc%2F630105d01930ae1d2058fe55%2F5f8d147cae7e8a56e5b732a4%2F15%2F70%2F630105d01930ae1d2058fe55&wp_cu=b1005792a416de1fbe1f17e5cf366b7d%7CB1FF71CA724A36FAE0530100007F88D6
Quote from: MU82 on August 18, 2022, 11:37:13 AM
Good news for the anti-vaxxers -- polio is back!
Ah, there's nothing like the classic hits!
Proof positive that vaccines don't work
Proof positive that anti-vax lunacy is spreading.
Noble, is a 43 million person study large enough for you?
https://newsroom.heart.org/news/myocarditis-risk-significantly-higher-after-covid-19-infection-vs-after-a-covid-19-vaccine
You are just another know-it-all scooper who follows facts and data instead of internet whackadoodles. And nobody can trust data from Britain. My facebook group said their commies.
Quote from: tower912 on August 25, 2022, 06:14:06 AM
You are just another know-it-all scooper who follows facts and data instead of internet whackadoodles. And nobody can trust data from Britain. My facebook group said their commies.
It wasn't on Tucker, either
Quote from: Uncle Rico on August 25, 2022, 06:30:05 AM
It wasn't on Tucker, either
Imagine touting anti-vaccine conspiracy theories from a very vaccinated muppet.
Quote from: Retire0 on August 25, 2022, 06:35:12 AM
Imagine touting anti-vaccine conspiracy theories from a very vaccinated muppet.
In reality, the scary thing about all this is, what's happening is just emboldening the anti-vax movement outside covid. Good job, America
Quote from: Uncle Rico on August 25, 2022, 06:37:28 AM
In reality, the scary thing about all this is, what's happening is just emboldening the anti-vax movement outside covid. Good job, America
unnatural carnal knowledge yeah.
Hence the polio spike.
Quote from: tower912 on August 25, 2022, 07:00:15 AM
Hence the polio spike.
It's really remarkable how the most advanced nation in the history of the world is populated by so many morons and selfishly stupid people that revel in their ignorance.
Quote from: Uncle Rico on August 25, 2022, 07:21:15 AM
It's really remarkable how the most advanced nation in the history of the world is populated by so many morons and selfishly stupid people that revel in their ignorance.
It's a generation who's entire life focus has been their retirement accounts.
Quote from: Retire0 on August 25, 2022, 07:45:25 AM
It's a generation who's entire life focus has been their retirement accounts.
It's more than that. It's the ability for people to be easily manipulated into believing conspiracy theories, both young and old. It's the lack of rational thought disguised as some intellectual freedom.
When the fringes of society begin to exert their lunacy on the genera public, we all lose. A rise in polio in 2022 is a sign of a stupid society
Maybe you missed this article from The Atlantic from May 13, 2020.
THE CONSPIRACY THEORISTS ARE WINNING
America is losing its grip on Enlightenment values and reality itself.
By Jeffrey Goldberg
MAY 13, 2020
About the author: Jeffrey Goldberg is the editor in chief of The Atlantic and a recipient of the National Magazine Award for Reporting. He is the author of Prisoners: A Story of Friendship and Terror.
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/05/shadowland-introduction/610840/
Quote from: Retire0 on August 25, 2022, 07:45:25 AM
It's a generation who's entire life focus has been their retirement accounts.
Whose vs. who's
Quote from: Uncle Rico on August 25, 2022, 06:37:28 AM
In reality, the scary thing about all this is, what's happening is just emboldening the anti-vax movement outside covid. Good job, America
Well, the traditional anti-vax movement has not been a conservative right wing stronghold. Many left leaning Bernie loving naturalists and way out liberal thinkers usually. Now they are joined by the politically charged right wing COVID anti-vaxxers. Maybe this is the long awaited bipartisanship this country needs!!!
Quote from: JWags85 on August 25, 2022, 10:44:26 AM
Well, the traditional anti-vax movement has not been a conservative right wing stronghold. Many left leaning Bernie loving naturalists and way out liberal thinkers usually. Now they are joined by the politically charged right wing COVID anti-vaxxers. Maybe this is the long awaited bipartisanship this country needs!!!
Yup. The merging of the two is probably a bad sign as a whole.
Quote from: Uncle Rico on August 25, 2022, 07:52:33 AM
It's more than that. It's the ability for people to be easily manipulated into believing conspiracy theories, both young and old. It's the lack of rational thought disguised as some intellectual freedom.
It's anti-intellectualism, and has been a foundation of nearly every totalitarian regime of the past couple centuries, and maybe beyond. It's no coincidence that the teachers and academics are usually among the first rounded up and sent to re-education camps (or, simply shot).
Quote from: Pakuni on August 25, 2022, 12:25:55 PM
It's anti-intellectualism, and has been a foundation of nearly every totalitarian regime of the past couple centuries, and maybe beyond. It's no coincidence that the teachers and academics are usually among the first rounded up and sent to re-education camps (or, simply shot).
This is quite true as well. It isn't a surprise to see segments of society attack academia and point fingers at them as the problem.
Quote from: MUDPT on August 24, 2022, 08:48:16 PM
Noble, is a 43 million person study large enough for you?
https://newsroom.heart.org/news/myocarditis-risk-significantly-higher-after-covid-19-infection-vs-after-a-covid-19-vaccine
From the article:
Risk of COVID-19 vaccine-associated myocarditis among men:
Among the 18 million men in the dataset, all of whom received at least one COVID-19 vaccine, more than 6 million men (34%) were younger than age 40.
An increased risk of vaccine-associated myocarditis was found in men ages 40 and younger after a first dose of either of the mRNA COVID-19 vaccines (4 and 14 estimated extra cases for every one million men vaccinated with respectively Pfizer or Moderna vaccine), or a second dose of any of the three COVID-19 vaccines available in England during the study period: 14, 11 and 97 estimated additional cases of myocarditis for every one million men vaccinated, respectively for the ChAdOx1, the Pfizer-BioNTech or the Moderna vaccine.
The increased risk of developing myocarditis among males younger than age 40 was also higher after receiving two doses of the Moderna vaccine when compared to the risk of myocarditis after COVID-19 infection. The researchers noted, however, the average age of people who received the Moderna vaccine was 32 years, compared to the majority of those who received the other vaccines were older than age 40.
In men ages 40 and older, a slightly increased risk of myocarditis was found after a booster dose of either of the two mRNA vaccines (Pfizer-BioNTech or Moderna): 3 estimated extra cases of myocarditis for every one million men vaccinated with either mRNA vaccine.This article on a study doesn't contradict anything I've pointed out. This is the basis for rethinking the 'one size fits all' argument... Medicine has never been that way and it shouldn't start now... don't treat grandma the same way you treat Jimmy the 18 year old collage track and field athlete. Also, different products have different rates of adverse events. So if you're picking one, I'd go with the Pfizer product.
Carry on you miserables.
Quote from: MUDPT on August 19, 2022, 07:36:38 AM
Hey, would you care to comment on this?
https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-study-vaccine-adolescents-897355749269?utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=APFactCheck&utm_campaign=SocialFlow
First of all, it's a fact check... ugh
a couple of things... I would like to see replication with a larger sample size in a trial setting. Note, the uniqueness of this study is that it is prospective and they are looking at subclinical symptoms, not the subjective observable symptoms you brought up in an earlier post.
As for the comment by the cardiologist, it could be considered malpractice to do a study like this (unless it was in a trial setting) where you have a placebo sample. The participants were all there for the vaccine and were not agreeing to potentially having a placebo.
Here are some more commentaries from other snake oil salesman:
https://youtu.be/ozcpl9IJlno
https://youtu.be/ekTR0w2M9-U
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 25, 2022, 02:46:29 PM
From the article:
Risk of COVID-19 vaccine-associated myocarditis among men:
Among the 18 million men in the dataset, all of whom received at least one COVID-19 vaccine, more than 6 million men (34%) were younger than age 40.
An increased risk of vaccine-associated myocarditis was found in men ages 40 and younger after a first dose of either of the mRNA COVID-19 vaccines (4 and 14 estimated extra cases for every one million men vaccinated with respectively Pfizer or Moderna vaccine), or a second dose of any of the three COVID-19 vaccines available in England during the study period: 14, 11 and 97 estimated additional cases of myocarditis for every one million men vaccinated, respectively for the ChAdOx1, the Pfizer-BioNTech or the Moderna vaccine.
The increased risk of developing myocarditis among males younger than age 40 was also higher after receiving two doses of the Moderna vaccine when compared to the risk of myocarditis after COVID-19 infection. The researchers noted, however, the average age of people who received the Moderna vaccine was 32 years, compared to the majority of those who received the other vaccines were older than age 40.
In men ages 40 and older, a slightly increased risk of myocarditis was found after a booster dose of either of the two mRNA vaccines (Pfizer-BioNTech or Moderna): 3 estimated extra cases of myocarditis for every one million men vaccinated with either mRNA vaccine.
This article on a study doesn't contradict anything I've pointed out. This is the basis for rethinking the 'one size fits all' argument... Medicine has never been that way and it shouldn't start now... don't treat grandma the same way you treat Jimmy the 18 year old collage track and field athlete. Also, different products have different rates of adverse events. So if you're picking one, I'd go with the Pfizer product.
Carry on you miserables.
Contracting Covid raises your chances for myocarditis much more than it does from getting vaccinated.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/04/01/myocarditis-risk-higher-after-covid-infection-than-vaccination-cdc-finds.html
FURTHERMORE,
QuoteHowever, the overwhelming majority of people who developed myocarditis after vaccination recovered fully and most of them did not report any effect on their quality of life, according to a CDC survey of health-care providers presented at the February meeting.
Here, lemme just lay it out for you in a big picture even a neanderthal can grasp.
(https://covid19.nih.gov/sites/default/files/2022-06/Myocarditis%20Risk%20Chart.png)
Fix your brain.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on August 25, 2022, 03:09:16 PM
Contracting Covid raises your chances for myocarditis much more than it does from getting vaccinated.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/04/01/myocarditis-risk-higher-after-covid-infection-than-vaccination-cdc-finds.html
FURTHERMORE,
Here, lemme just lay it out for you in a big picture even a neanderthal can grasp.
(https://covid19.nih.gov/sites/default/files/2022-06/Myocarditis%20Risk%20Chart.png)
Fix your brain.
Statistically speaking, by living in New Mexico, my chances of being struck by lightning in my lifetime is much higher than what's stated in your handy dandy meme.
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 25, 2022, 03:24:07 PM
Statistically speaking, by living in New Mexico, my chances of being struck by lightning in my lifetime is much higher than what's stated in your handy dandy meme.
This is a meme: (https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/mobile/000/000/346/COOLSTORY.jpg)
The graph I posted is a graph from the NIH.
(https://c.tenor.com/ZiLugTiVQNgAAAAC/the-more-you-know.gif)
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 25, 2022, 03:09:00 PM
First of all, it's a fact check... ugh
a couple of things... I would like to see replication with a larger sample size in a trial setting. Note, the uniqueness of this study is that it is prospective and they are looking at subclinical symptoms, not the subjective observable symptoms you brought up in an earlier post.
As for the comment by the cardiologist, it could be considered malpractice to do a study like this (unless it was in a trial setting) where you have a placebo sample. The participants were all there for the vaccine and were not agreeing to potentially having a placebo.
Here are some more commentaries from other snake oil salesman:
https://youtu.be/ozcpl9IJlno
https://youtu.be/ekTR0w2M9-U
LOL...
Quote from: noblewarrior on August 25, 2022, 03:09:00 PM
First of all, it's a fact check... ugh
a couple of things... I would like to see replication with a larger sample size in a trial setting. Note, the uniqueness of this study is that it is prospective and they are looking at subclinical symptoms, not the subjective observable symptoms you brought up in an earlier post.
As for the comment by the cardiologist, it could be considered malpractice to do a study like this (unless it was in a trial setting) where you have a placebo sample. The participants were all there for the vaccine and were not agreeing to potentially having a placebo.
Here are some more commentaries from other snake oil salesman:
https://youtu.be/ozcpl9IJlno
https://youtu.be/ekTR0w2M9-U
What's the difference between "sub clinical" vs. subjective?
Earlier in this thread, you questioned my credentials against a guy that doesn't see any patients. I posted an article with quotes from multiple cardiologists which agrees with my opinions on the study. I really don't care if you are vaccinated. I do care that you wish to share information which is misguided and could lead to the death of people. The vaccines are safe. They've been approved by experts who know more about vaccines then all of us on MU hoops.
Get vaccinated (or don't), and keep your opinions on stuff you have no idea about to yourself.
Quote from: Retire0 on August 25, 2022, 07:45:25 AM
It's a generation who's entire life focus has been their retirement accounts.
Lots and lots (and lots and lots) of the science deniers are poor as dirt.
Quote from: MU82 on August 26, 2022, 04:12:22 PM
Lots and lots (and lots and lots) of the science deniers are poor as dirt.
That's a rather bravest thing to say.
https://newsone.com/playlist/black-anti-vaxxers-covid-19-vaccine/
Will you boycott Black Panther 2 since the star is anti-vaxx?
Quote from: Billy Hoyle on September 03, 2022, 01:30:06 PM
That's a rather bravest thing to say.
https://newsone.com/playlist/black-anti-vaxxers-covid-19-vaccine/
Will you boycott Black Panther 2 since the star is anti-vaxx?
You would think such a tech-forward person such as Shuri would be heard louder in the community.
Yet another study showing that it's Covid -- and not the vaccines -- that put strain on human hearts.
https://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/coronavirus/article266179606.html?ac_cid=DM701713&ac_bid=943541746
People hospitalized for COVID-19 were more likely to have heart failure after their discharge than those hospitalized for another reason, a Duke University study published this month found.
The study's findings, published in Nature Communications, support a growing body of research that suggests some people infected with COVID-19 go on to develop long-term heart problems.
Using health records of more than 580,000 patients admitted to U.S. hospitals, Duke researchers tracked how often those who had COVID went to the hospital for heart issues in the year after their discharge. They found the COVID group was 45% more likely to be diagnosed with heart failure when compared to patients hospitalized with something other than COVID.
Quote from: MU82 on September 23, 2022, 10:08:07 AM
Yet another study showing that it's Covid -- and not the vaccines -- that put strain on human hearts.
https://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/coronavirus/article266179606.html?ac_cid=DM701713&ac_bid=943541746
People hospitalized for COVID-19 were more likely to have heart failure after their discharge than those hospitalized for another reason, a Duke University study published this month found.
The study's findings, published in Nature Communications, support a growing body of research that suggests some people infected with COVID-19 go on to develop long-term heart problems.
Using health records of more than 580,000 patients admitted to U.S. hospitals, Duke researchers tracked how often those who had COVID went to the hospital for heart issues in the year after their discharge. They found the COVID group was 45% more likely to be diagnosed with heart failure when compared to patients hospitalized with something other than COVID.
That's not what this article is saying... It doesn't even mention the vaccines. It says, and I agree because C-19 is very bad, is that contracting C-19 and needing hospitalization (not necessarily for C-19) vs. hospitalization w/out C-19 increases your probability of having future heart issues.
The study does not take into account the patient's vaccine status
Here's the article... attached below
Quote from: noblewarrior on September 23, 2022, 12:30:56 PM
That's not what this article is saying... It doesn't even mention the vaccines. It says, and I agree because C-19 is very bad, is that contracting C-19 and needing hospitalization (not necessarily for C-19) vs. hospitalization w/out C-19 increases your probability of having future heart issues.
The study does not take into account the patient's vaccine status
Here's the article... attached below
We've had misinformation warriors routinely claiming that vaccines cause heart problems when the truth is that serious bouts with Covid are FAR more likely to cause heart problems.
Quote from: MU82 on September 24, 2022, 10:28:52 AM
We've had misinformation warriors routinely claiming that vaccines cause heart problems when the truth is that serious bouts with Covid are FAR more likely to cause heart problems.
Dude, noble knows things.
Curious that the anti-vaxxers need to continuously and consistently lie.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/10/that-florida-analysis-on-covid-vaccines-is-you-guessed-it-total-garbage/
"Epidemiologists and public health experts spent the past weekend collectively shaking their heads at the latest harmful pronouncement from Florida's provocative surgeon general, Joseph Ladapo, who on Friday announced that he was recommending against mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccines for men ages 18 to 39.
Experts roundly dubbed the analysis "utter rubbish," "extremely misleading," and "comically bad." Some called the analysis method "terrible," and one epidemiologist called it "the absolute most batshit study design & analysis plan I have ever seen." Others noted that the conclusion "smells of p-hacking" and data cherry-picking.
These reactions are likely unsurprising to anyone who has followed Ladapo's work as Florida's top doctor. Brought in by Governor Ron DeSantis in 2021, Ladapo has spent the pandemic downplaying the threat of COVID-19, fighting public health measures, surrounding himself with prominent anti-vaccine voices, and attacking life-saving COVID-19 vaccines."
Much more at the link on the shittyness of the study.
Fascinating breakdowns this week comparing comparing and contrasting death rates in counties and their political tilts.
Quote from: TSmith34 on October 11, 2022, 03:36:48 PM
Curious that the anti-vaxxers need to continuously and consistently lie.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/10/that-florida-analysis-on-covid-vaccines-is-you-guessed-it-total-garbage/
"Epidemiologists and public health experts spent the past weekend collectively shaking their heads at the latest harmful pronouncement from Florida's provocative surgeon general, Joseph Ladapo, who on Friday announced that he was recommending against mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccines for men ages 18 to 39.
Experts roundly dubbed the analysis "utter rubbish," "extremely misleading," and "comically bad." Some called the analysis method "terrible," and one epidemiologist called it "the absolute most batcrap study design & analysis plan I have ever seen." Others noted that the conclusion "smells of p-hacking" and data cherry-picking.
These reactions are likely unsurprising to anyone who has followed Ladapo's work as Florida's top doctor. Brought in by Governor Ron DeSantis in 2021, Ladapo has spent the pandemic downplaying the threat of COVID-19, fighting public health measures, surrounding himself with prominent anti-vaccine voices, and attacking life-saving COVID-19 vaccines."
Much more at the link on the craptyness of the study.
hate to burst your spit bubble, but dr fettucine wasn't exactly the bastion of truth...show me the money!!! wait until they get him under oath. i don't think you'd put him in your category of "anti-vaxers need to continuously and consistently lie". you still can't pin him with any consistency. funny he seems to look best in red though
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on October 11, 2022, 11:33:58 PM
hate to burst your spit bubble, but dr fettucine wasn't exactly the bastion of truth...show me the money!!! wait until they get him under oath. i don't think you'd put him in your category of "anti-vaxers need to continuously and consistently lie". you still can't pin him with any consistency. funny he seems to look best in red though
Health care professional.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on October 11, 2022, 11:33:58 PM
hate to burst your spit bubble, but dr fettucine wasn't exactly the bastion of truth...show me the money!!! wait until they get him under oath. i don't think you'd put him in your category of "anti-vaxers need to continuously and consistently lie". you still can't pin him with any consistency. funny he seems to look best in red though
8 out of 10
Classic work
hey auntie geek00 i missed you and your no reply rating schtick to the actual post thing AGAIN. you musta been going thru withdrawals not having too much to go on. i'll try harder to give you some better stuff. your post as usual gets a big zero try addressing the actual substance of my post next time cuz it looks like you're running out of jazz
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on October 11, 2022, 11:33:58 PM
hate to burst your spit bubble, but dr fettucine wasn't exactly the bastion of truth...show me the money!!! wait until they get him under oath. i don't think you'd put him in your category of "anti-vaxers need to continuously and consistently lie". you still can't pin him with any consistency. funny he seems to look best in red though
What evidence is there that he continuously and consistently lied?
Quote from: MUDPT on October 12, 2022, 06:29:23 AM
What evidence is there that he continuously and consistently lied?
Or profited off said lies.
You'd think that two-plus years later rocket would have time for self-reflection and maybe realizing how horribly wrong he has been about all things Covid...but alas that has not happened. Still out here dunking on himself.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on October 11, 2022, 11:33:58 PM
hate to burst your spit bubble, but dr fettucine wasn't exactly the bastion of truth...show me the money!!! wait until they get him under oath. i don't think you'd put him in your category of "anti-vaxers need to continuously and consistently lie". you still can't pin him with any consistency. funny he seems to look best in red though
Cool.
So why do anti-vaxxers need to continuously and consistently lie? Why do they go to such lengths to intentionally run horribly flawed studies? Why have they, in numerous cases, been found to actually falsify data in order to pretend Ivermectin and HCQ worked?
Why is that?
And when you see these lies, when it is shown that people falsified data, when there are absolutely no reliable studies that show these treatments work, why do you cling to the idea that they do?
When you see that you have been lied to, why do you continue to believe the lies over the facts?
There's no point in engaging with the willfully ignorant
Quote from: TSmith34 on October 12, 2022, 07:27:05 AM
When you see that you have been lied to, why do you continue to believe the lies over the facts?
https://twitter.com/dril/status/134787490526658561?lang=en (https://twitter.com/dril/status/134787490526658561?lang=en)
Yeah write, hey?
https://youtu.be/VArXfQU--LA
Quote from: 4everwarriors on October 12, 2022, 11:29:26 AM
Yeah write, hey?
https://youtu.be/VArXfQU--LA
I mean, he was wrong. What's your point? (Outside that you are easily swayed by Youtube videos.)
Quote from: Sultan Sultanberger on October 12, 2022, 11:40:52 AM
I mean, he was wrong. What's your point? (Outside that you are easily swayed by Youtube videos.)
The irony is that folks like 4elder and roqqet see someone who isn't their 'team' make a mistake once and that makes them impossible to trust ever.
Meanwhile, their dudes are literally wrong all the damn time, and they just ignore it.
They're stupid people and they're broken and shouldn't be taken seriously.
So few do.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on October 12, 2022, 02:20:31 PM
The irony is that folks like 4elder and roqqet see someone who isn't their 'team' make a mistake once and that makes them impossible to trust ever.
Meanwhile, their dudes are literally wrong all the damn time, and they just ignore it.
They're stupid people and they're broken and shouldn't be taken seriously.
damn i miss cheap gas, energy independence, low inflation, roaring stock markets, and a safer world-you guys just set all of us back ?? years with your "truths"
Der iz know inflation, doe. Hour Commander-in-Chief sed sew, aina?
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on October 12, 2022, 03:30:14 PM
damn i miss cheap gas, energy independence, low inflation, roaring stock markets, and a safer world-you guys just set all of us back ?? years with your "truths"
A safer world.
