End of Chevron doctrine

[rocky_warrior]

Back to why we use to rely on agencies of experts to implement these things instead of relying on the coarse words of congress or the courts.

Indeed.  Gotcha.  I do think the idea of a "supreme court" is flawed.

[Pakuni]

These are good points.  Should SC opinions be subject to peer review before "decisions"?

https://www.propublica.org/article/supreme-court-errors-are-not-hard-to-find

In theory, they (read: their clerks) provide peer review. In reality,  it turns out Supreme Court justices and their clerks aren't any better at avoiding confirmation bias than the rest of us.

As for peer review, I have a hard time imagining any world in which Supreme Court justices have the humility to submit their work to external fact-checking.

[rocky_warrior]

humility to submit their work to external fact-checking.

Agreed.  Humility is not a strong point.  And that's kinda a problem.

[Skatastrophy]

How many days/months/years until we discover the first GPT-created supreme court brief?

[lawdog77]

He doesn't need to. He can put out a hit and say it is an official act because trump has already declared he will be a dictator on day 1. Hence, it would be an official act because it is done in the explicit case of losing our democracy.

We have one justice who has said he supports fully the overthrow of the US gov't. We have another who shows the same symptoms. They were the deciding votes.

This is the biggest hit to the existence and ideals of US democracy in our history.

Source?

[rocky_warrior]

How many days/months/years until we discover the first GPT-created supreme court brief?

Less than 2 years...until an AI hallucination makes it.  Though it's not just AI...just internet "facts".

Recently a friend complained that her AC kept her main level very cool, and the upstairs too warm.  Her and her neighbors theorized that  lack of appropriate "upstairs" returns may be causing the problem.  Perhaps true, but I suggested just closing a few main level vents - to which she replied with an article saying you should never do that, it'll cause excess pressure in the system, waste energy, kill your HVAC system, and might be a danger to your health!

Well, it turns out one of those is true.  It might waste energy.  But could keep you more comfortable (assuming you close less than 60% of the vents)
https://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/question/closing-vents-in-unused-rooms
https://escholarship.org/content/qt4vw4v8wz/qt4vw4v8wz.pdf

But what she sent is a WIDESPREAD internet hallucination.

In the end, she closed a couple main level vents and now both levels maintain the same temperature.

edit: I'll add...several articles mentioned "static airflow" and how you could mess it up.  No offense to HVAC techs out there, but most residential HVAC guys do zero static airflow analysis other than using blower size vs sq footage.

[brewcity77]

Indeed.  Gotcha.  I do think the idea of a "supreme court" is flawed.

I don't think the idea is flawed, but partisan appointees are. A better process would be to require replacement justices to gain unanimous consent from the sitting justices to join the court. If Clarence Thomas and Elena Kagan can't agree, the nominee isn't seated.

[rocky_warrior]

I don't think the idea is flawed, but partisan appointees are. A better process would be to require replacement justices to gain unanimous consent from the sitting justices to join the court. If Clarence Thomas and Elena Kagan can't agree, the nominee isn't seated.

I guess.  There are several different ways you could pick justices that are better than what we have right now.  But *I* think the problem is the that most of them interpret "supreme" as in their own power, not the level of justice. (see previous humility comments)

[Jockey]

Source?

Thomas' wife worked to overthrow the election. that is well documented and her comments, texts, etc. are available.

When asked about his wife's role in the attempted coup, Thomas said he supports everything his wife does.

[Zog from Margo]

https://www.archives.gov/milestone-documents/tonkin-gulf-resolution
That was NOT an action the president acted on himself!  Sure it got around the "act of war" rules, but nobody could argue it wasn't an official act!

By the time that resolution was passed, the US had been in Vietnam for 9 years and already had 9,000 troops there by 1962.

Besides, all of the actions taken by Presidents in conjunction with Vietnam were official acts. That's the point. Based on the domino theory, the President didn't need Congressional approval to take unilateral action to defend the country. Given that is a core function of the office, the President today would have absolute immunity in sending in troops and history shows that the Constitution would not require a declaration of war. The only remedy would be impeachment, which, as we have seen, cannot occur unless one party both controls the House and has a 2/3rds majority in the Senate.

[rocky_warrior]

By the time that resolution was passed, the US had been in Vietnam for 9 years and already had 9,000 troops there by 1962.

This is going to sound incredibly tone def, and Vietnam was largely before I was born. In 1960 the US had 2.4 million service members, 870k in the army.  You're talking about <0.5% of service members before the resolution.

