Sam Dekker Causes Bruhaha

[4everwarriors]

What is "white culture"?

Yogurt, hey?

[Dr. Blackheart]

Let’s be clear about one thing: there is no such thing as white culture. Absent in this thread is any explanation as to what American white culture is. We have white ethnic cultures, like Italian and French and Irish.

There’s really only one race in America that has developed a distinct culture - black. And to echo a previous poster, it’s not because they’ve been given some gift we should all be entitled to. Rather, it’s that they’ve been so marginalized by the rest of the country that they’ve developed their own unique cultural practices as a product of circumstance. So black “pride” becomes a way of taking some empowerment back from a society that has systematically disempowered them.

People shouldn’t be ashamed to be white. It’s simply how some of us are born. But “white pride” has very deep roots in something very malicious.

Well said. Much of American culture is borrowed. However, the most uniquely American food is from Black America, emanating from the South. Same with the roots of American music. Two uniquely American sports, baseball and basketball, helped break color barriers.

The historic record of the USA is comprised of mainly persecuted immigrants who came here or were forced here. The fusion of our cultures is when America is at its greatest. When we try to separate them is when we are at our ugliest.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

I’ve never quite understood why I should be proud of things I’ve never had any control of, things that are purely genetics.  Should I be proud that I am tall?  Proud that I am genetically lucky and still have a full head of hair?  I had nothing to do with these things. It’s like claiming a prize for something I didn’t earn.

And to be clear, TAMU’s point that minorities say “proud to be” X is something quite different, as he said a pushback against being marginalized.

But why would I or Dekker be “proud” to be born of a particular skin tone when we had nothing to do with it?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

no you can’t

Smh.  You never fail to remind me of the quote (variously attributed to Lincoln and Twain):

Better to shut your mouth and be thought the fool than open it and remove all doubt.

[Galway Eagle]

UnleashLaxBros

What exactly does your white pride entail? When you see other white folks do you give them a thumbs up for being in the same club? When does a person no longer qualify as being white? Do Obama or Koenig get half white pride? Is there a latitude lingitude cutoff where you qualify a person as no longer white but looking more Arab, asian, or African?

[Jay Bee]

Wait. There are white Chinese ppl?

[#UnleashSean]

UnleashLaxBros

What exactly does your white pride entail? When you see other white folks do you give them a thumbs up for being in the same club? When does a person no longer qualify as being white? Do Obama or Koenig get half white pride? Is there a latitude lingitude cutoff where you qualify a person as no longer white but looking more Arab, asian, or African?

I never said anything about me being for white pride. I don't like the entire pride movement at all. As you stated it's just there to be ''hey I'm white/black/Asian and you are white/black/Asian that's awesome let's do things'' it just discludes others which in my mind is just wrong .

However I was pointing out that dekker can be ridiculed for saying he enjoys being white while another will be rejoiced for saying he likes being black.

[forgetful]

I never said anything about me being for white pride. I don't like the entire pride movement at all. As you stated it's just there to be ''hey I'm white/black/Asian and you are white/black/Asian that's awesome let's do things'' it just discludes others which in my mind is just wrong .

However I was pointing out that dekker can be ridiculed for saying he enjoys being white while another will be rejoiced for saying he likes being black.

You are missing part of the picture that people are trying to illustrate, and where statements like "white pride" can be viewed as insensitive. 

Sub-cultures like the African-amerian culture exist because of historic marginalization of subsections of the population.  As others have noted, their heritage was stolen from them in slavery, most don't know their familiar roots.  At the end of slavery, they were still marginalized and treated as less than human until modern times.  That led to them being isolated from the larger "white" community.

Such marginalization leads to a culture that is distinct from that of the rest of america, particularly in the inner cities and south where large communities would form.  These sub-cultures were viewed (and still are viewed) negatively by the bulk of the population, as a part of the sub-humanization of the African-American community.  Even in current times some aspects of black-culture are viewed as negatives that should be "fixed." 

Black-pride, or pride in black-culture, is the counter movement to this treatment.  It says that they shouldn't be ashamed of their differences that stem from centuries of marginalization, rather it should be celebrated as part of who they are "their culture."  And that their culture is every bit as important as the broader "American culture."  It is not something that needs to be "fixed."

White-culture or white pride in this manner, doesn't make sense and can then be viewed as insensitive.  White-americans were never marginalized.  They didn't develop a distinct culture separate from America, because American has always been run by white-christians.  To celebrate it through "white pride," reinforces the idea of superiority of whites, and presents a negative lens on other sub-cultures. 

Other cultures did exist in the US for a long time.  Irish-american, Polish-american and numerous other immigrant groups were viewed as "undesirables" for a long time.  That gave rise to sub-cultures of Irish-americans or Polish-americans and pride in their heritage.  Some of these sub-cultures have vanished to an extent as identifying someone as Polish, or Irish isn't possible by the color of their skin, lending a more rapid integration, inter-marriage across groups and dissolution of bias.

