Quentin Grimes not living up to expectations at KU

[mu03eng]

Grimes isn’t explosive at all - which is the trait I value most in a player. Can’t really coach up explosion, but a guy can become a good shooter with enough effort.

Can we leave this kind of talk in the Nut Puncher thread?

[skianth16]

Why does this have to happen to every single thread. I swear, half of the heavy posters here are more interested in talking to/about Ners than they are MU basketball. Why bring it up? Why intentionally try to ruin another thread with this garbage.

[Pakuni]

Grimes isn’t explosive at all - which is the trait I value most in a player. Can’t really coach up explosion, but a guy can become a good shooter with enough effort.

Not explosive. At all.

https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/status/992189486724468736

[mu03eng]

Why does this have to happen to every single thread. I swear, half of the heavy posters here are more interested in talking to/about Ners than they are MU basketball. Why bring it up? Why intentionally try to ruin another thread with this garbage.

Tries to stop the Ners talk from ruining another thread by.....talking about Ners

[wadesworld]

Not explosive. At all.

https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/status/992189486724468736

Yeah.  The guy is freakishly athletic.  He was considered one of the best slashers in a class with Cam Reddish, Zion Williamson, etc.

He's not putting up ginormous numbers on a completely stacked, #1 team in the country.  Not super surprising.  Nor does it seem to be super concerning to NBA scouts as he'll be making millions a year from now.

[esotericmindguy]

Why does this have to happen to every single thread. I swear, half of the heavy posters here are more interested in talking to/about Ners than they are MU basketball. Why bring it up? Why intentionally try to ruin another thread with this garbage.

Same reason the neck size, high fives and  “cooling” on a player is brought up. Most of the people on this board are morons.

[MU82]

What percentage of your posts do you feel make reference to me?  You are on bizarre dude 82.

2.44%

[Floorslapper]

Yeah.  The guy is freakishly athletic.  He was considered one of the best slashers in a class with Cam Reddish, Zion Williamson, etc.

He's not putting up ginormous numbers on a completely stacked, #1 team in the country.  Not super surprising.  Nor does it seem to be super concerning to NBA scouts as he'll be making millions a year from now.

He's not freakishly athletic.  Dunking a basketball with zero defensive resistance as a 6'5" kid in open gym over a kid in jeans doesn't = freakishly athletic.

I agree he'll get paid millions in the NBA based on age and projected upside.  Granted I've only watched him play against MU, but he just doesn't strike me as a guy that will be an impact player this year in NCAA, and probably as a result not at NBA level even in 3-years.

BTW - Kansas is not going to be a Number 1 seed come March.  Overrated at present.

[wadesworld]

He's not freakishly athletic.  Dunking a basketball with zero defensive resistance as a 6'5" kid in open gym over a kid in jeans doesn't = freakishly athletic.

I agree he'll get paid millions in the NBA based on age and projected upside.  Granted I've only watched him play against MU, but he just doesn't strike me as a guy that will be an impact player this year in NCAA, and probably as a result not at NBA level even in 3-years.

BTW - Kansas is not going to be a Number 1 seed come March.  Overrated at present.

Kansas will be a 1 seed and might be the 1 overall seed.

Grimes was considered a top 5 recruit and a future lottery pick based on his athleticism and strength for a guard.  The questions about him were his consistency with his shot and his effort defensively.  Look at any draft profile for him and the two things first mentioned are "athleticism" and "strong."

nbadraft.net lists his athleticism as 8/10. (For reference, Zion is listed as 10, RJ Barrett as 8, Cam Reddish as 9, Romeo Langford as 8)

I know you can do all of these things and more so it's not as impressive to you as it is to the rest of us band members, but he is very, very athletic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfDEoTaiDh8

He's a guy trying to figure out his way going from being the best player on the court every game to being a guy who's got 5-7 other guys just as good as he is on his own team.

