Another Black man killed by cops ... this time by accident?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

That's exacly what I thought it was, to answer TSmiths second paragraph

My apologies for misunderstanding. I thought it was meant to address his first paragraph

[CountryRoads]

I've heard pissed off police chiefs all over the country.  Criminals are getting out too easily and committing the same heinous acts. 

Yes, here's two examples why from this week:

1. A woman was arrested twice last year at riots in Portland and extremely progressive DA Mike Schmidt dropped charges both times. Last week the same suspect randomly attacked a citizen and stabbed her with a knife.

https://www.kptv.com/news/portland-police-old-town-hotel-guest-stabbed-in-random-attack/article_0f6f072a-efdc-11eb-a178-df707bdcb8b0.html

2. An absolutely brutal attack (warning graphic video) in broad daylight just a few days ago in Seattle where a man was robbed and beaten unconscious. There's so many of these types of videos and robberies recently (I'm sure Target adjusted their hours in San Francisco for no reason). The police were also partially defunded in Seattle.

https://mynorthwest.com/3075146/rantz-22-year-old-still-spitting-up-blood-after-brutal-seattle-attack/

[Pakuni]

Yes, here's two examples why from this week:

1. A woman was arrested twice last year at riots in Portland and extremely progressive DA Mike Schmidt dropped charges both times. Last week the same suspect randomly attacked a citizen and stabbed her with a knife.

https://www.kptv.com/news/portland-police-old-town-hotel-guest-stabbed-in-random-attack/article_0f6f072a-efdc-11eb-a178-df707bdcb8b0.html

Don't know if you're being intentionally misleading or not, but the assailant in this case was not arrested last year during riots. She was arrested twice in February, both on disorderly conduct-type allegations unrelated to any kind of riots. The first was dismissed when the victim refused to cooperate with prosecutors. The second was dismissed by a judge, over objection, for lack of evidence.
In neither case was it the result of a decision by a prosecutor, "extremely progressive" or otherwise.

https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2021/07/out-of-town-visitor-chased-stabbed-in-portlands-old-town-neighborhood.html

2. An absolutely brutal attack (warning graphic video) in broad daylight just a few days ago in Seattle where a man was robbed and beaten unconscious. There's so many of these types of videos and robberies recently (I'm sure Target adjusted their hours in San Francisco for no reason). The police were also partially defunded in Seattle.

https://mynorthwest.com/3075146/rantz-22-year-old-still-spitting-up-blood-after-brutal-seattle-attack/

Once again, you're misleading people.
The "defunding" of the Seattle police budget was the result of two things:
1) Moving several functions - parking enforcement, victim services and 911 dispatch -  out of the police department and instead place the under civilian control.
2) Eliminating already vacant positions.
And, in fact, the budget approved by the city council included funding to hire 100 additional police officers. They're not eliminating cops. They're adding cops.

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/seattle-city-council-adopts-2021-budget-after-months-of-political-turbulence-mayor-will-sign/

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/25/us/seattle-police-budget-cut/index.html

[tower912]

Facts vs agenda

[forgetful]

You do realize that 40 mill legal guns were bought in 2020 alone?  And something like 40% were from 1st time owners? 

How do you determine a first time owner? First time having to go through a background check? Most southern gun owners I know have never bought a gun in a store, and never have gone through a background check.

Some of them own dozens of guns. They just buy them from people on the secondary market which is super unregulated in these states. That is the problem. Anyone can get a gun, because a lot of people just sell them to random people because they need cash to make it to the next payday.

That is why many/most of the gun crimes are committed by people using guns that were "originally" purchased legally. They were then sold to people who committed crimes on the secondary market.

In many of these instances, those guns are now considered "illegal" guns, because the person was not allowed to possess a weapon. The rational solution, police the secondary market, and hold people responsible for selling guns on the secondary market to convicted felons. Problem, the NRA and conservatives refuse even this simplest of measure most of the time.

[rocket surgeon]

2 replies to your inane posts and I'm a stalker?  Yet you'll argue about the color of sh!t with a cow for 3 pages?

I suppose this thread just magically happened to re-emerge the day after a cop was shot in face, yet your posts have nothing to do with that, but rather blame the guns. 

  i'm not feeling so fuzzy and warm about pak's little cartoon-tinge of racism in there?  i dunno, i'll have to leave that to the "experts"

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Don't know if you're being intentionally misleading or not, but the assailant in this case was not arrested last year during riots. She was arrested twice in February, both on disorderly conduct-type allegations unrelated to any kind of riots. The first was dismissed when the victim refused to cooperate with prosecutors. The second was dismissed by a judge, over objection, for lack of evidence.
In neither case was it the result of a decision by a prosecutor, "extremely progressive" or otherwise.

https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2021/07/out-of-town-visitor-chased-stabbed-in-portlands-old-town-neighborhood.html

Once again, you're misleading people.
The "defunding" of the Seattle police budget was the result of two things:
1) Moving several functions - parking enforcement, victim services and 911 dispatch -  out of the police department and instead place the under civilian control.
2) Eliminating already vacant positions.
And, in fact, the budget approved by the city council included funding to hire 100 additional police officers. They're not eliminating cops. They're adding cops.

