alleged sexual assault investigation of 4 on 1 by public saftey

[HouWarrior]

That's my wife to a tee....she immediately had doubts about the girl in terms of her immediate thoughts.  Doesn't mean she tried and convicted her, but her brain immediately wondered what she was up to not so much the guys.



I can't figure women out, stopped trying years ago.

My wife had the same reaction, and a pretty cogent reasoning.... Any woman making a false or inflated accusation, in her view, is just making it that much harder for the next one, who has a real claim to enforce her rights.

She said, ..."any woman crying Wolf, makes it harder for us to cry Pig, when y'all are actually being one.."

Wise woman--- I duly fear her...the secret to a 27 year marriage. lol

[pbiflyer]

As my daddy told me when I was a young man, "Son, women don't think like you think.   Women don't think like you think they are going to think.   And if you think you know what a woman is thinking, think again."     To my sister, his advice was, "Sweetheart, boys lie."

You have a good dad.

[wyzgy]

She feels unsafe now or has felt unsafe the past 5+ months that she's lived there?

unsafe from what?  see, this is where there has been so much ambiguity.  was it sexual assault or harassment?  most comments on this board seem to lean harassment.  o.k. then, unsafe from someone continuing to say something inappropriate(i.e. nice ass) or the repercussions of going public with the accusations?  there are also ways to mediate these things if we(as a society) weren't so damn litigious

[ChicosBailBonds]

unsafe from what?  see, this is where there has been so much ambiguity.  was it sexual assault or harassment?  most comments on this board seem to lean harassment.  o.k. then, unsafe from someone continuing to say something inappropriate(i.e. nice ass) or the repercussions of going public with the accusations?  there are also ways to mediate these things if we(as a society) weren't so damn litigious

I would assume unsafe from some moron in class or on a Friday night that wants to scream at her or whatever.  I could understand her feeling uncomfortable.

This is what is so tricky about this stuff.  She obviously feels something happened and I'm not going to disparage her for feeling that way.  I don't like that she waited months for this to go to the MPD, on the other hand the university had it from the very beginning, so it's not like she hadn't reported it.  She went down a path to the authorities.  Was it the right path?  Was it the right authorities?  Who knows. 

Now its out in public and she's probably concerned about getting those looks in class, those snide remarks from other students, or something worse, etc.

I don't want to pretend to be in her shoes or those of the 4 young men involved.  Sucks for everyone.

[cheebs09]

I understand what you are saying Chicos and I agree, but I think the original post about girls feeling uncomfortable was from a poster's friend's daughter and not the accuser. Although I could definitely see where the accuser is uncomfortable.

[Goose]

HouWarrior--How would your wife any idea what the girl experienced? I hope you meant to put your fear of your wife in teal....otherwise I'm speechless.

[HouWarrior]

HouWarrior--How would your wife any idea what the girl experienced? I hope you meant to put your fear of your wife in teal....otherwise I'm speechless.

I'll hold you to your speechless promise--lol.

As I alluded, I have tried a few sex harrassment cases, including one with a totally false accuser(admitted by her on the witness stand)......which is the situation that spurred my wife's  Wolf/Pig quote...not this case..

On this matter,on the facts to this point, and on the reports,  I honestly do suspect the delay, claim history and timing point to an attorney leveraging for her civil claims through the press, and the tardy criminal referral request. Broad press can both leverage a claim, and taint a jury pool. Our system affords either state pursued criminal pursuit of the actors, when there is a crime, or money to the victim; or both. Not money,here, from the athletes, but rather from the deeper pocketed institution, MU, on its investigatory/response failures. This is just as an employer is usually not liable for the occurence of harrasment, but is, instead sued for its training failures, or its investigation/disciplinary response(all employer liability grounds, accepted by a key US Sup Ct Decision).. As deep throat said....follow the money, as this unfolds in coming months. I hope my gut is dead wrong, for everyone's sake.

