MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: Slick on December 10, 2018, 04:51:07 PM
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https://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article222861665.html#navlink=SecList
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Glad we cooled on him
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Awwwww. Along the same lines, Jahvon Quinerly, a 5-star freshman PG, has only played in 7 of Villanova's 10 games and is not even seeing double digit minutes.
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Awwwww. Along the same lines, Jahvon Quinerly, a 5-star freshman PG, has only played in 7 of Villanova's 10 games and is not even seeing double digit minutes.
Jay doesn't play him or let him develop. the talent is there no doubt. he has struggled in the tiny stretches he gets but no reason he shouldn't see 12 min a game
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Glad we cooled on him
Did we cool on him or did he just pick KU over us lol?
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Jay doesn't play him or let him develop. the talent is there no doubt. he has struggled in the tiny stretches he gets but no reason he shouldn't see 12 min a game
Jay has earned the wright to dictate playing time.
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Jay has earned the wright to dictate playing time.
Yes. no debate there
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Jay has earned the wright to dictate playing time.
Nice.
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Did we cool on him or did he just pick KU over us lol?
It’s an inside joke that 5 people on this board think is funny.
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Just checked Grimes' kenpom player comps, most similar is Katin Reinhardt's frosh year at UNLV, thought that was pretty funny
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It’s an inside joke that everyone but 5 people on this board think is funny.
FIFY
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Did we cool on him or did he just pick KU over us lol?
Us.
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FIFY
Sure. 4 others and this chick.
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Jay doesn't play him or let him develop. the talent is there no doubt. he has struggled in the tiny stretches he gets but no reason he shouldn't see 12 min a game
Stoopid Jay Wright. What does he know? I hope Wright at least asked Ners for his input.
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Stoopid Jay Wright. What does he know? I hope Wright at least asked Ners for his input.
Let he who can dunk cast the first criticism
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Jay doesn't play him or let him develop. the talent is there no doubt. he has struggled in the tiny stretches he gets but no reason he shouldn't see 12 min a game
Jay teaching lesson about the importance of team, culture, practicing hard etc.
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Can you imagine if we got a 5* like Quinerly and then Wojo didn't play him? Especially if we lost a couple of games we were supposed to win? Yikes! Scoopageddon!
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Can you imagine if we got a 5* like Quinerly and then Wojo didn't play him? Especially if we lost a couple of games we were supposed to win? Yikes! Scoopageddon!
Hiroshima!.
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Wait, I've got this. ......you can't compare decisions that Wojo may or may not make to Jay Wright until Wojo wins two national championships. Because even though Jay Wright started slow at Villanova, it is an irrelevant comparison because he was still Jay Wright and Wojo is dumb. Pointing out ANY other coach's first 4+ years to Wojo is an excercise in futility because Wojo didn't do as well as I thought he should have done his first year. Fire Wojo, because it took overtime to beat Wisconsin!.....
There, how'd I do?
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There, how'd I do?
C+
You left out:
* huddles
* obvious obviousness that wojo can't coach
* wojo can't recruit good enough players to win
* players have regressed under wojo
* Marquette spends too much to accept mediocrity
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Wait, I've got this. ......you can't compare decisions that Wojo may or may not make to Jay Wright until Wojo wins two national championships. Because even though Jay Wright started slow at Villanova, it is an irrelevant comparison because he was still Jay Wright and Wojo is dumb. Pointing out ANY other coach's first 4+ years to Wojo is an excercise in futility because Wojo didn't do as well as I thought he should have done his first year. Fire Wojo, because it took overtime to beat Wisconsin!.....
There, how'd I do?
Oscar Worthy.
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Wait, I've got this. ......you can't compare decisions that Wojo may or may not make to Jay Wright until Wojo wins two national championships. Because even though Jay Wright started slow at Villanova, it is an irrelevant comparison because he was still Jay Wright and Wojo is dumb. Pointing out ANY other coach's first 4+ years to Wojo is an excercise in futility because Wojo didn't do as well as I thought he should have done his first year. Fire Wojo, because it took overtime to beat Wisconsin!.....
There, how'd I do?
It was OK, but your failure to mention Deonte Burton, John Dawson or volleyball is a bit de-motivating.
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C+
You left out:
* huddles
* obvious obviousness that wojo can't coach
* wojo can't recruit good enough players to win
* players have regressed under wojo
* Marquette spends too much to accept mediocrity but hey, at least the players do service work so that they can put it on their Instagram account to make it look like the money is being used on something worthwhile while the team flies the cushy life and gets smoked.
FIFY.
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C+
You left out:
* huddles
* obvious obviousness that wojo can't coach
* wojo can't recruit good enough players to win
* players have regressed under wojo
* Marquette spends too much to accept mediocrity
* Scoop Intelligencia
FIFY part 2
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Stoopid Jay Wright. What does he know? I hope Wright at least asked Ners for his input.
What percentage of your posts do you feel make reference to me? You are on bizarre dude 82.
As for Grimes - Not surprised to hear he’s underperforming his 5-star rating. Was not impressed with his game at all as he played against us. Can see why Wojo and staff seemed to like him, though, as he seems to be the more fundamental type of player, versus being the really great athlete.
Grimes isn’t explosive at all - which is the trait I value most in a player. Can’t really coach up explosion, but a guy can become a good shooter with enough effort.
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Grimes isn’t explosive at all - which is the trait I value most in a player. Can’t really coach up explosion, but a guy can become a good shooter with enough effort.