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/seattle-city-council-adopts-2021-budget-after-months-of-political-turbulence-mayor-will-sign/

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/25/us/seattle-police-budget-cut/index.html

Oops.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

How do you determine a first time owner? First time having to go through a background check? Most southern gun owners I know have never bought a gun in a store, and never have gone through a background check.

Some of them own dozens of guns. They just buy them from people on the secondary market which is super unregulated in these states. That is the problem. Anyone can get a gun, because a lot of people just sell them to random people because they need cash to make it to the next payday.

That is why many/most of the gun crimes are committed by people using guns that were "originally" purchased legally. They were then sold to people who committed crimes on the secondary market.

In many of these instances, those guns are now considered "illegal" guns, because the person was not allowed to possess a weapon. The rational solution, police the secondary market, and hold people responsible for selling guns on the secondary market to convicted felons. Problem, the NRA and conservatives refuse even this simplest of measure most of the time.

How many "southern gun owners" do you actally know?    

[MuggsyB]

How do you determine a first time owner? First time having to go through a background check? Most southern gun owners I know have never bought a gun in a store, and never have gone through a background check.

Some of them own dozens of guns. They just buy them from people on the secondary market which is super unregulated in these states. That is the problem. Anyone can get a gun, because a lot of people just sell them to random people because they need cash to make it to the next payday.

That is why many/most of the gun crimes are committed by people using guns that were "originally" purchased legally. They were then sold to people who committed crimes on the secondary market.

In many of these instances, those guns are now considered "illegal" guns, because the person was not allowed to possess a weapon. The rational solution, police the secondary market, and hold people responsible for selling guns on the secondary market to convicted felons. Problem, the NRA and conservatives refuse even this simplest of measure most of the time.

Whatever the case may be gun sales were up 60% in 2020.  You can speculate as to the reasons why.  I would imagine the greatest number of gun deaths are by suicide.  There's no getting around the basic fact that more guns bought means more deaths and the mental health component should be taken very seriously.  It seems to me it's far too easy for mentally ill people to obtain these weapons.

If it was up to me we'd have a society with no guns and Bears, Buffaloes, or Lions would take out psychopaths who hunt or assheads that kill innocent people.  When a person takes a selfie at Yellowstone with a Buffalo or Bear I root for them to get trampled or clawed to death but I digress.  I fully admit it needs to be more difficult to obtain a gun but we have a gun culture and the importance of the 2nd Amendment.  I'm just looking for rational solutions but haven't heard much to this point.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Whatever the case may be gun sales were up 60% in 2020.  You can speculate as to the reasons why.  I would imagine the greatest number of gun deaths are by suicide.  There's no getting around the basic fact that more guns bought means more deaths and the mental health component should be taken very seriously.  It seems to me it's far too easy for mentally ill people to obtain these weapons.

I agree. Why have attempts to pass stricter laws in this regard failed?

If it was up to me we'd have a society with no guns and Bears, Buffaloes, or Lions would take out psychopaths who hunt or assheads that kill innocent people.  When a person takes a selfie at Yellowstone with a Buffalo or Bear I root for them to get trampled or clawed to death but I digress.  I fully admit it needs to be more difficult to obtain a gun but we have a gun culture and the importance of the 2nd Amendment.  I'm just looking for rational solutions but haven't heard much to this point.

There have been proposals offered in this thread. Are those not rational? How about the bill the House passed in March that requires background checks on all purchases and most transfers (eliminating the gun show and private sale loopholes), are those not rational? Eliminating high capacity magazines? Increasing the age to purchase from 18 to 21? Requiring annual registration fees (just like your car) and proof of ownership? Trigger locks? Longer waiting periods? Restrictions on assault-style weapons?

Are none of those rational?

And yet once more, who is opposing every single measure, and who is benefiting financially and politically from it?

[MuggsyB]

I agree. Why have attempts to pass stricter laws in this regard failed?
There have been proposals offered in this thread. Are those not rational? How about the bill the House passed in March that requires background checks on all purchases and most transfers (eliminating the gun show and private sale loopholes), are those not rational? Eliminating high capacity magazines? Increasing the age to purchase from 18 to 21? Requiring annual registration fees (just like your car) and proof of ownership? Trigger locks? Longer waiting periods? Restrictions on assault-style weapons?

Are none of those rational?

And yet once more, who is opposing every single measure, and who is benefiting financially and politically from it?

Illinois and Maryland in particular have very strict gun laws and people are getting slaughtered.  I have no problem with increased background checks.  I think we need to deal with these gangs and the drug businesses.  Little kids should not be living in fear, it's beyond awful. 

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Illinois and Maryland in particular have very strict gun laws and people are getting slaughtered.  I have no problem with increased background checks.  I think we need to deal with these gangs and the drug businesses.  Little kids should not be living in fear, it's beyond awful.

