Seton on the dock of the bay

[Galway Eagle]

Frustrating result but I like this team. No quit.  Ball didn't go in the basket like it did against Creighton, but the Pirates don't give a team as many easy looks as the Blue Jays do.

I evidently watched the same game as Fluffy - but not the one seen by other Scoopers. Refs were actually good, let both teams play. Don't understand the hate for Seton Hall. They have one outstanding player and a bunch of lunch pail guys who bust their asses. Tough but not dirty.

Yeah I personally hate Hall for the old Hazel and Pope days. A little frustrated Willard essentially kept his job by the sketchy whitehead recruitment. And genuinely jealous they've gone from Delgado & co, to Powell, to Mamu.  a great system now that's taken some time to install.

[HutchwasClutch]

Btw, good defensive game overall. 1.04 Deff.  Mamu did kill us out of the doubles with 7 assists, though.

No it wasn't and yes he did. Guys completely out of position and unable to recover to challenge the open shooter sufficiently. I'd argue there shouldn't have been so much weak side help when Mamu was in the paint area. He and the shooters he was finding killed us, and the biggest basket of the night happened because of it.

[mileskishnish72]

Too many open 3's allowed.
Too few 3's made.

[HutchwasClutch]

It's a weakness of his, but he is the most athletic PG they've had in many years so he does have some strengths that offset that. He had more blocked shots and dunks tonight than we've had combined at that position in over 10 years. I'll take our chances with DJ at the point this year.

I love DJ's overall game and really hope we have him beyond this year. But he's got to clean up the sloppy handling. He's one of our worst turnover offenders. And Wojo needs to start making him accountable.

[Dr. Blackheart]

No it wasn't and yes he did. Guys completely out of position and unable to recover to challenge the open shooter sufficiently. I'd argue there shouldn't have been so much weak side help when Mamu was in the paint area. He and the shooters he was finding killed us, and the biggest basket of the night happened because of it.

Do you think the 1.22 against Creighton was?  In fact, MU's defense was good tonight and kept us in the game. You have to pick your poison with Mamu, and MU picked to give up the perimeter. The freshman would have been abused inside 1:1. I do agree our rotations were slow at times but 1.04 is very good for a BE game. MU's offense was crap.

Of course, our easy transition points given up on turnovers in the 1st half didn't help our defense.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Contrary to what many have said, I feel like we played solid defense 90% of the possessions this game. But every single possession we didn't play good defense, Seton Hall made us pay. Mamu abused us every time we doubled him in the paint. This is completely off memory but I think Seton Hall went 5/7 from three when Mamu passed out of a double. Need to do a better job of blocking passing lanes when we double in the post, have been consistently burned on this all season. I think a better strategy tonight would have been to play Mamu straight up and let him get his while locking down everyone else, especially given how the refs were calling the game. Poor coaching decision to continue to double Mamu.

Justin Lewis is a force on the boards and a very good offensive play. He's a bad defender. Which is fine, a lot of freshman are, he'll get better. That inbound to Mamu for an open three was a killer and was completely on Lewis for losing track of his assignment.

Also love Dawson on the boards and actually thought when he was on Mamu he did a good job defending him. He needs to get stronger in the post on offense. Given Seton Hall's size, not surprised he struggled. Should have a better game against Xavier.

Jared Rhoden made some very tough, contested, long twos. I really like him as a player and hate him as an opponent.

The turnovers were brutal in the first half. Contrary to what some seemed to have suggested, Wojo made some halftime adjustments and the turnovers were under control in the second half. 9 turnovers at half, 12 turnovers heading into the last minute of the game. The flop/charge and Koby travels were terrible ways for this game to end.

While I prefer this to 50 foul calls a game, I don't think the refs did a good job overall. That physical of a game, with that aggressive of a press by Seton Hall, there should have been more foul calls on both sides. In a normal game, I wouldn't minded the charge call on Lewis, but did seem inconsistent with the way the game had been called. The travel on Koby was a travel...but that call happens 3 or 4 times every game and I would say it doesn't get called more times than it does....as others have pointed out, there were a couple of missed travels on the other end that were killers (Rhoden, Aiken). Also, Mamu hooks almost every time he is in the post. I'm fine with it not being called...until you call it on John.

The other play that was an absolute run killer was the D.J. Carton block. Carton makes the huge three to cut the lead to 1. Comes down on the other end and obliterates Aiken's layup from behind. Garcia isn't expecting the rebound, fumbles it straight into the hands of Molson for an uncontested layup to push the lead out to 3. Even though we ended up tying it after the next possession, I feel like that changed the momentum.