(https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2022/01/05/ap21133832328925_slide-b0dd95a406932a0a12d86bc3759b1a665aeb57ab-s1600-c85.webp)
(https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2022/01/05/gettyimages-1294935650-edit_custom-52340c96c6bd941e4c4fb0c223ad7d370a2ba7eb-s1600-c85.webp)
(https://static01.nyt.com/images/2022/06/16/us/politics/16dc-gallows/merlin_182058765_baa458fd-763c-4667-98c2-327f5048fd79-jumbo.jpg?quality=75&auto=webp)
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on October 12, 2022, 03:30:14 PM
damn i miss cheap gas, energy independence, low inflation, roaring stock markets, and a safer world-you guys just set all of us back ?? years with your "truths"
7 out of 10
Not on topic, standard boilerplate nonsensical ramblings of simplicity. Good use of air quotes
Two words: Safe and effective.
https://insulinresistance.org/index.php/jir/article/view/71/221
Volunteering in a vaccine centre, I was one of the first to receive two doses of Pfizer's messenger ribonucleic acid (mRNA) vaccine, at the end of January 2021. Although I knew my individual risk was small from COVID-19 at age 43 with optimal metabolic health, the main reason I took the jab was to prevent transmission of the virus to my vulnerable patients. During early 2021, I was both surprised and concerned by a number of my vaccine-hesitant patients and people in my social network who were asking me to comment on what I regarded at the time as merely 'anti-vax' propaganda.
I was asked to appear on Good Morning Britain after a previously vaccine-hesitant film director Gurinder Chadha, Order of the British Empire (OBE), who was also interviewed, explained that I convinced her to take the jab.
But a very unexpected and extremely harrowing personal tragedy was to happen a few months later that would be the start of my own journey into what would ultimately prove to be a revelatory and eye-opening experience so profound that after six months of critically appraising the data myself, speaking to eminent scientists involved in COVID-19 research, vaccine safety and development, and two investigative medical journalists, I have slowly and reluctantly concluded that contrary to my own initial dogmatic beliefs, Pfizer's mRNA vaccine is far from being as safe and effective as we first thought. This critical appraisal is based upon the analytical framework for practicing and teaching evidence-based medicine, specifically utilising individual clinical expertise and/or experience with use of the best available evidence and taking into consideration patient preferences and values.
Quote from: noblewarrior on October 12, 2022, 04:27:15 PM
Two words: Safe and effective.
https://insulinresistance.org/index.php/jir/article/view/71/221
Volunteering in a vaccine centre, I was one of the first to receive two doses of Pfizer's messenger ribonucleic acid (mRNA) vaccine, at the end of January 2021. Although I knew my individual risk was small from COVID-19 at age 43 with optimal metabolic health, the main reason I took the jab was to prevent transmission of the virus to my vulnerable patients. During early 2021, I was both surprised and concerned by a number of my vaccine-hesitant patients and people in my social network who were asking me to comment on what I regarded at the time as merely 'anti-vax' propaganda.
I was asked to appear on Good Morning Britain after a previously vaccine-hesitant film director Gurinder Chadha, Order of the British Empire (OBE), who was also interviewed, explained that I convinced her to take the jab.
But a very unexpected and extremely harrowing personal tragedy was to happen a few months later that would be the start of my own journey into what would ultimately prove to be a revelatory and eye-opening experience so profound that after six months of critically appraising the data myself, speaking to eminent scientists involved in COVID-19 research, vaccine safety and development, and two investigative medical journalists, I have slowly and reluctantly concluded that contrary to my own initial dogmatic beliefs, Pfizer's mRNA vaccine is far from being as safe and effective as we first thought. This critical appraisal is based upon the analytical framework for practicing and teaching evidence-based medicine, specifically utilising individual clinical expertise and/or experience with use of the best available evidence and taking into consideration patient preferences and values.
Glad you are back to spew your anti vax BS, but in case anyone is interested in actual data:
https://mobile.twitter.com/dr_barrett/status/1574473896061026322
No increases in ischemic heart disease or ICU admissions since the introduction of the vaccines. This article is complete and utter BS.
Quote from: noblewarrior on October 12, 2022, 04:27:15 PM
Two words: Safe and effective.
https://insulinresistance.org/index.php/jir/article/view/71/221
Volunteering in a vaccine centre, I was one of the first to receive two doses of Pfizer's messenger ribonucleic acid (mRNA) vaccine, at the end of January 2021. Although I knew my individual risk was small from COVID-19 at age 43 with optimal metabolic health, the main reason I took the jab was to prevent transmission of the virus to my vulnerable patients. During early 2021, I was both surprised and concerned by a number of my vaccine-hesitant patients and people in my social network who were asking me to comment on what I regarded at the time as merely 'anti-vax' propaganda.
I was asked to appear on Good Morning Britain after a previously vaccine-hesitant film director Gurinder Chadha, Order of the British Empire (OBE), who was also interviewed, explained that I convinced her to take the jab.
But a very unexpected and extremely harrowing personal tragedy was to happen a few months later that would be the start of my own journey into what would ultimately prove to be a revelatory and eye-opening experience so profound that after six months of critically appraising the data myself, speaking to eminent scientists involved in COVID-19 research, vaccine safety and development, and two investigative medical journalists, I have slowly and reluctantly concluded that contrary to my own initial dogmatic beliefs, Pfizer's mRNA vaccine is far from being as safe and effective as we first thought. This critical appraisal is based upon the analytical framework for practicing and teaching evidence-based medicine, specifically utilising individual clinical expertise and/or experience with use of the best available evidence and taking into consideration patient preferences and values.
At this point, I fully support anti-vaxxers not getting vaccinated. Please proceed.
Quote from: TSmith34 on October 12, 2022, 07:16:55 PM
At this point, I fully support anti-vaxxers not getting vaccinated. Please proceed.
Seconded. And go big on ivermectin.
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on October 12, 2022, 03:30:14 PM
damn i miss cheap gas, energy independence, low inflation, roaring stock markets, and a safer world-you guys just set all of us back ?? years with your "truths"
You can dodge a ball, but can you dodge a wrench?
Quote from: tower912 on October 12, 2022, 08:42:24 PM
Seconded. And go big on ivermectin.
And bleach. Cheers!
Quote from: rocket ALM surgeon on October 12, 2022, 03:30:14 PM
damn i miss cheap gas, energy independence, low inflation, roaring stock markets, and a safer world-you guys just set all of us back ?? years with your "truths"
Kinda interesting that your understanding of politics, economics, and covid are about on the same level.
Find a hobby... actually probably retire.
So many ad hominum attacks. Thought those weren't allowed here. 🤔
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on October 13, 2022, 09:38:17 AM
So many ad hominum attacks. Thought those weren't allowed here. 🤔
ad hominem
Quote from: TSmith34 on October 12, 2022, 07:16:55 PM
At this point, I fully support anti-vaxxers not getting vaccinated. Please proceed.
🐷🐷
Remember the talking point here that Dr. Fauci was getting rich pushing COVID vaccines while simultaneously discrediting the evidence that hydroxy and ivermectin were cheap and easy cures? Well guess what...
https://www.thedailybeast.com/covid-misinformation-group-americas-frontline-doctors-implodes-over-dr-simone-golds-extravagant-spending?ref=author
Can't make this stuff up.
Don't need to.
Must have read the MUScoop mod guide to misappropriating funding.
Quote from: Sultan Sultanberger on November 14, 2022, 09:49:27 AM
Remember the talking point here that Dr. Fauci was getting rich pushing COVID vaccines while simultaneously discrediting the evidence that hydroxy and ivermectin were cheap and easy cures? Well guess what...
https://www.thedailybeast.com/covid-misinformation-group-americas-frontline-doctors-implodes-over-dr-simone-golds-extravagant-spending?ref=author
Can't make this stuff up.
Scam artists who bilked people by pushing fake cures also scammed from donations?
Shocking.
This gives me a headache. Where's my pillow?
I wonder how much money Dr. Gold got from Scoop dentists and trolls.
Now now...
Those ivermectin studies are coming out any day.
And if they don't, it's because they're being suppressed
https://twitter.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1597834732209045505?t=nBRtCbHmSqIIJ0vqpmrL9Q&s=19
Pretty good recap of all the vaccine mis/disinfo we were fed. These kinds of headlines were what was fueling the unbelievable vitriol towards the unvaccinated. Many people wanted the unvaccinated completely excluded from public life.
Quote from: Boozemon Barro on November 30, 2022, 07:45:56 AM
https://twitter.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1597834732209045505?t=nBRtCbHmSqIIJ0vqpmrL9Q&s=19
Pretty good recap of all the vaccine mis/disinfo we were fed. These kinds of headlines were what was fueling the unbelievable vitriol towards the unvaccinated. Many people wanted the unvaccinated completely excluded from public life.
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/united-states-rates-of-covid-19-deaths-by-vaccination-status?country=~50%2B
It's just a shame that soft minded people convinced so many that they could have taken a relatively harmless vaccine to protect themselves. I would have thought that we would be beyond that because it's become so obvious.
Yet here we are.
Quote from: Boozemon Barro on November 30, 2022, 07:45:56 AM
https://twitter.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1597834732209045505?t=nBRtCbHmSqIIJ0vqpmrL9Q&s=19
Pretty good recap of all the vaccine mis/disinfo we were fed. These kinds of headlines were what was fueling the unbelievable vitriol towards the unvaccinated. Many people wanted the unvaccinated completely excluded from public life.
I am sure Diamond from Diamond and Silk who is currently hospitalized with the CoCo is enthralled by your "data".
Quote from: Boozemon Barro on November 30, 2022, 07:45:56 AM
https://twitter.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1597834732209045505?t=nBRtCbHmSqIIJ0vqpmrL9Q&s=19
Pretty good recap of all the vaccine mis/disinfo we were fed. These kinds of headlines were what was fueling the unbelievable vitriol towards the unvaccinated. Many people wanted the unvaccinated completely excluded from public life.
Nowhere in that mishmash of random newspaper headlines was there anything that remotely resembled disinformation. You sir clearly do not understand a lick of science, virology, or epidemiology. You receive no beef-n-cheddars, and may the scoop overlords have mercy on you.
Quote from: Boozemon Barro on November 30, 2022, 07:45:56 AM
https://twitter.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1597834732209045505?t=nBRtCbHmSqIIJ0vqpmrL9Q&s=19
Pretty good recap of all the vaccine mis/disinfo we were fed. These kinds of headlines were what was fueling the unbelievable vitriol towards the unvaccinated. Many people wanted the unvaccinated completely excluded from public life.
A large number of the unvaccinated have excluded themselves from public life. Permanently.
Excess death rates after vaccines became available highly correlated to party affiliation.
https://ysph.yale.edu/news-article/study-finds-large-gap-in-excess-deaths-along-partisan-lines-after-covid-19-vaccines-introduced/
Please proceed, anti-vaxxers.
Quote from: TSmith34 on December 01, 2022, 08:46:46 PM
A large number of the unvaccinated have excluded themselves from public life. Permanently.
Excess death rates after vaccines became available highly correlated to party affiliation.
https://ysph.yale.edu/news-article/study-finds-large-gap-in-excess-deaths-along-partisan-lines-after-covid-19-vaccines-introduced/
Please proceed, anti-vaxxers.
🐷🐷
Ron DeSantis is going full anti-vaxxer on Laura Ingraham's Fox News show
https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1602863891742183429?s=20&t=cIyy4Kyd4Xiu8C2UVpWfdg
He's 100% correct. Mandated vaccination should never have been a thing. The short answer is there is too much money at stake for big pharma, etc. to have been up front and honest with the public. Never let a good crisis go to waste, aina?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on December 14, 2022, 08:57:25 AM
He's 100% correct. Mandated vaccination should never have been a thing. The short answer is there is too much money at stake for big pharma, etc. to have been up front and honest with the public. Never let a good crisis go to waste, aina?
4ever found a new daddy in Ron D.
Florida man nailed it, the rest of the world got it wrong. Just look at Florida's data!
Quote from: 4everwarriors on December 14, 2022, 08:57:25 AM
He's 100% correct. Mandated vaccination should never have been a thing. The short answer is there is too much money at stake for big pharma, etc. to have been up front and honest with the public. Never let a good crisis go to waste, aina?
No he is 100% wrong. We can argue the benefits of mandated vaccination all you want (IMO there is no need for it any longer), but he is arguing that the vaccination itself is a problem. He literally claimed "the benefit is miniscule." Really?
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/united-states-rates-of-covid-19-deaths-by-vaccination-status?country=~50%2B
The fact that a Marquette-trained, "medical professional" laps this up and says "yeah, he's right about this," shows you how far gone some people are. Just an embarrassment.
Oh, the irony, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on May 13, 2022, 12:04:09 PM
600,000 dead on his watch. Handed 2 vaccines, hey?
#Buffoon
Quote from: 4everwarriors on December 14, 2022, 08:57:25 AM
He's 100% correct. Mandated vaccination should never have been a thing. The short answer is there is too much money at stake for big pharma, etc. to have been up front and honest with the public. Never let a good crisis go to waste, aina?
Life comes at you pretty fast.
Quote from: MUBurrow on December 14, 2022, 09:39:13 AM
Life comes at you pretty fast.
LOL. Exactly.
4ever was all about the vaccines when he could credit Trump for them, but now that his new buddy doesn't like them, he mimics that talking point.
Last data I saw said vaccines had prevented 3.2 million American deaths vs no vaccines.
Honestly, doc drivel, it is impossible to take you seriously anymore.
https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/13/health/covid-19-vaccines-study/index.html
https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/3773239-covid-vaccines-saved-3-2-million-us-lives-researchers-say/
https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/985529
https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/covid-19-vaccines-saved-20-million-lives-in-1-year
So, the question becomes, why is he ignoring science and pandering?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on December 14, 2022, 08:57:25 AM
He's 100% correct. Mandated vaccination should never have been a thing. The short answer is there is too much money at stake for big pharma, etc. to have been up front and honest with the public. Never let a good crisis go to waste, aina?
Can you name one American who was actually forced to get the vaccine? Sure, many were mandated by their job, but free market tells me they could just go get another job.
Quote from: tower912 on December 14, 2022, 10:09:07 AM
So, the question becomes, why is he ignoring science and pandering?
Fox News' arm is sufficient wedged up his ass controlling him entirely.
SAD!
Quote from: Retire0 on December 14, 2022, 10:46:54 AM
Fox News' arm is sufficient wedged up his ass controlling him entirely.
SAD!
I bet that arm is vaccinated too.
From July 2021:
https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/564249-desantis-urges-public-to-get-vaccinated-these-shots-are-saving-lives/
"Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) is urging Floridians to get vaccinated against the coronavirus, saying that the shots are "saving lives."
In a press conference on Wednesday, DeSantis told reporters that 95% of the people being admitted to hospitals in the state due to COVID-19 complications haven't been vaccinated at all, implying that "vaccines are saving lives," especially with regard to nursing homes.
"If you look at the people that are being admitted to hospitals .... over 95% of them are either not fully vaccinated or not vaccinated at all," DeSantis said. "These vaccines are saving lives. They are reducing mortality."
From December 2020... DeSantis watching a Florida resident getting vaccinated.
(https://www.tampabay.com/resizer//vNjhZ3gCMm4xC7jEKdqmjidUNeE=/900x506/smart/filters:format(webP)/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/tbt/CAEIHREQ4FGAFEW6NTRFV2AX24.jpg)
Quote from the story: "Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis welcomed 20,000 doses of the coronavirus vaccine to Tampa General Hospital on Monday morning, calling their arrival a "historic" achievement in the fight against the pandemic."
Thanks, Doc Drivel, for bringing attention to this. Love and appreciate the self own.
July 2021
https://www.wfla.com/community/health/coronavirus/vaccines-are-saving-lives-desantis-stresses-importance-of-shots-as-florida-covid-cases-spike-criticizes-mask-mandates/
"During a visit to St. Petersburg to discuss red tide on Wednesday, Gov. Ron DeSantis took time to answer questions and address Florida's recent spike in coronavirus cases and stress the importance of Floridians getting a COVID-19 vaccine.
"So here's, I think, the most important thing with the data: if you are vaccinated—fully vaccinated—the chance of you getting seriously ill or dying from COVID is effectively zero," DeSantis said. "If you look at the people who are being admitted to hospitals, over 95 percent of them are either not fully vaccinated or not vaccinated at all. These vaccines are saving lives. They are reducing mortality."
The governor said he's been urging people to get vaccinated for months because of what he called the "summer season."
"We have a summer season here, just like last year," DeSantis said. "It started a little later this year. So you're going to have higher prevalence for the rest of July, probably into August. And then it goes back and goes the different waves. If you're vaccinated, those waves are not going to impact you in any significant way and I think that's the important message for people."
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on December 14, 2022, 11:27:27 AM
"During a visit to St. Petersburg to discuss red tide on Wednesday, Gov. Ron DeSantis took time to answer questions and address Florida's recent spike in coronavirus cases and stress the importance of Floridians getting a COVID-19 vaccine.
"So here's, I think, the most important thing with the data: if you are vaccinated—fully vaccinated—the chance of you getting seriously ill or dying from COVID is effectively zero," DeSantis said. "If you look at the people who are being admitted to hospitals, over 95 percent of them are either not fully vaccinated or not vaccinated at all. These vaccines are saving lives. They are reducing mortality."
The governor said he's been urging people to get vaccinated for months because of what he called the "summer season."
"We have a summer season here, just like last year," DeSantis said. "It started a little later this year. So you're going to have higher prevalence for the rest of July, probably into August. And then it goes back and goes the different waves. If you're vaccinated, those waves are not going to impact you in any significant way and I think that's the important message for people."
FWIW, DeSantis's pivot makes political sense from a nihlistic point of view. He clearly sees the fact that he wasn't a complete anti-vax ghoul as a liability in the republican primary. But he can't just say "I changed my mind now that fewer are dying of covid and its no longer politically beneficial to support vaccination." So he's propping up a big pharma straw man to enable him to claim he was tricked into supporting the vaccines. This is all hilariously obvious and drummed up, but his supporters won't object to his inconsistency, and this is all going to be about pharma, Fauci, etc.
Quote from: MUBurrow on December 14, 2022, 11:37:41 AM
FWIW, DeSantis's pivot makes political sense from a nihlistic point of view. He clearly sees the fact that he wasn't a complete anti-vax ghoul as a liability in the republican primary. But he can't just say "I changed my mind now that fewer are dying of covid and its no longer politically beneficial to support vaccination." So he's propping up a big pharma straw man to enable him to claim he was tricked into supporting the vaccines. This is all hilariously obvious and drummed up, but his supporters won't object to his inconsistency, and this is all going to be about pharma, Fauci, etc.
Oh I know. I just wish the 4evers of the world would admit either 1. how manipulated they are, or 2. that they don't care for intellectual consistency.
Alright, this isn't sea lion-ing, this is legitimate devils advocate from the only semi-reasonable vaccine/pharma deception standpoint Ive seen recently.
If vaccines were posited as definitively preventing transmission, when they in fact did not and Pfizer admitted as much later on, could it be said that both
A) vaccines saved millions of lives because it prevented severe infection, especially in the case of the elderly.
but also
B) were championed in a misleading fashion compared to other vaccines which indeed prevented contraction and transmission
Quote from: JWags85 on December 14, 2022, 04:32:13 PM
Alright, this isn't sea lion-ing, this is legitimate devils advocate from the only semi-reasonable vaccine/pharma deception standpoint Ive seen recently.
If vaccines were posited as definitively preventing transmission, when they in fact did not and Pfizer admitted as much later on, could it be said that both
A) vaccines saved millions of lives because it prevented severe infection, especially in the case of the elderly.
but also
B) were championed in a misleading fashion compared to other vaccines which indeed prevented contraction and transmission
You playing devils advocate
:shocked face:
Quote from: reinko on December 14, 2022, 04:55:27 PM
You playing devils advocate
:shocked face:
Sorry I forgot, we're all supposed to play party lines and agree with each other and/or make fun of dentists.
Please provide evidence of my history of insincerity or anything other than trying to reasonably add to the discussion whilst not being wholly left of center.
Quote from: JWags85 on December 14, 2022, 04:32:13 PM
Alright, this isn't sea lion-ing, this is legitimate devils advocate from the only semi-reasonable vaccine/pharma deception standpoint Ive seen recently.
If vaccines were posited as definitively preventing transmission, when they in fact did not and Pfizer admitted as much later on, could it be said that both
A) vaccines saved millions of lives because it prevented severe infection, especially in the case of the elderly.
but also
B) were championed in a misleading fashion compared to other vaccines which indeed prevented contraction and transmission
(B) wasn't "misleading." It proved to be inaccurate as more transmissible variants emerged.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on December 14, 2022, 05:33:46 PM
(B) wasn't "misleading." It proved to be inaccurate as more transmissible variants emerged.
Was it proven to fully prevent transmission of even earlier variants? I thought Pfizer admitted in EU panels last month that they never tested on the basis of transmission.
Obviously there is a difference between "reduces transmission/reduces likelihood of contracting COVID" and "prevents transmission".
Is it semantics? Sure. But I don't think its a point without merit. And its far from "DURR THE VAX DONT DO ANYTHING. THEY DO MORE HARM THAN GOOD"
Quote from: JWags85 on December 14, 2022, 05:51:25 PM
Was it proven to fully prevent transmission of even earlier variants? I thought Pfizer admitted in EU panels last month that they never tested on the basis of transmission.
Obviously there is a difference between "reduces transmission/reduces likelihood of contracting COVID" and "prevents transmission".
Is it semantics? Sure. But I don't think its a point without merit. And its far from "DURR THE VAX DONT DO ANYTHING. THEY DO MORE HARM THAN GOOD"
I mean in the link above, he calls them "useless." So I guess that's the standard I'm comparing it to.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on December 14, 2022, 06:02:52 PM
I mean in the link above, he calls them "useless." So I guess that's the standard I'm comparing it to.
I'm not defending DeSantis or any of the "lock Fauci up" crowd. Thats brain dead, as is any blind allegiance to any politically motivated messaging.
Quote from: JWags85 on December 14, 2022, 04:32:13 PM
Alright, this isn't sea lion-ing, this is legitimate devils advocate from the only semi-reasonable vaccine/pharma deception standpoint Ive seen recently.
If vaccines were posited as definitively preventing transmission, when they in fact did not and Pfizer admitted as much later on, could it be said that both
A) vaccines saved millions of lives because it prevented severe infection, especially in the case of the elderly.
but also
B) were championed in a misleading fashion compared to other vaccines which indeed prevented contraction and transmission
I'm ok with the playing Devil's advocate on this one, it is a reasonable question and one that should be asked, but in this case your hypothetical is misguided and inaccurate and the Devil's advocate position you are taking is based on the unfortunate reality that our media is ridiculously biased, and sucks at reporting accurately (please don't take the below as an attack...it is just providing information).
Your Devil's advocate position is based on the idea that Pfizer lied to the world regarding transmission. But they never made that claim. Pfizer in their own press releases and reports made clear that they never tested on that, instead they emphasized that it provided 95% protection from symptomatic infection.
