https://twitter.com/marquettembb/status/1346631266851020800?s=21
Good.
Some really ticky tack calls against MU so far.
Offense looks like a mess again
Keep going to Jamal
Please keep moving the ball when you get doubled
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 08:05:41 PM
Some really ticky tack calls against MU so far.
Offense looks like a mess again
Let Uconn dude get away with going through Jamals back on that board.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 08:05:41 PM
Some really ticky tack calls against MU so far.
Offense looks like a mess again
Thought DJs was a foul. Koby's was not.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on January 05, 2021, 08:08:31 PM
Let Uconn dude get away with going through Jamals back on that board.
Yup
Lewis had him beat. Just needed to go up
Jamal being aggressive again at least.
Couldnt get that last turn around to go.
No. 1 on UConn looks to me like he palms the ball on every possession.
Love seeing dawson hit a few early
Dawson early results is nice.
Uconn starting to get the volley ball rebounding going last few possessions. Been lucky to survive them.
OT:
Depaul has only played 3 games so far??
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 08:23:18 PM
OT:
Depaul has only played 3 games so far??
THey were at 0 for like a full month ha.
Missing some easy shots but love the aggressiveness.
Uconn is gonna start wearing us down on the glass as the legs get heavier
This is a really good stretch.
Uconn missing some looks though so we gotta be ready for a run back at us.
DJ looked a bit like Markus on that step back
Going to Jamal at the end of the clock is a great adjustment if he is going to play with confidence. If he shows confidence in his handle he can get that mid range shot at any time.
It seems that rust is a great thing.
Our guarded jump shots have been falling, but I don't think we want to live here.
Move the ball more/quicker. Go inside-out. Find mismatches. Push in transition
Do we miss more layups than most teams or do I just notice it more for MU because I'm rooting for them?
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 05, 2021, 07:54:27 PM
https://twitter.com/marquettembb/status/1346631266851020800?s=21
I don't want to get this run locked, but since you bring it up. MU, a Catholic school...although that is irrelevant...how about a Christian school, as SJ Society of Jesus would indicate, supports antiSemetic BLM, and now this. My alum donations to the B&G Fund hard at work I see.
Quote from: Marq3332 on January 05, 2021, 08:29:26 PM
I don't want to get this run locked, but since you bring it up. MU, a Catholic school...although that is irrelevant...how about a Christian school, as SJ Society of Jesus would indicate, supports antiSemetic BLM, and now this. My alum donations to the B&G Fund hard at work I see.
Sir, this is an Arby's
Offensive rebounds becoming a problem....
Fouls stacking up on important players
Every game, the announcers comment on Theo's physique. Shouldn't he average like 10 rebounds a game? I always expect him to be a monster on the boards, but he really isn't.
Quote from: Marq3332 on January 05, 2021, 08:29:26 PM
I don't want to get this run locked, but since you bring it up. MU, a Catholic school...although that is irrelevant...how about a Christian school, as SJ Society of Jesus would indicate, supports antiSemetic BLM, and now this. My alum donations to the B&G Fund hard at work I see.
Lol
Less dribbling in the half court, please
Quote from: Afroman on January 05, 2021, 08:33:13 PM
Every game, the announcers comment on Theo's physique. Shouldn't he average like 10 rebounds a game? I always expect him to be a monster on the boards, but he really isn't.
Rebounds are about understanding the angles. To get to double digit rebounding you have to be a student of the angles the way Henry was.
Quote from: Trump Loves The Big East on January 05, 2021, 08:37:23 PM
Rebounds are about understanding the angles. To get to double digit rebounding you have to be a student of the angles the way Henry was.
Jae was excellent at this
Sweet Jesus, so many easy baskets when we push offense.
Please keep doing it
Quote from: Trump Loves The Big East on January 05, 2021, 08:37:23 PM
Rebounds are about understanding the angles. To get to double digit rebounding you have to be a student of the angles the way Henry was.
That's what made Rodman so unbelievable.
Heckuva play by DJ.
Stop settling for outside shots
what the hell was that last shot by DJ?????? Playing so well and then just settling for chucking up some 3 early on in the shot clock....no discipline
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 08:44:33 PM
Stop settling for outside shots
Fine with that last one for the 2 for 1 but it backfired with the quick Uconn 3
Quote from: warriors141 on January 05, 2021, 08:45:21 PM
what the hell was that last shot by DJ?????? Playing so well and then just settling for chucking up some 3 early on in the shot clock....no discipline
Think that was to get the 2 for 1. Thought Wojo told him something coming down.
Quote from: warriors141 on January 05, 2021, 08:45:21 PM
what the hell was that last shot by DJ?????? Playing so well and then just settling for chucking up some 3 early on in the shot clock....no discipline
Two for one.
Lewis desperately needs to see an outside shot go in
Lewis had the whole court open to drive there. F
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 08:44:33 PM
Stop settling for outside shots
Their bigs in foul trouble. We got it inside and got a bunch of offensive rebounds for a few possessions in a row. Then totally went away from it to finish the half.
Feed the post.
Of course that was the three that Sy hit.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 08:46:33 PM
Lewis desperately needs to see an outside shot go in
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-91ModeFay7U/VHo6k4OgrjI/AAAAAAAAA44/mCq2rVXPAAQ/s1600/building_brick_wall.gif)
Im sorry, but why is Lewis still chucking up those 3's??? he was o for last game and 0-2 today... Is he supposed tone that good of a 3pt shooter??? was that last play for him to shoot 3??? plz help me understand???
Quote from: Marq3332 on January 05, 2021, 08:29:26 PM
I don't want to get this run locked, but since you bring it up. MU, a Catholic school...although that is irrelevant...how about a Christian school, as SJ Society of Jesus would indicate, supports antiSemetic BLM, and now this. My alum donations to the B&G Fund hard at work I see.
Somebody needs to review Catholic Social teaching and Jesuit philosophy.
Good half overall. Bit of a meh finish. ONly 4 TOs so thats great.
GOtta get some more fouls next half. They foul a ton and only had 6 this half.
Also Justin, I would love both things to improve but ill take 1 of the 2. Either start making your 3s or get to the line more and actually make those. Hes got so much talent but he misses statistically two of the easier shots regularly...wide open 3s and free throws.
Theo's been a really inept rebounder in conference play
MU's decision to wear Black and their written statement , didn't sit well on MUBB Facebook page ! ! ! I dont know if they are "real" fans or there just to stir the pot ! ! ! Just sayin' !! ! 8-)
Sure hope Bouknight is OK, but wouldn't really mind if he rested the rest of the game tonight.
The 2-on-1 seems to stymie our guards - there is never any penetration out of it, always a bailout pass around the top. I would love to see a more aggressive pass out of it to where we'd have a 4-on-3. Would also love to see us have a FT. Can't bitch about 4 TO's, though.
Quote from: Afroman on January 05, 2021, 08:40:29 PM
That's what made Rodman so unbelievable.
Agree. Possibly the greatest ever.
Also I don't think anyone will ever break Don Kojis Marquette rebounding record. averaged 15.1 boards a game over his career.
Quote from: guzica on January 05, 2021, 08:56:02 PM
MU's decision to wear Black and their written statement , didn't sit well on MUBB Facebook page ! ! ! I dont know if they are "real" fans or there just to stir the pot ! ! ! Just sayin' !! ! 8-)
I don't see anything.
Link?
Quote from: guzica on January 05, 2021, 08:56:02 PM
MU's decision to wear Black and their written statement , didn't sit well on MUBB Facebook page ! ! ! I dont know if they are "real" fans or there just to stir the pot ! ! ! Just sayin' !! ! 8-)
Please refer them to Theo's statement.
Quote from: guzica on January 05, 2021, 08:56:02 PM
MU's decision to wear Black and their written statement , didn't sit well on MUBB Facebook page ! ! ! I dont know if they are "real" fans or there just to stir the pot ! ! ! Just sayin' !! ! 8-)
Well yeah this stuff never sits well on social media no matter the team or sport. There are always people freaking out
F yes.
Came out focused and ready
Thats how you start a half.
Now bury em.
It's amazing how good this team can look when it hits shots. Love this version of Dawson!
18 point home lead. The worst place to be in in the BE...
Quote from: BLM on January 05, 2021, 09:09:50 PM
18 point home lead. The worst place to be in in the BE...
(https://media3.giphy.com/media/fXEhRluF0JYNzXigGO/giphy-downsized-large.gif)
DJ....be smarter
Good Timeout call there. Stop UConn momentum early
Big 6-0 run there from UConn. They have life.
Come on. Focus.
Quote from: TSmith34 on January 05, 2021, 09:01:16 PM
Please refer them to Theo's statement.
There are better hills to die on than this one. And these unis are hideous anyway.
Okay. Down to 8. All momentum to uconn.
Well. crap. We are going to have a battle.
Theo, feel free to grab a rebound with your exquisite physique.
went from looking fantastic to god awful pretty darn quick
Why in the hell are we taking the air out of the ball?
We didn't build a first half lead by playing in the half court.
symir cant hit an open 3 to save his life this year
UConn's intensity stepped up. Need to match it.
Quote from: Johnny B on January 05, 2021, 09:26:03 PM
symir cant hit an open 3 to save his life this year
To be fair, he actually hit one today.
Quote from: Johnny B on January 05, 2021, 09:26:03 PM
symir cant hit an open 3 to save his life this year
He also struggles handling the ball, passing the ball and defense. Other than that a well rounded player.
Let's hope this game is not the flip side of the GT game, both with 18-pt leads.
Quote from: mileskishnish72 on January 05, 2021, 09:28:27 PM
Let's hope this game is not the flip side of the GT game, both with 18-pt leads.
We are on pace to lose our entire lead that much quicker
just pathetic
feels like if we flip the g town halfs
We're dribbling this game away
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on January 05, 2021, 09:35:17 PM
We're dribbling this game away
Took all the air out of the ball
Only have themselves to blame
25-6 run.
We're getting pushed waaaay out in the half court.
unreal....wojo has no answers.........stupid fucker
This team won't take charges and loves standing around watching a pick and roll up top..... awesome
So disappointed in this effort. UConn started hitting some tough shots but MU only has themselves to blame.
This is horrendous. At least Gtown built the huge lead and lost it with a little pace.
thought we had the game won already..........this program under wojo is so pathetically weak. how many games do we just get outhustled, other teams play harder, tougher.
No energy with this team. Opposite of resilient tonight. Must be a Tuesday night in Milwakuee winter...uconn seems to bring some BE grit, I like that. They'll fit right in
20 sec. in a possession and we don't get the ball deeper than the top of the 3.
The telling comment was made by the TV announcer: UConn is the team playing harder.
That's the play wojo came up with out of a TO...
We are going to pull this out. Our shots will start to fall. UConn will cool off
How can a guy who is hated by so many for his obnoxious defensive intensity as a player have such vanilla teams with no grit. No intensity. No defense?
Crud
getting raped on the rebounds....fucking weak
just getting killed on the boards.
If Marquette loses I'm boycotting the Nova game on Friday
Quote from: warriors141 on January 05, 2021, 09:38:04 PM
thought we had the game won already..........this program under wojo is so pathetically weak. how many games do we just get outhustled, other teams play harder, tougher.
Wojos golden retriever style of ball in full effect tonight. Always the weaker and softer team.
Quote from: warriors141 on January 05, 2021, 09:39:44 PM
getting raped on the rebounds....unnatural carnal knowledgeing weak
Theo has big muscles, though.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on January 05, 2021, 09:04:46 PM
Well yeah this stuff never sits well on social media no matter the team or sport. There are always people freaking out
Several were pointing out that Blake is a violent felon pursued for rape, stealing a car resisting and threatening police. They questioned the reasoning behind the honor.
Please please stop trying to play in the halfcourt only. We need to push the transition
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on January 05, 2021, 09:41:12 PM
Several were pointing out that Blake is a violent felon pursued for rape, stealing a car resisting and threatening police. They questioned the reasoning behind the honor.
As they should
One of the worst offense sequences of the Wojo area. I like when we have 2 guys standing at the wings and Theo/Garcia standing still near the FT line as Torrence/Carton dribble furiously at the top of the key being hounded
Get the lead back with a 3 pt play.
GIve up 3 right back..
Helps UCONN that they actually run offense
Defensive intensity is the story of this game. MU. None. UConn. Tons.
Theo by himself?
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 09:42:10 PM
As they should
Perhaps they should have spent the minutes prior to the game focusing on winning a basketball game...
announcer on marquette defense "we are seeing really elementary stuff"
DJ I really thought would be more of a consistent scorer than this. Dude been mia a whole half again.
Quote from: ski44 on January 05, 2021, 09:46:42 PM
Perhaps they should have spent the minutes prior to the game focusing on winning a basketball game...
There are so many more important things in life than a college basketball game. Especially to young black men. Give it a rest.
DJ is playing terribly this half
Wojo's offensive scheming is embarrassing
Quote from: ski44 on January 05, 2021, 09:46:42 PM
Perhaps they should have spent the minutes prior to the game focusing on winning a basketball game...
Amen.......or perhaps at least playing with intensity. If we blow this I am done with this program
Pauley going all Jamal Cain on us.
Quote from: ChitownSpaceForRent on January 05, 2021, 09:47:51 PM
There are so many more important things in life than a college basketball game. Especially to young black men. Give it a rest.
No kidding lol. What an embarrassment some people are. Truly.
They score every time down the floor. So even if we god forbid do start scoring...
Wojo coached a great first half.
Damn. Looks like this one's getting away.
Defense creates offense. Wojo - where is the intensity?
Quote from: YaBlueIt on January 05, 2021, 09:48:06 PM
Wojo's offensive scheming is embarrassing
What scheme?
Quote from: warriors141 on January 05, 2021, 09:48:17 PM
Amen.......or perhaps at least playing with intensity. If we blow this I am done with this program
Please don't.
this is ridiciclous. carton isnt that good. dont see the speed some say he has
Quote from: WolfganghisKhan on January 05, 2021, 09:49:03 PM
What scheme?
The one that got us an 18 point lead.
And gave us the come from behind win against georgetown.
Don't be dense.
Quote from: ski44 on January 05, 2021, 09:46:42 PM
Perhaps they should have spent the minutes prior to the game focusing on winning a basketball game...
No objections from me. They must think the MUBB platform is a strong one that people give two f***s what they think. Maybe in the Buzz and Crean days when there were more fans and MU was winning s*** once in a while
Theo with nice hustle on the missed free throw.
MU's offense has been reduced to our Guards furiously dribbling up top with no plan and the other four drifting around. There is an initial ball screen but then a lot of repositioning. Very easy to guard. MU slow to get back on D and boxing out is optional
The problem (again) has sent what happened before the game. The problem becomes when the opposing coach makes adjustments and our coach looks confused. No adjustment. No change up. UConn figured us out and...nothing.
Constant problem of the Wojo era.
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 09:49:56 PM
No objections from me. They must think the MUBB platform is a strong one that people give two f***s what they think. Maybe in the Buzz and Crean days when there were more fans and MU was winning s*** once in a while
Obviously they still have a platform because you're still commenting on the situation.
Again. This is all about defensive intensity. They have it. We don't.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 05, 2021, 09:50:43 PM
The problem (again) has sent what happened before the game. The problem becomes when the opposing coach makes adjustments and our coach looks confused. No adjustment. No change up. UConn figured us out and...nothing.
Constant problem of the Wojo era.
There's never a counterpunch. That's the story of Wojo.
How are those that defended Wojo after the Gtown win feeling?
Seriously, don't guard Polley.
This team is an embarrassment.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 05, 2021, 09:50:43 PM
The problem (again) has sent what happened before the game. The problem becomes when the opposing coach makes adjustments and our coach looks confused. No adjustment. No change up. UConn figured us out and...nothing.
