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Author Topic: More conference realignment talk  (Read 32758 times)

Billy Hoyle

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #575 on: October 22, 2021, 12:27:45 PM »
Correct. Also, when has Few commented publicly about joining the BE?

he has, but "anonymously." He has his guys he feeds stuff to on the down low. His strongest statements about conferences were that other schools in the WCC has to step up their games and improve their programs. Schools responded, particularly Santa Clara, San Francisco, and LMU.

Pres and AD are the deciding factors. Boeheim was adamantly opposed to going to the ACC. How did that work out?
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Dr. Blackheart

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #576 on: October 22, 2021, 12:29:34 PM »
he has, but "anonymously." He has his guys he feeds stuff to on the down low. His strongest statements about conferences were that other schools in the WCC has to step up their games and improve their programs. Schools responded, particularly Santa Clara, San Francisco, and LMU.

Pres and AD are the deciding factors. Boeheim was adamantly opposed to going to the ACC. How did that work out?

I’d add Pacific too.

As to Syracuse, that AD and President were fired.

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #577 on: October 22, 2021, 12:35:29 PM »
Why all this debate? BE will do as Fox want$$$$. Simple end of story.

Billy Hoyle

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #578 on: October 22, 2021, 12:41:02 PM »
I’d add Pacific too.

As to Syracuse, that AD and President were fired.

But not for joining the ACC but rather being complicit in 10+ years of rules violations and the Bernie Fine coverups.

Pacific hired Stoudamire but hasn't actually made real investments in basketball.  Santa Clara is making the biggest leap, finally tapping into the Silicon Valley money and building ridiculous new facilities.  https://university-operations.scu.edu/planning-and-projects/campus-projects/athletics-excellence-center/

LMU is also planning a new facility and USF poured a lot of money into a big renovation of their arena. When Scholl retired Craig Pintens should be a candidate with what he's doing out there.
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The Lens

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #579 on: October 22, 2021, 12:47:04 PM »
But not for joining the ACC but rather being complicit in 10+ years of rules violations and the Bernie Fine coverups.

Pacific hired Stoudamire but hasn't actually made real investments in basketball.  Santa Clara is making the biggest leap, finally tapping into the Silicon Valley money and building ridiculous new facilities.  https://university-operations.scu.edu/planning-and-projects/campus-projects/athletics-excellence-center/

LMU is also planning a new facility and USF poured a lot of money into a big renovation of their arena. When Scholl retired Craig Pintens should be a candidate with what he's doing out there.

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tower912

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #580 on: October 22, 2021, 12:50:58 PM »
Another DUI and Few's opinion on the Big East won't matter.
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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #581 on: October 22, 2021, 01:28:45 PM »
Past behavior is the best predictor of future results.

You talked about how committed SLU is funding athletics and the results of that have been one NCAA tournament since 2014.  Are they willing to spend as much as or more Marquette?  Including other sports?

What happens when the current SLU administration turns over?  Are they going to continue that investment?  Historically they have not. 

What SLU done on the court, or even off for that matter, to earn a seat at the table?

I appreciate the questions and sincere discussion. Let’s take a look.

First, anyone that knows the name Larry Biondi, SJ, could tell you entertaining stories for days. (He’s SLU’s former 25 year school President). Some of the stories are legendary. He not only wasn’t interested in sports, he went out of his way to hinder sports often. He did a lot of good things for their school. They weren’t sports related. He had a difficult personality.

School Budgets were posted earlier in this thread by me. (Very few schools spend as much or more than Marquette). What SLU has done, which is very significant for them, is raise their budget to the same as Xavier’s budget right now, while still not being in a Power 5/Big East league. I am confident that would increase even more in a league such as the Big East. Getting to this point is significantly different than anything in their past. Within the current 15 years they have 3 new building projects worth $125 Million, all on campus, all for Athletics. Their most recently announced 2 projects were expected to be announced 2 years ago. It was delayed due to the pandemic.

Rick Majerus recruited Richard Chaiftez and vice versa. Chaifetz has already spent $30 Million. Additionally, he was one of many donors who gave a $1 Million each to their project announced this week. Chaifetz owns an Employee Benefits company based in Chicago. He’s very out front, rah rah type, sits courtside for games. He’s long wanted to own an NBA team.

