Recruiting as of 11/15/24

[Silkk the Shaka]

This is correct. James, McNeal and Wesley all had similar rankings.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/recruit_rankings_2005.html

Yep

'Nic #36, 'Rel #57 (ranked by all services, Rivals at 99 by far his lowest rating), WessyWes #61

[Spotcheck Billy]

By this logic shouldn't our recruiting class after the FF have been unreal?

If you choose to look at it negatively then of course this is the take you'll have. Or you can say "after three years of only playing with really young teams we've averaged 20 wins and .500 BE record. We're at a point where we're experienced and poised to make the jump to the next level, we want you to be a part of continuing that"

It could have been worse (see Badgers after back-to-back FF).

The 3 Amigos weren't a bad recruiting class after '03.

[MU82]

I like the way a bunch of old farts are trying to get into the heads of teenagers to figure out why those kids are opting to go elsewhere.

Surprised I haven't seen these potential reasons being discussed:

++ Weather

++ Frozen custard allergies

++ Fear that all Milwaukeeans of German heritage are Nazis

++ Anti-Christian discrimination

++ Won't play in same city as Ryan Braun

++ "Smoke and mirrors"

++ Too many guards as assistant coaches

++ The alumni team failed spectacularly in the TBT Final Four

++ Bailed as soon as they found out MU no longer will play in the beloved Bradley Center

++ Other schools offered sleazier hookers

++ Wojo Force One not as plush as recruits had hoped

++ Angry the rivalry with UWM isn't being renewed

++ Worried about getting injured by a flopping Davison

++ Scoop

++ Ring Out Ahoya = LAME!

++ Too awed by Derrick Wilson's legacy

++ The Upper Peninsula is too cold

[dw3dw3dw3]

Horribly ignorant comment.  Guys in the 101-250 ranking become productive High Major D1 players all the time.  Clearly less of them start from day one, but many are talented enough to become major contributors during their careers.  Recent BE players like Kamarr Baldwin (155), Kyron Cartwright (270), and Donte Divincenzo (120) would have looked mighty fine in MU uniforms these last few years.  Guys like Jerel McNeal,  and many many others would tend to disagree with you, as well.

No crap, yes they can become productive players, even stars, I'm not arguing the exceptions. Unranked kids can be stars and even make it to the NBA is an obvious statement that doesn't need to be said. Basing recruiting on hoping you are catching all the exceptions to the rule would be quite stupid though. There's a reason they are going after the 4 and 5 star kids 1st, because they are fricken good already and developing them in theory should make them even greater. Finding hidden gems and hoping they develop to play down the road is just blind hope from a fan's perspective. I'm hoping it works out and I'm sure it's always the coaches and players plan to have it work out otherwise the coach wouldn't take them and the player wouldn't commit. However, on average, these kids won't work out and MU will try to recruit over them without thinking twice. If MU signs Akanno, I'm 100% on board his development train and hope he finds a role, but I'm pretty sure the entire board would be in favor of signing another PG  immediately in '20 or '21. No '20 or '21 PG recruit is going to worry about Akanno eating up playing time.

[Galway Eagle]

It could have been worse (see Badgers after back-to-back FF).

The 3 Amigos weren't a bad recruiting class after '03.

Right but they weren't the immediate class. By sand knits logic that the nit is what's causing us issues the inverse should be true that the 03 Recruiting class should've been unreal

[GGGG]

No crap, yes they can become productive players, even stars, I'm not arguing the exceptions. Unranked kids can be stars and even make it to the NBA is an obvious statement that doesn't need to be said. Basing recruiting on hoping you are catching all the exceptions to the rule would be quite stupid though. There's a reason they are going after the 4 and 5 star kids 1st, because they are fricken good already and developing them in theory should make them even greater. Finding hidden gems and hoping they develop to play down the road is just blind hope from a fan's perspective. I'm hoping it works out and I'm sure it's always the coaches and players plan to have it work out otherwise the coach wouldn't take them and the player wouldn't commit. However, on average, these kids won't work out and MU will try to recruit over them without thinking twice. If MU signs Akanno, I'm 100% on board his development train and hope he finds a role, but I'm pretty sure the entire board would be in favor of signing another PG  immediately in '20 or '21. No '20 or '21 PG recruit is going to worry about Akanno eating up playing time.

It isn't simply "blind hope."  As I said, Wojo and Co have proven they can unearth and develop talent. 

[GrimmReaper33]

By this logic shouldn't our recruiting class after the FF have been unreal?

If you choose to look at it negatively then of course this is the take you'll have. Or you can say "after three years of only playing with really young teams we've averaged 20 wins and .500 BE record. We're at a point where we're experienced and poised to make the jump to the next level, we want you to be a part of continuing that"

Um, the 3 amigos class was pretty freaking good.