Constant problem of the Wojo era.
Truly is. Wojo can make adjustments to what a team has done for a half(like Creighton and Gtown). But I don't now if I have ever seen him successfully counter what a team adjusts to us doing.
Quote from: ChitownSpaceForRent on January 05, 2021, 09:47:51 PM
There are so many more important things in life than a college basketball game. Especially to young black men. Give it a rest.
We all are in agreement . That's why this statement was imprudent on many levels
Projos: You can't expect to win any games with number 12 shooting that way. Vegas spread was 1 and we'll be close to that so this loss is fine.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 09:49:51 PM
The one that got us an 18 point lead.
And gave us the come from behind win against georgetown.
Don't be dense.
Two halves vs 7 years of evidence. Our offense is hoping we're hitting our 3s.
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 09:49:56 PM
No objections from me. They must think the MUBB platform is a strong one that people give two f***s what they think. Maybe in the Buzz and Crean days when there were more fans and MU was winning s*** once in a while
Yet you keep commenting. Perhaps you should follow another team in protest.
Why is everyone just standing around??
That's amazing
We need GT Jamal.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 05, 2021, 09:53:28 PM
Yet you keep commenting. Perhaps you should follow another team in protest.
or just not follow any team until Marquette decides to care about winning again. You are right, more to life than college ball, I have better things to do than watch a trash product. Many other fans feel the same...hopefully that lights a fire under someones rear
Quote from: seakm4 on January 05, 2021, 09:54:19 PM
That's amazing
Inexplicably benched against UCLA too. Wojo has no touch.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 09:54:01 PM
Why is everyone just standing around??
Because this is our offense.
Quote from: WolfganghisKhan on January 05, 2021, 09:56:16 PM
Because this is our offense.
It was not our offense in the first half.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 09:56:46 PM
It was not our offense in the first half.
How long are you gonna cling to the first half?
#12 pretty much beat us all by himself
Quote from: 5DollarPitcher on January 05, 2021, 09:57:17 PM
How long are you gonna cling to the first half?
He has a point. But it's wojos fault
The next time a SE Wisconsin law enforcement officer gets murdered in the line of duty, I'll wait for MU to wear a jersey in that person's honor...
Wow, just wow.
Travel, and and airball for good measure
carton is just bad. one of the worst halfs i can remeber in the last years
Quote from: warriors141 on January 05, 2021, 09:55:22 PM
or just not follow any team until Marquette decides to care about winning again. You are right, more to life than college ball, I have better things to do than watch a trash product. Many other fans feel the same...hopefully that lights a fire under someones rear
Bye.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 09:56:46 PM
It was not our offense in the first half.
Because UCONN is actually playing defense this half with their adjustments. We have no answer.
And we foul out the game down 10 with 20 seconds left. My god Wojo come on man.
Quote from: ski44 on January 05, 2021, 09:57:58 PM
The next time a SE Wisconsin law enforcement officer gets murdered in the line of duty, I'll wait for MU to wear a jersey in that person's honor...
Great, since you're obviously not a fan anymore you can stop posting at any time.
Good news. Don't have to worry about Nova going in dry on us this week.
Quote from: 5DollarPitcher on January 05, 2021, 09:57:17 PM
How long are you gonna cling to the first half?
Well, considering the changes wojo made once we got the big lead. He instructed the guys to slow it down and play in the half court.
As opposed to building the lead by pushing the pace in transition.
That killed us.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 05, 2021, 10:00:20 PM
Well, considering the changes wojo made once we got the big lead. He instructed the guys to slow it down and play in the half court.
As opposed to building the lead by pushing the pace in transition.
That killed us.
UConn picked up the defensive intensity but you're generally not wrong. I also feel we went away from forcing Dawson which was working and clearly a huge mismatch that we were successfully exploiting.
That was a collapse of epic proportions. Up by 18, lose by 11. A 29 point swing. It's amazing how good they looked in the first half and how bad they looked in the second half.
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 09:49:56 PM
No objections from me. They must think the MUBB platform is a strong one that people give two f***s what they think. Maybe in the Buzz and Crean days when there were more fans and MU was winning s*** once in a while
Seems like you do give at least one f*** what they think..
Hey Chitown and BLM, perhaps we can meet up at the next "Take back the night" rally wearing Jacob Blake shirts and you can teach the rest of us how to be as woke as you are. Or we can suggest to MU BBall to pick a more appropriate person to honor in an attempt to bring awareness to racial injustice.
Quote from: mjmjun26 on January 05, 2021, 09:39:14 PM
We are going to pull this out. Our shots will start to fall. UConn will cool off
(https://media1.giphy.com/media/YrBRYRDN4M5ryrNOND/giphy.gif?cid=82a1493btwzdja9j769xs7db1c3g68wc7k53sw497nlpl1x7&rid=giphy.gif)
nm
Not worth any of my mental capacity
Quote from: FrennA on January 05, 2021, 10:16:25 PM
Hey Chitown and BLM, perhaps we can meet up at the next "Take back the night" rally wearing Jacob Blake shirts and you can teach the rest of us how to be as woke as you are. Or we can suggest to MU BBall to pick a more appropriate person to honor in an attempt to bring awareness to racial injustice.
Hey FrennA, are you of the opinion that anyone with a criminal background should be shot 7 times in the back? Just making sure I have that right.
It seems that the players (especially Theo) were the driving factors to wear the black jerseys, so that is nice MU gives them a platform to express themselves on issues they feel strongly about. However, if they are going to put a strong statement and say they are "EXTREMELY disappointed" in the ruling, then they should go on record and say specifically what would be a satisfying outcome to them. I'd like to hear that.
Quote from: CountryRoads on January 05, 2021, 10:31:54 PM
It seems that the players (especially Theo) were the driving factors to wear the black jerseys, so that is nice MU gives them a platform to express themselves on issues they feel strongly about. However, if they are going to put a strong statement and say they are "EXTREMELY disappointed" in the ruling, then they should go on record and say specifically what would be a satisfying outcome to them. I'd like to hear that.
Well, with any kind of common sense let's think critically about this. There were no charges against the police officer that shot Jacob Blake in the back 7 times. So if they were "EXTREMELY disappointed" in that ruling, I think you could assume that they would've preferred charges be pressed?
Quote from: BLM on January 05, 2021, 10:28:44 PM
Hey FrennA, are you of the opinion that anyone with a criminal background should be shot 7 times in the back? Just making sure I have that right.
Let's see Wades...wanted felon when it happened, resisting arrest, multiple taser attempts didn't subdue him, armed with a knife, kids in van he did not have full custody over and threatening to take off with them.
How about that, missed a few details. Well, there's a first time for everything.
Oh yeah, he was reason police were called to house in first place...
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on January 05, 2021, 10:34:04 PM
Let's see Wades...wanted felon when it happened, resisting arrest, multiple taser attempts didn't subdue him, armed with a knife, kids in van he did not have full custody over and threatening to take off with them.
How about that, missed a few details. Well, there's a first time for everything.
So your answer is yes, felons should be shot in the back 7 times. Got it. Says more about you than the MU players.
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on January 05, 2021, 10:34:04 PM
Let's see Wades...wanted felon when it happened, resisting arrest, multiple taser attempts didn't subdue him, armed with a knife, kids in van he did not have full custody over and threatening to take off with them.
How about that, missed a few details. Well, there's a first time for everything.
ive heard conflicting data but if this is all true, its kinda hard to fully get on board and honor him like the team did. i guess i dont get it
For MU fans, this is simple. If you don't support the team in this, you should end your Marquette fandom right now. The team doesn't want you. Go away. See my signature for confirmation.
let's make heroes out of criminals
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on January 05, 2021, 10:34:04 PM
Let's see Wades...wanted felon when it happened, resisting arrest, multiple taser attempts didn't subdue him, armed with a knife, kids in van he did not have full custody over and threatening to take off with them.
How about that, missed a few details. Well, there's a first time for everything.
You aren't wrong but seven shots in the back after slowly walking away is excessive.
I don't argue he shouldn't be resisting, especially with valid issues for arrest.
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 05, 2021, 10:38:19 PM
For MU fans, this is simple. If you don't support the team in this, you should end your Marquette fandom right now. The team doesn't want you. Go away. See my signature for confirmation.
well team is trash so..............
Quote from: warriors141 on January 05, 2021, 10:39:41 PM
well team is trash so..............
I thought you were "finished" about a half hour ago. Back already?
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 05, 2021, 10:38:19 PM
For MU fans, this is simple. If you don't support the team in this, you should end your Marquette fandom right now. The team doesn't want you. Go away. See my signature for confirmation.
as a leftist who thinks we can drastically improve our police system,i dont think you need to agree with absoulutly everything theo says to qualify as a fan.
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 05, 2021, 10:38:19 PM
For MU fans, this is simple. If you don't support the team in this, you should end your Marquette fandom right now. The team doesn't want you. Go away. See my signature for confirmation.
Right you are Brew. I think a lot of people have left, or decided they don't care about MUBB as much as they have in the past. Now whether that's due to the lackluster product put on the floor, or their political motivations, I'm not sure
What I do know is Marquette was around far before Theo and the team made their comments. Marquette will be around long after Theo and staff are gone. Nobody will encourage me to stop supporting due to their political motivations, their product on the floor has created enough of a reason to become a "casual fan" If you want to label it that.
The sooner wojo is gone, the better.
Quote from: Johnny B on January 05, 2021, 10:43:12 PM
as a leftist who thinks we can drastically improve our police system,i dont think you need to agree with absoulutly everything theo says to qualify as a fan.
+1
I support BLM that does not mean that every shot from police isn't justified. Is this one? IMO certainly not 7 times but maybe one or two are up for discussion given weapon, warrant, resist, and potential kidnapping.
Quote from: Johnny B on January 05, 2021, 10:43:12 PM
as a leftist who thinks we can drastically improve our police system,i dont think you need to agree with absoulutly everything theo says to qualify as a fan.
This.
Just to be objective. Has anyone seen an individual on drugs before and get shot? Specifically coke?
Justifying 7 shots, I'm not sure, however in the heat of the moment, someone who is tasered, a felon, possible kidnapping, well..
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 10:49:17 PM
Just to be objective. Has anyone seen an individual on drugs before and get shot? Specifically coke?
Justifying 7 shots, I'm not sure, however in the heat of the moment, someone who is tasered, a felon, possible kidnapping, well..
Which is why police reform is needed. If you can't get control of a situation where you have multiple police trying to control one unarmed person, well...
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 10:49:17 PM
Just to be objective. Has anyone seen an individual on drugs before and get shot? Specifically coke?
Justifying 7 shots, I'm not sure, however in the heat of the moment, someone who is tasered, a felon, possible kidnapping, well..
Coke? Was he trying to tell bad jokes, buy more shots and try and get everyone to go to the strip club? Meth or pcp is the drug you're looking for there.
Quote from: BLM on January 05, 2021, 10:50:15 PM
Which is why police reform is needed. If you can't get control of a situation where you have multiple police trying to control one unarmed person, well...
Also this.
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 10:49:17 PM
Just to be objective. Has anyone seen an individual on drugs before and get shot? Specifically coke?
Justifying 7 shots, I'm not sure, however in the heat of the moment, someone who is tasered, a felon, possible kidnapping, well..
Yes actually, administered first aid to him outside of doc Ryan's on Madison street in forest park (for my Chicago west sub people) it was 2016.
BLM, to answer your question, no. I am not of the opinion that anyone with a criminal record should be shot 7 times in the back. Nice try, though. Are you in politics by chance? Anyways, I don't have an opinion on that at all considering I wasn't there and like Hutch pointed out, a lot of info left out......conveniently. But since you asked my opinion, I'll give it to you. My opinion is I think MU could have picked a better example than Jacob Blake to recognize racial injustices. Maybe others disagree. Maybe one of those that disagree with me is Theo John. That's fine. However, Theo John doesn't speak for all the past, present and future MU fans and players and therefore doesn't dictate whether I, or anyone else, can be part of the MU fan base or not.
Quote from: FrennA on January 05, 2021, 10:54:21 PM
BLM, to answer your question, no. I am not of the opinion that anyone with a criminal record should be shot 7 times in the back. Nice try, though. Are you in politics by chance? Anyways, I don't have an opinion on that at all considering I wasn't there and like Hutch pointed out, a lot of info left out......conveniently. But since you asked my opinion, I'll give it to you. My opinion is I think MU could have picked a better example than Jacob Blake to recognize racial injustices. Maybe others disagree. Maybe one of those that disagree with me is Theo John. That's fine. However, Theo John doesn't speak for all the past, present and future MU fans and players and therefore doesn't dictate whether I, or anyone else, can be part of the MU fan base or not.
The decision came down today. There's a reason they did this today. But maybe next game they'll wear black for Elijah McClain and we can hear Scoopers who are uncomfortable admitting there are serious problems in our society attack him too and explain to me why he deserved to be murdered by police.
Quote from: Johnny B on January 05, 2021, 10:43:12 PM
as a leftist who thinks we can drastically improve our police system,i dont think you need to agree with absoulutly everything theo says to qualify as a fan.
Doesn't change that the team doesn't want fans that aren't with them on and off the court. And I'm pretty sure that extends beyond Theo, will extend beyond this current roster, & will extend beyond Wojo.
Quote from: BLM on January 05, 2021, 10:50:15 PM
Which is why police reform is needed. If you can't get control of a situation where you have multiple police trying to control one unarmed person, well...
Wades, I'm not saying we can't do better. we need to. My issue is MU supporting Mr. Blake given his past and the evidence in the case. Support and encourage police reform using facts, statistics, a different person MLK, Jackie Robinson, Rosa Parks, anyone else.
I'm not against police reform, prison reform, and other programs that can help. Being on the right side of the political spectrum, I can also agree on this
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 10:59:02 PM
Wades, I'm not saying we can't do better. we need to. My issue is MU supporting Mr. Blake given his past and the evidence in the case. Support and encourage police reform using facts, statistics, a different person MLK, Jackie Robinson, Rosa Parks, anyone else.
I'm not against police reform, prison reform, and other programs that can help. Being on the right side of the political spectrum, I can also agree on this
MLK was looked at the same way that many of the people the BLM movement have highlighted are. I'd even argue it's better to "support Mr. Blake." Does he have a checkered past? Sure. Does that mean he deserves to be paralyzed after being shot 7 times in the back because two police officers couldn't get control of the situation? Nope. They "supported Mr. Blake" because it's in their back yard and the decision not to charge the police officer involved came down today. This wasn't just some random decision to pick out someone to support out of nowhere.
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 05, 2021, 10:57:32 PM
Doesn't change that the team doesn't want fans that aren't with them on and off the court. And I'm pretty sure that extends beyond Theo, will extend beyond this current roster, & will extend beyond Wojo.
whose really with somone on every single issue? im probaly with the team on the vast majority of political issues and police brutality cases. blake didnt deserve getting shot 7 times. we need reform. we need a better way. Given the type of guy blake seemed to be at the time im just not up for honoring the guy. why should i? if that alone means i should renounce my fanship, thats kinda sad.
This is such bullsh!t. I can watch the hews for this partisan crap.
Is this not a basketball board?
Quote from: TSmith34 on January 05, 2021, 09:01:16 PM
Please refer them to Theo's statement.
make a statement? Sure. Take a stand? Ok. I'm all for it. But know what the hell you are taking a stand for. Ok Theo, I'll step aside as you support Marxism and Fascism ...something I guarantee you know nothing of. Btw, is a 13-15' face-up too much to ask for?
BLM, if next game they decide to honor McClain, perhaps you'll see all scoopers, including me, come out in support of it because we are not uncomfortable admitting there are racial injustices but perhaps we are uncomfortable praising the likes of someone like Blake while also attending events like "Take back the night". Is this really that hard to understand? I wonder how those of the "Me too" movement feels about Blake. Maybe they're MU fans, or maybe they can't be if Theo has already said so.
