More conference realignment talk

[DFW HOYA]

I think the Big East can be in a position to be a predator in conference realignment. It might not happen this year but they should be finding ways to bring some of these schools (and Gonzaga) into the fold so we can make our own basketball superconference.

What do people see in Gonzaga? It's Butler circa 2012.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

What do people see in Gonzaga? It's Butler circa 2012.

They could be. They could also be better. Even if they end up being Butler I've been pretty happy with that addition so I don't see the problem.

[Newsdreams]

What do people see in Gonzaga? It's Butler circa 2012.

Better than Georgetown right now, hey

[DFW HOYA]

Better than Georgetown right now, hey

If you don't want Georgetown, easy: vote us out.

[muwarrior69]

I've been thinking more about this. We don't know how long it will take but it seems inevitable that we are heading to 2 super football conferences. The only questions are how bloated these behemoths will get and who will make the cut and who will be left in the in the ACC/P12/B12 which will be the equivalent of the AAC/MWC/Sun Belt.

It seems certain that there will be some top basketball programs who don't make the cut as well as some solid basketball programs with large state school alumni bases. Programs like Kansas, Duke, North Carolina, Miami (FL), Syracuse, Louisville, Pitt, Wake Forest, Boston College, Washington, Oregon, Cal, Stanford, Arizona, Arizona State, Colorado, Cincinnati, Houston, Memphis, NC State, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Georgia Tech, Baylor, Oklahoma State, Iowa State, Texas Tech, BYU...some of them will get the coveted B1G/SEC invite, but I think most are left on the outside looking it.

I think the Big East can be in a position to be a predator in conference realignment. It might not happen this year but they should be finding ways to bring some of these schools (and Gonzaga) into the fold so we can make our own basketball superconference. Make it so there is no doubt that the top basketball conference is neither the the Big 10 nor the SEC so if they ever do break off and try to form their own tournament, they have to work with us or risk a direct competitor that gets just as many eyeballs.

I don't know if it can be pulled off, but that's the direction we should be heading.

Why wouldn't the leftovers not form their own conference especially schools like UNC, Kansas and Duke the basketball blue bloods. Sure, football is driving all this but I think there is a strong basketball after taste who will not get left out in left field. When you think about it, how many schools have consistently fielded good football and basketball teams? As one who does not follow college football, off the top of my hat the only schools that come to mind are Ohio State and Wisconsin. I am sure there are others but not many.

[SaveOD238]

Big  question is when does the SEC say, "Thank you Vanderbilt. It has been a pleasure having you."

If it's about the total athletic program, it will never happen. Vandy is great in baseball and has had its basketball moments. Some of their basketball players have been very, very good.

But if it's about football, which I think it is, Vanderbilt is on borrowed time. The SEC won't ask 'em to leave, per se, but they'll ask for massive upgrades to Dudley Field, improved competitiveness that requires Vanderbilt to recruit athletes they won't chase today and minimum attendance expectations.

They may be able to get around the stadium issue by playing at Nissan Stadium, or the new Metro Field that's being debated in Nashville, but the academics and attendance will be a big problem.

I've been wondering the same.  My guess is that Alabama, Florida, and Georgia can't just kick Vanderbilt and Mississippi State out of the conference. Ditto the Big Ten with Northwestern, etc.  The only way to trim the fat might be to leave those schools behind.

If the next step is two 24-30 team mega-conferences, the NEXT step is ONE Super Conference and everyone else left behind.  Think the failed European soccer Super League

[The Sultan]

I agree. But they will all continue to lose money on it.

Which is fine. You don't need football to be profitable to make it worthwhile to your university.

[WhiteTrash]

Big  question is when does the SEC say, "Thank you Vanderbilt. It has been a pleasure having you."

If it's about the total athletic program, it will never happen. Vandy is great in baseball and has had its basketball moments. Some of their basketball players have been very, very good.

But if it's about football, which I think it is, Vanderbilt is on borrowed time. The SEC won't ask 'em to leave, per se, but they'll ask for massive upgrades to Dudley Field, improved competitiveness that requires Vanderbilt to recruit athletes they won't chase today and minimum attendance expectations.

They may be able to get around the stadium issue by playing at Nissan Stadium, or the new Metro Field that's being debated in Nashville, but the academics and attendance will be a big problem.

I would be worried too if I was Vandy. I say this in all seriousness; now that academics are not part of the equation, the SEC does not need Vandy. Football is the ONLY factor in all of this and Vandy does not fit the SEC/BIG10 model membership. You can make a better case for UAB than Vandy. Or maybe Vandy isn't worried and is ready to move on, the University of Chicago has done just fine without the BIG10.

[Uncle Rico]

I would be worried too if I was Vandy. I say this in all seriousness; now that academics are not part of the equation, the SEC does not need Vandy. Football is the ONLY factor in all of this and Vandy does not fit the SEC/BIG10 model membership. You can make a better case for UAB than Vandy. Or maybe Vandy isn't worried and is ready to move on, the University of Chicago has done just fine without the BIG10.