I liked the adjustment to bring John down to help handle the press. Offense looked much more smooth in the second half. We can't wait until halftime to make that adjustment. Wojo has to be better about make adjustments on the fly. Also, we waited too long to burn our first timeout, should have happened after Dawson gave the ball away and Rhoden converted on the other end.

I hated Dawson fouling with .5 seconds left. Every point matters in the NET, pay attention and let the clock run out.

Carton absolutely has the ability to be an NBA point guard...if he can fix his handle. He's a wizard some times but other times he just begs to be turned over.

I love what John can do when fully healthy.

I appreciate that our team is trying to work the ball to find a great shot, but sometimes you need to let it fly when you have a good shot early in the shot clock. Too often we pass up an open look in favor of passing around the perimeter for another 10-15 seconds which sometimes gets a better look but more often than not gets a similar or worse look. With how good we are on the offensive glass, I think we can afford to have a quick trigger sometimes and just play volleyball with our misses.

No question, expected to win this one. Disappointed we didn't. Still ahead of where we need to be at this point in season. Get 1 of the next 2 and I'm feeling very good about the remainder of the season.

[BM1090]

Do you think the 1.22 against Creighton was?  In fact, MU's defense was good tonight and kept us in the game. You have to pick your poison with Mamu, and MU picked to give up the perimeter. The freshman would have been abused inside 1:1. I do agree our rotations were slow at times but 1.04 is very good for a BE game. MU's offense was crap.

Of course, our easy transition points given up on turnovers in the 1st half didn't help our defense.

First half defense wasn't great. There was a stretch in the 2nd half that it was really impressive. SHU couldn't do too much and two of their baskets were lucky putbacks.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Agreed with what Lenny said earlier, no quit in this team. Mental mistakes dug them a huge hole but they clawed and scratched their way back to a tie game with a chance to take the lead in the final minute. One more lucky bounce or favorable call for us or one less for the bad guys and we likely win this game. Still, horseshoes and hand grenades. Gotta take what they learned and take it out on Xavier.

[dgies9156]

This game is what happens when the core of your team includes two freshman, and almost-freshman in DJ Carton, Akanno and Torrance. One night you'll beat Creighton and the next night you slip on banana peel against thugs like Seton Hall.

It happens.

A year from now, this team pounds Seton Hall into the dirt, head first. They're that good. But they're maddingly inconsistent, which is why coaches often balk at playing freshmen. The turnovers last night are one example. I pulled what's left of my hair out over them. The sloppiness at times was too much to watch. That's a young team trying to find itself.

Morale of story: Savor the wins against Wisconsin and Creighton but know now that the Oklahoma States, UCLAs and Seton Halls are going to happen. It will happen again but as the season wears on, we'll grow in maturity and BIg East skills. Hopefull, if we see these turkeys again, we'll give them what they deserve.

[muwarrior69]

Zyprexa anyone? This team is bipolar. Down one day up the next.

[ATL MU Warrior]

I appreciate that our team is trying to work the ball to find a great shot, but sometimes you need to let it fly when you have a good shot early in the shot clock. Too often we pass up an open look in favor of passing around the perimeter for another 10-15 seconds which sometimes gets a better look but more often than not gets a similar or worse look. With how good we are on the offensive glass, I think we can afford to have a quick trigger sometimes and just play volleyball with our misses.

I have thought this same thing for the past few games. We seem to be so intent on running the offense that we pass up a lot of open shots that we should just let fly. I appreciate the desire to work the ball inside but it gets us into trouble with the shot clock often.

[MUDPT]

Teams kill us on high PnR leaving shooters in the corners with rotations being slow. Wisco ran a perfect one with Trice/ Reuvers to a wide open Ford late in that game. Hall was doing the same last night. Looked like Wojo started switching the high screen with about 5 minutes left.

[The Big East]

Big East is a tough conference historically every possession Is a battle. With a 20 game conference season, the winners are going to be those who can consistently bring their their energy for 40 minutes.

It was With great spirit that we fought back to tie it . Just need to find a way to keep it going to the victory. Closing out for wins is hard to do in any sport.

[MU82]

I love DJ's overall game and really hope we have him beyond this year. But he's got to clean up the sloppy handling. He's one of our worst turnover offenders. And Wojo needs to start making him accountable.

I'm curious what you mean by "hold him accountable."

Had Wojo not stuck with DJ in this game, we would have lost by 20.

Besides, how do you know he didn't hold him accountable by talking to him at length at halftime, or having an assistant do so during the game? Holding him accountable by benching him for 10 minutes would not have helped either DJ or the team.

And there were a couple of games where Wojo DID sit DJ for some stretches after DJ played poorly. Each situation is different.