Quote from: Marq3332 on January 05, 2021, 11:08:29 PM
make a statement? Sure. Take a stand? Ok. I'm all for it. But know what the hell you are taking a stand for. Ok Theo, I'll step aside as you support Marxism and Fascism ...something I guarantee you know nothing of. Btw, is a 13-15' face-up too much to ask for?
Marxism and fascism are not the same maybe you should read up. Also do you distrust your alma matter that much to not have explained these governmental structures to a senior at this point or are you implying he's a meat head or something else?
Edit are you also the type of person that uses socialism and communism interchangeably? Do you use democratic socialism and socialism interchangeably? I'd say if the answer is yes you're the one who knows nothing
Quote from: Marq3332 on January 05, 2021, 11:08:29 PM
make a statement? Sure. Take a stand? Ok. I'm all for it. But know what the hell you are taking a stand for. Ok Theo, I'll step aside as you support Marxism and Fascism ...something I guarantee you know nothing of. Btw, is a 13-15' face-up too much to ask for?
Ahh yes. The old bury your head in the sand so you don't have to face reality.
Quote from: FrennA on January 05, 2021, 11:09:02 PM
BLM, if next game they decide to honor McClain, perhaps you'll see all scoopers, including me, come out in support of it because we are not uncomfortable admitting there are racial injustices but perhaps we are uncomfortable praising the likes of someone like Blake while also attending events like "Take back the night". Is this really that hard to understand? I wonder how those of the "Me too" movement feels about Blake. Maybe they're MU fans, or maybe they can't be if Theo has already said so.
So if a bad guy gets unjustly shot by police it's just "meh, he wasn't a good guy?" Sorry, but yes, that is a pretty hard outlook for me to understand. Nobody is "praising" Jacob Blake. They are bringing awareness to an unarmed black man, regardless of his character, being shot in the back 7 times by the people that are supposed to serve and protect our community.
Quote from: warriors141 on January 05, 2021, 09:55:22 PM
or just not follow any team until Marquette decides to care about winning again. You are right, more to life than college ball, I have better things to do than watch a trash product. Many other fans feel the same...hopefully that lights a fire under someones rear
Agreed, and, it won't
Quote from: mileskishnish72 on January 05, 2021, 11:08:06 PM
This is such bullsh!t. I can watch the hews for this partisan crap.
Is this not a basketball board?
I was told by Rocky that any discussion of Jacob Blake is not considered political because basic human rights is not political.
So since Wojo got his ass handed to him on a platter this is what the board will be until further notice.
At the end of the day officer was by the drivers seat and at point blank range. Shout tire or him once.
I'm not pro Jacob Blake, see my post in the Kenosha thread, but he's not deserving of being paralyzed or shot seven times.
Quote from: ski44 on January 05, 2021, 09:57:58 PM
The next time a SE Wisconsin law enforcement officer gets murdered in the line of duty, I'll wait for MU to wear a jersey in that person's honor...
Amen
Quote from: ski44 on January 05, 2021, 09:57:58 PM
The next time a SE Wisconsin law enforcement officer gets murdered in the line of duty, I'll wait for MU to wear a jersey in that person's honor...
False equivalency
I won't ever understand how you can't understand that a guy with a previous warrant out for rape, disorderly conduct, and stealing a car is shot when the police are called and they know he has a warrant for these crimes.
The guy is told to get on the ground, he doesn't. He's tased twice by two separate officers, and nothing. The guy starts walking to the car, opens the door as the cop is on his back yelling at him to stop. There's a knife in the door. He gets shot 7 times.
I get it, and understand why/how it happened. Police are trained to shoot to kill. (Whether that should be a part of new police reform is up for discussion) although in this case, the officer did what he's trained to do.
Respect authority. That never was going to happen given his past and the events that led up to the shooting.
I don't remember Marquette basketball players being upset when four Milwaukee Police officers were killed in 2018 and 2019.
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 11:18:56 PM
I won't ever understand how you can't understand that a guy with a previous warrant out for rape, disorderly conduct, and stealing a car is shot when the police are called and they know he has a warrant for these crimes.
The guy is told to get on the ground, he doesn't. He's tased twice by two separate officers, and nothing. The guy starts walking to the car, opens the door as the cop is on his back yelling at him to stop. There's a knife in the door. He gets shot 7 times.
I get it, and understand why/how it happened. Police are trained to shoot to kill. (Whether that should be a part of new police reform is up for discussion) although in this case, the officer did what he's trained to do.
Respect authority. That never was going to happen given his past and the events that led up to the shooting.
Ahh yes. The white people never profiled by police or stopped for their skin color blaming the guy shot 7 times in the back for not respecting authority.
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 11:18:56 PM
I won't ever understand how you can't understand that a guy with a previous warrant out for rape, disorderly conduct, and stealing a car is shot when the police are called and they know he has a warrant for these crimes.
The guy is told to get on the ground, he doesn't. He's tased twice by two separate officers, and nothing. The guy starts walking to the car, opens the door as the cop is on his back yelling at him to stop. There's a knife in the door. He gets shot 7 times.
I get it, and understand why/how it happened. Police are trained to shoot to kill. (Whether that should be a part of new police reform is up for discussion) although in this case, the officer did what he's trained to do.
Respect authority. That never was going to happen given his past and the events that led up to the shooting.
Bad take on respect authority. Read some threads from our white posters on tickets. Let alone things you can't put yourself into their shoes for.
Good take on the summary of the situation and whether police should be retrained.
Question: is 7 times in the back a reasonable amount? That's a close range weapon and you have backup, you take two steps back and control the situation
Quote from: BLM on January 05, 2021, 10:28:44 PM
Hey FrennA, are you of the opinion that anyone with a criminal background should be shot 7 times in the back? Just making sure I have that right.
Frenn isn't arguing that. No one wanted that. But honor a rapist? Or maybe you don't have all the facts of the individual.
All lives matter, right BLM?
Quote from: BLM on January 05, 2021, 11:21:25 PM
Ahh yes. The white people never profiled by police or stopped for their skin color blaming the guy shot 7 times in the back for not respecting authority.
Wtf does that have to do with anything. Is what I said false? No.
Guy has a HISTORY of not listening, not following the law, violating a woman's human rights, in all sense a POS. He has a Warrant. That means there's a legal piece of paper for law environment to take him to jail for a cause. Did he rape a female because he's black? Is that her fault too? Tool.
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 11:27:57 PM
Wtf does that have to do with anything. Is what I said false? No.
Guy has a HISTORY of not listening, not following the law, violating a woman's human rights, in all sense a POS. He has a Warrant. That means there's a legal piece of paper for law environment to take him to jail for a cause. Did he rape a female because he's black? Is that her fault too? Tool.
For the record it was sexual assault for the warrant
Quote from: Galway Eagle on January 05, 2021, 11:22:53 PM
Bad take on respect authority. Read some threads from our white posters on tickets. Let alone things you can't put yourself into their shoes for.
Good take on the summary of the situation and whether police should be retrained.
Question: is 7 times in the back a reasonable amount? That's a close range weapon and you have backup, you take two steps back and control the situation
Of course sometimes cops can be a**holes when you get pulled over. Happened to me many times. Comparing getting a speeding ticket, and having a warrant and being a fugitive for rape is another story.
Cops are trained to shoot to kill, and that's what he did. If you want to argue we shouldn't do that, we can, but I can't agree that it was excessive given the guy wouldn't listen after being tased multiple times, and walked to a car, kidnapping kids, and grabbing a knife. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes
This is my last post on this. I'm not "meh" about him being shot. I'm seriously glad I wasn't put in that situation. But BLM, you sure seem to think highly of your ability to do better than that police officer. I on the other hand, from the safety of my home can't and won't judge that officer because I simply have never been in that situation. I wonder if he had complied if he would've been shot at all. Would it have been better if he was only shot once? What if that one shot was fatal? What if the officer did not shoot at all and Blake had a gun inside his van? What if Blake shot his kids? How is the officer to know if he is armed or not? What if Blake was able to shoot his kids because the cop didnt shoot him first. All I'm saying is stop acting like you would've done better when you have absolutely no clue and stop acting like Blake is innocent an appropriate model to use to point out racial injustice. Perhaps McClain is. Furthermore, I hear all this talk about police reform and I agree. However, how come I don't hear anything about citizen reform when dealing with police. Do what you're told, comply, and you'll get your day in court. For everyone of these Blake videos, there are several more where the police don't shoot but get shot first so cut the crap.
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 11:32:00 PM
Of course sometimes cops can be a**holes when you get pulled over. Happened to me many times. Comparing getting a speeding ticket, and having a warrant and being a fugitive for rape is another story.
Cops are trained to shoot to kill, and that's what he did. If you want to argue we shouldn't do that, we can, but I can't agree that it was excessive given the guy wouldn't listen after being tased multiple times, and walked to a car, kidnapping kids, and grabbing a knife. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes
You're right, we can debate a$$ hole cops all day lucky for us it's speeding not a counterfeit $20 bill or protecting their home from a seeming invasion
Again I agree with you he needed to be stopped. We can agree to disagree on the use of force though if the teams support was purely against the, in their opinion, excessive use of force would you be so against it? That being said old adages don't really help, we've all done stupid things and haven't won "stupid prizes" hell I once got attacked outside of caffs and hit an MPD officer square didn't get charged.
OT:
Lots of good stuff on reform here:
https://twitter.com/radleybalko/status/1346658745611415552?s=19
Quote from: FrennA on January 05, 2021, 11:34:06 PM
This is my last post on this. I'm not "meh" about him being shot. I'm seriously glad I wasn't put in that situation. But BLM, you sure seem to think highly of your ability to do better than that police officer. I on the other hand, from the safety of my home can't and won't judge that officer because I simply have never been in that situation. I wonder if he had complied if he would've been shot at all. Would it have been better if he was only shot once? What if that one shot was fatal? What if the officer did not shoot at all and Blake had a gun inside his van? What if Blake shot his kids? How is the officer to know if he is armed or not? What if Blake was able to shoot his kids because the cop didnt shoot him first. All I'm saying is stop acting like you would've done better when you have absolutely no clue and stop acting like Blake is innocent an appropriate model to use to point out racial injustice. Perhaps McClain is. Furthermore, I hear all this talk about police reform and I agree. However, how come I don't hear anything about citizen reform when dealing with police. Do what you're told, comply, and you'll get your day in court. For everyone of these Blake videos, there are several more where the police don't shoot but get shot first so cut the crap.
Again. White people who have never been profiled or pulled over because they have a certain skin tone telling people to comply with authority is ridiculous.
Nobody is holding Blake up as a model citizen. Being less than a model citizen shouldn't be reason to open fire on someone (who has their back to you, no less).
BLM is an obvious proud boy troll. Really top notch work. No one could possibly be this ignorant, dense, racist, and antagonizing. How many of you find yourself disagreeing so passionately with the ridiculous arguments he or she puts forth that you are beginning to question the merit of the BLM movement? Precisely. Bravo BLM.
Damn it BLM.....this is why I don't post....it never stops. Ok, this is my last post. Ridiculous? Ok you're right. Thanks for assuming my skin tone and previous experiences with police or others carrying. You know who I blame for Blake being paralyzed? You. Absolutely you. People like you who think complying with a person (police), carrying a lethal weapon, is "ridiculous". Keep telling people that complying with someone carrying a gun is ridiculous. I'll keep that in mind next time I get pulled over by police or held up by someone on State and 17th demanding my wallet. I'll think to myself, don't comply, BLM said it's ridiculous to do so. Plus, this can't be happening.....white people never come face to face with someone carrying a gun..... police or not. You and the dangerous non-sense you spew get people hurt and killed.
Teach your children - no matter how old - that the most dangerous thing that is likely to happen to them is an encounter with an armed person. Whether they are black or white or brown doesn't matter, and whether the armed person is a cop doesn't matter. If the armed person is a cop, they should be even more careful because the cops have a massive system of unions and lawyers and politicians behind them to keep them "above the law".
There are many countries where nobody has guns. Not the criminals, not the police... only the military.
It's a better situation.
Quote from: FrennA on January 05, 2021, 11:57:09 PM
Damn it BLM.....this is why I don't post....it never stops. Ok, this is my last post. Ridiculous? Ok you're right. Thanks for assuming my skin tone and previous experiences with police or others carrying. You know who I blame for Blake being paralyzed? You. Absolutely you. People like you who think complying with a person (police), carrying a lethal weapon, is "ridiculous". Keep telling people that complying with someone carrying a gun is ridiculous. I'll keep that in mind next time I get pulled over by police or held up by someone on State and 17th demanding my wallet. I'll think to myself, don't comply, BLM said it's ridiculous to do so. Plus, this can't be happening.....white people never come face to face with someone carrying a gun..... police or not. You and the dangerous non-sense you spew get people hurt and killed.
Well this is just filled with inaccuracy. I don't get along with wades/BLM but this is a lot of hyperbole and false equivalency.
Quote from: Galway Eagle on January 06, 2021, 12:00:04 AM
Well this is just filled with inaccuracy. I don't get along with wades/BLM but this is a lot of hyperbole and false equivalency.
That's just like your opinion man
I think the discussion here is missing that the DA did show evidence that he was armed with a knife ! ! ! And Police are trained to neutralize the "threat", and according to DA the "threat" continued after he was even tased and until he was shot 7x...
Quote from: guzica on January 06, 2021, 12:02:52 AM
I think the discussion here is missing that the DA did show evidence that he was armed with a knife ! ! ! And Police are trained to neutralize the "threat", and according to DA the "threat" continued after he was even tased and until he was shot 7x...
To be fair did you watch the video? He didn't exactly shoot him, check if he's still threatening, and repeat 6x...
Quote from: GLlanas on January 06, 2021, 12:01:25 AM
That's just like your opinion man
I mean parlor wouldn't correct the opinion I replied to.
One of the prevalent problems we have on these important national issues is making uninformed decisions. I wonder how many players/coaches/staff actually took the time to read Wray's exhaustive investigatory report? Many on this board refer to Blake as being "unarmed." The police, civilian witnesses, and Blake himself acknowledge he had a knife in his hand. Wray's resume is quite impressive re his involvement in police reforms. Relying on social media alone to form an opinion is ignorant. Spend time to review the facts coming from those who were on the scene. Read Supreme Court decisions that discuss the standards to be used when examining particular cases. If you can honestly say that you have educated yourself on the specific facts/evidence to form your opinion instead of just relying on superficial accounts via social media, then go ahead and speak your mind.
My difficulty is that the Marquette administration, I assume, allowed a school program/organization to use itself as a platform, under the school's name, to render a statement that undoubtedly would be met with reasonable criticism. Obviously, every player is entitled to have an opinion and such can be expressed as a personal opinion. But when such opinion is channeled via a university sponsored program, Marquette has a responsibility, as a institution of higher learning, to ensure such a statement is carefully worded & based on facts.
Quote from: Warrior84 on January 06, 2021, 12:13:29 AM
One of the prevalent problems we have on these important national issues is making uninformed decisions. I wonder how many players/coaches/staff actually took the time to read Wray's exhaustive investigatory report? Many on this board refer to Blake as being "unarmed." The police, civilian witnesses, and Blake himself acknowledge he had a knife in his hand. Wray's resume is quite impressive re his involvement in police reforms. Relying on social media alone to form an opinion is ignorant. Spend time to review the facts coming from those who were on the scene. Read Supreme Court decisions that discuss the standards to be used when examining particular cases. If you can honestly say that you have educated yourself on the specific facts/evidence to form your opinion instead of just relying on superficial accounts via social media, then go ahead and speak your mind.
