Poll: Markus Howard Jersey Retirement

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

This idea that Howard was a “representative” of Marquette is a bunch of nonsense. He drove two of our best players to transfer. That’s his legacy. Sam’s success magnifies it, which is why I assume this poll materialized. Sam was no “prima donna.” That’s a joke. He was a leader and one of the best players we’ve had since DWade. He simply tried to get Wojo to coach the damn team and the guy refused. That takes a lot of guts. He made the right decision to leave.

There are several players that should be honored before Howard. I have often thought #34 should be retired…Tony Smith, McIlvaine and Diener is a pretty good trio. If you’re gonna retire Howard, McNeal should be first.

[Pepe Sylvia]

Hopefully we never have to talk about the NIT again. That fact that people thought that was a success or an accomplishment is embarrassing

It was Marquette basketball i could watch and they won like 3 or 4 games or something, it was a good time. I have no regrets. Wish I coulda watched more Davante Gardner in the NIT, for example. But an accomplishment? I wouldn't say that.

[cheebs09]

This idea that Howard was a “representative” of Marquette is a bunch of nonsense. He drove two of our best players to transfer. That’s his legacy. Sam’s success magnifies it, which is why I assume this poll materialized. Sam was no “prima donna.” That’s a joke. He was a leader and one of the best players we’ve had since DWade. He simply tried to get Wojo to coach the damn team and the guy refused. That takes a lot of guts. He made the right decision to leave.

There are several players that should be honored before Howard. I have often thought #34 should be retired…Tony Smith, McIlvaine and Diener is a pretty good trio. If you’re gonna retire Howard, McNeal should be first.

I think that’s a Wojo problem and not a Markus problem.

[Galway Eagle]

This idea that Howard was a “representative” of Marquette is a bunch of nonsense. He drove two of our best players to transfer. That’s his legacy. Sam’s success magnifies it, which is why I assume this poll materialized. Sam was no “prima donna.” That’s a joke. He was a leader and one of the best players we’ve had since DWade. He simply tried to get Wojo to coach the damn team and the guy refused. That takes a lot of guts. He made the right decision to leave.

There are several players that should be honored before Howard. I have often thought #34 should be retired…Tony Smith, McIlvaine and Diener is a pretty good trio. If you’re gonna retire Howard, McNeal should be first.

Well he helped get Oso here. He was huge in getting MU national press, he differed most his success to saying he had great teammates rather than be an attention hog. He was a great ambassador for the mental health issues athletes face, He conducted himself well off the court without any rumblings of issues (Jimmy), he graduated with honors, and while I strongly disagree with the ethos of Fellowship of Christian Athletes he was instrumental in developing the chapter at MU.

You don't like his game, that's fine. You don't like that the coach put him in that scenario, that's fine. You can't separate him from the hausers, that's fine. But the guy absolutely was a fantastic representative for the university and saying otherwise is disingenuous.

And for the record I'm not for retiring his jersey. I think we should take down everyone except Ellis and Wade. Maybe Lee. Beyond that have a banner that has name, number, & years played call it the legends banner or whatnot.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

Is there anything more ridiculous than a player hoisting up 30 shots and then citing his teammates?

How was he “huge” in getting National press? The most attention we got when he was here was for the Hauser’s leaving because of him.

What “rumblings of issues did Jimmy have? There were none.

[Jockey]

If MU had won a conference championship, or heck, even a Big East Tournament title, we could ignore the NCAA tournament embarrassments.

But the fact Markus Howard led MU to 0 championships and postseason wins of any consequence makes it a hard no from me, dog.

Exactly. Guys like Mike Trout or Dan Marino should never get any honors. They were/are embarrassments to their teams.

[Galway Eagle]

Is there anything more ridiculous than a player hoisting up 30 shots and then citing his teammates?

How was he “huge” in getting National press? The most attention we got when he was here was for the Hauser’s leaving because of him.

What “rumblings of issues did Jimmy have? There were none.

1) Yes, praising the assists, praising that he had Rowsey or Sam that defenses also had to key in on. He easily could've been like "well try and stop me!"

2) Seriously? He literally kept MU as something to watch in 2019/20, he kept us on sportcenter. Without Markus that 18/19 team isn't a shadow of who they were. Sam needed a more athletic player to do a drive and dish. He wasn't going to carry that team on a 20-2 stretch.

3) maybe you weren't on campus or maybe you have your head i the sand like an ostrich. There absolutely were.

Again you've hated him since he started that's fine but it's a very important disclosure for context when posting.

[Uncle Rico]

Yes

[WellsstreetWanderer]

I am of the opinion that there are players more deserving of this honor

[Class71]

Wojo coached like he had one player on the team. One player shoots and the rest of the team watched.

Possibly if he had a better coach Markus may have developed into a better all around player. What Markus did was at an elite level but in other areas he was somewhat lacking.

In Smart's system he would have been much more effective but likely a lower scorer. He would have improved our 3 point shooting Percent and he would have improved overall. Add a Jim Chones type center and it would be dynasty time.

[CountryRoads]

The thing that is holding me back from saying his number should be retired right now is the lack of enough team success. Individual stats are mostly meaningless unless you also consider team success along with it.

The coach’s system that made him the focal point really wasn’t a winning formula. There’s a lot of players who could put up those stats if given the same green light.

[Its DJOver]

The thing that is holding me back from saying his number should be retired right now is the lack of enough team success. Individual stats are mostly meaningless unless you also consider team success along with it.

The coach’s system that made him the focal point really wasn’t a winning formula. There’s a lot of players who could put up those stats if given the same green light.

Are there though?  The coach was here for 7 years, Markus was only here for 4 of them, and no one ever really came close to putting up his level of production within the same system.

