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Author Topic: Marquette NBA Thread  (Read 439159 times)

Lennys Tap

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #925 on: October 05, 2020, 03:53:02 PM »


Methinks Jimmy already had a tremendous work ethic before he even met Buzz.

Methinks Jimmy was shy, tentative and a little in awe when he arrived in Milwaukee. At least one Scooper thought he was a wasted scholarship.

No doubt he had some skills and a solid work ethic. They were further honed at MU under Buzz. That continued after Jimmy left and went on to the NBA.

I’m sure JFB gives Buzz credit (and Buzz deserves it) but the lion’s share goes to Jimmy himself. From homeless to here, it’s one hell of a story.

MU82

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #926 on: October 05, 2020, 09:10:25 PM »
Methinks Jimmy was shy, tentative and a little in awe when he arrived in Milwaukee. At least one Scooper thought he was a wasted scholarship.

No doubt he had some skills and a solid work ethic. They were further honed at MU under Buzz. That continued after Jimmy left and went on to the NBA.

I’m sure JFB gives Buzz credit (and Buzz deserves it) but the lion’s share goes to Jimmy himself. From homeless to here, it’s one hell of a story.

Agree totally that, like every good coach, Buzz undoubtedly influenced Jimmy.

Also agree that Jimmy deserves most of the credit for what he has become. A great story, indeed. Proud he’s a Warrior!
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MU82

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #927 on: October 05, 2020, 09:26:13 PM »
Lenny, if you can, read that Athletic article with everyone talking about Jimmy.

Jimmy gives Buzz a ton of credit, that’s for sure.

And Buzz has this great quote:

As his career unfolded, before practice he would run over to me: “Coach, you going to be soft today or you going to be hard?” “Jimmy, I’ve got it.” “Oh, you’re saying I got more energy than you today?” “Jimmy, I’ve got it.” “Oh, OK. I was just wondering if you were going to coach me today.” He thrives on that. He would hold me accountable to that. “You coach me today. You coach me as hard as you want today, Coach.” He said it, and he meant it. He wanted everything to be grueling. He wanted it.

Great stuff.

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Lennys Tap

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #928 on: October 05, 2020, 09:41:04 PM »
Lenny, if you can, read that Athletic article with everyone talking about Jimmy.

Jimmy gives Buzz a ton of credit, that’s for sure.

And Buzz has this great quote:

As his career unfolded, before practice he would run over to me: “Coach, you going to be soft today or you going to be hard?” “Jimmy, I’ve got it.” “Oh, you’re saying I got more energy than you today?” “Jimmy, I’ve got it.” “Oh, OK. I was just wondering if you were going to coach me today.” He thrives on that. He would hold me accountable to that. “You coach me today. You coach me as hard as you want today, Coach.” He said it, and he meant it. He wanted everything to be grueling. He wanted it.

Great stuff.

Mike

I read the whole series of quotes and according to everyone Jimmy did NOT arrive at Marquette with a great work ethic. He was out of shape and constantly talking about quitting the team because he couldn’t hack it. However, coaches (and probably teammates) repeatedly talked him out of quitting and once he turned the corner (learned a work ethic) he became the leader/poster child for hard work. That’s what Mutaman means about learning his work ethic from Buzz. The quotes back up his opinion.

Additionally, my guess is that if Jimmy Butler the Younger had a super work ethic he could have parlayed his 1200 SAT scores into at least one 4 year D1 scholarship offer.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2020, 10:32:35 PM by Lennys Tap »

Mutaman

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #929 on: October 06, 2020, 12:05:00 AM »
Mike

I read the whole series of quotes and according to everyone Jimmy did NOT arrive at Marquette with a great work ethic. He was out of shape and constantly talking about quitting the team because he couldn’t hack it. However, coaches (and probably teammates) repeatedly talked him out of quitting and once he turned the corner (learned a work ethic) he became the leader/poster child for hard work. That’s what Mutaman means about learning his work ethic from Buzz. The quotes back up his opinion.

Additionally, my guess is that if Jimmy Butler the Younger had a super work ethic he could have parlayed his 1200 SAT scores into at least one 4 year D1 scholarship offer.