[Its DJOver]

He's not freakishly athletic.  Dunking a basketball with zero defensive resistance as a 6'5" kid in open gym over a kid in jeans doesn't = freakishly athletic.

I agree he'll get paid millions in the NBA based on age and projected upside.  Granted I've only watched him play against MU, but he just doesn't strike me as a guy that will be an impact player this year in NCAA, and probably as a result not at NBA level even in 3-years.

BTW - Kansas is not going to be a Number 1 seed come March.  Overrated at present.

Disagree with the bolded.  Gonzaga should get one.  One of Duke and UVA should get one.  There are enough good but not great teams in the B14 to beat Mich and drop them off the 1 line (@UW, @I4, @MSU). The MW is too weak for Nevada to get one, and KU already has the head to head with Tenn.  I haven't seen Texas Tech play at all, but based on our game with KSU, KU should roll, and I don't think there's enough talent in the B12 to match them.  If they win the conference and conference tourney, there's no way they don't get a 1.

[Goose]

esotericmindguy

Great post!!

[4everwarriors]

Same reason the neck size, high fives and  “cooling” on a player is brought up. Most of the people on this board are morons.

Pics, hey?

[brewcity77]

BTW - Kansas is not going to be a Number 1 seed come March.  Overrated at present.

They could be a 1-seed, but they are definitely overrated at present. They are incredibly lucky to be 8-0. They had to rally from behind in the second half to beat Marquette, Tennessee, Stanford, and New Mexico State. They could very easily be 4-4 and unranked right now.

Michigan, Duke, Gonzaga, and Virginia will all likely be strong contenders for 1-seeds. Nevada could legitimately go undefeated into the Tournament. I wouldn't rule the Jayhawks out yet, but they have not played like a top-5 team.

[wadesworld]

They could be a 1-seed, but they are definitely overrated at present. They are incredibly lucky to be 8-0. They had to rally from behind in the second half to beat Marquette, Tennessee, Stanford, and New Mexico State. They could very easily be 4-4 and unranked right now.

Michigan, Duke, Gonzaga, and Virginia will all likely be strong contenders for 1-seeds. Nevada could legitimately go undefeated into the Tournament. I wouldn't rule the Jayhawks out yet, but they have not played like a top-5 team.

They could not "easily be 4-4."  And they are not overrated.  Who would you rate ahead of them?

They have a neutral court beatdown of top 10 Michigan State, a neutral court comfortable win over top 25 Marquette, a neutral court overtime win over top 3 Tennessee, and haven't lost a game this season.  The only teams you could reasonably argue should be ahead of Kansas are Virginia and Michigan, and neither of them have close to a single win as good as Kansas's 2 best wins, and you could even argue Kansas's 3rd best win is better than any win Virginia or Michigan have.

[PGsHeroes32]

Can’t fault the kid for going to f’ing Kansas

I do really think he woulda been better off coming here college wise tho.

Either way he’s making the big bucks so going for the more sure thing(Kansas and a big12 title) is never dumb

[wadesworld]

Can’t fault the kid for going to f’ing Kansas

I do really think he woulda been better off coming here college wise tho.

Either way he’s making the big bucks so going for the more sure thing(Kansas and a big12 title) is never dumb

He’s also getting a head start on making money playing basketball by going to Kansas.

[brewcity77]

They could not "easily be 4-4."  And they are not overrated.  Who would you rate ahead of them?

They have a neutral court beatdown of top 10 Michigan State, a neutral court comfortable win over top 25 Marquette, a neutral court overtime win over top 3 Tennessee, and haven't lost a game this season.  The only teams you could reasonably argue should be ahead of Kansas are Virginia and Michigan, and neither of them have close to a single win as good as Kansas's 2 best wins, and you could even argue Kansas's 3rd best win is better than any win Virginia or Michigan have.

I'm pretty confident you haven't watched Kansas much. They went to overtime twice. Either could've been a loss. They had to rally from second half deficits against us and New Mexico State. Either could've easily been a loss. There's really no debate that they snatched victory from the jaws of defeat four times. That's easily 4-4.

