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Author Topic: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.  (Read 14060 times)

CountryRoads

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #100 on: December 03, 2021, 12:23:19 PM »
Quote from: BLM on December 03, 2021, 12:16:38 PM
Since one of the victims that died had rushed the shooter, is this now a case of self defense?

No, because the shooter provoked the attack. If the prosecutors were able to prove that Rittenhouse provoked the attack (since I’m assuming that’s where this post is coming from), he would have been found guilty also. They failed to do that and/or there was no evidence he did.
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reinko

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #101 on: December 03, 2021, 12:47:06 PM »
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Pakuni

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #102 on: December 03, 2021, 01:07:41 PM »
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Jockey

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #103 on: December 03, 2021, 01:08:31 PM »
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CountryRoads

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #104 on: December 03, 2021, 01:10:46 PM »
Quote from: reinko on December 03, 2021, 12:47:06 PM
Good Christ.

https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1466819872160165894?s=21

A lot of the times (like in the Waukesha incident) you shake your head and wonder how it could have been prevented. That’s not the case with this one. It should have been prevented multiple times. Charging the parents is the right move, imo. The more people that are held accountable, the better.
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Jockey

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #105 on: December 03, 2021, 01:11:46 PM »
Quote from: tower912 on December 03, 2021, 11:27:32 AM
The prosecutor just laid out her case in her press conference.   The parents look really bad, but this is going to be tough to win.

You are right. The parents will have the best lawyers that right-wing money can buy.
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The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #106 on: December 03, 2021, 01:22:18 PM »
Quote from: Jockey on December 03, 2021, 11:17:07 AM
This will be the evidence in the future for the "they wanna take all our guns" morons. The nuts will be out on Fox.

Quote from: Jockey on December 03, 2021, 01:11:46 PM
You are right. The parents will have the best lawyers that right-wing money can buy.


Is there some sort of right wing defense of the parents that I am missing?  Otherwise, why are you doing this?
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ZiggysFryBoy

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #107 on: December 03, 2021, 01:34:08 PM »
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on December 03, 2021, 01:22:18 PM

Is there some sort of right wing defense of the parents that I am missing?  Otherwise, why are you doing this?

It's what the Daily Koz told him.   ::) ::)
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Skatastrophy

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #108 on: December 03, 2021, 01:47:33 PM »
Quote from: BLM on December 03, 2021, 12:16:38 PM
Since one of the victims that died had rushed the shooter, is this now a case of self defense?

If it was tried in Wisconsin there would be a good chance.
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ZiggysFryBoy

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #109 on: December 03, 2021, 01:53:18 PM »
Quote from: Skatastrophy on December 03, 2021, 01:47:33 PM
If it was tried in Wisconsin there would be a good chance.

Good lord.  🤡
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forgetful

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #110 on: December 03, 2021, 01:58:14 PM »
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on December 03, 2021, 01:22:18 PM

Is there some sort of right wing defense of the parents that I am missing?  Otherwise, why are you doing this?

I haven't seen any efforts yet. But in general the NRA and 2nd amendment folks are adamantly against holding people responsible in any way, if their guns are used by others to commit crimes. So it would make sense, if they are remotely consistent, for the NRA and 2nd amendment folks to defend the parents.

Regardless, charging someone is one thing. Getting a conviction is another. I'd be surprised if they were able to get any conviction here.

To me, the biggest question is how did the school not enforce the student being removed, and/or calling mental health services immediately. Schools have been locked down for less than drawing a picture of people being shot after searching for ammunition.

It is clear the parents failed. But the school epically failed in this case too.
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Galway Eagle

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #111 on: December 03, 2021, 02:09:06 PM »
I think what gets the parents off is that when they heard about the shooting they check for the gun, called 911 & and texted him not to do it. If they didn't, it'd be much easier to get a conviction.


Just think this family was just another law abiding good guy with a gun... until they weren't. But of course because they eventually weren't they don't fit the box of "good law abiding people deserve guns"... until they don't.
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Pakuni

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #112 on: December 03, 2021, 02:13:13 PM »
Oakland County sheriff says the parents are MIA.
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The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #113 on: December 03, 2021, 02:15:08 PM »
Quote from: forgetful on December 03, 2021, 01:58:14 PM
I haven't seen any efforts yet. But in general the NRA and 2nd amendment folks are adamantly against holding people responsible in any way, if their guns are used by others to commit crimes. So it would make sense, if they are remotely consistent, for the NRA and 2nd amendment folks to defend the parents.

Regardless, charging someone is one thing. Getting a conviction is another. I'd be surprised if they were able to get any conviction here.

To me, the biggest question is how did the school not enforce the student being removed, and/or calling mental health services immediately. Schools have been locked down for less than drawing a picture of people being shot after searching for ammunition.

It is clear the parents failed. But the school epically failed in this case too.


Agreed.  The school screwed this up as well.
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MuggsyB

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #114 on: December 03, 2021, 02:26:20 PM »
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on December 03, 2021, 02:15:08 PM

Agreed.  The school screwed this up as well.

Absolutely.  This should have never happened.  Very sad and these parents are disgusting.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2021, 02:42:34 PM by MuggsyB »
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TSmith34, Inc.

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #115 on: December 03, 2021, 02:37:03 PM »
Quote from: Jockey on December 03, 2021, 01:11:46 PM
You are right. The parents will have the best lawyers that right-wing money can buy.
My opinion only, but I doubt it. There is no social wedge issue in this one. White kid shoots up a school? No upside to defend him, no way to rile up the base.

The strategy will be to ignore it and claim anyone talking about stricter gun laws is "politicizing it". That been the playbook in the past.
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pbiflyer

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #116 on: December 03, 2021, 02:41:15 PM »
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tower912

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #117 on: December 03, 2021, 02:52:44 PM »
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Skatastrophy

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #118 on: December 03, 2021, 03:16:22 PM »
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tower912

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #119 on: December 03, 2021, 03:20:47 PM »
I wonder if they will be smart enough to mask up.
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Luke 6:45   ...A good man produces goodness from the good in his heart; an evil man produces evil out of his store of evil.   Each man speaks from his heart's abundance...

It is better to be fearless and cheerful than cheerless and fearful.

The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #120 on: December 03, 2021, 03:27:08 PM »
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pacearrow02

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #121 on: December 03, 2021, 03:31:29 PM »
As more and more facts come out I almost/strangely feel bad for this kid.  Seemed to be screaming for help all the way up to the moment everything boiled over. 

Hope the parents and school officials face some sort of accountability.
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ZiggysFryBoy

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #122 on: December 03, 2021, 03:34:06 PM »
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MU82

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #123 on: December 03, 2021, 03:47:02 PM »
We've had threads here on Scoop -- usually after one of these needless sprees ends up with multiple deaths -- in which numerous common-sense suggestions to help reduce gun violence have been made.

I mean, how about a law stating that if daddy and mommy buy a gun, they have to provide evidence that they will lock it up securely, where the kids can't get to it? And if they fail to do so, and something like this Oakland incident happens, they would be held accountable and face serious prison time.

Wouldn't that be the definition of a common-sense law that would save lives? Whose 2nd Amendment rights would that take away?
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MuggsyB

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Re: Thoughts and prayers for Oxford, Mi.
« Reply #124 on: December 03, 2021, 03:52:32 PM »
Legally they're unfortunately going to have a hard time proving manslaughter for the parents in the state of Michigan.  As far as negligence for the school it's also probably a difficult case as inept as they were.  I would think though that the  parents of the victims will seek civil action.   What an unmitigated disaster and terrible tragedy.
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