Can we leave this kind of talk in the Nut Puncher thread?
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Why does this have to happen to every single thread. I swear, half of the heavy posters here are more interested in talking to/about Ners than they are MU basketball. Why bring it up? Why intentionally try to ruin another thread with this garbage.
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Grimes isn’t explosive at all - which is the trait I value most in a player. Can’t really coach up explosion, but a guy can become a good shooter with enough effort.
Not explosive. At all.
https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/status/992189486724468736 (https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/status/992189486724468736)
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Why does this have to happen to every single thread. I swear, half of the heavy posters here are more interested in talking to/about Ners than they are MU basketball. Why bring it up? Why intentionally try to ruin another thread with this garbage.
Tries to stop the Ners talk from ruining another thread by.....talking about Ners
(https://media.tenor.com/images/fa3143e89d76490bdf83835cbd3d9fed/tenor.gif)
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Not explosive. At all.
https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/status/992189486724468736 (https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/status/992189486724468736)
Yeah. The guy is freakishly athletic. He was considered one of the best slashers in a class with Cam Reddish, Zion Williamson, etc.
He's not putting up ginormous numbers on a completely stacked, #1 team in the country. Not super surprising. Nor does it seem to be super concerning to NBA scouts as he'll be making millions a year from now.
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Why does this have to happen to every single thread. I swear, half of the heavy posters here are more interested in talking to/about Ners than they are MU basketball. Why bring it up? Why intentionally try to ruin another thread with this garbage.
Same reason the neck size, high fives and “cooling” on a player is brought up. Most of the people on this board are morons.
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What percentage of your posts do you feel make reference to me? You are on bizarre dude 82.
2.44%
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Yeah. The guy is freakishly athletic. He was considered one of the best slashers in a class with Cam Reddish, Zion Williamson, etc.
He's not putting up ginormous numbers on a completely stacked, #1 team in the country. Not super surprising. Nor does it seem to be super concerning to NBA scouts as he'll be making millions a year from now.
He's not freakishly athletic. Dunking a basketball with zero defensive resistance as a 6'5" kid in open gym over a kid in jeans doesn't = freakishly athletic.
I agree he'll get paid millions in the NBA based on age and projected upside. Granted I've only watched him play against MU, but he just doesn't strike me as a guy that will be an impact player this year in NCAA, and probably as a result not at NBA level even in 3-years.
BTW - Kansas is not going to be a Number 1 seed come March. Overrated at present.
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He's not freakishly athletic. Dunking a basketball with zero defensive resistance as a 6'5" kid in open gym over a kid in jeans doesn't = freakishly athletic.
I agree he'll get paid millions in the NBA based on age and projected upside. Granted I've only watched him play against MU, but he just doesn't strike me as a guy that will be an impact player this year in NCAA, and probably as a result not at NBA level even in 3-years.
BTW - Kansas is not going to be a Number 1 seed come March. Overrated at present.
Kansas will be a 1 seed and might be the 1 overall seed.
Grimes was considered a top 5 recruit and a future lottery pick based on his athleticism and strength for a guard. The questions about him were his consistency with his shot and his effort defensively. Look at any draft profile for him and the two things first mentioned are "athleticism" and "strong."
nbadraft.net lists his athleticism as 8/10. (For reference, Zion is listed as 10, RJ Barrett as 8, Cam Reddish as 9, Romeo Langford as 8)
I know you can do all of these things and more so it's not as impressive to you as it is to the rest of us band members, but he is very, very athletic:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfDEoTaiDh8
He's a guy trying to figure out his way going from being the best player on the court every game to being a guy who's got 5-7 other guys just as good as he is on his own team.
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He's not freakishly athletic. Dunking a basketball with zero defensive resistance as a 6'5" kid in open gym over a kid in jeans doesn't = freakishly athletic.
I agree he'll get paid millions in the NBA based on age and projected upside. Granted I've only watched him play against MU, but he just doesn't strike me as a guy that will be an impact player this year in NCAA, and probably as a result not at NBA level even in 3-years.
BTW - Kansas is not going to be a Number 1 seed come March. Overrated at present.
Disagree with the bolded. Gonzaga should get one. One of Duke and UVA should get one. There are enough good but not great teams in the B14 to beat Mich and drop them off the 1 line (@UW, @I4, @MSU). The MW is too weak for Nevada to get one, and KU already has the head to head with Tenn. I haven't seen Texas Tech play at all, but based on our game with KSU, KU should roll, and I don't think there's enough talent in the B12 to match them. If they win the conference and conference tourney, there's no way they don't get a 1.
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esotericmindguy
Great post!!
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Same reason the neck size, high fives and “cooling” on a player is brought up. Most of the people on this board are morons.
Pics, hey?
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BTW - Kansas is not going to be a Number 1 seed come March. Overrated at present.
They could be a 1-seed, but they are definitely overrated at present. They are incredibly lucky to be 8-0. They had to rally from behind in the second half to beat Marquette, Tennessee, Stanford, and New Mexico State. They could very easily be 4-4 and unranked right now.
Michigan, Duke, Gonzaga, and Virginia will all likely be strong contenders for 1-seeds. Nevada could legitimately go undefeated into the Tournament. I wouldn't rule the Jayhawks out yet, but they have not played like a top-5 team.
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They could be a 1-seed, but they are definitely overrated at present. They are incredibly lucky to be 8-0. They had to rally from behind in the second half to beat Marquette, Tennessee, Stanford, and New Mexico State. They could very easily be 4-4 and unranked right now.
