COVID-19 (f/k/a "the Coronavirus")

[pacearrow02]

That's not how this works and you know it.

Not with the delta variant. 70% would have been enough before delta spread. Now it's not.

Science moves. Treatments change.

That's right, forgot about delta....damn the luck!!!

[tower912]

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/u-labor-revival-doubt-delta-100651590.html

[jesmu84]

That's right, forgot about delta....damn the luck!!!

Congrats on being the 2nd most disingenuous poster on the board

[Skatastrophy]

Congrats on being the 2nd most disingenuous poster on the board

That's generous of you. I just assume they're sincere idiots.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

I believe I saw today we are now at Biden's goal of 70% of Americans getting at least their first shot.  So we hit his goal yet still seem to be on a path back to mask mandates and other restrictions.  We did our part (generally speaking) and helped the administration hit their goal, albeit a couple weeks late.  Now it's their time to hold up their end of the bargain and let us return to normal without threat of increased restrictions etc.

Disingenuous trolling. Again.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

forgetful, gooo, care to weigh in on lambda?

https://www.news-medical.net/news/20210730/Scientists-suspect-Lambda-SARS-CoV-2-variant-most-dangerous.aspx

[MU82]

When's it going to end, hey?

I suggest you direct your question to all of your heroes who haven't been doing their part, nu?

[pacearrow02]

Disingenuous trolling. Again.

What's disingenuous or trolling about that post?  Biden said once we hit 70% we can go back to normal, we're there and the vaccine is proving to be very effective against Delta?

Do you not believe in the efficacy of the vaccine?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

What's disingenuous or trolling about that post?  Biden said once we hit 70% we can go back to normal, we're there and the vaccine is proving to be very effective against Delta?

Do you not believe in the efficacy of the vaccine?

[pacearrow02]

Good talk.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

forgetful, gooo, care to weigh in on lambda?

https://www.news-medical.net/news/20210730/Scientists-suspect-Lambda-SARS-CoV-2-variant-most-dangerous.aspx

We're all gonna die.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

We're all gonna die.

Eventually. I'd like not to hasten it unnecessarily though.

[jesmu84]

What's disingenuous or trolling about that post?  Biden said once we hit 70% we can go back to normal, we're there and the vaccine is proving to be very effective against Delta?

Do you not believe in the efficacy of the vaccine?

Are you concerned with unchecked spread of Delta through unvaccinated populations could lead to more variants that perhaps will be worse?

Do you acknowledge that variables have changed since his statement?

[pacearrow02]

Are you concerned with unchecked spread of Delta through unvaccinated populations could lead to more variants that perhaps will be worse?

Do you acknowledge that variables have changed since his statement?

No I don't agree things have changed.  There is a new variant that current vaccines are highly effective against in preventing serious illness and/or death.  There were multiple variants then, there are multiple variants now.  Until one proves resistant to any of the current vaccines what has really changed?

[pacearrow02]

Are you concerned with unchecked spread of Delta through unvaccinated populations could lead to more variants that perhaps will be worse?

Do you acknowledge that variables have changed since his statement?

And no I'm not concerned about the unchecked spread amongst the unvaccinated.  They have had ample opportunity to get the poke. 

[cheebs09]

And no I'm not concerned about the unchecked spread amongst the unvaccinated.  They have had ample opportunity to get the poke.

Not if they are under 12. Also, while still very effective, I think vaccines are less effective against Delta.

I'm vaccinated and not all that worried about Delta for myself. However, still nervous for my daughter. As others have said, unvaccinated is not just those who choose not to get the poke. The good news is I think the outcomes are still pretty good for kids with this.

[pacearrow02]

Not if they are under 12. Also, while still very effective, I think vaccines are less effective against Delta.

I'm vaccinated and not all that worried about Delta for myself. However, still nervous for my daughter. As others have said, unvaccinated is not just those who choose not to get the poke. The good news is I think the outcomes are still pretty good for kids with this.

Outcomes are still very good for kids.  From what I've seen even delta poses much less of a risk then influenza to kids.

We were over the moon with j&j being 67% effective against initial strains of Covid.  mRNA is much more effective then 67% against Delta.  If it was good enough then, should be good enough now.

[jesmu84]

And no I'm not concerned about the unchecked spread amongst the unvaccinated.  They have had ample opportunity to get the poke.

You missed the 2nd part of that question.

[jesmu84]

No I don't agree things have changed.  There is a new variant that current vaccines are highly effective against in preventing serious illness and/or death.  There were multiple variants then, there are multiple variants now.  Until one proves resistant to any of the current vaccines what has really changed?

Well, then you're objectively wrong.

At the time Biden said that, Delta was not rampaging around the US.

Had the US achieved 70% before Delta got here, we likely wouldn't be talking about Delta at all.

And, again, unchecked variant spread begets new variants. Why would you demand we wait until a worse variant presents itself? Why not prevent, as much as we can, that new variant from even forming?

You should go read up on some virology.

[pacearrow02]

You missed the 2nd part of that question.

What's the second part?  The what if about future potential variants.  Until we have global her immunity there will always be new variants.  Delta came from India, had nothing to do with us reaching 70% sooner.

[forgetful]

forgetful, gooo, care to weigh in on lambda?

https://www.news-medical.net/news/20210730/Scientists-suspect-Lambda-SARS-CoV-2-variant-most-dangerous.aspx

There have been a couple disheartening developments lately, both still not peer-reviewed (this is one of them). Lambda looks to combine the ease of spread of Delta with variants that evade the existing neutralizing antibodies. That's a bad combination. It also was prevalent in Chile, where vaccination rates are high.