My difficulty is that the Marquette administration, I assume, allowed a school program/organization to use itself as a platform, under the school's name, to render a statement that undoubtedly would be met with reasonable criticism. Obviously, every player is entitled to have an opinion and such can be expressed as a personal opinion. But when such opinion is channeled via a university sponsored program, Marquette has a responsibility, as a institution of higher learning, to ensure such a statement is carefully worded & based on facts.
+1
Quote from: Warrior84 on January 06, 2021, 12:13:29 AM
Wray's resume is quite impressive re his involvement in police reforms. Relying on social media alone to form an opinion is ignorant. Spend time to review the facts coming from those who were on the scene.
I did read some more on it after posting tonight, and it appears Wray is saying it would be difficult to impossible to bring charges, and that finding witnesses would be a problem. That's probably a reasonable reason not to bring charges.
It's also reasonable to be disappointed in that decision. It may be the right decision for legal reasons, but it's certainly doesn't help address the likelihood that the Kenosha officers probably didn't handle this correctly, and they also don't have cameras or procedures in place to "protect" the people they're supposed to protect and serve. Though some of that restitution may come in the civil case.
Quote from: Warrior84 on January 06, 2021, 12:13:29 AM
One of the prevalent problems we have on these important national issues is making uninformed decisions. I wonder how many players/coaches/staff actually took the time to read Wray's exhaustive investigatory report? Many on this board refer to Blake as being "unarmed." The police, civilian witnesses, and Blake himself acknowledge he had a knife in his hand. Wray's resume is quite impressive re his involvement in police reforms. Relying on social media alone to form an opinion is ignorant. Spend time to review the facts coming from those who were on the scene. Read Supreme Court decisions that discuss the standards to be used when examining particular cases. If you can honestly say that you have educated yourself on the specific facts/evidence to form your opinion instead of just relying on superficial accounts via social media, then go ahead and speak your mind.
My difficulty is that the Marquette administration, I assume, allowed a school program/organization to use itself as a platform, under the school's name, to render a statement that undoubtedly would be met with reasonable criticism. Obviously, every player is entitled to have an opinion and such can be expressed as a personal opinion. But when such opinion is channeled via a university sponsored program, Marquette has a responsibility, as a institution of higher learning, to ensure such a statement is carefully worded & based on facts.
Your words are violence, and I need them silenced! Cold-blooded logic
"We are about change. If you can't support us here I ask you Please don't support us on the court."
I will comply with Theo John's request.
That said, I wish him no ill will and hope for the best for him and his teammates.
Quote from: Warrior84 on January 06, 2021, 12:13:29 AM
One of the prevalent problems we have on these important national issues is making uninformed decisions. I wonder how many players/coaches/staff actually took the time to read Wray's exhaustive investigatory report? Many on this board refer to Blake as being "unarmed." The police, civilian witnesses, and Blake himself acknowledge he had a knife in his hand. Wray's resume is quite impressive re his involvement in police reforms. Relying on social media alone to form an opinion is ignorant. Spend time to review the facts coming from those who were on the scene. Read Supreme Court decisions that discuss the standards to be used when examining particular cases. If you can honestly say that you have educated yourself on the specific facts/evidence to form your opinion instead of just relying on superficial accounts via social media, then go ahead and speak your mind.
My difficulty is that the Marquette administration, I assume, allowed a school program/organization to use itself as a platform, under the school's name, to render a statement that undoubtedly would be met with reasonable criticism. Obviously, every player is entitled to have an opinion and such can be expressed as a personal opinion. But when such opinion is channeled via a university sponsored program, Marquette has a responsibility, as a institution of higher learning, to ensure such a statement is carefully worded & based on facts.
The university allowed the program, under its name, to take a stand against injustices in our society today. A group of mostly African American kids stood up against police brutality against mostly African Americans in America. I'm guessing the university is fine with those who feel this is controversial or worthy of criticizing losing interest in the school or the program. And they should be. Marquette is about being the difference. Not conforming because that's just how things have always been.
Quote from: coffee cup on January 06, 2021, 04:58:47 AM
"We are about change. If you can't support us here I ask you Please don't support us on the court."
I will comply with Theo John's request.
That said, I wish him no ill will and hope for the best for him and his teammates.
I'm sure Theo will take back his sentiment so you don't leave.
If only people would simply comply with authority there would never be police brutality.
https://youtu.be/oLiwQ5uVECY
You could find thousands of examples. But hey. Just comply with authority guys.
Quote from: BLM on January 06, 2021, 06:52:26 AM
If only people would simply comply with authority there would never be police brutality.
https://youtu.be/oLiwQ5uVECY
You could find thousands of examples. But hey. Just comply with authority guys.
What we should demand, as a starting point, are better trained police officers. Police officers who understand what Brother BLM is speaking about. Police officers who appreciate the history between the African-American community and local authorities. Police officers, who when threatened with a knife, don't keep firing after disabling a threat to them.
We really want police officers who don't burst into the wrong house and denigrate the resident. Or police officers who or kill someone without cause.
I think we're all in agreement that there are problems between police officers and the communities they supposedly protect. That's a recurring theme here. So now, how do you fix it? From Marquette's standpoint, what are they doing in their Criminal Justice department, Law School and Social Work schools to train tomorrow's police officers? How's the training and focus different than 10 years ago?
That's probably where I'd start rather than using an unfocused basketball team as a mouthpiece for the university.
Quote from: dgies9156 on January 06, 2021, 07:20:14 AM
What we should demand, as a starting point, are better trained police officers. Police officers who understand what Brother BLM is speaking about. Police officers who appreciate the history between the African-American community and local authorities. Police officers, who when threatened with a knife, don't keep firing after disabling a threat to them.
We really want police officers who don't burst into the wrong house and denigrate the resident. Or police officers who or kill someone without cause.
I think we're all in agreement that there are problems between police officers and the communities they supposedly protect. That's a recurring theme here. So now, how do you fix it? From Marquette's standpoint, what are they doing in their Criminal Justice department, Law School and Social Work schools to train tomorrow's police officers? How's the training and focus different than 10 years ago?
That's probably where I'd start rather than using an unfocused basketball team as a mouthpiece for the university.
With all do respect, the police training excuse is nonsense. It's police union lawyer bull.
And what does " unfocused" team mean?
Anyone who shoots a guy with a knife in the back, who "shoots" to kill, is a coward. That's what we want, a police force of fearful bullies? If we are in a firefight I'd kill you in a nanosecond and have no problem.
I don't understand shoot to kill in your back.
Rid the police of bullies and thugs, demilitarize the police. Get rid of the dogs, horses, tanks, and pyrotechnics. Use fire tactics, surround it and drown it.
That's it for me, it's bad for my blood pressure. People who need guns to be a man are pathetic.
Killings for Head Coach .
Quote from: vogue65 on January 06, 2021, 07:31:23 AM
With all do redpect, the police training excuse is nonsence.
Then, with appropriate respect, what do you propose we do?
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on January 05, 2021, 10:34:04 PM
Let's see Wades...wanted felon when it happened, resisting arrest, multiple taser attempts didn't subdue him, armed with a knife, kids in van he did not have full custody over and threatening to take off with them.
How about that, missed a few details. Well, there's a first time for everything.
Obviously he deserved it then. Good to know where you stand.
Quote from: dgies9156 on January 06, 2021, 07:48:15 AM
Then, with appropriate respect, what do you propose we do?
Hire real men/women, not fearful bullies and thugs.
Demilitarize.
Outlaw shooting anyone in the back.
Get rid of police unions. I'm pro union, I was a member of the UAW while at Marquette, Allis Chalmers.
Get rid of the blue line, the fraternity of bullies, the FOP. (Fraternal Order of Police)
It's not the training its the tactics that need change. Poor training is just an excuse, its bad apple police officers that is the problem and their supporters.
With all due respect, read the rest of my post.
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on January 05, 2021, 11:18:56 PM
I won't ever understand how you can't understand that a guy with a previous warrant out for rape, disorderly conduct, and stealing a car is shot when the police are called and they know he has a warrant for these crimes.
The guy is told to get on the ground, he doesn't. He's tased twice by two separate officers, and nothing. The guy starts walking to the car, opens the door as the cop is on his back yelling at him to stop. There's a knife in the door. He gets shot 7 times.
I get it, and understand why/how it happened. Police are trained to shoot to kill. (Whether that should be a part of new police reform is up for discussion) although in this case, the officer did what he's trained to do.
Respect authority. That never was going to happen given his past and the events that led up to the shooting.
Obviously you think he deserved it. Probably the only reason he is alive because the officer cared so deeply for him that he left him paralyzed instead.
Quote from: ski44 on January 05, 2021, 11:19:38 PM
I don't remember Marquette basketball players being upset when four Milwaukee Police officers were killed in 2018 and 2019.
Ah yes. Because if one can't be upset at ALL injustices, they can't be upset at any.
Just another stupid talking point from stupid people.
"I'm sure Theo will take back his sentiment so you don't leave."
He seems like a man of strong convictions in this matter so I doubt it.
Regardless, again, I wish him and his teammates well.
The reason prosecuters do what they do is that they live in the community.
Many are elected officials and have to do what the people want, to hell with justice or the law.
That is why we need federal oversight.
Not sure this has been posted ..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6m0CRt0_vYg
It's the nearly 2 hour press conference from the Kenosha County DA that painstakingly lays out the evidence and how they arrived at a charging decision.
It is the definitive set of information, and if one has doubts about the case, one needs to watch it before trying to argue.
Topper, I agree after watching the news that the officer should not have been charged. I think the DA laid out a really good case for why.
However that doesn't mean he handled it well. And it most certainly doesn't mean that MU shouldn't wear black in support.
Quote from: vogue65 on January 06, 2021, 07:31:23 AM
With all do respect, the police training excuse is nonsense. It's police union lawyer bull.
And what does " unfocused" team mean?
Anyone who shoots a guy with a knife in the back, who "shoots" to kill, is a coward. That's what we want, a police force of fearful bullies? If we are in a firefight I'd kill you in a nanosecond and have no problem.
I don't understand shoot to kill in your back.
Rid the police of bullies and thugs, demilitarize the police. Get rid of the dogs, horses, tanks, and pyrotechnics. Use fire tactics, surround it and drown it.
That's it for me, it's bad for my blood pressure. People who need guns to be a man are pathetic.
First of all, we're largely in agreement. The machismo culture that pervades most police departments needs to go. I agree, how many police departments need tanks, heavy arms hand grenades and a host of other weapons better suited for a battlefield than an American neighborhood. Dogs are for loving and hunting, not intimidating.
Second, we need better gun laws. We really do. Part of the reason for the arms race with police departments and undoubtedly part of the problems we're having between police and communities is the militarization of American society. When, here in Florida, it's easier to get a concealed carry permit than a driver's license, we know we have problems. Police, naturally, fear for their lives when they come in contact with the public because too many of us are armed. We really need to dial back the number of firearms in this country. Of course, the chances of that happening are close to zero.
Third, while I agree that we need to hold police accountable, to remove the "thugs" and "bullies" is easier said than done. For one thing, the police are unionized public employees. In today's world, American public employee unions are among the most power trade unions in the world. Breaking the Fraternal Order of Police is about as easy as, say, Vanderbilt being in the football national championship. I suppose it's possible, but....
Also, how do you define "thug" and "bully". This isn't porn where, "you know it when you see it." You must have an objective and quantifiable standard. It's easy to identify the officers in the Laquon McDonald incident and terminate them. Same for George Floyd. But on a day-to-day basis, setting standards for what you want in a police department begins with recruitment (i.e., college grads) and training. That isn't easy because society has conflicting expectations for what is desired in a police officer.
Ultimately, the police officer is the first line of social worker in a community. Police officers maintain order, mediate disputes, protect victims and potential victims and preserve the rights of all of us.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 06, 2021, 08:09:02 AM
Topper, I agree after watching the news that the officer should not have been charged. I think the DA laid out a really good case for why.
However that doesn't mean he handled it well. And it most certainly doesn't mean that MU shouldn't wear black in support.
The police officer should not be a police officer, the "case" his union made notwithstanding.
I would not like to have anything to do with him. His not being charged has nothing to do with it.
Not being charged does not make him a goid person. Winning a case does not make him a stand up person.
Quote from: dgies9156 on January 06, 2021, 08:13:33 AM
First of all, we're largely in agreement. The machismo culture that pervades most police departments needs to go. I agree, how many police departments need tanks, heavy arms hand grenades and a host of other weapons better suited for a battlefield than an American neighborhood. Dogs are for loving and hunting, not intimidating.
Second, we need better gun laws. We really do. Part of the reason for the arms race with police departments and undoubtedly part of the problems we're having between police and communities is the militarization of American society. When, here in Florida, it's easier to get a concealed carry permit than a driver's license, we know we have problems. Police, naturally, fear for their lives when they come in contact with the public because too many of us are armed. We really need to dial back the number of firearms in this country. Of course, the chances of that happening are close to zero.
Third, while I agree that we need to hold police accountable, to remove the "thugs" and "bullies" is easier said than done. For one thing, the police are unionized public employees. In today's world, American public employee unions are among the most power trade unions in the world. Breaking the Fraternal Order of Police is about as easy as, say, Vanderbilt being in the football national championship. I suppose it's possible, but....
Also, how do you define "thug" and "bully". This isn't porn where, "you know it when you see it." You must have an objective and quantifiable standard. It's easy to identify the officers in the Laquon McDonald incident and terminate them. Same for George Floyd. But on a day-to-day basis, setting standards for what you want in a police department begins with recruitment (i.e., college grads) and training. That isn't easy because society has conflicting expectations for what is desired in a police officer.
Ultimately, the police officer is the first line of social worker in a community. Police officers maintain order, mediate disputes, protect victims and potential victims and preserve the rights of all of us.
WRONG, we are totally in agreement.
All I can add is that federal oversight of police departments is a start.
The Defence Department giving equipment to local police departments can be stopped.
The equipment should be demilitarized and junked. Some equipment is demilitarized.
It all started after 9-11 with the concern about the perceived terrorist threat. The government was really concerned about a possible insurrection. Giving away equipment and training because of Al Qaeda was just an excuse.
You may know the armories are not for "training" they are to keerp the population in line. Now we have local militias doing their thing. Nice having the armories around, we may need them again.
The military equipment should stay in the armories.
Watching the talking heads on TV .. and posters here .. you can immediately tell who has watched the press conference and who has not.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on January 06, 2021, 08:38:26 AM
Watching the talking heads on TV .. and posters here .. you can immediately tell who has watched the press conference and who has not.
Kenosha is a symptomatic.
One decision is not the problem.
The problem is systemic.
I don't need to read one particular case as good or bad it might be.
One press conference does not reflect a trend.
The trend has been that unarmed people are being shot in the back.
Overwhelmingly they are black people. Hay Houston, we have a problem.
BLM the data doesn't affirm your statements. Police actually shoot more white perps and more unarmed whites than blacks per FBI figures.
Wondering where the compassion is for the woman raped and her traumatized children; the real victims in this story.
Quote from: vogue65 on January 06, 2021, 08:43:45 AM
Kenosha is a symptomatic.
One decision is not the problem.
The problem is systemic.
I don't need to read one particular case as good or bad it might be.
One press conference does not reflect a trend.
The trend has been that unarmed people are being shot in the back.
Overwhelmingly they are black people. Hay Houston, we have a problem.
IOW, don't confuse me with the facts.
I'd rather make some phony ones up to fit my preferred narrative.
Shake my head when I see BLM on the Marquette uniforms. It's a Marxist terrorist organization. All lives matter.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 06, 2021, 08:09:02 AM
Topper, I agree after watching the news that the officer should not have been charged. I think the DA laid out a really good case for why.
However that doesn't mean he handled it well. And it most certainly doesn't mean that MU shouldn't wear black in support.
