Recruiting as of 3/15/24

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Bishop listed as combo on every website i have seen

[dw3dw3dw3]

Seems like they want a PG or combo with this scholarship. Interesting there aren't any bigs they have targeted, talent must drop off pretty quick. I don't think either is going to deter top level PG recruits from coming. Bishop is in the 170s on 247 and Akanno doesn't even have a profile.  To expect much out of either, even as upperclassman, would be blind hope more than anything.

The bigger question to me is if we can land a top 5 PG in '20. With McEwen still playing, I think we will end up having to wait till '21 if we
are looking at a top 40 level kid. A kid in the 40-100 (Beekman?) range might be willing to 'learn' for a year behind McEwen, but I just don't think the program has enough juice (yet) to attract a top 40 kid who doesn't see starter level playing time as a freshman.

I'm still holding out hope that our recruiting for 20 will just be the Phenom class of Beekman, Johnson, Sibley, Polk, and Alex!

[Its DJOver]

Seems like they want a PG or combo with this scholarship. Interesting there aren't any bigs they have targeted, talent must drop off pretty quick. I don't think either is going to deter top level PG recruits from coming. Bishop is in the 170s on 247 and Akanno doesn't even have a profile.  To expect much out of either, even as upperclassman, would be blind hope more than anything.

The bigger question to me is if we can land a top 5 PG in '20. With McEwen still playing, I think we will end up having to wait till '21 if we
are looking at a top 40 level kid. A kid in the 40-100 (Beekman?) range might be willing to 'learn' for a year behind McEwen, but I just don't think the program has enough juice (yet) to attract a top 40 kid who doesn't see starter level playing time as a freshman.

I'm still holding out hope that our recruiting for 20 will just be the Phenom class of Beekman, Johnson, Sibley, Polk, and Alex!

Think you are reading way too much into rankings.  We got quite a bit out of the 203rd ranked player in 2010.  Davante had a significantly better career than a lot of PF ranked higher than him.

The top 25-30 kids are generally pretty accurate, but I don't think there is too much separating numbers 75-200.  Not always the case, but 247 does get it wrong occasionally.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

What's that, like 7-8 guys we've been pretty heavily involved with and whiffed on? Pretty obvious we're not going to land anything better than a project in '19. Rather than go that route, save one scholarship, for '20 and put the other scholarship toward a transfer.

Assuming we are as good as we think we are going to be this season (medium assumption) and assuming that everyone comes back next season who is supposed to come back (bigger assumption) than whatever freshman we were going to pick up in the 2019 class was not likely to play a lot of minute unless they were at the level of Carton, Wilson, Williamson, or Mannion. I'm okay bringing in a "project" for the 2019 class. You need four year guys who don't play big minutes the first few years but become key players as upperclassmen.

I do agree that a traditional transfer makes a lot of sense for this class. Get a proven player to sit out while we are loaded and have them ready to contribute when Sam/M2N/Anim/Ed all graduate.

[dw3dw3dw3]

Point is they won't have even played yet when we are trying to get a '20 PG commit.  No top '20 PG is going to look at the roster and get scared off by someone who wasn't ranked in the top 150.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

C'mon Sultan, get with the program. When we don't make the final 10, or 8, or 6 or 5 of guys we're recruiting (every guy we've been after so far for 2019) that's actually GOOD news. I know this because the Scoop intelligentsia tells me so. Maybe it becomes bad news in November or when we get to the #300 guy without any interest, but for now - so far, so good.

C'mon Lenny, don't be disingenuous. We made the final lists of our top targets (Carton, Mannion, Wilson) and missed on a whole bunch of others. All people are pointing out is that from a resources perspective, it is better to be out early so you can reallocate those resources elsewhere. Of course if you never get on the final lists that could be symptomatic of a problem with your coach's ability to recruit. Personally, I'm not worried about our staff's recruiting ability yet.

This seems like a year where we put all our eggs in our big targets like Carton and Wilson and now that we missed on them are struggling to catch up with other prospects who have had other high majors on them for months or even years. Fortunately, this is a year where we can afford to do that because we don't need a freshman to come in and play big minutes in 19-20. It does turn up the pressure for the 2020 class however.

Also, and I'm just spitballing here, but I wonder if the fact that Coach Nelson and Johnson were finalists for head coaching jobs have anything to do with it. Stan and Brett do a majority of the relationship building with recruits and Wojo is usually brought in as the closer. I wonder if its harder to sell recruits on Marquette when they know the two lead recruiters are ready to jump to head coaching positions. Please don't read this as I'm blaming the assistants because they are both fantastic and should absolutely be looking for head coaching jobs, but I do wonder if it makes an impact.

[Its DJOver]

Point is they won't have even played yet when we are trying to get a '20 PG commit.  No top '20 PG is going to look at the roster and get scared off by someone who wasn't ranked in the top 150.

And I think that's a valid point, but this

Bishop is in the 170s on 247 and Akanno doesn't even have a profile.  To expect much out of either, even as upperclassman, would be blind hope more than anything.