That isn't the case for hispanic/black/asian so pride in their culture is still important as a counter movement to bias and derogatory views on who they are.

[rocket surgeon]

Smh.  You never fail to remind me of the quote (variously attributed to Lincoln and Twain):

Better to shut your mouth and be thought the fool than open it and remove all doubt.

listen smith,
         hate to to break this to ya but you are not the end all, be all.  your opinion ain't all the chit.  even though we have never crossed paths, it is obvious you do not like me,  but you can (i think) lay off the personal attacks, please!
    if ya want to disagree with something, fine.  but knock off the trolling attacks.  if you are a father, have a good one

 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Wait. There are white Chinese ppl?

Yes. If you are white skinned but raised in China in the Chinese culture your ethnicity would be Chinese. Your race would be white. Now you may also be of Italian, Irish, or American ethnicity as well. Rui Hachimura is a good example of this. His race is half black and half asian but in the United States most would just call him black. One of his ethnicities is Japanese.

Race = what the government says you are on a census based on your skin color/geographic location
Ethnicity = what is your cultural background/ancesotry

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

no you can't!  i'm not going to get in to the morality of this, but the japanese-americans were rightly or wrongly placed in to these camps during world war II based on the safety and what is best for our country at the time.  i'm sure their was a punitive measure as well.  many probably believe it was punitive first, then what is best for our country

     the illegal-immigrant children are not citizens of this country.  they have come here and entered illegally.  try doing what they did in canada or mexico for that matter.  it is the illegal immigrant parents who bring their illegal immigrant children into this and then force the long arm of the law to enforce what they have and put all of them into a one size fits all.  then comes the faux outrage...unless ya'll remember elian gonzalez

    our laws regarding this are so lucy-goosey and need to be changed

Rocket, help me understand the bolded. I'm reading it as you think Japanese internment was justified and not something that we as Americans should be ashamed of. Is that what you meant?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

However I was pointing out that dekker can be ridiculed for saying he enjoys being white while another will be rejoiced for saying he likes being black.

What does black people saying they have black pride have to do with white people saying they have white pride? "Hey they're doing it so we need to be able to do it too?"

Remember there is a difference between equality and equity. We should always strive for the latter. Everyone getting the same thing doesn't acknowledge the fact that we are all different people with different histories and needs.

[4everwarriors]

Sew, is Dekker blue, green, pink, orr red? Sure as chit, 'xpect the big Master strapped on dis thread soon, hey?

[#UnleashSean]

Sew, is Dekker blue, green, pink, orr red? Sure as chit, 'xpect the big Master strapped on dis thread soon, hey?

Minus the whole death camp advocates, this thread has been a spread of knowledge.

[MU82]

I never said anything about me being for white pride. I don't like the entire pride movement at all. As you stated it's just there to be ''hey I'm white/black/Asian and you are white/black/Asian that's awesome let's do things'' it just discludes others which in my mind is just wrong .

However I was pointing out that dekker can be ridiculed for saying he enjoys being white while another will be rejoiced for saying he likes being black.

Did you not read TAMU's excellent post a little earlier about the difference between a member of a marginalized people talking about having pride in their race vs. members of the favored majority trying to co-opt the argument for their own purposes?

It's like responding to a black person who says "black lives matter" by shouting, "All lives matter." Of course all lives "matter," but white people haven't been told for hundreds of years that they don't matter in this country.

It's been more than a day since I asked what "white culture" is. Aside from references to mayo and yogurt, nobody has been able to define it ... because it doesn't have to be defined in America.

You know who talks often about "white culture" and "white pride"? David Duke, Richard Spencer and their ilk, that's who.

I absolutely am not putting Sam Dekker in their company. I don't know if he is a racist or not, a white supremacist or not. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and agree with those who say he mostly was guilty of ignorance and dopiness.

[rocket surgeon]

Rocket, help me understand the bolded. I'm reading it as you think Japanese internment was justified and not something that we as Americans should be ashamed of. Is that what you meant?

because i was not there, didn't live in that time, did not experience the emotions going on, etc etc i am not in any way form or fashion justifying or endorsing or supporting anything with regard to the internment of the japanese-americans.  i may be guilty of simplifying the reasons i believe that our governments/FDR issued executive order 9066-"safety" and what was "best for our country" at that time. this was a time of great panic.  it wasn't until much later that we did admit to our wrongs and between jimmy carter and ronald reagan, we tried to atone for that atrocity and paid reparations to any living camp survivor.   if you read my statement, leaving out my political leanings, you should be able to see that i was trying NOT to make any judgement of that point in time in our history.  i am not going to be baited in to this one tamu.  i think the actions of our government on the internment of the japanese-americans speaks for itself.   it is debatable if the japanese ever apologized for their atrocity upon us though, eyn'a?

