Wojo's Leash

[jesmu84]

To be fair to ners, the money does come back in the form of higher ticket prices, donation levels, etc....which is born by the fans.

Oh good lord. No point in discussing then.

Why do people get banned/leave, then come back and not announce who they were? Seems strange. Pretty disingenuous, at least.

[1SE]

We're only 2 years out of the postseason, where are you getting 4?

Based on how long people are saying they'll give Wojo.  "He's o-k to miss this year - if he misses next year we'll give him until 2018"

Again - hopefully we don't even miss this year.  But the topic of this thread is Wojo's leash - many of you think it should be longer than I do - that's fine - but I disagree.  Who knows - maybe Wojo needs the seat to be a little warm before he performs...

[1SE]

Oh good lord. No point in discussing then.

Why do people get banned/leave, then come back and not announce who they were? Seems strange. Pretty disingenuous, at least.

Ha - I'm not Ners - only started really following Scoop last year - but you all do seem to be quite obsessed with him.  I didn't think saying "Wojo's seat should be a bit warm if he misses the postseason this year" would be quite so controversial!

[ChicosBailBonds]

Based on how long people are saying they'll give Wojo.  "He's o-k to miss this year - if he misses next year we'll give him until 2018"

Again - hopefully we don't even miss this year.  But the topic of this thread is Wojo's leash - many of you think it should be longer than I do - that's fine - but I disagree.  Who knows - maybe Wojo needs the seat to be a little warm before he performs...

Earlier this month there was a poll here and where we would go.  A lot of people had NCAA....they were homers, which is fine.  Who knows, maybe they end up being right.  Many of us were NIT at best, very concerned about guard play.  That being said, next year I would think NIT for sure (assuming roster is roughly the same), so I don't think you're going to get to 4 years without an appearance.

[1SE]

Earlier this month there was a poll here and where we would go.  A lot of people had NCAA....they were homers, which is fine.  Who knows, maybe they end up being right.  Many of us were NIT at best, very concerned about guard play.  That being said, next year I would think NIT for sure (assuming roster is roughly the same), so I don't think you're going to get to 4 years without an appearance.

And if HE goes?  Although I suppose if he goes it means he played well this year which should translate to NIT...

[brewcity77]

I agree with everything with the exception that that timeline is too long.  The NIT isn't a huge hurdle - teams at are caliber of resource shouldn't be out of the post season for 4 years.  Plus - let's give him to March 2018 - we haven't seen any improvement, his guys haven't panned out - we bring in someone new - you all give them another 4 years to get it together - that's how you end up a St. Louis, or a DePaul - and again - if you're happy with that fine (I'm not really) - but we can get to that outcome spending a lot less money on the program.

I don't want to go that long out of the postseason. But right now I am expecting a 1-4 start. If we can rebound from that to finish say 16-17 with more Big East wins than last year (7-11 or better) but out of the NIT, doesn't that at least show progress, especially with a young team?

And if we take that young team next year and get a winning record, 18-14, but miss the NCAAs and NIT, should that result in firing despite constant improvement?

It's all about context, and I'm trying to provide that. Now on the other hand, if we are worse this year than last year (12 total wins or fewer) and don't show improvement next year either, then it may be time to cut the cord. But unless there's zero progress from now until March 2016, I definitely think Wojo should get at least 4 years to prove himself.

[1SE]

I don't want to go that long out of the postseason. But right now I am expecting a 1-4 start. If we can rebound from that to finish say 16-17 with more Big East wins than last year (7-11 or better) but out of the NIT, doesn't that at least show progress, especially with a young team?

And if we take that young team next year and get a winning record, 18-14, but miss the NCAAs and NIT, should that result in firing despite constant improvement?

It's all about context, and I'm trying to provide that. Now on the other hand, if we are worse this year than last year (12 total wins or fewer) and don't show improvement next year either, then it may be time to cut the cord. But unless there's zero progress from now until March 2016, I definitely think Wojo should get at least 4 years to prove himself.

Listen - that's a logical argument to make - my only problem with letting the Wojo experiment drag on for years (even showing the very modest progression you've suggested) is that each year we are irrelevant the more and more difficult not only recruiting becomes (let's face it - Milwaukee doesn't necessarily sell itself) but also the less prestigious the school looks to head coach candidates.  That being said, I was shocked that with our success in the past decade and our resources that we weren't able to attract a better candidate pool for the position.  Everyone was excited about "done deal" because Shaka seemed like the kind of coach we should have been able to attract.  But maybe untried assistants really are our ceiling.

Mediocrity festers. 

[brewcity77]

Listen - that's a logical argument to make - my only problem with letting the Wojo experiment drag on for years (even showing the very modest progression you've suggested) is that each year we are irrelevant the more and more difficult not only recruiting becomes (let's face it - Milwaukee doesn't necessarily sell itself) but also the less prestigious the school looks to head coach candidates.  That being said, I was shocked that with our success in the past decade and our resources that we weren't able to attract a better candidate pool for the position.  Everyone was excited about "done deal" because Shaka seemed like the kind of coach we should have been able to attract.  But maybe untried assistants really are our ceiling.

Mediocrity festers.