[wyzgy]

i know i know, the facts aren't out yet, but i'm just speculating here.  i'm wondering if some comments were exchanged, they were received the way they were intended, someone was insulted, more comments exchanged and it got more personal leading each to protect each others dignity and b/c it happenned in a crowd, prides were probably hurt and it became an i'll get you you mofor'er.  the girl(s) continue on throughout the night dwelling on the incident then wake up the next a.m. continue to talk about the isssue, growing madder by the minute, they call public saftey and you know the rest of the story.  now it's like, wow, did we really have to take this to this leve??

[shiloh26]

i know i know, the facts aren't out yet, but i'm just speculating here. 

That should be your cue to stop typing. 

[LON]

unsafe from what?  see, this is where there has been so much ambiguity.  was it sexual assault or harassment?  most comments on this board seem to lean harassment.  o.k. then, unsafe from someone continuing to say something inappropriate(i.e. nice ass) or the repercussions of going public with the accusations?  there are also ways to mediate these things if we(as a society) weren't so damn litigious

I have no idea.  I was asking a question in response to this:

I also feel, based on who I've talked to regarding this, that more of the girls are finding these players guilty than guys are. Most guys are taking a wait and see position, and want to see the legal process go through before passing judgement. I have a friend who lives in Humphrey, and she feels unsafe living there now. It's unfortunate that people are jumping to conclusions so quickly, but as houwarrior said, the assumption of guilt tends to be already there for the accused in society today.

[GGGG]

i know i know, the facts aren't out yet, but i'm just speculating here.  i'm wondering if some comments were exchanged, they were received the way they were intended, someone was insulted, more comments exchanged and it got more personal leading each to protect each others dignity and b/c it happenned in a crowd, prides were probably hurt and it became an i'll get you you mofor'er.  the girl(s) continue on throughout the night dwelling on the incident then wake up the next a.m. continue to talk about the isssue, growing madder by the minute, they call public saftey and you know the rest of the story.  now it's like, wow, did we really have to take this to this leve??

I'm *not* speculating here.  You keep talking out yer ass about something you know nothing about.

[MerrittsMustache]

i know i know, the facts aren't out yet, but i'm just speculating here.  i'm wondering if some comments were exchanged, they were received the way they were intended, someone was insulted, more comments exchanged and it got more personal leading each to protect each others dignity and b/c it happenned in a crowd, prides were probably hurt and it became an i'll get you you mofor'er.  the girl(s) continue on throughout the night dwelling on the incident then wake up the next a.m. continue to talk about the isssue, growing madder by the minute, they call public saftey and you know the rest of the story.  now it's like, wow, did we really have to take this to this leve??

The girl contacted public safety at 2:30am. She didn't sleep on it, let it simmer and then blow it out of proportion in her mind the next day.

Who knows? Maybe she's an angry, emotional drunk who was looking for attention, got it and then blew it out of proportion. Maybe she's an innocent girl who was harassed to the point where she felt unsafe. Maybe it's somewhere in between. WE DON'T KNOW so stop making up stories.

[willie warrior]

This thread is likened to a circle jerk. A bunch of speculation, vague innuendoes, and no facts. Don't even know who is being speculated about: BB players-men or womens, soccer players ar pep band members. What we need here is for Mike Tyson to get in the middle of this crowd and clean out the BS. Tyson sure as hell knows what sexual harassment, sexual abuse and rape is all about.

I guess everybody can have an opinion, but why speculate about this. Who is involved and what are the facts---otherwise get out of the circle jerk!!!!!

[GGGG]

Willie, I agree with you except they *are* basketball players.  And a number of people know *who* specifically they are, but aren't going to say so because it would be unfair to post as such in a public forum.  My understanding is that most of the students know who these players are too.

[TallTitan34]

Houwarrior, if it is a lawsuit against MU not properly handling things do you think she has a good case?

I realize all of the facts aren't out yet, but it looks like MU followed all of it's policies and processes that it has established for these situations.  In addition, the girl was told her right to bring the case to the MPD.  I guess I just don't get what her case would be against MU.