Jim Kavanaugh, is a SLU Soccer alum and billionaire. He is part owner of the St. Louis Blues hockey team, (They have a lot of owners), and their new MLS Soccer team, as well as a few other sports entities there. His company (Worldwide Technologies or WWT) also is a big sports advertiser, and does a lot with the local Nascar stuff there as well as the Senior PGA event there. He’s a big SLU and SLU basketball booster. He also wrote a $Million check and he’s behind the new $5 Million SLU Soccer building there that will be completed in December.

The lead donor of their new $20 Million Student Athlete building, Bob O’ Loughlin, is a developer of hotels and hospitality, new Union Station etc...

All of these represent newer SLU booster/donors. They still have some of the past ones. Some of these also sit on SLU’s Board of Trustees, which is also not something of the past. The past had a very Biondi friendly board of trustees there.

SLU’s current school President came from, wait for it…Dayton. He worked his way up at Dayton for 24 years. Fred Pestello is friendly, nerdy, Academic type who attends a lot of SLU sporting events in a wide variety of sports. A Biondi sighting at sporting event was compared to Big Foot sightings. Pestello has been there for 7 years.

SLU already often plays several Big East schools in non-revenue sports on a regular basis. Xavier, Creighton, Butler, Marquette, DePaul, are common opponents, shorter travel distances, less costs, for non revenue sports.

There will always be changes and turnover eventually in any role. You try to avoid the Pilarz/Williams situations as much as possible. Changes in President, BOT, boosters, has been significant since Biondi has left.

Their AD Chris May was picked by Majerus. He is roughly similar to Pestello in that he is an affable nerdy type. Neither of those two are charismatic salesmen. That’s more of a Travis Ford role. Ford understands selling, marketing well. He’s been in both the A-10 and a Power 5 League. He’a also from small town Kentucky, played at Mizzou/Kentucky, and his son is a recent student at Mizzou). He’s a big St. Louis sports fan since a kid. So, as long as he wins enough, he’s pretty entrenched there a while. But he has to win enough and he knows that.

Ford has been able to recruit the St. Louis area for players. Many coaches including Majerus struggled to do that over the years. Hiring Corey Tate has been very effective. SLU also hired a couple of other good assistants. One of those left for St. John’s and Mike Anderson, Van Macon. (He’s a New Yorker)

Other non revenue sports? (I follow Marquette’s non revenue sports and sometimes post about them)

Soccer is big there. Their Men’s team is #4 Nationally in Top Drawer Soccer. The Women’s team has several recent NCAA Tourneys. As is the case with other sports, coaching matters. And they have two good coaches who are there for the long haul. Their Men’s Soccer has a lot of those 1960’s 1970’s Marquette hoops types fans, Glory Days in the wink of a young girl’s eye. They have won the most National Titles but it’s been a long while. Competing for them is the expectation.

Lisa Stone (Wisconsin) is SLU’s Women’s Basketball Coach. She’s very solid, consistent, WNIT type of level.

They had a good volleyball coach (and results, 3 NCAA Tourneys) a while back (Ann Kordes) but she took a job at Louisville. In non revenue sports, in non power 5 leagues, it can be challenging.

They have baseball, (and softball) Good baseball coach, Darin Hendrickson, limited resources. He’s won the A-10 5 times, some NCAA Tourneys etc…If he had even more resources. they’d be even better.

And so on. Adding more resources in a new league will only help the non revenue sports.

That should answer some of your questions.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2021, 01:56:59 PM by shoothoops »

Dr. Blackheart

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #582 on: October 22, 2021, 01:37:50 PM »
But not for joining the ACC but rather being complicit in 10+ years of rules violations and the Bernie Fine coverups.

The Pittsburgh revolt leaders also got the boot.

Fluffy Blue Monster

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #583 on: October 22, 2021, 01:41:09 PM »
Looks like Old Dominion, Marshall, Southern Miss and James Madison will be going to the Sun Belt.  While James Madison would move up to FBS, the other three would be joining from Conference USA leaving them with only five members:  Florida International, Western Kentucky, Middle Tennessee, Louisiana Tech and UTEP.