Had Marquette wanted a proven coach like Howland or Cuonzo, they could have had them. The hiring process determined the best guy was Wojo. And with our resources, facilities, and a new arena coming, attracting a quality coach won't be a problem, even if Wojo fails for four years.

[GGGG]

Listen - that's a logical argument to make - my only problem with letting the Wojo experiment drag on for years (even showing the very modest progression you've suggested) is that each year we are irrelevant the more and more difficult not only recruiting becomes (let's face it - Milwaukee doesn't necessarily sell itself) but also the less prestigious the school looks to head coach candidates.  That being said, I was shocked that with our success in the past decade and our resources that we weren't able to attract a better candidate pool for the position.  Everyone was excited about "done deal" because Shaka seemed like the kind of coach we should have been able to attract.  But maybe untried assistants really are our ceiling.

Mediocrity festers. 

Marquette has hired bad coaches before.  If Wojo turns out to be a bad coach, they can hire a good replacement.  That's what the resources available to Marquette allows them to do.

Those resources do not allow a coach to fill a depleted roster in 18 months.  (If you call having a top 10 recruiting class a depleted roster.)

[ChicosBailBonds]

And if HE goes?  Although I suppose if he goes it means he played well this year which should translate to NIT...

If HE goes, he goes.  It may even provide more balance. There are times I watch this team and they look for HE to bail them out.  That's not good either.   He's a nice player, lets not make him out to be Jordan.

[Herman Cain]

If HE goes, he goes.  It may even provide more balance. There are times I watch this team and they look for HE to bail them out.  That's not good either.   He's a nice player, lets not make him out to be Jordan.

I agree with this analysis.

[MU82]

Were I as frustrated/disgusted/embarrassed as Ners Jr., I would look for another school to root for.

[Jay Bee]

Seriously?  Google "men's college basketball" spending at look at the teams in our neighborhood.  Look at the top 20.  None of these teams go 4 years out of the postseason.

Nonsensical measurement.

[4everwarriors]

This is so ridiculous, I don't know why I answer, but....

Anyone who thinks our talent is as good this year as Michigan State last year has never watched college basketball. Valentine, Trice, and Dawson were all better -far better - than anyone on this MU team. And they had a ton of experience playing together. One of those stiffs just threw up a triple-double against Kansas tonite. Time to fire Self for not being able to design the right defense.

And Louisville just had two guys drafted by the NBA off of their no-talent team.

The experience level between us and MSU/UL  - well, again, no comparison.

Yeah but, to be fair, da Louisville playas probably had more experience than ours, hey?

[4everwarriors]

Keep in mind he followed a guy who's stock was artificially inflated, the board of directors got involved, there were firings for improprieties and lying by one of his top lieutentents, driving the stock down....further dropped when the former CEO's performance in his final year after analysts predicted stellar results ended up being horrific....well below expectations across the board.....then when the CEO skipped town for less money and trading in a Fortune 100 job for a fortune 1000 job to stay ahead of the SEC.

Thus, it will take a few years for the current CEO to make his mark.

Both T-Cubed and Bumstead were portrayed years earlier, in the book, "Den of Thieves," hey?

[willie warrior]

Yeah but, to be fair, da Louisville playas probably had more experience than ours, hey?

With school sponsored Hookers--yeah they definitely have more experience.

[tower912]

Ners is alive and well on the scout board.   Deeznuts is clearly ners and is in danger of getting banned after only a couple of weeks.   

[GGGG]

Ners is alive and well on the scout board.   Deeznuts is clearly ners and is in danger of getting banned after only a couple of weeks.   

So I headed over there to see what that's about and saw this reply to Dodds.

"Yet, don't you find it odd that somehow in my 89 posts I've managed to acquire a 3.2 rating to your 3.1 rating accumulated over 74,900+ posts?"

That is top-shelf, grade A Ners right there.

[79Warrior]

"Didn't even bother to try for?"

He went after Shonn Miller and Damian Lee and lost them to Michigan and Louisville respectively.  He also was also looking at a number of Jucos, who he either ended up not offering or not landing.

Shonn Miller starts for UCONN.

[GGGG]

Shonn Miller starts for UCONN.

Yes thank you.  Brew corrected me earlier.

[1SE]

Despite almost snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, the leash is a little longer this morning. 

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Despite almost snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, the leash is a little longer this morning. 

That wasn't Wojo. See Traci Carter last minute turnovers and Duane Wilson 3 pointer.

[1SE]

Du's 3 is on Wojo - he neesd to get through to him.  So many games are won and lost in the last two minutes - so happy to come out with a W either way - but at least this team was ready to play.  Definitely not the Iowa team. 

[1SE]

So with a bit of a body of work now where are we at?  Non-con overall above expectations, conference play about at expectations (1 for 3 on big time scalps, but offset by fact we should have beat SH or Gtown - and neither a bad team, but SH a very bad loss) - if we run out the season on this trajectory (but I would say more downside than upside risk at this point) we are NIT and Wojo won't have wowed us but not terribly disappointed us either.  I know nothing short of a 12 game losing streak to end the season could disappoint Tower (or would even that?) but everyone else? 

[Loose Cannon]

Despite almost snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, the leash is a little longer this morning. 

Would you care to share why you don't like Wojo??