Futbol Talk

[JWags85]

Might not be fair to compare MASL to MLS, but I also don't think it's fair to look at Cincinnati's one year of data, and say it'd be a success.  It was the new ticket in town, teams always do well in their first year.  They were also the worst team in the league by a considerable margin (although this was expected), if they continue to be terrible, that attendance won't remain high for long.  Minnesota's attendance dropped from '18 to '19, and both Columbus and Chicago have been bottom 5 in attendance for a while now.  Comparing Milwaukee to cities that are actually getting a team (Sacramento, Austin etc.) and the overall level of interest in the sport isn't even close.

I was referring to FC Cincinnati’s entire history. Part of the reason they got an expansion club there was the success of their attendance as a USL squad. They’d routinely draw 20K+ as a “minor league” team. So I’d disagree their attendance will fall off.  This wasn’t a curiosity, new car smell attendance boost. Their numbers compared fairly closely with their USL days, only like a 5% increase.  Columbus attendance ebb and flow has been a curiosity, but Chicago isn’t fair. That’s a rabid soccer market, but the attendance is entirely affected by stadium location. With the Fire returning to the city next year, I think it’s a different story.

Not sure why the interest is “not even close”...based on? Austin, sure, Sacramento is only an expansion player cause they have an established USL team, not exactly a large, vibrant market. Milwaukee is no less a viable candidate than St Louis. Nashville is literally only getting a team because multiple billionaire families are spearheading it.  If Milwaukee had a USL team, it would be in the discussion easily if the city had abided. And look at Madison to see the success of upstart soccer in Wisconsin.

[brewcity77]

Peter Wilt was instrumental in getting the Madson USL club up and running this past year.  The League One side outdrew many USL Championship level teams.

He's done a great job promoting the Mingos. If anyone could've made a Milwaukee MLS franchise work, it's Wilt. Just like he did with the Fire, the Wave, & the Flamingos.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

I was referring to FC Cincinnati’s entire history. Part of the reason they got an expansion club there was the success of their attendance as a USL squad. They’d routinely draw 20K+ as a “minor league” team. So I’d disagree their attendance will fall off.  This wasn’t a curiosity, new car smell attendance boost. Their numbers compared fairly closely with their USL days, only like a 5% increase.  Columbus attendance ebb and flow has been a curiosity, but Chicago isn’t fair. That’s a rabid soccer market, but the attendance is entirely affected by stadium location. With the Fire returning to the city next year, I think it’s a different story.

Not sure why the interest is “not even close”...based on? Austin, sure, Sacramento is only an expansion player cause they have an established USL team, not exactly a large, vibrant market. Milwaukee is no less a viable candidate than St Louis. Nashville is literally only getting a team because multiple billionaire families are spearheading it.  If Milwaukee had a USL team, it would be in the discussion easily if the city had abided. And look at Madison to see the success of upstart soccer in Wisconsin.

Everytime im in Cincinnati, I non stop see people sporting FC Cincinnati gear, stickers, etc.  The team is heavily promoted.

[MU82]

Story in today's Charlotte Observer about how the new MLS franchises in St. Louis and Miami have not needed to use taxpayer dollars at all. Sad to see taxpayers here footing a billionaire's bill.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Story in today's Charlotte Observer about how the new MLS franchises in St. Louis and Miami have not needed to use taxpayer dollars at all. Sad to see taxpayers here footing a billionaire's bill.

The game you gotta play.

[jesmu84]

Has there been any impartial study that taxpayer subsidy of a sports team/stadium (or any other corporate welfare - Amazon, for example) is a benefit to the local community/economy?

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

It can produce localized benefits. Like to a neighborhood or a downtown. But usually not to an overall region.

[jesmu84]

It can produce localized benefits. Like to a neighborhood or a downtown. But usually not to an overall region.

Is that greater than the taxpayer burden?

[Pakuni]

Is that greater than the taxpayer burden?

It's worth keeping in mind that many of these stadium deals are funded either through taxes on tourism or tax rebates on revenues generated by the stadium itself. For example, the public money for the new Raiders stadium in Vegas is being provided through an increase on hotel taxes which is paid almost exclusively by out-of-towners. Or the Nashville soccer stadium, bonds foer which will be repaid through a team lease, a tax on ticket sales and a sales tax on purchases at the stadium.