[rocket surgeon]

Minus the whole death camp advocates, this thread has been a spread of knowledge.

this statement is a complete disgrace of what i said i you know it bro.  try to be a little more honest with your self man or exercise some self control and just move on

[GGGG]

because i was not there, didn't live in that time, did not experience the emotions going on, etc etc i am not in any way form or fashion justifying or endorsing or supporting anything with regard to the internment of the japanese-americans.  i may be guilty of simplifying the reasons i believe that our governments/FDR issued executive order 9066-"safety" and what was "best for our country" at that time. this was a time of great panic.  it wasn't until much later that we did admit to our wrongs and between jimmy carter and ronald reagan, we tried to atone for that atrocity and paid reparations to any living camp survivor.   if you read my statement, leaving out my political leanings, you should be able to see that i was trying NOT to make any judgement of that point in time in our history.  i am not going to be baited in to this one tamu.  i think the actions of our government on the internment of the japanese-americans speaks for itself.   it is debatable if the japanese ever apologized for their atrocity upon us though, eyn'a?

Why does apologizing for placing Americans in internment camps based upon their heritage have anything to do with Japan apologizing for Pearl Harbor?

[GGGG]

     the illegal-immigrant children are not citizens of this country.  they have come here and entered illegally.  try doing what they did in canada or mexico for that matter.  it is the illegal immigrant parents who bring their illegal immigrant children into this and then force the long arm of the law to enforce what they have and put all of them into a one size fits all.  then comes the faux outrage...unless ya'll remember elian gonzalez

That is false.  There is nothing in the laws of this country that force the United States to separate parents from their children. 

[Jockey]

Why does apologizing for placing Americans in internment camps based upon their heritage have anything to do with Japan apologizing for Pearl Harbor?

Simple. They all look alike

[Herman Cain]

What does black people saying they have black pride have to do with white people saying they have white pride? "Hey they're doing it so we need to be able to do it too?"

Remember there is a difference between equality and equity. We should always strive for the latter. Everyone getting the same thing doesn't acknowledge the fact that we are all different people with different histories and needs.

Sorry to burst your bubble but life doesn't work that way. I have suffered every indignity possible and asked for no special privilege because of the color of my skin. That is how I overcame the circumstance I was born into. I worked hard to be respected and dealt with in the business world on a basis of trust and what I brought to the table . I am sick and tired of white people who patronize the less historically blessed cultures and want to create a welfare culture with no accountability and no skills development. Forget the equal outcome routine and  demand more basic skills of people.  You will be surprised to see how much people can do when the expectations levels are raised.

[rocket surgeon]

That is false.  There is nothing in the laws of this country that force the United States to separate parents from their children.

if the parent is falsely claiming 1)to be the parent, 2)is a threat to the child, 3)is put into criminal proceedings, usually when they enter the country illegally, the children are put into protective custody of the HHS in temporary and safe shelters.

      these are the same rules/laws that have been in effect for the past ? years.  in other words, they haven't changed in the past 1 1/2 years.  if the adult has no other aggravating factors, i.e. previous illegal entry or another crime, they usually plead guilty, get time served.  if they want to return back to their home country, their children are returned to them and they leave together as a family unit to go back to their home country

[rocket surgeon]

Why does apologizing for placing Americans in internment camps based upon their heritage have anything to do with Japan apologizing for Pearl Harbor?

seriously??  maybe this was supposed to be teal?  by apology, i meant for their unprovoked attack/bombing of pearl harbor.
 
 another unnecessary attempt to troll your base-totally uncalled for sully.   

[forgetful]

seriously??  maybe this was supposed to be teal?  by apology, i meant for their unprovoked attack/bombing of pearl harbor.
 
 another unnecessary attempt to troll your base-totally uncalled for sully.

The bolded is inaccurate.  We instituted an embargo on Japan in 1941 that crippled their economy and would have made them lose the war.  That was definitely meant as provocation, and we were aware that it would likely lead to open war.
 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Sorry to burst your bubble but life doesn't work that way. I have suffered every indignity possible and asked for no special privilege because of the color of my skin. That is how I overcame the circumstance I was born into. I worked hard to be respected and dealt with in the business world on a basis of trust and what I brought to the table . I am sick and tired of white people who patronize the less historically blessed cultures and want to create a welfare culture with no accountability and no skills development. Forget the equal outcome routine and  demand more basic skills of people.  You will be surprised to see how much people can do when the expectations levels are raised.

Sorry Hermie, I think you are having a different conversation. We're talking about whether or not some black people saying they are proud to be black is good reason for some white people to be saying that they are proud to be white. I'm not sure what that has to do with welfare states.