I seem to recall Jimmy telling a story where after his first few weeks in Milwaukee  he called his "stepmom" and told her he didn't like it and she should send him the money to get back to Houston. She said if he was going to quit he would have to pay his own way back. So he stayed. 

MU82

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #930 on: October 06, 2020, 12:04:42 PM »
Mike

I read the whole series of quotes and according to everyone Jimmy did NOT arrive at Marquette with a great work ethic. He was out of shape and constantly talking about quitting the team because he couldn’t hack it. However, coaches (and probably teammates) repeatedly talked him out of quitting and once he turned the corner (learned a work ethic) he became the leader/poster child for hard work. That’s what Mutaman means about learning his work ethic from Buzz. The quotes back up his opinion.

Additionally, my guess is that if Jimmy Butler the Younger had a super work ethic he could have parlayed his 1200 SAT scores into at least one 4 year D1 scholarship offer.

I think you are making out Jimmy as more of a sloth than those quotes represent, but I don't want to argue with you.

I give Buzz a ton of credit for bringing Jimmy to MU, coaching him up, and getting our program among the nation's top few dozen. I enjoyed watching his teams play, and I wish we had some of that style now.

And I give Jimmy a ton of credit for working hard, both on his own accord and as pushed by his teammates and coaches. I think I speak for all of us when I say that back in 2011, nobody would have expected him to become one of the very best basketball players in the world -- which is exactly what he is.

And BTW, I also give Crean a ton of credit for all the good things he did at MU, especially recruiting Wade and hiring Buzz. Wade constantly credits Crean for the player he became -- pretty much never talks about MU without bringing up Crean -- so I guess if we're going to give Buzz lots of credit for Jimmy, we have to give Crean lots of credit for one of the five best 2-guards in basketball history.
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4everwarriors

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #931 on: October 06, 2020, 01:48:17 PM »
Crean sucks
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Slim

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #932 on: October 06, 2020, 08:00:22 PM »
Spoelstra just said:

“What else can you say but Jimmy F’n Butler!”

He didn’t mention Scoop.

WhiteTrash

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #933 on: October 06, 2020, 10:27:11 PM »
Spoelstra just said:

“What else can you say but Jimmy F’n Butler!”

He didn’t mention Scoop.

WtF? That's poor form.

Shooter McGavin

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #934 on: October 06, 2020, 10:46:13 PM »
Wish Jimmy was a little more confident in his three point shot.  Would be unstoppable and Miami would probably be tied 2-2. 

The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #935 on: October 07, 2020, 08:48:03 AM »
So fun....

Butler was maybe my favorite Marquette player ever.  But hoo boy is he hard to root for in the NBA.  Where he goes, drama and malcontent will follow.  Easily my least favorite former Marquette NBA player.

There is no doubt the Timberwolves, or any team, should build around KAT over Jimmy.  Jimmy's a very good player.  He'll never be the best player on a title team.  KAT probably won't be, but he has a chance to be.

Also, the Heat aren't "legit contenders."  They're playing very well in the regular season.  Without making a pretty big move, they have 0 chance of getting to the Finals without injuries to star players on the Bucks, 76ers, and C's.

KAT is better in every facet of the game other than ball handling and guarding on the perimeter.  Jimmy is so much better that he really turned the Timberwolves into a great team when he joined them.
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withoutbias

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #936 on: October 07, 2020, 09:01:41 AM »
So fun....

So wait.  You think if Butler and KAT trade places that the TWolves are in the Finals and the Heat are nowhere?

Let's face it.  The Bucks didn't have Giannis for 2.5 games, Simmons wasn't even available for any of the Playoffs, and the Heat aren't winning the Title.  They'll have a chance once Bam takes the next step and becomes the star he's going to be.

Currently?  Yeah, I'd take Butler over KAT.  But if I'm trying to build a team that's going to win a title?  I'm not taking a wing who won't (not even can't, but straight up won't) shoot 3s.

But congrats to Butler on a huge game that the Lakers slept through.  Glad he got his one win in the Finals.

The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #937 on: October 07, 2020, 09:08:07 AM »
LOL.