Michigan, Duke, Gonzaga, and Virginia will all likely be strong contenders for 1-seeds. Nevada could legitimately go undefeated into the Tournament. I wouldn't rule the Jayhawks out yet, but they have not played like a top-5 team.
They could not "easily be 4-4." And they are not overrated. Who would you rate ahead of them?
They have a neutral court beatdown of top 10 Michigan State, a neutral court comfortable win over top 25 Marquette, a neutral court overtime win over top 3 Tennessee, and haven't lost a game this season. The only teams you could reasonably argue should be ahead of Kansas are Virginia and Michigan, and neither of them have close to a single win as good as Kansas's 2 best wins, and you could even argue Kansas's 3rd best win is better than any win Virginia or Michigan have.
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Can’t fault the kid for going to f’ing Kansas
I do really think he woulda been better off coming here college wise tho.
Either way he’s making the big bucks so going for the more sure thing(Kansas and a big12 title) is never dumb
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Can’t fault the kid for going to f’ing Kansas
I do really think he woulda been better off coming here college wise tho.
Either way he’s making the big bucks so going for the more sure thing(Kansas and a big12 title) is never dumb
He’s also getting a head start on making money playing basketball by going to Kansas.
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They could not "easily be 4-4." And they are not overrated. Who would you rate ahead of them?
They have a neutral court beatdown of top 10 Michigan State, a neutral court comfortable win over top 25 Marquette, a neutral court overtime win over top 3 Tennessee, and haven't lost a game this season. The only teams you could reasonably argue should be ahead of Kansas are Virginia and Michigan, and neither of them have close to a single win as good as Kansas's 2 best wins, and you could even argue Kansas's 3rd best win is better than any win Virginia or Michigan have.
I'm pretty confident you haven't watched Kansas much. They went to overtime twice. Either could've been a loss. They had to rally from second half deficits against us and New Mexico State. Either could've easily been a loss. There's really no debate that they snatched victory from the jaws of defeat four times. That's easily 4-4.
Who would I rate ahead of them? Quite obviously Michigan, who has by far the best resume in the country. Because it's not just what you do but how you do it. Michigan has generally blown out their opponents & they have gone on the road. While Kansas is barely getting past Stanford and NMSU on their own floor, Michigan is trouncing Villanova & getting past a Northwestern team that's better than anyone Kansas has played at home on theirs. I would also have Virginia ahead of them because their wins have been decisive while Kansas is really struggling with mediocre competition at home.
Kansas has to be 3 on the basis of resume but I don't think they're the third best team in the country right now. Duke, Gonzaga, & Tennessee have all looked more impressive, but KU lucked out against UT.
And seriously...KU could very, very easily be 4-4. That's not a joke or overstatement by any stretch of the imagination.
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I'm pretty confident you haven't watched Kansas much. They went to overtime twice. Either could've been a loss. They had to rally from second half deficits against us and New Mexico State. Either could've easily been a loss. There's really no debate that they snatched victory from the jaws of defeat four times. That's easily 4-4.
Who would I rate ahead of them? Quite obviously Michigan, who has by far the best resume in the country. Because it's not just what you do but how you do it. Michigan has generally blown out their opponents & they have gone on the road. While Kansas is barely getting past Stanford and NMSU on their own floor, Michigan is trouncing Villanova & getting past a Northwestern team that's better than anyone Kansas has played at home on theirs. I would also have Virginia ahead of them because their wins have been decisive while Kansas is really struggling with mediocre competition at home.
Kansas has to be 3 on the basis of resume but I don't think they're the third best team in the country right now. Duke, Gonzaga, & Tennessee have all looked more impressive, but KU lucked out against UT.
And seriously...KU could very, very easily be 4-4. That's not a joke or overstatement by any stretch of the imagination.
None of that will matter come March. How many seed lines did Xavier drop because they had 12 1-2 possession games? They could have easily lost to East Tenn St, or Marshall in their non con, but they didn't. 4 point win at MU, 5 point win vs DePaul, 6 point win vs StJ, OT against both Gtown and BU, 1 point win at CU, 3 point win at DePaul. If almost losing games mattered, they would not have gotten a 1.
Bottom line it that in their non con, Kansas could get 5 wins against teams that end the season ranked (MSU, MU, TENN, NOVA, ASU). Whether or not those wins were pretty won't matter. Also, who in the B12 will beat them. I'll admit to not seeing any Texas Tech, but KSU shouldn't trouble them. Oklahoma? The fighting Shakas?
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I'm pretty confident you haven't watched Kansas much. They went to overtime twice. Either could've been a loss. They had to rally from second half deficits against us and New Mexico State. Either could've easily been a loss. There's really no debate that they snatched victory from the jaws of defeat four times. That's easily 4-4.
Who would I rate ahead of them? Quite obviously Michigan, who has by far the best resume in the country. Because it's not just what you do but how you do it. Michigan has generally blown out their opponents & they have gone on the road. While Kansas is barely getting past Stanford and NMSU on their own floor, Michigan is trouncing Villanova & getting past a Northwestern team that's better than anyone Kansas has played at home on theirs. I would also have Virginia ahead of them because their wins have been decisive while Kansas is really struggling with mediocre competition at home.
Kansas has to be 3 on the basis of resume but I don't think they're the third best team in the country right now. Duke, Gonzaga, & Tennessee have all looked more impressive, but KU lucked out against UT.