Poor UTEP.  They were abandoned in the WAC by seven of their former conference members when they formed the Mountain West.  The other two members left behind were eventually invited, Fresno (all sports) and Hawaii (football only).  Now Conference USA is crumbling around them and there looks to be no Mountain West lifeline coming.  (Unless Boise goes to the Big 12.)
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brewcity77

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #584 on: October 22, 2021, 01:48:59 PM »
Another DUI and Few's opinion on the Big East won't matter.

Why, because they'll suspend him for 2 buy games AND a secret scrimmage?
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tower912

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #585 on: October 22, 2021, 01:50:36 PM »
One is a fluke.  Two is a pattern.
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brewcity77

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #586 on: October 22, 2021, 01:53:21 PM »
One is a fluke.  Two is a pattern.

Two is coincidence. Need to get to three to be a trend  ;)
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Uncle Rico

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #587 on: October 22, 2021, 01:54:25 PM »
I appreciate the questions and sincere discussion. Let’s take a look.

First, anyone that knows the name Larry Biondi could tell you entertaining stories for days. (He’s SLU’s former 25 year school President). Some of the stories are legendary. He not only wasn’t interested in sports, he went out of his way to hinder sports often.

School Budgets were posted earlier in this thread by me. (Very few schools spend as much or more than Marquette). What SLU has done, which is very significant for them, is raise their budget to the same as Xavier’s budget right now, while still not being in a Power 5/Big East league. I am confident that would increase even more in a league such as the Big East. Getting to this point is significantly different than anything in their past. Within the current 15 years they have 3 new building projects worth $125 Million, all on campus, all for Athletics. Their most recently announced 2 projects were expected to be announced 2 years ago. It was delayed due to the pandemic.

Rick Majerus recruited Richard Chaiftez and vice versa. Chaifetz has already spent $30 Million. Additionally, he was one of many donors who gave a $1 Million each to their project announced this week. Chaifetz owns an Employee Benefits company based in Chicago. He’s very out front, rah rah type, sits courtside for games. He’s long wanted to own an NBA team.

Jim Kavanaugh, is a SLU Soccer alum and billionaire. He is part owner of the St. Louis Blues hockey team, (They have a lot of owners), and their new MLS Soccer team, as well as a few other sports entities there. His company (Worldwide Technologies or WWT) also is a big sports advertiser, and does a lot with the local Nascar stuff there as well as the Senior PGA event there. He’s a big SLU and SLU basketball booster. He also wrote a $Million check and he’s behind the new $5 Million SLU Soccer building there that will be completed in December.

The lead donor of their new $20 Million Student Athlete building, Bob O’ Loughlin, is a developer of hotels and hospitality, new Union Station etc...

All of these represent newer SLU booster/donors. They still have some of the past ones. Some of these also sit on SLU’s Board of Trustees, which is also not something of the past. The past had a very Biondi friendly board of trustees there.

SLU’s current school President came from, wait for it…Dayton. He worked his way up at Dayton for 24 years. Fred Pestello is friendly, nerdy, Academic type who attends a lot of SLU sporting events in a wide variety of sports. A Biondi sighting at sporting event was compared to Big Foot sightings. Pestello has been there for 7 years.

SLU already often plays several Big East schools in non-revenue sports on a regular basis. Xavier, Creighton, Butler, Marquette, DePaul, are common opponents, shorter travel distances, less costs, for non revenue sports.

There will always be changes and turnover eventually in any role. You try to avoid the Pilarz/Williams situations as much as possible. Changes in President, BOT, boosters, has been significant since Biondi has left.

Their AD Chris May was picked by Majerus. He is roughly similar to Pestello in that he is an affable nerdy type. Neither of those two are charismatic salesmen. That’s more of a Travis Ford role. Ford understands selling, marketing well. He’s been in both the A-10 and a Power 5 League. He’a also from small town Kentucky, played at Mizzou/Kentucky, and his son is a recent student at Mizzou). He’s a big St. Louis sports fan since a kid. So, as long as he wins enough, he’s pretty entrenched there a while. But he has to win enough and he knows that.