Is misguided at best.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Seems like they want a PG or combo with this scholarship. Interesting there aren't any bigs they have targeted, talent must drop off pretty quick. I don't think either is going to deter top level PG recruits from coming. Bishop is in the 170s on 247 and Akanno doesn't even have a profile.  To expect much out of either, even as upperclassman, would be blind hope more than anything.

Horribly ignorant comment.  Guys in the 101-250 ranking become productive High Major D1 players all the time.  Clearly less of them start from day one, but many are talented enough to become major contributors during their careers.  Recent BE players like Kamarr Baldwin (155), Kyron Cartwright (270), and Donte Divincenzo (120) would have looked mighty fine in MU uniforms these last few years.  Guys like Jerel McNeal,  and many many others would tend to disagree with you, as well.

[GGGG]

Seems like they want a PG or combo with this scholarship. Interesting there aren't any bigs they have targeted, talent must drop off pretty quick. I don't think either is going to deter top level PG recruits from coming. Bishop is in the 170s on 247 and Akanno doesn't even have a profile.  To expect much out of either, even as upperclassman, would be blind hope more than anything.

First, I trust Wojo & Co's ability to identify talent more than I do 247's.  They have a track record for identifying talent that contributes solidly despite their rankings.  It may take time (Anim) and they may leave (Cheatham, Carter) but I don't think they're recruited any duds outside of the Froling transfer.

Second, there are countless exceptions to your assertion that only blind hope would lead us to believe that he could have an impact as an upper-classman.  Andrew Rowsey was not ranked by any scouting service coming out of high school.  So was Joseph Chartouny and Kobe McEwen.  Greg Elliott was ranked #224 in the country by 247. 

[Boone]

Well, Mr. Sand-Knit, then you haven't looked at the verbal commits site, where J. Bishop is listed as a PG. Besides, at just 6'2", his future is likely at PG. 

[Goose]

At the moment, recruiting is not looking too good.

[milwaukee ex-pat]

"So was Joseph Chartouny and Kobe McEwen."  I believe I read Kobe was the highest ever ranked recruit for Utah State when he signed and was as high as top 50 in at least one service.

[Its DJOver]

"So was Joseph Chartouny and Kobe McEwen."  I believe I read Kobe was the highest ever ranked recruit for Utah State when he signed and was as high as top 50 in at least one service.

I believe that the conversation was only referencing 247, who had Koby at 175.

https://247sports.com/Player/Koby-McEwen-75484//high-school-129123

[DCHoopster]

At the moment, recruiting is not looking too good.

Grad transfers or coaches getting fired at the end of the year open kids up to re-recruit.  MU really only needs to sign 1 kid, they have a solid 11 kids coming back,
maybe a transfer or grad transfer happens, if so then they need somebody.  Losing Chartonny, have McEven for 2 years.  They still have 7 back in 2 years.  That
year they will need to recruit 3 or 4 kids.  That will give Wojo 2 years of NCAA tournament ball, if that is the case, recruiting gets easier.  New building and kids seeing
MU playing in them will help, it will interesting to see how many Wisconsin kids are at the Wiscy-MU game this year.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

Horribly ignorant comment.  Guys in the 101-250 ranking become productive High Major D1 players all the time.  Clearly less of them start from day one, but many are talented enough to become major contributors during their careers.  Recent BE players like Kamarr Baldwin (155), Kyron Cartwright (270), and Donte Divincenzo (120) would have looked mighty fine in MU uniforms these last few years.  Guys like Jerel McNeal,  and many many others would tend to disagree with you, as well.

McNeal was ranked top 60-ish. The rest of your points are good.

Jimmy Butler was off the recruiting radar when he graduated HS.  Not saying Akanno is a future NBA all star,  just that their recruitments have some similarities.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Jerel Mcneal was in one top 100 ranking, 99 by rivals.  Had two major offers Dayton and Marquette.  No where near 60s.

[milwaukee ex-pat]

Hmm mebbe I was thinking of his pg ranking...  this article says sort of blandly he was top 100 for ESPN but being the highest ever recruit at USU maybe not such a high bar to clear...
https://www.hjnews.com/logan_hj/guard-commits-to-aggie-men-s-basketball/article_8d5a6ea1-05f3-57f5-8122-a82e771f8972.html

McEwen is listed as a ESPN Top 100 Basketball Recruit. At the Adidas Nations Tournament this past summer, he finished third in scoring with 21 points per game and led the tourney in steals, averaging three per game. Last season as a junior, McEwen averaged 20 points, 5.0 rebounds and 3.0 assists per game.

He had offers from Wake Forest, Baylor, Miami, Ole Miss, Texas Tech, Georgia Tech and Xavier. In fact, he still had trips planned to Texas Tech and Georgia Tech, but canceled them after visiting USU.

[Its DJOver]

Hmm mebbe I was thinking of his pg ranking...  this article says sort of blandly he was top 100 for ESPN but being the highest ever recruit at USU maybe not such a high bar to clear...
https://www.hjnews.com/logan_hj/guard-commits-to-aggie-men-s-basketball/article_8d5a6ea1-05f3-57f5-8122-a82e771f8972.html

McEwen is listed as a ESPN Top 100 Basketball Recruit. At the Adidas Nations Tournament this past summer, he finished third in scoring with 21 points per game and led the tourney in steals, averaging three per game. Last season as a junior, McEwen averaged 20 points, 5.0 rebounds and 3.0 assists per game.

