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Author Topic: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?  (Read 24086 times)

rocket surgeon

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"girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« on: July 14, 2014, 05:31:51 PM »
seriously?  can someone explain to me how this is even worthy of wasting a second of our lives on?  i thought marquette was a little more to the middle than this.  there are way more important issues facing our world than to worry about using this phrase in any civil discourse and finding it offensive.  as it turns out, james south and susanne foster have a big role in who gets hired/fired in the philosophy department and the college of arts and sciences.  i can understand the arts part, but sciences?  arts have been traditionally more about feelings and creativity-fine, but sciences are and should always be fact based.  after reading about this, i have a real problem with someone of ms. foster's persuasion having anything to do with hiring anyone.  come on marquette!  how about a little more balance? 


http://www.mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2014/07/marquette-philosophy-professor.html
don't...don't don't don't don't

chapman

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2014, 05:51:50 PM »
It's been way too long since I've heard a good Wacko MU Faculty story.  Unfortunately, the void can not be filled by the imagination since the real thing is always far too crazy for anyone to make up.

rocket surgeon

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2014, 06:01:48 PM »
i totally agree, but this one is really embarrassing.  do some of these types have no pride?  but then again, mr.(dr.?) south could have/should have nipped this one in the bud.  he could have acted like a real dept. head and leader and told her to stfu and go read nietzhe
don't...don't don't don't don't

wildbill sb

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2014, 06:31:55 PM »
Not sure how many "wackos" are suggested by the referenced piece ("blog").  It seems to me that McAdams himself has inferred, implied, generalized, name-called, and "ad-hominemed," etc. in his unsubstantiated diatribe against all policies, faculty, positions, and issues to the left of his right. One hopes the good Profesor  deals with thorny/controversial questions in his classes in a more "fair and balanced" way, no? 
“I’m working as hard as I can to get my life and my cash to run out at the same time. If I can just die after lunch Tuesday, everything will be perfect.”  - Doug Sanders, professional golfer

keefe

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2014, 06:37:25 PM »
Not sure how many "wackos" are suggested by the referenced piece ("blog").  It seems to me that McAdams himself has inferred, implied, generalized, name-called, and "ad-hominemed," etc. in his unsubstantiated diatribe against all policies, faculty, positions, and issues to the left of his right. One hopes the good Profesor  deals with thorny/controversial questions in his classes in a more "fair and balanced" way, no? 

John McAdams is an esteemed and respected academician.


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forgetful

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2014, 06:42:29 PM »
John McAdams is an esteemed and respected academician.

Yes, he is. 

But his reaction to this story was a bit over the top and leaning towards plain bias.  Nearly (but not as much), of an over-reaction as the Philosophy department chair.  He immediately jumped to this being politically biased.

Department chairs are not that well trained to deal with issues like this, so often one will lean towards over precaution.  File the complaint and get it over with.  You can always retract the complaint later if you deem your actions in correct.  That is what happened here.  He over-reacted, the aggrieved professor filed an appeal and in the end everything turned out exactly as it should.

Really no need to bring all this to public light.

WellsstreetWanderer

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2014, 08:29:23 PM »
Marquette has a  Gender & Sexuality Resource Center?   Well I guess you have to do something with a Women's Studies degree.

keefe

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2014, 02:59:19 AM »
Well I guess you have to do something with a Women's Studies degree.

You live in Portland so you'll know that degree helps sell Subarus


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rocket surgeon

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2014, 05:51:11 AM »
Yes, he is. 

But his reaction to this story was a bit over the top and leaning towards plain bias.  Nearly (but not as much), of an over-reaction as the Philosophy department chair.  He immediately jumped to this being politically biased.

Department chairs are not that well trained to deal with issues like this, so often one will lean towards over precaution.  File the complaint and get it over with.  You can always retract the complaint later if you deem your actions in correct.  That is what happened here.  He over-reacted, the aggrieved professor filed an appeal and in the end everything turned out exactly as it should.

really no need to bring this to public light??

i believe ms. foster's reaction to a very benign phrase "girls night out" to be very revealing of a tight sphincter disease. a condition that reals it's ugly head when trying to view the world through a kaleidoscope of  feminazi anger.  and oh boy, they will find offense in just about everything that is not on the ever growing list of p.c.isms.  ms. foster is guilty of blowing her cover and that of the whole department-indoctrination into how one should think:what you can and cannot say if you want to be in the club or get passing grases.  if you look real close, you'll see the tree's thru the forest and it isn't real pretty. or you can just put your hands over your ears and eye's and scream-lalalalalalalalalalalal
don't...don't don't don't don't

