NFL Thread 2019-2020

[The Sultan]

I don't know. I saw some pretty bad body language from Aaron Rodgers last week. I guess that confirms that he's a poor competitor.

I guess you missed the part where I said "Now everyone has that to some extent..."

And I think Rodgers track record speaks for itself.

[The Sultan]

Most intense competitors don't show up to the stadium looking like one of the golden girls either.

Irrelevant. 

[MU82]

I guess you missed the part where I said "Now everyone has that to some extent..."

And I think Rodgers track record speaks for itself.

I also think Rodgers' track record speaks for itself. He is a great QB and a first-ballot HoFer. He gets pissed and frustrated sometimes. So do many others. Doesn't mean they don't care.

Cam Newton's track record his first 7 years in the league was pretty good, too. Included in that was a 5-year stretch that included 4 playoff appearances, 3 division titles, a Super Bowl, an MVP and some outstanding stats -- all while growing from an immature kid to a respected team leader who does amazing charity work in Charlotte.

Despite injury, he played very well the first half of last season. Then his body gave up on him. He has not played well this season, and I'm pretty sure he's more injured than the Panthers are letting on publicly. His running ability is what made him really special, but he has taken a lot of punishment during his career and he no longer seems to have the explosiveness to be the athlete he once was.

Maybe some of that will be seen as excuses. OK. But they also are facts.

Interwebs psychologists looking at Newton's body language and determining he doesn't care despite his long history as a highly competitive, winning QB? Those aren't facts.

[JWags85]

Also for 82, I havent paid enough attention, but has Cam lost weight?  I don't know if its maybe his QB jacket being different, but he seems slimmer than he has in recent years.  He's still a big dude, but just seems leaner

[MU82]

Also for 82, I havent paid enough attention, but has Cam lost weight?  I don't know if its maybe his QB jacket being different, but he seems slimmer than he has in recent years.  He's still a big dude, but just seems leaner

Yep. He became a vegan. Maybe that's part of his effen problem!

[The Sultan]

I also think Rodgers' track record speaks for itself. He is a great QB and a first-ballot HoFer. He gets pissed and frustrated sometimes. So do many others. Doesn't mean they don't care.

Cam Newton's track record his first 7 years in the league was pretty good, too. Included in that was a 5-year stretch that included 4 playoff appearances, 3 division titles, a Super Bowl, an MVP and some outstanding stats -- all while growing from an immature kid to a respected team leader who does amazing charity work in Charlotte.

Despite injury, he played very well the first half of last season. Then his body gave up on him. He has not played well this season, and I'm pretty sure he's more injured than the Panthers are letting on publicly. His running ability is what made him really special, but he has taken a lot of punishment during his career and he no longer seems to have the explosiveness to be the athlete he once was.

Maybe some of that will be seen as excuses. OK. But they also are facts.

Interwebs psychologists looking at Newton's body language and determining he doesn't care despite his long history as a highly competitive, winning QB? Those aren't facts.

Cool.

I still have never gotten the impression that he was an "intense competitor."

[MU82]

Cool.

I still have never gotten the impression that he was an "intense competitor."

You're right. He's never given a damn.

[Pakuni]

Cool.

I still have never gotten the impression that he was an "intense competitor."

No snark intended ... but does someone even make it to the NFL, much less become league MVP, without being an intense competitor? Being good at football is really hard. Being good at quarterback is even harder. I struggle to imagine how someone attains Cam's level of success, not to mention putting up with the physical and mental toll of the game, without being a competitor.

I do understand that Cam gives off a lackadaisical vibe, and "business decision" will forever haunt him, but I'll never buy the notion that a good football player doesn't care. The game is such that a person who doesn't work hard and who doesn't care will not succeed, regardless of physical talents (see: Russell, Jamarcus).

[The Sultan]

You're right. He's never given a damn.

Never said that.  Don't be disengenuous. 

[The Sultan]

No snark intended ... but does someone even make it to the NFL, much less become league MVP, without being an intense competitor? Being good at football is really hard. Being good at quarterback is even harder. I struggle to imagine how someone attains Cam's level of success, not to mention putting up with the physical and mental toll of the game, without being a competitor.

I do understand that Cam gives off a lackadaisical vibe, and "business decision" will forever haunt him, but I'll never buy the notion that a good football player doesn't care. The game is such that a person who doesn't work hard and who doesn't care will not succeed, regardless of physical talents (see: Russell, Jamarcus).

It's all in the context of being an NFL player.

[MU82]

No snark intended ... but does someone even make it to the NFL, much less become league MVP, without being an intense competitor? Being good at football is really hard. Being good at quarterback is even harder. I struggle to imagine how someone attains Cam's level of success, not to mention putting up with the physical and mental toll of the game, without being a competitor.

I do understand that Cam gives off a lackadaisical vibe, and "business decision" will forever haunt him, but I'll never buy the notion that a good football player doesn't care. The game is such that a person who doesn't work hard and who doesn't care will not succeed, regardless of physical talents (see: Russell, Jamarcus).

Of course this is the case, Pakuni.

But it's much easier to look at somebody for 5 seconds and decide that he can't possibly be an intense competitor.

I mean, I also heard he refused to do a slap of five!

[The Sultan]

But it's much easier to look at somebody for 5 seconds and decide that he can't possibly be an intense competitor.