Wearing black in support of police reform, Kenosha and its community, social justice and for equality is a much different message than wearing black "in support" of Jacob Blake - which was the leading and introductory line of last night's communication from the players, the program and the university.
Both things can be true: the arrest and detainment of Mr. Blake could have better (while the officer legally did nothing wrong); the communication and messaging behind the intent from MUBB last night could have also been better.
How dare you utter such thoughts. Soon you will be sent to the re-education community to get your thoughts manipulated.
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on January 06, 2021, 09:51:24 AM
BLM the data doesn't affirm your statements. Police actually shoot more white perps and more unarmed whites than blacks per FBI figures.
Wondering where the compassion is for the woman raped and her traumatized children; the real victims in this story.
Let's say we're at a party where 7/10 people have blonde hair 3/10 are dark haired and police show up. They ticket 4 of the blondes and ticket all three of the dark hair. Which group is worse effected? Every brown haired person is effected and would believe they were profiled while some blondes got to walk away free. The hard number is worse for blondes though. This is essentially what you're arguing which while factually true ignores the percentages.
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on January 06, 2021, 09:51:24 AM
BLM the data doesn't affirm your statements. Police actually shoot more white perps and more unarmed whites than blacks per FBI figures.
Wondering where the compassion is for the woman raped and her traumatized children; the real victims in this story.
You are right. Black people are actually treated more justly by law enforcement. ::)
I honestly wonder what rock some people live under. Just crazy stuff that is said around here.
The good news is that justice was being sought for the rape victim, given that the police were aware of this and, apparently, very fearful of this man. Probably should've had more backup, and probably should've been positioned to prevent him from getting to his car in the first place if they were so worried about the kidnapping of the kdis in the car.
Justice is rarely ever sought after for victims of police brutality.
Lot of threatened white guys in here.
I would hope Wojo has Noble Wray in to speak to the team and provide some perspective on this investigation and policing in general. Wray did a lot of good work within Obama's DOJ and I think it would be a valuable session for everyone involved.
I don't begrudge MU for standing up like they have; there are many times where police have crossed the line. There are also times where that line is gray. And IMO, there are times where they didn't cross the line but that doesn't mean the line is correct.
Quote from: vogue65 on January 06, 2021, 08:43:45 AM
Kenosha is a symptomatic.
One decision is not the problem.
The problem is systemic.
I don't need to read one particular case as good or bad it might be.
One press conference does not reflect a trend.
The trend has been that unarmed people are being shot in the back.
Overwhelmingly they are black people. Hay Houston, we have a problem.
This is factually untrue.
Quote from: The Lens on January 06, 2021, 10:58:27 AM
I would hope Wojo has Noble Wray in to speak to the team and provide some perspective on this investigation and policing in general. Wray did a lot of good work within Obama's DOJ and I think it would be a valuable session for everyone involved.
I don't begrudge MU for standing up like they have; there are many times where police have crossed the line. There are also times where that line is gray. And IMO, there are times where they didn't cross the line but that doesn't mean the line is correct.
+1 this the lens to look at this through (
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on January 06, 2021, 08:06:09 AM
Not sure this has been posted ..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6m0CRt0_vYg
It's the nearly 2 hour press conference from the Kenosha County DA that painstakingly lays out the evidence and how they arrived at a charging decision.
It is the definitive set of information, and if one has doubts about the case, one needs to watch it before trying to argue.
Thanks for sharing. It was interesting to get the facts behind the decision.
As Fluffy has atoned to, the title of this thread didn't fully capture the statement by the team. Injustice is often not 100% right or wrong. A guilty person can be treated as unjustly as an innocent one. Blake can be guilty of his crimes, but still be treated unjustly. If we support injustice for even the guiltiest of persons, we all have lost as a democracy.
A Jesuit education teaches us to challenge all injustices, including those by its own hand. Be the Difference. The team simply chose to wear a uniform and have a reflection. While we may or may not 100% support their statement, we all should support their position. We are all better for their action, and all MU alumni should be proud. This is what we were taught. This is how we should live our lives.
We can all continue to bloviate mindlessly on a message board to no effect, or we can go out and "be the difference" as our team did last night.
Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on January 06, 2021, 11:25:02 AM
As Fluffy has atoned to, the title of this thread didn't fully capture the statement by the team. Injustice is often not 100% right or wrong. A guilty person can be treated as unjustly as an innocent one. Blake can be guilty of his crimes, but still be treated unjustly. If we support injustice for even the guiltiest of persons, we all have lost as a democracy.
A Jesuit education teaches us to challenge all injustices, including those by its own hand. Be the Difference. The team simply chose to wear a uniform and have a reflection. While we may or may not 100% support their statement, we all should support their position. We are all better for their action, and all MU alumni should be proud. This is what we were taught. This is how we should live our lives.
We can all continue to bloviate mindlessly on a message board to no effect, or we can go out and "be the difference" as our team did last night.
Beautifully said.
Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on January 06, 2021, 11:25:02 AM
As Fluffy has atoned to, the title of this thread didn't fully capture the statement by the team. Injustice is often not 100% right or wrong. A guilty person can be treated as unjustly as an innocent one. Blake can be guilty of his crimes, but still be treated unjustly. If we support injustice for even the guiltiest of persons, we all have lost as a democracy.
A Jesuit education teaches us to challenge all injustices, including those by its own hand. Be the Difference. The team simply chose to wear a uniform and have a reflection. While we may or may not 100% support their statement, we all should support their position. We are all better for their action, and all MU alumni should be proud. This is what we were taught. This is how we should live our lives.
We can all continue to bloviate mindlessly on a message board to no effect, or we can go out and "be the difference" as our team did last night.
Spot on.
The idea that this man was a victim of injustice is not something that I will accept. As the mother of a police officer, I am dismayed by the effect that this is having on the majority good police officers and their work. I would challenge those who are making their decisions based on a brief video without factual information to put themselves in the position of the officer. Watch the video with The results of the investigation by Noble Wray a well respected black former police chief. Now put yourself as an officer in situations where someone has a knife or a gun or approaching a vehicle for a "routine" traffic stop. Do you second guess what you should be doing to protect yourself and others? Are your thoughts with those officers whose lives were destroyed (officer in Ferguson who was exonerated by Obama's justice department) when they did what they should and think twice before reacting.
My son is a MU graduate who was educated in Jesuit teaching and values and I have never seen his morale so low. I for one am NOT proud of my university for that statement.
A civilan oversight review board is necessary to get justice, not a prosecutor, no matter how noble he or she may be.
The review board has to look for paterns of behavior because bad apples always have a track record.
Very hard to believe that the shoot first guys don't have a track record.
Someone asked me how I can identify a bully or a thug.
My answer is by a patern of behavior.
One could probably ask the officers on a legitimate force who were the bullies and thugs and get them identified.
Again, patern of behavior and identification by peer review. Not so difficult.
Now we have cameras, but we are asked to disbelieve our lying eyes.
If a police officer doesn't want to be held accountable, if a community doesn't want civilian oversight there is nothing I can say. A lot of things are legal, but unethical.
I have been called a lyar, thanks.
Just one question. Who fights against oversight? The victims? I think not.
Quote from: warriormom on January 06, 2021, 12:23:31 PM
The idea that this man was a victim of injustice is not something that I will accept. As the mother of a police officer, I am dismayed by the effect that this is having on the majority good police officers and their work. I would challenge those who are making their decisions based on a brief video without factual information to put themselves in the position of the officer. Watch the video with The results of the investigation by Noble Wray a well respected black former police chief. Now put yourself as an officer in situations where someone has a knife or a gun or approaching a vehicle for a "routine" traffic stop. Do you second guess what you should be doing to protect yourself and others? Are your thoughts with those officers whose lives were destroyed (officer in Ferguson who was exonerated by Obama's justice department) when they did what they should and think twice before reacting.
My son is a MU graduate who was educated in Jesuit teaching and values and I have never seen his morale so low. I for one am NOT proud of my university for that statement.
I would have more sympathy for statements like this if more officers themselves spoke out against bad actors in their own ranks.
Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on January 06, 2021, 11:25:02 AM
As Fluffy has atoned to, the title of this thread didn't fully capture the statement by the team. Injustice is often not 100% right or wrong. A guilty person can be treated as unjustly as an innocent one. Blake can be guilty of his crimes, but still be treated unjustly. If we support injustice for even the guiltiest of persons, we all have lost as a democracy.
A Jesuit education teaches us to challenge all injustices, including those by its own hand. Be the Difference. The team simply chose to wear a uniform and have a reflection. While we may or may not 100% support their statement, we all should support their position. We are all better for their action, and all MU alumni should be proud. This is what we were taught. This is how we should live our lives.
We can all continue to bloviate mindlessly on a message board to no effect, or we can go out and "be the difference" as our team did last night.
Where is the line between injustice and appropriate action? Where I live, the local police brutality martyr shot two individuals then rushed the police officer on the scene while pointing a loaded gun at him. Was it an injustice for that officer to shoot the individual rushing him?
The two incidents which happened last month in Columbus were an injustice. What happened to George Floyd was an injustice. Amadu Diallo was a tremendous injustice. Jacob Blake? I'm not seeing it. We had access to a 30 second cell phone video, not all of the evidence.
Quote from: vogue65 on January 06, 2021, 12:25:29 PM
A civilan oversight review board is necessary to get justice, not a prosecutor, no matter how noble he or she may be.
Can you explain that? Why would a civilian board succeed where a prosecutor would fail?
Quote from: warriormom on January 06, 2021, 12:23:31 PM
The idea that this man was a victim of injustice is not something that I will accept. As the mother of a police officer, I am dismayed by the effect that this is having on the majority good police officers and their work. I would challenge those who are making their decisions based on a brief video without factual information to put themselves in the position of the officer. Watch the video with The results of the investigation by Noble Wray a well respected black former police chief. Now put yourself as an officer in situations where someone has a knife or a gun or approaching a vehicle for a "routine" traffic stop. Do you second guess what you should be doing to protect yourself and others? Are your thoughts with those officers whose lives were destroyed (officer in Ferguson who was exonerated by Obama's justice department) when they did what they should and think twice before reacting.
My son is a MU graduate who was educated in Jesuit teaching and values and I have never seen his morale so low. I for one am NOT proud of my university for that statement.
Perhaps we should revisit trafic stops.
Years ago my town was out on an interstate, at night, raising money with traffic stops. Being real macho. They don't do that anymore. Life is none the worse for it.
The New Jersey State Police were racially profiling and conducting many traffic stops, they don't do it anymore. There was a consent decree involved.
Two or three officers in a car might help. In Italy you never see an officer on patrol by himself. The Lone Ranger even had Tonto.
The morale is irrevelant, sorry, the people being shot is the issue. The morale might be better if the police had a better relationship with the civilians. Hopefully the police can figure it out, they are the ones suffering along with the victims of their behavior.
All I know is that shooting unarmed civilians in the back, black or white civilians, is deplorable.
It may be legal, it may be justifiable in a court of law, it may be blamed on poor training, it may be defensible by the police union, but it is still unacceptable.
I can't for the life of me understand shooting an unarmed person.
Now, how about the laydown weapon.
How many police officers cary a laydown weapon? Forget it, we have enough to talk about.
Quote from: warriormom on January 06, 2021, 12:23:31 PM
The idea that this man was a victim of injustice is not something that I will accept. As the mother of a police officer
Is it possible you're too close to the police culture to be objective?
Quote from: warriormom on January 06, 2021, 12:23:31 PM
I am dismayed by the effect that this is having on the majority good police officers and their work. I would challenge those who are making their decisions based on a brief video without factual information to put themselves in the position of the officer.
Agreed, he was resisting, armed, warrant out, mom screaming he has my kids and my keys, etc.
Quote from: warriormom on January 06, 2021, 12:23:31 PM
Now put yourself as an officer in situations where someone has a knife or a gun or approaching a vehicle for a "routine" traffic stop. Do you second guess what you should be doing to protect yourself and others?
gun is irrelevant it did not happen in this case, you can argue it's merits of other cases but not this one. But you're right it's a stressful job and one I am not envious of. That being said they asked for the job they weren't drafted so I would expect/hope that training and general personality is one where calm and logical thinking prevail over skittish hotheads with explicit biases.
Quote from: warriormom on January 06, 2021, 12:23:31 PMare your thoughts with those officers whose lives were destroyed (officer in Ferguson who was exonerated by Obama's justice department) when they did what they should and think twice before reacting.
Some times yes, other times no, there's many times simple laws for police protection are what guard officers from being charged whether or not the actual actions would have made a normal individual charged. Are you telling me I should feel sympathy for Mattingly who's now suing Breonna Taylor's boyfriend because his trauma from being doxed? I don't think so.
Quote from: warriormom on January 06, 2021, 12:23:31 PMMy son is a MU graduate who was educated in Jesuit teaching and values and I have never seen his morale so low. I for one am NOT proud of my university for that statement.
I hope he's never put in a poor situation and that he can be part of proper police reform representing MU well.
Quote from: Billy Hoyle on January 06, 2021, 12:39:46 PM
Where is the line between injustice and appropriate action?
In this case I would say the line was about five or six shots in the back. Also the trailing a person within knife range then saying "I was threatened by a knife", when you're able to take two steps back and not be, is also a bit of overkill.
Remind me again why the second officer couldn't have shot right at the tires to prevent him from driving away? I know it's not movies but we're talking point blank range at a stopped vehicle where they chose to tail the guy by a foot instead of thinking "He's trying to drive away lets take that away from him"
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on January 06, 2021, 12:45:12 PM
Can you explain that? Why would a civilian board succeed where a prosecutor would fail?
Simple, patern of behavior.
An overly agressive or bigoted officer would have a record of complaints and thereby identified as a person unfit for the badge.
In my career I was accused as being anti-Semitic by a person who felt I was being unfair to him.
There was a hearing, the person who felt harmed had his say. People who knew me for a long time had there say. There was never another incident.
Now if it happened again, and again, or similar claims were made, I would have been and should have been removed. That is the difference between the prosecutor taking action based on one investigation and a system, behond the legal system but within our legal ststem, to clean up an organization.
In NYC, because of the union FOP, no past complaints can be presented at a trial. Records are sealed. Result is bad actors stay around.
I obviously don't know much about Wisconsin, but this problem, the shooting of unarmed people, is widespread. It must be corrected. Before video this has been going on for decades and remained under the radar.
Quote from: Galway Eagle on January 06, 2021, 12:57:25 PM
In this case I would say the line was about five or six shots in the back. Also the trailing a person within knife range then saying "I was threatened by a knife", when you're able to take two steps back and not be, is also a bit of overkill.
Remind me again why the second officer couldn't have shot right at the tires to prevent him from driving away? I know it's not movies but we're talking point blank range at a stopped vehicle where they chose to tail the guy by a foot instead of thinking "He's trying to drive away lets take that away from him"
They do it because they can.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on January 06, 2021, 12:45:12 PM
Can you explain that? Why would a civilian board succeed where a prosecutor would fail?
I answered your question below or above from this post. It somehow got bracketed, check it out, if you wish.
A problematic officer with a good lawyer could hang around for a long time and cause harm.
There are loopholes, technicalities, exceptions, mistakes, yada, yada, yada.
There are also paterns of behavior. Bullies and thugs don't change their stripes. One incident is usually not enough to spot them. Let me see the file on these guys, let me see the police green sheet on the police officer.
edit: not needed
Quote from: Stretchdeltsig on January 06, 2021, 10:01:47 AM
Shake my head when I see BLM on the Marquette uniforms. It's a Marxist terrorist organization. All lives matter.
Good to see you are going with the racist slogan. MU education didn't take, apparently.
Am I missing something?
Are you making me go downstairs to watch T.V.?
Believe nothing you hear, and only half that you see.