Who would I rate ahead of them? Quite obviously Michigan, who has by far the best resume in the country. Because it's not just what you do but how you do it. Michigan has generally blown out their opponents & they have gone on the road. While Kansas is barely getting past Stanford and NMSU on their own floor, Michigan is trouncing Villanova & getting past a Northwestern team that's better than anyone Kansas has played at home on theirs. I would also have Virginia ahead of them because their wins have been decisive while Kansas is really struggling with mediocre competition at home.

Kansas has to be 3 on the basis of resume but I don't think they're the third best team in the country right now. Duke, Gonzaga, & Tennessee have all looked more impressive, but KU lucked out against UT.

And seriously...KU could very, very easily be 4-4. That's not a joke or overstatement by any stretch of the imagination.

[Its DJOver]

I'm pretty confident you haven't watched Kansas much. They went to overtime twice. Either could've been a loss. They had to rally from second half deficits against us and New Mexico State. Either could've easily been a loss. There's really no debate that they snatched victory from the jaws of defeat four times. That's easily 4-4.

Who would I rate ahead of them? Quite obviously Michigan, who has by far the best resume in the country. Because it's not just what you do but how you do it. Michigan has generally blown out their opponents & they have gone on the road. While Kansas is barely getting past Stanford and NMSU on their own floor, Michigan is trouncing Villanova & getting past a Northwestern team that's better than anyone Kansas has played at home on theirs. I would also have Virginia ahead of them because their wins have been decisive while Kansas is really struggling with mediocre competition at home.

Kansas has to be 3 on the basis of resume but I don't think they're the third best team in the country right now. Duke, Gonzaga, & Tennessee have all looked more impressive, but KU lucked out against UT.

And seriously...KU could very, very easily be 4-4. That's not a joke or overstatement by any stretch of the imagination.

None of that will matter come March.  How many seed lines did Xavier drop because they had 12 1-2 possession games?  They could have easily lost to East Tenn St, or Marshall in their non con, but they didn't.  4 point win at MU, 5 point win vs DePaul, 6 point win vs StJ, OT against both Gtown and BU, 1 point win at CU, 3 point win at DePaul.  If almost losing games mattered, they would not have gotten a 1. 

Bottom line it that in their non con, Kansas could get 5 wins against teams that end the season ranked (MSU, MU, TENN, NOVA, ASU).  Whether or not those wins were pretty won't matter.  Also, who in the B12 will beat them.  I'll admit to not seeing any Texas Tech, but KSU shouldn't trouble them.  Oklahoma?  The fighting Shakas?

[wadesworld]

I'm pretty confident you haven't watched Kansas much. They went to overtime twice. Either could've been a loss. They had to rally from second half deficits against us and New Mexico State. Either could've easily been a loss. There's really no debate that they snatched victory from the jaws of defeat four times. That's easily 4-4.

Who would I rate ahead of them? Quite obviously Michigan, who has by far the best resume in the country. Because it's not just what you do but how you do it. Michigan has generally blown out their opponents & they have gone on the road. While Kansas is barely getting past Stanford and NMSU on their own floor, Michigan is trouncing Villanova & getting past a Northwestern team that's better than anyone Kansas has played at home on theirs. I would also have Virginia ahead of them because their wins have been decisive while Kansas is really struggling with mediocre competition at home.

Kansas has to be 3 on the basis of resume but I don't think they're the third best team in the country right now. Duke, Gonzaga, & Tennessee have all looked more impressive, but KU lucked out against UT.

And seriously...KU could very, very easily be 4-4. That's not a joke or overstatement by any stretch of the imagination.

Oh good God. This might be the most outlandish post I’ve ever seen on Scoop. Absolutely hysterical.

[brewcity77]

Xavier though was generally an exception. I'm not saying KU can't earn a 1-seed. My first on the topic acknowledged that. I'm saying they are lucky and overrated. The odds are they will regress to the mean as the season goes on and games that could be wins will be losses.

