2014-15 NFC North/NFL Thread

[Dish]

Here's 3 real facts for you...

-Ray Rice beat the hell out of his wife (watch whatever video you want...or don't...)
-Ray Rice told Roger Goodell exactly that
-Goodell responded by giving Ray Rice a 2 game suspension

Goodell should be fired for that alone.

By the way, don't forget the NFL goes pink starting with this Thursday night's game!

[Dish]

Yes, actually a number of people did break the law here, including the law itself.   So yes, I'm dead serious.  When your employer, or the NFL in this case, is not allowed to have access to certain information, you want them to break the law to acquire it.  I just want to make sure you're good with that.  Then I have a few follow-up questions for you in terms of where it stops and what rights the individual has as it tries to square with due process....thanks....I'll hang up and listen.

So is there a statue of limitations that only exists in your world where when a case is adjudicated, do you have to wait X number of months to view (at that point) a privately held video that the law at that point has ZERO room to enforce upon who does view it? I'm curious on that one. Is it a month? 3 months? A year?

Sorry, I have to run. The tooth fairy and the Easter Bunny are coming over. We were going to watch a snuff film together, but don't want to break any laws.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Chicos, is there a 3rd alternative I'm missing here?  I'd like a clear, concise, logical (almost....scientific) explanation as to a 3rd theory as to how we got here that does not bathe the NFL and Goodell in guilt?

Define guilt?  I've offered a logical alternative....did it happen this way, who knows.  Here goes:

They saw the video of what happened outside the elevator. 
They interviewed the parties involved who both claimed to be the problem (drinking, she attacked him, he attacked her, etc, etc)
They waited to see what law enforcement and the criminal system did (which was put him in a probationary program)
They issued a suspension
They didn't see the inside video despite asking for it through official channels, and were denied.

After seeing the inside video, they took much stronger action.


What you guys keep coming down on is the NFL "should have known" the contents of the elevator video. I agree, they should.  Where I disagree with others here is how does one go about obtaining it?  There is due process in this country, but what some of you are saying is the hell with it, anyway possible you must get that video, even if legally you are not allowed to have it.  What am I missing, because I think that nails exactly what some of you are saying.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Here's 3 real facts for you...

-Ray Rice beat the hell out of his wife (watch whatever video you want...or don't...)
-Ray Rice told Roger Goodell exactly that
-Goodell responded by giving Ray Rice a 2 game suspension

Goodell should be fired for that alone.

By the way, don't forget the NFL goes pink starting with this Thursday night's game!

You're not watching the games anyway....you've taken the stand.

You know what Ray Rice told Roger Goodell?  Say can you tell us what he said...provide the transcript?   Ray Rice his is fiance, a heinous act, but Ray Rice and his soon to be wife said she was attacking him, spit on him, hit him.  That he used self defense.  Was it true, how do you know without seeing the video....which they asked for....which the were legally denied....which you want them to break the law to obtain.  What other laws would you like employers to break?

Beat the hell out of his wife?  I have a different definition of beat, it usually means repeatedly dealing blows.  Since so many people here love the dictionary... "a punishment or assault in which the victim is hit repeatedly."

The video I saw was terrible, he punched her and knocked her out.  Horrible, terrible, but the video painted that picture much differently than the reported word that people had access to earlier.  It's why everyone got up in arms....AFTER the video came out.  The video changed everything.

James Foley was beheaded, we all know that.  It is horrible to read.  Would watching the video make it much worse?  You bet it does, the video changes everything.

[mu03eng]

Define guilt?  I've offered a logical alternative....did it happen this way, who knows.  Here goes:

They saw the video of what happened outside the elevator. 
They interviewed the parties involved who both claimed to be the problem (drinking, she attacked him, he attacked her, etc, etc)
They waited to see what law enforcement and the criminal system did (which was put him in a probationary program)
Ray Rice told them what happened in the elevator, which was at a minimum that he hit his fiance and as a result(in some manner) she became unconscious)
They issued a suspension
They didn't see the inside video despite asking for it through official channels, and were denied.

After seeing the inside video, they took much stronger action.


What you guys keep coming down on is the NFL "should have known" the contents of the elevator video. I agree, they should.  Where I disagree with others here is how does one go about obtaining it?  There is due process in this country, but what some of you are saying is the hell with it, anyway possible you must get that video, even if legally you are not allowed to have it.  What am I missing, because I think that nails exactly what some of you are saying.

