Can't believe the amount of uncontested 3's we allow and the low minutes for good players like Burton.
Buzz is going to have some key transfers this year and he deserves them...this is on him.
Buzz is doing what he can with this club, but allowing this horrendous backcourt to continue without getting the young guys experience or a chance blows my mind.
Quote from: 77ncaachamps on February 22, 2014, 03:33:45 PM
Buzz is doing what he can with this club, but allowing this horrendous backcourt to continue without getting the young guys experience or a chance blows my mind.
That kills me too...
Quote from: The Sultan of Silly on February 22, 2014, 03:32:44 PM
Can't believe the amount of uncontested 3's we allow and the low minutes for good players like Burton.
Buzz is going to have some key transfers this year and he deserves them...this is on him.
who is going to transfer? care to put a wager on it?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 03:39:06 PM
who is going to transfer? care to put a wager on it?
If I had to bet i'd take say JJJ.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 03:39:06 PM
who is going to transfer? care to put a wager on it?
Hopefully most of the posters on the game thread will find a new team to cheer for next season.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 03:39:06 PM
who is going to transfer? care to put a wager on it?
I hope JJJ stays.
But he was your son, wouldn't you be looking elsewhere?
DuW?
Quote from: 77ncaachamps on February 22, 2014, 03:40:54 PM
I hope JJJ stays.
But he was your son, wouldn't you be looking elsewhere?
Why? Because he missed a lot of practice time with an injury and hasn't earned his playing time when healthy? I'd tell my son that if he wants to play more, he should get better.
We'll lose 2 of Duane Wilson, Jajuan Johnson, Deonte Burton and Steve Taylor.
We are not losing Duane Wilson after he convinced Luke Fisher to transfer here.
JJJ will transfer however.
Quote from: The Sultan of Silly on February 22, 2014, 03:43:52 PM
We'll lose 2 of Duane Wilson, Jajuan Johnson, Deonte Burton and Steve Taylor.
fine. don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out. i want players who want to be here.
This is why I absolutely hate this board cause you all think you know exactly what a college kid is thinking. I do agree Buzz has struggled this year with coaching but you have no clue what goes through these kids minds.
Just when I think you can't get any dumber, you go and do something like this... and totally redeem yourself!
Quote from: 77ncaachamps on February 22, 2014, 03:40:54 PM
I hope JJJ stays.
But he was your son, wouldn't you be looking elsewhere?
Of course.... To be a Top 40 player who played +30 Mpg coming out of High School, leave Memphis turning down offers to be benched inexplicably for games at a time barring hes not hurt.... I'd be on the phone...
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 03:48:12 PM
fine. don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out. i want players who want to be here.
Just out of curiosity, why would any high ranked HIGH SCHOOL player want to come here, based on what has happened this year?
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on February 22, 2014, 03:42:32 PM
Why? Because he missed a lot of practice time with an injury and hasn't earned his playing time when healthy? I'd tell my son that if he wants to play more, he should get better.
Maybe. He can sit out a year upon transferring and get stronger.
But you're right. A month out with an ankle injury (sprain) may not be enough.
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 22, 2014, 03:57:21 PM
Of course.... To be a Top 40 player who played 38 Mpg coming out of High School, leave Memphis turning down offers to be benched inexplicably for games at a time barring hes not hurt.... I'd be on the phone...
inexplicably? i bet buzz is telling him exactly why. just because he's not telling you, doesn't mean JJJ doesn't know.
Quote from: 77ncaachamps on February 22, 2014, 03:40:54 PM
I hope JJJ stays.
But he was your son, wouldn't you be looking elsewhere?
Without lengthy explanation, yes I would.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 03:58:43 PM
Just out of curiosity, why would any high ranked HIGH SCHOOL player want to come here, based on what has happened this year?
because they want to play for marquette and buzz williams. that's why.
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 22, 2014, 03:57:21 PM
Of course.... To be a Top 40 player who played 38 Mpg coming out of High School, leave Memphis turning down offers to be benched inexplicably for games at a time barring hes not hurt.... I'd be on the phone...
38 mpg in high school?! DANG! His team must've went into at least double OT every single game!
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 03:58:43 PM
Just out of curiosity, why would any high ranked HIGH SCHOOL player want to come here, based on what has happened this year?
... Because college is a 4 year process of growth and maturation.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 04:00:09 PM
because they want to play for marquette and buzz williams. that's why.
::), nice answer.
Am I the only person who transferred after my freshman year of college because I was told I couldn't be a MD after 1 year?
Quote from: esard2011 on February 22, 2014, 03:52:56 PM
This is why I absolutely hate this board cause you all think you know exactly what a college kid is thinking. I do agree Buzz has struggled this year with coaching but you have no clue what goes through these kids minds.
I can tell you that all of these kids are used to being stars...and they all put in the same work basically once on campus in the way of practice time/workouts.
If you are a talented freshman, and are sitting behind a guy who is really struggling...what do you think is going through your head? What do you think the people close to you - friends, family, inner circle start telling you?
At least in JJJ's case he has Mayo in front of him...and Jake..who is the only reliable 3 point threat. But Burton and Dawson??
I absolutely concede Burton and Dawson aren't near the defenders of Juan and Derrick...but...we've tried the other way for 27 games now...and we almost lost what should have been as close to a lock of a game as possible today. Team isn't going ANYWHERE with this backcourt..
Quote from: wadesworld on February 22, 2014, 04:00:12 PM
38 mpg in high school?! DANG! His team must've went into (at least 1) OT every single game!
At least 2 every game actually ;) 32 minutes plus 4 minute OTs.
Quote from: WarriorFan on February 22, 2014, 04:01:04 PM
... Because college is a 4 year process of growth and maturation.
It should be.
But that's why we're not a one and done school like UK, Duke, UNC, etc.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 22, 2014, 04:00:12 PM
38 mpg in high school?! DANG! His team must've went into (at least 1) OT every single game!
From being the #1 Guy in Tennessee... To DNP, DNP on the bench on Marquette... His Family has gotta be heated..
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:01:50 PM
::), nice answer.
what's wrong with that answer? it's the truth. players come here because they want to play for marquette, and, more specifically, for buzz.
Quote from: esard2011 on February 22, 2014, 04:02:33 PM
At least 2 every game actually ;) 32 minutes plus 4 minute OTs.
Haha yeah I edited it after you started to reply but before you posted.
Quote from: Ners on February 22, 2014, 04:02:18 PM
I can tell you that all of these kids are used to being stars...and they all put in the same work basically once on campus in the way of practice time/workouts.
If you are a talented freshman, and are sitting behind a guy who is really struggling...what do you think is going through your head? What do you think the people close to you - friends, family, inner circle start telling you?
At least in JJJ's case he has Mayo in front of him...and Jake..who is the only reliable 3 point threat. But Burton and Dawson??
I absolutely concede Burton and Dawson aren't near the defenders of Juan and Derrick...but...we've tried the other way for 27 games now...and we almost lost what should have been as close to a lock of a game as possible today. Team isn't going ANYWHERE with this backcourt..
agreed. not a pretty picture all around.
So JJJ will transfer when 30 minutes (thomas) at the 2 opens next year? Interesting.
The season isn't over. I've been critical of Thomas, but he's playing well, as is Mayo. JJJ isn't as good as them right now. Had buzz game him heavy minutes early in the year he might be ready, but he isn't.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 04:03:26 PM
what's wrong with that answer? it's the truth. players come here because they want to play for marquette, and, more specifically, for buzz.
I'm looking for specifics based on this season, why the hell would any player who is highly ranked want to come here?
Quote from: WarriorFan on February 22, 2014, 04:01:04 PM
... Because college is a 4 year process of growth and maturation.
But when you see what may be your path by looking at the more grown and mature players who have "earned it" over you, is that the path you want to be on? Would be only natural to have some uneasiness about it being the right place to develop.
If JJJ wants to play high level basketball next season, his best opportunity is at Marquette. If he wants to leave, he can leave...not the first, won't be the last.
Is JJJ hurt or are the rumors of his impending departure true?
From my view up close the last few home games, the young guys still look invested and into the game. Despite the limited playing time for JJJ & Dawson, they're still engaged. If one of them decided to transfer already I feel like there would be more signs of apathy. I definitely see Duane sticking around. Steve should be playing a lot next year too.
If Johnson is worried about playing behind Mayo and competing with Ahmed Hill I suppose there's a chance he won't be in an MU uniform next year. If any situation is fishy, it's his. It's too reminiscent of other guys Buzz has sat prior to their departure. But then there is the argument that Buzz always shortens the rotation we progress toward March.
I don't think it's wrong to speculate about transfers. As fans we want to know how the roster shakes up in the future. I expect something to happen, but it's totally up in the air. I'm never worried about Buzz's ability to assemble a competitive, talented and winning roster.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:08:30 PM
I'm looking for specifics based on this season, why the hell would any player who is highly ranked want to come here?
Winning program. Go the NBA. It didn't stop UK from getting top players after their NIT game vs Robert Morris.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:08:30 PM
I'm looking for specifics based on this season, why the hell would any player who is highly ranked want to come here?
Yet we have multiple top 100 players coming in next year...and one top 50 for 2015. Imagine that.
Marquette, and this thread in particular, has an over abundance of complete a55hole fans. Know it all jerkoffs.
Just too bad we didn't win by enough today.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:08:30 PM
I'm looking for specifics based on this season, why the hell would any player who is highly ranked want to come here?
but isn't there more to recruiting than the last single season? buzz's entire tenure at marquette? the future of the team? etc.
Quote from: KenoshaWarrior on February 22, 2014, 03:46:40 PM
We are not losing Duane Wilson after he convinced Luke Fisher to transfer here.
JJJ will transfer however.
I'm not for sure on that, Bro.
Quote from: Jamil_toMU10 on February 22, 2014, 04:11:44 PM
From my view up close the last few home games, the young guys still look invested and into the game. Despite the limited playing time for JJJ & Dawson, they're still engaged.
This. They are the exact opposite of Ferguson towards the end of the season last year. He looked so unhappy every time they put a camera on him sitting on the bench.
I guess things really are good in Marquette land when we can win and still beotch.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 22, 2014, 04:05:10 PM
Haha yeah I edited it after you started to reply but before you posted.
I was editing it... lol... He posted too quick....
But honestly if my kid cant crack a lineup for games at a time.... That Juan Anderson played 20 minutes in and the Hand Eye Coordination of a Snake....
I'd be concerned.... Highly Concerned....
Also, no chance Duane transfers. He would have to sit out ANOTHER year and since he already used his redshirt year he would only get 3 years to play. JJJ also, I dont see him wanting to sit out a year.
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 22, 2014, 04:15:06 PM
I was editing it... lol... He posted too quick....
But honestly if my kid cant crack a lineup for games at a time.... That Juan Anderson played 20 minutes in and the Hand Eye Coordination of a Snake....
I'd be concerned.... Highly Concerned....
OK Mr. Maymon, we hear you.
You guys are clowns. What a joke of a thread. Cesspool of the internet.
Quote from: Ners on February 22, 2014, 04:02:18 PM
I can tell you that all of these kids are used to being stars...and they all put in the same work basically once on campus in the way of practice time/workouts.
If you are a talented freshman, and are sitting behind a guy who is really struggling...what do you think is going through your head? What do you think the people close to you - friends, family, inner circle start telling you?
At least in JJJ's case he has Mayo in front of him...and Jake..who is the only reliable 3 point threat. But Burton and Dawson??
I absolutely concede Burton and Dawson aren't near the defenders of Juan and Derrick...but...we've tried the other way for 27 games now...and we almost lost what should have been as close to a lock of a game as possible today. Team isn't going ANYWHERE with this backcourt..
A big east road game is a lock??!?!?! Far better MU teams have lost to far wosre Depaul teams at Allstate. I truly think each of your posts is dumber than the one before it!
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on February 22, 2014, 04:12:38 PM
Marquette, and this thread in particular, has an over abundance of complete a55hole fans. Know it all jerkoffs.
Just too bad we didn't win by enough today.
Agreed.
The same people come out and same the same stuff. And it's always negative bitching and moaning. Nothing constructive.
I think you guys sell all these guys short by asserting their transfers. What if JJJ and Duane are tough kids that understand they need to get better and there are plenty of minutes to be had next year? I know it's a crazy notion, but it can still happen.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 04:12:55 PM
but isn't there more to recruiting than the last single season? buzz's entire tenure at marquette? the future of the team? etc.
Fair enough, what 4 year players have seen dramatic improvement at MU under Buzz? What percentage of players have been here 4 years? What Buzz high school recruit has made it to the NBA?
He is successful with JUCO's because they have had someone else coach them. It is at JUCO's that our great players learned their skill and get GAME experience, it is at MU that they learned about effort, attitude and discipline. Buzz cares more about effort than talent or ability. I hope Buzz either goes back to heavily recruiting JUCO's or recruits players with actual skill or else we will see a lot more seasons like this one.
