Was: Israel is at War; Now: Scoopers diagnose your anti-Semitism

[Uncle Rico]

Are you a Russian judge. What does it take to get a 10?

He failed to mention The View and/or ice cream

[Heisenberg]

Numerous people here have put out possible ideas and partial solutions. Obviously with a lot of thought.

But you just throw out ill thought out answers to solve everything and insult those who have actual ideas.

You are a know-it-all who knows almost nothing. You think the longer your post is, the wiser you are. It's embarrassing in the worst chicos tradition.

Long posts about having American troops fighting in Gaza, using poison gas in the hospital, fantasies about Arab peacekeepers, and the suggestion that hundreds of thousands of Palestinians be moved into Israel, are posts that have been a lot of thought put into it.

So you're allowed to criticize me in a way I am not allowed to criticize the ridiculousness of forgetful's post.

Because  if I wrote that BS you'd be lighting it up like no other post I've ever written.

[MU82]

I addressed Musk earlier. I barely pay attention to him and have no idea what he is saying. And I'm not interested in spending time coming up to speed on his tweets.

So have at him .... not interested.

Ah, so you're only interested in Musk when it serves your purposes to fellate him. No interest in his anti-Semitism at all. Only certain people's anti-Semitism bothers you. Got it.

[forgetful]

What could have been done differently is kind of a moot point now.

Anyone have any ideas on what the end game looks like? Once the primary military objectives are met, what then?

How does one avoid this just following the endless cycle of violence in the region?

[forgetful]

Long posts about having American troops fighting in Gaza, using poison gas in the hospital, fantasies about Arab peacekeepers, and the suggestion that hundreds of thousands of Palestinians be moved into Israel, are posts that have been a lot of thought put into it.

So you're allowed to criticize me in a way I am not allowed to criticize the ridiculousness of forgetful's post.

Because  if I wrote that BS you'd be lighting it up like no other post I've ever written.

1. I called for a coalition. And newsflash, American troops are on the ground over there right now. You won't see it publicly discussed, because the types of troops operating in the region aren't discussed.

2. You are the first to discuss using poison gas in hospitals.

3. It's not a fantasy. It could be done. But needs a 2-state solution to get people on board. It's actually consistent with elements of the Arab Peace Plan that has been proposed multiple times since 2002.

4. Temporary relocation of refugees into Israel is better than bombing them in Gaza, and/or suggestions of forcing them into Egypt.

Next, I'm not addressing most of your posts because they are ridiculous. And I would have posted earlier, but I was working with a group setting up a Shabbat with empty chairs for the 240 hostages still being held in Gaza.

[Heisenberg]

What could have been done differently is kind of a moot p'oint now.

Anyone have any ideas on what the end game looks like? Once the primary military objectives are met, what then?

How does one avoid this just following the endless cycle of violence in the region?

How did we avoid the endless cycle of violence with Germany and Japan, and the confederacy? By winning the war.

The cycle of violence continues because you have a negotiated peace or half settlements. One side has to prevail over the other and the cycle of violence ends. prevailing does not mean genocide, Germany, Japan, and the confederacy were not a genocide.

[Heisenberg]

1. I called for a coalition. And newsflash, American troops are on the ground over there right now. You won't see it publicly discussed, because the types of troops operating in the region aren't discussed.

2. You are the first to discuss using poison gas in hospitals.

3. It's not a fantasy. It could be done. But needs a 2-state solution to get people on board. It's actually consistent with elements of the Arab Peace Plan that has been proposed multiple times since 2002.

4. Temporary relocation of refugees into Israel is better than bombing them in Gaza, and/or suggestions of forcing them into Egypt.

Next, I'm not addressing most of your posts because they are ridiculous. And I would have posted earlier, but I was working with a group setting up a Shabbat with empty chairs for the 240 hostages still being held in Gaza.

American troops are on the ground looking for our hostages. That is hardly the same as a coalition of Western armies killing Palestinians. Do you have any idea what that would signal to the Arab world to the Muslim World? That would set off a world war between the West and the Muslim world where 1 billion people would die.

When did I discuss using poison Gas in a hospital? You're the one who brought up "smoke them out." This means use poison gas.

But I see, we're supposed to take you conceptually, not precisely and analytically like everybody else does here on this board. So what did you mean by "smoke them out?"

Did you really mean "wait them out?" And deny the patients their proper medical care and maybe food and water? No, they're supposed to surround the hospital and let it operate indefinitely for the rest of time ... that's what you meant.

In other words, you want them to do nothing. Do you want Hamas to operate in the tunnels under the hospital for the forever, plotting to kill Jews?

Again, you can write the words "Arab peacekeeping." Still, there is absolutely nothing in the 75-year history, the current rhetoric among Arab politicians, Israeli politicians, American politicians, the Western press, and the Arab press to suggest this was ever considered viable. It is something you just made up.