Quote from: vogue65 on January 06, 2021, 01:37:09 PM
Am I missing something?
Are you making me go downstairs to watch T.V.?
Believe nothing you hear, and only half that you see.
Capitol on lock down.
Morale is important. No they weren't drafted to do this job, but tell me how do you get quality individuals to do this job when they are vilified, judged and tried based upon social media video and "facts" that are immediately put out and then disproven but remain the narrative. Examples in this case: the officers didn't do anything before shooting, Blake was there to break up a neighborhood fight, he was returning to his vehicle just trying to kind his own business.
Google knife attacks against police to see horrific videos of police being attacked by knives
I would encourage those who don't have law enforcement experience to speak with a trained officer and discuss this case and others in regards to your concerns. It is eye opening
I am not naive enough to believe that there are no concerns with law enforcement. But the wholesale vilification which many do is uncalled for.
My ideas for reform (many which mean more money not less to police
1. Body cams for all police departments. Maybe need federal money for this
2. 2 man squads. Protects officers and the public
3. Improved training for training officers
4. Longer more extensive training. My son has a college degree and he gets the same training as a 19 year old former police aid.
5 physical fitness requirements for officers
6. Evaluations of incidents with all involved major and minor. On my hospital unit we identified incidents that had potential for bad outcomes as well as bad outcomes and we reviewed them as a team, giving lessons learned to those involved and not involved. As someone said patterns of behavior should and can be tracked and dealt with hopefully before tragic outcomes
7. Mental health care for officers. Most of us can't imagine what these officers have to deal with daily. And yes I know they signed up for the job. We want to keep them mentally healthy to perform it
8. Decrease the power of unions. I have no idea how you do this
edit: not needed
edit: not needed
Quote from: warriormom on January 06, 2021, 01:49:34 PM
But the wholesale vilification which many do is uncalled for.
I agree with your whole post except that part. I guess it depends on how you define "many", but there are very few, you could say "some" who are advocating wholesale vilification. I don't see anyone here saying that, nor "many" in the general public (using my definition of many).
My bad Rocky.
Hope you can forgive me :-X
Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on January 06, 2021, 11:25:02 AM
As Fluffy has atoned to, the title of this thread didn't fully capture the statement by the team. Injustice is often not 100% right or wrong. A guilty person can be treated as unjustly as an innocent one. Blake can be guilty of his crimes, but still be treated unjustly. If we support injustice for even the guiltiest of persons, we all have lost as a democracy.
A Jesuit education teaches us to challenge all injustices, including those by its own hand. Be the Difference. The team simply chose to wear a uniform and have a reflection. While we may or may not 100% support their statement, we all should support their position. We are all better for their action, and all MU alumni should be proud. This is what we were taught. This is how we should live our lives.
We can all continue to bloviate mindlessly on a message board to no effect, or we can go out and "be the difference" as our team did last night.
...The special uniform display just seems so contrived. Like taking a knee. Without creativity. Why didn't MU protest a Hispanic police chief getting unjustly fired in Milwaukee? Why hasn't MU condemned violence AGAINST police? Where is the organized protest against domestic violence, Mr. Lovell? Child sex trafficking? Crickets.
Should Blake have been shot in the back? No. Emphatically no. But there has to be a better way to go about bringing attention to a cause. With that, there should be consistency in seeking justice for ALL lives. Do police lives matter? How about innocent lives lost tonight on American streets due to gun violence? Where's the organized cause for them? Will MU wear a special uni in their honor? Black lives matter? Damn straight. Asian lives, Hispanic, Caucasian, and do on. ALL LIVES.
And if I might add a basketball comment...MU has the $ for a Wojo goodbye. No doubt about it.
I can't help but wonder what the crowds would be like at these games if fans were allowed in the arena -- More vocal/outspoken than usual? Smaller? Indifferent? I have to think that attendance will be taking a significant dip next season.
I just hope they don't wear brown in support of the attempted coup.
Quote from: Marq3332 on January 06, 2021, 05:59:15 PM
...The special uniform display just seems so contrived. Like taking a knee. Without creativity. Why didn't MU protest a Hispanic police chief getting unjustly fired in Milwaukee? Why hasn't MU condemned violence AGAINST police? Where is the organized protest against domestic violence, Mr. Lovell? Child sex trafficking? Crickets.
Should Blake have been shot in the back? No. Emphatically no. But there has to be a better way to go about bringing attention to a cause. With that, there should be consistency in seeking justice for ALL lives. Do police lives matter? How about innocent lives lost tonight on American streets due to gun violence? Where's the organized cause for them? Will MU wear a special uni in their honor? Black lives matter? Damn straight. Asian lives, Hispanic, Caucasian, and do on. ALL LIVES.
And if I might add a basketball comment...MU has the $ for a Wojo goodbye. No doubt about it.
Right. Because unless people protest EVERY injustice, they should be criticized for protesting one.
Very intellectually lazy on your part.
If you are anti-BLM but a Dwyane Wade fan, I would recommend NOT checking out his Twitter or Instagram accounts.
Quote from: Marq3332 on January 06, 2021, 05:59:15 PM
...The special uniform display just seems so contrived. Like taking a knee. Without creativity. Why didn't MU protest a Hispanic police chief getting unjustly fired in Milwaukee? Why hasn't MU condemned violence AGAINST police? Where is the organized protest against domestic violence, Mr. Lovell? Child sex trafficking? Crickets.
Should Blake have been shot in the back? No. Emphatically no. But there has to be a better way to go about bringing attention to a cause. With that, there should be consistency in seeking justice for ALL lives. Do police lives matter? How about innocent lives lost tonight on American streets due to gun violence? Where's the organized cause for them? Will MU wear a special uni in their honor? Black lives matter? Damn straight. Asian lives, Hispanic, Caucasian, and do on. ALL LIVES.
And if I might add a basketball comment...MU has the $ for a Wojo goodbye. No doubt about it.
The only one that might be relevant is the Hispanic mention due to Garcia and Perez. Everything else isn't relevant to young black men playing basketball... in Milwaukee where Kareem has mentioned racism and more recently sterling brown happened
It's funny those that are nojos, and vocal on every loss, are also anti-BLM. Strange how that works.
Quote from: We R Final Four on January 06, 2021, 07:23:25 PM
It's funny those that are nojos, and vocal on every loss, are also anti-BLM. Strange how that works.
So what is your point. That nojos are against anti nuclear family communists. Or tha Pro jos are communists?
Quote from: We R Final Four on January 06, 2021, 07:23:25 PM
It's funny those that are nojos, and vocal on every loss, are also anti-BLM. Strange how that works.
I disagree that there is causality there. There are far more anti Wojo's than anti BLM people.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on January 06, 2021, 08:06:09 AM
Not sure this has been posted ..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6m0CRt0_vYg
It's the nearly 2 hour press conference from the Kenosha County DA that painstakingly lays out the evidence and how they arrived at a charging decision.
It is the definitive set of information, and if one has doubts about the case, one needs to watch it before trying to argue.
Saw most of this in real time (preempting Jeopardy BTW) and agree the DA did a terrific job.
Quote from: Spaniel with a Short Tail on January 06, 2021, 08:28:26 PM
Saw most of this in real time (preempting Jeopardy BTW) and agree the DA did a terrific job.
Saw it as well. 30 second cellphone video or the mountains of documents and testimony, including testimony from Blake. What to believe...
Quote from: Billy Hoyle on January 07, 2021, 10:32:47 AM
Saw it as well. 30 second cellphone video or the mountains of documents and testimony, including testimony from Blake. What to believe...
I'll believe a black man was shot 7 times in the back by police.
But hey. Let's open up the gates to the Capitol building for all these white people! "When the looting starts, the shooting starts." He must have cut that short. "If you're black or in support of black people and equality in this country" would have made it accurate.
Quote from: warriormom on January 06, 2021, 01:49:34 PM
Morale is important. No they weren't drafted to do this job, but tell me how do you get quality individuals to do this job when they are vilified, judged and tried based upon social media video and "facts" that are immediately put out and then disproven but remain the narrative. Examples in this case: the officers didn't do anything before shooting, Blake was there to break up a neighborhood fight, he was returning to his vehicle just trying to kind his own business.
Google knife attacks against police to see horrific videos of police being attacked by knives
I would encourage those who don't have law enforcement experience to speak with a trained officer and discuss this case and others in regards to your concerns. It is eye opening
I am not naive enough to believe that there are no concerns with law enforcement. But the wholesale vilification which many do is uncalled for.
My ideas for reform (many which mean more money not less to police
1. Body cams for all police departments. Maybe need federal money for this
2. 2 man squads. Protects officers and the public
3. Improved training for training officers
4. Longer more extensive training. My son has a college degree and he gets the same training as a 19 year old former police aid.
5 physical fitness requirements for officers
6. Evaluations of incidents with all involved major and minor. On my hospital unit we identified incidents that had potential for bad outcomes as well as bad outcomes and we reviewed them as a team, giving lessons learned to those involved and not involved. As someone said patterns of behavior should and can be tracked and dealt with hopefully before tragic outcomes
7. Mental health care for officers. Most of us can't imagine what these officers have to deal with daily. And yes I know they signed up for the job. We want to keep them mentally healthy to perform it
8. Decrease the power of unions. I have no idea how you do this
Morale is important, but it is not my problem, shooting unarmed citizens in the back is the issue, not morale.
With all due respect, a claim to authority is illogical. That means my position before I retired, my educational institutions, my connections, my family and friends, my mother, are all irrevelant.
I like your list of police reform, I agree 100%, it is a great start. You being a health-care professional or the mother of a police afficer is unnecessary to sell your good ideas. Your good ideas stand on their own merit.
We could add to your list civilian review boards, Justice Department oversight, demilitarization,
expanded mental health services to include the family, annual suicide prevention training, come to mind off the top of my head.
The reason we need universal civilian review is because without it we have prosecutorial discretion. That is lawyer talk for, the fix is in.
Review Newark's policies if you want to see success. Their data is impressive
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 07, 2021, 11:31:35 AM
Review Newark's policies if you want to see success. Their data is impressive
Who would have thunk it. Yes, I'm familiar with it. They have come a long way.
Believe me, this is not my lane.
The patrol book is also superior.
A little in the weeds, but, effective policies and procedures are vitally important.
Now for my bias.
Most Midwest rube towns don't even have patrol standards, beyond shoot first then, eventually, call backup and an ambulance.
A little over the top, I know.
Quote from: Billy Hoyle on January 07, 2021, 10:32:47 AM
Saw it as well. 30 second cellphone video or the mountains of documents and testimony, including testimony from Blake. What to believe...
You do understand the difference between the ability to bring a case, vs the idea that everything was justified, no?
Quote from: rocky_warrior on January 07, 2021, 11:48:08 AM
You do understand the difference between the ability to bring a case, vs the idea that everything was justified, no?
Do you understand the difference between the ability to bring a case (prosecutorial discretion), vs. justice, ethics, human compasion?
The criminal justice system needs to be overhauled.
Policing policy and procedures need to be changed.
This is not my field. All I know is that the system is broken and the prosecutors, public defenders,
police chiefs and the courts have not been willing or able to fix it. Without corrective action and systemic change we will have more shootings, killings, and breakdowns in society.
Quote from: We R Final Four on January 06, 2021, 07:23:25 PM
It's funny those that are nojos, and vocal on every loss, are also anti-BLM. Strange how that works.
Because Wojo is black? How about the NoJos stumping for black coaches for his replacement?
Looking for racism where there is none does not help the cause, in fact it hurts it.
Oh well, it is your right to live in a world of stereotypes.
Quote from: vogue65 on January 07, 2021, 12:14:18 PM
Do you understand the difference between the ability to bring a case (prosecutorial discretion), vs. justice, ethics, human compasion?
Vogue - using my vogue to dummies translator I've determined we're in agreement (and saying the same thing).
Quote from: rocky_warrior on January 07, 2021, 12:21:37 PM
Vogue - using my vogue to dummies translator I've determined we're in agreement (and saying the same thing).
Ha, you're not the only one who needs to translate my thinking.
When I was shrunk at Wright Paterson the A.F. stood me up in front of the class as an example of something. It didn't help.
Yes, I know we agree on this one. Most people don't understand what goes on between the legal system and ethics and justice.
A Justice Department team once told me that some people want something like money and some people want justice, they want to prove a point. I got it.
Most people don't know how the system works and then they get a resentment.
Thanks.
Serious question - why wouldn't the team continue to wear black uniforms for the rest of the season (to support BLM and bring attention to social justice initiatives)? We could wear them at home on on road games (since majority of teams where white uniforms at home). If they wanted to mix up the lines/numbers on the jersey, they can rotate between the yellow and teal sets.
Let's just be honest - after the events yesterday - athletes' messaging and calls will only grow louder in sports in the near (and probably long) term.
Quote from: GoldenWarrior11 on January 07, 2021, 01:17:02 PM
Serious question - why wouldn't the team continue to wear black uniforms for the rest of the season (to support BLM and bring attention to social justice initiatives)? We could wear them at home on on road games (since majority of teams where white uniforms at home). If they wanted to mix up the lines/numbers on the jersey, they can rotate between the yellow and teal sets.
Let's just be honest - after the events yesterday - athletes' messaging and calls will only grow louder in sports in the near (and probably long) term.
Couldnt wear them against depaul and Providence
Quote from: We R Final Four on January 06, 2021, 07:23:25 PM
It's funny those that are nojos, and vocal on every loss, are also anti-BLM. Strange how that works.
Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa! I would wear a BLM tee shirt while driving Wojo to the airport. Let's stop generalizing. I want social justice for all and a of bunch of S16 runs.
I'm glad I have the fortitude to avoid these political discussions.
Quote from: BLM on January 07, 2021, 10:46:36 AM
I'll believe a black man was shot 7 times in the back by police.
But hey. Let's open up the gates to the Capitol building for all these white people! "When the looting starts, the shooting starts." He must have cut that short. "If you're black or in support of black people and equality in this country" would have made it accurate.
Two things that are unrelated. Virtue signal away!
Quote from: Billy Hoyle on January 07, 2021, 03:12:42 PM
Two things that are unrelated. Virtue signal away!
Not really. You're upset that the team wore black jerseys and kneeled for the National Anthem in a form of protest and named Jacob Blake as someone they stand with. Meanwhile, we're cool with police in DC letting white supremacists storm the Capitol.
Quote from: We R Final Four on January 06, 2021, 07:23:25 PM
It's funny those that are nojos, and vocal on every loss, are also anti-BLM. Strange how that works.
Also not how it works, because I'm not in favor of Wojo, but am definitely not anti-BLM.
Quote from: Jockey on January 07, 2021, 02:02:51 PM
I'm glad I have the fortitude to avoid these political discussions.
Good for you, Jockey!!
Quote from: warriormom on January 06, 2021, 01:49:34 PM
Morale is important. No they weren't drafted to do this job, but tell me how do you get quality individuals to do this job when they are vilified, judged and tried based upon social media video and "facts" that are immediately put out and then disproven but remain the narrative. Examples in this case: the officers didn't do anything before shooting, Blake was there to break up a neighborhood fight, he was returning to his vehicle just trying to kind his own business.
Google knife attacks against police to see horrific videos of police being attacked by knives
I would encourage those who don't have law enforcement experience to speak with a trained officer and discuss this case and others in regards to your concerns. It is eye opening
I am not naive enough to believe that there are no concerns with law enforcement. But the wholesale vilification which many do is uncalled for.
My ideas for reform (many which mean more money not less to police
1. Body cams for all police departments. Maybe need federal money for this
2. 2 man squads. Protects officers and the public
3. Improved training for training officers
4. Longer more extensive training. My son has a college degree and he gets the same training as a 19 year old former police aid.