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmoa2034577 (https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmoa2034577)
And even went on the media and flat out told everyone that they could not comment on whether people could still be infected and transmit to others.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/3-vaccine-executives-say-after-approval-distribution-will-be-main-n1249928 (https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/3-vaccine-executives-say-after-approval-distribution-will-be-main-n1249928)
Even the FDA made all this clear in their announcements on it being approved.
https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-takes-key-action-fight-against-covid-19-issuing-emergency-use-authorization-first-covid-19 (https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-takes-key-action-fight-against-covid-19-issuing-emergency-use-authorization-first-covid-19)
"The vaccine was 95% effective in preventing COVID-19 disease among these clinical trial participants with eight COVID-19 cases in the vaccine group and 162 in the placebo group. Of these 170 COVID-19 cases, one in the vaccine group and three in the placebo group were classified as severe.
At this time, data are not available to make a determination about how long the vaccine will provide protection, nor is there evidence that the vaccine prevents transmission of SARS-CoV-2 from person to person." (emphasis added)
So the media portraying the "big lie" regarding the vaccines are following revisionist history. There was no big pharmaceutical conspiracy. They reported exactly what the data said, that it protected (95%) against symptomatic infection of the prevailing strains, and 100% admitted they did not know about whether it protected against spread.
Others in the media/government indicated it reduced spread of the existing strains, which was true, but all that was based on epidemiological data and trends, not any official trial...and no one ever claimed otherwise.
Don't worry, the incoming House is planning to "investigate" everything about the Covid response, and I'm sure they'll do a thorough, facts-only review.
Fauci will kick their butts sideways. But they won't realize it. Or care.
Along those lines, I think there were a couple of studies that initially said in spring 2021 that vaccines significantly reduced transmission. As Delta came about in Summer 2021, that definitely changed. There was certainly a "spiking of the football" that the vaccines were a cure all by the Biden administration, but most of the epidemiologists were definitely more reserved. Bottom line: vaccines work, including the new fall boosters. They protect from severe infection and they also reduce the amount of viral load and chance of transmission.
Quote from: forgetful on December 14, 2022, 06:52:48 PM
I'm ok with the playing Devil's advocate on this one, it is a reasonable question and one that should be asked, but in this case your hypothetical is misguided and inaccurate and the Devil's advocate position you are taking is based on the unfortunate reality that our media is ridiculously biased, and sucks at reporting accurately (please don't take the below as an attack...it is just providing information).
Your Devil's advocate position is based on the idea that Pfizer lied to the world regarding transmission. But they never made that claim. Pfizer in their own press releases and reports made clear that they never tested on that, instead they emphasized that it provided 95% protection from symptomatic infection.
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmoa2034577 (https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmoa2034577)
And even went on the media and flat out told everyone that they could not comment on whether people could still be infected and transmit to others.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/3-vaccine-executives-say-after-approval-distribution-will-be-main-n1249928 (https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/3-vaccine-executives-say-after-approval-distribution-will-be-main-n1249928)
Even the FDA made all this clear in their announcements on it being approved.
https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-takes-key-action-fight-against-covid-19-issuing-emergency-use-authorization-first-covid-19 (https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-takes-key-action-fight-against-covid-19-issuing-emergency-use-authorization-first-covid-19)
"The vaccine was 95% effective in preventing COVID-19 disease among these clinical trial participants with eight COVID-19 cases in the vaccine group and 162 in the placebo group. Of these 170 COVID-19 cases, one in the vaccine group and three in the placebo group were classified as severe. At this time, data are not available to make a determination about how long the vaccine will provide protection, nor is there evidence that the vaccine prevents transmission of SARS-CoV-2 from person to person." (emphasis added)
So the media portraying the "big lie" regarding the vaccines are following revisionist history. There was no big pharmaceutical conspiracy. They reported exactly what the data said, that it protected (95%) against symptomatic infection of the prevailing strains, and 100% admitted they did not know about whether it protected against spread.
Others in the media/government indicated it reduced spread of the existing strains, which was true, but all that was based on epidemiological data and trends, not any official trial...and no one ever claimed otherwise.
Thanks for the thorough and thoughtful response.
Yea, I never bought some of the vast pharma conspiracy. I think the misguidance in vaccine testing/performance was news/media headlines and blurbs, which people naturally never read into.
Quote from: MUDPT on December 15, 2022, 07:29:32 AM
Along those lines, I think there were a couple of studies that initially said in spring 2021 that vaccines significantly reduced transmission. As Delta came about in Summer 2021, that definitely changed. There was certainly a "spiking of the football" that the vaccines were a cure all by the Biden administration, but most of the epidemiologists were definitely more reserved. Bottom line: vaccines work, including the new fall boosters. They protect from severe infection and they also reduce the amount of viral load and chance of transmission.
Yea thats sort of where I was getting at. Epidemiologists and hard science professionals kept things in perspective even if their words or findings were being phrased incorrectly in headlines or news reports.
Vaccine hesitancy is fueling a measles resurgence in Columbus, Ohio. Most of the 81 infected children are old enough to get vaccinated, but their parents chose not to, officials said.
Measles is a highly contagious virus that undermines the immune system, making those infected more susceptible to other diseases. The World Health Organization and CDC called it an "imminent" global threat.
Perfect.
Looks like chickenpox, too.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2022/12/26/vaccine-hesitancy-measles-chickenpox-polio-flu/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F38aa837%2F63a9d100ef9bf67b2337a827%2F5f8d147cae7e8a56e5b732a4%2F10%2F70%2F63a9d100ef9bf67b2337a827&wp_cu=b1005792a416de1fbe1f17e5cf366b7d%7CB1FF71CA724A36FAE0530100007F88D6
More than a third of parents with children under 18 — and 28 percent of all adults — now say parents should be able to decide not to vaccinate their children for measles, mumps and rubella (MMR) to attend public schools, even if remaining unvaccinated may create health risks for others, according to new polling by the Kaiser Family Foundation, a health-care research nonprofit.
Public sentiments against vaccine mandates have grown significantly since the pandemic, said Jen Kates, a Kaiser senior vice president. A 2019 poll by the Pew Research Center found that less than a quarter of parents — and 16 percent of all adults — opposed school vaccination requirements.
The growing opposition stems largely from shifts among people who identify as or lean Republican, the Kaiser survey found, with 44 percent saying parents should be able to opt out of those childhood vaccines — more than double the 20 percent who felt that way in 2019.
Why vaccinate your kids against serious diseases that had been all but wiped out when you can scream "FREEDOM!" instead?
Quote from: MU82 on December 26, 2022, 01:18:41 PM
The growing opposition stems largely from shifts among people who identify as or lean Republican, the Kaiser survey found, with 44 percent saying parents should be able to opt out of those childhood vaccines — more than double the 20 percent who felt that way in 2019.
[/i]
Why vaccinate your kids against serious diseases that had been all but wiped out when you can scream "FREEDOM!" instead?
Pro-lifers. ;D ;D ;D
Quote from: MU82 on December 26, 2022, 08:48:12 AM
Vaccine hesitancy is fueling a measles resurgence in Columbus, Ohio. Most of the 81 infected children are old enough to get vaccinated, but their parents chose not to, officials said.
Measles is a highly contagious virus that undermines the immune system, making those infected more susceptible to other diseases. The World Health Organization and CDC called it an "imminent" global threat.
Perfect.
"Perfect"
Well you kind of used some facts.
The number has since spiked, and as of Thursday morning, Columbus Public Health reported at least 82 cases, including 32 hospitalizations. All of those cases are among children 17 and younger, with nearly 94% of those cases infecting infants, babies and children up to the age of 5, health data shows. No children have so far died in the outbreak.
It so far appears that all of the children impacted by the outbreak are at least partially unvaccinated, meaning they have only received one dose of the necessary two for the measles-mumps-rubella vaccine, known as MMR, although four children still have an unknown vaccination status. Children are recommended to get their first dose between 12 and 15 months of age and the second between the age of 4 and 6. (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ohio-measles-outbreak-82-children-infected-unvaccinated-babies-toddlers/)
It's not vaccine hesitancy, it's the fact that most of them aren't old enough to get the 2nd dose. But don't let the facts get in the way of the picture you constantly want to paint.
Quote from: MU_B on January 04, 2023, 08:17:50 AM
"Perfect"
Well you kind of used some facts.
The number has since spiked, and as of Thursday morning, Columbus Public Health reported at least 82 cases, including 32 hospitalizations. All of those cases are among children 17 and younger, with nearly 94% of those cases infecting infants, babies and children up to the age of 5, health data shows. No children have so far died in the outbreak.
It so far appears that all of the children impacted by the outbreak are at least partially unvaccinated, meaning they have only received one dose of the necessary two for the measles-mumps-rubella vaccine, known as MMR, although four children still have an unknown vaccination status. Children are recommended to get their first dose between 12 and 15 months of age and the second between the age of 4 and 6. (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ohio-measles-outbreak-82-children-infected-unvaccinated-babies-toddlers/)
It's not vaccine hesitancy, it's the fact that most of them aren't old enough to get the 2nd dose. But don't let the facts get in the way of the picture you constantly want to paint.
I didn't make up what I wrote. State health officials were quoted in published reports. Thanks for providing more recent detail, which doesn't mean some parents aren't putting their kids in danger by refusing vaccinations for these diseases.
Quote from: MU_B on January 04, 2023, 08:17:50 AM
"Perfect"
Well you kind of used some facts.
The number has since spiked, and as of Thursday morning, Columbus Public Health reported at least 82 cases, including 32 hospitalizations. All of those cases are among children 17 and younger, with nearly 94% of those cases infecting infants, babies and children up to the age of 5, health data shows. No children have so far died in the outbreak.
It so far appears that all of the children impacted by the outbreak are at least partially unvaccinated, meaning they have only received one dose of the necessary two for the measles-mumps-rubella vaccine, known as MMR, although four children still have an unknown vaccination status. Children are recommended to get their first dose between 12 and 15 months of age and the second between the age of 4 and 6. (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ohio-measles-outbreak-82-children-infected-unvaccinated-babies-toddlers/)
It's not vaccine hesitancy, it's the fact that most of them aren't old enough to get the 2nd dose. But don't let the facts get in the way of the picture you constantly want to paint.
If the people that could have been vaccinated, were vaccinated, then the ones that did get the Measels, who were partially vaccinated, wouldn't have gotten it. It's how vaccines work.
Quote from: MUDPT on January 04, 2023, 09:20:33 PM
If the people that could have been vaccinated, were vaccinated, then the ones that did get the Measels, who were partially vaccinated, wouldn't have gotten it. It's how vaccines work.
Thanks for trying to provide information to the willfully misinformed.
Quote from: MU82 on January 04, 2023, 10:29:33 AM
I didn't make up what I wrote. State health officials were quoted in published reports. Thanks for providing more recent detail, which doesn't mean some parents aren't putting their kids in danger by refusing vaccinations for these diseases.
You said: "Most of the 81 infected children are old enough to get vaccinated, but their parents chose not to, officials said."
I don't know where you got this information, because you didn't provide a source or a link, but apparently it was wrong.
Quote from: MU82 on January 04, 2023, 09:36:13 PM
Thanks for trying to provide information to the willfully misinformed.
Says the guy who literally passed along misinformation.
You're misinformed.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on January 05, 2023, 04:48:17 AM
I don't know where you got this information, because you didn't provide a source or a link, but apparently it was wrong.
Looks like it was from here but the original author didn't provide a source either
https://captimes.com/opinion/dave-zweifel/opinion-growing-aversion-to-vaccines-puts-us-all-at-risk/article_ee9466f7-f120-5d99-85d1-fbd39ced3d79.html
Quote from: TAMU, the Wizard of MU Basketball on January 05, 2023, 07:13:41 AM
Looks like it was from here but the original author didn't provide a source either
https://captimes.com/opinion/dave-zweifel/opinion-growing-aversion-to-vaccines-puts-us-all-at-risk/article_ee9466f7-f120-5d99-85d1-fbd39ced3d79.html
LOL, Dave Zweifel? Been a long time since I saw that name. I didn't know that guy was still alive much less writing. Anyway, a poor job by a former newspaper editor...or excuse me..."editor emeritus." ::)
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on January 05, 2023, 04:48:17 AM
You said: "Most of the 81 infected children are old enough to get vaccinated, but their parents chose not to, officials said."
I don't know where you got this information, because you didn't provide a source or a link, but apparently it was wrong.
Says the guy who literally passed along misinformation.
The statement literally comes directly from the link embedded in the article MU82 provided. It is cited in the article.
https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/columbus/viz/MeaslesPublicReport/MeaslesPublicReport?publish=yes
(https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/columbus/viz/MeaslesPublicReport/MeaslesPublicReport?publish=yes)
Which shows that 74 of the 82 children infected were unvaccinated.
nm
Quote from: forgetful on January 05, 2023, 11:26:45 AM
The statement literally comes directly from the link embedded in the article MU82 provided. It is cited in the article.
https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/columbus/viz/MeaslesPublicReport/MeaslesPublicReport?publish=yes
(https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/columbus/viz/MeaslesPublicReport/MeaslesPublicReport?publish=yes)
Which shows that 74 of the 82 children infected were unvaccinated.
First MMR dose is supposed to come between 12-15 months (parent of a toddler). So what this data tells us is that 23 of the 74 unvaccinated were certainly not old enough to receive it so not due to parents' choice. 23 certainly were old enough to receive it which on some level makes it a parents choice (whether that's because of anti-vax stance, ignorance, lack of money, etc we don't know). That leaves the 36 1-2 year olds that were old enough to receive that vaccine but we don't know if the parent was choosing not to vaccinate them or if they just hadn't had that doctor's appointment yet (probably safe to assume that at least a majority of them were at least late getting that first dose). I assume the 4 partially vaccinated fall into this group as well. There's also the 4 with unknown vaccination statuses.
I think what we can say certainty from this data is that at least 28% of the cases involve a child whose parents have chosen not to vaccinate them. 28% of the cases involve a child who was not old enough to vaccinate.
Quote from: TAMU, the Wizard of MU Basketball on January 05, 2023, 02:14:47 PM
First MMR dose is supposed to come between 12-15 months (parent of a toddler). So what this data tells us is that 23 of the 74 unvaccinated were certainly not old enough to receive it so not due to parents' choice. 23 certainly were old enough to receive it which on some level makes it a parents choice (whether that's because of anti-vax stance, ignorance, lack of money, etc we don't know). That leaves the 36 1-2 year olds that were old enough to receive that vaccine but we don't know if the parent was choosing not to vaccinate them or if they just hadn't had that doctor's appointment yet (probably safe to assume that at least a majority of them were at least late getting that first dose). I assume the 4 partially vaccinated fall into this group as well. There's also the 4 with unknown vaccination statuses.
I think what we can say certainty from this data is that at least 28% of the cases involve a child whose parents have chosen not to vaccinate them. 28% of the cases involve a child who was not old enough to vaccinate.
Having a 2 year old, the amount of times our vaccination appointment gets cancelled due to not having any vaccines is crazy. I think we are on our 3rd or 4th try and have tried a few spots. Plus she needs 3 doses. She would fall into the category of not being fully vaccinated, but it's not due to a lack of effort.
Quote from: cheebs09 on January 05, 2023, 03:56:21 PM
Having a 2 year old, the amount of times our vaccination appointment gets cancelled due to not having any vaccines is crazy. I think we are on our 3rd or 4th try and have tried a few spots. Plus she needs 3 doses. She would fall into the category of not being fully vaccinated, but it's not due to a lack of effort.
That's really unfortunate. We've been lucky, haven't had that happen to us yet
Quote from: cheebs09 on January 05, 2023, 03:56:21 PM
Having a 2 year old, the amount of times our vaccination appointment gets cancelled due to not having any vaccines is crazy. I think we are on our 3rd or 4th try and have tried a few spots. Plus she needs 3 doses. She would fall into the category of not being fully vaccinated, but it's not due to a lack of effort.
My son got his 2 month shots 2 days shy of his 2 month mark. If we had waited till after the 2 month mark, we had at least a 10-14 day delay due to scheduling and availability.
I know anti-vax became a big deal with COVID but I feel the narrative extending to all vaccines and inoculations is getting a bit much and stretching. Empirically, I know 6-7 couples who were against the COVID vaccine, most I believe still have no gotten it. None have withheld other vaccines from their kids, and 3 of those couples had kids aging into the standard rounds of vaccines all anti-vaxxers ardently avoid, since COVID vaccines were out.
Quote from: TAMU, the Wizard of MU Basketball on January 05, 2023, 02:14:47 PM
First MMR dose is supposed to come between 12-15 months (parent of a toddler). So what this data tells us is that 23 of the 74 unvaccinated were certainly not old enough to receive it so not due to parents' choice. 23 certainly were old enough to receive it which on some level makes it a parents choice (whether that's because of anti-vax stance, ignorance, lack of money, etc we don't know). That leaves the 36 1-2 year olds that were old enough to receive that vaccine but we don't know if the parent was choosing not to vaccinate them or if they just hadn't had that doctor's appointment yet (probably safe to assume that at least a majority of them were at least late getting that first dose). I assume the 4 partially vaccinated fall into this group as well. There's also the 4 with unknown vaccination statuses.
I think what we can say certainty from this data is that at least 28% of the cases involve a child whose parents have chosen not to vaccinate them. 28% of the cases involve a child who was not old enough to vaccinate.
The original article states that "most of them were unvaccinated" and "most were eligible age wise for vaccination" the data supports this.
I wasn't disagreeing with anything or debating numbers, just pointing out to Sultan who claimed that MU82 was spreading false information, and not providing links to the data, when both the article and the link within it supported what was published and what MU82 wrote.
Never mind . You're just being intellectually dishonest now.
Quote from: TAMU, the Wizard of MU Basketball on January 05, 2023, 04:10:12 PM
That's really unfortunate. We've been lucky, haven't had that happen to us yet
Just to clarify, this is just Covid shots luckily. We haven't had any issues with other shots.
Sounds like an equity issue
Diamond, of Diamond & Silk, just totally owned the libs.
Please proceed, anti-vaxxers.
Quote from: reinko on November 30, 2022, 04:31:27 PM
I am sure Diamond from Diamond and Silk who is currently hospitalized with the CoCo is enthralled by your "data".
🤔
Sad news, guys. Turns out Damar Hamlin actually died and the NFL is trotting out a body double.
https://www.mediaite.com/sports/anti-vax-conspiracy-theorists-spread-absurd-claim-damar-hamlin-is-not-alive-and-nfl-is-using-a-body-double/
Quote from: Pakuni on January 24, 2023, 02:59:37 PM
Sad news, guys. Turns out Damar Hamlin actually died and the NFL is trotting out a body double.
https://www.mediaite.com/sports/anti-vax-conspiracy-theorists-spread-absurd-claim-damar-hamlin-is-not-alive-and-nfl-is-using-a-body-double/
There are definitely some of these sudden death cases where the vaccine at least plays a factor but this particular conspiracy theory is wayyy out there.
Quote from: statnik on January 24, 2023, 06:45:49 PM
There are definitely some of these sudden death cases where the vaccine at least plays a factor but this particular conspiracy theory is wayyy out there.
> I believe in some conspiracy theories but not others
Quote from: statnik on January 24, 2023, 06:45:49 PM
There are definitely some of these sudden death cases where the vaccine at least plays a factor but this particular conspiracy theory is wayyy out there.
::)
Quote from: statnik on January 24, 2023, 06:45:49 PM
There are definitely some of these sudden death cases where the vaccine at least plays a factor but this particular conspiracy theory is wayyy out there.
Literally nope.
Quote from: statnik on January 24, 2023, 06:45:49 PM
There are definitely some of these sudden death cases where the vaccine at least plays a factor but this particular conspiracy theory is wayyy out there.
Oh, there are? Do tell. You have something to back this up undoubtedly.
At least you posted this is the right thread.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on January 25, 2023, 12:29:08 PM
Literally nope.
C'mom man, hoo ya gonna turn ta wen yo schmeckle turns grey and falls off, hey?
Nice selfie of you and rocket.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 25, 2023, 03:04:03 PM
C'mom man, hoo ya gonna turn ta wen yo schmeckle turns grey and falls off, hey?
Jesus
aina?
Quote from: tower912 on January 25, 2023, 03:13:35 PM
Nice selfie of you and rocket.
what's your fixation on me tower? stunted growth syndrome? little man? maybe you could use a little more debriefing? suffering from being unable to take out your inadequacies on the mashy? do something man cuz you're screaming out for help
Thanks for the laugh.
Everyone should probably read this. And for the anti-vax/ pro death crowd, please go line by line and provide the studies that disprove all of the points.
https://yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com/p/covid-19-vaccines-and-sudden-deaths
Thank you.
Quote from: MUDPT on January 26, 2023, 05:28:35 AM
Everyone should probably read this. And for the anti-vax/ pro death crowd, please go line by line and provide the studies that disprove all of the points.
https://yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com/p/covid-19-vaccines-and-sudden-deaths
Thanks MUDPT. all of this data is publicly available, yet people like Wallstreet and our rapidly mentally declining dentists will never read or acknowledge the slew verifiable facts.
Because as we know, the nefarious "they" are hiding the real results.
Careful, side effects of the vaccine!
My concern is no proper research is actually being done with these myriad 'sudden deaths' and very few of the ones in athletes have been diagnosed as being related to COVID. Imagine someone told you this would be popping up in the news on a daily basis at this point. There's also real research that's been done on the blood of vaccinated individuals, and a very small minority had normal presentation:
https://ijvtpr.com/index.php/IJVTPR/article/view/47
Quote from: statnik on January 26, 2023, 06:23:59 PM
My concern is no proper research is actually being done with these myriad 'sudden deaths' and very few of the ones in athletes have been diagnosed as being related to COVID. Imagine someone told you this would be popping up in the news on a daily basis at this point. There's also real research that's been done on the blood of vaccinated individuals, and a very small minority had normal presentation:
https://ijvtpr.com/index.php/IJVTPR/article/view/47
Do you have anything from a reputable journals? That link is a "journal" that appeared at the beginning of the pandemic and is a political mouthpiece.
The editor in chief is a Ph.D in General Linguistics from the University of Rochester in New York
If you went to Marquette you should be able to check your own sources. I honestly shouldn't have had to look this up for you.
I like 'Benzi Dental Clinic'
Quote from: Skatastrophy on January 26, 2023, 06:40:29 PM
Do you have anything from a reputable journals? That link is a "journal" that appeared at the beginning of the pandemic and is a political mouthpiece.
The editor in chief is a Ph.D in General Linguistics from the University of Rochester in New York
If you went to Marquette you should be able to check your own sources. I honestly shouldn't have had to look this up for you.
Can't wait for forgetful's review of this article. :)
Quote from: statnik on January 26, 2023, 06:23:59 PM
My concern is no proper research is actually being done with these myriad 'sudden deaths' and very few of the ones in athletes have been diagnosed as being related to COVID.