It highlights the risks of variants spreading widely amongst the vaccinated/unvaccinated. It puts a selective pressure (vaccination) on the virus that can lead to the emergence of escape variants. Let's see what additional research comes out on the degree to which Delta can escape existing vaccines. It is certainly a worrisome development.

The other is data coming out of Rockefeller University that shows that although booster shots can increase antibody levels, they are unlikely to boost resistance to escape variants. Which means new versions of the vaccine will need to be developed. The good news is both Pfizer and Moderna are already looking at this...the question is which variant to design the booster vaccine off of.

The good news from the Rockefeller study, those that were infected, and then later got a vaccine have antibodies that are broadly efficacious agains all current variants of concern.

[pacearrow02]

There have been a couple disheartening developments lately, both still not peer-reviewed (this is one of them). Lambda looks to combine the ease of spread of Delta with variants that evade the existing neutralizing antibodies. That's a bad combination. It also was prevalent in Chile, where vaccination rates are high.

It highlights the risks of variants spreading widely amongst the vaccinated/unvaccinated. It puts a selective pressure (vaccination) on the virus that can lead to the emergence of escape variants. Let's see what additional research comes out on the degree to which Delta can escape existing vaccines. It is certainly a worrisome development.

The other is data coming out of Rockefeller University that shows that although booster shots can increase antibody levels, they are unlikely to boost resistance to escape variants. Which means new versions of the vaccine will need to be developed. The good news is both Pfizer and Moderna are already looking at this...the question is which variant to design the booster vaccine off of.

The good news from the Rockefeller study, those that were infected, and then later got a vaccine have antibodies that are broadly efficacious agains all current variants of concern.

Am i understanding escape variants correctly.  They emerge from people getting  the existing vaccines?

[forgetful]

Am i understanding escape variants correctly.  They emerge from people getting  the existing vaccines?

You are not. Variants emerge as due to natural selection. Variants that spread more readily eventually out compete (for hosts) other variants. This is most likely to occur as a natural process in unvaccinated individuals.

What can occur in vaccinated/or previously infected individuals, is that over time selective pressures can develop, e.g. immunity to the original form of the virus, whether natural immunity or vaccine-based immunity. If a virus can get hold in these populations, possibly due to a weakened immune system, then any mutations that occur during normal replication that enhance infectivity will win. In my opinion, the presence of a selective pressure leads to a more likely possibility of an escape variant; albeit with a caveat...it is much less likely a virus will be replicating in a vaccinated host. We use these selective pressures in many laboratory experiments to evolve proteins, or organisms with desired traits.

Although unlikely, a replicating virus in a "immune" host can lead to a true escape variant. That is why it is important to vaccinate EVERYONE. No hosts to spread, no risk of variants.

There are some situations that can increase this low level likelihood though. Some of the original variants developed in people with compromised immune systems that retained low-level replicating virus for months. That kind of environment allows a lot of time for mutations to accumulate.

[pacearrow02]

You are not. Variants emerge as due to natural selection. Variants that spread more readily eventually out compete (for hosts) other variants. This is most likely to occur as a natural process in unvaccinated individuals.

What can occur in vaccinated/or previously infected individuals, is that over time selective pressures can develop, e.g. immunity to the original form of the virus, whether natural immunity or vaccine-based immunity. If a virus can get hold in these populations, possibly due to a weakened immune system, then any mutations that occur during normal replication that enhance infectivity will win. In my opinion, the presence of a selective pressure leads to a more likely possibility of an escape variant; albeit with a caveat...it is much less likely a virus will be replicating in a vaccinated host. We use these selective pressures in many laboratory experiments to evolve proteins, or organisms with desired traits.

Although unlikely, a replicating virus in a "immune" host can lead to a true escape variant. That is why it is important to vaccinate EVERYONE. No hosts to spread, no risk of variants.

There are some situations that can increase this low level likelihood though. Some of the original variants developed in people with compromised immune systems that retained low-level replicating virus for months. That kind of environment allows a lot of time for mutations to accumulate.

Phew!!  Next time starting and ending with "you are not" works for me but appreciate the explanation.  Didn't understand half of it but was relieved by the little I did learn. 👍

[pbiflyer]

And we have teachers who don't want to teach, business owners who are either hurting or gone out completely, people who don't want to work, landlords who can't collect their due rent, unmeasurable psychological issues related to covid and its handling, etc., etc.
When's it going to end, hey?

Probably never with idiots like this:

Top RNC official in Florida spreads Covid-19 conspiracies, calling vaccines the 'mark of the beast'
https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/02/politics/kfile-rnc-peter-feaman-covid-19-vaccine/index.html

Amid recent surging coronavirus cases in Florida, a top Republican National Committee official in the state has spread anti-vaccine rhetoric and misinformation, comparing the Biden administration's vaccine efforts to Nazi-era "brown shirts," and twice calling the vaccines "the mark of the beast," comparable to a "false god."

Feaman is one of three officials representing Florida in the governing body of the RNC, the political committee which leads the Republican Party. He has served in the position since 2012.
His reelection to the position in 2020 at an annual Florida Republican Party meeting was supported by state party chairman Joe Gruters, and he was previously appointed to nomination commissions for state and federal judges by Sen. Marco Rubio and then-Florida Gov. Rick Scott. He also served as an elector in the 2016 and 2020 presidential election.