And seriously...KU could very, very easily be 4-4. That's not a joke or overstatement by any stretch of the imagination.
Oh good God. This might be the most outlandish post I’ve ever seen on Scoop. Absolutely hysterical.
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Xavier though was generally an exception. I'm not saying KU can't earn a 1-seed. My first on the topic acknowledged that. I'm saying they are lucky and overrated. The odds are they will regress to the mean as the season goes on and games that could be wins will be losses.
As far as who in the Big 12 will beat them, I'd say the better question is who couldn't? After watching them against Stanford and NMSU, I think they could lose to anyone in that league on their home floor, and definitely on the road. The worst teams in the Big 12 are better than the teams that very nearly beat Kansas already at Phog Allen.
History tells us they'll win the league, but recent history tells us they aren't remotely as good as their record.
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As far as who in the Big 12 will beat them, I'd say the better question is who couldn't? After watching them against Stanford and NMSU, I think they could lose to anyone in that league on their home floor, and definitely on the road. The worst teams in the Big 12 are better than the teams that very nearly beat Kansas already at Phog Allen.
You can say the exact same thing for Mich, UVA, and Duke though. There are 5 ACC teams in the top 15, there is a much higher chance that they all beat up on each other than UVA goes 17-1 again. There are 6 ranked B14 teams as well as 4 additional receiving votes. Now I think a lot of those teams are overrated but that's still a lot of quality opponents that can beat Michigan. Of the undefeated team (with the exception of non P6, sorry Houston, Furman, and Nevada), Kansas has by far the easiest path to 0-2 losses, and already having 2 top 10 wins, it's fair to say that they've been lucky thus far, but the are ranked appropriately.
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As far as who in the Big 12 will beat them, I'd say the better question is who couldn't? After watching them against Stanford and NMSU, I think they could lose to anyone in that league on their home floor, and definitely on the road. The worst teams in the Big 12 are better than the teams that very nearly beat Kansas already at Phog Allen.
Come on. The Big 12 has some talent this year, but Kansas will still probably win the league. And that has nothing to do with the last 10-20 years. It's because the team this year is very talented. Sure, they've had a couple games where they started out slow, but I don't know if that makes them overrated. It certainly doesn't mean that every team in their conference is capable of beating them.
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Can’t fault the kid for going to f’ing Kansas
I do really think he woulda been better off coming here college wise tho.
Either way he’s making the big bucks so going for the more sure thing(Kansas and a big12 title) is never dumb
When you say he would have been better off at MU, do you mean because we have better academics? Or do you mean from a development standpoint?
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They could be a 1-seed, but they are definitely overrated at present. They are incredibly lucky to be 8-0. They had to rally from behind in the second half to beat Marquette, Tennessee, Stanford, and New Mexico State. They could very easily be 4-4 and unranked right now.
Michigan, Duke, Gonzaga, and Virginia will all likely be strong contenders for 1-seeds. Nevada could legitimately go undefeated into the Tournament. I wouldn't rule the Jayhawks out yet, but they have not played like a top-5 team.
Or maybe this is a sign of a very good team that has resilience, good clutch players and good coaching down the stretch of games -- all signs of a team that can win bigly in March.
I'm always leery to say a team "could be" such-and-such record or "should be" such-and-such. A team's record usually (not always, but usually) is what it is supposed to be, and "luck" usually (not always, but usually) is a product of talent, hard work and good preparation.
FWIW (not much IMHO), Self has said several times that his team is "not very good." It's pretty obviously a way to tamp down expectations and to motivate his players, but he publicly is agreeing with you, brewski.
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You can say the exact same thing for Mich, UVA, and Duke though.
That they'll lose conference games? Sure. But in terms of looking vulnerable against inferior competition? Not at all. Duke has handled everyone except Gonzaga comfortably, including teams that are at least decent like Kentucky, San Diego State, Indiana, and Yale. Same goes for Virginia, who had some close margins but were really only in danger of losing once against VCU.
The "Kansas is overrated" logic is because they have looked very unconvincing against weak opponents. Give them the same record but double digit wins against Stanford and NMSU and it would be a different story. The record doesn't raise questions. How they got there certainly does.
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Come on. The Big 12 has some talent this year, but Kansas will still probably win the league. And that has nothing to do with the last 10-20 years. It's because the team this year is very talented. Sure, they've had a couple games where they started out slow, but I don't know if that makes them overrated. It certainly doesn't mean that every team in their conference is capable of beating them.
Every team in their conference is better than Stanford or NMSU. Stanford was the better team for 40 minutes at Phog Allen & NMSU was right there until the end. If Stanford & NMSU can play even with Kansas, then every Big 12 team certainly can.
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That they'll lose conference games? Sure. But in terms of looking vulnerable against inferior competition? Not at all. Duke has handled everyone except Gonzaga comfortably, including teams that are at least decent like Kentucky, San Diego State, Indiana, and Yale. Same goes for Virginia, who had some close margins but were really only in danger of losing once against VCU.
The "Kansas is overrated" logic is because they have looked very unconvincing against weak opponents. Give them the same record but double digit wins against Stanford and NMSU and it would be a different story. The record doesn't raise questions. How they got there certainly does.
I guess I just view basketball as only having two outcomes; winning and losing. There are three undefeated P6 teams in the top 10, and of those three, only one has a pair of top 10 wins, and therefore should be ranked 1. When comparing teams with similar records, the committee and AP has consistently ranked quality of win higher than margin of victory.