As far as who in the Big 12 will beat them, I'd say the better question is who couldn't? After watching them against Stanford and NMSU, I think they could lose to anyone in that league on their home floor, and definitely on the road. The worst teams in the Big 12 are better than the teams that very nearly beat Kansas already at Phog Allen.

History tells us they'll win the league, but recent history tells us they aren't remotely as good as their record.

[Its DJOver]

As far as who in the Big 12 will beat them, I'd say the better question is who couldn't? After watching them against Stanford and NMSU, I think they could lose to anyone in that league on their home floor, and definitely on the road. The worst teams in the Big 12 are better than the teams that very nearly beat Kansas already at Phog Allen.

You can say the exact same thing for Mich, UVA, and Duke though.  There are 5 ACC teams in the top 15, there is a much higher chance that they all beat up on each other than UVA goes 17-1 again.  There are 6 ranked B14 teams as well as 4 additional receiving votes.  Now I think a lot of those teams are overrated but that's still a lot of quality opponents that can beat Michigan.  Of the undefeated team (with the exception of non P6, sorry Houston, Furman, and Nevada), Kansas has by far the easiest path to 0-2 losses, and already having 2 top 10 wins, it's fair to say that they've been lucky thus far, but the are ranked appropriately.

[skianth16]

As far as who in the Big 12 will beat them, I'd say the better question is who couldn't? After watching them against Stanford and NMSU, I think they could lose to anyone in that league on their home floor, and definitely on the road. The worst teams in the Big 12 are better than the teams that very nearly beat Kansas already at Phog Allen.

Come on. The Big 12 has some talent this year, but Kansas will still probably win the league. And that has nothing to do with the last 10-20 years. It's because the team this year is very talented. Sure, they've had a couple games where they started out slow, but I don't know if that makes them overrated. It certainly doesn't mean that every team in their conference is capable of beating them.

[skianth16]

Can’t fault the kid for going to f’ing Kansas

I do really think he woulda been better off coming here college wise tho.

Either way he’s making the big bucks so going for the more sure thing(Kansas and a big12 title) is never dumb

When you say he would have been better off at MU, do you mean because we have better academics? Or do you mean from a development standpoint?

[MU82]

They could be a 1-seed, but they are definitely overrated at present. They are incredibly lucky to be 8-0. They had to rally from behind in the second half to beat Marquette, Tennessee, Stanford, and New Mexico State. They could very easily be 4-4 and unranked right now.

Michigan, Duke, Gonzaga, and Virginia will all likely be strong contenders for 1-seeds. Nevada could legitimately go undefeated into the Tournament. I wouldn't rule the Jayhawks out yet, but they have not played like a top-5 team.

Or maybe this is a sign of a very good team that has resilience, good clutch players and good coaching down the stretch of games -- all signs of a team that can win bigly in March.

I'm always leery to say a team "could be" such-and-such record or "should be" such-and-such. A team's record usually (not always, but usually) is what it is supposed to be, and "luck" usually (not always, but usually) is a product of talent, hard work and good preparation.

FWIW (not much IMHO), Self has said several times that his team is "not very good." It's pretty obviously a way to tamp down expectations and to motivate his players, but he publicly is agreeing with you, brewski.

[brewcity77]

You can say the exact same thing for Mich, UVA, and Duke though.

That they'll lose conference games? Sure. But in terms of looking vulnerable against inferior competition? Not at all. Duke has handled everyone except Gonzaga comfortably, including teams that are at least decent like Kentucky, San Diego State, Indiana, and Yale. Same goes for Virginia, who had some close margins but were really only in danger of losing once against VCU.

The "Kansas is overrated" logic is because they have looked very unconvincing against weak opponents. Give them the same record but double digit wins against Stanford and NMSU and it would be a different story. The record doesn't raise questions. How they got there certainly does.