Quote from: LAZER on February 22, 2014, 04:19:17 PM
I think you guys sell all these guys short by asserting their transfers. What if JJJ and Duane are tough kids that understand they need to get better and there are plenty of minutes to be had next year? I know it's a crazy notion, but it can still happen.
You aren't keeping up with the narrative. They already are better but Buzz is only playing the worse players because he is stubbornly loyal.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:08:30 PM
I'm looking for specifics based on this season, why the hell would any player who is highly ranked want to come here?
probably not a good thing if you're recruiting a kid that looks at one year of basketball and makes a decision about a team...but i can name a few reasons why kids would want to come to MU...
*vander blue
*jimmy butler
*dwight buycks
*jae crowder
*lazar hayward
*DJO
*wes mathews
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:20:52 PM
Fair enough, what 4 year players have seen dramatic improvement at MU under Buzz? What percentage of players have been here 4 years? What Buzz high school recruit has made it to the NBA?
He is successful with JUCO's because they have had someone else coach them. It is at JUCO's that our great players learned their skill and get GAME experience, it is at MU that they learned about effort, attitude and discipline. Buzz cares more about effort than talent or ability. I hope Buzz either goes back to heavily recruiting JUCO's or recruits players with actual skill or else we will see a lot more seasons like this one.
This may be the dumbest thing posted on this site ever.
Quote from: 77ncaachamps on February 22, 2014, 03:40:54 PM
I hope JJJ stays.
But he was your son, wouldn't you be looking elsewhere?
Why? Does everything have to be instant gratification? If he wants to make it to the NBA (and I'm sure he does), it is all about working hard and being ready.
And I'm sure JJJ knows this. I think he will be an outstanding player at MU as soon as next year.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:20:52 PM
What Buzz high school recruit has made it to the NBA?
Vander Blue.
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 04:18:41 PM
Agreed.
The same people come out and same the same stuff. And it's always negative bitching and moaning. Nothing constructive.
Agreed...it sounds like MU fans opining about an IU team that isn't theirs. ;)
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on February 22, 2014, 04:12:38 PM
Marquette, and this thread in particular, has an over abundance of complete a55hole fans. Know it all jerkoffs.
Just too bad we didn't win by enough today.
Seems to me you "All American Posters" just can't tolerate opinions outside your own.The program is better off with ruthless fans who will only accept excellence. The future is now and fans should be disgusted with the players, Buzz, the entirety of this season. Just because you post all the time doesn't make your opinion more valid. Maybe it just makes you loud.
Everyone should be welcome to voice an opinion on here. We all want W's. Period.
Quote from: connie on February 22, 2014, 04:22:41 PM
This may be the dumbest thing posted on this site ever.
Duh. It was Bencat. Were you expecting different?
Quote from: brandx on February 22, 2014, 04:24:06 PM
Duh. It was Bencat. Were you expecting different?
Sorry. I have been thrown off lately by River Rat.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on February 22, 2014, 04:13:16 PM
I'm not for sure on that, Bro.
I heard Looney's going to Duke!
Quote from: Mumichfan06 on February 22, 2014, 04:24:03 PM
Seems to me you "All American Posters" just can't tolerate opinions outside your own.The program is better off with ruthless fans who will only accept excellence. The future is now and fans should be disgusted with the players, Buzz, the entirety of this season. Just because you post all the unnatural carnal knowledgeing time doesn't make your opinion more valid. Maybe it just makes you loud.
Then say something substantive. Not just paragraphs full of cliches.
Quote from: avid1010 on February 22, 2014, 04:21:51 PM
probably not a good thing if you're recruiting a kid that looks at one year of basketball and makes a decision about a team...but i can name a few reasons why kids would want to come to MU...
*vander blue Didn't make it four years, didn't make the NBA, not a great deal of improvement
*jimmy butler JUCO
*dwight buycks JUCO
*jae crowder JUCO
*lazar Hayward Only played two years under Buzz, Crean guy IMO
*DJO JUCO
*wes Mathews Again Crean guy, only played one year under Buzz
Quote from: connie on February 22, 2014, 04:22:41 PM
This may be the dumbest thing posted on this site ever.
But true when you go through the list of good to great players under Buzz
Vander Blue made the NBA. You really should pay attention more.
Quote from: connie on February 22, 2014, 04:24:58 PM
Sorry. I have been thrown off lately by River Rat.
I always assumed they were the same guy. ;D
High concern on Du Wilson and JJJ both leaving.
Wes Matthews said on Senior Day, thank you coach Buzz for taking the hand cuffs off of me!
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 04:26:27 PM
Vander Blue made the NBA. You really should pay attention more.
That's making it?.... ::)Ok, how is that kool aid?
Quote from: Goose on February 22, 2014, 04:28:24 PM
High concern on Du Wilson and JJJ both leaving.
If Duane would he would be gone by now. Is it a real loss if JJJ left?
Quote from: brandx on February 22, 2014, 04:24:06 PM
Duh. It was Bencat. Were you expecting different?
Again, tell me where I am wrong? I listed my reasons and they are valid.
What exactly do you bring to the table? Besides insults?
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:20:52 PM
Fair enough, what 4 year players have seen dramatic improvement at MU under Buzz? What percentage of players have been here 4 years? What Buzz high school recruit has made it to the NBA?
He is successful with JUCO's because they have had someone else coach them. It is at JUCO's that our great players learned their skill and get GAME experience, it is at MU that they learned about effort, attitude and discipline. Buzz cares more about effort than talent or ability. I hope Buzz either goes back to heavily recruiting JUCO's or recruits players with actual skill or else we will see a lot more seasons like this one.
If that was true, why would he waste time, energy and effort on recruiting highly ranked players? He surely could find high effort guys in the 200+ rankings?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 04:31:44 PM
If that was true, why would he waste time, energy and effort on recruiting highly ranked players? He surely could find high effort guys in the 200+ rankings?
His rotations suggest it is true. He starts lesser talented players at 4 of the 5 positions on the floor because they give a better effort.
You always go after the highest caliber players you can get.
Quote from: Mumichfan06 on February 22, 2014, 04:24:03 PM
Seems to me you "All American Posters" just can't tolerate opinions outside your own.The program is better off with ruthless fans who will only accept excellence. The future is now and fans should be disgusted with the players, Buzz, the entirety of this season. Just because you post all the time doesn't make your opinion more valid. Maybe it just makes you loud.
Everyone should be welcome to voice an opinion on here. We all want W's. Period.
"Ruthless" fans who just speculate who is going to transfer and blast our coach who has never missed the tournament...and this after a victory? Why should you be "disgusted" with this season? It's been a rough ride...so what? Does ripping teenagers make you feel better? Not speaking of you in particular, but the treatment of Derrick Wilson on this board is atrocious and offensive. We are a Jesuit institution and we have grown men throwing fits about the fact that he plays too many minutes, while guys who were "high school stars" (Whoppee!) are not playing enough for them. It's absolutely pathetic.
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 04:25:21 PM
Then say something substantive. Not just paragraphs full of cliches.
Says the guy who defends every move Buzz makes without any original thought.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:29:03 PM
That's making it?.... ::)Ok, how is that kool aid?
I don't know you or care to, but Vander made more money in 10 days than you did in 2 year!
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:29:03 PM
That's making it?.... ::)Ok, how is that kool aid?
Played for Celtics briefly, but he did!
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:33:56 PM
His rotations suggest it is true. He starts lesser talented players at 4 of the 5 positions on the floor because they give a better effort.
You always go after the highest caliber players you can get.
If this is the long term plan though, to bring in high caliber guys and get them to put in their max effort before they see the court, doesn't that allow for very successful teams in the end? Imagine JJJ, Burton, Duane, Dawson 3 years from now, with their talent plus max effort all over the court. Wouldn't that be a good scenario? And underclassmen below them would see the success and effort that would cause them to repeat the cycle. I don't know if that's Buzz's strategy, but it looks good.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:33:56 PM
He starts lesser talented players at 4 of the 5 positions on the floor because they give a better effort.
Completely stupid remark.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 04:37:26 PM
If this is the long term plan though, to bring in high caliber guys and get them to put in their max effort before they see the court, doesn't that allow for very successful teams in the end? Imagine JJJ, Burton, Duane, Dawson 3 years from now, with their talent plus max effort all over the court. Wouldn't that be a good scenario? And underclassmen below them would see the success and effort that would cause them to repeat the cycle. I don't know if that's Buzz's strategy, but it looks good.
+1000
Ad I think Deonte and JJJ will be outstanding as soon as next year. They have the talent and this year they have learned the difference between high school ball and college ball and how much more effort is required in college.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on February 22, 2014, 04:34:39 PM
"Ruthless" fans who just speculate who is going to transfer and blast our coach who has never missed the tournament...and this after a victory? Why should you be "disgusted" with this season? It's been a rough ride...so what? Does ripping teenagers make you feel better? Not speaking of you in particular, but the treatment of Derrick Wilson on this board is atrocious and offensive. We are a Jesuit institution and we have grown men throwing fits about the fact that he plays too many minutes, while guys who were "high school stars" (Whoppee!) are not playing enough for them. It's absolutely pathetic.
1. I don't speculate who is going to transfer, but I certainly understand why they would.
2. When this board is quiet after a win you and the other Buzz apologists comment about how quiet is, you can't have it both ways
3. I don't rip players, this is on Buzz, and he deserves every bit of criticism he is getting this year.
4. Bottom line, we are all Marquette fans, some of us have higher expectations than others, some have been fans longer than others, but we all are entitled to our opinions. Especially when those opinions have solid facts to back them up. The "All-Americans" need to respect that. The
Quote from: bradley center bat on February 22, 2014, 04:36:36 PM
I don't know you or care to, but Vander made more money in 10 days than you did in 2 year!
Again, personal attack and nothing to do with the topic. A ten day contract is not "making it."
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:35:55 PM
Says the guy who defends every move Buzz makes without any original thought.
Sorry but no.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:29:03 PM
That's making it?.... ::)Ok, how is that kool aid?
It is a factually accurate statement. Sorry that the truth bothers you.
Quote from: brandx on February 22, 2014, 04:37:51 PM
Completely stupid remark.
Keep talking smart, what is wrong about that?
Gardner more talented than Otule
Dawson more talented than D. Wilson
JJJ and Mayo more talented than Jake
Everyone is more talented than Juan
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:41:31 PM
Again, personal attack and nothing to do with the topic. A ten day contract is not "making it."
What is it?
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:40:40 PM
1. I don't speculate who is going to transfer, but I certainly understand why they would.
2. When this board is quiet after a win you and the other Buzz apologists comment about how quiet is, you can't have it both ways
3. I don't rip players, this is on Buzz, and he deserves every bit of criticism he is getting this year.
4. Bottom line, we are all Marquette fans, some of us have higher expectations than others, some have been fans longer than others, but we all are entitled to our opinions. Especially when those opinions have solid facts to back them up. The "All-Americans" need to respect that. The
Just curious... I missed "All-Americans" entry into Scoop. I've heard other posters called slurpers, trolls, ignorant, drunk, stobborn and many more, but not this.
Who are they, and when/why did they get that title? Just trying to keep up.
I have no idea, if anyone is transferring. However, since a lot of you are claiming that JJJ is transferring. Is he transferring, because he is not playing or is Buzz not playing him, because he is transferring? As far as coaching, I am coming to the conclusion that this might be Buzz's best coaching year. Given by this boards astute analysis we have the worse starting point guard and the worse starting shooting guard in the league is it not truly amazing that we are tied for 3rd place?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 04:37:26 PM
If this is the long term plan though, to bring in high caliber guys and get them to put in their max effort before they see the court, doesn't that allow for very successful teams in the end? Imagine JJJ, Burton, Duane, Dawson 3 years from now, with their talent plus max effort all over the court. Wouldn't that be a good scenario? And underclassmen below them would see the success and effort that would cause them to repeat the cycle. I don't know if that's Buzz's strategy, but it looks good.
Than why isn't it working this year?
If everyone stays four years and ego's are removed from the equation this is a solid long term plan. Again this goes back to me asking how many players have made it 4 years under Buzz?
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:43:37 PM
Keep talking smart, what is wrong about that?
Gardner more talented than Otule
Dawson more talented than D. Wilson
JJJ and Mayo more talented than Jake
Everyone is more talented than Juan
"Hard work beats talent when talent fails to work hard."
If Buzz thinks the "talent" isn't working hard enough for the "hard work" to beat them, then the "hard work" damn well better be on the floor.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:43:37 PM
Keep talking smart, what is wrong about that?
Gardner more talented than Otule
Dawson more talented than D. Wilson
JJJ and Mayo more talented than Jake
Everyone is more talented than Juan
Having more tools...or more talent....does not make them better basketball players right now.
As I said, you and others seem to want to have a series of one-on-ones to determine the starting line up.