I am not entirely clear what you are trying to say here, particularly the second portion of the sentence.
Nonetheless, did you read the link from MUDPT? The sections that address the "sudden death" and "athletes dying in droves"? There is no "proper research" being conducted because there is zero evidence either of these things are based on fact.
Again, if you have evidence either of things are real please post your sources.
#evidencenomatta
Quote from: statnik on January 26, 2023, 06:23:59 PM
My concern is no proper research is actually being done with these myriad 'sudden deaths' and very few of the ones in athletes have been diagnosed as being related to COVID. Imagine someone told you this would be popping up in the news on a daily basis at this point. There's also real research that's been done on the blood of vaccinated individuals, and a very small minority had normal presentation:
https://ijvtpr.com/index.php/IJVTPR/article/view/47
Time after time in this thread people who have zero critical thinking skills get dunked on for linking their 'sources'.
Absolutely amazing that they continue to do so without regard.
And the rest of the woke experts simply drink the Kool Aid, unquestionably, without critical thinking skills if their own. So much for their Marquette education, hey?
We are aware of the problems coming out of the dental skill. Though I do appreciate how you have raised your selfie game.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 27, 2023, 06:17:17 AM
And the rest of the woke experts simply drink the Kool Aid, unquestionably, without critical thinking skills if their own. So much for their Marquette education, hey?
You got vaccinated, Doc. I'm expecting you to experience #suddendeath from it any minute now.
Chit happens, aina?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 27, 2023, 06:17:17 AM
And the rest of the woke experts simply drink the Kool Aid, unquestionably, without critical thinking skills if their own. So much for their Marquette education, hey?
What's the "woke Kool Aid" exactly? This?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSfeCqKty9o
Or this?
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/v_EUa1buffQ
You getting played like a fiddle. You have been for almost three years. And you sill don't realize it.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 27, 2023, 06:17:17 AM
And the rest of the woke experts simply drink the Kool Aid, unquestionably, without critical thinking skills if their own. So much for their Marquette education, hey?
Kool aid from the New England Journal of Medicine? Fill 'er up
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 27, 2023, 06:17:17 AM
And the rest of the woke experts simply drink the Kool Aid, unquestionably, without critical thinking skills if their own. So much for their Marquette education, hey?
Interesting. Does critical thinking now mean coming to conclusions that aren't supported by facts? Because every time one of you is challenged to actually back up your conspiracy theories, whether it is roqqet's touting of HCQ and Ivermectin or the latest internet nonsense of sudden deaths, you either post easily debunked sources or slink away silently.
In fact, when it has been proven you've been lied to, such as when it was shown the data for Ivermectin studies was faked, one would think it might make you suspect about those claims going forward, but instead it just causes you to double down on the dumb. I'm sure in his heart of hearts, roqqet still think Ivermectin is an effective treatment for COVID, despite a mountain of evidence against the idea and not a single study for it. Talk about Kool Aid.
That's some great critical thinking skills.
Quote from: TSmith34, No'er of Bawl on January 27, 2023, 12:41:26 PM
Interesting. Does critical thinking now mean coming to conclusions that aren't supported by facts? Because every time one of you is challenged to actually back up your conspiracy theories, whether it is roqqet's touting of HCQ and Ivermectin or the latest internet nonsense of sudden deaths, you either post easily debunked sources or slink away silently.
In fact, when it has been proven you've been lied to, such as when it was shown the data for Ivermectin studies was faked, one would think it might make you suspect about those claims going forward, but instead it just causes you to double down on the dumb. I'm sure in his heart of hearts, roqqet still think Ivermectin is an effective treatment for COVID, despite a mountain of evidence against the idea and not a single study for it. Talk about Kool Aid.
That's some great critical thinking skills.
We just haven't waited long enough for the real, honest to god truthful studies to be published.
Quote from: ATL MU Warrior on January 27, 2023, 01:36:44 PM
We just haven't waited long enough for the real, honest to god truthful studies to be published.
5 years to judge, aina?
Quote from: ATL MU Warrior on January 27, 2023, 01:36:44 PM
We just haven't waited long enough for the real, honest to god truthful studies to be published.
How long do you have to wait? Are you cool with millions more people dying? You do know that deaths plummeted in elderly after the introduction of vaccines right?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 27, 2023, 06:17:17 AM
And the rest of the woke experts simply drink the Kool Aid, unquestionably, without critical thinking skills if their own. So much for their Marquette education, hey?
I'm going to take a guess that I'm in the top 1% on this board with regards to COVID knowledge. My job for the past almost 3 years has involved caring COVID patients. Ask myself or anyone of my colleagues, if they should be vaccinated, 100% would say yes. Those of us who have studied it and have seen it ravage humans on a daily basis, were overjoyed when the vaccine was approved by experts. Drinking kool-aid implies following blindly the thoughts of one man. There were thousands of people who developed the vaccines and then went through the initial trials to get human approval. That's not drinking kool-aid. That's a belief in the scientific discovery (whether you want to believe that God helped or not, is up to you). The speed that which it came, literally saved hundreds of thousands of lives. My Marquette education was always going to lead me to face this disease with my abilities, to help my community. Cura personalis aina?
Quote from: MUDPT on January 28, 2023, 05:43:12 AM
How long do you have to wait? Are you cool with millions more people dying? You do know that deaths plummeted in elderly after the introduction of vaccines right?
My man, I was imitating rocket and the other morons. It was a joke.
Quote from: ATL MU Warrior on January 28, 2023, 06:54:16 AM
My man, I was imitating rocket and the other morons. It was a joke.
Sorry. I don't know who is being serious or not anymore. Go Marquette!
Quote from: ATL MU Warrior on January 28, 2023, 06:54:16 AM
My man, I was imitating rocket and the other morons. It was a joke.
Sorry, you're a science denier now. I'll send you your free Russia Times subscription via DM
Quote from: Skatastrophy on January 28, 2023, 08:39:11 AM
Sorry, you're a science denier now. I'll send you your free Russia Times subscription via DM
Thank you very much.
Maybe I'll be invited to the next meat-eating summit.
Quote from: ATL MU Warrior on January 28, 2023, 08:49:17 AM
Thank you very much.
Maybe I'll be invited to the next meat-balleating summit.
FIFY
Quote from: ATL MU Warrior on January 28, 2023, 08:49:17 AM
Thank you very much.
Maybe I'll be invited to the next meat- (B)eating summit.
FIFY
Quote from: MUDPT on January 28, 2023, 05:43:12 AM
How long do you have to wait? Are you cool with millions more people dying? You do know that deaths plummeted in elderly after the introduction of vaccines right?
I buy that it can be helpful and even essential for the elderly and those with multiple comorbidities but this notion that it's an obvious positive decision for everyone is what I'm trying to argue against.
Quote from: statnik on January 28, 2023, 10:11:27 AM
I buy that it can be helpful and even essential for the elderly and those with multiple comorbidities but this notion that it's an obvious positive decision for everyone is what I'm trying to argue against.
But there is no negative
Quote from: Hards Alumni on January 29, 2023, 05:01:53 PM
But there is no negative
C'mon man, you can't say that with authority. The effects of this gene altering vaccine will likely not be know for years. This was an experimental vaccine that was rushed to market. We were all led to believe that you won't get covid if vaccinated.
Remember thalidomide? After Jesus, who ya gonna call when your gurkee turns grey and sloughs off, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 29, 2023, 05:35:18 PM
C'mon man, you can't say that with authority. The effects of this gene altering vaccine will likely not be know for years. This was an experimental vaccine that was rushed to market. We were all led to believe that you won't get covid if vaccinated.
Remember thalidomide? After Jesus, who ya gonna call when your gurkee turns grey and sloughs off, hey?
"Gene altering." 🤣🤣🤣
This from a "medical professional."
mRNA vaccines aren't all that new. Isn't that one of the reasons the Covid vaccine was able to be developed so quickly?
Yes.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 29, 2023, 05:35:18 PM
C'mon man, you can't say that with authority. The effects of this gene altering vaccine will likely not be know for years. This was an experimental vaccine that was rushed to market. We were all led to believe that you won't get covid if vaccinated.
Remember thalidomide? After Jesus, who ya gonna call when your gurkee turns grey and sloughs off, hey?
You should talk with this guy:
The one that liked to credit Trump with getting the vaccine created:Yeah, dat fookin' fool only got da vaccine in motion, and in warp speed, while in office so C'mon Man Joe could be the hero and place an order, with one swift stroke of his pen. Oh, how easy, but we won't go there, hey?
Had Trump not put the wheels of vaccine production in motion, and at the speed of light, Biden would have no vaccine to purchase and distribute at this point. Talk 'bout savin' lives, hey?
The one that begged to take the vaccine. The one that got angry about someone else getting the vaccine before him:Fahrenheit, my ass is takin' dat vaccine da furst moment itz available ta mee, hey?
Eye'm jellus. If ya score sum xtra Pfizer or Moderna, help a bro out, hey?
Can't get the vaccine quick enough, being 10 inches from people's grills and such all day, aina?
Why in the hell would Biden give the vaccine to the 9/11 mastermind before Americans? They can all rot in motherfookin' hell, aina?
The one that urged people to get the vaccine and get on with their lives:Get your vaccinations and start to live again. Science is real, hey?
There is risk in living every day. Get your vaccination and start living again. That's the end game. Just do it, aina?
The vaccine is the end game, hey?
They still are not. The vaccine is the end game and your get out of jail card. Take it in your arm and 2 weeks later you are done with this nonsense, hey?
That touted the effectiveness of the vaccines:Once vaccinated, your chances of getting covid are extremely slim. And, if you do, getting very ill and/or dying are essentially off the table. Look at it this way, if you were told you had a 95% chance of winning tonight's lottery, you'd buy a ticket, aina?
Strongly disagree. Even with 95% immunity, you have a 99% chance of surviving covid , if you contract it. Pretty good odds, wouldn't you say? Those who are skeptical and/or afraid need to do whatever makes them comfortable. Just don't impose any restrictions on the rest of us who are vaccinated or willing to live "normally." Life is a gamble every day. People die in their sleep or can die during sexual intercourse. So, pick your poison. Carrying on, as we have for nearly a year now is crazy. Time to end this nonsense and all that goes with it.
There also is no evidence that those who are vaccinated harbor the virus, and certainly don't harbor enough to spread it.
If you've been vaccinated, you are not a threat to anyone, nor are they a threat to you. For those who have yet to be immunized, they should do whatever they see fit to do, to protect themselves.
The vaccine essentially takes hospitalization and death off the table even if you are one of the unlucky 5-28% who could be infected after full vaccination. If I told you to buy a lottery ticket for tonight's drawing since you would have a 72-95% chance of winning the jackpot, everyone would run to the corner gas station with dollars in hand. So, what's the big deal? Those who are still skeptical or fearful can remain that way and don't have to change. But, let the rest of us carry on as we did pre-March 2020. Follow the science because its real, hey?
Right on! Get vaccinated and live your life. This chit is gonna be around, so learn to live with it, hey?
Vaccination takes serious illness, hospitalization, and death off the table. Its over. Carry on.
And even tried to help others get vaccinated:Here y'all...I may be able to save your life.
If you fit into the categories now eligible for vaccinations, and are in the area, contact:
Infinity Pharmacy
2700 S. 60 St. 53219
(414) 988-0008
Time slots are readily available. Full disclosure, I receive no compensation for referrals. This is done from the goodness of my heart and the desire to get everyone vaccinated asap, hey?
Thought vaccine skepticism was "unreal":I've had several discussions over the past couple of weeks with folks who refuse the vaccine. Their stance centers around skepticism and not wanting to be guinea pigs. Unreal, aina?
And knew boosters would be the way to go:Yes, there will be variants, like there is each year with different flu stains. That's what boosters will take care of. Get your vaccination and its over, except for those like Mike who insist on drinking the kool-aid until the very, very last dog is hung, aina?
Holy crap.
Are those for real?
Brilliant.
Dementia is real
Funniest freakin' thing I've read on the interwebs so far in 2023.
Quote from: MU82 on January 29, 2023, 08:24:44 PM
Funniest freakin' thing I've read on the interwebs so far in 2023.
At least he has the scanner
Wannabe fascist DeSantis keeps his disinfo training rolling:
Gov. DeSantis Incorrectly Claims Covid-19 Booster Makes You 'More Likely To Get Infected'
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucelee/2023/01/19/gov-desantis-incorrectly-claims-covid-19-boosters-makes-you-more-likely-to-get-infected/?sh=b6cc7d947fb9
"De Governor asserted, "[Florida Surgeon General] Joe Ladapo can talk a little bit more about it. Like almost every study now has said, with these new boosters, you're more likely to get infected with the bivalent booster." What? How is that the case? Well, it is easy to "DeBunk" such claims because "every study" did not say what DeSantis had said. In fact, studies have said exactly "DeOpposite."
Pity the mentally challenged dentists who hear this and can't tell fact from fiction.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 29, 2023, 05:35:18 PM
C'mon man, you can't say that with authority. The effects of this gene altering vaccine will likely not be know for years. This was an experimental vaccine that was rushed to market. We were all led to believe that you won't get covid if vaccinated.
Remember thalidomide? After Jesus, who ya gonna call when your gurkee turns grey and sloughs off, hey?
You don't understand how the vaccine works, and I can't say I'm surprised. Nor do you understand that the amount of thalidomide in older vaccines was easily taken care of by the liver.
You're a fool.
Man, disappointed in you, hey?
i'm gonna stick my arse out here fully realizing all the lauded epidemiologists here will be handing it back to me, but you guys don't know-
1) the scope of the people who've received the vax with "detrimental effects" including death
2) the long term effects of this vaccin, the side effects, i.e. thalidomide
go ahead and throw bleach, ivermectin, remdesivir, etc etc...ya'll don't know, but it may take years for the studies and for one to be allowed to speak out about them... kinda like on this board-you guys already have this one nutted i guess, well thats what dr joe and meeeka tells ya anyway
Quote from: rocket surgeon on January 31, 2023, 08:00:43 PM
i'm gonna stick my arse out here fully realizing all the lauded epidemiologists here will be handing it back to me, but you guys don't know-
1) the scope of the people who've received the vax with "detrimental effects" including death
2) the long term effects of this vaccin, the side effects, i.e. thalidomide
go ahead and throw bleach, ivermectin, remdesivir, etc etc...ya'll don't know, but it may take years for the studies and for one to be allowed to speak out about them... kinda like on this board-you guys already have this one nutted i guess, well thats what dr joe and meeeka tells ya anyway
So no matter how many times your idiotic stances have been shown to be wrong, you're just gonna claim that it "may take years" for the real studies that will eventually prove them right. 🙄🙄🙄
This dental school of ours...
Oh yes, "no one is allowed to speak out about them". You see, there are all these people that have all the data that prove roqqet is right, but they are all being silenced. Not allowed to speak out! Terrible!
And who is that is silencing all these people who know the truth? YOU BETTER NOT ASK, OR ELSE.
Conspiracy theory "healthcare professional".
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 31, 2023, 07:39:45 PM
Man, disappointed in you, hey?
"Get your vaccinations and start to live again. Science is real, hey?"
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on January 31, 2023, 08:22:52 PM
So no matter how many times your idiotic stances have been shown to be wrong, you're just gonna claim that it "may take years" for the real studies that will eventually prove them right. 🙄🙄🙄
This dental school of ours...
Yes, of course, that is the back pedal. Don't worry, they'll be dead before we actually know what the long term side effects are! ::) ::)
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 31, 2023, 07:39:45 PM
Man, disappointed in you, hey?
Honestly given what was just brought up in the receipts, you should at the very least do some self reflection.
Quote from: rocket surgeon on January 31, 2023, 08:00:43 PM
i'm gonna stick my arse out here fully realizing all the lauded epidemiologists here will be handing it back to me, but you guys don't know-
1) the scope of the people who've received the vax with "detrimental effects" including death
2) the long term effects of this vaccin, the side effects, i.e. thalidomide
go ahead and throw bleach, ivermectin, remdesivir, etc etc...ya'll don't know, but it may take years for the studies and for one to be allowed to speak out about them... kinda like on this board-you guys already have this one nutted i guess, well thats what dr joe and meeeka tells ya anyway
You remind me of my friend at Marquette who was a brilliant PA and then proceeded to get hit by a car and blame the weather.
Opinions are like ass holes. Everyone has one, aina?
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on January 31, 2023, 08:22:52 PM
So no matter how many times your idiotic stances have been shown to be wrong, you're just gonna claim that it "may take years" for the real studies that will eventually prove them right. 🙄🙄🙄
This dental school of ours...
What shows the bias and people's inexplicable trust in the government and big pharma is how quickly people distrust HCQ and Ivermectin after having uses in the past and yet similarly how quickly they fall in line despite limited timeframe to study side effects of a vaccine.
Quote from: statnik on February 01, 2023, 07:04:59 AM
What shows the bias and people's inexplicable trust in the government and big pharma is how quickly people distrust HCQ and Ivermectin after having uses in the past and yet similarly how quickly they fall in line despite limited timeframe to study side effects of a vaccine.
Limited timeframe? We have had a worldwide mass vaccination campaign going on for two years! There is no statistical evidence showing that it is causing significant harm, deaths or altering anyone's DNA. We are talking about billions of people.
What it has shown is that the death rate is significantly higher for those who are unvaccinated.
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/united-states-rates-of-covid-19-deaths-by-vaccination-status?country=~50%2B
This has nothing to do with trust in the government or big pharma. It's just simple, black and white statistics.
Quote from: statnik on February 01, 2023, 07:04:59 AM
What shows the bias and people's inexplicable trust in the government and big pharma is how quickly people distrust HCQ and Ivermectin after having uses in the past and yet similarly how quickly they fall in line despite limited timeframe to study side effects of a vaccine.
Not really, no. HCQ and Ivermectin were subjected to a plethora of studies to show whether or not they could be useful tools in treating COVID. Had they shown any efficacy they would have been gladly accepted in the effort to save lives and misery.
But they didn't show any efficacy whatsoever. None of the validated, peer reviewed studies showed them to be of any use against COVID regardless of their use for other purposes. But still, for political reasons, one side INSISTED they were effective. And, when it was proven that in a number of studies the "researchers" even faked the data to try to prove these things worked, did it perhaps cause that side to rethink their position? Why of course not, not only was the science not followed, it was actively disregarded because it didn't align with their political beliefs.
Instead of questioning why people were faking the data to try to show these treatments worked, instead of questioning why one side even made treating a deadly epidemic political in the first place, the mentally declining dentists dug in further, pulling their tinfoil hats on ever tighter and insisting that the nefarious "they" were suppressing the truth and just wait, any day now the real studies would come out.
So take the challenge roqqet has failed repeatedly: show a single study that can stand up to scrutiny proving HCQ or Ivermectin are effective treatments for COVID.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on February 01, 2023, 03:09:15 AM
Opinions are like ass holes. Everyone has one, aina?
Only one side has brought opinions to this discussion, imo
Quote from: rocket surgeon on January 31, 2023, 08:00:43 PM
i'm gonna stick my arse out here fully realizing all the lauded epidemiologists here will be handing it back to me, but you guys don't know-
1) the scope of the people who've received the vax with "detrimental effects" including death
2) the long term effects of this vaccin, the side effects, i.e. thalidomide
go ahead and throw bleach, ivermectin, remdesivir, etc etc...ya'll don't know, but it may take years for the studies and for one to be allowed to speak out about them... kinda like on this board-you guys already have this one nutted i guess, well thats what dr joe and meeeka tells ya anyway
We don't know "long term effects." Except the sickest/ oldest/ most people with co-morbidities would have dropped dead after the vaccine administration and yet they didn't. Deaths plummeted after the introduction of vaccines.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on February 01, 2023, 03:09:15 AM
Opinions are like ass holes. Everyone has one, aina?
The trouble is when people present their opinions as facts and can't back them up with any data other than, "big pharma", "the government" and disreputable scientists.
Quote from: MUDPT on February 01, 2023, 11:38:21 AM
We don't know "long term effects." Except the sickest/ oldest/ most people with co-morbidities would have dropped dead after the vaccine administration and yet they didn't. Deaths plummeted after the introduction of vaccines.
Yes, but people on the right have entered a post-truth world where science, facts, and data no longer matter. Nothing shows this more clearly than parsing the data by red counties vs. blue counties. COVID death rates and excess mortality are correlated by political ideology.
People like Tucker and Ingraham promoting suspicion about the vaccines side-by-side with extolling the virtues of snake oil remedies like HCQ and Ivermectin have
literally led a couple of hundred thousand people to early deaths. But their followers don't care, no amount of verifiable data will convince them otherwise. I no longer care either.
Now that everyone who wants the vaccines and boosters can get them, and we've built up quite a bit of resistance to COVID, I fully support their desire to partake of their death march in the name of their ideology.
Please proceed anti-vaxxers.
Quote from: TSmith34, Inc. on February 01, 2023, 01:18:48 PM
Yes, but people on the right have entered a post-truth world where science, facts, and data no longer matter. Nothing shows this more clearly than parsing the data by red counties vs. blue counties. COVID death rates and excess mortality are correlated by political ideology.
People like Tucker and Ingraham promoting suspicion about the vaccines side-by-side with extolling the virtues of snake oil remedies like HCQ and Ivermectin have literally led a couple of hundred thousand people to early deaths. But their followers don't care, no amount of verifiable data will convince them otherwise. I no longer care either.
Now that everyone who wants the vaccines and boosters can get them, and we've built up quite a bit of resistance to COVID, I fully support their desire to partake of their death march in the name of their ideology.
Please proceed anti-vaxxers.
I know it would be hard to prosecute so you couldn't bring a criminal case easily (e.g. negligent manslaughter), but I'd love to see someone bring a civil case against them, saying that they knowingly lied to their audience and that it directly led to the death of a loved one who died, because they listened to them.
I would think you'd have a chance in a civil suit. And maybe, we'd see some of these political opportunists think a bit before intentionally spreading dangerous propaganda.
Quote from: forgetful on February 01, 2023, 02:44:14 PM
I know it would be hard to prosecute so you couldn't bring a criminal case easily (e.g. negligent manslaughter), but I'd love to see someone bring a civil case against them, saying that they knowingly lied to their audience and that it directly led to the death of a loved one who died, because they listened to them.
I would think you'd have a chance in a civil suit. And maybe, we'd see some of these political opportunists think a bit before intentionally spreading dangerous propaganda.
Could they though? Has anyone successful sued a pastor or church for urging someone to pray away a treatable sickness that lead to death?
Quote from: forgetful on February 01, 2023, 02:44:14 PM
I know it would be hard to prosecute so you couldn't bring a criminal case easily (e.g. negligent manslaughter), but I'd love to see someone bring a civil case against them, saying that they knowingly lied to their audience and that it directly led to the death of a loved one who died, because they listened to them.
