POLL:Uconn to Big East good or bad?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

What exactly are they doing to burn down football? Everyone keeps saying this, but UConn keeps saying they haven't yet decided what they will do. I don't believe they don't have a plan, but continually putting off what it is doesn't inspire confidence.

It doesn't matter what they do with football. It's irrelevant to the conversation.

Our conference is so much better than the AAC that we were able to poach a football school from them despite them having nowhere to put their football program. This speaks to the strength of our conference. We can't raid the power conferences but we can prey on other football conferences. This is a good thing.

[Herman Cain]

What exactly are they doing to burn down football? Everyone keeps saying this, but UConn keeps saying they haven't yet decided what they will do. I don't believe they don't have a plan, but continually putting off what it is doesn't inspire confidence.

They are hoping that they can somehow convince the AAC to let them stay in for football. Right now the AAC position is for the Huskies to pound sand . We will know more on that in the days and weeks ahead.

Even if U Conn stays in AAC football, they are extremely low in the pecking order of attractive candidates for college football conference expansion.

[brewcity77]

The last time we were in a league with football programs it seemed relevant. Did the money go out of football and I missed it?

We've found stability by divorcing from football. This is totally the "our crazy ex wasn't THAT bad" mindset.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

They are hoping that they can somehow convince the AAC to let them stay in for football. Right now the AAC position is for the Huskies to pound sand . We will know more on that in the days and weeks ahead.

Even if U Conn stays in AAC football, they are extremely low in the pecking order of attractive candidates for college football conference expansion.

Maybe they promise to schedule (1) or (2) BB games a year against AAC teams or something like that.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

The last time we were in a league with football programs it seemed relevant. Did the money go out of football and I missed it?

We've found stability by divorcing from football. This is totally the "our crazy ex wasn't THAT bad" mindset.

You're really making mountains out if molehills here Brew.

Like you said people are looking to find the good and ignoring the bad, you're doing the opposite.

Marquette will be fine, the Big East will be fine, the world still turns.

[MU Buff]

The last time we were in a league with football programs it seemed relevant. Did the money go out of football and I missed it?

We've found stability by divorcing from football. This is totally the "our crazy ex wasn't THAT bad" mindset.

Isn't it different now that the basketball schools have control? In the past, we were at the mercy of whatever the football schools wanted to do.

[brewcity77]

You're really making mountains out if molehills here Brew.

Like you said people are looking to find the good and ignoring the bad, you're doing the opposite.

Marquette will be fine, the Big East will be fine, the world still turns.

I've acknowledged the potential upside. If all goes perfectly, it could work really well. Those asserting this is basically a zero risk proposition, in my opinion, have their heads buried really deep in the sand.

We left for a reason.

[Eldon]

It doesn't matter what they do with football. It's irrelevant to the conversation.

Our conference is so much better than the AAC that we were able to poach a football school from them despite them having nowhere to put their football program. This speaks to the strength of our conference. We can't raid the power conferences but we can prey on other football conferences. This is a good thing.

Great point.

Props to Val.  Big, big props.

[Herman Cain]

I've acknowledged the potential upside. If all goes perfectly, it could work really well. Those asserting this is basically a zero risk proposition, in my opinion, have their heads buried really deep in the sand.

We left for a reason.

Here is what needs to happen for the risk scenario you envision to play out. First, U Conn basketball has to become a national power again at the level they were  under Jim Calhoun. Second, their football team has to become a winner in the AAC and in bowls consistently. Then, Third, conference expansion has to happen in a big way again. it has to be a big movement because there are so many more logical, TV market attractive candidates  than U Conn even if scenario one and two were met. The reason we know this to be true is that U Conn got passed over several times before when they actually did meet the first two conditions. Since that time other schools  with P5 ambition have made major strides.  Finally the politics of Connecticut are such that 41 million losses are not going to be tolerated for long, which means they would somehow have to find a way to be relevant with less money,  which is a huge mountain to climb. So what is the probability all of the above actually playing out and what is the timeline of such developments.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

The last time we were in a league with football programs it seemed relevant. Did the money go out of football and I missed it?

We've found stability by divorcing from football. This is totally the "our crazy ex wasn't THAT bad" mindset.

But our ex wasn't crazy. The ACC is a better conference than the Big East. Always has been, always will be. You can't blame schools for doing what's best for them. If we had been offered a spot in the ACC we would have been gone so fast your head would have spun.