Quote from: Archies Bat on February 22, 2014, 04:44:58 PM
Just curious... I missed "All-Americans" entry into Scoop. I've heard other posters called slurpers, trolls, ignorant, drunk, stobborn and many more, but not this.
Who are they, and when/why did they get that title? Just trying to keep up.
I was wondering what the hell he was talking about as well, but then I realized that he must be talking about the poster rank above the stars. It goes from walk-on to starter to something to ultimately All-American, all based on the total number of posts.
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 04:45:54 PM
Having more tools...or more talent....does not make them better basketball players right now.
As I said, you and others seem to want to have a series of one-on-ones to determine the starting line up.
Never said they were better basketball players right now, I said they are more talented. It is not an all or nothing argument. I just find it ridiculous the minutes and leashes given to the young guys in comparison to the upper classmen, when there isn't a significant difference in the on court results. It is a joke and will no doubt cost us in the future.
Quote from: esard2011 on February 22, 2014, 04:15:32 PM
Also, no chance Duane transfers. He would have to sit out ANOTHER year and since he already used his redshirt year he would only get 3 years to play. JJJ also, I dont see him wanting to sit out a year.
Wilson may not have to sit out due to this redshirt season with injury and such. That could explain why he didn't move at semester break.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 22, 2014, 04:25:07 PM
I heard Looney's going to Duke!
Not what he told me last Wednesday.
Quote from: ElDonBDon on February 22, 2014, 04:49:30 PM
I was wondering what the hell he was talking about as well, but then I realized that he must be talking about the poster rank above the stars. It goes from walk-on to starter to something to ultimately All-American, all based on the total number of posts.
Thanks for clarifying, I was trying to figure out if it was a compliment or not.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:50:03 PM
Never said they were better basketball players right now, I said they are more talented. It is not an all or nothing argument. I just find it ridiculous the minutes and leashes given to the young guys in comparison to the upper classmen, when there isn't a significant difference in the on court results. It is a joke and will no doubt cost us in the future.
No significant difference in on court results?
You realize that since Buzz shortened his line up and went with the more experienced guys, that they have won four out of five?
Why isn't it working this year? I don't know. Maybe it's the players in particularly the seniors who lack court knowledge or as much skill as prior seniors or leaders? Maybe it's Buzz. Either way, again, this effing board and what it's turned into this year - even a win - is a farce.
So after 8 years of making the tournament, a) Buzz sucks, b) nobody in their right mind would ever want to play for him/Marquette, c) half the team is gone because we all know more than Buzz and he's o violist being unfair to Dawson and JJJ.
We've become spoiled here. Most programs haven't had the consistent success we have had. Time to lighten up Francis.
Quote from: Niv Berkowitz on February 22, 2014, 04:54:11 PM
Why isn't it working this year? I don't know. Maybe it's the players in particularly the seniors who lack court knowledge or as much skill as prior seniors or leaders? Maybe it's Buzz. Either way, again, this effing board and what it's turned into this year - even a win - is a farce.
So after 8 years of making the tournament, a) Buzz sucks, b) nobody in their right mind would ever want to play for him/Marquette, c) half the team is gone because we all know more than Buzz and he's o violist being unfair to Dawson and JJJ.
We've become spoiled here. Most programs haven't had the consistent success we have had. Time to lighten up Francis.
Well said All American
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:45:36 PM
Than why isn't it working this year?
If everyone stays four years and ego's are removed from the equation this is a solid long term plan. Again this goes back to me asking how many players have made it 4 years under Buzz?
The plan may be working this year as it's showing JJJ, Burton, etc what it takes to play at a high D1 program. We may not be seeing that translate into on-court success because we don't have a great starting 5. But, again, if Buzz keeps recruiting high caliber players, then it could work down the road. The guys who are playing this year are not the same caliber players as what Buzz has been recruiting the lately.
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 04:53:55 PM
No significant difference in on court results?
You realize that since Buzz shortened his line up and went with the more experienced guys, that they have won four out of five?
They haven't beaten anyone all year that is worth putting on a resume, with the experienced guys and they have done nothing to improve the future, by limiting the minutes of the young guys. Basically a lost season.
Sigh....even after a win all of our players are going to transfer.
I posted this in another thread. No one disputed it. If you think it is wrong, I would welcome debate on why it is or isn't true.
Will the freshmen transfer because of playing time?
Let's think about this logically. If you accept the premise that the freshmen want more playing time right now, then why would they transfer? Next season at least one of them will HAVE to start (unless we have a really good freshmen) and if they aren't starting, they will be the first options off the bench. If they transfer, then they will get ZERO playing time next year as they will have to sit out. In two years, they will be the stars of this team as their will be only one Senior ahead of them. Meanwhile, if they transferred, they would be just getting to play now and would probably be getting the same if not less PT that they would have gotten for Marquette. The ONLY time transferring for PT makes sense is if you think that a player younger than you is going to be above you on the depth chart. That's why I hold that Dawson may transfer because Duane is now in a lower class than he is. I hope he doesn't, kid has talent. These players picked Marquette for more reasons than just PT. Trust those other reasons.
Also, these freshmen are in the top 7 in freshmen minutes during the Buzz era. Only Mayo, Vander, Gardner, and Maymon had more. If Buzz is half the man I think he is, I am sure he would have given these frosh heads up about what kind of PT they could expect.
Will frosh playing time this year negatively impact recruiting?
This is an argument I am more willing to accept. However, I think it is flawed. I truly believe that Buzz plays the players who give us the best chance of winning. If we accept this premise, then we must assume that the freshmen would be getting even less playing time at teams that are better than us. Buzz can counter any concerns a recruit has about PT but simply stating that the players who give us the best chance to win will play. Every HS student thinks that they will help a college team win. And if they don't think that they can help us win, then we probably don't want them.
So yes, I think an opposing coach could point to freshmen PT and try to sway recruits away from us. But the only teams that can do that are teams who are worse than us, so we have the upper hand on them in other ways. Our freshmen would not be starting at 95% of the teams that are better than us this year.
Recruits choose schools for more than immediate playing time.
Look, the future is bright. Most fans can't or refuse to see it because they don't like where they are now. But these doom and gloom predictions are baseless. They are just angry fans looking for a way to blow off steam. The freshmen love Marquette, they love Buzz, and they accept the playing time that they are given.
That being said, someone is going to transfer. The more and more I hear about Malek Harris, the more and more it sounds like he is coming to Marquette. That requires at least one player to go. The only three who I believe are threats to transfer are (in descending order of likelihood): John Dawson, Juan Anderson, and Jajuan Johnson. Taylor, Burton, and Duane aren't going anywhere.
Dawson may fear being behind Duane on the depth chart who is now a year younger. If that is the case, Dawson would never start and may be better served to play elsewhere. Anderson is already behind several younger players on the depth chart. Unless he discovers some untapped potential in the offseason, it may be best for him to Lockett-transfer somewhere else where he can be a star. Jajuan Johnson could fear that he will be behind both Mayo and Hill next season. If Hill surplants him, JJJ may end up a bench player for his whole career. If this is the case, he transferring may be the best option.
But, no matter which of the three transfer, they will end up at a lesser program than Marquette. If a player needs to go down a competition level in order to be successful, do we really need them at Marquette? No. In addition, we will replace them with someone even better. This has happened every time someone has left a Buzz Williams team (except maybe in Maymon's case. Who did we replace him with?)
So, yes, a transfer will happen. It will not be because Buzz did not play them enough. It will be because Buzz gave them as much time as they deserved, and they simply weren't good enough to cut it as a Marquette Warrior.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:57:06 PM
They haven't beaten anyone all year that is worth putting on a resume, with the experienced guys and they have done nothing to improve the future, by limiting the minutes of the young guys. Basically a lost season.
Oh this argument again. Put players that aren't ready out there so they can be better next year.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 22, 2014, 04:59:30 PM
(except maybe in Maymon's case. Who did we replace him with?)
Jae Crowder.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on February 22, 2014, 04:34:39 PM
"Ruthless" fans who just speculate who is going to transfer and blast our coach who has never missed the tournament...and this after a victory? Why should you be "disgusted" with this season? It's been a rough ride...so what? Does ripping teenagers make you feel better? Not speaking of you in particular, but the treatment of Derrick Wilson on this board is atrocious and offensive. We are a Jesuit institution and we have grown men throwing fits about the fact that he plays too many minutes, while guys who were "high school stars" (Whoppee!) are not playing enough for them. It's absolutely pathetic.
I don't agree with PRN often,
But when I do, it's about this
OJ Mayo does a daddy McDermott and Todd is officially a walk on like Doug.
No one transfers and they all play basketball together happily ever after.
EOM
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 04:59:54 PM
Oh this argument again. Put players that aren't ready out there so they can be better next year.
The argument is that I don't agree they aren't ready. But how dare I question Buzz!
Quote from: jimmybutlerfanatic on February 22, 2014, 05:06:35 PM
OJ Mayo does a daddy McDermott and Todd is officially a walk on like Doug.
No one transfers and they all play basketball together happily ever after.
EOM
OJ Mayo is not an employee of Marquette University, and Todd is not his son, so therefore Todd will not be getting free tuition, and thus will not be walking on at Marquette.
I understand the frustration during a tough season - one that is much worse than we expected.
But when the same uninformed people start telling all of us who is going to transfer, then it starts to get on my nerves.
Obviously my first thought, and those of most of the rational people here is that they don't know what they are talking about. And most people here know that is correct. Are some of these posters who make atrocious posts here in the inner circle of these players and are being told by the player that he is going to transfer? Of course not. It's just attention getting frustration.
I would venture a guess that not a single person posting here knows if anyone will or will not transfer. But of course that doesn't stop them from saying as much.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:07:15 PM
The argument is that I don't agree they aren't ready. But how dare I question Buzz!
Well here's my point of view...
On the one hand, we have a successful coach who sees these guys for a number of hours every day and has come to the conclusion that they aren't ready.
On the other hand, we have internet message board guy.
Guess who I am going to give the benefit of the doubt to? Especially since what he has been doing has been successful recently. Hint: Not you.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on February 22, 2014, 04:50:32 PM
Wilson may not have to sit out due to this redshirt season with injury and such. That could explain why he didn't move at semester break.
Wrong. You can only get a medical redshirt if the injury prevented you from playing the entire season. Duane could have played for a month now. Unless the coach leaves or the whole graduation in 3 years thing you have to sit out a year before transfering. People on this board are pathetic...
Quote from: brandx on February 22, 2014, 05:10:41 PM
I understand the frustration during a tough season - one that is much worse than we expected.
But when the same uninformed people start telling all of us who is going to transfer, then it starts to get on my nerves.
Obviously my first thought, and those of most of the rational people here is that they don't know what they are talking about. And most people here know that is correct. Are some of these posters who make atrocious posts here in the inner circle of these players and are being told by the player that he is going to transfer? Of course not. It's just attention getting frustration.
I would venture a guess that not a single person posting here knows if anyone will or will not transfer. But of course that doesn't stop them from saying as much.
Just dumb.....see I can do it too.
Quote from: brandx on February 22, 2014, 05:10:41 PM
I would venture a guess that not a single person posting here knows if anyone will or will not transfer. But of course that doesn't stop them from saying as much.
You forgot about Dreadman.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:07:15 PM
The argument is that I don't agree they aren't ready. But how dare I question Buzz!
As your posts have shown, you certainly are much more knowledgeable than Buzz when it comes to basketball.
And we all respect your knowledge too ::) ::) ::)
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 05:11:05 PM
Well here's my point of view...
On the one hand, we have a successful coach who sees these guys for a number of hours every day and has come to the conclusion that they aren't ready.
On the other hand, we have internet message board guy.
Guess who I am going to give the benefit of the doubt to? Especially since what he has been doing has been successful recently. Hint: Not you.
So you come here to defend Buzz's every move without an original thought of your own? Got it.
Quote from: Archies Bat on February 22, 2014, 05:12:31 PM
You forgot about Dreadman.
Yeah - he's my go-to-guy for insider info ;D
Quote from: brandx on February 22, 2014, 05:10:41 PM
I understand the frustration during a tough season - one that is much worse than we expected.
But when the same uninformed people start telling all of us who is going to transfer, then it starts to get on my nerves.
Obviously my first thought, and those of most of the rational people here is that they don't know what they are talking about. And most people here know that is correct. Are some of these posters who make atrocious posts here in the inner circle of these players and are being told by the player that he is going to transfer? Of course not. It's just attention getting frustration.
I would venture a guess that not a single person posting here knows if anyone will or will not transfer. But of course that doesn't stop them from saying as much.
Agree. Hell I even talk to the players semi-regularly and I couldnt even tell you if anybody is going to transfer.
Quote from: The Sultan of Silly on February 22, 2014, 03:43:52 PM
We'll lose 2 of Duane Wilson, Jajuan Johnson, Deonte Burton and Steve Taylor.
