“Now is the time”

[TallTitan34]

Love it.

[mu03eng]

12 Team League
East:
Seton Hall
St. Johns
Georgetown
Villanova
Providence
Dayton

West:
Marquette
DePaul
CincinnatiXavier
Creighton
SLU
GonzagaButler

Fixed and I think that is an amazing basketball conference given the circumstances, with a variety of styles and some natural rivalries possible in there.  Also makes sense geographically as no one would have more than a 4 hour plan ride for anything.  Also some strong non-revenue sport possibilities there especially in soccer and volleyball.  Lacrosse we might need to land somewhere else.

Not to be a narcissist and quote myself....but I will.

You take this league to NBC and their sports network that is dying for content especially without NHL, get a 5 year contract.  The games will be on all the time, hell they are still replaying equestrian events from the London Olympics, some of the bigger match ups get shown on NBC itself, and then you see if you can get a bigger deal when all the restructuring is done.  Basically, you take the BEast exit money and the initial network deal to float/build the league for 5 years, hope like hell you get a couple of deep tourney runs out of members of the league and work like crazy to build brand recognition.  You'll still get A talent, the key is the first 5 years in getting everything established.

[mu03eng]

And for those that worry about going with NBC Sports or CBS sports instead of the 4 letter network, I think they are in for a perfect storm of disaster in the next 5-10 years.  All of these things will be hitting at roughly the same time
-Overpaying for NFL rights
    -Concussion nightmare coming for the NFL and costs/impact to the game associated with it
    -Same thing for college football
-Conference realignment/money grab in college football
    -"Unpaid" labor force
-ESPN constantly raising their broadcast rights cost to the providers(they will push back)
-Content delivery will move from the cable providers to more web-based, ala cart(how much who knows, but it will impact revenues for ESPN)
-A generally souring public opinion of ESPN with the help of websites like Deadspin constantly hammering away at them.
-Proliferation of competitive sports networks
   -not that any one network would take them down, but there will be an erosion of content over time that     will catch up with them

ESPN isn't going away, but they might be in a much weaker position 5 years from now from a content position, so we build brand, get a good league and we can go to any network including ESPN with leverage.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

12 Team League
East:
Seton Hall
St. Johns
Georgetown
Villanova
Providence
Dayton

West:
Marquette
DePaul
CincinnatiXavier
Creighton
SLU
GonzagaButler

Fixed and I think that is an amazing basketball conference given the circumstances, with a variety of styles and some natural rivalries possible in there.  Also makes sense geographically as no one would have more than a 4 hour plan ride for anything.  Also some strong non-revenue sport possibilities there especially in soccer and volleyball.  Lacrosse we might need to land somewhere else.

I could live with this.

I would also like these schools to make sure they go out and play a tough non-conf. schedule in order to keep the teams/conf. profiles up. It's important for this conference to play a lot of major conf. schools in order to keep of the perception that the "New Big East" is a "major conference".

These schools can't play a bunch of cupcakes, and then play each other in conf. and expect to stay nationally relevant.

[mu03eng]

I could live with this.

I would also like these schools to make sure they go out and play a tough non-conf. schedule in order to keep the teams/conf. profiles up. It's important for this conference to play a lot of major conf. schools in order to keep of the perception that the "New Big East" is a "major conference".

These schools can't play a bunch of cupcakes, and then play each other in conf. and expect to stay nationally relevant.

Completely agree.  This league would also have the advantage of focusing on basketball, the other big conference teams will be focused on football first as the revenue generator and basketball second.  Some recruits will be attracted to the "I am the man on campus" thought.

[Litehouse]

If it happens, I'd STRONGLY prefer to keep it at 10, at least for now.  That way we can play a full round robin 18 game schedule with home-and-home against everyone.  Build up better rivalries, better match-ups for TV, less mouths to feed, keep it focused for now.

Also, the more I think about it, the more I really think the time is now.  We could make a huge publicity splash, with the way all this conference crap is going we could come out and say college football is ruining college basketball and we're here to make a stand and fight for college basketball because that's our #1 priority.  We care more about basketball than everyone else and this is the premiere place for players to come and play, and true fans of the game to watch.  Stake our claim now before we get lost in the shuffle.  All the schools can use this as a huge opportunity to establish their identity.  We are scrappy private colleges in urban areas serving a higher purpose, with an unmatched commitment to basketball.