GGGG

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2014, 09:28:32 AM »
really no need to bring this to public light??

i believe ms. foster's reaction to a very benign phrase "girls night out" to be very revealing of a tight sphincter disease. a condition that reals it's ugly head when trying to view the world through a kaleidoscope of  feminazi anger.  and oh boy, they will find offense in just about everything that is not on the ever growing list of p.c.isms.  ms. foster is guilty of blowing her cover and that of the whole department-indoctrination into how one should think:what you can and cannot say if you want to be in the club or get passing grases.  if you look real close, you'll see the tree's thru the forest and it isn't real pretty. or you can just put your hands over your ears and eye's and scream-lalalalalalalalalalalal



Man you are one buzz word after another.

This is a combination of....

**lack of "real world" experience on the behalf of faculty members
**lack of training for department chairs to handle this issue.
**an atmosphere in higher education that has become hyper-sensitive to issues related to sexual harassment.

Really, no one should be calling grown women "girls" in today's workplace anyway, but this turned something rather small and innocuous into something way bigger than it should have been.

Benny B

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #10 on: July 15, 2014, 09:34:19 AM »
You live in Portland so you'll know that degree helps sell Subarus

That's harassment.
Wow, I'm very concerned for Benny.  Being able to mimic Myron Medcalf's writing so closely implies an oncoming case of dementia.

Lennys Tap

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #11 on: July 15, 2014, 10:14:04 AM »




Really, no one should be calling grown women "girls" in today's workplace anyway, but this turned something rather small and innocuous into something way bigger than it should have been.

SNL did a great skit on this topic awhile back: When Brad Pitt walks into the coffee room leering and asking suggestively "What are you girls doing tonight" the women swoon. When the nerd walks in and asks politely if he can get anyone a cup of coffee they pounce on him - "You don't think we're capable of getting our own coffee? We don't need to put up with this sexual harassment! We're filing a complaint!" Sometimes it's not what's said but who says it.

But I do agree that to some, "girls" is an insult. To others, not so much. Speaks to different generations, since today "guys" are both men and women. When I grew up "girls" was the feminine, "guys" the masculine. I have slipped and used "girls" myself, but because I'm charming and old (and the women I know aren't hyper sensitive) I've yet to be excoriated for it. 

Chicago_inferiority_complexes

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2014, 10:24:00 AM »


Man you are one buzz word after another.

This is a combination of....

**lack of "real world" experience on the behalf of faculty members
**lack of training for department chairs to handle this issue.
**an atmosphere in higher education that has become hyper-sensitive to issues related to sexual harassment.

Really, no one should be calling grown women "girls" in today's workplace anyway, but this turned something rather small and innocuous into something way bigger than it should have been.

Good summary. It just seems like an example of how petty and pathetic academia seems these days. And that's probably a problem that's a lot bigger than right-left politics.

GGGG

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #13 on: July 15, 2014, 10:35:05 AM »
Good summary. It just seems like an example of how petty and pathetic academia seems these days. And that's probably a problem that's a lot bigger than right-left politics.


Like many things, independence from day-to-day crap is part of what makes academia strong.  I mean, it's good that society has room for really smart people who are really passionate about something and create knowledge for knowledge sake.  We have a professor here where I work who is the typical "absent minded professor" type, but the dude knows German history like the back of his hand.  All those obscure little principalities?  He can tell you everything about them and trots off to Germany every summer to discover and share more about them.

That's a good thing.

But, as with everything, your greatest strength can also turn into your greatest weakness.  And this is what the side-effect is for something like that.  A detachment from reality and a lack of pragmatic approach to decision making.  Not every decision is some sort of grand, philosophical statement.  Sometimes sh*t just needs to get done.

Coleman

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #14 on: July 15, 2014, 10:36:09 AM »
Not sure how many "wackos" are suggested by the referenced piece ("blog").  It seems to me that McAdams himself has inferred, implied, generalized, name-called, and "ad-hominemed," etc. in his unsubstantiated diatribe against all policies, faculty, positions, and issues to the left of his right. One hopes the good Profesor  deals with thorny/controversial questions in his classes in a more "fair and balanced" way, no? 

McAdams? No way!!!!  ::)

Coleman

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2014, 10:37:09 AM »
John McAdams is an esteemed and respected academician.