And yet, MUScoop will still have you. Therein lies the problem.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 22, 2014, 05:10:30 PM
OJ Mayo is not an employee of Marquette University, and Todd is not his son, so therefore Todd will not be getting free tuition, and thus will not be walking on at Marquette.
He's saying OJ would pay for Todd to go to school. He would use his own NBA money. You really couldn't understand that?
Quote from: brandx on February 22, 2014, 05:12:55 PM
As your posts have shown, you certainly are much more knowledgeable than Buzz when it comes to basketball.
And we all respect your knowledge too ::) ::) ::)
I could care less if you respect my basketball knowledge. But your blind loyalty to a guy who has a had a terrible season is pathetic.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 22, 2014, 05:10:30 PM
OJ Mayo is not an employee of Marquette University, and Todd is not his son, so therefore Todd will not be getting free tuition, and thus will not be walking on at Marquette.
What does any of that have to do with anything?
Bet OJ can spend/give his $$$ to anyone he wants.
The vow of poverty Jesuits will take it.
Trying to put a positive spin on this topic and another h8er dream crushes my theory.
H8 this place l8ly.
Quote from: Ners on February 22, 2014, 04:02:18 PM
I can tell you that all of these kids are used to being stars...and they all put in the same work basically once on campus in the way of practice time/workouts.
If you are a talented freshman, and are sitting behind a guy who is really struggling...what do you think is going through your head? What do you think the people close to you - friends, family, inner circle start telling you?
At least in JJJ's case he has Mayo in front of him...and Jake..who is the only reliable 3 point threat. But Burton and Dawson??
I absolutely concede Burton and Dawson aren't near the defenders of Juan and Derrick...but...we've tried the other way for 27 games now...and we almost lost what should have been as close to a lock of a game as possible today. Team isn't going ANYWHERE with this backcourt..
I'm curious, Ners. What transfer opportunities do you think Dawson will have?
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:17:31 PM
I could care less if you respect my basketball knowledge. But your blind loyalty to a guy who has a had a terrible season is pathetic.
Blind loyalty is a problem. I think turning on a guy after one disappointing season is also a problem.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 05:21:42 PM
Blind loyalty is a problem. I think turning on a guy after one disappointing season is also a problem.
Agreed. But getting yelled at and asked for your D1 coaching credentials because you call out a few foolish coaching decisions is the biggest problem of all.
There is no middle ground on this board.
It is one disappointing season, but it doesn't mean you can't point out flaws in that given season.
If someone came out and said "Buzz flat out sucks at coaching" then we got something to work with.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:13:07 PM
So you come here to defend Buzz's every move without an original thought of your own? Got it.
I said "give benefit of the doubt to." So when we are winning, I really don't see much need to question what he is doing.
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on February 22, 2014, 05:25:29 PM
Agreed. But getting yelled at and asked for your D1 coaching credentials because you call out a few foolish coaching decisions is the biggest problem of all.
There is no middle ground on this board.
It is one disappointing season, but it doesn't mean you can't point out flaws in that given season.
If someone came out and said "Buzz flat out sucks at coaching" then we got something to work with.
Agreed, HH.
But we definitely have had people say the equivalent of "Buzz flat out sucks at coaching"
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 22, 2014, 04:03:15 PM
From being the #1 Guy in Tennessee... To DNP, DNP on the bench on Marquette... His Family has gotta be heated..
Not the #1 Guy in Tennessee. Get your facts straight, unless it gets in the way of what you want to argue.
Does the word "Horrendously" count?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 05:28:06 PM
Agreed, HH.
But we definitely have had people say the equivalent of "Buzz flat out sucks at coaching"
Yeah and if that's the case it is fair to get on them.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:08:30 PM
I'm looking for specifics based on this season, why the hell would any player who is highly ranked want to come here?
Because you're here to stick up for them in MUScoop?
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 22, 2014, 05:21:42 PM
Blind loyalty is a problem. I think turning on a guy after one disappointing season is also a problem.
That's just it. I am not turning on him. I like the guy and want him to stay here but he has flaws. On this board we are not allowed to point out flaws of the coach without being called names or having insults thrown at us. I never rip players like some here do. I have never booed in my lifetime as a fan. Being critical doesn't make me a bad fan. I believe he is a good guy and teaches valuable lessons. I just think he has a lot of flaws as a basketball coach.
After the way this year has gone, especially the way Buzz has used his roster. I have no idea what to expect next year except we all know Derrick Wilson will be the starting PG unless he gets run over by a bus.
That being said, I'm a bit confused by talk that Deonte Burton of all people will transfer. He's the only freshman underclassman seeing consistent minutes.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 22, 2014, 05:01:25 PM
I don't agree with PRN often,
But when I do, it's about this
I second the comments. Just absolutely absurd the way some folks are acting. Morons.
Criticism is fine, but to denigrate players or coaches is disgusting.
Quote from: LittleMurs on February 22, 2014, 05:32:03 PM
Because you're here to stick up for them in MUScoop?
No, I want all the experts, like yourself to explain it to me. The track record of developing high school talent isn't there, IMO.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:33:09 PM
That's just it. I am not turning on him. I like the guy and want him to stay here but he has flaws. On this board we are not allowed to point out flaws of the coach without being called names or having insults thrown at us. I never rip players like some here do. I have never booed in my lifetime as a fan. Being critical doesn't make me a bad fan. I believe he is a good guy and teaches valuable lessons. I just think he has a lot of flaws as a basketball coach.
Fine....what exactly do you think he should do any why?
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:33:09 PM
That's just it. I am not turning on him. I like the guy and want him to stay here but he has flaws. On this board we are not allowed to point out flaws of the coach without being called names or having insults thrown at us. I never rip players like some here do. I have never booed in my lifetime as a fan. Being critical doesn't make me a bad fan. I believe he is a good guy and teaches valuable lessons. I just think he has a lot of flaws as a basketball coach.
In this instance, I wasn't referring to you Ben.
Quote from: Jamil_toMU10 on February 22, 2014, 04:11:44 PM
From my view up close the last few home games, the young guys still look invested and into the game. Despite the limited playing time for JJJ & Dawson, they're still engaged. If one of them decided to transfer already I feel like there would be more signs of apathy. I definitely see Duane sticking around. Steve should be playing a lot next year too.
If Johnson is worried about playing behind Mayo and competing with Ahmed Hill I suppose there's a chance he won't be in an MU uniform next year. If any situation is fishy, it's his. It's too reminiscent of other guys Buzz has sat prior to their departure. But then there is the argument that Buzz always shortens the rotation we progress toward March.
I don't think it's wrong to speculate about transfers. As fans we want to know how the roster shakes up in the future. I expect something to happen, but it's totally up in the air. I'm never worried about Buzz's ability to assemble a competitive, talented and winning roster.
This year that worry would be justified. Not enough in the 2011 and 2012 classes has MU in a down year. This year's freshmen and next year's class should solve the problems. 2015 is already looking promising, as well.
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 22, 2014, 04:15:06 PM
I was editing it... lol... He posted too quick....
But honestly if my kid cant crack a lineup for games at a time.... That Juan Anderson played 20 minutes in and the Hand Eye Coordination of a Snake....
I'd be concerned.... Highly Concerned....
Sheer, unmitigated stupidity.
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 05:36:35 PM
Fine....what exactly do you think he should do any why?
Take out Jake and Derrick more frequently. They need rest throughout the game to keep fresh, so they can play late game defense. Most of the time when Jake or Derrick get burned it is late in games.
Get more consistent rotations and consistent minutes for guys. Build some chemistry on the court. Don't start JJJ for two or three games then bench him for three. Don't give Dawson 10 minutes in one half and then bench him for four games. They develop no flow, no chemistry. Everyone on this team is a "specialist" instead of a complete basketball player. Our two most complete players are Jamil and Todd IMO and they are the two who seem to have the most brain farts. The season is almost over and they still don't seem comfortable playing with each other. That is a problem.
Thank you. Very reasonable response. I think the one thing that you perhaps don't understand (and admittedly neither do I), is how much Buzz communicates with his players about their roles.
However I just think you weaken your argument when you say things like "why would any recruit come here given what has happened this year."
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:07:15 PM
The argument is that I don't agree they aren't ready. But how dare I question Buzz!
You genuinely believe, no bullsh*t, that you're in a position to know more and/or better than the actual head coach. Honest question. Yes or no.
Btw I open this to any and all, not just you in particular. This is the question I'd love to see some answer
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 05:47:25 PM
Thank you. Very reasonable response. I think the one thing that you perhaps don't understand (and admittedly neither do I), is how much Buzz communicates with his players about their roles.
However I just think you weaken your argument when you say things like "why would any recruit come here given what has happened this year."
I have major concerns about Buzz's communication with his players as well. Some of the comments by Todd throughout the last three seasons have caught my attention. I don't have a link at the moment, but I think we've all heard them.
The comment about why would a recruit come here, was a legitimate question. I wasn't just bashing Buzz with it. I was being serious. I wanted to know why a recruit would consider us when he most likely won't see the court on a significant basis until he is a junior. Most highly ranked kids aren't going to have patience for that. Add to that the upperclassman are less physically gifted and still getting 30+minutes a night this season. Seems like a major turn off for a top 100 kid with NBA dreams and a lot of options to play elsewhere. Basically, I hope our future recruiting isn't hurt by this season. The kids we have locked up for the 14 and 15 class are great, but I am concerned going forward with our ability to get top 100 kids.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 04:43:37 PM
Keep talking smart, what is wrong about that?
Gardner more talented than Otule
Dawson more talented than D. Wilson
JJJ and Mayo more talented than Jake
Everyone is more talented than Juan
Just saw this one, had to comment.
Our starting lineup by most time played is D Wilson, Mayo, Thomas, J Wilson, Gardner
So Gardner does play more than Otue
Dawson has more potential but is not better right now
Mayo already starts, JJJ would replace Mayo not Thomas. JJJ is not better than Mayo
Juan is third off the bench.
Quote from: NickelDimer on February 22, 2014, 05:47:58 PM
You genuinely believe, no bullsh*t, that you're in a position to know more and/or better than the actual head coach. Honest question. Yes or no.
Btw I open this to any and all, not just you in particular. This is the question I'd love to see some answer
::)
No, I believe Buzz knows more about basketball than I do. I also believe that he isn't above criticism and that he has made a lot of mistakes that are obvious to most people with some familiarity with basketball. Do you get that or should I draw you a map?
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 05:01:03 PM
Jae Crowder.
I thought it was someone else. Nevermind, I stand corrected
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:56:22 PM
I have major concerns about Buzz's communication with his players as well. Some of the comments by Todd throughout the last three seasons have caught my attention. I don't have a link at the moment, but I think we've all heard them.
I think you need to understand that Todd has been a challenge for Buzz since he has been here. And frankly if it weren't for Buzz, Todd would not be at Marquette.
And the reason that Juan played so much today is because DePaul is a guard oriented team, and Juan is a good, perimeter defender with his length. He's not going to get those minutes with a more interior oriented team.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:13:07 PM
So you come here to defend Buzz's every move without an original thought of your own? Got it.
That is Sultan all day long, with his smug slurping. Wonder how much comment that will foster. They still haven't recovered from woody. Sultan has never seen the forest from the trees. The only thing he abides by is the gospel according to El Buzzo.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 22, 2014, 04:59:30 PM
Sigh....even after a win all of our players are going to transfer.
I posted this in another thread. No one disputed it. If you think it is wrong, I would welcome debate on why it is or isn't true.
Will the freshmen transfer because of playing time?
Let's think about this logically. If you accept the premise that the freshmen want more playing time right now, then why would they transfer? Next season at least one of them will HAVE to start (unless we have a really good freshmen) and if they aren't starting, they will be the first options off the bench. If they transfer, then they will get ZERO playing time next year as they will have to sit out. In two years, they will be the stars of this team as their will be only one Senior ahead of them. Meanwhile, if they transferred, they would be just getting to play now and would probably be getting the same if not less PT that they would have gotten for Marquette. The ONLY time transferring for PT makes sense is if you think that a player younger than you is going to be above you on the depth chart. That's why I hold that Dawson may transfer because Duane is now in a lower class than he is. I hope he doesn't, kid has talent. These players picked Marquette for more reasons than just PT. Trust those other reasons.
Also, these freshmen are in the top 7 in freshmen minutes during the Buzz era. Only Mayo, Vander, Gardner, and Maymon had more. If Buzz is half the man I think he is, I am sure he would have given these frosh heads up about what kind of PT they could expect.
Will frosh playing time this year negatively impact recruiting?
This is an argument I am more willing to accept. However, I think it is flawed. I truly believe that Buzz plays the players who give us the best chance of winning. If we accept this premise, then we must assume that the freshmen would be getting even less playing time at teams that are better than us. Buzz can counter any concerns a recruit has about PT but simply stating that the players who give us the best chance to win will play. Every HS student thinks that they will help a college team win. And if they don't think that they can help us win, then we probably don't want them.