If we wait around a few years to cash all the remaining pay-outs and units from the departees, the Big East brand will continue to be diluted.  All the conferences will settle in on their final structure, the story will be over, and we'll look like the left-overs doing something out of desperation because there's nothing left to do.  Also, the ACC will have more time to weasel their way into MSG.  It might cost us financially short-term, but it would be far better for our brand identity as a group, which is really what playing basketball is about for us anyway, a way to raise the profile of our schools.

[chapman]

I could live with this.

I would also like these schools to make sure they go out and play a tough non-conf. schedule in order to keep the teams/conf. profiles up. It's important for this conference to play a lot of major conf. schools in order to keep of the perception that the "New Big East" is a "major conference".

These schools can't play a bunch of cupcakes, and then play each other in conf. and expect to stay nationally relevant.

Agree.  I like 12 teams as well for that reason; it presents a natural 16 game schedule which gives more slots for out of conference flexibility but still enough size to not beat up on each other so much it makes it difficult to get 6+ NCAA bids.

[M@RQUETTEW@RRIORS]

The key to all of this is "NOW"

While the bball schools hold the advantage and voting power.  Otherwise the cast offs from the "football" schools will regain the power.  And the conference will be a cluster $%^&  of Houston, Tulane, etc.  The schedule will be a joke and we will be unidentifiable in a sea of 25 teams that nobody cares about.

Make no mistake the football schools would do exactly the same thing if they were in our position.  We have what?  6 months till Temple gets a vote?  NOW...

[Aughnanure]

12 Team League
East:
Seton Hall
St. Johns
Georgetown
Villanova
Providence
Dayton Richmond/VCU

West:
Marquette
DePaul
CincinnatiXavier
Creighton
SLU
GonzagaButler

Fixed and I think that is an amazing basketball conference given the circumstances, with a variety of styles and some natural rivalries possible in there.  Also makes sense geographically as no one would have more than a 4 hour plan ride for anything.  Also some strong non-revenue sport possibilities there especially in soccer and volleyball.  Lacrosse we might need to land somewhere else.

I don't think you'd split up Dayton and Xavier. I'd rather go Richmond (private, big endowment) or VCU and really hold down the east coast. Dayton would be a better option for a 15 or 16 team league.

[Litehouse]

Why do people want to go any higher than 10?  Every game against SLU, Creighton or Richmond means we likely lose a game against Georgetown, Villanova, or St. Johns.

[reinko]

I don't think you'd split up Dayton and Xavier. I'd rather go Richmond (private, big endowment) or VCU and really hold down the east coast. Dayton would be a better option for a 15 or 16 team league.

Plus I still hold a grudge against Dayton for that shellacking we took, what like 3 years ago?

[MUfan12]

Plus I still hold a grudge against Dayton for that shellacking we took, what like 3 years ago?

My grudge goes back to all the screwjobs we'd get whenever we played down there. The officiating in that 2003 game was a travesty.

[Aughnanure]

Why do people want to go any higher than 10?

Because I think there's a pretty deep crop of candidates to get to 12 w/ VCU, Butler, Creighton, Xavier, St. Louis, Richmond, Wichita St, Dayton...

...And to be honest, they help the league look better w/ the dead-weight the league will be carrying with programs that have had little national success/attention for the past 8 years (DePaul, Providence, Seton Hall). I actually think those programs will be ready to really thrive in this league - but just from outward perception currently - there're the weakest part.

I'm also a fan of divisions or pods (if 16), because it gives teams and fans multiple things to win and shoot for, rather than always finishing just 7th.

[Warrior of Law]

How do we petition the Directors of Athletics/presidents to get this done...pronto? 

[77smooth]

I'm liking some variation of this idea, but here's one other thought to keep in mind: The conference landscape will be changing for years, and if, for example, the ACC is weakened enough, more schools might become available for future expansion. I'm even thinking about some schools that offer football now but that might decide to cut their programs (sound familiar?). One possible example: Wake Forest. The Demon Deacons have a nice basketball history but haven't been significant, or any good, in football for a long, long time. Schools like that could end up joining a "basketball-only" conference down the road.

[Aughnanure]

How do we petition the Directors of Athletics/presidents to get this done...pronto? 

Wait, they don't already read MUScoop religiously?

[Litehouse]

Because I think there's a pretty deep crop of candidates to get to 12 w/ VCU, Butler, Creighton, Xavier, St. Louis, Richmond, Wichita St, Dayton...

...And to be honest, they help the league look better w/ the dead-weight the league will be carrying with programs that have had little national success/attention for the past 8 years (DePaul, Providence, Seton Hall). I actually think those programs will be ready to really thrive in this league - but just from outward perception currently - there're the weakest part.