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When you say he would have been better off at MU, do you mean because we have better academics? Or do you mean from a development standpoint?
Development imo.
Sure we have Markus as a high usage guy. But we had a clear need at guard for a ball handler. Playing time woulda been there, shots woulda been there for him and with him we’d be really damn good as well.
At KU he’s sharing with another 5 Star guard(who some thought was better already), then you have a extremely high usage guy in Lawson whose is the go to guy and then another proven high efficiency big in Azuibuke.
While those guys can help make things easier for him, they also make his role more of just that...a role player.
Again, can’t knock the decision at all. I just think he had a chance to showcase himself more with us and still be on a really good team.
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I guess I just view basketball as only having two outcomes; winning and losing. There are three undefeated P6 teams in the top 10, and of those three, only one has a pair of top 10 wins, and therefore should be ranked 1. When comparing teams with similar records, the committee and AP has consistently ranked quality of win higher than margin of victory.
And statistics show that's a mistake. Margin of victory is an excellent tool for predicting outcomes. Also, the voters are hypocrites in that regard. Duke jumped from 3 to 1 over Kansas because of their margin against Kentucky despite Kansas also winning that same night.
How and where you win is as important as who you do it against. Large margins & road wins are more impressive and better indicators of team quality than small winning margins at home.
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And statistics show that's a mistake. Margin of victory is an excellent tool for predicting outcomes. Also, the voters are hypocrites in that regard. Duke jumped from 3 to 1 over Kansas because of their margin against Kentucky despite Kansas also winning that same night.
How and where you win is as important as who you do it against. Large margins & road wins are more impressive and better indicators of team quality than small winning margins at home.
That explains why 10-0 Furman, with 5 true road wins is 23rd, and 8-0 Texas Tech with no road games is 11th. Quality of opponent is far more important than just winning. That's why so many people complain about our non conference strength of schedule every year. What do you think was more reflective of the quality of Gtown last year. Their 10-1 non conference with no quality wins, or their 5-13 conference record?
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I've been as big a Wojo supporter as anyone, but this was bad. Losing by the point spread isn't the issue. Having a 9-point halftime lead and never being in the game in the second half is disgraceful. That game felt over even before we lost the lead.
We just needed a basket and kept throwing up bad looks. We didn't attack inside. Markus took contested looks too early. Then after falling down 14, we get it back to single digits with about a minute left and go inside when only threes would give us a chance.
Maybe we shouldn't have won, but we should've been in that game. And asking "what adjustments?" is a copout response. That's literally Wojo's job. To answer that question. Go inside, draw fouls, attack Azubuike, chirp at the refs and take a technical when Azubuike and Lawson are traveling or Cain is getting hacked inside without a whistle.
The first half was great, but that second was one of the worst coached halves I've seen in a long time. And I feel like second half adjustments is somewhere we are always at a disadvantage.
We should've won that game, but at the minimum, we certainly should've been in it. We weren't from the 20:00 mark of the second half, even when we still had the lead. That's sad.
Went from “we weren’t in the game from the 20:00 mark of the second half” to “Kansas could’ve easily lost to us.”
You point to a 2 point road win at powerhouse Northwestern as a positive on Michigan’s resume and then try to talk down Kansas’s resume because they could’ve lost to #3 Tennessee on a neutral court. It’s absurd.
I’m glad Michigan is smoking up far inferior opponents. Their resume is also nowhere close to as good as Kansas’s. Kansas’s 3rd best win is right on par with Michigan’s very best win.
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Quality of opponent is far more important than just winning.
Exactly. Which is why Kansas barely beating marginal opponents like Stanford & NMSU matters.
Went from “we weren’t in the game from the 20:00 mark of the second half” to “Kansas could’ve easily lost to us.”
You point to a 2 point road win at powerhouse Northwestern as a positive on Michigan’s resume and then try to talk down Kansas’s resume because they could’ve lost to #3 Tennessee on a neutral court. It’s absurd.
I’m glad Michigan is smoking up far inferior opponents. Their resume is also nowhere close to as good as Kansas’s. Kansas’s 3rd best win is right on par with Michigan’s very best win.
Fine, take us out of it. They are still incredibly lucky to not be 5-3 and unranked.
And the difference is that Northwestern is the ONLY close game Michigan has played. Were you really impressed by Kansas against Stanford? I watched that game. They were bad. They were bad against NMSU. They are not as good a team as Michigan right now.
Kansas hasn't played an opponent at home as good as Purdue or UNC, yet they struggled more than UM has at home. No one with working eyes or any numerical sense could see how bad KU was in their last two home games and conclude they are better than Michigan, Duke, or Gonzaga.
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Does anyone else scroll through the replies to see where the post gets back on topic, only to be disappointed that it never actually does get back to the original scope?
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Brew, it sounds like you'd be in favor of our non-conference next year being one big road trip through the SWAC. We'd rack up all those road wins, and they all (better be) by a comfortable margin.
Playing and beating good teams far is more important than the margin, or the location, and Kansas has played and beat more good teams than anyone else in the country. I don't necessarily like it, but Coach K's non conference strategy has proven to be quite effective over the years.
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What happened with Grimes' visit to MU? Didn't he let everyone know he was going to KU but was going to enjoy any festivities they had planned for him anyway?
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Does anyone else scroll through the replies to see where the post gets back on topic, only to be disappointed that it never actually does get back to the original scope?