So yes, I think an opposing coach could point to freshmen PT and try to sway recruits away from us. But the only teams that can do that are teams who are worse than us, so we have the upper hand on them in other ways. Our freshmen would not be starting at 95% of the teams that are better than us this year.
Recruits choose schools for more than immediate playing time.
Look, the future is bright. Most fans can't or refuse to see it because they don't like where they are now. But these doom and gloom predictions are baseless. They are just angry fans looking for a way to blow off steam. The freshmen love Marquette, they love Buzz, and they accept the playing time that they are given.
That being said, someone is going to transfer. The more and more I hear about Malek Harris, the more and more it sounds like he is coming to Marquette. That requires at least one player to go. The only three who I believe are threats to transfer are (in descending order of likelihood): John Dawson, Juan Anderson, and Jajuan Johnson. Taylor, Burton, and Duane aren't going anywhere.
Dawson may fear being behind Duane on the depth chart who is now a year younger. If that is the case, Dawson would never start and may be better served to play elsewhere. Anderson is already behind several younger players on the depth chart. Unless he discovers some untapped potential in the offseason, it may be best for him to Lockett-transfer somewhere else where he can be a star. Jajuan Johnson could fear that he will be behind both Mayo and Hill next season. If Hill surplants him, JJJ may end up a bench player for his whole career. If this is the case, he transferring may be the best option.
But, no matter which of the three transfer, they will end up at a lesser program than Marquette. If a player needs to go down a competition level in order to be successful, do we really need them at Marquette? No. In addition, we will replace them with someone even better. This has happened every time someone has left a Buzz Williams team (except maybe in Maymon's case. Who did we replace him with?)
So, yes, a transfer will happen. It will not be because Buzz did not play them enough. It will be because Buzz gave them as much time as they deserved, and they simply weren't good enough to cut it as a Marquette Warrior.
Just throwing this out there again. I made a logical well thought out post about my thoughts about potential transfers. No responses. Just angry bickering back and forth. Anyone got a response?
Quote from: The Sultan of Serenity on February 22, 2014, 05:27:51 PM
I said "give benefit of the doubt to." So when we are winning, I really don't see much need to question what he is doing.
Yessir--never question the front runner--said Bonnie to Clyde.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:58:42 PM
::)
No, I believe Buzz knows more about basketball than I do. I also believe that he isn't above criticism and that he has made a lot of mistakes that are obvious to most people with some familiarity with basketball. Do you get that or should I draw you a map?
Haha, thin skin. Simmer down kitty
Quote from: NickelDimer on February 22, 2014, 06:08:06 PM
Haha, thin skin. Simmer down kitty
Not at all, thought you might need pictures, not sure what your reading level is based on your posts.
Quote from: LittleMurs on February 22, 2014, 05:42:30 PM
Sheer, unmitigated stupidity.
Be careful, apparently Nevada is some kind BFD.
Agree with this poster, that Buzz and his staff seem to have done an awful job coaching this year. Many of the players seem to perform worse than the year before or in high school. MU needs better coaching. Buzz had appeared out of sorts in too many games. Not sure why, but, Buzz has not looked good this year. Maybe he needs better assistants. Wish it weren't so, but, Buzz has not been a dominating coach this year. Our defense stinks.
News flash, the Big East isn't high school, kid!
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on February 22, 2014, 05:17:08 PM
He's saying OJ would pay for Todd to go to school. He would use his own NBA money. You really couldn't understand that?
Nope, I understood that. OJ Mayo is not forking out $30,000 so that Buzz can get an extra scholarship player on his team, one who could potentially compete for minutes with his brother. Doug McDermott is not paying a dime for his schooling. He goes to school for free because his father is an employee of the university. Todd's dad is not his coach, and Todd is not getting free tuition outside of a basketball scholarship.
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on February 22, 2014, 05:25:29 PM
Agreed. But getting yelled at and asked for your D1 coaching credentials because you call out a few foolish coaching decisions is the biggest problem of all.
There is no middle ground on this board.
It is one disappointing season, but it doesn't mean you can't point out flaws in that given season.
If someone came out and said "Buzz flat out sucks at coaching" then we got something to work with.
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on February 22, 2014, 04:32:52 PM
Yeah I think ultimately its Davante. He made the clutch free throws.
Buzz being the fool he is had him on the bench for most of the second half and he never got in rhythm.
You didn't "call out a few foolish coaching decisions." You said, "Buzz being the fool that he is..." You are saying Buzz is a fool. Which is more or less saying, "Buzz flat out sucks at coaching." It's right there for you to see. "Buzz being the fool that he is" is much different than saying, "That was a foolish thing to have Davante on the bench for so long."
Quote from: LittleMurs on February 22, 2014, 05:42:30 PM
Sheer, unmitigated stupidity.
About as useful as anything you've said this year... Clown
It's threads like these that you might as well shut down this site.
Scoop is officially a cesspool, sorry moderators, but it's enough.
Quote from: The Sultan of Silly on February 22, 2014, 03:43:52 PM
We'll lose 2 of Duane Wilson, Jajuan Johnson, Deonte Burton and Steve Taylor.
+1000
JJJ is a lock to leave. Wouldnt be suprised if Burton left either
Quote from: Dreadman24 on February 22, 2014, 07:29:18 PM
+1000
JJJ is a lock to leave. Wouldnt be suprised if Burton left either
A lock... How so If he's already, catching splinters in his A$$ on the bench here why would he go sit out a year to maybe get playing time some where else in 2016....
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 22, 2014, 06:04:33 PM
Just throwing this out there again. I made a logical well thought out post about my thoughts about potential transfers. No responses. Just angry bickering back and forth. Anyone got a response?
I think this was well written.
I can give you my own perspective having a couple D 1 kids. I think the mistake Buzz is making is that there are plenty of opportunities , within his own historical coaching style, to keep everyone relatively happy and build team chemistry. Kids who come to a program like ours are all stars from wherever they came from and not used to being benched. The people around them tend to have unrealistic expectations. So when you sit these kids for games on end and the players they are sitting behind bad will is created and it is fed by family friends etc who don't have the full picture. I can tell you from experience I have heard many parents who have a radically different view of their kids talent than what reality was and abett their kids in bad transfer decisions. Logic would say that all the freshman have bright futures starting next year, but my experience says there are many illogical voices they listen to.
Quote from: PTM on February 22, 2014, 07:26:19 PM
It's threads like these that you might as well shut down this site.
Scoop is officially a cesspool, sorry moderators, but it's enough.
+1. Jumping the shark. Has to be said. Looking for value in these threads but really have to skip over a lot to find anything informative.
Quote from: PTM on February 22, 2014, 07:26:19 PM
It's threads like these that you might as well shut down this site.
Scoop is officially a cesspool, sorry moderators, but it's enough.
(http://www.phlashers.com/images/aWinner.gif)
Quote from: Chris Columbo on February 22, 2014, 07:36:32 PM
I think this was well written.
I can give you my own perspective having a couple D 1 kids. I think the mistake Buzz is making is that there are plenty of opportunities , within his own historical coaching style, to keep everyone relatively happy and build team chemistry. Kids who come to a program like ours are all stars from wherever they came from and not used to being benched. The people around them tend to have unrealistic expectations. So when you sit these kids for games on end and the players they are sitting behind bad will is created and it is fed by family friends etc who don't have the full picture. I can tell you from experience I have heard many parents who have a radically different view of their kids talent than what reality was and abett their kids in bad transfer decisions. Logic would say that all the freshman have bright futures starting next year, but my experience says there are many illogical voices they listen to.
Your right... I have D1 Family too and I know first hand the conversations that go on and people expecting to see you play. Family and Friends traveling to games taking off work and you don't play makes them angry and they put those voices in your head that often make them transfer. I'd tell all the Freshmen to stay at Marquette its better than leaving and sitting for a year somewhere else the guys playing 30+ Min a game had to start somewhere, their day is coming. Stay patient
I haven't read pages 2-6 of this but I have watched every MU game this year. I'm glad the freshman aren't playing. I have not seen anything out of JJJ that makes me all warm and fuzzy.
Of course I mostly watch the defensive end of the court.
This is the worst thread in the history of scoop. Simply appalling.
Quote from: Chris Columbo on February 22, 2014, 07:36:32 PM
I think this was well written.
I can give you my own perspective having a couple D 1 kids. I think the mistake Buzz is making is that there are plenty of opportunities , within his own historical coaching style, to keep everyone relatively happy and build team chemistry. Kids who come to a program like ours are all stars from wherever they came from and not used to being benched. The people around them tend to have unrealistic expectations. So when you sit these kids for games on end and the players they are sitting behind bad will is created and it is fed by family friends etc who don't have the full picture. I can tell you from experience I have heard many parents who have a radically different view of their kids talent than what reality was and abett their kids in bad transfer decisions. Logic would say that all the freshman have bright futures starting next year, but my experience says there are many illogical voices they listen to.
So Buzz should bow into the illogical voices and play their kids more???
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on February 22, 2014, 06:00:18 PM
I think you need to understand that Todd has been a challenge for Buzz since he has been here. And frankly if it weren't for Buzz, Todd would not be at Marquette.
I understand Todd has been a challenge, but from all things I've read and heard they had no relationship through Todd's sophomore season. It isn't just Todd either, a lot of guys on the team seem to have no idea what their role is....STjr and Juan come to mind. It seems like there are games where some of these guys have no idea what their role will be. One thing I do know from playing and coaching experience is players appreciate knowing their roles and what is expected from them on a daily basis. It seems to me this has been an issue this year due to inconsistencies from players and coaches.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 08:04:24 PM
I understand Todd has been a challenge, but from all things I've read and heard they had no relationship through Todd's sophomore season. It isn't just Todd either, a lot of guys on the team seem to have no idea what their role is....STjr and Juan come to mind. It seems like there are games where some of these guys have no idea what their role will be. One thing I do know from playing and coaching experience is players appreciate knowing their roles and what is expected from them on a daily basis. It seems to me this has been an issue this year due to inconsistencies from players and coaches.
What makes you believe that Juan and STJr don't know their roles?
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on February 22, 2014, 08:01:53 PM
So Buzz should bow into the illogical voices and play their kids more???
I am saying that there is room to be more economical in minutes distribution to achieve both short and long term objectives. It is simply not worth losing your future to accommodate a mediocre present. Buzz is a street smart guy and understands these issues , I am just very surprised at how he has handled this.
i think "horrendous" is a pretty harsh word to describe anything this team has done this year. some weaknesses, yes, but, come on man!! horrendous would be like a surgeon removing the wrong-fill-in-the-blank body part or something
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on February 22, 2014, 08:07:55 PM
What makes you believe that Juan and STJr don't know their roles?
Their body language on the court and their playing time. They often look extremely confused, STjr on defense and Juan on offense. One game STjr is the hero (Georgetown) than he doesn't get on the court for a week. Juan starts and plays 3 minutes one game and 22 the next. I don't fault them, it is extremely difficult to come in and be effective when you've sat for a week. I know a guy who played professionally for a couple of years in the NBA and overseas. He always said the hardest thing was going from being a college star to being a bench guy in the pros. He said the NBA was especially difficult because he would go a week at a time with DNP's. Point is even if Buzz is communicating with them, it is difficult to not have a routine or consistency with your playing time.
Quote from: rocket surgeon on February 22, 2014, 08:13:34 PM
i think "horrendous" is a pretty harsh word to describe anything this team has done this year. some weaknesses, yes, but, come on man!! horrendous would be like a surgeon removing the wrong-fill-in-the-blank body part or something
Penis
Quote from: The Sultan of Silly on February 22, 2014, 03:43:52 PM
We'll lose 2 of Duane Wilson, Jajuan Johnson, Deonte Burton and Steve Taylor.
I forget ... is that more or fewer players than you had getting kicked out over academics a couple years back?
Bunch o' drama queens around here today.
And I say that as someone thoroughly disappointed by today's effort, and the season overall.
I wonder how much playing time the freshmen really tought they were going to get when they signed. I do not think Dawson expected to play ahead of either Wilson, so overall I have to believe he has played more than he expected when he signed. JJJ when he signed was behind Blue and Mayo, so he should of not expected much playing time. It is hard to say what Burton was expecting, but with the senior front court he should not have expected as much time as he is getting. He also would have had to fight Mckay for playing time, if McKay had not transferred. The only reason I think anyone is transferring is because Buzz continues to recruit for 2014.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 06:11:02 PM
Not at all, thought you might need pictures, not sure what your reading level is based on your posts.
Buuuuurn!!
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 05:17:31 PM
I could care less if you respect my basketball knowledge. But your blind loyalty to a guy who has a had a terrible season is pathetic.