What I am saying is, even if you accept everything the NFL says at face value....they are guilty as hell of poor judgement and a willingness to accept serious domestic violence as less significant then smoking pot or taking PEDs.  That is the best case scenario.  On that alone Goodell should be on the hot seat.

[mu03eng]

You're not watching the games anyway....you've taken the stand.

You know what Ray Rice told Roger Goodell?  Say can you tell us what he said...provide the transcript?   Ray Rice his is fiance, a heinous act, but Ray Rice and his soon to be wife said she was attacking him, spit on him, hit him.  That he used self defense.  Was it true, how do you know without seeing the video....which they asked for....which the were legally denied....which you want them to break the law to obtain.  What other laws would you like employers to break?

Beat the hell out of his wife?  I have a different definition of beat, it usually means repeatedly dealing blows.  Since so many people here love the dictionary... "a punishment or assault in which the victim is hit repeatedly."



The video I saw was terrible, he punched her and knocked her out.  Horrible, terrible, but the video painted that picture much differently than the reported word that people had access to earlier.  It's why everyone got up in arms....AFTER the video came out.  The video changed everything.

James Foley was beheaded, we all know that.  It is horrible to read.  Would watching the video make it much worse?  You bet it does, the video changes everything.

Go back and look at twitter.....people were up in arms about the suspension prior to the elevator video....once the second video came out, ESPN and other media outlets couldn't white wash it anymore.

[brandx]

Yes, actually a number of people did break the law here, including the law itself.   So yes, I'm dead serious.  When your employer, or the NFL in this case, is not allowed to have access to certain information, you want them to break the law to acquire it.  I just want to make sure you're good with that.  Then I have a few follow-up questions for you in terms of where it stops and what rights the individual has as it tries to square with due process....thanks....I'll hang up and listen.

I will echo Sultan and call you out as lying.

If Roger wanted the video, all he had to do is call the casino and ask for it.you know this and also know that it is not illegal -yet continue to repeat the lie. Since you are not stupid, there can be only one other conclusion.

[jesmu84]

nm

[reinko]

If a certain poster can't say RR beat the hell out of his fiance,  honestly y'all,  how can you expect this certain poster to look at anything objectively.   Just stop,  live those minutes you would have typed a response to the fullest.   Smile,  laugh,  play,  do anything.   I am done.

[ChicosBailBonds]

So is there a statue of limitations that only exists in your world where when a case is adjudicated, do you have to wait X number of months to view (at that point) a privately held video that the law at that point has ZERO room to enforce upon who does view it? I'm curious on that one. Is it a month? 3 months? A year?

Sorry, I have to run. The tooth fairy and the Easter Bunny are coming over. We were going to watch a snuff film together, but don't want to break any laws.

Again, they asked for the video and were told no by law enforcement.  They had no legal right to it.  You haven't answered my question still....do you think it is ok for the NFL, or your employer, to obtain such pieces of information when they are lawfully not entitled to it?  His lawyer said no to the request.  Law enforcement said no to the request.  It appears you believe the NFL and any employer should go outside of legal means to garner information.  If I have represented you incorrectly, please clarify for me.

[ChicosBailBonds]

What I am saying is, even if you accept everything the NFL says at face value....they are guilty as hell of poor judgement and a willingness to accept serious domestic violence as less significant then smoking pot or taking PEDs.  That is the best case scenario.  On that alone Goodell should be on the hot seat.

That's a fair point, and probably why a few weeks ago he said he blew it and changed the NFL policy moving forward on domestic violence.

Though I don't agree with you that it is the best case scenario, because I continue to believe the video changes everything and if they didn't see the video, that matters in my opinion. I also don't support an entity illegally obtaining evidence, but it seems some people here do.  That's a very slippery slope IMO.

[ChicosBailBonds]

If a certain poster can't say RR beat the hell out of his fiance,  honestly y'all,  how can you expect this certain poster to look at anything objectively.   Just stop,  live those minutes you would have typed a response to the fullest.   Smile,  laugh,  play,  do anything.   I am done.