Also, I don't think your sales pitch is all that compelling, which is my point on why it's a harder pitch right now.  I'm sure when Holtman was recruiting DJ Carton to OSU he said "Marquette, huh?  Have they made the tournament under Wojo?  I just remember beating them up pretty good when I was at Butler.. I've won 5 tourney games since he's been there." 

"But Coach, Wojo told me he's averaged a .500 BE record the last 3 years!"

I'm half kidding, but you get the point.  FWIW, I'm really not concerned about it.  Wojo's recruiting is the least of my concerns and he has shown he can play the transfer game if they don't get anyone they like in the '19 class.  Win this year and it will make recruiting easier.

[Galway Eagle]

Um, the 3 amigos class was pretty freaking good.

How are you the second person to respond with this. Do people think the final four happened in 05? Did the Amigos commit following the final four and just redshirt two years?

[GrimmReaper33]

How are you the second person to respond with this. Do people think the final four happened in 05? Did the Amigos commit following the final four and just redshirt two years?

So it wasn't right off the heels of the FF team but you're absolutely kidding yourself if you don't think FF team had some impact on the three amigo's perception of Marquette basketball.  It's the equivalent of the 2020 recruiting class if we had just went to the FF this past season.  You don't think that would help with recruiting for the 2020 class right now?

[Galway Eagle]

So it wasn't right off the heels of the FF team but you're absolutely kidding yourself if you don't think FF team had some impact on the three amigo's perception of Marquette basketball.  It's the equivalent of the 2020 recruiting class if we had just went to the FF this past season.  You don't think that would help with recruiting for the 2020 class right now?

Right but that has zero to do with the reason I brought it up.

Sand knits statement of: NIT=bad recruits right away would mean that FF=great recruits right away. What happened two years later has zero to do with the point unless we're arguing whether the NIT bid this year ruined our chances in 2020.

[Spotcheck Billy]

Right but they weren't the immediate class. By sand knits logic that the nit is what's causing us issues the inverse should be true that the 03 Recruiting class should've been unreal

But weren't they? Wouldn't the immediate class pretty much already have been committed by the '03 FF run?

[BM1090]

But weren't they? Wouldn't the immediate class pretty much already have been committed by the '03 FF run?

Yes. But the following year's class was also bad. We had a 2 year NIT run prior to the Amigos

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Since there seems to be some confusion, here's the recruiting classes around Marquette's Final Four:

April 2003: Final Four
Class of 2003: 4-star Dameon Mason, 3-star Brandon Bell, JUCO Marcus Jackson, 2-star Carlton Christian (Class ranked #29 overall by 247, also all committed prior to Final Four)
Class of 2004: 3-star Ousmane Barro, 3-star Ryan Amoroso, 3-star Mike Kinsella (Class ranked #68 overall by 247)
Class of 2005: 4-star Dominic James, 4-star Jerel McNeal, 4-star Wesley Matthews, 3-star Matt Mortensen, JUCO Jamil Lott (Class ranked #11 overall by 247)

So to address MSK and Bags argument. Marquette's Final Four in 2003 did not seem to greatly benefit the recruiting in the class of 2004. It probably helped two years later with recruiting the class of 2005. Does that mean that the NIT appearance will hurt recruiting for 2019/2020? No idea. I don't think the two are actually related.

I really think it is simpler than we are making it out to be. Recruits want to play. Looking at our roster for next season, only elite level prospects would likely be able to carve out minutes next year. Other successful programs compensate for lack of immediate playing time by pointing out recent postseason success. Marquette does not have that under Wojo. Without playing time or postseason success to offer, Marquette is having a harder time with the 2019 class. If all goes well, Marquette will have both playing time and postseason success to offer to the 2020 class....also to 2019 transfers this coming summer.

[Nukem2]

The Class of 2005 was influenced by MU's imminent entry to the Big East and the entry to the BE was greatly helped by the FF run.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Since there seems to be some confusion, here's the recruiting classes around Marquette's Final Four:

April 2003: Final Four
Class of 2003: 4-star Dameon Mason, 3-star Brandon Bell, JUCO Marcus Jackson, 2-star Carlton Christian (Class ranked #29 overall by 247, also all committed prior to Final Four)
Class of 2004: 3-star Ousmane Barro, 3-star Ryan Amoroso, 3-star Mike Kinsella (Class ranked #68 overall by 247)
Class of 2005: 4-star Dominic James, 4-star Jerel McNeal, 4-star Wesley Matthews, 3-star Matt Mortensen, JUCO Jamil Lott (Class ranked #11 overall by 247)

So to address MSK and Bags argument. Marquette's Final Four in 2003 did not seem to greatly benefit the recruiting in the class of 2004. It probably helped two years later with recruiting the class of 2005. Does that mean that the NIT appearance will hurt recruiting for 2019/2020? No idea. I don't think the two are actually related.