I really ought to put you on ignore, but your statements are dumber than Willie, so I want to see if you get even more ridiculous.
An 8 page thread responding to a troll. Anyone care to post a summary.
Quote from: mu-rara on February 22, 2014, 09:15:38 PM
I really ought to put you on ignore, but your statements are dumber than Willie, so I want to see if you get even more ridiculous.
Oh please don't put me on ignore.....I will be heart broken.
Nice factual rebuttal to my posts that you disagree with though, thanks for setting me straight and letting me know where I was wrong.
BTW, for those that didn't get the "All American" remark check the status of this guy and the amount of posts.
He's an "expert," just ask him.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 08:13:47 PM
One game STjr is the hero (Georgetown) than he doesn't get on the court for a week. Juan starts and plays 3 minutes one game and 22 the next.
Noticed many of these inconsistencies. Seems Buzz just doesn't have many answers this year, and the erratically inconsistent assignment of roles and minutes is a sign of his desperation. JJJ and Burton starting for a few games, then JJJ getting DNPs and Burton as little as three minutes. Jake being the last guy off the bench in a couple of those games then never leaving the court shortly after. Dawson gradually getting increased minutes, then after one lackluster performance resetting back to DNPs. Juan buried at the end of the bench, then back to starting. Gardner going through a six game stretch where he didn't play less than 34 minutes, then a seven game stretch averaging 23. The Jamil point guard experiment.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 22, 2014, 06:57:25 PM
Nope, I understood that. OJ Mayo is not forking out $30,000 so that Buzz can get an extra scholarship player on his team, one who could potentially compete for minutes with his brother. Doug McDermott is not paying a dime for his schooling. He goes to school for free because his father is an employee of the university. Todd's dad is not his coach, and Todd is not getting free tuition outside of a basketball scholarship.
So it went like this 4 years ago?
Creighton AD: Congratulations Coach McDermott! Welcome to the staff. As an employee all your kids can get their education here for free as one of your perks.
Coach McDermott: That's great! But my son Doug will be designated a scholarship player here if you want him on the basketball team. We McDermott's are a proud people and come from a long lineage of scholarship atheletes.
Creighton AD But Coach. He can still be on the team as a walk on. And since you're the head coach now you can play him as much or as little as you want. Plus why not give another kid a free education by not giving Doug the scholarship. You'll have an extra player on the team due to Doug's walk-on status. Did I mention that Doug can attend school here for free without you using up a scholarship for the basketball team?
Coach McDermott Doug gets a scholarship to Creighton or I walk and take my son with me.
I won't put anything past anyone living in the state of NE, but something doesn't seem right about what you're suggesting. Everything going into this year was how Doug gave up his scholarship to come back and what a hero he is for doing that. But he never needed the scholarship anyway since his dad was an employee of the university?
$30,000 seems like strip club make it rain money for an NBA player. And we've seen how loyal Buzz is to seniors. Todd wouldn't be fighting anyone for minutes. Plus him and Burton are the only 2 players on the team who have heart and that look in their eyes like they want to win. Everyone else lacks this.
Quote from: jimmybutlerfanatic on February 22, 2014, 10:37:00 PM
I won't put anything past anyone living in the state of NE, but something doesn't seem right about what you're suggesting. Everything going into this year was how Doug gave up his scholarship to come back and what a hero he is for doing that. But he never needed the scholarship anyway since his dad was an employee of the university?
Doug McDermott is paying full tuition. The NCAA requires a coach be at a school for 5 years in order for his son to qualify for free tuition. Greg McDermott has been at Creighton since 2010. That said, Greg is getting paid over $1M so the $30K in tuition isn't going to break him.
After reading through some of the angry posts on this thread, I'm really starting to doubt the notion that ignorance is bliss.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on February 22, 2014, 10:49:50 PM
Doug McDermott is paying full tuition. The NCAA requires a coach be at a school for 5 years in order for his son to qualify for free tuition. Greg McDermott has been at Creighton since 2010. That said, Greg is getting paid over $1M so the $30K in tuition isn't going to break him.
Yahoo! says: OJ Mayo getting paid $8 million this year.
Wikipedia says: On April 25, 2013, McDermott announced he would be returning to Creighton for his senior season and would not be entering the 2013 NBA Draft.[6] That July, he relinquished his scholarship and became a walk-on for his final season at Creighton. This came about after the NCAA had granted senior guard Grant Gibbs, who had missed full seasons at both Gonzaga and Creighton with injuries, a rare sixth year of eligibility, putting Creighton over the NCAA's limit of 13 scholarships in the 2013–14 season.[7]
Can't I be in my happy place and think that since MU is over on scholarships that no one will transfer and OJ will pay for Todd's schooling for 1 year?!
Given the astounding amount of criticism leveled at just about every player on the team not named "Flood" I am astounded that we have now begun to simultaneously criticize the coaching of a team that is currently in THIRD FREAKING PLACE in the conference. Which is it, the players that can't play or the coach that can't coach? Make up your minds because your little pity party is getting old.
What a bunch of spoiled f%#$. One disappointing year out of six and you turn into a pack of whiny little bitc@#$.
Quote from: connie on February 22, 2014, 11:02:45 PM
Given the astounding amount of criticism leveled at just about every player on the team not named "Flood" I am astounded that we have now begun to simultaneously criticize the coaching of a team that is currently in THIRD FREAKING PLACE in the conference. Which is it, the players that can't play or the coach that can't coach? Make up your minds because your little pity party is getting old.
What a bunch of spoiled f%#$. One disappointing year out of six and you turn into a pack of whiny little bitc@#$.
+1
Quote from: connie on February 22, 2014, 11:02:45 PM
Given the astounding amount of criticism leveled at just about every player on the team not named "Flood" I am astounded that we have now begun to simultaneously criticize the coaching of a team that is currently in THIRD FREAKING PLACE in the conference. Which is it, the players that can't play or the coach that can't coach? Make up your minds because your little pity party is getting old.
What a bunch of spoiled f%#$. One disappointing year out of six and you turn into a pack of whiny little bitc@#$.
On the money. The whiney bitch brigade has been out of control. Just a sad and pathetic lot.
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 22, 2014, 07:16:02 PM
About as useful as anything you've said this year... Clown
I love a guy wearing a foam rubber nose calling people "clowns."
"You don't know who I am."
I do. You're a total Bozo. A laughable boob.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 08:13:47 PM
Their body language on the court and their playing time. They often look extremely confused, STjr on defense and Juan on offense.
The body language I saw today was Juan laughing and hugging buzz - during the game.
I'd always thought Marquette had a very good and very intelligent fan base. Buzz has taken criticism every year (and much of it deserved or at least thoughtful criticism). This year, while yes, the team maybe hasn't met expectations (that probably weren't tempered enough after the loss of Blue and even DuWil's injury), our fan base has been, well, horrendous. It's embarrassing.
Clearly Buzz has been a successful coach. Why some people think he is above criticism however is baffling. Every coach makes mistakes that they wish they could change. This year has been a roller coaster of up and down playing time for multiple players and is confusing. Posters give their view...good grief it's a fricken fan message board! Why do some posters get so bent out of shape when others offer their insight? Because you don't share the same opinion? Get over it!
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 22, 2014, 11:10:38 PM
On the money. The whiney bitch brigade has been out of control. Just a sad and pathetic lot.
+1,000,000
We need a set of acronyms to be used here to just save us all from the constant BS rants on DW, Buzz, etc. it's so tiring. The same arguments and comments and opinions spoken by the same core guys in a trillion different ways.
BCC - Buzz can't coach
DWSRRRB - Derrick Wilson sucks really really really bad
WWJJJP - why won't JJJ play!?
WWDP - why won't Dawson play!?
WDDWP - why does DW play!?
Etc...
Quote from: jimmybutlerfanatic on February 22, 2014, 11:02:18 PM
Yahoo! says: OJ Mayo getting paid $8 million this year.
Wikipedia says: On April 25, 2013, McDermott announced he would be returning to Creighton for his senior season and would not be entering the 2013 NBA Draft.[6] That July, he relinquished his scholarship and became a walk-on for his final season at Creighton. This came about after the NCAA had granted senior guard Grant Gibbs, who had missed full seasons at both Gonzaga and Creighton with injuries, a rare sixth year of eligibility, putting Creighton over the NCAA's limit of 13 scholarships in the 2013–14 season.[7]
Can't I be in my happy place and think that since MU is over on scholarships that no one will transfer and OJ will pay for Todd's schooling for 1 year?!
OJ is not gonna pay for Todd to go to Marquette ha ha No way...
McDermott and Creighton recruited and offered that same scholarship that Grant Gibbs is on to this kid from New Mexico who turned it down and wound up going to a school in Milwaukee oh his name is John Dawson. . . .
http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/player/_/id/162866/john-dawson
You all sound drunk right now.
Quote from: Chris Columbo on February 22, 2014, 07:36:32 PM
I think this was well written.
I can give you my own perspective having a couple D 1 kids. I think the mistake Buzz is making is that there are plenty of opportunities , within his own historical coaching style, to keep everyone relatively happy and build team chemistry. Kids who come to a program like ours are all stars from wherever they came from and not used to being benched. The people around them tend to have unrealistic expectations. So when you sit these kids for games on end and the players they are sitting behind bad will is created and it is fed by family friends etc who don't have the full picture. I can tell you from experience I have heard many parents who have a radically different view of their kids talent than what reality was and abett their kids in bad transfer decisions. Logic would say that all the freshman have bright futures starting next year, but my experience says there are many illogical voices they listen to.
Thank you for your response. I agree that students and the people around them don't necessarily see the same things as logical that I do. I guess that is my fatal flaw in this arguement. Tim Maymon certainly didn't see things my way. But I guess I would agree with some others and say that this is no reason for Buzz to change course from his game plan. I want him to win now, not appease players who may or may not make us better in the future.
However, I will agree that if I were Buzz, I would have found a little more time in garbage minutes earlier in the season to get some guy some more reps. I also agree that Derrick gets gassed when he plays 40 minutes and any negative Dawson brings is far outweighed by the positive of simply giving Derrick a short breather.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 22, 2014, 03:58:43 PM
Just out of curiosity, why would any high ranked HIGH SCHOOL player want to come here, based on what has happened this year?
The same reason that a team like Villanova can end up as a top 10 team and still get recruits after some down years. The ability/personality of the coach and the culture of the program.
Our one down season in several years still puts us in the top half of a good conference and just on the edge of the tourney bubble. Relax.
Quote from: Ners on February 22, 2014, 04:02:18 PM
I absolutely concede Burton and Dawson aren't near the defenders of Juan and Derrick...but...we've tried the other way for 27 games now...and we almost lost what should have been as close to a lock of a game as possible today. Team isn't going ANYWHERE with this backcourt..
This team might not be going ANYWHERE this season, but Buzz isn't just the coach of one single MU team. He is the head of a program. Isn't it possible that many of Buzz's coaching decisions this year are significantly influenced by where he wants the program and young players to be in two to three years?
Quote from: mu-rara on February 22, 2014, 09:15:38 PM
I really ought to put you on ignore, but your statements are dumber than Willie, so I want to see if you get even more ridiculous.
yup--MU wawa, one of the typical who if he disagrees starts the name calling. So predictable. Hide behind your post name and call names at somebody you disagree with. Because his is the only opinion that matters in his mind. Another dumb statement from Willie, right, wawa?
Quote from: mubuzz on February 22, 2014, 11:25:50 PM
Why some people think he is above criticism however is baffling.
Do you know what a straw man argument is? Where has anyone said Buzz is above criticism? What most of casual posters are tired of is the same post, day after day, ruining every thread, no matter how if topic. We get it and in many cases we even agree. Buzz's patterns this year have been confusing. But you simply can't substitute your opinion based on game watching for Buzz's opinion based on practices, games, and what he's specifically looking for from a player. You just don't have that information.
On the radio show last week, Juan said that the substitution pattern can be confusing, but Buzz is upfront about what he's trying to do, whether that's offense/defense or targeting a match up.
He can do doing a horrible job at it this year (I think we can agree he's missing something). That's up for friendly debate. Your opinion of what being fact, however, is not.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 23, 2014, 07:33:30 AM
yup--MU wawa, one of the typical who if he disagrees starts the name calling...Another dumb statement from Willie, right, wawa?
Seriously? Did you just make fun of this poster's name in the same breath you say that other people are name calling?
Quote from: willie warrior on February 23, 2014, 07:33:30 AM
yup--MU wawa, one of the typical who if he disagrees starts the name calling. So predictable. Hide behind your post name and call names at somebody you disagree with. Because his is the only opinion that matters in his mind. Another dumb statement from Willie, right, wawa?
The next intelligent statement you post on here will be the first, so...yeah.