Perhaps this is personal to you, and for that I'm appreciative an apologize.  But it has little to do with the SC immunity decision.

[forgetful]

I'm actually with Rocky to some extent, in that in many regards there wasn't anything that exceptional about the overall decision in this case.

The president should have immunity for most official actions.

What makes this so problematic, is they took the case up to hear it in full. If this is the route they were going to go, they could have easily refused the case, saying it was premature, due to the fact that no decisions have been made by lower courts on whether these were official actions or actions outside of official presidential business.

They could have let the courts make the decisions, try the cases, and let Trump appeal.

Instead, they took the case up, delayed all the trials, and then made a decision that essentially punts back to the lower courts anyways.

It makes it look like it was all a ruse to protect Trump from prosecution.

[The Sultan]

No.

Aren't you on vacation? Why don't you play with the grandkids, take a walk with the wife or have dinner with friends instead of feeding your Scoop addiction? Maybe assuming grandkids, a wife or friends who want to be with you is a bridge too far but a guy can hope.

I have no grandkids. And you were wrong.

But keep trying.

[lawdog77]

Thomas' wife worked to overthrow the election. that is well documented and her comments, texts, etc. are available.

When asked about his wife's role in the attempted coup, Thomas said he supports everything his wife does.

That's quite the leap.Ms. Thomas might be crazy, but her husband isnt going to criticize her in public. She isnt going to influence his decisions, if you know anything about him.

[rocket surgeon]

just catching up on the discussion, watching from the outside, I can honestly say that I was thoroughly impressed with Rockies moderation here.  decent command of the topic while acknowledging he hasn't read the whole thing as i'm sure very few of the others have as well.  but tactfully walking the fine line here while keeping some of the known "activists" and heavy breathers under control.  I say he deserves a raise

    regardless of heisy's post being plagiarized or not, it was super informative and summarized the Chevron thingy brilliantly, but gave the "haters" more reason to hate because the hate the message and the messenger.  damn you heisy-just put quotes and a footnote man and you would still have been hated, but the haters would have had less ammo

[rocket surgeon]

Thomas' wife worked to overthrow the election. that is well documented and her comments, texts, etc. are available.

When asked about his wife's role in the attempted coup, Thomas said he supports everything his wife does.

  you and 82 snuggling together is a weird look, but yeah, I could see it

[The Sultan]

just catching up on the discussion, watching from the outside, I can honestly say that I was thoroughly impressed with Rockies moderation here.  decent command of the topic while acknowledging he hasn't read the whole thing as i'm sure very few of the others have as well.  but tactfully walking the fine line here while keeping some of the known "activists" and heavy breathers under control.  I say he deserves a raise

    regardless of heisy's post being plagiarized or not, it was super informative and summarized the Chevron thingy brilliantly, but gave the "haters" more reason to hate because the hate the message and the messenger.  damn you heisy-just put quotes and a footnote man and you would still have been hated, but the haters would have had less ammo

Heisey's post was also filled with exaggerations. 

[MU82]

  you and 82 snuggling together is a weird look, but yeah, I could see it

you and 45 snuggling together ... I definitely could see that.

[Uncle Rico]

That's quite the leap.Ms. Thomas might be crazy, but her husband isnt going to criticize her in public. She isnt going to influence his decisions, if you know anything about him.

But the bribes will

[rocky_warrior]

I won't have time to check in much today... So... Behave!

[lawdog77]

I won't have time to check in much today... So... Behave!

[Scoop Snoop]

[tower912]

Don't make me pull this website over or so help me....

[MU82]

A survey from The Associated Press-NORC Center for Public Affairs Research found that 7 in 10 Americans think the high court's justices are more influenced by ideology, while only about 3 in 10 U.S. adults think the justices are more likely to provide an independent check on other branches of government by being fair and impartial.

https://apnews.com/article/supreme-court-trump-presidential-immunity-abortion-gun-2918d3af5e37e44bbad9c3526506c66d?

[lawdog77]

A survey from The Associated Press-NORC Center for Public Affairs Research found that 7 in 10 Americans think the high court's justices are more influenced by ideology, while only about 3 in 10 U.S. adults think the justices are more likely to provide an independent check on other branches of government by being fair and impartial.

https://apnews.com/article/supreme-court-trump-presidential-immunity-abortion-gun-2918d3af5e37e44bbad9c3526506c66d?

Feelings, not facts