It's always really easy for you to refute someone's argument by telling outright lies isn't it.  Sad.

[MU82]

It's always really easy for you to refute someone's argument by telling outright lies isn't it.  Sad.

You claimed he wasn't an intense competitor. Others say his body language somehow proved he was just mailing it in last night. Isn't the burden of proof on the accusers?

It was a really ridiculous claim, and you all are smart enough to know it.

I guess none of y'all has seen him hurtle his body toward the goal line, absorbing massive hits, stretching out to just barely get the football across, putting his health on the line -- something he has done numerous times. Numerous times, he has been spun around in midair before he crash-lands in the end zone. I guess only athletes who aren't intense competitors and who mail it in put their bodies on the line like that.

Yep, Sultan, I'm the sad one because I'm making sarcastic, obviously hyperbole-filled statements about ridiculous claims. Next time, for the uninitiated, I'll use teal. (Actually, I won't.)

[The Sultan]

You claimed he wasn't an intense competitor. Others say his body language somehow proved he was just mailing it in last night. Isn't the burden of proof on the accusers?

It was a really ridiculous claim, and you all are smart enough to know it.

I guess none of y'all has seen him hurtle his body toward the goal line, absorbing massive hits, stretching out to just barely get the football across, putting his health on the line -- something he has done numerous times. Numerous times, he has been spun around in midair before he crash-lands in the end zone. I guess only athletes who aren't intense competitors and who mail it in put their bodies on the line like that.

Yep, Sultan, I'm the sad one because I'm making sarcastic, obviously hyperbole-filled statements about ridiculous claims. Next time, for the uninitiated, I'll use teal. (Actually, I won't.)

I've seen him play plenty of times.  Much more than 5 seconds.  I've seen him do all the things you have seen him do.  I never got the impression that that made him more "intense" than most.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Cool, nads and sultan going at each other.  This is a new pissing match.

[Jockey]

Cam is one of the most intense competitors I've ever seen, and I didn't get the vibe at all that he was mailing it in.


I think Cam is still hurting a little; not nearly as explosive a runner, so they're not even trying him as one. I mean ... 4th and half-yard with the game on the line -- for 8 years that would have been a near-automatic Cam keeper, and he converted darn near 100% of the time.

Mike, I didn't mean to put you on the spot. Like Dish, I noticed a certain demeanor with Cam last night that I hadn't seen before (granted I haven't watched him as much as you have). He just seemed like a different guy.

Also, as someone else posted, he did not seem as physically imposing as in the past. I was just looking for your opinion -which I respect.

It slipped my mind for a minute that we were on Scoop where answering a query will bring multiple attacks.

[MU82]

I've seen him play plenty of times.  Much more than 5 seconds.  I've seen him do all the things you have seen him do.  I never got the impression that that made him more "intense" than most.

And I never gave the impression that he was "more" intense than most. I just said he was an intense competitor, as most great professional athletes are.

You can have the last word on this subject if you'd like.

It slipped my mind for a minute that we were on Scoop where answering a query will bring multiple attacks.

It's all good. I'm not as intense as I used to be.

[Cheeks]

Good thing is that Cam hasn't let it influence his wardrobe on game days....dapper as always

[Dish]

Cam was a more intense competitor. Something mentally and/or physically was off Thursday night, it was glaringly obvious. That doesn't demean his career, but he absolutely had a body language look of get me the hell out of here. If years of physical toll have caught up with him, I certainly understand. The Panthers keep saying he's fine. If that's the true case, his current game statistically proves something is way off.

[MU82]

Lots of talking heads are ripping on Cam -- and deservedly so, he has not been good since midseason last year.

https://www.charlotteobserver.com/sports/nfl/carolina-panthers/article235061547.html?

Above and beyond those in that article, I have heard Steve Young, Troy Aikman, Tony Korheiser, Michael Irvin,Tim Hasselbeck and several others talk about him.

Given what my fellow Scoopers have said, I seriously am surprised that not a single one of them -- some of whom were VERY critical of him, like savagely critical of him -- mentioned that he had bad body language, that he looked like he didn't want to be there, etc.

I guess Scoopers are just more observant than Steve Young and Tim Hasselbeck are.

[The Sultan]

Lots of talking heads are ripping on Cam -- and deservedly so, he has not been good since midseason last year.

https://www.charlotteobserver.com/sports/nfl/carolina-panthers/article235061547.html?

Above and beyond those in that article, I have heard Steve Young, Troy Aikman, Tony Korheiser, Michael Irvin,Tim Hasselbeck and several others talk about him.

Given what my fellow Scoopers have said, I seriously am surprised that not a single one of them -- some of whom were VERY critical of him, like savagely critical of him -- mentioned that he had bad body language, that he looked like he didn't want to be there, etc.

I guess Scoopers are just more observant than Steve Young and Tim Hasselbeck are.

You are the most intense passive aggressive poster on Scoop.

[CreightonWarrior]

Why didn't they review that Allison fumble? I'm pretty sure his knee was down.

[cheebs09]

Why didn't they review that Allison fumble? I'm pretty sure his knee was down.

I think it started coming out once he was hit.

[#UnleashSean]

Why didn't they review that Allison fumble? I'm pretty sure his knee was down.

All turnovers are reviewed. He was not down.

[The Sultan]

Dear God

Thank you for Mitch Trubisky and Kirk Cousins.

Amen.