Ford has been able to recruit the St. Louis area for players. Many coaches including Majerus struggled to do that over the years. Hiring Corey Tate has been very effective. SLU also hired a couple of other good assistants. One of those left for St. John’s and Mike Anderson, Van Macon. (He’s a New Yorker)

Other non revenue sports? (I follow Marquette’s non revenue sports and sometimes post about them)

Soccer is big there. Their Men’s team is #4 Nationally in Top Drawer Soccer. The Women’s team has several recent NCAA Tourneys. As is the case with other sports, coaching matters. And they have two good coaches who are there for the long haul. Their Men’s Soccer has a lot of those 1960’s 1970’s Marquette hoops types fans, Glory Days in the wink of a young girl’s eye. They have won the most National Titles but it’s been a long while. Competing for them is the expectation.

Lisa Stone (Wisconsin) is SLU’s Women’s Basketball Coach. She’s very solid, consistent, WNIT type of level.

They had a good volleyball coach (and results, 3 NCAA Tourneys) a while back (Ann Kordes) but she took a job at Louisville. In non revenue sports, in non power 5 leagues, it can be challenging.

They have baseball, (and softball) Good baseball coach, Darin Hendrickson, limited resources. He’s won the A-10 5 times, some NCAA Tourneys etc…If he had even more resources. they’d be even better.

And so on. Adding more resources in a new league will only help the non revenue sports.

That should answer some of your questions.

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The Equalizer

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #588 on: October 22, 2021, 02:33:24 PM »
I don't think Texas,  OU or the SEC view the world like you do. Maybe you're smarter. We'll see.

Oh, I think they view it exactly as I do. 

Texas and OU are the newcomers.  The losers will be the existing SEC members.
 
If Gonzaga joins the Big East, the big winners are Val and Gonzaga. The losers are the 11 other members of the conference.   

Galway Eagle

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #589 on: October 22, 2021, 02:51:04 PM »
Oh, I think they view it exactly as I do. 

Texas and OU are the newcomers.  The losers will be the existing SEC members.
 
If Gonzaga joins the Big East, the big winners are Val and Gonzaga. The losers are the 11 other members of the conference.

1. Villanova likely doesn't lose either

2. It depends on if the other programs stand to ring the bell to another top tier program.
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Viper

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #590 on: October 22, 2021, 02:55:39 PM »
Think you're really overestimating Marquette as a program if you think we are the equivalent of Texas football.
analogy. Nothing more, BLM was making an analogy. He’s not saying MU hoops is = Texas fball. (Although Texas football ain’t sh!t)

cheebs09

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #591 on: October 22, 2021, 02:57:19 PM »
Oh, I think they view it exactly as I do. 

Texas and OU are the newcomers.  The losers will be the existing SEC members.
 
If Gonzaga joins the Big East, the big winners are Val and Gonzaga. The losers are the 11 other members of the conference.

Don’t the other schools get a marquee matchup and likely more money per year?


Billy Hoyle

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #592 on: October 22, 2021, 03:37:53 PM »
Looks like Old Dominion, Marshall, Southern Miss and James Madison will be going to the Sun Belt.  While James Madison would move up to FBS, the other three would be joining from Conference USA leaving them with only five members:  Florida International, Western Kentucky, Middle Tennessee, Louisiana Tech and UTEP.

Poor UTEP.  They were abandoned in the WAC by seven of their former conference members when they formed the Mountain West.  The other two members left behind were eventually invited, Fresno (all sports) and Hawaii (football only).  Now Conference USA is crumbling around them and there looks to be no Mountain West lifeline coming.  (Unless Boise goes to the Big 12.)

Right now their only option may be the WAC in all sports except football as the WAC just added four Texas schools and now sponsors FCS football. They could be an independent along with NMSU.

I'm kind of sad to see CUSA dissolve with USM being the last original member now leaving. We were instrumental in forming the conference and it started when I was at MU.
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TAMU Eagle

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #593 on: October 22, 2021, 03:49:30 PM »
Looks like Old Dominion, Marshall, Southern Miss and James Madison will be going to the Sun Belt.  While James Madison would move up to FBS, the other three would be joining from Conference USA leaving them with only five members:  Florida International, Western Kentucky, Middle Tennessee, Louisiana Tech and UTEP.