You can't treat each player the same. We know that DJ has battled some things, and that's how he ended up on the transfer market in the first place. For all you and I know, Wojo -- who is far closer to DJ than you or I will ever be -- has handled DJ's situation absolutely perfectly this season.

Last night, I was thrilled that Wojo let DJ play his way out of his problems. Doing so almost won the game for us.

[CTWarrior]

I have no idea how they reviewed the play where Aiken shoved Cain to the ground with a two-handed push in the chest and decided not to call anything.

This was the only quibble I had with the refs.  I guess it wasn't flagrant enough or above the shoulders.

[CTWarrior]

Not blaming the refs for the loss but just like Greg got penalized for flopping against Creighton I don't think Hall should have been rewarded there.

Eh, Lewis lowered his shoulder and went straight through the defender.  They are gonna call that almost every time.  I thought Koby travelled, too. 

[CTWarrior]

When MU cleared the press, they didn't attack the advantage, they pulled it back out and reset the offense. The results showed it.

Excellent point.  Seton Hall played a very good game defensively.  Reminded me of OK State.  Carton did not handle the tight pressure defense real well, especially in the first half.

[hairy worthen]

I have no idea how they reviewed the play where Aiken shoved Cain to the ground with a two-handed push in the chest and decided not to call anything.

Cain flopped his head back, thats why. Refs were fine, mu lost this one on their own.

[hairy worthen]

This is a fun team to watch as opposed to Wojos previous teams. You can clearly see the talent and fight. I am optimistic they will be a top 10 team or better a year from now as they progress as a team and mature. For this year, what we have seen so far is what we will get. Some exceptional games, some not.

[Dr. Blackheart]

We saw BE preseason player of the year in Zegarowski. We saw Mamu. Zegaroeski is good (and had a bad game versus us) but Mamu is, to me, so much harder and versatile to matchup with. I don't see where it's even close on POY.

[MU82]

We saw BE preseason player of the year in Zegarowski. We saw Mamu. Zegaroeski is good (and had a bad game versus us) but Mamu is, to me, so much harder and versatile to matchup with. I don't see where it's even close on POY.

We still have a whole season ahead to see other candidates, but I agree with you that it's hard to imagine a better all-around player in the league than Mamu. As you say, a difficult matchup for anybody.

[StillWarriors]

We saw BE preseason player of the year in Zegarowski. We saw Mamu. Zegaroeski is good (and had a bad game versus us) but Mamu is, to me, so much harder and versatile to matchup with. I don't see where it's even close on POY.

Agree. Bad game against us aside for Zegarowski, everything Seton Hall does seems to come off Mamu creating something for himself or a wide open look for somebody. Last night those somebodies were hitting at a good clip. Mamu's combination of size, skill, unselfishness and speed make him a really tough guard for almost all college players. He'll be a solid pro.

[Lennys Tap]

I'm curious what you mean by "hold him accountable."

Had Wojo not stuck with DJ in this game, we would have lost by 20.

Besides, how do you know he didn't hold him accountable by talking to him at length at halftime, or having an assistant do so during the game? Holding him accountable by benching him for 10 minutes would not have helped either DJ or the team.

And there were a couple of games where Wojo DID sit DJ for some stretches after DJ played poorly. Each situation is different.

You can't treat each player the same. We know that DJ has battled some things, and that's how he ended up on the transfer market in the first place. For all you and I know, Wojo -- who is far closer to DJ than you or I will ever be -- has handled DJ's situation absolutely perfectly this season.

Last night, I was thrilled that Wojo let DJ play his way out of his problems. Doing so almost won the game for us.

The skill gap between DJ and our next best Point guard is a mile wide. With Symir out it is even wider. Whether he's at the top of his game or he's struggling, Carton has to play as many minutes as he's physically able.

[The Sultan]

Agree. Bad game against us aside for Zegarowski, everything Seton Hall does seems to come off Mamu creating something for himself or a wide open look for somebody. Last night those somebodies were hitting at a good clip. Mamu's combination of size, skill, unselfishness and speed make him a really tough guard for almost all college players. He'll be a solid pro.

He will have a good pro career, but not sure it will be in the NBA.  While he IS big, he doesn't really PLAY big.  And I am not sure he is a good enough shooter to overcome a lack of athleticism.

[MU82]

The skill gap between DJ and our next best Point guard is a mile wide. With Symir out it is even wider. Whether he's at the top of his game or he's struggling, Carton has to play as many minutes as he's physically able.

Yep. It would have done neither DJ nor the team any good to bench him last night. He is still relatively young -- still hasn't played the equivalent of one full college season. He will get better on the court, experiencing the highs and lows while learning on the fly, not on the bench.