Oh my...I'd invite you to read what I actually said, which was 100% truthful.  It was horrible, terrible, awful, etc, etc, etc.... he punched her, knocked her out, etc.  I merely questioned his word choice.  To beat the hell out of someone is repeatedly to strike them.  Unless there is another video, that's not what happened.  He struck her with a vicious blow, he did not beat the hell out of her. Horrific, appalling, etc, etc, but you don't get to change the meaning of beat.  Sorry Reinko, that's accurate and you know it.  No more than you would say a guy going up to someone else and sucker punching him or cold cocking him with one punch was "beating the hell" out of the dude.  It isn't, and you know it.  Doesn't make it any less vicious, but it isn't the same thing.  LA cops "beat" Rodney King. 


beat
bēt/
verb
verb: beat; 3rd person present: beats; past tense: beat; gerund or present participle: beating; past participle: beaten

    1.strike (a person or an animal) repeatedly and violently so as to hurt or injure them, usually with an implement such as a club or whip.
    "a woman whose husband would frequently beat her after becoming drunk

[Dish]

So anyway...

[Sir Lawrence]

So anyway...

Bears/Packers.  Very quiet from both camps.  Both are worried about losing. 

[Dish]

Bears/Packers.  Very quiet from both camps.  Both are worried about losing. 

I have no clue what to make of the Bears, I think you hit the nail on the head here though.

I think the Pack might be an average team. But, Rodgers owns the Bears, and Capers typically brings his best to own Cutler.

Another Cutler loss to Green Bay...if he can't beat Green Bay now, then when?

If the Pack go to 1-3, with 2 division losses, could they fight back or would the wheels potentially fall off?

As a Bears fan, I just picture Jordy running crossing routes all afternoon, posting a 9-145-1 line this Sunday.

[ChicosBailBonds]

So anyway...

...breaking the law is a means to an end....I support my employer doing it to me and hope all employers do it.....

[forgetful]

Yes, actually a number of people did break the law here, including the law itself.   So yes, I'm dead serious.  When your employer, or the NFL in this case, is not allowed to have access to certain information, you want them to break the law to acquire it.  I just want to make sure you're good with that.  Then I have a few follow-up questions for you in terms of where it stops and what rights the individual has as it tries to square with due process....thanks....I'll hang up and listen.

Chico's I've read numerous articles indicating that if anyone provided the tape to the NFL that had access to it, that it would not have been remotely in violation of the law. 

That the casino and the employees freely had the right to provide it to others (maybe they would be fired, but not against the law).

[wadesworld]

I have no clue what to make of the Bears, I think you hit the nail on the head here though.

I think the Pack might be an average team. But, Rodgers owns the Bears, and Capers typically brings his best to own Cutler.

Another Cutler loss to Green Bay...if he can't beat Green Bay now, then when?

If the Pack go to 1-3, with 2 division losses, could they fight back or would the wheels potentially fall off?

As a Bears fan, I just picture Jordy running crossing routes all afternoon, posting a 9-145-1 line this Sunday.

It's too bad the Packers don't run crossing routes anymore.  If they did they might be a lot more than an average team.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Should be a good game. I went home this weekend to avoid getting into conflict with packers fans. Just out of curiosity I looked up ticket prices on stub hub just to see if I could snag one and not a single ticket was under $400.

[brandx]

Chico's I've read numerous articles indicating that if anyone provided the tape to the NFL that had access to it, that it would not have been remotely in violation of the law. 

That the casino and the employees freely had the right to provide it to others (maybe they would be fired, but not against the law).

Chicos KNOWS this. It is public knowledge.

He keeps repeating the lie and then acts the victim when called a liar.

[NavinRJohnson]

I don't think either team is any good. That said, I expect the packers to win.

[jesmu84]

It begins...

[wadesworld]

How much did the Bears pay the refs to get that call?  That's as bad of a call as I've seen this year.

Not that it would've mattered, the Packers would've sat back in coverage on 3rd and 14 and AJ Hawk would've watched Bennet cross over the middle while Hawk stays square to the line of scrimmage and Bennet would've picked up 15 yards for a first down.

[wadesworld]

Well, that was a quick answer.  Love the playcalling by McCarthy.  Good things happen when you use the most dangerous offensive player in the NFL.

[Dish]

Pack run defense leaving plenty to be desired.