Speak for yourself, the off topic stuff is where it gets juicy! You literally have to click every blah titled thread just to find the good stuff. ::)
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If we're talking about Kansas' performance overall, you can't ignore that Azubuike has been out the last 1.5 games with a foot injury. MU also made their big run with Azubuike on the bench in foul trouble. If he stays out much longer, KU will experience losses that could impact their ranking.
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If we're talking about Kansas' performance overall, you can't ignore that Azubuike has been out the last 1.5 games with a foot injury. MU also made their big run with Azubuike on the bench in foul trouble. If he stays out much longer, KU will experience losses that could impact their ranking.
Yep for sure, huge loss that impacts how they play across the board
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Does anyone else scroll through the replies to see where the post gets back on topic, only to be disappointed that it never actually does get back to the original scope?
I'll get back to you as soon as I get caught up on the nm thread.
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Exactly. Which is why Kansas barely beating marginal opponents like Stanford & NMSU matters.
Fine, take us out of it. They are still incredibly lucky to not be 5-3 and unranked.
And the difference is that Northwestern is the ONLY close game Michigan has played. Were you really impressed by Kansas against Stanford? I watched that game. They were bad. They were bad against NMSU. They are not as good a team as Michigan right now.
Kansas hasn't played an opponent at home as good as Purdue or UNC, yet they struggled more than UM has at home. No one with working eyes or any numerical sense could see how bad KU was in their last two home games and conclude they are better than Michigan, Duke, or Gonzaga.
That damn kenpom guy is clueless again.
Come on man. You’re a great MU poster. You’re an awful UM poster. Glad you think home wins over Purdue and UNC are more impressive than neutral wins over Tennessee and Michigan State!
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Xavier though was generally an exception. I'm not saying KU can't earn a 1-seed. My first on the topic acknowledged that. I'm saying they are lucky and overrated. The odds are they will regress to the mean as the season goes on and games that could be wins will be losses.
As far as who in the Big 12 will beat them, I'd say the better question is who couldn't? After watching them against Stanford and NMSU, I think they could lose to anyone in that league on their home floor, and definitely on the road. The worst teams in the Big 12 are better than the teams that very nearly beat Kansas already at Phog Allen.
History tells us they'll win the league, but recent history tells us they aren't remotely as good as their record.
...yet they scored 22 straight against us which means if you use the transitive rule we were right up there with Stanford and NMSU and the rest of the Big12 is better than us.
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And statistics show that's a mistake. Margin of victory is an excellent tool for predicting outcomes. Also, the voters are hypocrites in that regard. Duke jumped from 3 to 1 over Kansas because of their margin against Kentucky despite Kansas also winning that same night.
How and where you win is as important as who you do it against. Large margins & road wins are more impressive and better indicators of team quality than small winning margins at home.
You get it. Wades and DJ don't.
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Brew, it sounds like you'd be in favor of our non-conference next year being one big road trip through the SWAC. We'd rack up all those road wins, and they all (better be) by a comfortable margin.
Playing and beating good teams far is more important than the margin, or the location, and Kansas has played and beat more good teams than anyone else in the country. I don't necessarily like it, but Coach K's non conference strategy has proven to be quite effective over the years.
SMDH. I don't think you're paying any attention here. Villanova, North Carolina, Purdue, Providence, & South Carolina are not SWAC teams. Two were preseason top-10 teams. All are high majors that lost by double digits to Michigan.
It's who you beat, where you beat them, and how you beat them. It all matters. And beating teams like that by double digits is more impressive than beating NMSU by 3 at home.
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Come on guys......they are both worthy......Michigan has won more impressively overall but Kansas has played a more difficult schedule and is still undefeated......KU could have lost a few.....Michigan really could have only lost 1 but wasn't impressive against Northwestern or South Carolina.
Sometimes I think we argue for the sake or arguing......but please...not 2 of my favorite posters!
Ps I just had gallbladder surgery.....please let it go for my sake...... ;D
Pps this is what happens when we win 5 in a row and then get 10 days off......we go nuts.
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SMDH. I don't think you're paying any attention here. Villanova, North Carolina, Purdue, Providence, & South Carolina are not SWAC teams. Two were preseason top-10 teams. All are high majors that lost by double digits to Michigan.
It's who you beat, where you beat them, and how you beat them. It all matters. And beating teams like that by double digits is more impressive than beating NMSU by 3 at home.
Preseason ranking mean absolutely nothing, and you know that (unless you really think that the team that lost to Furman and Penn is actually the 9th best team in the country). None of those teams are CURRENTLY top 10, meanwhile Tenn and MSU are both top 10 right now (and both lost to KU on a neutral court). The AP poll disagrees with you, the coaches poll disagrees with you, kenpom disagrees with you, the selection committee disagrees with you. Both teams are undefeated, one's played the toughest strength of schedule, one's played the 46th (19 spots behind us BTW).
https://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/rankings/sos
Generally speaking, if you are undefeated and play a schedule that is tougher than literally everyone else in the country, you're deserving of being the #1 team in the country.
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Come on guys......they are both worthy......Michigan has won more impressively overall but Kansas has played a more difficult schedule and is still undefeated......KU could have lost a few.....Michigan really could have only lost 1 but wasn't impressive against Northwestern or South Carolina.
Sometimes I think we argue for the sake or arguing......but please...not 2 of my favorite posters!
Ps I just had gallbladder surgery.....please let it go for my sake...... ;D
Pps this is what happens when we win 5 in a row and then get 10 days off......we go nuts.