[Shanunu]

I have no idea.  I was asking a question in response to this:

Quote from: Shanunu on March 30, 2011, 12:33:29 PM
I also feel, based on who I've talked to regarding this, that more of the girls are finding these players guilty than guys are. Most guys are taking a wait and see position, and want to see the legal process go through before passing judgement. I have a friend who lives in Humphrey, and she feels unsafe living there now. It's unfortunate that people are jumping to conclusions so quickly, but as houwarrior said, the assumption of guilt tends to be already there for the accused in society today.

Essentially, she's always been a little creeped out by a few of the players, but never had any real problems. But now that rumors and such are coming out, many of which are probably untrue, she worries about letting her guard down whenever she's in her building. It just sucks that girls have to feel that way in their own apartment building, especially one university owned. I'm not condemning the players as guilty, but reality is that people will feel more apprehensive to be around them after all that's floating around out there.

[wyzgy]

I'm *not* speculating here.  You keep talking out yer ass about something you know nothing about.

That should be your cue to stop typing.

who made you guys the queens of the message boards?? this is a venue to exchange thoughts-if you geeks don't like mine, put me on ignore

[Benny B]

Id rather have it as a joke than focus on the status of the basketball team when a girl might have been raped

Who's claiming rape?  Rape and sexual assault are two entirely different crimes.  If you don't understand the difference, I'm sure Wikipedia can provide a primer.

[MisterJaylenBrownMU]

This thread is likened to a circle jerk. A bunch of speculation, vague innuendoes, and no facts. Don't even know who is being speculated about: BB players-men or womens, soccer players ar pep band members . . . . I guess everybody can have an opinion, but why speculate about this. Who is involved and what are the facts---otherwise get out of the circle jerk!!!!!

Reminds me of one of my favorite Daily Show clips of all time: http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-november-10-2003/prince-charles-scandal

[shiloh26]

That should be your cue to stop typing.

who made you guys the queens of the message boards?? this is a venue to exchange thoughts-if you geeks don't like mine, put me on ignore

Yep, the problem clearly lies in everyone else.   

[willie warrior]

Willie, I agree with you except they *are* basketball players.  And a number of people know *who* specifically they are, but aren't going to say so because it would be unfair to post as such in a public forum.  My understanding is that most of the students know who these players are too.

Yes, so instead we get 300 plus posts, many speculating what is going on, that it was members of the BB team, so the whole team gets tarred and feathered--at least tainted. I'm beginning  to wish we would land a huge recruit to get people on a different kick. I will be ignoring these dumb innuendoes.

[Coleman]

That should be your cue to stop typing. 

That should be your cue to stop typing.

BURN 

[HouWarrior]

Houwarrior, if it is a lawsuit against MU not properly handling things do you think she has a good case?

I realize all of the facts aren't out yet, but it looks like MU followed all of it's policies and processes that it has established for these situations.  In addition, the girl was told her right to bring the case to the MPD.  I guess I just don't get what her case would be against MU.

I agree-- its appears MU was quick to press release each and every of its investigative steps the night of the incident,which seemed to follow policy. There is a little more mystery, as to the steps in the disciplinary hearing, but only because they are by policy/maybe law to be kept confidential. What is odd is the victim claiming favored treatment, when there apparently was a "guilt" finding of violating campus no sexual harrassment policy---Could she reasonably expect them to find criminal assault,without any medical referral/scene biology, and without the victim pursuing a MPD report option? MU lacks jurisdiction over crimes.
We dont know the punishment--maybe that was "favorable".

For now it seems there is no publicly known problematic evidence of MU liability/exposure, so far. Of course your case is in the best shape when you first meet and hear only your clients side of the facts....and it only goes downhill after that. lol

[TallTitan34]

Thanks, houwarrior.

[MUfan12]

April Fool's Day strikes again.

Also, if what I was told today about this is what actually happened, Ari's "Disney Duke Lacrosse" description was perfect. Don't think this will be much of an issue.