Poor UTEP.  They were abandoned in the WAC by seven of their former conference members when they formed the Mountain West.  The other two members left behind were eventually invited, Fresno (all sports) and Hawaii (football only).  Now Conference USA is crumbling around them and there looks to be no Mountain West lifeline coming.  (Unless Boise goes to the Big 12.)

I'm honestly surprised UTEP got left out in favor of those 4. Solid program in a large metro area. I guess no one wants to travel that far.

So does CUSA go Northeast and grab UConn, UMass, and Army? Take in Liberty? Are there other FCS powers ready to make the jump? Would NDST jump up to FBS? If they did is that too far outside CUSA's footprint? Is Sam Houston State ready to jump up? Does UTEP stay or go independent?
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source?

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #594 on: October 22, 2021, 05:04:28 PM »
I'm honestly surprised UTEP got left out in favor of those 4. Solid program in a large metro area. I guess no one wants to travel that far.

So does CUSA go Northeast and grab UConn, UMass, and Army? Take in Liberty? Are there other FCS powers ready to make the jump? Would NDST jump up to FBS? If they did is that too far outside CUSA's footprint? Is Sam Houston State ready to jump up? Does UTEP stay or go independent?

Part of UConn's reasoning for leaving the AAC was the cost of travel in the Southern-centric conference. My guess is they aren't interested.

WhiteTrash

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #595 on: October 22, 2021, 08:07:31 PM »
Oh, I think they view it exactly as I do. 

Texas and OU are the newcomers.  The losers will be the existing SEC members.
 
If Gonzaga joins the Big East, the big winners are Val and Gonzaga. The losers are the 11 other members of the conference.
I know reading is a lost art these days.  ".. and the SEC" Was in my post. So the SEC members see it like you do and stupidly accepted OU and Texas?

I conceded you may be right in the end but the SEC thinks exactly opposite of you. We shall see who's right in the years to come.

Fluffy Blue Monster

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #596 on: October 22, 2021, 08:47:48 PM »
I'm honestly surprised UTEP got left out in favor of those 4. Solid program in a large metro area. I guess no one wants to travel that far.

So does CUSA go Northeast and grab UConn, UMass, and Army? Take in Liberty? Are there other FCS powers ready to make the jump? Would NDST jump up to FBS? If they did is that too far outside CUSA's footprint? Is Sam Houston State ready to jump up? Does UTEP stay or go independent?

If I am UTEP, I hold out on making any decisions until they see if the Big 12 takes Boise.
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BallBoy

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #597 on: October 23, 2021, 02:07:33 PM »
I appreciate the questions and sincere discussion. Let’s take a look.

First, anyone that knows the name Larry Biondi, SJ, could tell you entertaining stories for days. (He’s SLU’s former 25 year school President). Some of the stories are legendary. He not only wasn’t interested in sports, he went out of his way to hinder sports often. He did a lot of good things for their school. They weren’t sports related. He had a difficult personality.

School Budgets were posted earlier in this thread by me. (Very few schools spend as much or more than Marquette). What SLU has done, which is very significant for them, is raise their budget to the same as Xavier’s budget right now, while still not being in a Power 5/Big East league. I am confident that would increase even more in a league such as the Big East. Getting to this point is significantly different than anything in their past. Within the current 15 years they have 3 new building projects worth $125 Million, all on campus, all for Athletics. Their most recently announced 2 projects were expected to be announced 2 years ago. It was delayed due to the pandemic.

Rick Majerus recruited Richard Chaiftez and vice versa. Chaifetz has already spent $30 Million. Additionally, he was one of many donors who gave a $1 Million each to their project announced this week. Chaifetz owns an Employee Benefits company based in Chicago. He’s very out front, rah rah type, sits courtside for games. He’s long wanted to own an NBA team.

Jim Kavanaugh, is a SLU Soccer alum and billionaire. He is part owner of the St. Louis Blues hockey team, (They have a lot of owners), and their new MLS Soccer team, as well as a few other sports entities there. His company (Worldwide Technologies or WWT) also is a big sports advertiser, and does a lot with the local Nascar stuff there as well as the Senior PGA event there. He’s a big SLU and SLU basketball booster. He also wrote a $Million check and he’s behind the new $5 Million SLU Soccer building there that will be completed in December.