And nothing has changed. Every last school in the Big East would prefer to be in the ACC. Every one of them. If there's stability, it's only because we are conference made up of programs not good enough to be in the ACC....so UConn will fit right in!

We left for a reason.

Yes, and football had nothing to do with it. We left to get away from schools like ECU, Tulane, etc. diluting our basketball product. UConn, Notre Dame, Cincy, and Louisville were all invited to join the Catholic 7. They declined. So unless you think UConn is going to dilute our basketball product, the situations are very different.

[brewcity77]

it has to be a big movement because there are so many more logical, TV market attractive candidates  than U Conn even if scenario one and two were met. The reason we know this to be true is that U Conn got passed over several times before when they actually did meet the first two conditions.

Who in the AAC would be more attractive? Who in the MAC or even Mountain West? There aren't that many recognizable state schools outside the P5 in football. UConn may not have been a great option, but they're still at or near the top. And their basketball doesn't have to become elite. Unless by elite, you mean on par with Rutgers or TCU.

Yes, and football had nothing to do with it. We left to get away from schools like ECU, Tulane, etc. diluting our basketball product. UConn, Notre Dame, Cincy, and Louisville were all invited to join the Catholic 7. They declined. So unless you think UConn is going to dilute our basketball product, the situations are very different.

Schools like ECU & Tulane were only invited because of football. Football had everything to do with it.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Schools like ECU & Tulane were only invited because of football. Football had everything to do with it.

That's why they were invited. But it's not why we left.

The current Big East does not have football as a sponsored sport. So there is no risk of inviting an inferior basketball school because they have a football program.

[brewcity77]

Another unintended consequence could very well be the end of the rivalry with Wisconsin. In addition, Kentucky/Louisville, Xavier/Cincy, and any other non-con rivalries could go away.

Here's why. The general NCAA calculus is winning 20 games in a 31-game schedule. That generally means going over .500 in league play (10-8) and going .500 in significant non-con games (MU has averaged 6/year under Wojo). So 10-8 in league, 3-3 in significant games, 7-0 in exempt tourney home games & buy games.

Going to 20 means you now need to go 11-9 in conference. That means going 9-2 in the shorter non-con season. In a regular year, assume 3 quality games from the exempt tourney & for the Big East, one Gavitt & one B12 Challenge game. To get to 9-2, you have to have a winning record in those 5 games (3-2) and be perfect in your remaining 6 buy & exempt tourney home games.

That doesn't leave any room for quality buy game risks like Buffalo or Vermont, home-and-home series with Georgia or NC State, or rivalry games like Wisconsin or Notre Dame. If this goes through, any hopes of a ND series are likely over, and the annual Wisconsin rivalry could very well go away as well.

[brewcity77]

That's why they were invited. But it's not why we left.

The current Big East does not have football as a sponsored sport. So there is no risk of inviting an inferior basketball school because they have a football program.

We left because they were invited.

They were invited because of football.

Not a lot of dots to connect. 🤷‍♂️

[Uncle Rico]

Another unintended consequence could very well be the end of the rivalry with Wisconsin. In addition, Kentucky/Louisville, Xavier/Cincy, and any other non-con rivalries could go away.

Here's why. The general NCAA calculus is winning 20 games in a 31-game schedule. That generally means going over .500 in league play (10-8) and going .500 in significant non-con games (MU has averaged 6/year under Wojo). So 10-8 in league, 3-3 in significant games, 7-0 in exempt tourney home games & buy games.

Going to 20 means you now need to go 11-9 in conference. That means going 9-2 in the shorter non-con season. In a regular year, assume 3 quality games from the exempt tourney & for the Big East, one Gavitt & one B12 Challenge game. To get to 9-2, you have to have a winning record in those 5 games (3-2) and be perfect in your remaining 6 buy & exempt tourney home games.

That doesn't leave any room for quality buy game risks like Buffalo or Vermont, home-and-home series with Georgia or NC State, or rivalry games like Wisconsin or Notre Dame. If this goes through, any hopes of a ND series are likely over, and the annual Wisconsin rivalry could very well go away as well.

Wisconsin could easily end the series anyway since they've already gone to a 20-game conference season. 