I'm not arguing whether these deals are good or bad, or whether the benefits outweigh the costs, but by and large the public money for these projects isn't coming out of local residents' pockets.

[Its DJOver]

It's official.

https://www.espn.com/soccer/major-league-soccer/story/4014801/sources-charlotte-to-become-mls-30th-franchise-for-record-$325-million

Really hope they stop at 30, the quality in play has slowly been dropping for a few years now.  Commit to 30, stay with it for the foreseeable future, let the franchises develop their respective academies, and overall quality will rise across the board.  Also, stop bringing in the ageing stars, I like that more and more of the DP's have been younger players.

[JWags85]

It's official.

https://www.espn.com/soccer/major-league-soccer/story/4014801/sources-charlotte-to-become-mls-30th-franchise-for-record-$325-million

Really hope they stop at 30, the quality in play has slowly been dropping for a few years now.  Commit to 30, stay with it for the foreseeable future, let the franchises develop their respective academies, and overall quality will rise across the board.  Also, stop bringing in the ageing stars, I like that more and more of the DP's have been younger players.

30 already is too many IMO, but thats also probably a function of my desire for pro/rel that will never come.

And actually totally agree on the DPs.  2019 was the first year that I could look through the list of DPs and its mostly either the aforementioned aging stars, or young talent, a lot from South America.  Id love to see the MLS become like the Eredivisie.  Entertaining soccer that is a springboard to the greater leagues in Europe.  For awhile, I remember seeing too many DPs like Nemanja Nikolic.  Late 20s from a middle tier European league (I remember seeing DPs that came from the Hungarian league, Norwegian Eliteserin, Danish Superliga, etc).  They missed their shot at a top 4 league and at best would be a contributor at a team that sneaks into the CL group stages through qualifiers.  But then come to the MLS and make a bundle but not really improve the profile of the league.  Now they need players like Josef Martinez and others to level up to La Liga and elsewhere after excelling in the MLS to prove that path.

[shoothoops]

Story in today's Charlotte Observer about how the new MLS franchises in St. Louis and Miami have not needed to use taxpayer dollars at all. Sad to see taxpayers here footing a billionaire's bill.

The reason why St. Louis didn't have a team sooner is because in today's MLS, you need billionaire type money. There were multiple different attempts, but not an owner with Big boy Big girl money so to speak.

The Taylor family (founders of Enterprise Rent-a-Car $26 billion revenue) are the money people. They are not sports people. They have done a ton of charitable things in many categories. They are the last resort. When Kroenke moved the Rams, they wanted to do something. So they have partnered with soccer people. Previously, quietly they became a quiet minority owner in the St. Louis Blues years ago. (One of a few dozen) The Taylor family was well aware that there is zero appetite in St. Louis for public money for teams and stadiums after what happened with the Rams. So they came in as a last resort. They will do it first class. They have a strong reputation. But again it takes a lot of money these days to get involved.

Tepper is paying $325 million entry fee in Charlotte. This morning it was said there will be a $110 million tourism tax incentives for football stadium renovations and new Eastland headquarters for the team.

[panda]

December/January brings FA cup 3rd round, busy Christmas league schedule, closing of Champions League group stage and possibly League Cup games. Right when you think you’re out of the busy game schedule, congratulations make the semis of the League Cup and you’re given a two legged playoff! Fantastic….. All for qualification into the black hole that is Europa league. Big clubs don’t need the League Cup unless of course they have the squad players to make a deep run.

Given the choice, no manager or fan for that matter would prioritize League Cup ahead of the other three competitions listed.

Bump

https://twitter.com/lfc/status/1207005070396706818

[Its DJOver]

Bump

https://twitter.com/lfc/status/1207005070396706818

They're only throwing out the youth team because of the Club World Cup game tomorrow.  Klopp's not even there.  You won't see full strength sides, but in the other 3 League Cup games tomorrow, you will not see a full squad change that Liverpool was forced into.  If the 1st team wasn't in Qatar right now you would see a lot more familiar faces.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Bump

https://twitter.com/lfc/status/1207005070396706818

Hey, with a Longstaff on your side, not all is bad.

[MUfan12]

The goals have been self-inflicted, but that Liverpool U-23 team has been better than Villa for much of the first half.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Hey, with a Longstaff on your side, not all is bad.

Bet longstaff scores a lot.