I would think you'd have a chance in a civil suit. And maybe, we'd see some of these political opportunists think a bit before intentionally spreading dangerous propaganda.
Much like the Dominion Voting Machine lawsuit where Fox is being sued for $1.5bil for libel and most expect Fox to lose.
I suspect the pharmaceuticals companies can sue for the same reason.
Quote from: JWags85 on February 01, 2023, 02:56:55 PM
Could they though? Has anyone successful sued a pastor or church for urging someone to pray away a treatable sickness that lead to death?
There is a key difference. Churches/Pastors can point to legitimate religious beliefs (i.e. they truly believe that God can cure the disease). Parents though have been charged and convicted for "faith healing" leading to their children's death.
For Tucker et al., I think if someone looked into them, you could find documentation that they do not believe what they are saying, but are saying it anyway. In that regard, they are knowingly lying to people about something that can/did contribute to their death. I think that would be enough in a civil case, not sure about in a criminal case, although cases against parents that were successful could be precedent.
Quote from: MU Fan in Connecticut on February 01, 2023, 03:02:53 PM
Much like the Dominion Voting Machine lawsuit where Fox is being sued for $1.5bil for libel and most expect Fox to lose.
I suspect the pharmaceuticals companies can sue for the same reason.
Yes, exactly. Once Fox/OAN/Newsmax et al saw that there could be financial repercussions from their knowingly lying and causing harm to Dominion, they shut down their lies.
On the vaccine side, I said here long ago that their calculus is that the upside of keeping their viewers perpetually in a state of misinformed rage and grievance is far greater to them than the downside of killing a few hundred thousand of them. This will continue to be true until they face the same sort of repercussions as they face with Dominion.
Quote from: forgetful on February 01, 2023, 02:44:14 PM
I know it would be hard to prosecute so you couldn't bring a criminal case easily (e.g. negligent manslaughter), but I'd love to see someone bring a civil case against them, saying that they knowingly lied to their audience and that it directly led to the death of a loved one who died, because they listened to them.
I would think you'd have a chance in a civil suit. And maybe, we'd see some of these political opportunists think a bit before intentionally spreading dangerous propaganda.
Alas, Tucker already has proven the "nobody with functioning brain cells believes me" defense is a winner.
When Tucker Carlson says on his show "[r]emember the facts of the story; these are undisputed" no reasonable person would believe that he was about to state facts. At least, that was Tucker Carlson's own argument in defending himself from a libel suit.
That argument convinced U.S. District Judge Mary Kay Vyskocil, who dismissed a lawsuit brought by model and actress Karen McDougal. McDougal sued for defamation, alleging Carlson baselessly told his audience she was extorting the President. President Trump allegedly paid $150,000 to help keep quiet a year-long affair with the former Playboy model.
According to Judge Vyskocil, "Fox persuasively argues . . . that given Mr. Carlson's reputation, any reasonable viewer arrives with an appropriate amount of skepticism about the statements he makes." She doesn't stop there, writing that "[w]hether the Court frames Mr. Carlson's statements as exaggeration, non-literal commentary, or simply bloviating for his audience, the conclusion remains the same—the statements are not actionable."
https://www.findlaw.com/legalblogs/greedy-associates/tucker-carlson-successfully-argues-nobody-really-believes-tucker-carlson-is-reporting-facts/
Quote from: Pakuni on February 01, 2023, 04:15:18 PM
Alas, Tucker already has proven the "nobody with functioning brain cells believes me" defense is a winner.
When Tucker Carlson says on his show "[r]emember the facts of the story; these are undisputed" no reasonable person would believe that he was about to state facts. At least, that was Tucker Carlson's own argument in defending himself from a libel suit.
That argument convinced U.S. District Judge Mary Kay Vyskocil, who dismissed a lawsuit brought by model and actress Karen McDougal. McDougal sued for defamation, alleging Carlson baselessly told his audience she was extorting the President. President Trump allegedly paid $150,000 to help keep quiet a year-long affair with the former Playboy model.
According to Judge Vyskocil, "Fox persuasively argues . . . that given Mr. Carlson's reputation, any reasonable viewer arrives with an appropriate amount of skepticism about the statements he makes." She doesn't stop there, writing that "[w]hether the Court frames Mr. Carlson's statements as exaggeration, non-literal commentary, or simply bloviating for his audience, the conclusion remains the same—the statements are not actionable."
https://www.findlaw.com/legalblogs/greedy-associates/tucker-carlson-successfully-argues-nobody-really-believes-tucker-carlson-is-reporting-facts/
I totally forgot about that case, maybe because it seems like that should be an onion article, not an actual court defense/decision.
That's the problem with the reasonable person standard. Oftentimes we are not dealing with reasonable people.
I would temper your expectations that there is any viable route to legal relief like you were discussing above.
Sounds like pakuni & 🐷🐷 watch more fox news than most on the right.
For the diehard believers that the vaccines are beneficial for every single person, what would be your argument for those who already had COVID (let's say it was a typical cold/flu severity for them) and they're young/healthy? Keep in mind it's more commonly those who have had it already that tend to get short term flu like symptoms from the vax passing through.
Quote from: statnik on February 02, 2023, 04:29:45 PM
For the diehard believers that the vaccines are beneficial for every single person, what would be your argument for those who already had COVID (let's say it was a typical cold/flu severity for them) and they're young/healthy? Keep in mind it's more commonly those who have had it already that tend to get short term flu like symptoms from the vax passing through.
It's safe and effective at preventing death regardless of previous infection. Despite your beliefs, no one is getting sick from or damaged by the vaccine. If you believe differently, please show your work.
Also, calling anyone here a "diehard believer" is a misnomer. I don't
believe the vaccine works, I
know it works. There are hundreds of studies that prove that to be the case.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on February 02, 2023, 04:37:45 PM
It's safe and effective at preventing death regardless of previous infection. Despite your beliefs, no one is getting sick from or damaged by the vaccine. If you believe differently, please show your work.
Also, calling anyone here a "diehard believer" is a misnomer. I don't believe the vaccine works, I know it works. There are hundreds of studies that prove that to be the case.
You don't 'know' it works for everyone, just like everyone on the vax skeptical side, all you know are anecdotes, and if you believe studies are being approved and peer-reviewed with no bias, then that's fine. Doesn't make it true though, something you 'know'. Why then are people in other countries getting compensation for vaccine damage/injury?
Quote from: statnik on February 02, 2023, 04:44:32 PM
You don't 'know' it works for everyone, just like everyone on the vax skeptical side, all you know are anecdotes, and if you believe studies are being approved and peer-reviewed with no bias, then that's fine. Doesn't make it true though, something you 'know'. Why then are people in other countries getting compensation for vaccine damage/injury?
I'm done arguing with morons about the safety and effectiveness of a scientifically proven vaccine that has been dosed in the billions world wide who cannot provide evidence of their claims.
So either put up, or shut up.
Quote from: statnik on February 02, 2023, 04:44:32 PM
You don't 'know' it works for everyone, just like everyone on the vax skeptical side, all you know are anecdotes, and if you believe studies are being approved and peer-reviewed with no bias, then that's fine. Doesn't make it true though, something you 'know'. Why then are people in other countries getting compensation for vaccine damage/injury?
Until you show your work, it is just flatulence.
Quote from: statnik on February 02, 2023, 04:29:45 PM
For the diehard believers that the vaccines are beneficial for every single person, what would be your argument for those who already had COVID (let's say it was a typical cold/flu severity for them) and they're young/healthy? Keep in mind it's more commonly those who have had it already that tend to get short term flu like symptoms from the vax passing through.
No idea why I'm remotely engaging with someone that refuses to accept all rational scientific evidence, but here it goes.
My argument for why every person who can safely get the vaccine (there are allergies etc.). The vaccine significantly reduces the likelihood that you get a symptomatic case of COVID.
Each time you get a symptomatic case of COVID, regardless of whether it is mild or severe, COVID induces rewiring of your myeloid cells, converting them into a pro-clotting form that decreases your innate immune system response.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-35638-y
(https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-35638-y)
The result is damage to lungs, kidneys, brain, heart and just about every other tissue. So much damage, that images of individuals brain post-COVID demonstrates a decrease in white matter that in many cases looks like early Alzheimers.
https://academic.oup.com/brain/article/145/5/1830/6464331 (https://academic.oup.com/brain/article/145/5/1830/6464331)
Similar long-lasting damage can be seen in many tissues. The weird thing (see 1st link) is this change in your myeloid cells persists for a long time in COVID. Meaning, the damage persists, and also weakens your innate immune system, making it more likely that you get other infections (see the rash of childhood viral infections that crippled children's hospitals).
So what does that mean for subsequent infections. Well the research is clear. Being reinfected (symptomatic infections) amplifies this damage and increases the likelihood of long lasting damage to our organs.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-022-02051-3
(https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-022-02051-3)
How can you avoid chronically damaging your immune system, heart, lungs, kidneys, brain, etc? Get vaccinated, and reduce your risk of getting a systematic infection and decreasing the impact of any infections you do get.
Don't get vaccinated and you are putting your entire health at long-term risk with each subsequent symptomatic infection.
The above is how you document and support your case (e.g. show your work).
Quote from: statnik on February 02, 2023, 04:44:32 PM
You don't 'know' it works for everyone, just like everyone on the vax skeptical side, all you know are anecdotes, and if you believe studies are being approved and peer-reviewed with no bias, then that's fine. Doesn't make it true though, something you 'know'. Why then are people in other countries getting compensation for vaccine damage/injury?
Ah. I see. All the studies really amount to nothing more than anecdotes because actually they are biased. Ah.
Strikingly similar to roqqet's belief that "they" "aren't allowing people to talk about it". You're keeping fine company. Still waiting for you to take up the roqqet challenge: show a single study that can stand up to scrutiny proving HCQ or Ivermectin are effective treatments for COVID. Oh, that's right. You can't, but only because no one is allowed to talk about it.
You know, there was once a healthcare professional that posted, "Vaccination takes serious illness, hospitalization, and death off the table. Its over. Carry on." But I strongly support anti-vaxxers never getting another shot. Please proceed.
Quote from: TSmith34, Inc. on February 02, 2023, 07:46:06 PM
Ah. I see. All the studies really amount to nothing more than anecdotes because actually they are biased. Ah.
Strikingly similar to roqqet's belief that "they" "aren't allowing people to talk about it". You're keeping fine company. Still waiting for you to take up the roqqet challenge: show a single study that can stand up to scrutiny proving HCQ or Ivermectin are effective treatments for COVID. Oh, that's right. You can't, but only because no one is allowed to talk about it.
You know, there was once a healthcare professional that posted, "Vaccination takes serious illness, hospitalization, and death off the table. Its over. Carry on." But I strongly support anti-vaxxers never getting another shot. Please proceed.
Soooooooweeeeeeee. 🐷🐷
This Piggy Ziggy went to Marquette
This Piggy Ziggy should have stayed home
This Piggy Ziggy ate roast meats
Class, this Piggy Ziggy has none
And this Piggy Ziggy cried 'wee, wee, wee', all the day long.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsBrd3u1JZw
Ziggy piggy, ziggy piggy
Quote from: TSmith34, Inc. on February 03, 2023, 07:08:36 AM
This Piggy Ziggy went to Marquette
This Piggy Ziggy should have stayed home
This Piggy Ziggy ate roast meats
Class, this Piggy Ziggy has none
And this Piggy Ziggy cried 'wee, wee, wee', all the day long.
The Dos Pigs is your burden. Can't just put it on someone else. 🐷🐷
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on February 03, 2023, 12:38:28 PM
The Dos Pigs is your burden. Can't just put it on someone else. 🐷🐷
I mean, it seems like its your burden to carry on something that was never really funny to begin with. But maybe that's just me.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 03, 2023, 12:54:45 PM
I mean, it seems like its your burden to carry on something that was never really funny to begin with. But maybe that's just me.
Do not be too hard on Piggy Ziggy. He's shown that he has literally nothing of value to add. This is the best he can do. Best to just pat him on the head like a three-year-old with his first finger painting and tell him how clever he is.
Quote from: TSmith34, Inc. on February 03, 2023, 01:47:55 PM
Do not be too hard on Piggy Ziggy. He's shown that he has literally nothing of value to add. This is the best he can do. Best to just pat him on the head like a three-year-old with his first finger painting and tell him how clever he is.
🐷🐷
Cry dos-pig cry.
https://bmjmedicine.bmj.com/content/2/1/e000373
Though at least they seemed to have had more positive outcomes overall, this study makes one pause about the frequently peddled narrative that myocarditis is more likely from a COVID-19 bout than vaccination against it.
Quote from: statnik on February 05, 2023, 08:55:49 AM
https://bmjmedicine.bmj.com/content/2/1/e000373
Though at least they seemed to have had more positive outcomes overall, this study makes one pause about the frequently peddled narrative that myocarditis is more likely from a COVID-19 bout than vaccination against it.
Show me in the article where it says this.
Or did you just read tweets again, and run in here with a link?
Quote from: statnik on February 05, 2023, 08:55:49 AM
https://bmjmedicine.bmj.com/content/2/1/e000373
Though at least they seemed to have had more positive outcomes overall, this study makes one pause about the frequently peddled narrative that myocarditis is more likely from a COVID-19 bout than vaccination against it.
Huh ...
In a population based study of 23 million individuals in Denmark, Finland, Norway, and Sweden, we found that myocarditis after vaccination with SARS-CoV-2 mRNA vaccines was associated with a significantly lower risk of heart failure within 90 days of admission compared with conventional myocarditis and myocarditis after covid-19 disease.
Also, among younger patients with no potentially predisposing comorbidities for developing myocarditis, we found that myocarditis after covid-19 disease was associated with a substantially higher risk of heart failure or death at 90 days of follow-up compared with myocarditis after vaccination. Taken together, our findings suggested that the outcomes of myocarditis after vaccination were less severe than other types of myocarditis during the first 90 days after the onset of myocarditis.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 05, 2023, 11:14:26 AM
Huh ...
In a population based study of 23 million individuals in Denmark, Finland, Norway, and Sweden, we found that myocarditis after vaccination with SARS-CoV-2 mRNA vaccines was associated with a significantly lower risk of heart failure within 90 days of admission compared with conventional myocarditis and myocarditis after covid-19 disease.
Also, among younger patients with no potentially predisposing comorbidities for developing myocarditis, we found that myocarditis after covid-19 disease was associated with a substantially higher risk of heart failure or death at 90 days of follow-up compared with myocarditis after vaccination. Taken together, our findings suggested that the outcomes of myocarditis after vaccination were less severe than other types of myocarditis during the first 90 days after the onset of myocarditis.
You literally didn't read my quote, the findings that it was more commonly found post vaccine than post illness, just having that burden post vaccine is still a major consideration if you're on the fence, had the virus already and are in a low risk group for COVID-19 effects.
Quote from: statnik on February 05, 2023, 08:55:49 AM
https://bmjmedicine.bmj.com/content/2/1/e000373
Though at least they seemed to have had more positive outcomes overall, this study makes one pause about the frequently peddled narrative that myocarditis is more likely from a COVID-19 bout than vaccination against it.
No where in that article does it say/do anything that could make one pause about the accurate and scientifically vetted information regarding the likelihood of getting myocarditis from COVID-19, other causes, as compared to from a vaccine.
Show your work!
I also noticed no response to my details on why one should get vaccinated. But your article provides another, your article makes it clear that in healthy young people, the risk of adverse outcomes from COVID infection is far greater than from a vaccine.
Quote from: statnik on February 05, 2023, 11:21:47 AM
You literally didn't read my quote, the findings that it was more commonly found post vaccine than post illness, just having that burden post vaccine is still a major consideration if you're on the fence, had the virus already and are in a low risk group for COVID-19 effects.
But that doesn't mean what you're claiming it does.
How many people in the study have received the vaccine vs tested positive for COVID?
Quote from: Pakuni on February 05, 2023, 11:58:06 AM
But that doesn't mean what you're claiming it does.
How many people in the study have received the vaccine vs tested positive for COVID?
It would appear that "Statnik" does not understand how statistics works.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 05, 2023, 11:58:06 AM
But that doesn't mean what you're claiming it does.
How many people in the study have received the vaccine vs tested positive for COVID?
Consider the number of boosters many have had, not so much of a difference anymore.
Hmmm crickets for my question.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on February 05, 2023, 01:49:34 PM
Hmmm crickets for my question.
His Adobe subscription ran out, he has no way to highlight text. Happens to the best of us
Calling all jackals: Some reading materials if you want to spend the time. Stop jabbing yourselves people. It's MFing poison.
https://mdpi-res.com/d_attachment/vaccines/vaccines-10-01651/article_deploy/vaccines-10-01651-v2.pdf?version=1666320394
Since no nucleocapsid protein could be detected, the presence of spike protein must be ascribed to vaccination rather than to viral infection. The findings corroborate previous reports of encephalitis and myocarditis caused by gene-based COVID-19 vaccines.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9025013/pdf/jcm-11-02219.pdf
Post COVID-19 infection was not associated with either myocarditis (aHR 1.08; 95% CI 0.45 to 2.56) or pericarditis (aHR 0.53; 95% CI 0.25 to 1.13). We did not observe an increased incidence of neither pericarditis nor myocarditis in adult patients recovering from COVID-19 infection.
But there is an increase?
🤷🏻♂️... I wonder what it is? 🧐
autopsy
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9702955/pdf/392_2022_Article_2129.pdf
Histology showed patchy interstitial myocardial T-lymphocytic infiltration, predominantly of the CD4 positive sub- set, associated with mild myocyte damage. Overall, autopsy findings indicated death due to acute arrhythmogenic cardiac failure. Thus, myocarditis can be a potentially lethal complication following mRNA-based anti-SARS-CoV-2 vaccination. Our findings may aid in adequately diagnosing unclear cases after vaccination and in establishing a timely diagnosis in vivo, thus, providing the framework for adequate monitoring and early treatment of severe clinical cases.
... and has been common knowledge for awhile... it's not a one size fits all situation...
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S001393512201982X
https://youtu.be/5zRvYp8QKNY
What is the world coming to when IVM is being suggested to rid the body of spike post infection and to help with post shot adverse effects 🤷🏻♂️
https://mdpi-res.com/d_attachment/ijms/ijms-23-15480/article_deploy/ijms-23-15480-v2.pdf?version=1671672532
They furthermore suggest therapeutic options using competitive glycan-binding agents such as IVM and may help elucidate rare serious adverse effects (AEs) associated with COVID-19 mRNA vaccines, which use spike protein as the generated antigen.
When I want to discredit vaccines, I always turn to Chinese scientific journals...
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 07, 2023, 09:53:31 AM
When I want to discredit vaccines, I always turn to Chinese scientific journals...
Personally, I just head on over to twitter to my personally curated team of lunatics.
Then I blindly post links to articles they push without reading them and also quote the portions they have.
I don't actually understand any of it, but that doesn't really matter to me.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on February 07, 2023, 10:07:03 AM
Personally, I just head on over to twitter to my personally curated team of lunatics.
Then I blindly post links to articles they push without reading them and also quote the portions they have.
I don't actually understand any of it, but that doesn't really matter to me.
Are you running for President? It's worked in the past
Quote from: Hards Alumni on February 07, 2023, 10:07:03 AM
Personally, I just head on over to twitter to my personally curated team of lunatics.
Then I blindly post links to articles they push without reading them and also quote the portions they have.
I don't actually understand any of it, but that doesn't really matter to me.
I had no idea you were a dentist.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on February 07, 2023, 10:07:03 AM
Personally, I just head on over to twitter to my personally curated team of lunatics.
Then I blindly post links to articles they push without reading them and also quote the portions they have.
I don't actually understand any of it, but that doesn't really matter to me.
Who's on your team these days?
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 06, 2023, 09:35:15 PM
Calling all jackals: Some reading materials if you want to spend the time. Stop jabbing yourselves people. It's MFing poison.
Please proceed, anti-vaxxer.
Hubris.
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 07, 2023, 05:33:03 PM
Hubris.
I support your personal choice. In fact I encourage it.
Wow.. we'll get'em next time...
From my curated Twitter... to access the chapters, use the menu link in the upper right. Reference links are embedded in the body of the narrative. Time to catch up people.
https://www.norfolkgroup.org/
I'm predicting TSmitty will suddenly stop posting one day and there'll be no cause.
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 07, 2023, 09:12:05 PM
Wow.. we'll get'em next time...
From my curated Twitter... to access the chapters, use the menu link in the upper right. Reference links are embedded in the body of the narrative. Time to catch up people.
https://www.norfolkgroup.org/
I'm predicting TSmitty will suddenly stop posting one day and there'll be no cause.
Multiple folks from the "academy of science and freedom".
Quick Google search leads to their page with a mission statement: (bolded mine)
QuoteThe current age is one of science and technology. Together, they have remade the world. They have improved nutrition and extended life spans. They have provided an abundance previously unknown. Their cooperation is fundamental and transformative to mankind. However, while science and technology are partners, they are not the same thing. The words "science" and "technology" are derived from different roots: science from the Latin word scientia for knowing; and technology from the Greek words techne for art or doing, and logos for reason, speech, or understanding. Knowing and doing, of course, are not the same thing either. Knowing is receptive and observant. Doing is active and assertive. The classic authors claim that both knowing and doing are natural and necessary to us, but they are distinguished. Doing is an exercise of power, and power can get in the way of observing and therefore knowing. Hillsdale College's Academy for Science and Freedom will combat this danger by preserving both the integrity of scientific study and the realm of choice and freedom that is proper to everyone, scientists and non-scientists alike.
Since the onset of the COVID-19 pandemic, widespread and aggressive moves have been made against both the individual and academic freedom required to conduct and interpret science. This pandemic has exposed grave problems in the essential functioning of science, research, and debate. Institutions, including elite research universities, public health agencies, and top scientific journals, quickly fell in line with herd thinking about remedies for the pandemic. They loudly and publicly supported solutions like lockdowns that continue to generate enormous collateral public health damage to this day. Moreover, many important clinical trials were suppressed for political reasons. This is because policymakers were unduly influenced by what they understood to be a consensus in the scientific community, a false notion that resulted in draconian policies.
Instead of open and free discourse to seek the scientific truths underlying urgently needed solutions, the opposite way of thinking has taken hold. Scientists whose research and data interpretation differ from the desired narrative have been silenced, censored, and slandered. Academia and the research community, dominated by a single viewpoint, now actively engage in intimidation and false declarations of consensus, and they abuse the peer-review system for publishing findings. This intolerance has fostered a climate of fear and has inhibited other scientists and experts from contributing to the public discussion, effectively inducing self-censorship. This has severely damaged the environment for civil discourse, and consequently, it has become extremely difficult for the public to arrive at any objective understanding of facts.
This dangerous trend threatens the free exchange of ideas essential to republican government and the public good. Hillsdale College's Academy for Science and Freedom will provide a framework for study and discourse that will serve to educate and inform the citizens and leaders who will be faced with the inevitable public health crises to come.
