Sweden?

[WarriorDad]

Here is the order on March 25th for Gov Cuomo, the important part is even underlined from his directive.  This is not a federal rule, and he changed course a few weeks ago.  How someone wants to defend this as a federal rule and completely against Science is baffling.  Both sides make mistakes, all levels of gov't have made mistakes.

https://coronavirus.health.ny.gov/system/files/documents/2020/03/doh_covid19-_nhadmissionsreadmissions_-032520.pdf

Paragraph 5.  "No resident shall be denied Re-Admission or admission to the NH (nursing home) solely based on a confirmed or suspected diagnosis of COVID-19.  NHs are prohibited from requiring  hospitalized resident who determined medically stable to be tested for COVID19 prior to admission or readmission"

[Pakuni]

I am grateful to the Swedish people for taking this risk because someone had to do it.  They may be wrong, they may be proven right.

I somehow glossed over this previously, but holy jeebus, this is gross. The Swedish people aren't lab rats to be experimented upon, Cheeks. The idea that someone "had to" take a risk with thousands of lives is inhuman. This isn't some 10th grade biology experiment.
I'd bet anything that is not how the Swedish health authorities view this. I'm sure they acted in what they honestly believed was in their people's best interests. I happen to believe they are wrong, and the evidence to this point sure seems to support that, but no way were they as cavalier with lives as you are.
But no doubt those who have died and their families appreciate your gratitude.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

The people of New York did this.  Nobody knew wild spread was happening.  If 'going for herd immunity' was actually the goal, they did it 'better' and it didn't turn out great. Emerging markets are next for different reasons.  How much more evidence do we need that uncontrolled spread is bad for people- bad for the economy

[WarriorDad]

Not exactly trending positive.

They may be wrong, they may be right.  Someone had to take the chance on this rather than everyone going down the same path. The Swedish people support the action, they want their civil liberties and to be treated like adults to make decisions.  It is not as if everything is open. Most of their deaths have been in nursing homes where they have openly admitted they screwed up.  Our politicians in blue and red states, and the federal level, refuse to admit the tragic handling of nursing homes. 

Still early in the process.

[forgetful]

Here is the order on March 25th for Gov Cuomo, the important part is even underlined from his directive.  This is not a federal rule, and he changed course a few weeks ago.  How someone wants to defend this as a federal rule and completely against Science is baffling.  Both sides make mistakes, all levels of gov't have made mistakes.

https://coronavirus.health.ny.gov/system/files/documents/2020/03/doh_covid19-_nhadmissionsreadmissions_-032520.pdf

Paragraph 5.  "No resident shall be denied Re-Admission or admission to the NH (nursing home) solely based on a confirmed or suspected diagnosis of COVID-19.  NHs are prohibited from requiring  hospitalized resident who determined medically stable to be tested for COVID19 prior to admission or readmission"

Are you being intentionally intellectually dishonest again?

1. The federal rule, that I mentioned, was clearly articulated as a federal rule on who could be admitted to Javits. There was a 25 point checklist, that had to be satisfied, before a patient could be admitted to Javits. It was a federal rule, and precluded the nursing home patients. The 25 point checklist made it almost impossible for patients to be admitted.

2. There is no one debating the language of the original rule. You left off the part of the rule though that stated if they could not properly care for the patient, including maintaining isolation, alternative arrangements would be made. The rule was exactly what you have underlined above, you couldn't deny a patient "solely" due to prior COVID status, you could deny based on inability to care for said patient properly.

If you are looking for a bad guy here, look at the nursing homes that accepted patients they couldn't care for and the nursing homes that were refusing to test patients, and were hiding bodies instead of alerting authorities.

[The Sultan]

They may be wrong, they may be right.  Someone had to take the chance on this rather than everyone going down the same path. The Swedish people support the action, they want their civil liberties and to be treated like adults to make decisions.  It is not as if everything is open. Most of their deaths have been in nursing homes where they have openly admitted they screwed up.  Our politicians in blue and red states, and the federal level, refuse to admit the tragic handling of nursing homes. 

Still early in the process.

Everyone has their civil liberties Cheeks. 

Anyway, continuously defending Sweden isn't really a good look.  But that's never really stopped you before.

[Pakuni]

The National Review was touting Sweden as a model for the world on May 3.
Now even they've jumped ship.

https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/05/how-does-the-swedish-model-look-right-now/#slide-1

[The Sultan]

I will say this, I wish Sweden's approach worked.  Really it would give me reassurance since everything is opening up here.  But I fear it shows that we will be in for a rough ride.

[Hards Alumni]

I will say this, I wish Sweden's approach worked.  Really it would give me reassurance since everything is opening up here.  But I fear it shows that we will be in for a rough ride.