So Israel opens its border and corrals hundreds of thousands of people into a big livestock pen and feeds and cleans them. The world goes crazy that they're treating them like Subhumans. Then, with no civilians in Gaza, they turn the place into your parking lot without killing any civilians. And that none of those hundreds of thousands of people in the big livestock pen in Israel want to return. So then what?

Do you force them to return to Gaza at the point of a bayonet? That is a human rights violation and might be worse than what is happening right now. And while in Israel for the long haul, they start screaming about the right of return, how they want their land back, their rights to vote, and the other nearly six million Palestinians to have the same. In other words, they just won. They just took over Israel.

Every one of the four above is a complete disaster. They take a bad situation and make it orders of magnitude worse.

[Not all scoop users are created equal apparently]

American troops are on the ground looking for our hostages. That is hardly the same as a coalition of Western armies killing Palestinians. Do you have any idea what that would signal to the Arab world to the Muslim World? That would set off a world war between the West and the Muslim world where 1 billion people would die.

When did I discuss using poison Gas in a hospital? You're the one who brought up "smoke them out." This means use poison gas.

But I see, we're supposed to take you conceptually, not precisely and analytically like everybody else does here on this board. So what did you mean by "smoke them out?"

Did you really mean "wait them out?" And deny the patients their proper medical care and maybe food and water? No, they're supposed to surround the hospital and let it operate indefinitely for the rest of time ... that's what you meant.

In other words, you want them to do nothing. Do you want Hamas to operate in the tunnels under the hospital for the forever, plotting to kill Jews?

Again, you can write the words "Arab peacekeeping." Still, there is absolutely nothing in the 75-year history, the current rhetoric among Arab politicians, Israeli politicians, American politicians, the Western press, and the Arab press to suggest this was ever considered viable. It is something you just made up.

So Israel opens its border and corrals hundreds of thousands of people into a big livestock pen and feeds and cleans them. The world goes crazy that they're treating them like Subhumans. Then, with no civilians in Gaza, they turn the place into your parking lot without killing any civilians. And that none of those hundreds of thousands of people in the big livestock pen in Israel want to return. So then what?

Do you force them to return to Gaza at the point of a bayonet? That is a human rights violation and might be worse than what is happening right now. And while in Israel for the long haul, they start screaming about the right of return, how they want their land back, their rights to vote, and the other nearly six million Palestinians to have the same. In other words, they just won. They just took over Israel.

Every one of the four above is a complete disaster. They take a bad situation and make it orders of magnitude worse.

[Heisenberg]

Ah, so you're only interested in Musk when it serves your purposes to fellate him. No interest in his anti-Semitism at all. Only certain people's anti-Semitism bothers you. Got it.

A few posts ago you criticized me for posting what you thought was an attack.

But now that I committed terrible sin of not paying attention to Musk, because I'm not interested in what he says, it is perfectly ok to attack me, complete with a homopobic slur.

Honestly 82 you're better than this. I expected it from the weak minded snowflakes, not you.

[Heisenberg]

Maybe Hamas = Palestinians

If so, and their stated goal is to eliminate the Jewish race, what is the proportional response?

Better question might be what is not. See WW2.

——

Survey finds majority in the West Bank support the Oct 7 massacre

https://www.i24news.tv/en/news/middle-east/palestinian-territories/1700158968-survey-finds-majority-in-the-west-bank-justify-the-oct-7-massacre

The Birzeit University poll finds that Palestinian terror groups are widely supported, with over 80 percent supporting the various factions

An opinion poll conducted by Birzeit University's Arab World for Research & Development (AWRAD) revealed that a majority of surveyed Palestinians in the West Bank support the October 7 massacre carried out by Hamas, and an even wider majority have a positive view of the various terrorist factions.

After over 1,200 people were brutally murdered and over 240 taken hostage, including children and elderly, many civilians tortured and raped, the survey showed that 68 percent in the West Bank strongly supported the massacres and kidnapping, while another 16 percent supported to some extent.

Asked on their view of various entities, respondents answered overwhelmingly in support of the military wings of the terrorist organizations; Palestinian Islamic Jihad with 84 percent; al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades with 80 percent, and al-Qassam Brigades with the highest 89 percent, though Hamas as a whole received a lower 76 percent.

[rocket surgeon]

so how is it the revelations of all the anti-antisemitism that has been present all along, but just buried to act as if it doesn't exist, any different than the KKK? 

it's NOT

so why such a disproportionate response to it? 

  the huge pro-palestinian (insurrections) riots are nothing but huge gatherings of "bigoted", although not a strong enough term, people(used loosely)

interesting how media seems a little ok with antisemitism but bring up david duke and their hair's on fire and rightly so, but seems a little off

[The Sultan]

so how is it the revelations of all the anti-antisemitism that has been present all along, but just buried to act as if it doesn't exist, any different than the KKK? 

it's NOT

so why such a disproportionate response to it? 

  the huge pro-palestinian (insurrections) riots are nothing but huge gatherings of "bigoted", although not a strong enough term, people(used loosely)

interesting how media seems a little ok with antisemitism but bring up david duke and their hair's on fire and rightly so, but seems a little off

WTF are you talking about? There have been plenty of stories on rising antisemitism all over the media. Just do a Google search and you can see it.