I really think it is simpler than we are making it out to be. Recruits want to play. Looking at our roster for next season, only elite level prospects would likely be able to carve out minutes next year. Other successful programs compensate for lack of immediate playing time by pointing out recent postseason success. Marquette does not have that under Wojo. Without playing time or postseason success to offer, Marquette is having a harder time with the 2019 class. If all goes well, Marquette will have both playing time and postseason success to offer to the 2020 class....also to 2019 transfers this coming summer.

Two huge negatives for MU in 2003, CUSA and Tom Crean.  Apart from dwade n the three amigos i cannot be convinced that he did a whole lot in the recruiting or coaching areas.  Could not hold oneill or Buzz' jocks.  Wont take Wojo much to out do him either.  Iu figured it out.  Hes at Georgia now,  doing the coaching equivalent of Jon bon jovi playing at a casino in the sticks for 800 people.  Gonna say the charleton owes dwade at least $20 million

[Stretchdeltsig]

Playing time matters.  You seem to be reading the comments differently than others are.

Spot on.  We have a full roster now.  There isn't much room or playing time available.  Everyone should relax and get ready for a couple of great years.

[MU82]

Gonna say the charleton owes dwade at least $20 million

Ben Har (baugh)?

From his cold, dead hands ...

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Two huge negatives for MU in 2003, CUSA and Tom Crean.  Apart from dwade n the three amigos i cannot be convinced that he did a whole lot in the recruiting or coaching areas.  Could not hold oneill or Buzz' jocks.  Wont take Wojo much to out do him either.  Iu figured it out.  Hes at Georgia now,  doing the coaching equivalent of Jon bon jovi playing at a casino in the sticks for 800 people.  Gonna say the charleton owes dwade at least $20 million

Well the move to the Big East was announced late in 2003, theoretically could have been used in recruiting for Class of 2004. I'm not going to bother trying to change your mind about TC.

[Herman Cain]

Seems like they want a PG or combo with this scholarship. Interesting there aren't any bigs they have targeted, talent must drop off pretty quick. I don't think either is going to deter top level PG recruits from coming. Bishop is in the 170s on 247 and Akanno doesn't even have a profile.  To expect much out of either, even as upperclassman, would be blind hope more than anything.

The bigger question to me is if we can land a top 5 PG in '20. With McEwen still playing, I think we will end up having to wait till '21 if we
are looking at a top 40 level kid. A kid in the 40-100 (Beekman?) range might be willing to 'learn' for a year behind McEwen, but I just don't think the program has enough juice (yet) to attract a top 40 kid who doesn't see starter level playing time as a freshman.

I'm still holding out hope that our recruiting for 20 will just be the Phenom class of Beekman, Johnson, Sibley, Polk, and Alex!

This would be a home run.

[Jay Bee]

I like the way a bunch of old farts are trying to get into the heads of teenagers to figure out why those kids are opting to go elsewhere.

Surprised I haven't seen these potential reasons being discussed:

1) mistreatment of McAdams

So many kids want big minutes early. We're stocked full of talent this year and next

[barfolomew]

++ The Upper Peninsula is too cold

The University of Marquette:
Come for the fall foliage, stay for the basketball!

[mubb3434]

2022 From Milwaukee, Jeffrey Brazziel was on campus for an unofficial today. Does anyone know anything about him?

[MuMark]

I know he is one of the best players in the Wisconsin 2022 class and we are monitoring his progress enough that we hosted him on campus.

[bilsu]

Two huge negatives for MU in 2003, CUSA and Tom Crean.  Apart from dwade n the three amigos i cannot be convinced that he did a whole lot in the recruiting or coaching areas.  Could not hold oneill or Buzz' jocks.  Wont take Wojo much to out do him either.  Iu figured it out.  Hes at Georgia now,  doing the coaching equivalent of Jon bon jovi playing at a casino in the sticks for 800 people.  Gonna say the charleton owes dwade at least $20 million

I think what hurts Wojo in recruiting is his personality. He comes across as a nice guy and potential recruits generally like him. However, he is less exciting than many other coaches personality wise. It pays to be a character like Al McGuire or Buzz. I compare Wojo personality wise to Hank Raymonds. A solid person, who lacked the charisma needed to win over the top recruits when the blue bloods show up.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

I think what hurts Wojo in recruiting is his personality. He comes across as a nice guy and potential recruits generally like him. However, he is less exciting than many other coaches personality wise. It pays to be a character like Al McGuire or Buzz. I compare Wojo personality wise to Hank Raymonds. A solid person, who lacked the charisma needed to win over the top recruits when the blue bloods show up.

When did Buzz ever outrecruit a blue blood? If I remember right, his highest ever recruit was Vander and it was always going to be Marquette or Wisconsin. Yes he got the solid 3 and 4 stars, but so has Wojo with Markus, Sam, Joey, Cain, Bailey etc.