2023 MLB Thread

[wadesworld]

Counsell is a heckuva manager.  They're not that good

Agreed. I don't know why anyone thinks Counsell's lost the team or isn't a good manager anymore. The roster is terrible and he has them competitive every year. Good pitching that doesn't stay healthy. One of the worst group of position players in all of baseball.

[Uncle Rico]

Agreed. I don't know why anyone thinks Counsell's lost the team or isn't a good manager anymore. The roster is terrible and he has them competitive every year. Good pitching that doesn't stay healthy. One of the worst group of position players in all of baseball.

Idiots spend their time blaming coaches and managers.  Most of the time, it's the players

[4everwarriors]

Nah, its da GM. #12 wuz write, aina?

[Uncle Rico]

Nah, its da GM. #12 wuz write, aina?

Those NFC Championship games must have been built on Ted Thompson.  Even the home one

[rocket surgeon]

the brewers screwed themselves taking corbin burnes to arbitration.  maybe not the arbitration part, but the process.  they may have saved themselves $740k but some of the arguments they used to gain favor of the arbiter p!ssed off burnes for sure. 

  so what ya gonna get for $10,000,000?? 

    -a p!ssed off pitcher for one more year, then SEE YA.  plus, he's probably taking his clubhouse meals home in doggie bags

   

[wadesworld]

the brewers screwed themselves taking corbin burnes to arbitration.  maybe not the arbitration part, but the process.  they may have saved themselves $740k but some of the arguments they used to gain favor of the arbiter p!ssed off burnes for sure. 

  so what ya gonna get for $10,000,000?? 

    -a p!ssed off pitcher for one more year, then SEE YA.  plus, he's probably taking his clubhouse meals home in doggie bags

   

The Brewers were never going to be able to pay Burnes his next contract. He'll enjoy being in a big market. The Brewers should trade him before the deadline.

[MUfan12]

The Brewers were never going to be able to pay Burnes his next contract. He'll enjoy being in a big market. The Brewers should trade him before the deadline.

If the team was being honest with themselves they would have dealt him in the off-season. There's no way their piecemeal offense was going to be good enough to compete for a pennant.

[HutchwasClutch]

the brewers screwed themselves taking corbin burnes to arbitration.  maybe not the arbitration part, but the process.  they may have saved themselves $740k but some of the arguments they used to gain favor of the arbiter p!ssed off burnes for sure. 

  so what ya gonna get for $10,000,000?? 

    -a p!ssed off pitcher for one more year, then SEE YA.  plus, he's probably taking his clubhouse meals home in doggie bags

   

Absolutely agree. It came out that one of their "arguments" was Burnes's performance last year was in part a reason for missing postseason. He was furious and rightfully so, and all but said it in spring training.  They could have avoided arbitration with one of baseball's stud starting pitchers (which of course has been a unicorn in Brewers history) by anteing up what a minimum veterans salary would have been to avoid arbitration.  It was colossally stupid short and long term for the organization. This is why teams try to avoid arbitration if at all reasonable, which it certainly would have been with Burnes.

So Attanasio again shows his hand what his priorities really are.  But he is great at the small market owner narrative. 

[HutchwasClutch]

The Brewers were never going to be able to pay Burnes his next contract. He'll enjoy being in a big market. The Brewers should trade him before the deadline.

Maybe correct, although Attanasio is great at crying poor with his $750 million net worth and very strong support and attendance in the time he's owned them.  But long term, pitchers are extremely risky for the Brewers no question.

But why pi** him off while you still have him?  Is that smart relations with your best and most valuable player?? That answer's itself

[Uncle Rico]

the brewers screwed themselves taking corbin burnes to arbitration.  maybe not the arbitration part, but the process.  they may have saved themselves $740k but some of the arguments they used to gain favor of the arbiter p!ssed off burnes for sure. 

  so what ya gonna get for $10,000,000?? 

    -a p!ssed off pitcher for one more year, then SEE YA.  plus, he's probably taking his clubhouse meals home in doggie bags

   

Poor Corbin.  A lot of people hate facts.  He's one of them

[rocket surgeon]

If the team was being honest with themselves they would have dealt him in the off-season. There's no way their piecemeal offense was going to be good enough to compete for a pennant.

yes

hopefully they can put something together before i bolts via free agency and they get nothing.  don't know if there is a "no trade" clause in his current contract or teams he can NOT want to go to.  i'm sure corbin would love to ride his current contract and let the brewers see who his new team is  on espn

[Uncle Rico]

yes

hopefully they can put something together before i bolts via free agency and they get nothing.  don't know if there is a "no trade" clause in his current contract or teams he can NOT want to go to.  i'm sure corbin would love to ride his current contract and let the brewers see who his new team is  on espn

Rookie contracts are notorious for their no-trade clauses

[The Sultan]

Maybe correct, although Attanasio is great at crying poor with his $750 million net worth and very strong support and attendance in the time he's owned them.  But long term, pitchers are extremely risky for the Brewers no question.