[brewcity77]

Wisconsin could easily end the series anyway since they've already gone to a 20-game conference season.

I hypothesized that on Twitter, but the reality that it becomes a complication for both parties only increases the likelihood. The non-con schedule will almost certainly suffer for this. We likely won't see more than one quality non-con home game most years. And it's more likely we'll have zero quality non-con home games than two.

[Uncle Rico]

I hypothesized that on Twitter, but the reality that it becomes a complication for both parties only increases the likelihood. The non-con schedule will almost certainly suffer for this. We likely won't see more than one quality non-con home game most years. And it's more likely we'll have zero quality non-con home games than two.

It's possible.  I won't pretend to say the non-con schedule won't possibly suffer.  That said, there is still a need to schedule to fill Fiserv and schedule for March.  The quality of the league will go up and down

[Herman Cain]

Who in the AAC would be more attractive? Who in the MAC or even Mountain West? There aren't that many recognizable state schools outside the P5 in football. UConn may not have been a great option, but they're still at or near the top. And their basketball doesn't have to become elite. Unless by elite, you mean on par with Rutgers or TCU.

Schools like ECU & Tulane were only invited because of football. Football had everything to do with it.

Houston is the 7th largest media market. They are a no brainer fit on many levels with the Big 12. 

UCF is the largest on campus  university in the country with 68,000 students.
Orlando where UCF is in the 18th largest media market and nearby Tampa is 18th with viewership state wide. UCF has sold out their football season tickets and is using that to build the rest of the athletic complex with goal of being a top 25 athletics program overall.

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/ucf-knights/os-sp-ucf-charge-on-orlando-0510-20190510-5km64eosvjctpklr4ku4efm4d4-story.html

Cincinnati has a long history of consistent success in both football and basketball and has all the on campus facilities and donor support required of a Power 5 program.  In a solid TV market in a football centric area.

Memphis has been investing heavily in football and getting bowl bound results, basketball has been consistently strong and most importantly they have the backing of one of the biggest advertisers in Fed EX. Geographically desirable being in the center of country.


BYU. Football tradition great. Only obstacle in past has been their  TV contract. They are very desirable from a football perspective and have decent basketball as well. 

Then there are what I call the  companion schools, SMU and USF. So while neither would be a headline pick, if Houston or UCF comes on board they would be  companions with big media markets . Analogy, when Big Ten brought Maryland on board, Rutgers came along for the ride as a companion.

U Conn would be below all of those .

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

We left because they were invited.

They were invited because of football.

Not a lot of dots to connect. 🤷‍♂️

But you're misconnecting the dots. The Catholic 7 was fine with adding football schools. This is why UConn, Louisville,  Notre Dame,  and Cincy were invited to split with the C7. They weren't fine with asking bad basketball schools.

UConn is a very good basketball program. The fact that they have football is irrelevant.

[The Sultan]

The last time we were in a league with football programs it seemed relevant. Did the money go out of football and I missed it?

We've found stability by divorcing from football. This is totally the "our crazy ex wasn't THAT bad" mindset.

We were in a conference that sponsored football that was making decisions for football related reasons. This is completely different. Not really comparable.

[Nukem2]

We were in a conference that sponsored football that was making decisions for football related reasons. This is completely different. Not really comparable.

Yes, would only have 1 of 11 with a FBS posture.  Quite different.

[The Sultan]

We left because they were invited.

They were invited because of football.

Not a lot of dots to connect. 🤷‍♂️

That's the point Brew. No school invited to join the BE will be invited because of football.

[Billy Hoyle]

But you're misconnecting the dots. The Catholic 7 was fine with adding football schools. This is why UConn, Louisville,  Notre Dame,  and Cincy were invited to split with the C7. They weren't fine with asking bad basketball schools.

UConn is a very good basketball program. The fact that they have football is irrelevant.

Inviting Tulane is what pushed everyone over the edge, Larry Williams especially who led the departure.  The interesting part of that whole situation was his daughter worked in Tulane Athletics at the time and she had to deal with her dad's criticism of her employer.

https://www.nola.com/tulane/2012/12/tulanes_loudest_big_east_criti.html

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

I can't imagine Cincy is too happy about this.

[The Sultan]

I can't imagine Cincy is too happy about this.

I would guess Temple is less happy than Cincy. The Bearcats have a decent football football program.