5 physical fitness requirements for officers
6. Evaluations of incidents with all involved major and minor. On my hospital unit we identified incidents that had potential for bad outcomes as well as bad outcomes and we reviewed them as a team, giving lessons learned to those involved and not involved. As someone said patterns of behavior should and can be tracked and dealt with hopefully before tragic outcomes
7. Mental health care for officers. Most of us can't imagine what these officers have to deal with daily. And yes I know they signed up for the job. We want to keep them mentally healthy to perform it
8. Decrease the power of unions. I have no idea how you do this
Morale is important. When teacher unions got smashed and police kepth their unions I must have missed the police worrying about the teacher unions and teacher morale.
When the sheriff of Kenosha made extremely racist comments, I must have missed when fellow police stood up against him and said he was hurting the morale of people of color.
So I agree with much of what you suggest, and I know many great police officers, but I don't think you get to play the morale card. If you even think about going there, think about the morale of our black and brown youth.
The police love Trum and Trump has repeatedly stoked racial tensions and was clear in stating he loved those morons who took over the capitol at his request, and I must have missed the part where his supporters showed their love for police.
Perhaps someone can tell me when we have ever seen anything like this with protests involving people of color.
https://twitter.com/DanielNewman/status/1346941975237419009?s=09
I have a degree from MU and know many great priests...that said, the sexual assults by priests and the cover up doesn't have me worried about the morale of Catholics or priests.
Quote from: avid1010 on January 07, 2021, 07:45:28 PM
https://twitter.com/DanielNewman/status/1346941975237419009?s=09
That video is very suspect and I wish people would stop sharing it. There are already civilians behind the fence as you can see by the guy in sweats waving everyone on, and as the camera pans. For all we know, the police we escorting people out of the fenced off area. Like I said, more confusion that clarity from the short video.
Quote from: rocky_warrior on January 07, 2021, 09:11:05 PM
That video is very suspect and I wish people would stop sharing it. There are already civilians behind the fence as you can see by the guy in sweats waving everyone on, and as the camera pans. For all we know, the police we escorting people out of the fenced off area. Like I said, more confusion that clarity from the short video.
Can I share the video of the police officer taking selfies with the "protesters" inside the Capitol?
Quote from: BLM on January 07, 2021, 09:13:29 PM
Can I share the video of the police officer taking selfies with the "protesters" inside the Capitol?
You can share whatever you like, that particular (selfie) video seems to be disturbingly accurate.
Quote from: avid1010 on January 07, 2021, 07:45:28 PM
The police love Trum and Trump has repeatedly stoked racial tensions and was clear in stating he loved those morons who took over the capitol at his request, and I must have missed the part where his supporters showed their love for police.
Perhaps someone can tell me when we have ever seen anything like this with protests involving people of color.
https://twitter.com/DanielNewman/status/1346941975237419009?s=09
Have you been under a rock for four years? Trump's message was to rise everyone up . People of color did far better the last four than anytime in history that' swhy they voted for him in record numbers. His message to those listening was he wanted the people to benefit from America not just the politically connected.
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on January 07, 2021, 09:35:39 PM
Have you been under a rock for four years? Trump's message was to rise everyone up . People of color did far better the last four than anytime in history that' swhy they voted for him in record numbers. His message to those listening was he wanted the people to benefit from America not just the politically connected.
Lol. Yeah. Donald Trump. For America, baby.
Not seeing this being reported much nationally, but it looks like BLM militant (and leader of Insurgence USA) John Earle Sullivan was arrested in connection with the Capitol breaching. He was reportedly one of the only people to get video of the shooting yesterday. Wonder what that's all about.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CIesAjylQ8v/?igshid=qn1hdej0vq4d
Quote from: BLM on January 07, 2021, 09:13:29 PM
Can I share the video of the police officer taking selfies with the "protesters" inside the Capitol?
It was also very inspiring to see a cop holding the hand of a terrorist helping her down the Capitol steps. :-\
Gonna be a lot of stuff coming out about the cops and the Defense Department. The coup attempt didn't just materialize Wednesday morning.
Quote from: rocky_warrior on January 07, 2021, 09:11:05 PM
That video is very suspect and I wish people would stop sharing it. There are already civilians behind the fence as you can see by the guy in sweats waving everyone on, and as the camera pans. For all we know, the police we escorting people out of the fenced off area. Like I said, more confusion that clarity from the short video.
Clarity
https://twitter.com/justinjm1/status/1347174957613199360?s=19
Quote from: rocky_warrior on January 07, 2021, 09:11:05 PM
That video is very suspect and I wish people would stop sharing it. There are already civilians behind the fence as you can see by the guy in sweats waving everyone on, and as the camera pans. For all we know, the police we escorting people out of the fenced off area. Like I said, more confusion that clarity from the short video.
So let me explain that video to you, as I had it explained to me by a friend who is a retired black cop/detective. POLICE ARE TRAINED TO NEVER TURN THEIR BACK TO A POSSIBLE THREAT. He was appauled they didn't view those protesters as being possibly violent, and absolutely felt it would have looked different if they were people of color, Muslim, etc.
Quote from: CountryRoads on January 07, 2021, 10:32:48 PM
Not seeing this being reported much nationally, but it looks like BLM militant (and leader of Insurgence USA) John Earle Sullivan was arrested in connection with the Capitol breaching. He was reportedly one of the only people to get video of the shooting yesterday. Wonder what that's all about.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CIesAjylQ8v/?igshid=qn1hdej0vq4d
Source on this guy being arrested in DC? The link you shared connects him to the Utah legislative building.
Please, please, please tell us you're trying to further say that BLM/antifa is behind what happened in DC
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on January 07, 2021, 09:35:39 PM
Have you been under a rock for four years? Trump's message was to rise everyone up . People of color did far better the last four than anytime in history that' swhy they voted for him in record numbers. His message to those listening was he wanted the people to benefit from America not just the politically connected.
Thanks...I was under some crazy rock where people, many with ties to racist hate groups, stormed the capitol after being told to do so by Trump...and then Trump failed to call in the National Guard, so Pence finally did after 90 minutes, while Trump released a video saying he loved those patriots. I clearly need to get out more. I saw "proud boys" shirts, "6mwe" shirts (6 million jews killed weren't enough), confederate flags, nazi gear, etc. Then I heard Trump say he loved them and they were very special.
And since when does losing the black vote by roughly 80 % points signal a success?
Blacks can and should be Republicans if they choose...that's obvious. Racism is alive and well in both parties, in law enforcement, in education, etc. To act like Trump hasn't stoked racial flames is simply insane.
There's good people on both sides. Stand down and stand by buddy. I love you...you are very special. :-\
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on January 07, 2021, 09:35:39 PM
Have you been under a rock for four years? Trump's message was to rise everyone up . People of color did far better the last four than anytime in history that' swhy they voted for him in record numbers. His message to those listening was he wanted the people to benefit from America not just the politically connected.
My friend Darrel lived in Newark, he was a black Republican, one of the 8% or so of blacks who are Republicans. Most blacks who knew him thought him a lityle strange for being a Republican and would talk behind his back.
He was into reale state, read between the lines, drove a fancy car, dressed well and had a great personality.
He never wore a mask and one day Covid got him, he died, may he rest in peace. His defiance was his political statement and showed his loyality to the president and the party. When some people make it they turn Republican, you know, hard work, low taxes, law and order, charter schools, anti abortion, gun rights, etc.. That's nothing new, the Irish do it, the Italians do it, the Cubans and Poles do it.
One life lost because of misinformation may not seem like much, it's only one life, it's just some black Republican in Newark. Pitty.
Is it politics now, Rocky?
Quote from: 5DollarPitcher on January 08, 2021, 12:10:04 AM
Is it politics now, Rocky?
Yeah...our team and university are making a political stand and we're discussing it.
Quote from: avid1010 on January 08, 2021, 12:15:04 AM
Yeah...our team and university are making a political stand and we're discussing it.
I was told by Rocky and Wades the stand wasn't political. That's all. Strange how the conversation would tangentially bring us to Trump, Antifa, etc, if the team's stand wasn't political.
Can't say I didn't see it coming though.
Quote from: 5DollarPitcher on January 08, 2021, 12:18:01 AM
I was told by Rocky and Wades the stand wasn't political. That's all. Strange how the conversation would tangentially bring us to Trump, Antifa, etc, if the team's stand wasn't political.
Can't say I didn't see it coming though.
Perhaps BLM is not "political", it might be ethical, historical, or spiritual.
Can someone be a Republican and a supporter of BLM?
Why not?
How about a Republican who is against fascists?
Why not?
Because our media give us our political beliefs. They define everything, they brand everything.
Are Republicans anti China? Is Boeing against one of it's bigest customers?
We trade with China, we sell them Boeing 777's, they sell us junk for Walmart, what a deal.
I have a BLM sticker on my car (Democrat), my car is a Volkswagen (Republican), I am a member of the Ametican Legion (Republican), I am a Marquette basketball fan and they support BLM ( Democrat), I'm a member of the ACLU (Democrat), I play golf (Republican), I play at a public course (Democrat).
So we spend our time fighting for our brand, our team, our tribe and we fight among ourselves.
I'm tired of talking points, stereotypes and argumentative small minded thinking. If that's what politics has become, as Lindsey Graham said last night, you can count me out.
Anyone have any good new ideas that can solve one of our real problems?
Quote from: vogue65 on January 08, 2021, 12:50:26 AM
Perhaps BLM is not "political", it might be ethical, historical, or spiritual.
Can someone be a Republican and a supporter of BLM?
Why not?
How about a Republican who is against fascists?
Why not?
Because our media give us our political beliefs. They define everything, they brand everything.
Are Republicans anti China? Is Boeing against one of it's bigest customers?
We trade with China, we sell them Boeing 777's, they sell us junk for Walmart, what a deal.
I have a BLM sticker on my car (Democrat), my car is a Volkswagen (Republican), I am a member of the Ametican Legion (Republican), I am a Marquette basketball fan and they support BLM ( Democrat), I'm a member of the ACLU (Democrat), I play golf (Republican), I play at a public course (Democrat).
So we spend our time fighting for our brand, our team, our tribe and we fight among ourselves.
I'm tired of talking points, stereotypes and argumentative small minded thinking. If that's what politics has become, as Lindsey Graham said last night, you can count me out.
Anyone have any good new ideas that can solve one of our real problems?
Nothing that you say is untrue. But it's still political. That's the whole point.
To think that political is strictly Republican vs Democrat and my saying that the stand was political means I'm cornering the BLM movement into one of those two boxes and everybody that's X believes Y is just not understanding what it means to say something is "political".
Political is defined as relating to the government or the public affairs of a country. All of this rhetoric is political under the scope of that definition. No matter what your own personal beliefs may be.
What am I doing reading this thread?
Oh yeah, I wanted to see how it got to 13 pages without being locked.
Quote from: vogue65 on January 08, 2021, 12:50:26 AM
Perhaps BLM is not "political", it might be ethical, historical, or spiritual.
Can someone be a Republican and a supporter of BLM?
Why not?
How about a Republican who is against fascists?
Why not?
Because our media give us our political beliefs. They define everything, they brand everything.
Are Republicans anti China? Is Boeing against one of it's bigest customers?
We trade with China, we sell them Boeing 777's, they sell us junk for Walmart, what a deal.
I have a BLM sticker on my car (Democrat), my car is a Volkswagen (Republican), I am a member of the Ametican Legion (Republican), I am a Marquette basketball fan and they support BLM ( Democrat), I'm a member of the ACLU (Democrat), I play golf (Republican), I play at a public course (Democrat).
So we spend our time fighting for our brand, our team, our tribe and we fight among ourselves.
I'm tired of talking points, stereotypes and argumentative small minded thinking. If that's what politics has become, as Lindsey Graham said last night, you can count me out.
Anyone have any good new ideas that can solve one of our real problems?
Yeah. Here is the good news. Both political parties are totally corrupt and are useless liars
Time to start over
Quote from: willie warrior on January 08, 2021, 05:23:43 AM
Yeah. Here is the good news. Both political parties are totally corrupt and are useless liars
Time to start over
I understand your position.
However, I respectfully disagree with all politician's being totally corrupt.
Quote from: 5DollarPitcher on January 08, 2021, 12:10:04 AM
Is it politics now, Rocky?
That's the problem with America. Should black people have equal rights is a political debate. America is definitely Great.
Quote from: 4everDawson on January 08, 2021, 01:11:34 AM
What am I doing reading this thread?
Oh yeah, I wanted to see how it got to 13 pages without being locked.
You are curious, but uncofortable with political conversation, I understand that.
If you are capable, you might try expressing yourself and joining in. It's fun, not exactly what is on T.V., sometimes great insight and informative.
Take what you can use, ignore the rest.
Quote from: BLM on January 08, 2021, 06:42:42 AM
That's the problem with America. Should black people have equal rights is a political debate. America is definitely Great.
Back to philosophy 101.
Define your terms.
There is good politics and bad politics, politics and somethng else we call politics
Good politics is resolving disagreement by using debate, comprimise, and civility.
Bad politics is viewing everything as war, all or nothing extreme positions. Winning by any means possible, uncivilized behavior. Extreme rhetoric, poitics by street fights, distortions, propaganda,
riots all considered as politics is not in my view politics. It is a failure of politics.
Why is BLM the topic?
The topic should be police reform, white privlege, health care, regressive tax policy, job creation, offshoring and downsizing, mergers and acquisitions, distribution of wealth, Wall Street regulations, work place safety, the list is long and good politics would help resolve the issues.
But no, we debate and fight over three letters, BLM. We call that intellectual rigor or politcs. The game, so-called politics, is for no useful purpose other than winning and gaining power to stay in power.
Our culture accepts and demands it. Politics now is entertainment, photo opps., drama and not problem solving. The probem has become politics itself.
I've moved from center-right to libertarian over the last 10 months, and I'd wear a BLM T-shirt to drive Wojo to the airport right now.
Well, if it was a MU BLM t-shirt and you were a recruit, that would be an NCAA violation. Or something like that.
Quote from: tower912 on January 08, 2021, 08:43:29 AM
Well, if it was a MU BLM t-shirt and you were a recruit, that would be an NCAA violation. Or something like that.
Everyone's answer is Wojo should hire an older assistant coach (people are in complete denial that Rob Judson is employed by MU) so I propose we hire the grizzled 56 year old Scott Monarch.
Quote from: The Lens on January 08, 2021, 08:59:39 AM
Everyone's answer is Wojo should hire an older assistant coach (people are in complete denial that Rob Judson is employed by MU) so I propose we hire the grizzled 56 year old Scott Monarch.
He does have head coaching experience at Virginia Tech.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sportingnews.com/us/amp/ncaa-basketball/news/virginia-tech-buzz-williams-new-hokie-head-coach-marquette-golden-eagles-college-basketball0-bald-fake-picture-website/16v2t3xt27x5i1d6erfnaadggz
Quote from: The Lens on January 08, 2021, 08:59:39 AM
Everyone's answer is Wojo should hire an older assistant coach (people are in complete denial that Rob Judson is employed by MU) so I propose we hire the grizzled 56 year old Scott Monarch.
And in denial that Lavin hiring Gene Keady ultimately failed.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 08, 2021, 09:16:08 AM
And in denial that Lavin hiring Gene Keady ultimately failed.
hANk wAS oLDer thAN AL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on January 07, 2021, 09:35:39 PM
His message to those listening was he wanted the people to benefit from America not just the politically connected.
LOL
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on January 07, 2021, 09:35:39 PM
His message to those listening was he wanted the people to benefit from America not just the politically connected.
Of course he then governed in the exactly opposite manner, but hey let's not be too nitpicky here.