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 07, 2023, 09:12:05 PM
Wow.. we'll get'em next time...
From my curated Twitter... to access the chapters, use the menu link in the upper right. Reference links are embedded in the body of the narrative. Time to catch up people.
https://www.norfolkgroup.org/
I'm predicting TSmitty will suddenly stop posting one day and there'll be no cause.
More on the founder of the academy of science and freedom and contributor to the Norfolk group:
https://www.cal-catholic.com/standfords-dr-bhattacharya-to-start-academy-of-science-and-freedom/
Wrote "Great Barrington Declaration" and works closely with Scott Atlas
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 07, 2023, 09:12:05 PM
Wow.. we'll get'em next time...
From my curated Twitter... to access the chapters, use the menu link in the upper right. Reference links are embedded in the body of the narrative. Time to catch up people.
https://www.norfolkgroup.org/
I'm predicting TSmitty will suddenly stop posting one day and there'll be no cause.
What are you wanting to extract from that? The primary criticisms are that in the very early days of the pandemic, the government failed in all regards (e.g. the first 3-6 months), in controlling, monitoring, and preventing the spread of the disease.
They also critique major mistakes like providing an EUA for hydroxychloroquine, questioning why it was allowed to be prescribed at all when all evidence said it didn't work, and if anything, caused more deaths.
Pretty much it is a diatribe about how the political leaders failed spectacularly in the first couple months. Is that the take-home message you want us to take? That the government failed and no one should have ever been taking HCQ?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 07, 2023, 09:34:39 PM
Multiple folks from the "academy of science and freedom".
Quick Google search leads to their page with a mission statement: (bolded mine)
And, what?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 07, 2023, 09:39:56 PM
More on the founder of the academy of science and freedom and contributor to the Norfolk group:
https://www.cal-catholic.com/standfords-dr-bhattacharya-to-start-academy-of-science-and-freedom/
Wrote "Great Barrington Declaration" and works closely with Scott Atlas
And, what?
Quote from: forgetful on February 07, 2023, 10:01:55 PM
What are you wanting to extract from that? The primary criticisms are that in the very early days of the pandemic, the government failed in all regards (e.g. the first 3-6 months), in controlling, monitoring, and preventing the spread of the disease.
They also critique major mistakes like providing an EUA for hydroxychloroquine, questioning why it was allowed to be prescribed at all when all evidence said it didn't work, and if anything, caused more deaths.
Pretty much it is a diatribe about how the political leaders failed spectacularly in the first couple months. Is that the take-home message you want us to take? That the government failed and no one should have ever been taking HCQ?
That's all you read? There's 10 chapters - https://www.norfolkgroup.org/chapters. Looks like the previous link was corrupted.. :(
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 08, 2023, 09:31:40 AM
And, what?
And, what?
That's all you read?
I got the vaccine and can't read anymore
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 08, 2023, 09:31:40 AM
And, what?
And, what?
They are pointing out that the source of your information is poor. The authors are whackos. None of what they've written on their blog is valuable.
Quote from: Skatastrophy on February 08, 2023, 09:55:56 AM
They are pointing out that the source of your information is poor. The authors are whackos. None of what they've written on their blog is valuable.
Can't have any alternative views now can we? You say whackos, others disagree. You are welcome to your opinion.
Here's the chapter on vaccines? Just asking the questions... and enjoy the convenient links to journal articles (not all Chinese). Those who are not jackals may want to look them over. I'm not particularly posting here to convince anyone (especially the jackals) to not take the jabs but to provide data to those who may be interested in consuming what's out there in areas outside the MSM.... you know, those 'news' outlets sponsored by Pfizer, the most trusted name in medicine.
https://www.norfolkgroup.org/chapters/chapter-eight-covid-19-vaccines
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 08, 2023, 10:20:04 AM
Can't have any alternative views now can we?
You can...and do. But FYI, your views are wacko, in case you weren't aware.
WTF do you mean by "alternative views?"
The vaccines are safe and effective. This isn't an opinion. This is a fact.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 08, 2023, 10:31:27 AM
WTF do you mean by "alternative views?"
The vaccines are safe and effective. This isn't an opinion. This is a fact.
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 08, 2023, 10:22:43 AM
You can...and do. But FYI, your views are wacko, in case you weren't away.
Neither of these posts are true. They might even rise to the level of a lie? You both seem to really enjoy being coprophages. Anyway... you're the boss Rocky, and can mute me anytime you want. Seems to be the thing these days for dissenting voices.
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 08, 2023, 10:41:07 AM
Neither of these post are true. They might even rise to the level of a lie?
No they don't. You've been captured by conspiracy. And now you're a victim of Stockholm Syndrome.
Sad and pathetic.
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 08, 2023, 10:41:07 AM
Seems to be the thing these days for dissenting voices.
Name a dissenting voice I (or we) have muted?
Anyhow, I wish you good health with not being vaccinated. Apparently most of us have "poisoned ourselves" and soon you'll be able to live out your old years without us! (the fact that you don't think that is whack is crazy!)
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 08, 2023, 10:46:52 AM
Name a dissenting voice I (or we) have muted?
Anyhow, I wish you good health with not being vaccinated. Apparently most of us have "poisoned ourselves" and soon you'll be able to live out your old years without us! (the fact that you don't think that is whack is crazy!)
Edit..., I did call it poison... but poison doesn't have to kill ya.
Didn't say any of that, exactly...it was more of a euphemism. You talking about TSmitty. That's his game.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 08, 2023, 10:46:10 AM
No they don't. You've been captured by conspiracy. And now you're a victim of Stockholm Syndrome.
Sad and pathetic.
Sultanx is projecting.
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 08, 2023, 10:46:52 AM
Name a dissenting voice I (or we) have muted?
Anyhow, I wish you good health with not being vaccinated. Apparently most of us have "poisoned ourselves" and soon you'll be able to live out your old years without us! (the fact that you don't think that is whack is crazy!)
Chico's still posting? He might be but not as Chicos.
here's the website again- ;)
https://www.norfolkgroup.org/chapters
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 08, 2023, 10:20:04 AM
Can't have any alternative views now can we? You say whackos, others disagree. You are welcome to your opinion.
Here's the chapter on vaccines? Just asking the questions... and enjoy the convenient links to journal articles (not all Chinese). Those who are not jackals may want to look them over. I'm not particularly posting here to convince anyone (especially the jackals) to not take the jabs but to provide data to those who may be interested in consuming what's out there in areas outside the MSM.... you know, those 'news' outlets sponsored by Pfizer, the most trusted name in medicine.
https://www.norfolkgroup.org/chapters/chapter-eight-covid-19-vaccines
They do two things in all their analysis.
1. Pose questions (no answers) to make it seem like there was nefarious behavior, but the answers are actually well known, rooted in quality science and led to saving lives.
2. Criticize the people in charge early in the pandemic for doing a very poor job of everything.
In general, they are the worst types of people. They look for any fault they can possibly find in others decisions/ studies, where the "faults" they find are very clearly biased by their preconceived ideas (not data), and then worst of all offer no actual solutions or ideas, just criticize and ask questions for which the answers are known if they go and look for them.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 08, 2023, 10:31:27 AM
WTF do you mean by "alternative views?"
The vaccines are safe and effective. This isn't an opinion. This is a fact.
It's like the alternative view on the Holocaust (didn't happen), birds (aren't real), climate change (doesn't exist), the earth is round (it's flat), etc etc.
When did crazy/wrong become mainstream?
Quote from: forgetful on February 08, 2023, 11:38:35 AM
They do two things in all their analysis.
1. Pose questions (no answers) to make it seem like there was nefarious behavior, but the answers are actually well known, rooted in quality science and led to saving lives.
2. Criticize the people in charge early in the pandemic for doing a very poor job of everything.
In general, they are the worst types of people. They look for any fault they can possibly find in others decisions/ studies, where the "faults" they find are very clearly biased by their preconceived ideas (not data), and then worst of all offer no actual solutions or ideas, just criticize and ask questions for which the answers are known if they go and look for them.
It's the Tucker-ing of "science."
Are there mutant worms in every vaccine? And if there are mutant worms in every vaccine, do they crawl up inside humans and turn them into godless socialists?
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 08, 2023, 11:06:33 AM
here's the website again- ;)
https://www.norfolkgroup.org/chapters
If you don't mind me asking, what is it you hope to accomplish here?
What is your area of expertise?
Quote from: Hards Alumni on February 08, 2023, 01:51:25 PM
If you don't mind me asking, what is it you hope to accomplish here?
I mean, he is accurately posting in the "Vaccine Misinformation" thread!
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 08, 2023, 10:20:04 AM
Can't have any alternative views now can we? You say whackos, others disagree. You are welcome to your opinion.
Here's the chapter on vaccines? Just asking the questions... and enjoy the convenient links to journal articles (not all Chinese). Those who are not jackals may want to look them over. I'm not particularly posting here to convince anyone (especially the jackals) to not take the jabs but to provide data to those who may be interested in consuming what's out there in areas outside the MSM.... you know, those 'news' outlets sponsored by Pfizer, the most trusted name in medicine.
https://www.norfolkgroup.org/chapters/chapter-eight-covid-19-vaccines
Serious question, does the MSM also influence other countries or just the US
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 08, 2023, 10:41:07 AM
Neither of these posts are true. They might even rise to the level of a lie? You both seem to really enjoy being coprophages. Anyway... you're the boss Rocky, and can mute me anytime you want. Seems to be the thing these days for dissenting voices.
Victims of the vaccines have to go on Reddit to be heard and understood. Any 'academic' or mainstream forum tends to shun this. Just glad I never felt forced to take it. Nearly did by my employer though.
Quote from: statnik on February 08, 2023, 09:27:29 PM
Victims of the vaccines have to go on Reddit to be heard and understood. Any 'academic' or mainstream forum tends to shun this. Just glad I never felt forced to take it. Nearly did by my employer though.
100% false. Academics and mainstream science forums deal in facts and data. If there was data to support "victims of vaccines" they would 100% publish them, because they would be well known and super respected for discovering dangers in a previously believed to be safe vaccine.
You don't see them published, because cases being posted on reddit aren't rooted in facts or data, but randos personal beliefs.
Quote from: statnik on February 08, 2023, 09:27:29 PM
Victims of the vaccines have to go on Reddit to be heard and understood. Any 'academic' or mainstream forum tends to shun this. Just glad I never felt forced to take it. Nearly did by my employer though.
I've seen 400+ patients hospitalized for COVID-19 and I haven't seen one from a vaccine related injury.
Quote from: forgetful on February 08, 2023, 09:46:25 PM
100% false.
I'm trying to imagine the mind of the person that believes they know more than thousands of respected scientists because they read Twitter or Reddit (or really, any website). Eh, apparently they don't need a "poison jab" to negatively affect their brains.
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 07, 2023, 09:12:05 PM
Wow.. we'll get'em next time...
From my curated Twitter... to access the chapters, use the menu link in the upper right. Reference links are embedded in the body of the narrative. Time to catch up people.
https://www.norfolkgroup.org/
I'm predicting TSmitty will suddenly stop posting one day and there'll be no cause.
Yes, I am sure I'll be featured on "Died Suddenly II".
Please do not follow my lead and get vaccinated and fully boosted, I beg you.
Quote from: statnik on February 08, 2023, 09:27:29 PM
Victims of the vaccines have to go on Reddit to be heard and understood. Any 'academic' or mainstream forum tends to shun this. Just glad I never felt forced to take it. Nearly did by my employer though.
Please proceed, anti-vaxxers.
Quote from: noblewarrior on February 08, 2023, 10:20:04 AM
Can't have any alternative views now can we? You say whackos, others disagree. You are welcome to your opinion.
This is where you right-wingers fail every bit of logical reasoning ability you should have gained from attending Marquette.
When people point out all the flaws, poor reasoning, outright lies, unsupported claims, failed science, and intentional misinformation in the sources you post, it isn't because that are not letting you have "alternative views", it is because they are critiquing the accuracy of your sources, pointing out that they are built upon a mountain of horsesh!t, and you are an imbecile for believing them.
No one is saying you "can't" have idiotic opinions grounded in lies, just helpfully pointing out that you are a dumbsh!t for having them.
Quote from: statnik on February 08, 2023, 09:27:29 PM
Victims of the vaccines have to go on Reddit to be heard and understood. Any 'academic' or mainstream forum tends to shun this. Just glad I never felt forced to take it. Nearly did by my employer though.
(https://media.tenor.com/kUc7qrAzbgIAAAAM/spit-take-laugh.gif)
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 08, 2023, 09:51:44 PM
I'm trying to imagine the mind of the person that believes they know more than thousands of respected scientists because they read Twitter or Reddit (or really, any website). Eh, apparently they don't need a "poison jab" to negatively affect their brains.
Rocky, its called "doing your research" at the University of Youtube. Very prestigious.
Quote from: TSmith34, Inc. on February 08, 2023, 10:57:48 PM
This is where you right-wingers fail every bit of logical reasoning ability you should have gained from attending Marquette.
When people point out all the flaws, poor reasoning, outright lies, unsupported claims, failed science, and intentional misinformation in the sources you post, it isn't because that are not letting you have "alternative views", it is because they are critiquing the accuracy of your sources, pointing out that they are built upon a mountain of horsesh!t, and you are an imbecile for believing them.
No one is saying you "can't" have idiotic opinions grounded in lies, just helpfully pointing out that you are a dumbsh!t for having them.
🐷🐷
Quote from: forgetful on February 08, 2023, 09:46:25 PM
100% false. Academics and mainstream science forums deal in facts and data. If there was data to support "victims of vaccines" they would 100% publish them, because they would be well known and super respected for discovering dangers in a previously believed to be safe vaccine.
You don't see them published, because cases being posted on reddit aren't rooted in facts or data, but randos personal beliefs.
Some are personal experience, but you could have hundreds of people post on a liberal-oriented forum of academics, and they would all be dismissed.
Quote from: MUDPT on February 08, 2023, 09:48:38 PM
I've seen 400+ patients hospitalized for COVID-19 and I haven't seen one from a vaccine related injury.
When you see people go in for a major issue, do you ask them or find out if they've had the vaccine recently? If not, that's part of it right there. If it doesn't appear related to COVID from the start, good chance the vaccine conveniently doesn't come up unless the patient pushes that side. It would make sense a lot of them would like to ignore any possible link to a vaccine they chose (in many cases) to take.
Quote from: statnik on February 09, 2023, 04:43:22 PM
When you see people go in for a major issue, do you ask them or find out if they've had the vaccine recently? If not, that's part of it right there. If it doesn't appear related to COVID from the start, good chance the vaccine conveniently doesn't come up unless the patient pushes that side. It would make sense a lot of them would like to ignore any possible link to a vaccine they chose (in many cases) to take.
Lol
Quote from: statnik on February 09, 2023, 04:43:22 PM
When you see people go in for a major issue, do you ask them or find out if they've had the vaccine recently? If not, that's part of it right there. If it doesn't appear related to COVID from the start, good chance the vaccine conveniently doesn't come up unless the patient pushes that side. It would make sense a lot of them would like to ignore any possible link to a vaccine they chose (in many cases) to take.
"I have no evidence for my opinion whatsoever, and there is a mountain of evidence against what I am saying, but damn it, I'm just going to believe what I want to believe."
Quote from: statnik on February 09, 2023, 04:43:22 PM
When you see people go in for a major issue, do you ask them or find out if they've had the vaccine recently? If not, that's part of it right there. If it doesn't appear related to COVID from the start, good chance the vaccine conveniently doesn't come up unless the patient pushes that side. It would make sense a lot of them would like to ignore any possible link to a vaccine they chose (in many cases) to take.
So you propose a study, which you feel that nobody has done yet, to determine the root cause of "major issues" that people are experiencing. Why do you think there are no studies out there covering this? Do you think it is because there are no studies that have been done yet? Or because the studies that have been done are flawed in some way where the vaccine "just doesn't come up" conveniently to protect... someone or something? Or, maybe, the findings of studies in reputable journals published by reputable scientists from reputable institutions don't match your point of view, and that's frustrating for you?
Quote from: MUDPT on February 08, 2023, 09:48:38 PM
I've seen 400+ patients hospitalized for COVID-19 and I haven't seen one from a vaccine related injury.
Obviously because the vaccinated all died. Didn't have time to get to you. Probably piling up in the streets by now.
Oh and unless part of the cult is also that nutty belief that people can live forever, we will all stop posting here one day.
Just catching up on this thread. I was filming myself shaking my legs due to the vax while my hands capturing it are perfectly still
Quote from: statnik on February 09, 2023, 04:40:02 PM
Some are personal experience, but you could have hundreds of people post on a liberal-oriented forum of academics, and they would all be dismissed.
No. They're all 'personal experience' and most of it is made up to drive clicks, views, and fake internet points from rubes.
You're just not willing to see that you're one of those rubes. Lost in the sauce.
Same as it ever was.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on February 10, 2023, 05:56:28 AM
No. They're all 'personal experience' and most of it is made up to drive clicks, views, and fake internet points from rubes.
You're just not willing to see that you're one of those rubes. Lost in the sauce.
Same as it ever was.
I got the jab and died months ago
Quote from: Uncle Rico on February 10, 2023, 07:39:07 AM
I got the jab and died months ago
The vaccine is a miracle! It magically allows the dead to browse and post online. Incredible!
4 jabs. I must be a cat. 5 lives to go.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on February 10, 2023, 05:56:28 AM
No. They're all 'personal experience' and most of it is made up to drive clicks, views, and fake internet points from rubes.
You're just not willing to see that you're one of those rubes. Lost in the sauce.
Same as it ever was.
That's worse, if it's all personal experience but it's being dismissed due to 'my studies show' that's not a good thing.
Quote from: statnik on February 10, 2023, 04:11:16 PM
That's worse, if it's all personal experience but it's being dismissed due to 'my studies show' that's not a good thing.
True. Conclusions should be based on anecdotes, not studies with data and such.
Quote from: statnik on February 09, 2023, 04:43:22 PM
When you see people go in for a major issue, do you ask them or find out if they've had the vaccine recently? If not, that's part of it right there. If it doesn't appear related to COVID from the start, good chance the vaccine conveniently doesn't come up unless the patient pushes that side. It would make sense a lot of them would like to ignore any possible link to a vaccine they chose (in many cases) to take.
Looking at Epic, about a 3rd of the way down, there's a COVID-19 box that tells us two things. 1. Are they vaccinated, due for a booster, not vaccinated or have previously refused to be vaccinated? 2. Have they tested positive for COVID in the past 30 days? So to you answer your question, yes everyone can find a patient's vaccination status (when they had their shot), within 5 seconds of opening a chart.
Quote from: MUDPT on February 10, 2023, 05:45:59 PM
Looking at Epic, about a 3rd of the way down, there's a COVID-19 box that tells us two things. 1. Are they vaccinated, due for a booster, not vaccinated or have previously refused to be vaccinated? 2. Have they tested positive for COVID in the past 30 days? So to you answer your question, yes everyone can find a patient's vaccination status (when they had their shot), within 5 seconds of opening a chart.
I was going to say, this is extremely available information to attending physicians.
Quote from: MUDPT on February 10, 2023, 05:45:59 PM
Looking at Epic, about a 3rd of the way down, there's a COVID-19 box that tells us two things. 1. Are they vaccinated, due for a booster, not vaccinated or have previously refused to be vaccinated? 2. Have they tested positive for COVID in the past 30 days? So to you answer your question, yes everyone can find a patient's vaccination status (when they had their shot), within 5 seconds of opening a chart.
(https://y.yarn.co/c366118a-e9a2-4fcc-ac81-439e631c6762_text.gif)
Quote from: statnik on February 10, 2023, 04:11:16 PM
That's worse, if it's all personal experience but it's being dismissed due to 'my studies show' that's not a good thing.
F*ck your data!
F*ck science!
Give me the stories I heard from Jim Bob at Walmart!
Quote from: Coleman on February 13, 2023, 10:20:43 AM
F*ck your data!
F*ck science!
Give me the stories I heard from Jim Bob at Walmart!
James Robert is a good guy
Well, well, look what we have here:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna71027
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 08:39:08 AM
Well, well, look what we have here:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna71027
Well, well what?
Quote from: Uncle Rico on February 17, 2023, 08:53:51 AM
Well, well what?
2nd paragraph under 'Does infection-acquired immunity outperform vaccines'. They think immunity from natural infection should've been considered with vaccine mandate policies.
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 08:39:08 AM
Well, well, look what we have here:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna71027
Maybe read more?
Still, experts stress that vaccination is the preferable route to immunity, given the risks of Covid, particularly in unvaccinated people.
"The problem of saying 'I'm gonna get infected to get immunity' is you might be one of those people that end up in the hospital or die," Murray said. "Why would you take the risk when you can get immunity through vaccination quite safely?"
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 17, 2023, 09:30:50 AM
Maybe read more?
Still, experts stress that vaccination is the preferable route to immunity, given the risks of Covid, particularly in unvaccinated people.
"The problem of saying 'I'm gonna get infected to get immunity' is you might be one of those people that end up in the hospital or die," Murray said. "Why would you take the risk when you can get immunity through vaccination quite safely?"
I'm talking about people who already know they had it when it was mandated for work, school or other places. Those people should've been considered in similar stead to those with one round of vaccines.
Europe accounted for natural infection for many of their mandates, the US largely did not.
Yeah. Maybe they should have just accepted the science and got the shot. Not much sympathy here.
Idaho lawmakers introduce legislation to criminalize those who administer COVID vaccines
The bill would make administering an mRNA vaccine -- a COVID vaccine -- a misdemeanor.
https://www.ktvb.com/article/news/local/capitol-watch/idaho-lawmakers-introduce-legislation-to-criminalize-those-who-administer-covid-vaccines-legislature/277-2436a514-e7da-4b31-9762-f9be10300075
Ahhh, no wonder Idaho is Chico's Promised Land. You know, it would be helpful if all you anti-vaxxers would move to Idaho en masse, sure would make the post-mortem clean up easier.
Quote from: TSmith34, Inc. on February 17, 2023, 11:02:48 AM
Idaho lawmakers introduce legislation to criminalize those who administer COVID vaccines
The bill would make administering an mRNA vaccine -- a COVID vaccine -- a misdemeanor.
https://www.ktvb.com/article/news/local/capitol-watch/idaho-lawmakers-introduce-legislation-to-criminalize-those-who-administer-covid-vaccines-legislature/277-2436a514-e7da-4b31-9762-f9be10300075
Ahhh, no wonder Idaho is Chico's Promised Land. You know, it would be helpful if all you anti-vaxxers would move to Idaho en masse, sure would make the post-mortem clean up easier.
As usual the truth is somewhere in between but neither side can handle nuance. The vaccine has been beneficial for some, made no difference for many, and has hurt a small (but understandably frustrated) minority. It shouldn't have been mandated but shouldn't be criminalized to administer it.