I'm also a fan of divisions or pods (if 16), because it gives teams multiple things to win and shoot for, rather than always finishing just 7th.

We might get there eventually, but I'd rather keep it tight and focused for now (Xavier, Dayton, Butler).  Every game against VCU, Creighton, St. Louis, Richmond, Wichita St means we lose a game against someone like G-Town, Nova or St. Johns.

[ceh]

“Now is the time (to dissolve). The basketball schools, they probably still have enough big names to have some leverage with TV. Pull a couple of A-10 schools and do it. I don’t know enough about what they’d be able to do (TV contract-wise), but I think you’d better make a move now or else you’re really going to get lost.”

Credibility lost in the first paragraph ....

[LAZER]

Because I think there's a pretty deep crop of candidates to get to 12 w/ VCU, Butler, Creighton, Xavier, St. Louis, Richmond, Wichita St, Dayton...

...And to be honest, they help the league look better w/ the dead-weight the league will be carrying with programs that have had little national success/attention for the past 8 years (DePaul, Providence, Seton Hall). I actually think those programs will be ready to really thrive in this league - but just from outward perception currently - there're the weakest part.

I'm also a fan of divisions or pods (if 16), because it gives teams multiple things to win and shoot for, rather than always finishing just 7th.

12 teams gives you a nice Tournament format as well, but I wouldn't want to go more than that.  The strength of this conference would be its depth.

[JTBMU7]

this sounds great but what is the mechanism for making it happen? i just dont know how it comes about or who is representing the "new league". i still think it's more viable/realistic that all 7 teams just jump into the A10 given their established infrastructure.

[reinko]

How do we petition the Directors of Athletics/presidents to get this done...pronto? 

Maybe Ners can write a love letter to Buzz again.

[M@RQUETTEW@RRIORS]

this sounds great but what is the mechanism for making it happen? i just dont know how it comes about or who is representing the "new league". i still think it's more viable/realistic that all 7 teams just jump into the A10 given their established infrastructure.

The mechanism is at hand.  The bball schools currently hold enough votes to make things happen.

Step 1)  Extend the time period that allows Temple to gain voting rights.(dirty pool, but what are the football schools doing to us?)

Step 2) If you dont want to do step 1, then rescind the membership of all of the new football schools.

Step 3) The other "better football schools"  uconn, cincy etc were gonna leave anyway.

This way we keep the Big East name and can still collect the exit fees from the remaining football schools when they go.

Is it hardball?  Definately.  But what hasnt been lately with all of the re-alignment stuff?

[chapman]

Because I think there's a pretty deep crop of candidates to get to 12 w/ VCU, Butler, Creighton, Xavier, St. Louis, Richmond, Wichita St, Dayton...

...And to be honest, they help the league look better w/ the dead-weight the league will be carrying with programs that have had little national success/attention for the past 8 years (DePaul, Providence, Seton Hall). I actually think those programs will be ready to really thrive in this league - but just from outward perception currently - there're the weakest part.

I'm also a fan of divisions or pods (if 16), because it gives teams and fans multiple things to win and shoot for, rather than always finishing just 7th.

Agree.  And too many MU/Georgetown, MU/Xavier, etc. head-to-heads can hurt tournament chances for the conference.  Plus, while it may offer more "premiere" games to schedule with a smaller conference, it also offers less total games.  Whether you're looking to pitch to ESPN, which you need a game when they want it because the premiere matchups will still play second fiddle to BCS leagues, or the NBC which just needs some programming a few more schools gives you a few more games to televise.  12 teams playing 16 games gives more games than 10 playing 18, 12 playing 18 games or 14 teams allows for more games.  And, as noted above, the pool of potential teams to add to the current BE core sweeten the pot since they're much more "televisable" than Providence and DePaul currently are.

[frozena pizza]

Yep, if you could get to 12 or 14 with Xavier, Butler and some combination of Dayton, SLU, Creighton, VCU, Richmond and keep the Big East name, the tournament at MSG and a decent TV deal, I'd say do it today.  I would be pretty happy with that outcome given the circumstances.  I'd much prefer that to Conference-USA version 2.0.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Interesting:

If you only took 10 today, that would give you flexibility to add 4-6 more in a handful of years. There could be some pretty nice options depending how everything shakes out.

At the rate the landscape is changing, that might be a fantastic move, or it could also backfire.