I think the Heat are way better off with Butler than they would be with KAT.  Are you kidding?

Butler made the Finals.  (After your prediction they would have a "0 chance.")   KAT finished 14th in the Western Conference and didn't even make the bubble.  Great guy to build around.

I mean, if you keep wanting to have this discussion, I'm fine with it.  But it seems like a REALLY bad hill to defend right now.
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withoutbias

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #938 on: October 07, 2020, 09:42:10 AM »
LOL.

I think the Heat are way better off with Butler than they would be with KAT.  Are you kidding?

Butler made the Finals.  (After your prediction they would have a "0 chance.")   KAT finished 14th in the Western Conference and didn't even make the bubble.  Great guy to build around.

I mean, if you keep wanting to have this discussion, I'm fine with it.  But it seems like a REALLY bad hill to defend right now.

Yes.  The Heat are better off with Butler than they are with KAT.  Why?  Because they have Bam.  Who is a very similar player to KAT.

And ahh.  You stopped reading at "0 chance" and didn't realize I said "If there were injuries," which there were.

But yeah good call.  Other than the Bam and KAT, the roster makeups are identical, the East is as good as the West, etc.  TWolves a well run franchise with great pieces all over the place just like the Heat.  Only difference is KAT and Jimmy.

LOL!

PGsHeroes32

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #939 on: October 07, 2020, 10:33:33 AM »
Yes.  The Heat are better off with Butler than they are with KAT.  Why?  Because they have Bam.  Who is a very similar player to KAT.

And ahh.  You stopped reading at "0 chance" and didn't realize I said "If there were injuries," which there were.

But yeah good call.  Other than the Bam and KAT, the roster makeups are identical, the East is as good as the West, etc.  TWolves a well run franchise with great pieces all over the place just like the Heat.  Only difference is KAT and Jimmy.

LOL!

Well for 1.

Giannis didnt miss 2.5 games. He actually missed 1.5. They were already down 3-0 with Giannis. Their 1 win came in the game he was hurt lol.

Second off.

Jimmy and the Heat didn't play the 76ers. The 76ers lost to the Celtics. In a 4 game sweep. The Celtics were the considerably better basketball team.

Third off.

Jimmy now has injuries to his 2nd and 3rd best players in the finals. No mention there.

4th off.

You're an idiot.
Lazar picking up where the BIG 3 left off....

withoutbias

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #940 on: October 07, 2020, 10:54:28 AM »
Well for 1.

Giannis didnt miss 2.5 games. He actually missed 1.5. They were already down 3-0 with Giannis. Their 1 win came in the game he was hurt lol.

Second off.

Jimmy and the Heat didn't play the 76ers. The 76ers lost to the Celtics. In a 4 game sweep. The Celtics were the considerably better basketball team.

Third off.

Jimmy now has injuries to his 2nd and 3rd best players in the finals. No mention there.

4th off.

You're an idiot.

Giannis had 18 points in the game the Bucks won...

So write off the fact that the Bucks missed Giannis for 1.5 games, but it's a devastating blow that the heat missed Bam for 1 game?  Makes sense.

Has Jimmy won a title as the best player on the team?  As far as I know, he hasn't.  Which was the point that fluffy thought he was disproving.  But...

PGsHeroes32

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #941 on: October 07, 2020, 10:59:57 AM »
Giannis had 18 points in the game the Bucks won...

So write off the fact that the Bucks missed Giannis for 1.5 games, but it's a devastating blow that the heat missed Bam for 1 game?  Makes sense.

Has Jimmy won a title as the best player on the team?  As far as I know, he hasn't.  Which was the point that fluffy thought he was disproving.  But...

Uhhh the Heat missed Bam for 2.5 games.

Boy you are really, really not good at this.
Lazar picking up where the BIG 3 left off....

withoutbias

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #942 on: October 07, 2020, 11:05:29 AM »
Uhhh the Heat missed Bam for 2.5 games.

Boy you are really, really not good at this.

AKA "No, Jimmy has not won a title as the best player, but I can't say that because that's the entire point, so I'll go into calculating minutes a guy played in a game and decide he didn't play half a game here or there."