[DienerTime34]

Exactly. Guys like Mike Trout or Dan Marino should never get any honors. They were/are embarrassments to their teams.

LMAO what? Dan Marino won 8 playoff games. And led the Dolphins to a Super Bowl.

If Markus had led us to the NCAA Championship game, heck, retire his jersey AND build him a statue.

[Viper]

This idea that Howard was a “representative” of Marquette is a bunch of nonsense. He drove two of our best players to transfer. That’s his legacy. Sam’s success magnifies it, which is why I assume this poll materialized. Sam was no “prima donna.” That’s a joke. He was a leader and one of the best players we’ve had since DWade. He simply tried to get Wojo to coach the damn team and the guy refused. That takes a lot of guts. He made the right decision to leave.

There are several players that should be honored before Howard. I have often thought #34 should be retired…Tony Smith, McIlvaine and Diener is a pretty good trio. If you’re gonna retire Howard, McNeal should be first.

Sam was such a great leader, he quit. MH?…2xAA gets a banner.

[dgies9156]

OK gang, accepting the difference between retiring the jersey and retiring the number, here's who I'd put in both categories:

Retired Numbers
15 -- Butch Lee
24 -- George Thompson (because of a commitment the University made to George)
31 -- Bo Ellis/Doc Rivers

You could sell me on 3 -- Dwyane Wade as well for what DWade did in 2003.

Now for the retired uniforms
11 -- Tyler Kolek!
14 -- Dean Meminger
20 -- Maurice Lucas
22 -- Jim Chones, Jeral McNeal
34 -- Tony Smith/Jim Mcilvaine
43 -- Earl Tatum
44 -- Don Kojis
45 -- Bob Lackey (a personal favorite for which few will agree)

Other than Lackey, the only controversial one on the list is Tyler "F**k 'em" Kolek. That's a few years away but I'd be sure to make room for it because it should happen.

I don't have Markus on this list because his contribution to the team and winning is lacking. He was a great shooter and good scorer but if he's going up there, Lackey, Tyler, Larry McNeill, Bernard Toone, Sam Worthen and Odell Ball and a host of others need to be there too!

[lawdog77]

Exactly. Guys like Mike Trout or Dan Marino should never get any honors. They were/are embarrassments to their teams.

John Stockton, Karl Malone, Charles Barkley, Patrick Ewing.

Strike that last one.

[MUfan12]

Let's go full ass Carolina and retire a bunch of jerseys.

0- Howard
1- James
10- Miller
20- Lucas, Novak
22- McNeal, Chones
23- Matthews
31- Rivers
32- Hayward
33- Butler
34- Diener, T. Smith
43- Tatum
44- Kojis

Retired Numbers:

3- Wade
14- Meminger
15- Lee
24- Thompson
31- Ellis

[MUBBau]

Juan Anderson is a Big East Champion, has a Sweet 16 and an Elite 8, and is an NBA Champion. I think he needs to be in the discussion too!

[Newsdreams]

Is there anything more ridiculous than a player hoisting up 30 shots and then citing his teammates?

How was he “huge” in getting National press? The most attention we got when he was here was for the Hauser’s leaving because of him.

What “rumblings of issues did Jimmy have? There were none.

You should stop using that handle.

[lawdog77]

Sam was such a great leader, he quit. MH?…2xAA gets a banner.

Sam had his chances that magical season. Creighton he was 1/7 with 0 assists, Georgetown he was 2/11. I'm not bitter. Plenty of blame to go around.

[fjm]

Sam had his chances that magical season. Creighton he was 1/7 with 0 assists, Georgetown he was 2/11. I'm not bitter. Plenty of blame to go around.

Hey you jerk!
You know facts are not allowed here!
His poor shooting was due to wojo recruiting him and getting him on the team! If Wojo hadn’t recruited Sam then he wouldn’t have shot that poorly against Georgetown or creighton.

Also Sam was super successful at Virginia… which proves he was all world here and Markus should have only passed to him.

[brewcity77]

Everything in the article says jersey, not number.

What's the list of retired jerseys but non-retired numbers? Until the institution changes their practice, it's about retiring the number.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

Absolutely. 

[MUBBau]

What's the list of retired jerseys but non-retired numbers? Until the institution changes their practice, it's about retiring the number.

I think the fact that we have two 31's in the rafters proves it's jerseys and not numbers that get retired.

[Coleman]

Poorly researched.
1.  States individual accolades shouldn’t be the measure yet then states individual accolades of two people without NCAA wins. Neither is in first place in those categories. Let alone by nearly 800 points
2. Calls out that Doc’s Jersey was retired because of his NBA success, except his Jersey was retired in 2004 which happened before his NBA Championship as a coach in 2008
3.  Prior to that, Doc was a good player in the NBA but probably hasn’t had as good a career as many Marquette players whose jersey isn’t retired.   I would say folks like Butler/Wes have had just as good of a playing career in the NBA.  Doc’s NBA achievements as a player is one all-star appearance. At the time of his Jersey retirement as a coach it was one coach of the year. Should we start the Butler/Wes jerseys should or should not be retired thread before they officially retire?   
4.  Markus is the only MU player to be a consensus all-American twice.
5.  Of the players to receive AA status only three haven’t had their jersey retired Chones, Markus and Worthen. Chones has an NBA title.  So based on NBA success shouldnt his be retired too?
6. Calls out Doc for being number 10 in assists. Doc has 409 assists to Markus 392. Is 400 the magic number?  does the 17 assists overshadow the 1500 point difference?  3yrs vs 4yrs shouldn't matter as it is career impact.

All this to say I think the criteria for not retiring Markus’ Jersey is arbitrary and poorly thought out.

The funniest inconsistency to me was saying Markus being the all time leading scorer doesn't matter, but justified Kojis' number being retired because he is the all time leading rebounder lol.