He had offers from Wake Forest, Baylor, Miami, Ole Miss, Texas Tech, Georgia Tech and Xavier. In fact, he still had trips planned to Texas Tech and Georgia Tech, but canceled them after visiting USU.

This is key.  Looking at which programs have offered a player is often far more informing than any ranking.  In an attempt to bring this back to current prospects, Bishop has offers from quite a few other high majors including three other Beast teams in X, StJ, and Gtown.  This tells me that the 174 that 247 lists him as is likely a little low.  Akanno doesn't have as many high major offers, but as pointed out, because of his late birthday he is likely undervalued as well.  Given the stage of the recruiting cycle and the current roster, I think either of these kids would be decent pickups, even if they don't move the needle very much until they are upperclassmen.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Well, Mr. Sand-Knit, then you haven't looked at the verbal commits site, where J. Bishop is listed as a PG. Besides, at just 6'2", his future is likely at PG.

Well VC doesn't have a slot for combo guard. They divide everyone into PG/SG/SF/PF/C. They also tend to sort players more by size than by skillset. For example, Theo John is definitely a C, but VC lists him as a PF because he's only 6'9.

A combo guard is a player that can play either the PG or the SG position. Typically, though not always, combo guards are SGs that can also play PG rather than the other way around. James Bishop is most definitely a combo guard and his skillset is more aligned with that of a SG than a PG despite his height.

When comparing and contrasting J Bishop and D Akanno I think the best way to look at it is that one is an offensive combo guard and the other is a defensive combo guard. Bishop's skillset will remind you of Markus Howard and Akanno's will remind you more of Greg Elliott.

[MU82]

We're doomed!

willie is right, Wojo can't recruit. Should have been fired 3 years ago after his first team didn't win the NCAA title.

Doomed! Doomed, I say!

[GrimmReaper33]

It's not surprising that this recruiting cycle has been a little harder for Wojo and staff.  For the first time, they can't honestly promise a lot of early playing time for guys.  When a new coach first comes in, recruiting is almost easier in a sense because there is a little buzz around the new guy- the coach can sell early playing time and a vision of what he says he's going to accomplish.

Now, when you can't necessarily promise early playing time to top 100 type recruits, you try to sell your accomplishments as a coach (tournament runs, appearances, etc.) and getting guys to the league.  As a head coach, Wojo doesn't really have the postseason success to point to, or a list of guys who played for him and got drafted- yet. 

Just another reason this season is so important for Wojo and MU.  It's put up or shut up time.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

Jerel Mcneal was in one top 100 ranking, 99 by rivals.  Had two major offers Dayton and Marquette.  No where near 60s.

McNeal RSCI Top 100 Composite (using 5 rankings total)

August 2004
86 (4 top 100 lists)
https://sites.google.com/site/rscihoops/home/2005-summer

October 2004
55 (4 top 100 lists)
https://sites.google.com/site/rscihoops/home/2005-fall

June 2005
57 (5 top 100 lists)
https://sites.google.com/site/rscihoops/home/2005-final

Edit: Links added

[Lennys Tap]

McNeal was ranked top 60-ish. The rest of your points are good.

This is correct. James, McNeal and Wesley all had similar rankings.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

It's not surprising that this recruiting cycle has been a little harder for Wojo and staff.  For the first time, they can't honestly promise a lot of early playing time for guys.  When a new coach first comes in, recruiting is almost easier in a sense because there is a little buzz around the new guy- the coach can sell early playing time and a vision of what he says he's going to accomplish.

Now, when you can't necessarily promise early playing time to top 100 type recruits, you try to sell your accomplishments as a coach (tournament runs, appearances, etc.) and getting guys to the league.  As a head coach, Wojo doesn't really have the postseason success to point to, or a list of guys who played for him and got drafted- yet. 

Just another reason this season is so important for Wojo and MU.  It's put up or shut up time.

After 4 years at a program and you are coming off a NIT season its a little harder to sell kids on your vision, as well.  All the top programs have full rosters yet continue to get good players.  The top players want to play for a winner.  Wojo’s story has to sound a little hollow at this point.  I see this as the biggest factor.  Go to the tourney this year and recruiting opens back up regardless of roster make up. 

[Galway Eagle]

After 4 years at a program and you are coming off a NIT season its a little harder to sell kids on your vision, as well.  All the top programs have full rosters yet continue to get good players.  The top players want to play for a winner.  Wojo’s story has to sound a little hollow at this point.  I see this as the biggest factor.  Go to the tourney this year and recruiting opens back up regardless of roster make up.

By this logic shouldn't our recruiting class after the FF have been unreal?

If you choose to look at it negatively then of course this is the take you'll have. Or you can say "after three years of only playing with really young teams we've averaged 20 wins and .500 BE record. We're at a point where we're experienced and poised to make the jump to the next level, we want you to be a part of continuing that"