The lead donor of their new $20 Million Student Athlete building, Bob O’ Loughlin, is a developer of hotels and hospitality, new Union Station etc...

All of these represent newer SLU booster/donors. They still have some of the past ones. Some of these also sit on SLU’s Board of Trustees, which is also not something of the past. The past had a very Biondi friendly board of trustees there.

SLU’s current school President came from, wait for it…Dayton. He worked his way up at Dayton for 24 years. Fred Pestello is friendly, nerdy, Academic type who attends a lot of SLU sporting events in a wide variety of sports. A Biondi sighting at sporting event was compared to Big Foot sightings. Pestello has been there for 7 years.

SLU already often plays several Big East schools in non-revenue sports on a regular basis. Xavier, Creighton, Butler, Marquette, DePaul, are common opponents, shorter travel distances, less costs, for non revenue sports.

There will always be changes and turnover eventually in any role. You try to avoid the Pilarz/Williams situations as much as possible. Changes in President, BOT, boosters, has been significant since Biondi has left.

Their AD Chris May was picked by Majerus. He is roughly similar to Pestello in that he is an affable nerdy type. Neither of those two are charismatic salesmen. That’s more of a Travis Ford role. Ford understands selling, marketing well. He’s been in both the A-10 and a Power 5 League. He’a also from small town Kentucky, played at Mizzou/Kentucky, and his son is a recent student at Mizzou). He’s a big St. Louis sports fan since a kid. So, as long as he wins enough, he’s pretty entrenched there a while. But he has to win enough and he knows that.

Ford has been able to recruit the St. Louis area for players. Many coaches including Majerus struggled to do that over the years. Hiring Corey Tate has been very effective. SLU also hired a couple of other good assistants. One of those left for St. John’s and Mike Anderson, Van Macon. (He’s a New Yorker)

Other non revenue sports? (I follow Marquette’s non revenue sports and sometimes post about them)

Soccer is big there. Their Men’s team is #4 Nationally in Top Drawer Soccer. The Women’s team has several recent NCAA Tourneys. As is the case with other sports, coaching matters. And they have two good coaches who are there for the long haul. Their Men’s Soccer has a lot of those 1960’s 1970’s Marquette hoops types fans, Glory Days in the wink of a young girl’s eye. They have won the most National Titles but it’s been a long while. Competing for them is the expectation.

Lisa Stone (Wisconsin) is SLU’s Women’s Basketball Coach. She’s very solid, consistent, WNIT type of level.

They had a good volleyball coach (and results, 3 NCAA Tourneys) a while back (Ann Kordes) but she took a job at Louisville. In non revenue sports, in non power 5 leagues, it can be challenging.

They have baseball, (and softball) Good baseball coach, Darin Hendrickson, limited resources. He’s won the A-10 5 times, some NCAA Tourneys etc…If he had even more resources. they’d be even better.

And so on. Adding more resources in a new league will only help the non revenue sports.

That should answer some of your questions.

In 2008, SLU opened their $80m new arena. Since then they had 4 tournament appearances.  3 of the 4 came from the Rick Majerus’ recruits. They hired Travis Ford in 2016 and he has one tourney appearance. Wojo had three.

In 2020, they were 23-8 but fourth in the A10. Tells you about the A10. Travis is entering his 6th season which means he is close to either jumping ship or being let go.  In his best year, he got run over by VA Tech in the first round.

All this is to say, history shows that SLU hasn’t jumped to P6 level even with the investment. Not to say they won’t have a good run at some point or be better than history has shown. 

But at the end of the day it doesn’t matter anyway, the Big East is the premier basketball only conference. They don’t have to take anyone so they can be extremely selective. An invite is extremely beneficial for SLU but for the other side it is not.  SLU will always be there so the BE can wait to see if the SLU investment actually changes anything. Right now SLU is not a marquee brand in basketball unlike Gonzaga who has made the tourney every year since 1999 and has two runner-ups. I don’t see Gonzaga as working out. Unless Fox sees STL as a completely untapped revenue market it ain’t happening and until SLU has a Gonzaga like run, the A10 is a good place to prove themselves. 

shoothoops

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #598 on: October 23, 2021, 04:15:29 PM »
In 2008, SLU opened their $80m new arena. Since then they had 4 tournament appearances.  3 of the 4 came from the Rick Majerus’ recruits. They hired Travis Ford in 2016 and he has one tourney appearance. Wojo had three.