Didn't see this until just now. Just for you Mark, I will officially drop this (until March). Wishing you a speedy recovery.
Ps I take it I'm the odd man out, and you really only like Brew and Wades.
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You get it. Wades and DJ don't.
Says the guy who tried to bet people that Xavier was “overrated” in January and tried to make the claim that if they finished 6th in the polls instead of 7th that is proof. Lol.
Oh and by the way Xavier then finished with a 1 seed so you then shifted the goalposts to “see they lost to FSU so they were overrated.”
UVA vastly overrated too hey?
But what do I know? Beating Purdue, UNC, and Nova is more impressive than beating Tennessee, Michigan State, and Marquette.
Thanks for the laughs as always Lenny. The entertainment from you never fails.
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Says the guy who tried to bet people that Xavier was “overrated” in January and tried to make the claim that if they finished 6th in the polls instead of 7th that is proof. Lol.
Oh and by the way Xavier then finished with a 1 seed so you then shifted the goalposts to “see they lost to FSU so they were overrated.”
UVA vastly overrated too hey?
But what do I know? Beating Purdue, UNC, and Nova is more impressive than beating Tennessee, Michigan State, and Marquette.
Thanks for the laughs as always Lenny. The entertainment from you never fails.
You are hopeless.
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You are hopeless.
When it comes to giving into stupidity, yes I am.
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When it comes to stupidity, yes I am.
FIFY
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Says the guy who tried to bet people that Xavier was “overrated” in January and tried to make the claim that if they finished 6th in the polls instead of 7th that is proof. Lol.
Oh and by the way Xavier then finished with a 1 seed so you then shifted the goalposts to “see they lost to FSU so they were overrated.”
UVA vastly overrated too hey?
But what do I know? Beating Purdue, UNC, and Nova is more impressive than beating Tennessee, Michigan State, and Marquette.
Thanks for the laughs as always Lenny. The entertainment from you never fails.
Sorry for calling you hopeless but the way you distort what others say just to try to win an argument is frustrating. The polls said Xavier was somewhere between the 4th and 7th best team in the country from January until March. Sagerin and Pomeroy had them in the teens (15th before the Big East and NCAA tournaments). The polls are to basketball what batting average and rbis are to baseball. Sagerin and Pomeroy are WAR, FIP and any number of other advanced stats. Want to insist Xavier was better than Duke last year or that there are better players than Trout out there? Fine. Knowledgeable basketball or baseball fans will laugh, but by all means, fine.
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Sorry for calling you hopeless but the way you distort what others say just to try to win an argument is frustrating. The polls said Xavier was somewhere between the 4th and 7th best team in the country from January until March. Sagerin and Pomeroy had them in the teens (15th before the Big East and NCAA tournaments). The polls are to basketball what batting average and rbis are to baseball. Sagerin and Pomeroy are WAR, FIP and any number of other advanced stats. Want to insist Xavier was better than Duke last year or that there are better players than Trout out there? Fine. Knowledgeable basketball or baseball fans will laugh, but by all means, fine.
Last January you literally said Xavier was overrated when they were ranked 6 in the polls and offered a bet that they would not be ranked 7 in the polls to end the season. When they finished the season in the top 4 of the polls and as a 1 seed you changed your argument to “kenpom and other sites say Xavier is 15 and losing in the 2nd round proves I was right all along.”
You were right...when you shifted the goalposts. You can deny it. But you’re lying.
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Come on guys......they are both worthy......Michigan has won more impressively overall but Kansas has played a more difficult schedule and is still undefeated......KU could have lost a few.....Michigan really could have only lost 1 but wasn't impressive against Northwestern or South Carolina.
Sometimes I think we argue for the sake or arguing......but please...not 2 of my favorite posters!
Ps I just had gallbladder surgery.....please let it go for my sake...... ;D
Pps this is what happens when we win 5 in a row and then get 10 days off......we go nuts.
Did you have the gb removed? Mine was yanked out on a business trip 15 years ago. Monitor the diet, especially any foods that are fried or acidic...things won’t quite be the same. Good luck
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Can you imagine if we got a 5* like Quinerly and then Wojo didn't play him? Especially if we lost a couple of games we were supposed to win? Yikes! Scoopageddon!
Just think if we could recruit like Coach Cal. Apples and oranges. We are progressing well let's focus on that.
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The point is that based on body of work, Kansas now is overrated in similar fashion to 2017-18 Xavier. Both won the games (so far) they had to win, but in doing so showed how vulnerable they were.
I get Kansas and Xavier being highly ranked, but I also get why those rankings were suspect when you dig into the numbers. If one strictly wants to justify Kansas on the W-L record and preseason expectations, I suppose that's one perspective to take. It's just a really hard argument to make that the fashion in which Kansas escaped home games against marginal opponents like Stanford & New Mexico State isn't a massive blaring klaxon.
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I think Kansas has underachieved so far and will progress towards the mean as the season goes on.
I think Michigan has overachieved so far and will regress towards the mean as the season goes on.
I could absolutely be wrong but I wouldn't blame anyone that had that opinion (or the opposite one) at this point.
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The point is that based on body of work, Kansas now is overrated in similar fashion to 2017-18 Xavier. Both won the games (so far) they had to win, but in doing so showed how vulnerable they were.
I get Kansas and Xavier being highly ranked, but I also get why those rankings were suspect when you dig into the numbers. If one strictly wants to justify Kansas on the W-L record and preseason expectations, I suppose that's one perspective to take. It's just a really hard argument to make that the fashion in which Kansas escaped home games against marginal opponents like Stanford & New Mexico State isn't a massive blaring klaxon.