[JWags85]

They're only throwing out the youth team because of the Club World Cup game tomorrow.  Klopp's not even there.  You won't see full strength sides, but in the other 3 League Cup games tomorrow, you will not see a full squad change that Liverpool was forced into.  If the 1st team wasn't in Qatar right now you would see a lot more familiar faces.

Pretty rare to see a startinG 11 that to the man won’t see ANY match time in the EPL. Well Jones popped his cherry last week, but other than that, the rest of those guys aren’t even on the bench. Even Brewster wasn’t there. Extenuating circumstances of course, but still amazing

[ZiggysFryBoy]

3 acres of weed?  Tottenham Hotbox, aina?

https://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/daniel-levy-new-tottenham-stadium-club-new-dawn-a4316696.html

[Its DJOver]

December/January brings FA cup 3rd round, busy Christmas league schedule, closing of Champions League group stage and possibly League Cup games. Right when you think you’re out of the busy game schedule, congratulations make the semis of the League Cup and you’re given a two legged playoff! Fantastic….. All for qualification into the black hole that is Europa league. Big clubs don’t need the League Cup unless of course they have the squad players to make a deep run.

Given the choice, no manager or fan for that matter would prioritize League Cup ahead of the other three competitions listed.

Everton, Leicester, and United all throwing out full, or nearly full strength squads.  City including some youngsters, but still a world class front line.  League cup is the second least prioritized trophy in England (behind the Community Shield), but teams still play for it, and were it not for the Club World Cup, Liverpool would have put out an equally as strong line-up yesterday.

[Pakuni]

Marquette's Patrick Seagrist and Luka Prpa go #10 and #32 overall, respectively, in the MLS draft.

[Its DJOver]

https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2020/01/20/toronto-fc-captain-michael-bradley-undergo-ankle-surgery-could-be-out-four-months

Nothing against Bradley, but I really hope that this ends his international career.  Just a case of needing to move on, especially with Adams coming into his own in Leipzig.

Still think the biggest questions are in the defensive end, Steffen hasn't exactly lit up Germany since going back, Brooks hasn't been great either, but I still think he's the best CB of the group, Miazga's been disappointing based on his potential, CCV needs to move on, and it's tough to gauge Palmer-Brown when he's only in Austria.  I really don't want to have to be reliant on the MLS CB's, but if they're the only one's getting consistent game time, I don't know what other choice there is.

[JWags85]

Still think the biggest questions are in the defensive end, Steffen hasn't exactly lit up Germany since going back, Brooks hasn't been great either, but I still think he's the best CB of the group, Miazga's been disappointing based on his potential, CCV needs to move on, and it's tough to gauge Palmer-Brown when he's only in Austria.  I really don't want to have to be reliant on the MLS CB's, but if they're the only one's getting consistent game time, I don't know what other choice there is.

I dont think this is fair at all.  Hes unfortunately not on a very good club, but he's draw plenty of praise for his play.  Numerous team of the week honors in the Bundesliga, and even when Fortuna has gotten shelled, people have been quick to defend him and remove fault from him.  He's been battling some knee issues since mid fall, but otherwise I think his performance has been very encouraging and there isn't much out there to say otherwise.

I think the only positive about CCV is that Spurs are keeping close enough of an eye on him to pull him back to London once they realized the new manager at Stoke wasn't super keen on him.  Would be nice if he can be moved again by the end of this winter window.  He's still only 22, which is crazy.

Really wish Aaron Long had gotten that EPL move.  Feel like he's gonna plateau in MLS otherwise.

[Its DJOver]

I dont think this is fair at all.  Hes unfortunately not on a very good club, but he's draw plenty of praise for his play.  Numerous team of the week honors in the Bundesliga, and even when Fortuna has gotten shelled, people have been quick to defend him and remove fault from him.  He's been battling some knee issues since mid fall, but otherwise I think his performance has been very encouraging and there isn't much out there to say otherwise.

I've been pretty underwhelmed concerning his abilities with his feet.  If we were just playing the "boot ball" of the 90s and 00s, he'd be fine, but I would be majorly concerned with him against anybody that initiates a high press.  My concern is that, outside of Mexico, we won't see any decent press in CONCACAF, and then we'll just be totally overwhelmed when someone throws it at us in a high level meaningful game.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Jay Berhalter stepping down.

https://soccer.nbcsports.com/2020/02/06/us-soccer-usmnt-uswnt-jay-berhalter-carlos-cordeiro/amp/?__twitter_impression=true