Cool. So we agree, at the very least, that there should be additional laws that help keep firearms out of the hands of the mentally ill and that expand background checks. We also appear to agree that we should try to keep guns out of the hands of gangs and drug dealers.

So which party is blocking such laws from being enacted?

[Billy Hoyle]

Aren't you a lawyer? Shouldn't you be able to recognize a logical argument vs emotional? I mean we get it you lump all of BLM and Antifa together because your wife went through a horrific situation. But have some pride in the arguments that you make for goodness sake and take a step back to be able to think "is what I'm saying logical"

One protests and one riots. I separated those actions. Neither happened here. It's like the tragic death of this individual wasn't worth their energy.

And neither BLM nor Antifa had anything to do with my wife's attack. Rather, one spent months ravaging my city with violence and destruction to which it hasn't (and may never) recover, and the other sat back and subtly nodded while they did it.

[jesmu84]

https://www.wthr.com/article/news/local/indiana-man-accused-of-buying-gun-used-in-fatal-shooting-of-chicago-police-officer/531-e1f31986-b354-41f1-b773-82c0acd4e169

Didn't someone earlier mention neighbor state purchases?

[CountryRoads]

Major news sources and social media (Google, Twitter, etc) are aggressively suppressing information about the suspects but here is some information about the cop killers:

https://thepostmillennial.com/breaking-two-brothers-charged-in-fatal-shooting-of-chicago-cop-ella-french

[Pakuni]

Major news sources and social media (Google, Twitter, etc) are aggressively suppressing information about the suspects but here is some information about the cop killers:

https://thepostmillennial.com/breaking-two-brothers-charged-in-fatal-shooting-of-chicago-cop-ella-french

Your link cites CBS 2 in Chicago as its source.
The Chicago Tribune posted the story at 6:56 pm.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/criminal-justice/ct-chicago-police-officer-shooting-charges-20210809-re3hfhimmrehvavustzr2ofyd4-story.html

A Google search provided numerous links to stories about the arrest and suspects..

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Major news sources and social media (Google, Twitter, etc) are aggressively suppressing information about the suspects but here is some information about the cop killers:

https://thepostmillennial.com/breaking-two-brothers-charged-in-fatal-shooting-of-chicago-cop-ella-french

Maybe you want to go back and apologize for your previous post full of false information before posting another one?

[forgetful]

How many "southern gun owners" do you actally know?    

Let's just go with a lot, bordering on a crap-ton.

[Hards Alumni]

  i'm not feeling so fuzzy and warm about pak's little cartoon-tinge of racism in there?  i dunno, i'll have to leave that to the "experts"

It's a long standing internet meme. That you see racism in it probably says a lot about your inability to understand what is and what isn't racism.

[jficke13]

Ah noted propagandists and purveyors of selectively edited materials designed to foment right wing anger, The Post Millennial. Forgive me if I save myself the time and just make up some angry race-based lies to tell myself, and skip that click.

[lawdog77]

My apologies for misunderstanding. I thought it was meant to address his first paragraph

No worries. I am not always the most clear when posting.

As to his first paragraph about ineffective laws, jesmu posted the news article about charges for the Indiana POS.

Danzy, 29, of Hammond, is charged with conspiracy to violate federal firearm laws, including knowingly transferring and giving a firearm to an out-of-state resident, knowingly making a false written statement to acquire a firearm, and knowingly disposing of a firearm to a convicted felon. He made his first court appearance Monday.

Those all seem to be ineffective, as the horse was already out of the barn, so to speak. What can we do to tighten this up?

[jesmu84]

No worries. I am not always the most clear when posting.

As to his first paragraph about ineffective laws, jesmu posted the news article about charges for the Indiana POS.

Danzy, 29, of Hammond, is charged with conspiracy to violate federal firearm laws, including knowingly transferring and giving a firearm to an out-of-state resident, knowingly making a false written statement to acquire a firearm, and knowingly disposing of a firearm to a convicted felon. He made his first court appearance Monday.

Those all seem to be ineffective, as the horse was already out of the barn, so to speak. What can we do to tighten this up?

Increase gun control in the state of Indiana

[lawdog77]

Increase gun control in the state of Indiana

In what capacity? The article doesn't really mention it, but it seems him buying the gun wasn't the issue, it was him breaking federal laws by the straw purchase. Would a better background check have stopped this? A longer wait to make a purchase?

[jesmu84]

In what capacity? The article doesn't really mention it, but it seems him buying the gun wasn't the issue, it was him breaking federal laws by the straw purchase. Would a better background check have stopped this? A longer wait to make a purchase?

I would say institute any number of the previously mentioned sensible gun control legislation on a national/federal level.

[The Sultan]

In what capacity? The article doesn't really mention it, but it seems him buying the gun wasn't the issue, it was him breaking federal laws by the straw purchase. Would a better background check have stopped this? A longer wait to make a purchase?

Some of them may work.  Some of them may not.  But continuing to shrug our collective shoulders and say "what can you do?" isn't a solution.