In 2020, they were 23-8 but fourth in the A10. Tells you about the A10. Travis is entering his 6th season which means he is close to either jumping ship or being let go.  In his best year, he got run over by VA Tech in the first round.

All this is to say, history shows that SLU hasn’t jumped to P6 level even with the investment. Not to say they won’t have a good run at some point or be better than history has shown. 

But at the end of the day it doesn’t matter anyway, the Big East is the premier basketball only conference. They don’t have to take anyone so they can be extremely selective. An invite is extremely beneficial for SLU but for the other side it is not.  SLU will always be there so the BE can wait to see if the SLU investment actually changes anything. Right now SLU is not a marquee brand in basketball unlike Gonzaga who has made the tourney every year since 1999 and has two runner-ups. I don’t see Gonzaga as working out. Unless Fox sees STL as a completely untapped revenue market it ain’t happening and until SLU has a Gonzaga like run, the A10 is a good place to prove themselves.

Again, you are saying past results equals future results. Several of the newer Big East teams have fared better in the Big East, than prior to it, including Marquette.

In 6 seasons prior to joining the Big East, MUBB had 2 NCAA Tourney Appearances. All of those seasons were played under Tom Crean. (Deane 2 our of 5 seasons) (O’Neill 2 out of 5 seasons) (Dukiet 0 of 3) (Majerus 0 of 3).

Al McGuire Center opened in 2003. Budgets, facilities, other things helped. Fr. Wild, Bill Cords etc…so many things that are either assets or non hindrances.

After joining, Marquette had 3 straight NCAA Tourney appearances until Crean left. Then, MUBB continued that streak to 8 by making the NCAA Tourney 5 straight seasons under Buzz.

(This is where some people come in and talk about 44 years ago. But it isn’t about 44 years ago. It’s about the future.)

Creighton has finished in the top 3 of the Big East 6 out of 8 seasons since joining the league. They had their first NCAA Tourney 2nd weekend in 47 years this past year.

Prior?

Creighton missed the NCAA Tourney 4 of their previous 6 seasons.

Dana Altman had missed the NCAA Tourney 5 of his final 7 seasons at Creighton in the MVC before leaving for Oregon.

Since? Altman and Oregon have finished 1 or 2 in Pac 12 in 7 of 11 seasons. 5 NCAA 2nd weekends, Elite 8, a Final Four. In 16 seasons as Creighton’s coach, Altman made the NCAA Tourney 2nd weekend exactly zero times in the MVC.

As I’ve said before, SLU certainly has to keep doing its part on and off of the floor. They had something going with Moser and Majerus, (in spite of Biondi and others, who didn’t leave until late 2013.) that didn’t extend longer due to Rick’s health and Moser getting his own HC position at Loyola. Rick was adamant that Crews get the SLU HC job. That didn’t work out so well for them, and the removal change was too slow and too loyal. Ford came in and had to start over from that. He turned it around and made the NCAA’s his 3rd season, and has had had two solid seasons since. He’ll need to go another step there regardless of league to keep his job after the next few years. But several things have changed off of the court during his time at SLU, just as several things changed at MUBB off of the court, around the time of TC.

Again, all of what they are doing recently and doing moving forward is not in a Power 5/Big East league. It’s pretty easy to see why they are a strong candidate. Schools increase investment and expectation based as their league $ increases. And as I showed in the examples, on court results increased after the league changed too. What stands out are clearing many hurdles and making a lot of investment, raising budgets, etc…and those things matter.

Expansion and realignment discussions happen when they happen. Big East Commissioner brought it up, therefore the discussion is now or current, just as they were now or current the last few times it happened the past 15 years.







rocky_warrior

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Re: More conference realignment talk
« Reply #599 on: October 23, 2021, 05:08:55 PM »
Holy words. TL;DR did someone say something not 100% complimentary towards a St. Louis institution?
“Normal is an illusion. What's normal for the spider is chaos for the fly.”  -Morticia Addams

 

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