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 12:12:33 PM
As usual the truth is somewhere in between but neither side can handle nuance. The vaccine has been beneficial for some, made no difference for many, and has hurt a small (but understandably frustrated) minority. It shouldn't have been mandated but shouldn't be criminalized to administer it.
Isn't this the same outcome as any other vaccine?
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 12:12:33 PM
As usual the truth is somewhere in between but neither side can handle nuance. The vaccine has been beneficial for some, made no difference for many, and has hurt a small (but understandably frustrated) minority. It shouldn't have been mandated but shouldn't be criminalized to administer it.
Can you name one American who was forced to get the vaccine?
Quote from: reinko on February 17, 2023, 12:31:12 PM
Can you name one American who was forced to get the vaccine?
I am pro-vaccine but enlisted members of the US Military were forced. But they are also forced to get about a dozen other vaccines. It kind of comes with the job.
But you're right, no one else was really forced. Some companies mandated it. But isn't letting companies do what they want a conservative principle?
Quote from: Coleman on February 17, 2023, 12:40:29 PM
I am pro-vaccine but enlisted members of the US Military were forced. But they are also forced to get about a dozen other vaccines. It kind of comes with the job.
But you're right, no one else was really forced. Some companies mandated it. But isn't letting companies do what they want a conservative principle?
Even active duty could resist and be discharged.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 17, 2023, 12:29:13 PM
Isn't this the same outcome as any other vaccine?
For vaccines to be required for primary schools, higher education, etc. they're typically something that's a serious concern for their particular age group. COVID-19 does not fit that for a lot of the institutions that require them so in my mind (and a large pct of the country) it's one of the reasons there shouldn't be COVID-19 vaccine mandates for schools/most workplaces.
Quote from: reinko on February 17, 2023, 12:31:12 PM
Can you name one American who was forced to get the vaccine?
Not in the literal forced, but Fordham University requires bivalent boosters, and this announcement came partway through the semester and did not offer tuition reimbursement for those who thought 'enough is enough'. That's quite close to 'forcing' someone to get the vaccine:
https://www.fordham.edu/student-life/safety-health-and-wellness/health-services/covid-19-vaccine-requirement/
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 02:08:33 PM
For vaccines to be required for primary schools, higher education, etc. they're typically something that's a serious concern for their particular age group. COVID-19 does not fit that for a lot of the institutions that require them so in my mind (and a large pct of the country) it's one of the reasons there shouldn't be COVID-19 vaccine mandates for schools/most workplaces.
So you believe vaccines can and should be mandated for any one in a particular age group that is susceptible to the illness?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 17, 2023, 02:33:10 PM
So you believe vaccines can and should be mandated for any one in a particular age group that is susceptible to the illness?
It's plausible, I can see where assisted living homes might want a mandate. I don't prefer it, but most of all I'm opposed to it happening where most of the people mandated aren't at a big risk of severe disease and death. What's the worst about university mandates for the vaccines is they were often for the student body but not the faculty, looked like they cared about protecting the older faculty from students carrying it but not the students themselves.
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 02:13:57 PM
Not in the literal forced, but Fordham University requires bivalent boosters, and this announcement came partway through the semester and did not offer tuition reimbursement for those who thought 'enough is enough'. That's quite close to 'forcing' someone to get the vaccine:
https://www.fordham.edu/student-life/safety-health-and-wellness/health-services/covid-19-vaccine-requirement/
Students can choose from 3000 other colleges
Quote from: reinko on February 17, 2023, 03:29:28 PM
Students can choose from 3000 other colleges
This happened partway through the semester that they mandated the bivalent booster. Either you lose tens of thousands for nothing or you take a booster, neither are good options if you're vaccine/repeated booster hesitant.
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 03:38:52 PM
This happened partway through the semester that they mandated the bivalent booster. Either you lose tens of thousands for nothing or you take a booster, neither are good options if you're vaccine/repeated booster hesitant.
🎻 🎻 🎻
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 03:16:19 PM
It's plausible, I can see where assisted living homes might want a mandate. I don't prefer it, but most of all I'm opposed to it happening where most of the people mandated aren't at a big risk of severe disease and death. What's the worst about university mandates for the vaccines is they were often for the student body but not the faculty, looked like they cared about protecting the older faculty from students carrying it but not the students themselves.
So you do support mandates and vaccines. Interesting.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 17, 2023, 07:11:44 PM
So you do support mandates and vaccines. Interesting.
Reading comprehension ftl. I'm not going to rail against some mandates the way I would for less vulnerable groups. I know nuance isn't popular here. Mandates should be a last resort if the situation is dire and it's completely obvious the people involved would consistently and nearly completely benefit from the protection, that isn't the case at schools and most workplaces.
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 07:24:35 PM
Reading comprehension ftl. I'm not going to rail against some mandates the way I would for less vulnerable groups. I know nuance isn't popular here. Mandates should be a last resort if the situation is dire and it's completely obvious the people involved would consistently and nearly completely benefit from the protection, that isn't the case at schools and most workplaces.
Did you just state schools shouldn't require vaccines for students?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 17, 2023, 08:16:49 PM
Did you just state schools shouldn't require vaccines for students?
I'll wait for him to rail against Universities that mandate a bacterial meningitis vaccine for the students, but not the faculty.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 17, 2023, 08:16:49 PM
Did you just state schools shouldn't require vaccines for students?
Use your critical thinking, I said schools shouldn't require vaccines where the risk is relatively low like COVID-19, and of course in this case they rushed the production so its effects were less known at the time of mandate compared to most of the required vaccinations. Many of these required vaccines are due to the high prevalence and virulence in children, certainly a contrast to COVID where they are least at risk of any age group.
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 08:55:17 PM
Use your critical thinking, I said schools shouldn't require vaccines where the risk is relatively low like COVID-19, and of course in this case they rushed the production so its effects were less known at the time of mandate compared to most of the required vaccinations. Many of these required vaccines are due to the high prevalence and virulence in children, certainly a contrast to COVID where they are least at risk of any age group.
So you do support mandates and vaccines?
So confusing
Quote from: forgetful on February 17, 2023, 08:39:40 PM
I'll wait for him to rail against Universities that mandate a bacterial meningitis vaccine for the students, but not the faculty.
The risk is greater for college students than most other demographics, in an environment where it spreads as well. Also it has had much more time to be studied for side effects.
If I was really anti-vax I wouldn't have received the AIDS vaccine on campus that was required based on my service learning site back in college. I am definitely anti-mandate for this particular vaccine though, in nearly all cases.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 17, 2023, 09:01:15 PM
So you do support mandates and vaccines?
So confusing
The risk of long term side effects has to be demonstrably low in addition to a significant threat to the population they are requiring it for in order for me to support vaccine mandates.
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 09:03:22 PM
The risk of long term side effects has to be demonstrably low in addition to a significant threat to the population they are requiring it for in order for me to support vaccine mandates.
What's the length of a new vaccine testing do you want before giving to folks? 5 years? 10? 20?
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 09:01:30 PM
The risk is greater for college students than most other demographics, in an environment where it spreads as well. Also it has had much more time to be studied for side effects.
If I was really anti-vax I wouldn't have received the AIDS vaccine on campus that was required based on my service learning site back in college. I am definitely anti-mandate for this particular vaccine though, in nearly all cases.
Tell me more about this AIDS vaccine that you were required to get.
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 09:03:22 PM
The risk of long term side effects has to be demonstrably low in addition to a significant threat to the population they are requiring it for in order for me to support vaccine mandates.
So you support the COVID-19 vaccine, or just deny scientific data. Which is it?
And lastly, more college age kids had debilitating effects from COVID-19, and/or died from COVID, than were adversely affected or died from Meningitis (before the vaccine was mandated).
I mistyped, it was a Hepatitis vaccine.
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 08:39:08 AM
Well, well, look what we have here:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna71027
Most of my colleagues, the ones up in COVID at work all day, contracted COVID, over the last 14 months, starting with the Omicron wave. That was over a year after receiving the first vaccine does. The vaccine mandates for healthcare workers was completely justified. It protects patients. It also protects hospital systems from collapsing during major waves, due to so many employees getting sick. Sorry, not sorry.
Quote from: MUDPT on February 18, 2023, 06:28:08 AM
Most of my colleagues, the ones up in COVID at work all day, contracted COVID, over the last 14 months, starting with the Omicron wave. That was over a year after receiving the first vaccine does. The vaccine mandates for healthcare workers was completely justified. It protects patients. It also protects hospital systems from collapsing during major waves, due to so many employees getting sick. Sorry, not sorry.
So it didn't work, and thanks to the vaccines, sounds like they all got it the same winter? Vaccines are supposed to prevent, not delay, illness.
Quote from: statnik on February 18, 2023, 07:08:35 AM
So it didn't work, and thanks to the vaccines, sounds like they all got it the same winter? Vaccines are supposed to prevent, not delay, illness.
Tell me you don't understand how vaccines work without telling me you don't know how vaccines work.
Quote from: statnik on February 18, 2023, 07:08:35 AM
So it didn't work, and thanks to the vaccines, sounds like they all got it the same winter? Vaccines are supposed to prevent, not delay, illness.
No. Quite the opposite actually. The vaccines prevented severe illness and deaths and all of them came back after their quarantine period ended. No one was hospitalized. Everyone has said that the COVID vaccines prevented severe illness and death. Some said they would stop infection (it didn't to the degree we hoped it did).
Quote from: pbiflyer on February 18, 2023, 08:58:21 AM
Tell me you don't understand how vaccines work without telling me you don't know how vaccines work.
This works less effectively than most actual vaccines, that I know.
Are there any other vaccines that people on here can think of where you're wise to build in a day or two to recover from the vaccine itself because if it gives you flu-like symptoms that means it's working?
Quote from: statnik on February 18, 2023, 10:45:57 AM
Are there any other vaccines that people on here can think of where you're wise to build in a day or two to recover from the vaccine itself because if it gives you flu-like symptoms that means it's working?
Shingles. Flu shot for some. Pretty regular occurrence actually.
Quote from: statnik on February 18, 2023, 10:45:57 AM
Are there any other vaccines that people on here can think of where you're wise to build in a day or two to recover from the vaccine itself because if it gives you flu-like symptoms that means it's working?
Can I lend you a book on understanding the immune system?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 18, 2023, 11:03:09 AM
Can I lend you a book on understanding the immune system?
I hope the frequently boosted individuals still have one, I'm not so sure if they do anymore. More sickness going around the office now, meanwhile in my personal circles the unvaxxed have been healthier this winter, and it's been common from what I've heard/read from others too.
Quote from: statnik on February 18, 2023, 11:09:15 AM
I hope the frequently boosted individuals still have one, I'm not so sure if they do anymore. More sickness going around the office now, meanwhile in my personal circles the unvaxxed have been healthier this winter, and it's been common from what I've heard/read from others too.
Anecdotes are fun, aren't they?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 18, 2023, 11:27:24 AM
Anecdotes are fun, aren't they?
Until they get computed into studies, considering how recent studies have evolved in this vaccine war, I wouldn't be looking forward to future ones if I got the vax.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 18, 2023, 11:01:52 AM
Shingles. Flu shot for some. Pretty regular occurrence actually.
Tetanus shots take a little to bounce back from too.
Quote from: statnik on February 18, 2023, 11:47:03 AM
Until they get computed into studies, considering how recent studies have evolved in this vaccine war, I wouldn't be looking forward to future ones if I got the vax.
I'm sure they'll come out right after the positive ivermectin studies
The unvaxxed I know are living to 120 years old, are having sex daily, and are eating whatever they want without gaining weight. And unvaxxed NEVER get Covid. Only fully vaxxed have died from it all this time. Stoopid vaxxers ... signing up for death sentences. That's just science!
Quote from: statnik on February 18, 2023, 11:09:15 AM
I hope the frequently boosted individuals still have one, I'm not so sure if they do anymore. More sickness going around the office now, meanwhile in my personal circles the unvaxxed have been healthier this winter, and it's been common from what I've heard/read from others too.
I have had 4 shots. In/ out of patient rooms with all kinds of respiratory/ stomach viruses. I haven't been out for illness since 2019 (knock on wood).
#anecdote
Quote from: MUDPT on February 18, 2023, 03:10:51 PM
I have had 4 shots. In/ out of patient rooms with all kinds of respiratory/ stomach viruses. I haven't been out for illness since 2019 (knock on wood).
#anecdote
My wife and I are both boosted and vaxxed. We got gnarly colds in the fall. My 5 month old son isn't vaxxed and hasn't been sick yet.
Oh, and my 87 year old former neighbor was fully boosted and vaxxed and died of pancreatic cancer last year. So CHECKMATE.
Really may need to review your medical credentials!!!
Quote from: statnik on February 17, 2023, 10:55:22 PM
I mistyped, it was a Hepatitis vaccine.
Yes, people frequently mistype hepatitis as A-I-D-S. Just fat fingering.
Quote from: statnik on February 18, 2023, 07:08:35 AM
So it didn't work, and thanks to the vaccines, sounds like they all got it the same winter? Vaccines are supposed to prevent, not delay, illness.
Ignorance is bliss, I guess.
Quote from: JWags85 on February 18, 2023, 06:23:18 PM
My wife and I are both boosted and vaxxed. We got gnarly colds in the fall. My 5 month old son isn't vaxxed and hasn't been sick yet.
Oh, and my 87 year old former neighbor was fully boosted and vaxxed and died of pancreatic cancer last year. So CHECKMATE.
Really may need to review your medical credentials!!!
Proof that the pancreatic cancer vaccine is useless.
Quote from: statnik on February 18, 2023, 10:45:57 AM
Are there any other vaccines that people on here can think of where you're wise to build in a day or two to recover from the vaccine itself because if it gives you flu-like symptoms that means it's working?
Other than all the examples off of the top of people's heads you mean?
There certainly is something to be said for a person repeatedly pantsing themselves who just blithely comes back for more. Are you related to roqqet?
Have you seen the price for quality dominatrix services lately? Easily a much more cost effective way to get repeatedly kicked in the junk
Quote from: statnik on February 18, 2023, 11:47:03 AM
Until they get computed into studies, considering how recent studies have evolved in this vaccine war, I wouldn't be looking forward to future ones if I got the vax.
You need at least two sides to have a war. Only one side thinks they're under attack.
serious question:
anyone here NOT come down with covid that they know of?
i've had the initial vax plus the follow-up, no booster
if i had covid, i was not aware of it. the couple of times i wasn't feeling well, i tested negative and the malaise was short lived- 24 hours? i haven't missed a day of work due to illness in multiple years
knock on wood
To my knowledge I have not had covid - professional tested the couple times I traveled in the first year-ish. Home tested any time I've felt "off" since. I've vax'd + boosted + boosted + boosted.
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 19, 2023, 08:03:42 PM
rocket - to my knowledge I have not had covid - professional tested the couple times I traveled in the first year-ish. Home tested any time I've felt "off" since. I've vax'd + boosted + boosted + boosted.
👆🏻
Quote from: reinko on February 19, 2023, 08:04:15 PM
👆🏻
Hah, though I've now realized I lied (not about having covid). I actually a flew a ton in 2020 (some in 2021) within the continental US not feeling sick. Still don't think I ever had covid. Though got every booster I was eligible for.
i flew quite a bit myself plus had my face in a lot of faces. no one caught covid to the best of our knowledge within my office. a few got it from outside the office. we tested anytime someone had questionable S & S's one of my hygienists got it from her mom who is a nurse. an assistant got it from her husband who worked the YMCA. another assistant got it at large family function. other than that, we've been blessed
however, i had a dear sister in law, my wife's surrogate mother pass away last month from damage to her lungs from covid. she was an 8 year survivor of a kidney transplant, diabetic and over weight. 1 month prior, she survived a bout of leukemia-her WBC rose to 50,000. yes over 50k. they put her on some med and to this day, the med staff could not believe they got her down to 9,000 within a week. she caught covid from her son over Christmas. recovered, but her lungs were badly damaged and could not exchange O2 sufficient for survival. she was vaxed vaxed boosted and boosted. too many comorbidities
Have not had it, to the best of my knowledge. Know people who lost parents to it, and a former co-worker lost his wife, all in the first year. . Relative has long Covid, it's no joke.
Please don't jinx me.
Retired former co-workers, parishioners, distant relatives, people I ran calls on who died from COVID, my number is in the teens.
Other than food poisoning, the first time I had it was the sickest I have felt as an adult. For 9 days. Sense of smell was wrecked for 18 months. Still weird compared to pre-COVID, but at least I can smell most things.
The second time I had it I treated it with cough drops.
I've never had it that I'm aware of. No shots. Family all had it, i tested negative every time.
I've never had it. My 10yo son got a positive result on Thanksgiving morning 22, but the other 3 of us in the house didn't get it. That was the first and only case in our house. We're all max vaxxed.
I had a mild case last summer. Know multiple people who were hospitalized, lost parents, siblings, etc. Have one friend who lost her 30 year old son early in the pandemic. Just awful. Wife is dealing with mild, long Covid issues.
Had it last April. Painful, hacking cough and really heavy fatigue for about four days. Wasn't the sickest I've ever been but still wasn't a whole helluva lot of fun.
My wife is an RN who kept right on working through the worst of the pandemic. She's never had COVID that we know of. Been tested literally dozens of times, especially from late 2020 through mid 2022.
I've had it, as have other family members, as have all her co-workers, as have hundreds (or more) of her patients, etc etc.
My wife has received all of her shots and boosters, usually as soon as they became available. As statnik would say, that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that fully vaxxed and boosted people never get COVID.
Got it in October 2022 at a small convention with 12,000 of my closest friends. A week or so of coughing and exhaustion. Took a while to bounce back. Fully vaxxed and boosted.
Being the giver I am gave it to the Mrs. She handled it better.
Daughter got it at college. Cold like symptoms. Teen son attends a large high school and remains unscathed.
Quote from: MU82 on February 20, 2023, 02:41:44 PM
My wife is an RN who kept right on working through the worst of the pandemic. She's never had COVID that we know of. Been tested literally dozens of times, especially from late 2020 through mid 2022.
I've had it, as have other family members, as have all her co-workers, as have hundreds (or more) of her patients, etc etc.
My wife has received all of her shots and boosters, usually as soon as they became available. As statnik would say, that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that fully vaxxed and boosted people never get COVID.
At least I'm basing my thoughts on numerous anecdotes, not just one ::)
Quote from: statnik on February 20, 2023, 08:38:36 PM
At least I'm basing my thoughts on numerous anecdotes, not just one ::)
Most conspiracy theories agree.
I know several people that have died of Covid. None vaxxed. But they were sure the vaccine was deadly.
Quote from: statnik on February 20, 2023, 08:38:36 PM
At least I'm basing my thoughts on numerous anecdotes, not just one ::)
The self-pantsing continues.
I had my annual physical and got the most recent booster on the reco of my primary. He is borderline on new boosters, at this point, for those in good health, under 60, etc... But he said with a 5 month old at home, better to air on the side of caution.
So, I wish you all the best as I'm sure I will soon be shuffling off this mortal coil like countless other healthy athletic younger men who got the booster and then promptly died. Its been a pleasure
Quote from: JWags85 on February 21, 2023, 09:39:32 AM
I had my annual physical and got the most recent booster on the reco of my primary. He is borderline on new boosters, at this point, for those in good health, under 60, etc... But he said with a 5 month old at home, better to air on the side of caution.
So, I wish you all the best as I'm sure I will soon be shuffling off this mortal coil like countless other healthy athletic younger men who got the booster and then promptly died. Its been a pleasure
I had my annual physical in December and my primary doctor rec'd getting the second booster also. I know I'm going to Asia at some point this year for work, so I was waiting until I had more clarity when and then will schedule.
Quote from: JWags85 on February 21, 2023, 09:39:32 AM
I had my annual physical and got the most recent booster on the reco of my primary. He is borderline on new boosters, at this point, for those in good health, under 60, etc... But he said with a 5 month old at home, better to air on the side of caution.
So, I wish you all the best as I'm sure I will soon be shuffling off this mortal coil like countless other healthy athletic younger men who got the booster and then promptly died. Its been a pleasure
Thoughts & prayers
Wife, kids and I all fully vaxxed. All have had it except me. One daughter still dealing with long Covid.
I know 5 people who have died from Covid. All fully vaxxed but had one or more comorbidities.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 23, 2023, 09:17:22 AM
Wife, kids and I all fully vaxxed. All have had it except me. One daughter still dealing with long Covid.
I know 5 people who have died from Covid. All fully vaxxed but had one or more comorbidities.
That's a lot Lenny. I'm sorry for your losses. Really sad.
Was this before the rollout of Paxlovid? My mom probably owes her life to that drug. She was vaxxed, but had several comorbities, and was in a really bad way for a couple days. The Paxlovid knocked it out in 48 hours. She got a rebound case after the course of the drug but it was incredibly mild compared to the original. I really think it was a lifesaver.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 23, 2023, 09:17:22 AM
I know 5 people who have died from Covid. All fully vaxxed but had one or more comorbidities.
Only about 10 behind me. All pre-vax or anti-vax. Nobody close to me has died from COVID after being vaxxed.
Quote from: tower912 on February 23, 2023, 09:48:01 AM
Only about 10 behind me. All pre-vax or anti-vax. Nobody close to me has died from COVID after being vaxxed.
Are you counting the ones who died from the vaccine itself?
I do not know anyone who has died from COVID who was fully vaccinated. Between retired former co-workers, parishioners, and patient's I ran on, mid teens. None of them were fully vaccinated. I realize that it is only an anecdote.
Quote from: Coleman on February 23, 2023, 09:41:39 AM
That's a lot Lenny. I'm sorry for your losses. Really sad.
Was this before the rollout of Paxlovid? My mom probably owes her life to that drug. She was vaxxed, but had several comorbities, and was in a really bad way for a couple days. The Paxlovid knocked it out in 48 hours. She got a rebound case after the course of the drug but it was incredibly mild compared to the original. I really think it was a lifesaver.
IIRC, yes, pre Paxlovid.
Huh. Why is it that the anti-vax, pro-Ivermectin side lies and manipulates their data and results?
Florida surgeon general fudged data for dubious COVID analysis
https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/02/floridas-polarizing-surgeon-general-accused-of-manipulating-covid-data/
"Florida's health department opened and then closed an investigation into the state's polarizing surgeon general, Joseph Ladapo, after a tipster claiming to have insider knowledge alleged that Ladapo "manipulated data" and committed "scientific fraud" in his final edits to what became a contentious, widely panned analysis on COVID-19 vaccine safety in young men.