But why pi** him off while you still have him?  Is that smart relations with your best and most valuable player?? That answer's itself

I mean...what's the consequence?

[The Sultan]

yes

hopefully they can put something together before i bolts via free agency and they get nothing.  don't know if there is a "no trade" clause in his current contract or teams he can NOT want to go to.  i'm sure corbin would love to ride his current contract and let the brewers see who his new team is  on espn

You don't understand rookie baseball contracts. The Brewers are in complete control.

[MUBurrow]

Agreed. I don't know why anyone thinks Counsell's lost the team or isn't a good manager anymore. The roster is terrible and he has them competitive every year. Good pitching that doesn't stay healthy. One of the worst group of position players in all of baseball.

+1.  When you look at that lineup, Counsell maxmizes what he has every year, particularly when it comes to interchangeable parts journeymen in the lineup and his bullpen. 

The franchise's biggest problem right now is the combo of not developing hitters and being a low payroll team paying 1/5 of its total payroll to Christian Yelich.  The lack of homegrown regulars in the lineup is becoming a real problem.  Last year, only 2 of the top 15 in PAs played their first MLB game with the Crew - Taylor was 8th and Hiura was 12th.  This year looks better, but if the top seven spots in the lineup aren't filled by at least three of Mitchell, Wiemer, Turang, Frelick, and Taylor by mid next year, this team just cannot meaningfully compete.

[cheebs09]

Having read more about this while it was going on, the $700k battle was the product of a crappy process. There's a lot of pressure from the owners to not establish new precedents for players, and the Burnes contract would have done that.

I think the way contracts are set up early and the process is pretty unfair, but it is collectively bargained. Good young players are a bargain for teams until they hit free agency.

I don't think Burnes is going to sign with Milwaukee long term even if they went $700k over his asking price this year.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Having read more about this while it was going on, the $700k battle was the product of a crappy process. There's a lot of pressure from the owners to not establish new precedents for players, and the Burnes contract would have done that.

I think the way contracts are set up early and the process is pretty unfair, but it is collectively bargained. Good young players are a bargain for teams until they hit free agency.

I don't think Burnes is going to sign with Milwaukee long term even if they went $700k over his asking price this year.

Then they should have paid him the $700k outside arbitration.

[Jockey]

+1.  When you look at that lineup, Counsell maxmizes what he has every year, particularly when it comes to interchangeable parts journeymen in the lineup and his bullpen. 

The franchise's biggest problem right now is the combo of not developing hitters and being a low payroll team paying 1/5 of its total payroll to Christian Yelich.  The lack of homegrown regulars in the lineup is becoming a real problem.  Last year, only 2 of the top 15 in PAs played their first MLB game with the Crew - Taylor was 8th and Hiura was 12th.  This year looks better, but if the top seven spots in the lineup aren't filled by at least three of Mitchell, Wiemer, Turang, Frelick, and Taylor by mid next year, this team just cannot meaningfully compete.

I agree except for Taylor. Next year he will be 30 years old with a WAR probably under 4.0 for his career. Just a 5th outfielder type.

[Hards Alumni]

The Brewers were never going to be able to pay Burnes his next contract. He'll enjoy being in a big market. The Brewers should trade him before the deadline.

Irrelevant.  The word is out that the Brewers will cheap out on talent.  It's a bad look regardless.

[wadesworld]

Irrelevant.  The word is out that the Brewers will cheap out on talent.  It's a bad look regardless.

Not really though. That's why the process is in place. This happens every single offseason with every single team. And the arbiter sided with the Brewers.

[The Sultan]

OMG the Brewers played hardball in an arbitration case! Nobody will want to play here now!!!

[MUBurrow]

I agree except for Taylor. Next year he will be 30 years old with a WAR probably under 4.0 for his career. Just a 5th outfielder type.

You're right. I was being overly optimistic including him, but he is who he is at this point.

[Hards Alumni]

Not really though. That's why the process is in place. This happens every single offseason with every single team. And the arbiter sided with the Brewers.

Won the battle to lose the war.

It's a poorly run organization.

[The Sultan]

Won the battle to lose the war.

What war?

[MUBurrow]

Irrelevant.  The word is out that the Brewers will cheap out on talent.  It's a bad look regardless.

Disagree.  You can make an argument that it was stupid because it pooped in the punchbowl of the org's relationship with Burnes, and has factored into his drop in performance.  But the word has been out for a long time on how the Brewers do business.  Taking Burnes to arb isn't going to prevent agents from negotiating extensions for young guys, and here are their top $ FA signings over the last five years:
2023: Wade Miley - $4.5MM
2022: Andrew McCutcheon - $8.5MM
2021: JBJ - $13MM; Kolton Wong - $26MM/3
2020: Avisail Garcia - $20MM/2
2019: Yaz Grandal - $16MM