Yes. If you ignore their neutral court wins over top 3 Tennessee, top 10 Michigan State, and top 25 Marquette the absolutely their resume is not that of the top team in the country. I have no idea why in the world you would do that, but you are so sure I see you’re point now.
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Did you have the gb removed? Mine was yanked out on a business trip 15 years ago. Monitor the diet, especially any foods that are fried or acidic...things won’t quite be the same. Good luck
I did have it removed. Thanks
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Grimes today vs. Nova-14 Minutes;1 Pt; 3 TO; 3 Fouls.
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Looks like Grimes is going pro. Can we get Bid Daddy's explanation now?
https://twitter.com/qdotgrimes/status/1116093166439084032
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This kid probably will not be drafted, way over rated, needs 2 more years in college. Hope he likes the G league
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Looks like Grimes is going pro. Can we get Bid Daddy's explanation now?
https://twitter.com/qdotgrimes/status/1116093166439084032
Unfortunately, I think that the Big Daddy train is gone :'(
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Good luck to him. Marquette may have dodged a bullet there.
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Might be perfect for him to test the draft process. He had some good games later in the season. Scored 18 points with 7 rebounds, 4 assists and 4 steals in their Big 12 conference tournament win over West Virginia. Kid has a ton of potential. If he doesn't like what he hears, he can always come back. (Unless he's signed with an agent, of course.)
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Unfortunately, I think that the Big Daddy train is gone :'(
Yep, its been a long, long, time.
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Might be perfect for him to test the draft process. He had some good games later in the season. Scored 18 points with 7 rebounds, 4 assists and 4 steals in their Big 12 conference tournament win over West Virginia. Kid has a ton of potential. If he doesn't like what he hears, he can always come back. (Unless he's signed with an agent, of course.)
He can sign with an agent under the new rules...
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Good luck to him. Marquette may have dodged a bullet there.
I would’ve loved another guard with size and athleticism on this year’s team.
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I would have, too. And he would have been better than Chartouny. But he did not come close to meeting expectations at Kansas.
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I would have, too. And he would have been better than Chartouny. But he did not come close to meeting expectations at Kansas.
Agree with this. I suspect Grimes also wouldn't have lived up to fan expectations here, but he would've provided more than we got from JC.
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Good luck to him. Marquette may have dodged a bullet there.
Ummm, no.
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Good luck to him, but man he should stay another year, guard class is down next year
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I'm not sure I'd say we "dodged a bullet," but I am not convinced we would have won even one more game if Grimes had taken Sacar's minutes. Indeed, IMHO we might have lost another game or two.
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I'm not sure I'd say we "dodged a bullet," but I am not convinced we would have won even one more game if Grimes had taken Sacar's minutes. Indeed, IMHO we might have lost another game or two.
Impossible to prove, but I think adding Grimes to the roster could have netted us 2-3 more wins
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Impossible to prove, but I think adding Grimes to the roster could have netted us 2-3 more wins
Exactly. Impossible to prove.
Against Nova, when the Hausers were MIA, Sacar was the only player other than Markus to do anything on offense. Without him, that's a loss IMHO. Impossible to say which others would have been losses (or wins with Grimes).
All I'm saying is that I'm not gonna do a "what might have been" lament involving a kid who was mostly mediocre. Hell, I kid about Herro sometimes, but at least he was a real impact player.
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I don't think Grimes would have impacted Sacar's minutes that much.
I also think he was much better than mediocre. Mediocre players don't play 27 minutes a game as true freshmen for Kansas.
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I don't think Grimes would have impacted Sacar's minutes that much.
I also think he was much better than mediocre. Mediocre players don't play 27 minutes a game as true freshmen for Kansas.
Definitely better then mediocre.
But given his recruitment status - 5-star, top 10 overall player who only stuck around for one year - I'd say his performance was not quite up to what KU or others expected.
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Definitely better then mediocre.
But given his recruitment status - 5-star, top 10 overall player who only stuck around for one year - I'd say his performance was not quite up to what KU or others expected.
I also think he was much better than mediocre. Mediocre players don't play 27 minutes a game as true freshmen for Kansas.
If one defines "mediocre" as "of only moderate quality," I don't see how Grimes can be described as better than that ... and certainly not "much" better than that.
His eFG% (.482) was 10th best on the team, his FG% (.384) was 11th best, he averaged 2 assists and less than 1 steal. He did nothing particularly well.
He played 27 mpg because Self didn't have somebody better to give some of those minutes to.
His stats actually were quite similar to Sacar's. Not quite as good in some areas, just a little better in others. And Sacar was a very good defender. Sacar also wasn't a supposed stud coming into the season.
IMHO, given Grimes' recruitment status, his performance was extremely disappointing at best.
All that said, I certainly wanted us to get him, and maybe he would have done better in the BEast at Marquette.
One thing for sure: There would have been quite a Scoop discussion (or 100) about how not ready for the NBA he isn't.
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Disappointing for how high he was ranked? Sure. Mediocre? No. Grimes would have played starter's minutes on our team.
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Disappointing for how high he was ranked? Sure. Mediocre? No. Grimes would have played starter's minutes on our team.
All right, TAMU, I'm not going to turn this into a multi-page, semantics-based argument about a player none of us should give a rat's rump about.
I wish the young man well in his future endeavors. Go Marquette!