Quote from: Utile et Dulce on February 23, 2014, 07:56:54 AM
Do you know what a straw man argument is? Where has anyone said Buzz is above criticism? What most of casual posters are tired of is the same post, day after day, ruining every thread, no matter how if topic. We get it and in many cases we even agree. Buzz's patterns this year have been confusing. But you simply can't substitute your opinion based on game watching for Buzz's opinion based on practices, games, and what he's specifically looking for from a player. You just don't have that information.
On the radio show last week, Juan said that the substitution pattern can be confusing, but Buzz is upfront about what he's trying to do, whether that's offense/defense or targeting a match up.
To be fair, Juan said that the substitutions patterns can take awhile for the freshmen to get used to.
And I thought that Juan had great demeanor yesterday. Someone mentioned that he was laughing and had his arm around Buzz after a timeout. Juan has a limited role. He knows it. But he performs to it.
Quote from: ATL MU Warrior on February 23, 2014, 08:32:12 AM
The next intelligent statement you post on here will be the first, so...yeah.
Ah yes, the old I am more intelligent than you argument. That always is a winner everywhere. "So...yeah" just drips with intellect.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 23, 2014, 07:33:30 AM
yup--MU wawa, one of the typical who if he disagrees starts the name calling. So predictable. Hide behind your post name and call names at somebody you disagree with. Because his is the only opinion that matters in his mind. Another dumb statement from Willie, right, wawa?
Wawa? I'm embarrassed for you.
I saw this thread and thought, "Don't do it. Don't read it. Just gonnabe the same old BS." However, while watching TV this morning - and like a moth to a light - I foolishly clicked on page 1. 25 minutes later, I feel dumber. I sooooo regret that decision. I think I'll go kick the dog.
This thread is the best. Missing some of posts as like a quarter of the posters in it are already ignored by myself. But for the one's I can see it is classic.
Instead of titled "Horrendously coached year" I think a better title would be Negativos Unite!!!
I've only read the title of this thread......
In before the lock.
Quote from: MUSF on February 23, 2014, 01:14:38 AM
This team might not be going ANYWHERE this season, but Buzz isn't just the coach of one single MU team. He is the head of a program. Isn't it possible that many of Buzz's coaching decisions this year are significantly influenced by where he wants the program and young players to be in two to three years?
As those in the "Derrick gives us our best chance to win" camp would argue - Buzz is playing for wins right now, and playing the guys he feels gives us the best chance to win right now. I'd agree that every coach plays to win right now, for this yea,r as priority Number 1. Priority 2 for a coach would be to develop the talent in the program and groom for future years.
Where the disconnect for some of us exists, is that when the lineup that Buzz apparently feels gives us the best chance to win - loses against virtually all decent teams - there likely would be little fall off in the way of wins/losses if the young guys got more minutes. We probably still wouldn't beat the elite teams, yet probably still wouldn't lose to the mediocre/bad teams...and in the process the freshman would have gotten valuable experience for them and Buzz to build on heading into next year.
The big area of frustration of course for me is at PG. The PG is the quarterback of your team...and virtually equally important to a basketball team as a QB is to a football team. Have a really good PG/QB, you almost always have a chance to win. Have a really poor QB/PG....really hard to win. Most all here agree that Dawson has a higher ceiling than Derrick...some of us just wanted to see what would happen if we made the switch at the most important position on the floor to see if it could have jump started this season, while also building Dawson's game for next season...and knowing if he is a viable option at PG (which I personally believe he is.)
Quote from: Ners on February 23, 2014, 10:51:39 AM
As those in the "Derrick gives us our best chance to win" camp would argue - Buzz is playing for wins right now, and playing the guys he feels gives us the best chance to win right now. I'd agree that every coach plays to win right now, for this yea,r as priority Number 1. Priority 2 for a coach would be to develop the talent in the program and groom for future years.
Where the disconnect for some of us exists, is that when the lineup that Buzz apparently feels gives us the best chance to win - loses against virtually all decent teams - there likely would be little fall off in the way of wins/losses if the young guys got more minutes. We probably still wouldn't beat the elite teams, yet probably still wouldn't lose to the mediocre/bad teams...and in the process the freshman would have gotten valuable experience for them and Buzz to build on heading into next year.
The big area of frustration of course for me is at PG. The PG is the quarterback of your team...and virtually equally important to a basketball team as a QB is to a football team. Have a really good PG/QB, you almost always have a chance to win. Have a really poor QB/PG....really hard to win. Most all here agree that Dawson has a higher ceiling than Derrick...some of us just wanted to see what would happen if we made the switch at the most important position on the floor to see if it could have jump started this season, while also building Dawson's game for next season...and knowing if he is a viable option at PG (which I personally believe he is.)
Perhaps Buzz believes he's helping to build the future and this year by playing Derrick so many minutes because Derrick will be the main PG next season as well.
College basketball coaches aren't concerned with "getting the team ready for next year." They're concerned with winning. They're going to play the guys who they think give the team the best chance to win the game that they're currently playing. At no point during or going into a key game has Buzz EVER thought, "I need to get Freshman A some minutes so that he gains experience for next season." That's just not how coaches' minds work. Fans worry about the future and act like game experience will automatically make a player better the following season. Coaches look to win. That's it. Playing freshmen primarily to "get them experience for next year" can cost a teams wins which can cost a coach his job.
I'll say it again - Coaches coach to win the game that they're playing. It's that simple.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on February 23, 2014, 01:55:52 PM
College basketball coaches aren't concerned with "getting the team ready for next year." They're concerned with winning. They're going to play the guys who they think give the team the best chance to win the game that they're currently playing. At no point during or going into a key game has Buzz EVER thought, "I need to get Freshman A some minutes so that he gains experience for next season." That's just not how coaches' minds work. Fans worry about the future and act like game experience will automatically make a player better the following season. Coaches look to win. That's it. Playing freshmen primarily to "get them experience for next year" can cost a teams wins which can cost a coach his job.
I'll say it again - Coaches coach to win the game that they're playing. It's that simple.
Yeah but people sit up there and act like the BackCourt we start is good and they wouldn't start or be the first man off the bench for at least 8 of the 10 Big East Teams..... There are D-2 Schools they wouldn't start for.... Until they graduate or are sat down.. This team will remain a little above .500 theres no way we should have 11 losses and will lose another game or 2 before the season is over... crazy
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 23, 2014, 02:02:54 PM
Yeah but people sit up there and act like the BackCourt we start is good and they wouldn't start or be the first man off the bench for at least 8 of the 10 Big East Teams..... There are D-2 Schools they wouldn't start for.... Until they graduate or are sat down.. This team will remain a little above .500 theres no way we should have 11 losses and will lose another game or 2 before the season is over... crazy
Other than maybe Butler, with the roster we have, who should we have beaten that we didn't?
Quote from: wadesworld on February 23, 2014, 02:08:27 PM
Other than maybe Butler, with the roster we have, who should we have beaten that we didn't?
Losses to New Mexico we allowed 40 back court points (Cullen Neal went off), Xavier we allowed 42 back court points (Christion went off had 28), Arizona State we allowed 44 Points back court points (Thames went off) and St Johns 31 back court points. (Harrison had 27)... All Games where a guards went off on our outstanding defenders....
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 23, 2014, 02:19:11 PM
Losses to New Mexico we allowed 40 back court points (Cullen Neal went off), Xavier we allowed 42 back court points (Christion went off had 28), Arizona State we allowed 44 Points back court points (Thames went off) and St Johns 31 back court points. (Harrison had 27)... All Games where a guards went off on our outstanding defenders....
And playing weaker defenders would have prevented that?
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 23, 2014, 02:02:54 PM
Yeah but people sit up there and act like the BackCourt we start is good and they wouldn't start or be the first man off the bench for at least 8 of the 10 Big East Teams..... There are D-2 Schools they wouldn't start for.... Until they graduate or are sat down.. This team will remain a little above .500 theres no way we should have 11 losses and will lose another game or 2 before the season is over... crazy
The fact that you actually believe the bolded to be true shows your ignorance. Jake, in fact, started 51 games for a D1 school as a freshman and soph. Has playing better competition in a high-major program somehow made him a significantly worse player?
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on February 23, 2014, 02:21:38 PM
And playing weaker defenders would have prevented that?
we'll never know..
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on February 23, 2014, 02:26:40 PM
The fact that you actually believe the bolded to be true shows your ignorance. Jake, in fact, started 51 games for a D1 school as a freshman and soph. Has playing better competition in a high-major program somehow made him a significantly worse player?
Oh please Started 51 games at South Dakota in the Great West Conference "Wow"...
Brandon Jefferson of (23-1) Division 2 Metro State averages 21 points a game shoots 92 percent from the free throw line and would compete with both of them for their starting job.
One can't starter cant create his own Shot and the other cant shoot period. It is what it is...
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 23, 2014, 02:46:28 PM
Oh please Started 51 games at South Dakota in the Great West Conference "Wow"...
Brandon Jefferson of (23-1) Division 2 Metro State averages 21 points a game shoots 92 percent from the free throw line and would compete with both of them for their starting job.
Love this logic. Nevada finds one team where Jake or Derrick *might* not start, and he thinks he's made a point.
Just another one of these guys that bitches and moans...and this time after a win.
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on February 23, 2014, 02:51:01 PM
Love this logic. Nevada finds one team where Jake or Derrick *might* not start, and he thinks he's made a point.
Just another one of these guys that bitches and moans...and this time after a win.
no not might *WONT*
and Whatever your starters suck live with it Slupery.... you bitch too.. stop it..
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 23, 2014, 01:17:25 PM
Perhaps Buzz believes he's helping to build the future and this year by playing Derrick so many minutes because Derrick will be the main PG next season as well.
Completely agree.
I also wonder about the posters who claim Buzz doesn't want to develop any of the freshman for the future. Did they really think this through? Buzz doesn't want to develop guys who will be the future of the program? He is developing them everyday in practice.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 23, 2014, 01:17:25 PM
Perhaps Buzz believes he's helping to build the future and this year by playing Derrick so many minutes because Derrick will be the main PG next season as well.
And that sir, is the rub!
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on February 23, 2014, 02:51:01 PM
Love this logic. Nevada finds one team where Jake or Derrick *might* not start, and he thinks he's made a point.
Just another one of these guys that bitches and moans...and this time after a win.
Did not notice your new name until earlier, Sultan. I see you picked up what I tabbed for you. Things are looking brighter, you are starting to slurp toward my side. Congratulations! Let me know when you start believing that Al was MU's greatest coach.
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 23, 2014, 02:54:18 PM
no not might *WONT*
and Whatever your starters suck live with it Slupery.... you bitch too.. stop it..
"your"?? are you even a Marquette fan?
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 23, 2014, 02:54:18 PM
no not might *WONT*
Really? Are you the coach of Metro State?
Quote from: willie warrior on February 23, 2014, 03:17:50 PM
Did not notice your new name until earlier, Sultan. I see you picked up what I tabbed for you. Things are looking brighter, you are starting to slurp toward my side. Congratulations! Let me know when you start believing that Al was MU's greatest coach.
So for the record, you "tabbing" Sultan a slurper isn't the same as the people you get angry at for calling you names? Just making sure I have the double standards down properly.
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 23, 2014, 02:46:28 PM
Oh please Started 51 games at South Dakota in the Great West Conference "Wow"...
Brandon Jefferson of (23-1) Division 2 Metro State averages 21 points a game shoots 92 percent from the free throw line and would compete with both of them for their starting job.
One can't starter cant create his own Shot and the other cant shoot period. It is what it is...
Brandon Jefferson is listed at 5'9", meaning he is likely 5'7". Against D1 competition he shot 33% from 3 and 40% from 2 with a whopping 1.2 A/TO ratio. That is against the likes of power houses canisius, Elon, Fair Dickinson and Rhode island. The last was the only team they played that even qualifies for mid major status and they are dreadful.
Agains RI, he was 4-14 (29%) from the field and 2-8 (25%) from 3.
Dylan Flood would see the game for us before Jefferson got off the Bench. Try again.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 23, 2014, 01:17:25 PM
Perhaps Buzz believes he's helping to build the future and this year by playing Derrick so many minutes because Derrick will be the main PG next season as well.
Geez we have had so much success with him this year...hopefully next year he can play even more minutes!!!
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on February 23, 2014, 02:21:38 PM
And playing weaker defenders would have prevented that?
No...playing weaker defenders wouldn't have prevented Thames, Carson, Garrett, Harrison, Christon, et al from going off....but you know what...we also likely wouldn't be outscored in the backcourt 40-10 in those games either....and I can live with Jake getting minutes....but when we are constantly outscored at the PG position by 10 points per game...and when the opposition totally disrespects our PG and sags off 8' allowing a help defender into the paint and to shut off our interior game, as well as make slashing from the wing from Mayo more difficult....yeah...I'd sure as hell be happy to run the risk of Dawson and Mayo playing 32 minutes per game as opposed to the Derrick and Jake show we've gotten all year long...and just seeing if by chance we could have beat a few of the decent opponents on our schedule...but possibly run the risk of giving up a few more points in the process.