The dubious analysis at the center of the controversy was posted online last October by the health department. Oddly, though, it did not list any authors or bear the health department's letterhead or other identifiers. Ladapo used the analysis as the basis for the state's concerning recommendation that males aged 18 to 39 should not receive an mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccine. That recommendation goes against the recommendations of all other major health organizations, including the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
As Ars previously reported, the analysis was roundly criticized by outside epidemiologists and other health experts, who described it as "utter rubbish," "extremely misleading," "comically bad," "seriously flawed," and "the absolute most batshit study design and analysis plan I have ever seen." Others noted that the conclusion "smells of p-hacking" and data cherry-picking."
Quote from: TSmith34, Inc. on February 25, 2023, 10:26:00 PM
Huh. Why is it that the anti-vax, pro-Ivermectin side lies and manipulates their data and results?
Florida surgeon general fudged data for dubious COVID analysis
https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/02/floridas-polarizing-surgeon-general-accused-of-manipulating-covid-data/
"Florida's health department opened and then closed an investigation into the state's polarizing surgeon general, Joseph Ladapo, after a tipster claiming to have insider knowledge alleged that Ladapo "manipulated data" and committed "scientific fraud" in his final edits to what became a contentious, widely panned analysis on COVID-19 vaccine safety in young men.
The dubious analysis at the center of the controversy was posted online last October by the health department. Oddly, though, it did not list any authors or bear the health department's letterhead or other identifiers. Ladapo used the analysis as the basis for the state's concerning recommendation that males aged 18 to 39 should not receive an mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccine. That recommendation goes against the recommendations of all other major health organizations, including the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
As Ars previously reported, the analysis was roundly criticized by outside epidemiologists and other health experts, who described it as "utter rubbish," "extremely misleading," "comically bad," "seriously flawed," and "the absolute most batcrap study design and analysis plan I have ever seen." Others noted that the conclusion "smells of p-hacking" and data cherry-picking."
🐷🐷
Whacko doctors still nuts, this time about ivermectin curing the flu.
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/redirect-to/?redirect=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.washingtonpost.com%2Fhealth%2F2023%2F02%2F26%2Fivermectin-use-covid-flu-rsv%2F
Studies the alliance points to as supporting the use of ivermectin for RSV and flu were conducted in test tubes, which means their conclusions have not been tested in humans, medical experts say.
"If you threw Coca-Cola into cell culture, you would see an antiviral effect. But you wouldn't want to be squirting Coca-Cola up your nose against the flu and RSV," said John P. Moore, a professor of microbiology and immunology at Weill Cornell Medical College.
Quote from: pbiflyer on February 26, 2023, 05:43:34 PM
Whacko doctors still nuts, this time about ivermectin curing the flu.
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/redirect-to/?redirect=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.washingtonpost.com%2Fhealth%2F2023%2F02%2F26%2Fivermectin-use-covid-flu-rsv%2F
Studies the alliance points to as supporting the use of ivermectin for RSV and flu were conducted in test tubes, which means their conclusions have not been tested in humans, medical experts say.
"If you threw Coca-Cola into cell culture, you would see an antiviral effect. But you wouldn't want to be squirting Coca-Cola up your nose against the flu and RSV," said John P. Moore, a professor of microbiology and immunology at Weill Cornell Medical College.
So you shouldn't put coke up your nose. Sound advice.
Quote from: TSmith34, Inc. on February 27, 2023, 10:12:14 AM
So you shouldn't put coke up your nose. Sound advice.
Tony Montana disagrees with your assessment.
On the subject of Covid misinformation, our Energy Department has joined the FBI in concluding what logic dictated from the jump - that most likely the corona virus escaped from a lab in Wuhan and not a wet market.
Hmmm...guess it's not a conspiracy theory anymore.
I love the way John Stewart put it: imagine a section Hershey,Pa 50 feet from the Hershey chocolate factory engulfed in a cloud of chocolaty deliciousness - and the government determined that the most likely cause was a big shovel that accidentally scraped a random cocoa bean.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 27, 2023, 09:49:45 PM
On the subject of Covid misinformation, our Energy Department has joined the FBI in concluding what logic dictated from the jump - that most likely the corona virus escaped from a lab in Wuhan and not a wet market.
Hmmm...guess it's not a conspiracy theory anymore.
I love the way John Stewart put it: imagine a section Hershey,Pa 50 feet from the Hershey chocolate factory engulfed in a cloud of chocolaty deliciousness - and the government determined that the most likely cause was a big shovel that accidentally scraped a random cocoa bean.
https://abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/lab-leak-theory-report-covids-origins/story?id=97493392
"Low confidence". It's not a conspiracy theory but it's far from "confirming what logic dictated". Also still very much the intelligence community's minority view. There simply isn't confirmation
Take it easy on Lenny. Tucker didn't go into that level of detail.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 28, 2023, 02:34:16 AM
Take it easy on Lenny. Tucker didn't go into that level of detail.
The only way to know that would be to watch him.
So you do.
I don't.
Quote from: ZaLiN on February 28, 2023, 12:26:26 AM
https://abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/lab-leak-theory-report-covids-origins/story?id=97493392
"Low confidence". It's not a conspiracy theory but it's far from "confirming what logic dictated". Also still very much the intelligence community's minority view. There simply isn't confirmation
One explanation was logical but embarrassing.
One explanation was illogical but let everyone off the hook.
So the government and their version of Pravda picked "b"and called anyone who picked "a" racist, xenophobic and a conspiracy theorist. We're mad at China now so we don't care if they're embarrassed (even if it embarrasses us too). So moving towards what was always the most logical theory is no longer racist, xenophobic or a conspiracy. It's just the most likely. And since letting China off the hook is no longer our desired outcome it will be OK if one by one our intelligence agencies turn the obvious to consensus.
Lenny ... could you please explain why the DOE's "low confidence" finding is more credible than the findings of four other federal agencies which reached a different conclusion?
I am on the fence regarding origin. I do know I do not trust the Chinese to admit error publicly. So, continued mitigation.
The real question is, do you trust the U.S. Government to be transparent and truthful?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on February 28, 2023, 09:11:55 AM
The real question is, do you trust the U.S. Government to be transparent and truthful?
What source do you believe over the combined world governments? It has to be hard to get all of them on the same page to lie consistently, wouldn't it be? But they've all kept it up with great consistency. That seems like truth to me.
Quote from: tower912 on February 28, 2023, 09:02:22 AM
I am on the fence regarding origin.
Being on the fence about the origin seems like a perfectly rational position to take. What has always bothered me is how some have been 100% about the origin
not coming from a lab and anyone who thought it came from a lab is a conspiracy theorist.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 28, 2023, 08:51:18 AM
So the government and their version of Pravda picked "b"and called anyone who picked "a" racist, xenophobic and a conspiracy theorist.
This really didn't happen. The notion of a "lab leak" was never outright dismissed by the government - including by Fauci.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 28, 2023, 09:40:03 AM
This really didn't happen. The notion of a "lab leak" was never outright dismissed by the government - including by Fauci.
Yep. Back in November, Fauci said:
Anthony Fauci, the retiring top official in the United States response to the Covid-19 pandemic, said Sunday he has "a completely open mind" about the origins of the respiratory virus.
"I have a completely open mind about that, despite people saying that I don't," Fauci said, when asked on NBC's "Meet the Press" about the theory that the virus may have leaked from a lab in China in 2019.
Fauci acknowledged that a group of international, respected virologists has written that strong evidence shows the virus jumped from animals to humans, but said it "hasn't been definitively proven." https://www.politico.com/news/2022/11/27/fauci-china-covid-lab-leak-theory-00070867
There were people on the media who dismissed it which was not correct. Just like there were people dismissing the risks, death tolls, etc (far more proveably factual, not remotely equivalent).
What feels like an overall rejection of the theory to some I think likely stems from an already adversarial position on the Chinese government. To not consider this position the logical and most likely answer is a direct attack on the idea that China=bad. (that's not a xenophobic accusation, it's a governmental/economic position)
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 28, 2023, 09:40:03 AM
This really didn't happen. The notion of a "lab leak" was never outright dismissed by the government - including by Fauci.
HORSE HOCKEY!!
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/anthony-fauci-wuhan-lab-coronavirus-source-dismissal/
Dr. Anthony Fauci, the nation's top infectious disease expert, AGAIN DISMISSED the idea that a lab in Wuhan, China, was the original source of the coronavirus. In an interview with National Geographic published Monday, Fauci cited scientific evidence that shows the virus was not man-made.
he was trying to "hood wink" us into the bat origin thing
this guy ("expert") knew damn well what and where this thing came from. if your fav red haired pol knew back in 2020, drop the mic, where this came from without pause, "the china virus" fettucine sure in the hell knew. or i would hope so because he is the grand pooba of "experts"
Quote from: rocket surgeon on February 28, 2023, 10:45:30 AM
HORSE HOCKEY!!
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/anthony-fauci-wuhan-lab-coronavirus-source-dismissal/
Dr. Anthony Fauci, the nation's top infectious disease expert, AGAIN DISMISSED the idea that a lab in Wuhan, China, was the original source of the coronavirus. In an interview with National Geographic published Monday, Fauci cited scientific evidence that shows the virus was not man-made.
he was trying to "hood wink" us into the bat origin thing
this guy ("expert") knew damn well what and where this thing came from. if your fav red haired pol knew back in 2020, drop the mic, where this came from without pause, "the china virus" fettucine sure in the hell knew. or i would hope so because he is the grand pooba of "experts"
Where are the ivermectin studies?
Quote from: rocket surgeon on February 28, 2023, 10:45:30 AM
HORSE HOCKEY!!
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/anthony-fauci-wuhan-lab-coronavirus-source-dismissal/
Dr. Anthony Fauci, the nation's top infectious disease expert, AGAIN DISMISSED the idea that a lab in Wuhan, China, was the original source of the coronavirus. In an interview with National Geographic published Monday, Fauci cited scientific evidence that shows the virus was not man-made.
he was trying to "hood wink" us into the bat origin thing
this guy ("expert") knew damn well what and where this thing came from. if your fav red haired pol knew back in 2020, drop the mic, where this came from without pause, "the china virus" fettucine sure in the hell knew. or i would hope so because he is the grand pooba of "experts"
From your link:
"If you look at the evolution of the virus in bats and what's out there now, [the scientific evidence] is very, very strongly leaning toward this could not have been artificially or deliberately manipulated ... Everything about the stepwise evolution over time strongly indicates that [this virus] evolved in nature and then jumped species,"
Very, very, very strongly leaning is not an outright dismisal.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 28, 2023, 11:24:17 AM
From your link:
"If you look at the evolution of the virus in bats and what's out there now, [the scientific evidence] is very, very strongly leaning toward this could not have been artificially or deliberately manipulated ... Everything about the stepwise evolution over time strongly indicates that [this virus] evolved in nature and then jumped species,"
Very, very, very strongly leaning is not an outright dismisal.
Arguing with idiots is pointless
Quote from: Uncle Rico on February 28, 2023, 11:50:33 AM
Arguing with idiots is pointless
True - some people are dumb enough to believe when told their chances are "one in a million" that they really have a chance. Or that being very, very, very sure is the same as having an open mind. Crazy.
I'd be surprised = unlikely, but possible
I'd be very surprised = LOL
I'd be very, very surprised = no f'n way
I'd be very, very, very, surprised = what are you, nuts
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 28, 2023, 12:23:55 PM
True - some people are dumb enough to believe when told their chances are "one in a million" that they really have a chance. Or that being very, very, very sure is the same as having an open mind. Crazy.
You don't think people with an open mind can be "very, very, very sure" of something?
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 28, 2023, 12:23:55 PM
True - some people are dumb enough to believe when told their chances are "one in a million" that they really have a chance. Or that being very, very, very sure is the same as having an open mind. Crazy.
I'd be surprised = unlikely, but possible
I'd be very surprised = LOL
I'd be very, very surprised = no f'n way
I'd be very, very, very, surprised = what are you, nuts
Just to be clear, Fauci didn't say "he'd be very, very surprised." He said the scientific evidence was "very, very strongly leaning toward" a particular conclusion.
And, more importantly, the conclusion wasn't about whether or not there was a lab leak. It was about whether or not the virus evolved naturally, as opposed to something man-made.
Accuracy matters, right?
Also, could you answer my question for you above? I 'd hate to get the impression that you're dodging it.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2023, 01:02:27 PM
Just to be clear, Fauci didn't say "he'd be very, very surprised." He said the scientific evidence was "very, very strongly leaning toward" a particular conclusion.
And, more importantly, the conclusion wasn't about whether or not there was a lab leak. It was about whether or not the virus evolved naturally, as opposed to something man-made.
Accuracy matters, right?
Also, could you answer my question for you above? I 'd hate to get the impression that you're dodging it.
No, he/she said "very, very strongly leaning toward this could not have been artificially or deliberately manipulated... Eveything about ...strongly indicates... jumped species "
Was very careful to say the science says no way was this a lab deal
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2023, 09:00:06 AM
Lenny ... could you please explain why the DOE's "low confidence" finding is more credible than the findings of four other federal agencies which reached a different conclusion?
It's the most recent so I'm assuming it's based on the most recent information.
Though I will concede China is making it hard to get information. Which also leads me to believe the lab leak is more likely than the wet market theory.
Now that I've answered your question, I have a couple for you.
If the two leading theories are that the origin of a virus that killed 1,000,000 Americans occurred in a lab to which he has connections or from some unknown animal which do you think Dr Fauci might be most likely to favor?
When he (now) says "We may never know" is that what he's hoping for?
Quote from: Uncle Rico on February 28, 2023, 11:50:33 AM
Arguing with idiots is pointless
you really are full of yourself ain't ya
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on February 28, 2023, 11:24:17 AM
From your link:
"If you look at the evolution of the virus in bats and what's out there now, [the scientific evidence] is very, very strongly leaning toward this could not have been artificially or deliberately manipulated ... Everything about the stepwise evolution over time strongly indicates that [this virus] evolved in nature and then jumped species,"
Very, very, very strongly leaning is not an outright dismisal.
disingenuous and slippery,,,he's supposed to be THE EXPERT. if the guy isn't on your team you'd be laughing at him
Quote from: rocket surgeon on February 28, 2023, 08:57:33 PM
disingenuous and slippery,,,he's supposed to be THE EXPERT. if the guy isn't on your team you'd be laughing at him
He's on your team too you moron.
Quote from: rocket surgeon on February 28, 2023, 08:57:33 PM
disingenuous and slippery,,,he's supposed to be THE EXPERT. if the guy isn't on your team you'd be laughing at him
I don't have a team. And I like experts to have open minds and who are willing to change their opinion based on additional evidence. That's what smart people do.
No surprise you don't like him.
Fr. Fauci is an evil little man who's s fraud and a phony, hey?
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on March 01, 2023, 04:39:52 AM
I don't have a team. And I like experts to have open minds and who are willing to change their opinion based on additional evidence. That's what smart people do.
No surprise you don't like him.
sully-open mind?? don't make me laugh man! you are probably one of the most opinionated, close minded dudes here. so, join the club open minded smart guy
so because i don't like fauci makes me dumb? your mind is only open to the "experts" you believe. history will show fauci to be one of the most corrupt "experts" we have ever seen. he authorized gain of function not directly but thru a non-profit called ecohealth alliance. we knew this virus came from wuhan lab back in 2019, but your hero continued to try to throw cover for them. he more or less rode the tide of the media slowly exposing the obvious if you watch is ever evolving admissions, EXCEPT for using tax payer money for gain of function studies.
we knew back in 2019, a few lab workers from wuhan insitute of VIROLOGY were admitted to a hospital with covid symptoms. oh, but china said covid might have come from U.S. soldiers? then from pangolins, then from wet markets? oh, but don't look into wuhan, which studies BAT VIRUSES because china said so?
watch the sequences of fauci's interviews and press conferences and have an open mind buddy
also interesting-i'm all for people making as much money as possible-legally. pretty interesting how this "public service" worker more than doubled his net worth from $5 mil to over $12.6 mil...might as well have his own "foundation" eyn'a?
How is Marquette's dental school still accredited?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 01, 2023, 05:16:28 AM
Fr. Fauci is an evil little man who's s fraud and a phony, hey?
You're the guy who kept saying the vaccine was good and everyone should get it then flip flopped, right?
Quote from: rocket surgeon on March 01, 2023, 05:20:34 AM
we knew this virus came from wuhan lab back in 2019
Lol. We and Know are doing some heavy lifting here. This is still an unknown.
Quote from: rocket surgeon on February 28, 2023, 10:45:30 AM
HORSE HOCKEY!!
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/anthony-fauci-wuhan-lab-coronavirus-source-dismissal/
Dr. Anthony Fauci, the nation's top infectious disease expert, AGAIN DISMISSED the idea that a lab in Wuhan, China, was the original source of the coronavirus. In an interview with National Geographic published Monday, Fauci cited scientific evidence that shows the virus was not man-made.
he was trying to "hood wink" us into the bat origin thing
this guy ("expert") knew damn well what and where this thing came from. if your fav red haired pol knew back in 2020, drop the mic, where this came from without pause, "the china virus" fettucine sure in the hell knew. or i would hope so because he is the grand pooba of "experts"
You are mixing ideas here. There was an original idea that the virus was INTENTIONALLY man-made in Wuhan. That is a conspiracy theory and does not align with scientific evidence that shows the virus was not man-made. Just like Fauci said.
That is different than it being an accidental lab leak, which remains unlikely, and according to the majority of intelligence experts around the world and in the US the less likely origin.
So Fauci has been consistent.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 28, 2023, 04:03:18 PM
It's the most recent so I'm assuming it's based on the most recent information.
Not a good assumption. More likely the most recent, because the DOE does not really have experts to investigate this. A good question would be, why is the DOE issuing a report at all?
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 28, 2023, 04:03:18 PM
If the two leading theories are that the origin of a virus that killed 1,000,000 Americans occurred in a lab to which he has connections or from some unknown animal which do you think Dr Fauci might be most likely to favor?
When he (now) says "We may never know" is that what he's hoping for?
An absurd question and logical fallacy. Fauci has no connections to this lab or the research being done there. It is a gross exaggeration, and demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of science funding. By your analogy, then Trump also had connections to the lab.
And he says, "we may never know," because from the very beginning it was very unlikely to ever trace this back to a root cause. It remains very unlikely to do so, which is why almost all conclusions are "low confidence" which is pretty much damn near, "hey guys we need to finalize the report...someone flip a coin."
Knew that guy wasn't sh1t long before watching him try to throw a baseball
Shameful
Also, I'll trust science over government agencies that are not using scientists to come to their conclusions.
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2023/02/28/1160162845/what-does-the-science-say-about-the-origin-of-the-sars-cov-2-pandemic (https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2023/02/28/1160162845/what-does-the-science-say-about-the-origin-of-the-sars-cov-2-pandemic)
I'll also note, that it evolving in animals, and spread from animals to people, technically does not rule out a "lab leak" hypothesis.
It does rule out it being "man-made" which was the original claims by a certain segment of the population.
Quote from: jesmu84 on March 01, 2023, 07:17:36 AM
You're the guy who kept saying the vaccine was good and everyone should get it then flip flopped, right?
An enlightened mind is ever evolving as the pieces of the puzzle come together. My Marquette education taught me many things including questioning authority.
Face it, the vaccine was effective in lessening the symptoms through the delta variant. Essentially, no benefit thereafter.
There is no shame in admitting you were dooped. We all were and many continue to be, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 01, 2023, 08:39:32 AM
An enlightened mind is ever evolving as the pieces of the puzzle come together. My Marquette education taught me many things including questioning authority.
Face it, the vaccine was effective in lessening the symptoms through the delta variant. Essentially, no benefit thereafter.
There is no shame in admitting you were dooped. We all were and many continue to be, hey?
I'm sure open minded sully will agree with this statement. ::)
Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on March 01, 2023, 09:08:10 AM
I'm sure open minded sully will agree with this statement. ::)
I am perfectly fine with continuing to question authority on vaccines. But he is absolutely wrong when he says "virtually no benefit."
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna58322
Vaccines and boosters still remain effective when compared to the alternative.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 28, 2023, 04:03:18 PM
It's the most recent so I'm assuming it's based on the most recent information.
So, prior to this report, you believed a lab leak was not the most likely source, because that was the most recent information at the time?
And if a new report emerges in six months conflicting with the DOE, will you then side with those findings, since they're the most recent?
Quote
If the two leading theories are that the origin of a virus that killed 1,000,000 Americans occurred in a lab to which he has connections or from some unknown animal which do you think Dr Fauci might be most likely to favor?
Not a clue, but as forgetful accurately points out, Fauci has no "connections" to this lab, and it's been proven time and again that what NIH funding went to Wuhan was used on work that couldn't have led to COVID.
Quote
When he (now) says "We may never know" is that what he's hoping for?
Also, no clue. I'm pretty smart, but not smart enough to read the mind of Anthony Fauci. I suspect you believe you can. In which case, congrats.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on March 01, 2023, 09:20:02 AM
I am perfectly fine with continuing to question authority on vaccines. But he is absolutely wrong when he says "virtually no benefit."
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna58322
Vaccines and boosters still remain effective when compared to the alternative.
Sure, for those with comorbidities. Giving the vaccine to children should be a crime. They are not at risk. But, teacher unions are powerful. And, while I'm at it, myocarditis post vaccine is a real thing, albeit not a huge percentage, but nonetheless its a terrible risk factor post vaccine for some, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 01, 2023, 10:27:42 AM
Sure, for those with comorbidities. Giving the vaccine to children should be a crime. They are not at risk. But, teacher unions are powerful. And, while I'm at it, myocarditis post vaccine is a real thing, albeit not a huge percentage, but nonetheless its a terrible risk factor post vaccine for some, hey?
This has all been debunked before...
Da gospel accordin' ta Scoop know-it-alls, aina?
When your sources admit to lying when they know the truth in order to boost rating...
Or, in the words of the late, great, Christine McVie..... tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies....
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on March 01, 2023, 05:44:34 AM
How is Marquette's dental school still accredited?
dr lobb is leaving/retiring from the dental school so there ya go doc sully, take it over and get rid of those who think different and have opposing beliefs than yours-classic! get in there so those students have another thing to put on their resume-
hey everyone, you're not going to believe this but i saw the almighty sully and wanted to reach out and shake his hand but but but i was just so honored to be in the same room with him and...
i don't know if marquette could handle the flood of notoriety
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 01, 2023, 12:10:02 PM
Da gospel accordin' ta Scoop know-it-alls, aina?
Provide actual data to support your assertions.
I am happy to re-evaluate any of my current stances based on new data. I do so all the time.
Just read this, that came out last summer:
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abp8715
Or if you need it layman's terms, this Twitter thread:
https://twitter.com/RiverTamYDN/status/1630617163407998977
Quote from: MUDPT on March 01, 2023, 04:33:32 PM
Just read this, that came out last summer:
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abp8715
Or if you need it layman's terms, this Twitter thread:
https://twitter.com/RiverTamYDN/status/1630617163407998977
You probably think Jewish space lasers haven't started all the California fires, too. Use your Marquette education