In subjects such as the Kennedy Assassination, yes.

Unfortunately he uses that respect to go off on tangents railing against the university, often making something out of nothing in an effort to portray himself as a persecuted victim.

GGGG

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2014, 10:38:27 AM »
In subjects such as the Kennedy Assassination, yes.

Unfortunately he uses that respect to go off on tangents railing against the university, often making something out of nothing.


Which, ironically, is a symptom of the same problems he likes to accuse others of having.

Canned Goods n Ammo

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2014, 10:42:38 AM »

Which, ironically, is a symptom of the same problems he likes to accuse others of having.

This.

Step 1: Somebody overreacts to something small and stupid.

Step 2: Somebody overreacts to the overreaction to something small and stupid.

The correct reaction in both cases is just an eye roll, and move on with your life.

No winners in these sorts of things. Get back to work, people.

reinko

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2014, 10:47:23 AM »

GGGG

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #19 on: July 15, 2014, 10:48:16 AM »
This.

Step 1: Somebody overreacts to something small and stupid.

Step 2: Somebody overreacts to the overreaction to something small and stupid.

The correct reaction in both cases is just an eye roll, and move on with your life.

No winners in these sorts of things. Get back to work, people.


Not to mention that the world of academia that he lives in allows him to publicly rail against his employer and his colleagues whenever he wants.  Try doing that in any other workplace.  

Or even try to be a non-tenured employee and doing that at Marquette.

Chicago_inferiority_complexes

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #20 on: July 15, 2014, 11:01:50 AM »

Not to mention that the world of academia that he lives in allows him to publicly rail against his employer and his colleagues whenever he wants.  Try doing that in any other workplace.  

Or even try to be a non-tenured employee and doing that at Marquette.

I'm sure McAdams doesn't mind criticism of his handling of political issues on campus. This was an expressly political issue.

But even back when I was on campus, a lot of the campus liberals (students) respected him because he seemed to be one of the few professors looking out for student interests, especially w.r.t. the administration, on completely apolitical subjects. We all know that the MU administration can get pretty insular, and it was nice to have a professor looking out for students against that.

Canned Goods n Ammo

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #21 on: July 15, 2014, 11:12:24 AM »
I'm sure McAdams doesn't mind criticism of his handling of political issues on campus. This was an expressly political issue.

But even back when I was on campus, a lot of the campus liberals (students) respected him because he seemed to be one of the few professors looking out for student interests, especially w.r.t. the administration, on completely apolitical subjects. We all know that the MU administration can get pretty insular, and it was nice to have a professor looking out for students against that.

I think a Prof. that speaks out has tremendous value.

I just hope that he/she picks the right spot. It's okay to let some stuff slide.

Spotcheck Billy

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #22 on: July 15, 2014, 12:03:45 PM »
In subjects such as the Kennedy Assassination, yes.



 I want to be Jackie Onassis
 I want to wear a pair of dark sunglasses
 I want to be Jackie Onassis, oh yeah

 I want bodyguards all around
 I'm anxious to avoid an autograph hound
 Just let me be Jackie Onassis, oh yeah

 I'm ready for the world to take a good look at me
 Photographers can snap my picture, I'll pose for free
 Tabloids can make my name a household word
 I'll belong to millions but be free as a bird

 I want my portrait done by Andy Warhol
 I'll let them market a Jackie O doll
 Just let me be Jackie Onassis, oh yeah...

by Human Sexual Response

Lennys Tap

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #23 on: July 15, 2014, 12:36:28 PM »
This.

Step 1: Somebody overreacts to something small and stupid.

Step 2: Somebody overreacts to the overreaction to something small and stupid.

The correct reaction in both cases is just an eye roll, and move on with your life.

No winners in these sorts of things. Get back to work, people.

If Step 1 is Susanne Foster being offended and going to Chairman South and Step 2 is Chairman South's letter and trip to the HR department then I'm in total agreement. Both were out of line. The guy fighting for his career/reputation or the guy who reported it? Not so much.

ATWizJr

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Re: "girls night out" is sexual harassment?
« Reply #24 on: July 15, 2014, 12:51:51 PM »
If Step 1 is Susanne Foster being offended and going to Chairman South and Step 2 is Chairman South's letter and trip to the HR department then I'm in total agreement. Both were out of line. The guy fighting for his career/reputation or the guy who reported it? Not so much.
+1