Wholeheartedly agree.  I think we're going to be trying to take care of smaller outbreaks for months.  Hopefully we can keep them under control.

[Big Papi]

The National Review was touting Sweden as a model for the world on May 3.
Now even they've jumped ship.

https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/05/how-does-the-swedish-model-look-right-now/#slide-1

The article itself states that it is too early to tell if their strategy will work.  Meanwhile California has a year's worth of suicide attempts in the last 4 weeks.  We don't know the ramifications of the amounts of deaths that could of been saved due to hospitals being shut down and children are not getting immunized.  Who knows who is counting what data and demographics play a role too.  There could be a second worse wave and who knows what else. 

It sounds like the Swedes are at the moment comfortable with their strategy while ours is a mess.

Its just too early to tell whose strategy is the best or has failed.

 

[tower912]

This is going to be one of those times that the entity involved is going to admit their mistake and 'some people' are still going to be defending the admittedly wrong choice.

[Pakuni]

Meanwhile California has a year's worth of suicide attempts in the last 4 weeks. 

Could you provide some evidence of this, please?

[tower912]

I saw a Washington Examiner quoting a local ABC affiliate in Northern California.

[Pakuni]

I saw a Washington Examiner quoting a local ABC affiliate in Northern California.

I saw that also. It was one doctor from one hospital making a comment on his own experience with no statistical evidence to support it.
I'm wondering how that got that extrapolated for the entire state of California, especially when there's actual evidence to the contrary out there (see below), albeit from just one county ... which is still better than one doctor.

Well, I mean, I do know how it happened. Just look at who's pushing the narrative.

https://www.sanluisobispo.com/news/local/article242738356.html

[forgetful]

Also, there are significantly fewer deaths from the flu, car accidents, etc., due to the quarantine. Let's say there are some areas of increased death too, the net affect, is that overall deaths from other causes are likely down. And we have also saved lives in quarantine from Corona too.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Are you being intentionally intellectually dishonest again?

Always

[WarriorDad]

What would ABBA say about the response?  That is all that really matters.   

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/22/abbas-bjrn-ulvaeus-too-soon-to-decide-on-swedens-virus-response.html

Just like that, UK's rate is back to number one in the world.

No, they are not lab rats and the citizens don't believe they are either.  They continue to support their gov't stance.

One other fact, deaths are on the decline in Sweden.  They may be right, they may be wrong but it is way too early to know.

Long live ABBA.

[WarriorDad]

Cuomo's response to New York Nursing homes is borderline criminal and was not based on science.  It was anti science.  We knew in February how this was impacting the elderly, we knew even more in March.  Somehow you are defending his edict and not giving credit to DeSantis for actually using science to purposely not make the same mistake.

This is how locked into biases people are that as long as a D or a R is next to their name, they prejudge the outcomes without looking at the data.  There is no defense for Cuomo in NHs and DeSantis got it right.  One used science, the other did not.

Need to catch a flight for the weekend.  Everyone be safe.

[Lennys Tap]

What would ABBA say about the response?  That is all that really matters.   

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/22/abbas-bjrn-ulvaeus-too-soon-to-decide-on-swedens-virus-response.html

Just like that, UK's rate is back to number one in the world.

No, they are not lab rats and the citizens don't believe they are either.  They continue to support their gov't stance.

One other fact, deaths are on the decline in Sweden.  They may be right, they may be wrong but it is way too early to know.

Long live ABBA.

"Fernando" is one of the worst "hit" songs of all time. God, how I hate ABBA.

[Uncle Rico]

"Fernando" is one of the worst "hit" songs of all time. God, how I hate ABBA.

I heard "Fernando" a day or two ago and couldn't turn it off because it was so bad. 

[ZiggysFryBoy]

"Fernando" is one of the worst "hit" songs of all time. God, how I hate ABBA.

Thanks for the earworm, lenny, you basterd.   

[TSmith34, Inc.]

"Fernando" is one of the worst "hit" songs of all time. God, how I hate ABBA.

Spot on.

[Pakuni]

Say what you want about ABBA, but they've brought Scoop an exceedingly rare area of total agreement.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Say what you want about ABBA, but they've brought Scoop an exceedingly rare area of total agreement.

Kumbaya, pakuni.   

[WarriorDad]

Important link? 

Vitamin D deficiency and COVID deaths. 

https://youtu.be/tBSfIckPV44


In the clip, mentions African Americans in particular because melanin in skin often causes deficiency in Vitamin D.  Also mentions the Somalis in Sweden and other African immigrants in countries like the UK and northern nations.  Somalis make up 5% of Swedish deaths despite only 1% of the population.

Vitamin D appears to be a potential link to Sweden, African Americans and the general idea pushed by some scientists that the Sun is a good thing in the battle against the virus.