You're right.  I'm not as good at deflecting as you are.

oldwarrior81

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #943 on: October 07, 2020, 12:38:08 PM »
Best player on a team that won a championship?  That's a pretty lofty goal for any.

Over the past 30 seasons this basically is the list:  Outside the Pistons, first ballot HOF players.
Kawhi
Durant/Curry
LeBron
Nowitzki
Kobe
Duncan
Garnett
Wade
Billups/Hamilton
Shaq
Jordan
Olajuwon
« Last Edit: October 07, 2020, 12:41:33 PM by oldwarrior81 »

Markusquette

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #944 on: October 07, 2020, 01:14:41 PM »
The bubble has been a complete mess. Even with a dysfunctional team, Philly would have battled the Celtics with Simmons. They could have gotten to the ECF with him healthy.

I'm not sold on Towns as a superstar at all. Hype faded after his rookie year. Butler has the makeup of a winner and Towns, not so much. The Heat have been undermanned the last couple of games and banged up. Barely lost last night. What Miami/Butler did to get to this point is very impressive. The Lakers just have Lebron and Davis. That's hard as hell to get past.

PGsHeroes32

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #945 on: October 07, 2020, 01:38:27 PM »
AKA "No, Jimmy has not won a title as the best player, but I can't say that because that's the entire point, so I'll go into calculating minutes a guy played in a game and decide he didn't play half a game here or there."

You're right.  I'm not as good at deflecting as you are.

I haven't deflected anything, nor made any sort of stance.

I just keep calling out your errors.

Which you then deflect.
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MU82

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #946 on: October 07, 2020, 02:19:12 PM »
Y'all are arguing about a bunch of hypothetical situations in which nobody can be proved right or wrong.

In other words ...

Scoop!

Jimmy has done amazing with the Heat and yes, I'd rather have him than KAT. We know Jimmy has the game and the mind set to win and lead. We don't know that about KAT, who couldn't even take the heat from ... Jimmy.

One thing that a couple of you have talked about is Jimmy's cruddy 3-point shooting, and I felt the same. But I just looked it up and, from 2014-19 -- covering his last 3 seasons in Chicago, his 1.5 years in Minny and his half season in Philly -- he shot a respectable .351 from 3, on 3.1 attempts per game. During his time in Minnesota, he shot .355 on 3.6 attempts per game.

So it's not like he is, well, Ben Simmons.

LeBron is a career .344 shooter from deep, Kemba .360 (though better his last few seasons), and Kawhi, the two seasons he ended with titles, shot .349 and .371. As good as Kawhi and LeBron are, nobody fears their 3-point shots; most opponents will pick their poison and give them those.

Now, Jimmy shot only .244 this season, which isn't good enough. But I have a feeling that if he feels he's settling in for Miami, he will focus on that this offseason and will improve at least to his best level. Which will be plenty good enough, especially as Bam, Herro and others around him get better. The Heat have two elite 3-point shooters and a few other guys who can score from deep.

Jimmy does everything else at an All-Star level. All he needed was the right team to lead and the right coach, and it looks like he's found all that.

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The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #947 on: October 07, 2020, 02:25:37 PM »
I mean yeah, it would be nice if Butler was a better three point shooter, but as MU82 points out, it's hardly a necessity if...

...he does other things at an elite level (like getting to the free throw line)

...and there are other's that fill that role on the team.
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The Big East

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #948 on: October 07, 2020, 07:41:23 PM »
When Jimmy gets the ball around the top of the key he makes a strong move through the lane and can either get the mid range jumper or long arm extended layup almost every time. He also plays with a very high IQ and realizes when the defense collapses on him to kick it out to a wide open three. He has an old school style to his game that is very appealing .

Newsdreams

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Re: Marquette NBA Thread
« Reply #949 on: October 08, 2020, 12:35:42 PM »
When Jimmy gets the ball around the top of the key he makes a strong move through the lane and can either get the mid range jumper or long arm extended layup almost every time. He also plays with a very high IQ and realizes when the defense collapses on him to kick it out to a wide open three. He has an old school style to his game that is very appealing .
Traditional?
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