Ners - you must be proud today as Dawson had a good run yesterday with Wilson in foul trouble. Had a good game I thought.
Quote from: mattyv1908 on February 23, 2014, 05:47:54 PM
Ners - you must be proud today as Dawson had a good run yesterday with Wilson in foul trouble. Had a good game I thought.
Dawson showed his potential again yesterday, and pros/cons of him playing - he's without question an upgrade offensively over Derrick, and the team is much better at the offensive end with him in the game. Dawson did struggle defensively yesterday, more so than what I felt I've seen from him in other games. That said, Derrick struggled defensively with Garrett as well...not sure our defensive gameplan was sound yesterday, with a lot of the switching taking place - and how we played pick/roll action wasn't very good either.
I genuinely believe it is hard to replicate game speed/intensity in practice, and this is how it would benefit our young guys to get more game action...they need to figure it out a little better on defensive end...
Quote from: mubuzz on February 23, 2014, 04:55:52 PM
Geez we have had so much success with him this year...hopefully next year he can play even more minutes!!!
Did you even read the post I responded to? Because that's not at all the conclusion to be taken from my post. The original was a comment on how we should be trying to win now and builidng for the future - indicating we should play Dawson to get him ready for the furture. However, if Buzz feels Derrick is the future, next year, then Buzz would be trying to win now, by playing Derrick more now, and trying to build for the future, by playing Derrick more now and building him for next year. I don't know if that's Buzz's plan, but it's certainly logical if he views Derrick as better this year and Derrick as the starter next year.
Instead of jumping to conclusions about my posts, please ask for clarification if you aren't sure what I mean.
Quote from: Ners on February 23, 2014, 05:44:17 PM
No...playing weaker defenders wouldn't have prevented Thames, Carson, Garrett, Harrison, Christon, et al from going off....but you know what...we also likely wouldn't be outscored in the backcourt 40-10 in those games either....and I can live with Jake getting minutes....but when we are constantly outscored at the PG position by 10 points per game...and when the opposition totally disrespects our PG and sags off 8' allowing a help defender into the paint and to shut off our interior game, as well as make slashing from the wing from Mayo more difficult....yeah...I'd sure as hell be happy to run the risk of Dawson and Mayo playing 32 minutes per game as opposed to the Derrick and Jake show we've gotten all year long...and just seeing if by chance we could have beat a few of the decent opponents on our schedule...but possibly run the risk of giving up a few more points in the process.
While I agree the bolded portion is frustrating, doesn't it all even out if our C outscores their C by 10 points per game? You attempt to score based on match-ups and advantages. Other teams have the advantage at PG; typically we have it in the frontcourt. As long as we win, does it matter where the points come from?
Quote from: Ners on February 23, 2014, 06:12:07 PM
Dawson showed his potential again yesterday, and pros/cons of him playing - he's without question an upgrade offensively over Derrick, and the team is much better at the offensive end with him in the game. Dawson did struggle defensively yesterday, more so than what I felt I've seen from him in other games. That said, Derrick struggled defensively with Garrett as well...not sure our defensive gameplan was sound yesterday, with a lot of the switching taking place - and how we played pick/roll action wasn't very good either.
I genuinely believe it is hard to replicate game speed/intensity in practice, and this is how it would benefit our young guys to get more game action...they need to figure it out a little better on defensive end...
+1,000,000
Quote from: g0lden3agle on February 23, 2014, 04:06:18 PM
So for the record, you "tabbing" Sultan a slurper isn't the same as the people you get angry at for calling you names? Just making sure I have the double standards down properly.
never get angry--as you likely do. No double standard, as slurping is a good thing and not considered as idiot, jerk, etc. But think what you want, Golden one.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 23, 2014, 06:20:46 PM
Did you even read the post I responded to? Because that's not at all the conclusion to be taken from my post. The original was a comment on how we should be trying to win now and builidng for the future - indicating we should play Dawson to get him ready for the furture. However, if Buzz feels Derrick is the future, next year, then Buzz would be trying to win now, by playing Derrick more now, and trying to build for the future, by playing Derrick more now and building him for next year. I don't know if that's Buzz's plan, but it's certainly logical if he views Derrick as better this year and Derrick as the starter next year.
Instead of jumping to conclusions about my posts, please ask for clarification if you aren't sure what I mean.
My bad jesmu...I feel like this site has turned into a battlefield lately and it's easy to jump to conclusions.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 23, 2014, 06:22:18 PM
While I agree the bolded portion is frustrating, doesn't it all even out if our C outscores their C by 10 points per game? You attempt to score based on match-ups and advantages. Other teams have the advantage at PG; typically we have it in the frontcourt. As long as we win, does it matter where the points come from?
How much more effective do you think Gardner, Otule and Jamil could operate in the paint, and Todd slashing to the basket - if there wasn't Derrick's defender typically sagged to the painted area?
I feel our Center advantage gets nullified due to the above - certainly not maximized as much as it could be. The trickle down/domino effect having such a limited PG offensively results in the other guys on the floor not being as effective as they could be. I've said it before, I'd be happy with Derrick launching 5 3pt shots a game when they sag that far off of him - I think he'd likely make 1 of 5...and that's enough to keep the defense honest.
But, we haven't won at a rate anyone on this board expected going into this year - even when it was known Duane and McKay were gone...so I can't agree with your statement - "As long as we win, does it matter where the points come from." If we were winning at a higher rate, yes, I could go along with that and say no, it doesn't matter where the points come from...but our resume really is pretty poor this year...
Quote from: mattyv1908 on February 23, 2014, 05:47:54 PM
Ners - you must be proud today as Dawson had a good run yesterday with Wilson in foul trouble. Had a good game I thought.
+1
Quote from: Ners on February 23, 2014, 10:51:39 AM
The big area of frustration of course for me is at PG.
Really? Why didn't you say so before?
Quote from: willie warrior on February 23, 2014, 06:26:40 PM
never get angry--as you likely do. No double standard, as slurping is a good thing and not considered as idiot, jerk, etc. But think what you want, Golden one.
Slurper has a positive connotation? Interesting.
Quote from: Nevada233 on February 23, 2014, 02:19:11 PM
Losses to New Mexico we allowed 40 back court points (Cullen Neal went off), Xavier we allowed 42 back court points (Christion went off had 28), Arizona State we allowed 44 Points back court points (Thames went off) and St Johns 31 back court points. (Harrison had 27)... All Games where a guards went off on our outstanding defenders....
You have to realize that part of the problem is the new foul rules. In some games all you have to do is touch a guard as he drives to the basket (even if the guard runs into you) and a foul is called. Put a team in the bonus who has a very quick guard that drives to the basket and you have no chance to stop them.
Quote from: Ners on February 23, 2014, 07:59:26 PM
How much more effective do you think Gardner, Otule and Jamil could operate in the paint, and Todd slashing to the basket - if there wasn't Derrick's defender typically sagged to the painted area?
I feel our Center advantage gets nullified due to the above - certainly not maximized as much as it could be. The trickle down/domino effect having such a limited PG offensively results in the other guys on the floor not being as effective as they could be. I've said it before, I'd be happy with Derrick launching 5 3pt shots a game when they sag that far off of him - I think he'd likely make 1 of 5...and that's enough to keep the defense honest.
But, we haven't won at a rate anyone on this board expected going into this year - even when it was known Duane and McKay were gone...so I can't agree with your statement - "As long as we win, does it matter where the points come from." If we were winning at a higher rate, yes, I could go along with that and say no, it doesn't matter where the points come from...but our resume really is pretty poor this year...
I just don't agree with many of the items here. If you're going to look at PG points between teams in a vacuum, then you should also look at C points in a vacuum. Regardless of how effective the frontcourt is, if they're scoring more points than the other team's frontcourt, then we have the advantage there, like they might have at PG.
I understand the point you are making about sagging and being disruptive, but points are points, regardless if they're hard to get or if they're easy to get. In fact, that sagging is one reason Buzz has opted to start bring the ball in from the wing with Todd, Jamil and Jake.
And I really just don't understand why you can't agree with my statement. Even if we haven't won as much as some people thought (including myself), all that matters is that we score more than the other team, regardless of who/how we score. Whether we have 20 wins or 3 wins, it shouldn't matter how we score as long as we score more. That seems straight-forward to me.
There are things you can criticise Buzz about. The number of transfers, which keeps the team young and inexperienced. Not fouling when up three. I just do not think we should believe we know more about who should be playing on this team, because we do not see what players are doing every day and we do not understand what Buzz wants them to do. Buzz knows more about basketball than we do and coaching is his livelihood. He is going to play who he thinks will win the game. His goal this year is still to get to NCAA tournament and he is not going to give up to play younger players.
Quote from: bilsu on February 23, 2014, 09:11:39 PM
There are things you can criticise Buzz about. The number of transfers, which keeps the team young and inexperienced. Not fouling when up three. I just do not think we should believe we know more about who should be playing on this team, because we do not see what players are doing every day and we do not understand what Buzz wants them to do. Buzz knows more about basketball than we do and coaching is his livelihood. He is going to play who he thinks will win the game. His goal this year is still to get to NCAA tournament and he is not going to give up to play younger players.
Well said bilsu.
Quote from: bilsu on February 23, 2014, 09:11:39 PM
There are things you can criticise Buzz about. The number of transfers, which keeps the team young and inexperienced.
Is our number of transfers really that bad? Not picking on you specifically, but I sense so much frustration and fear about transfers. But I really think we are on par for most D1 programs.
2013 Class (as of right now): Jameel McKay (reason unknown)
2012 Class: Jamal Ferguson (clearly wasn't able to play at this level)
2011 Class: 0 transfers
2010 Class: Jamail Jones (had to transfer to FGCU to find minutes), Reggie Smith (had to transfer to Eastern Illinois to find minutes...also potentially related to sexual assault case)
2009 Class: Jerrone Maymon (dragged off the team by father), Erik Williams (couldn't even get minutes at Sam Houston State...also potentially connected to sexual assault case), Yous Mbao (couldn't even get minutes at Marshall)
2008 Class: Liam McMorrow (had a heart condition)
Basically, we've been getting one transfer a year (I think the average for D1 is around 1.8 transfers a year). The years we've had multiple, it's been for things beyond the coach's control or the players clearly didn't pan out.
I really don't think transfers are an issue for our team.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 23, 2014, 11:49:59 PM
Is our number of transfers really that bad? Not picking on you specifically, but I sense so much frustration and fear about transfers. But I really think we are on par for most D1 programs.
2013 Class (as of right now): Jameel McKay (reason unknown)
2012 Class: Jamal Ferguson (clearly wasn't able to play at this level)
2011 Class: 0 transfers
2010 Class: Jamail Jones (had to transfer to FGCU to find minutes), Reggie Smith (had to transfer to Eastern Illinois to find minutes...also potentially related to sexual assault case)
2009 Class: Jerrone Maymon (dragged off the team by father), Erik Williams (couldn't even get minutes at Sam Houston State...also potentially connected to sexual assault case), Yous Mbao (couldn't even get minutes at Marshall)
2008 Class: Liam McMorrow (had a heart condition)
Basically, we've been getting one transfer a year (I think the average for D1 is around 1.8 transfers a year). The years we've had multiple, it's been for things beyond the coach's control or the players clearly didn't pan out.
I really don't think transfers are an issue for our team.
Reggie Smith actually transferred to UNLV first. Roseboro, not sure if he was considered a transfer...I know Newbill was not (nor was Durley), but for some reason I thought Roseboro was.
TJ Taylor is another one that transferred. Of course Juan Anderson and Jake Thomas transferred and then untransferred.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 24, 2014, 12:18:27 AM
Reggie Smith actually transferred to UNLV first. Roseboro, not sure if he was considered a transfer...I know Newbill was not (nor was Durley), but for some reason I thought Roseboro was.
TJ Taylor is another one that transferred. Of course Juan Anderson and Jake Thomas transferred and then untransferred.
Regarding Smith, that's why I used the phrasing "to find minutes." I know he transferred to UNLV first but he couldn't crack their rotation either.
I forgot about TJ Taylor and Roseboro. Neither of them ended up at quality programs either...North Texas and Maryland-Baltimore County (with a stop at St. Bonaventure's) respectively.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 24, 2014, 12:18:27 AM
Reggie Smith actually transferred to UNLV first. Roseboro, not sure if he was considered a transfer...I know Newbill was not (nor was Durley), but for some reason I thought Roseboro was.
TJ Taylor is another one that transferred. Of course Juan Anderson and Jake Thomas transferred and then untransferred.
Juan was going to transfer for family reasons and Jake because he didn't want to pay full freight at MU...neither of which really count as negatives against the program. I think the transfers aren't an issue so much as some misfires in recruiting. I think Buzz is in love with the diamond in the rough player but sometimes it turns out to just be a rock.