Nashville is a good market

[WhiteTrash]

Nashville is a good market

True, but Houston is a great market and its not on anyone's radar.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Why wouldn't the leftovers not form their own conference especially schools like UNC, Kansas and Duke the basketball blue bloods. Sure, football is driving all this but I think there is a strong basketball after taste who will not get left out in left field. When you think about it, how many schools have consistently fielded good football and basketball teams? As one who does not follow college football, off the top of my hat the only schools that come to mind are Ohio State and Wisconsin. I am sure there are others but not many.

They might form their own, which is why I didn't say it was a given, just that we should work towards it.

And it depends on your definition of "good" but I would say many schools are good in both basketball and football

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

True, but Houston is a great market and its not on anyone's radar.

I've oft3n wondered about them. On paper they should be a bigger player in realignment.  Maybe the SEC feels like TAMU and TU already deliver the Houston market

[panda]

True, but Houston is a great market and its not on anyone's radar.

With streaming platforms and pay for programming coming into play, the market grab will become less and less prevalent.

[GoldenWarrior11]

The SEC isn't kicking out Vanderbilt.  The history of conferences kicking out a member for non-competitiveness are few and far between (and messy to say the least - see Temple/Big East).  As the lone private institution in the SEC, there is also great financial value in the conference having Vanderbilt (in addition to the academic association they bring).  Now, Vanderbilt could one day say "this is too much and we can't continue down this path".  However, no President or BOT wants to be an ex-President or ex-Board member by willingly turning down ~$80-100 million annually I'm television revenue. That certainly isn't happening either.

[WhiteTrash]

The SEC isn't kicking out Vanderbilt.  The history of conferences kicking out a member for non-competitiveness are few and far between (and messy to say the least - see Temple/Big East).  As the lone private institution in the SEC, there is also great financial value in the conference having Vanderbilt (in addition to the academic association they bring).  Now, Vanderbilt could one day say "this is too much and we can't continue down this path".  However, no President or BOT wants to be an ex-President or ex-Board member by willingly turning down ~$80-100 million annually I'm television revenue. That certainly isn't happening either.

You're probably right but "academic association" means nothing.

[Newsdreams]

Better than Georgetown right now, hey

LOL was a joke

[Uncle Rico]

With streaming platforms and pay for programming coming into play, the market grab will become less and less prevalent.

That's incorrect.  The market matters for alumni that live in said markets

[Uncle Rico]

I've oft3n wondered about them. On paper they should be a bigger player in realignment.  Maybe the SEC feels like TAMU and TU already deliver the Houston market

With global warming running unchecked, Houston will be under water sooner than later, so it makes sense

[panda]

That's incorrect.  The market matters for alumni that live in said markets

I think brand recognition matters much more at this point than market. Houston is an interesting example. While I don't personally know the perception of the university within the city, they could be a huge given their recent commitment athletic success.

However adding a random school from a big market does not boost conference caliber. Smart additions from programs with a track record of success is the way to go moving forward to appeal to a national, streaming audience.

[forgetful]

Won't happen for the same reason the C7, UC, UConn and USF didn't dissolve the Big East in 2012: no one is forfeiting tournament credits or (hypothetical) exit fees.

The remaining schools will not have a choice if the majority vote for dissolution. There may be enough going to the SEC, and B10 to force a dissolution of the ACC.

[Uncle Rico]

I think brand recognition matters much more at this point than market. Houston is an interesting example. While I don't personally know the perception of the university within the city, they could be a huge given their recent commitment athletic success.

However adding a random school from a big market does not boost conference caliber. Smart additions from programs with a track record of success is the way to go moving forward to appeal to a national, streaming audience.

Big 16 says, see Rutgers and Maryland

[panda]

Big 16 says, see Rutgers and Maryland

I did buy a $2 lower bowl friday ticket to the big ten tournament in Brooklyn last year. Catch the fever !

[GoldenWarrior11]

The remaining schools will not have a choice if the majority vote for dissolution. There may be enough going to the SEC, and B10 to force a dissolution of the ACC.

The Big East (2012) had the same opportunity when Syracuse, Pittsburgh, West Virginia, Louisville, Rutgers, Notre Dame and the C7 had overwhelming majority interest to dissolve the conference.  Each could have kept their tournament credits and eliminated their exit fees.

For many reasons, that just doesn't happen.  It won't happen here either.

[panda]

Big 16 says, see Rutgers and Maryland

You're making my point. Rutgers and Maryland have no brand recognition. They're not growing the b10 brand. Usc and ucla will absolutely do that.

Rutgers and Maryland were worthless additions with the idea of eastern expansion. Usc and ucla could be located anywhere and they both carry the name that will excite common fans anywhere. 

[GoldenWarrior11]

I think brand recognition matters much more at this point than market. Houston is an interesting example. While I don't personally know the perception of the university within the city, they could be a huge given their recent commitment athletic success.

However adding a random school from a big market does not boost conference caliber. Smart additions from programs with a track record of success is the way to go moving forward to appeal to a national, streaming audience.

Wish Mike Aresco realized that in 2012 before inviting Memphis, Houston, SMU, UCF, Tulane and ECU.  His media market plan destroyed the TV valuation to pennies on the dollar, cementing the basketball schools to jump ship.