Quote from: avid1010 on January 07, 2021, 11:54:08 PM
Thanks...I was under some crazy rock where people, many with ties to racist hate groups, stormed the capitol after being told to do so by Trump...and then Trump failed to call in the National Guard, so Pence finally did after 90 minutes, while Trump released a video saying he loved those patriots. I clearly need to get out more. I saw "proud boys" shirts, "6mwe" shirts (6 million jews killed weren't enough), confederate flags, nazi gear, etc. Then I heard Trump say he loved them and they were very special.
And since when does losing the black vote by roughly 80 % points signal a success?
Blacks can and should be Republicans if they choose...that's obvious. Racism is alive and well in both parties, in law enforcement, in education, etc. To act like Trump hasn't stoked racial flames is simply insane.
There's good people on both sides. Stand down and stand by buddy. I love you...you are very special. :-\
This might be the best post I've ever read on this board, thank you Avid1010 (100% seriousness, no sarcasm)
Imagine going to the political rally of a mainstream candidate and wearing a Camp Auschwitz tee shirt with no fear of condemnation. It's really incredible, indefensible and would seem impossible pre 2015.
Quote from: Jockey on January 07, 2021, 02:02:51 PM
I'm glad I have the fortitude to avoid these political discussions.
Thanks man, needed a good laugh today, hey?
Quote from: The Lens on January 08, 2021, 10:35:26 AM
Imagine going to the political rally of a mainstream candidate and wearing a Camp Auschwitz tee shirt with no fear of condemnation. It's really incredible, indefensible and would seem impossible pre 2015.
That mindset has been stoked and instigated and normalized. And there is no accountability for those who did so and continue to do so because they want those votes in the future.
One of the funniest things I have ever seen. If I didn't know better, I would swear it is a skit from Portlandia.
https://crooksandliars.com/2021/01/karen-and-chad-go-rioting
Quote from: Jockey on January 08, 2021, 11:44:19 AM
One of the funniest things I have ever seen. If I didn't know better, I would swear it is a skit from Portlandia.
https://crooksandliars.com/2021/01/karen-and-chad-go-rioting
Really hope SNL does a parody this weekend though can't get much funnier than it already is
Quote from: Jockey on January 08, 2021, 11:44:19 AM
One of the funniest things I have ever seen. If I didn't know better, I would swear it is a skit from Portlandia.
https://crooksandliars.com/2021/01/karen-and-chad-go-rioting
Dude, I already used that line.
(https://images2.imgbox.com/99/a8/BS6zEUP3_o.png) (https://imgbox.com/BS6zEUP3)
Of course it was in a now locked thread so you might have missed it.
Quote from: TSmith34 on January 08, 2021, 11:58:03 AM
Dude, I already used that line.
(https://images2.imgbox.com/99/a8/BS6zEUP3_o.png) (https://imgbox.com/BS6zEUP3)
Of course it was in a now locked thread so you might have missed it.
Great minds, my brother.
Quote from: vogue65 on January 08, 2021, 06:38:39 AM
I understand your position.
However, I respectfully disagree with all politician's being totally corrupt.
I said both political parties. Still stand by it. Government at the federal level is corrupt.
Quote from: Eye on January 08, 2021, 08:39:27 AM
I've moved from center-right to libertarian over the last 10 months, and I'd wear a BLM T-shirt to drive Wojo to the airport right now.
Interesting.
Are they anarchists?
Every year they show up at my Post Office, set up their table and are against whomever is president.
They were against Clinton, Bush, Obama and now Trump.
You can never please them.
Quote from: WellsstreetWanderer on January 07, 2021, 09:35:39 PM
Have you been under a rock for four years? Trump's message was to rise everyone up . People of color did far better the last four than anytime in history that' swhy they voted for him in record numbers. His message to those listening was he wanted the people to benefit from America not just the politically connected.
amen. Black unemployment under Trump at record lows. Job participation rates for all classes at all-time highs. Border security. Rebuilt military...peace thru strength. Middle East peace accords. USMCA. NATO pay-up. Energy independence. Pro life, Pro law enforcement etc etc. Yeah, I'd say Trump is pro America. Tweet too much? Sure. As for the MUScooper under the moniker BLM, well, he's never let facts dissuade him from not being ignorant. I mean, he went off for about 273 posts on Duane Wilson not being a leader of TxA&M. Like, who cares?
Quote from: Marq3332 on January 08, 2021, 09:48:09 PM
amen. Black unemployment under Trump at record lows. Job participation rates for all classes at all-time highs. Border security. Rebuilt military...peace thru strength. Middle East peace accords. USMCA. NATO pay-up. Energy independence. Pro life, Pro law enforcement etc etc. Yeah, I'd say Trump is pro America. Tweet too much? Sure. As for the MUScooper under the moniker BLM, well, he's never let facts dissuade him from not being ignorant. I mean, he went off for about 273 posts on Duane Wilson not being a leader of TxA&M. Like, who cares?
You don't have to defend Trump anymore, he's history.
Next up, Ted Cruz, let's hear about how smart he is, what a great debater he is, what a leader he is, and how Texas is the best, bigest, wealthiest, most christian, best educated, least Covid infected state in the Union and how Ted Cruz can take credit for most of it.
Quote from: Marq3332 on January 08, 2021, 09:48:09 PM
amen. Black unemployment under Trump at record lows. Job participation rates for all classes at all-time highs. Border security. Rebuilt military...peace thru strength. Middle East peace accords. USMCA. NATO pay-up. Energy independence. Pro life, Pro law enforcement etc etc. Yeah, I'd say Trump is pro America. Tweet too much? Sure. As for the MUScooper under the moniker BLM, well, he's never let facts dissuade him from not being ignorant. I mean, he went off for about 273 posts on Duane Wilson not being a leader of TxA&M. Like, who cares?
Wait. You saw what happened on 1/6/2021 and you're STILL telling yourself that Donald Trump is "pro America?" Good god the crazy that is shared on here is incredible.
Quote from: Marq3332 on January 08, 2021, 09:48:09 PM
amen. Black unemployment under Trump at record lows. Job participation rates for all classes at all-time highs. Border security. Rebuilt military...peace thru strength. Middle East peace accords. USMCA. NATO pay-up. Energy independence. Pro life, Pro law enforcement etc etc. Yeah, I'd say Trump is pro America. Tweet too much? Sure. As for the MUScooper under the moniker BLM, well, he's never let facts dissuade him from not being ignorant. I mean, he went off for about 273 posts on Duane Wilson not being a leader of TxA&M. Like, who cares?
Trump benefitted from the Obama economy for three years and was a complete and utter disaster in year four. Like everyone with a brain predicted, when a real crisis hit he proved incapable, and in the end quite destructive. To the point where we literally have members of his own party asking him to resign.
He will go down as one of, if not the worst, presidents in history.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 09, 2021, 05:19:34 AM
Trump benefitted from the Obama economy for three years and was a complete and utter disaster in year four. Like everyone with a brain predicted, when a real crisis hit he proved incapable, and in the end quite destructive. To the point where we literally have members of his own party asking him to resign.
He will go down as one of, if not the worst, presidents in history.
Now that is a huge pile of hogwash. Straight out of rules for radicals
Who would win a one on one bb game, Trump or Biden?
Quote from: willie warrior on January 09, 2021, 05:59:19 AM
Now that is a huge pile of hogwash. Straight out of rules for radicals
Who would win a one on one bb game, Trump or Biden?
I know it's hard for people to admit they were horribly wrong, but perhaps someday you will open your mind.
Why are there even mods?
Report it.
Quote from: willie warrior on January 09, 2021, 05:59:19 AM
Who would win a one on one bb game, Trump or Biden?
Excellent question. Are there are ramps on the court?
Biden would win. Trump would claim he won. His cheering section would storm the floor.
Push ups are more Biden's wheelhouse. And only against people from America's heartland he calls out as fat at rallies. Not to mention the complexity of bb is probably to much for his dementia riddled brain.
Quote from: willie warrior on January 09, 2021, 05:59:19 AM
Now that is a huge pile of hogwash. Straight out of rules for radicals
Who would win a one on one bb game, Trump or Biden?
HOGWASH, very insightful, well thought out position. Nothing more needs to be said, you said it all. Very helpful for my understanding. You asked, Trump would foul out.
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on January 09, 2021, 08:43:08 AM
Push ups are more Biden's wheelhouse. And only against people from America's heartland he calls out as fat at rallies. Not to mention the complexity of bb is probably to much for his dementia riddled brain.
Ah yes. Trump has a very stable brain and is the epitome of an incredible physical specimen.
Lol. Seriously some of this stuff is too damn good.
Quote from: willie warrior on January 09, 2021, 05:59:19 AM
Now that is a huge pile of hogwash. Straight out of rules for radicals
Who would win a one on one bb game, Trump or Biden?
Great. Now we have to worry about President Lavar Ball if 1 on 1 skills is a key criteria.
Quote from: BLM on January 09, 2021, 08:54:12 AM
Ah yes. Trump has a very stable brain and is the epitome of an incredible physical specimen.
Lol. Seriously some of this stuff is too damn good.
Nothing Trump has done points to any dementia. Disagree with him all you want, point out his character flaws. Those are all legit arguments. But dementia or some form of it is not one of his issues.
Biden's handlers were scared to death to let him campaign and speak off the cuff after he was flubbing interviews on MSDNC. That isn't even arguable. We saw how his campaign was managed. This is a guy who would forget what state he was in, repeated he was a candidate for senate, placed his hand on his wife's shoulder and introduced her as his sister, etc.
Quote from: cheebs09 on January 09, 2021, 08:59:23 AM
Great. Now we have to worry about President Lavar Ball if 1 on 1 skills is a key criteria.
Just trying to bring dialogue here back to basketball, rather than political cancel culture. Guess it may be too far gone for that. So cancel culture away
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on January 09, 2021, 09:18:44 AM
Nothing Trump has done points to any dementia. Disagree with him all you want, point out his character flaws. Those are all legit arguments. But dementia or some form of it is not one of his issues.
Biden's handlers were scared to death to let him campaign and speak off the cuff after he was flubbing interviews on MSDNC. That isn't even arguable. We saw how his campaign was managed. This is a guy who would forget what state he was in, repeated he was a candidate for senate, placed his hand on his wife's shoulder and introduced her as his sister, etc.
Nm
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 09, 2021, 05:19:34 AM
Trump benefitted from the Obama economy for three years and was a complete and utter disaster in year four. Like everyone with a brain predicted, when a real crisis hit he proved incapable, and in the end quite destructive. To the point where we literally have members of his own party asking him to resign.
He will go down as one of, if not the worst, presidents in history.
Prior to Wednesday he was comfortably in the lower third with guys like Fillmore, Harding, or Harrison. But after Wednesday your bolded is unquestionably the case. It'll be a three man battle for bottom spot with him, Buchanan, and A. Johnson.
Quote from: tower912 on January 09, 2021, 08:32:55 AM
Biden would win. Trump would claim he won. His cheering section would storm the floor.
This is low key very good.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 09, 2021, 05:19:34 AM
Trump benefitted from the Obama economy for three years and was a complete and utter disaster in year four. Like everyone with a brain predicted, when a real crisis hit he proved incapable, and in the end quite destructive. To the point where we literally have members of his own party asking him to resign.
He will go down as one of, if not the worst, presidents in history.
Trump made significant achievements in many areas.
1. The economy grew in a way that created upward wage growth for those at the bottom.
2. Lowest Black unemployment rate
3. Lowest Hispanic unemployment rate
4. One item never Noted in the media is that Trump Administration focused EPA in actual clean ups versus harassing business , which led to most Environmental clean ups in history
5. Europeans were forced to pay their fair share of NATO
6. ISIS gone
7. Troops removed from Mideast
8. Low energy prices from increased production and for first time US became net exporter of Oil
9. HBCU's fully funded for 10 years
10. Lowest Mortgage rates in history
11. Vaccines developed in less than one year
12. Numerous peace treaties negotiated in the Middle East
13. Sabre rattling from North Korea stopped
14. Criminal Justice Reform
15. vaping legislation
16. Restored due process on campuses
17. Space Force
18. 5 G Networks built on Western Technologies
19. Confronted China economically and Extracted significant revenues without increasing prices .
20. Significant tax cuts for all.
Quote from: tower912 on January 09, 2021, 08:32:55 AM
Biden would win. Trump would claim he won. His cheering section would storm the floor.
Biden would either stay in the basement and miss the game or get confused and score at the wrong hoop.
Trump would fill the arena and blather on awhile, never pick up the basketball but said he beat Wilt Chamberlain's single game scoring record.
Both would be painful to watch in a post-game interview.
On an alumni hoops basis, Trump went to Penn and no one cares about Penn hoops, while Biden went to Syracuse and we all hate Syracuse.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 09, 2021, 05:19:34 AM
Trump benefitted from the Obama economy for three years and was a complete and utter disaster in year four. Like everyone with a brain predicted, when a real crisis hit he proved incapable, and in the end quite destructive. To the point where we literally have members of his own party asking him to resign.
He will go down as one of, if not the worst, presidents in history.
sorry...Prez O had 8 yrs. accomplished zip of consequence. Played the race card quite well, however. Economy in year 4? You%u2019ve heard of covid 19, yes? And which admin turbo-charged to a vaccine? It%u2019s an easy answer. (Too bad in WI we have a terd for a Gov that can%u2019t seem to handle distribution of said vaccine.) However, you referred to Lovell as a weenie, so we agree for once.
Quote from: Herman Cain on January 09, 2021, 10:56:29 AM
Trump made significant achievements in many areas.
1. The economy grew in a way that created upward wage growth for those at the bottom.
2. Lowest Black unemployment rate
3. Lowest Hispanic unemployment rate
4. One item never Noted in the media is that Trump Administration focused EPA in actual clean ups versus harassing business , which led to most Environmental clean ups in history
5. Europeans were forced to pay their fair share of NATO
6. ISIS gone
7. Troops removed from Mideast
8. Low energy prices from increased production and for first time US became net exporter of Oil
9. HBCU's fully funded for 10 years
10. Lowest Mortgage rates in history
11. Vaccines developed in less than one year
12. Numerous peace treaties negotiated in the Middle East
13. Sabre rattling from North Korea stopped
14. Criminal Justice Reform
15. vaping legislation
16. Restored due process on campuses
17. Space Force
18. 5 G Networks built on Western Technologies
19. Confronted China economically and Extracted significant revenues without increasing prices .
20. Significant tax cuts for all.
👍
Quote from: Herman Cain on January 09, 2021, 10:56:29 AM
Trump made significant achievements in many areas.
1. The economy grew in a way that created upward wage growth for those at the bottom.
2. Lowest Black unemployment rate
3. Lowest Hispanic unemployment rate
4. One item never Noted in the media is that Trump Administration focused EPA in actual clean ups versus harassing business , which led to most Environmental clean ups in history
5. Europeans were forced to pay their fair share of NATO
6. ISIS gone
7. Troops removed from Mideast
8. Low energy prices from increased production and for first time US became net exporter of Oil
9. HBCU's fully funded for 10 years
10. Lowest Mortgage rates in history
11. Vaccines developed in less than one year
12. Numerous peace treaties negotiated in the Middle East
13. Sabre rattling from North Korea stopped
14. Criminal Justice Reform
15. vaping legislation
16. Restored due process on campuses
17. Space Force
18. 5 G Networks built on Western Technologies
19. Confronted China economically and Extracted significant revenues without increasing prices .
20. Significant tax cuts for all.
Source?
Well, to answer $5s question, this is now clearly just political. I actually appreciated/laughed that willie tried a hoops tie-in. First time I found willie funny in a long time.
I'll close by saying, we left this one open to have a discussion about social (in)justice in the US spurred on by the black uniforms/Jacob Blake decision. I appreciate all those that could stick on that topic and engaged in a thoughtful discussion. I hope the rest of you can continue to have those types of discussions in your real lives.
Cheerio!