Stop being willfully ignorant.

[Uncle Rico]

so how is it the revelations of all the anti-antisemitism that has been present all along, but just buried to act as if it doesn't exist, any different than the KKK? 

it's NOT

so why such a disproportionate response to it? 

  the huge pro-palestinian (insurrections) riots are nothing but huge gatherings of "bigoted", although not a strong enough term, people(used loosely)

interesting how media seems a little ok with antisemitism but bring up david duke and their hair's on fire and rightly so, but seems a little off

7 out of 10

[MU82]

so how is it the revelations of all the anti-antisemitism that has been present all along, but just buried to act as if it doesn't exist, any different than the KKK? 

it's NOT

so why such a disproportionate response to it? 

  the huge pro-palestinian (insurrections) riots are nothing but huge gatherings of "bigoted", although not a strong enough term, people(used loosely)

interesting how media seems a little ok with antisemitism but bring up david duke and their hair's on fire and rightly so, but seems a little off

YOU love Trump. YOU love Tucker. YOU love Musk. YOU downplay the evil bigotry of Jew-haters like MTG and the Proud Boys.

YOU obviously are more than "a little ok with antisemitism."

[MU82]

But now that I committed terrible sin of not paying attention to Musk, because I'm not interested in what he says

The question is WHY aren't you interested in what Elon Musk says?

You are VERY interested in what some 18-22 year old college student signs - you think he or she should be unemployable for the rest of his or her life if his or her name is on some student protest paper ... but you aren't the least bit interested in one of the most powerful people in the world actively recruiting Jew-haters to his platform, actively supporting Jew-haters, going out of his way to agree with Jew-haters?

19-year-old Skippy Jones at Harvard is a threat to Jews and Israel ... a few Scoopers you disagree with are threats to Jews and Israel ... a few politicians with little real influence are threats to Jews and Israel ... but Elon Effen Musk isn't?

Here's this today on Seeking Alpha:

IBM has suspended advertising on Elon Musk's X, formerly known as Twitter, after a media report said the social media platform ran the tech giant's ads next to pro-Nazi material.

Non-profit website Media Matters said it found ads from major brands such as IBM (IBM), Apple (AAPL), Oracle (ORCL), Comcast's (CMCSA) Xfinity and NBCUniversal's Bravo next to content "that touts Adolf Hitler and his Nazi Party."

"IBM (IBM) has zero tolerance for hate speech and discrimination, and we immediately suspended all advertising on X while we investigate this entirely unacceptable situation," a company spokesperson told Seeking Alpha. ...

IBM's move follows Musk agreeing with a conspiracy theory that claimed Jewish communities were "pushing dialectical hatred against whites." He also blamed the ADL for anti-white rhetoric.

"At a time when antisemitism is exploding in America and surging around the world, it is dangerous to use one's influence to validate and promote antisemitic theories," said ADL CEO Jonathan Greenblatt.

Douchey, you've probably written 100 posts on what you feel is anti-Semitism on college campuses. I've agreed with some and not agreed with others. In other threads, you've displayed admiration for Elon Musk (you're right: I shouldn't have used the term "fellated") and you have spoken about what an important outlet you think X is.

But now that the two issues have collided - Musk is a powerful anti-Semite with powerful allies (including most of the GOP) and a powerful platform - you suddenly aren't "interested"?

OK. But somehow I have a feeling that if this were the NYT taking advertising dollars from the Nazis or if this were a university president claiming Jewish communities were "pushing dialectical hatred against whites," you'd have been VERY interested, and you'd have had another couple dozen posts about it.

My recommendation would be that you tone down your rhetoric toward a few Scoopers you disagree with, and start focusing your outrage on powerful people like Musk, whose Jew-hating actually has an influence on the world.

[Heisenberg]

The Economist is portraying things in Gaza a little differently.

I guess the livestock pen in Israel is not needed.

-----

The end of the beginning
The battle of northern Gaza is almost over
But a dire humanitarian situation in the south is getting worse

https://www.economist.com/middle-east-and-africa/2023/11/15/the-battle-of-northern-gaza-is-almost-over

city which, six weeks ago, was home to nearly 1m people is now a hollow shell. When The Economist was invited on November 14th to join an Israeli military-supply convoy to al-Shati, a once-cramped refugee camp in northern Gaza, none of its 90,000 residents was there. Many of the camp's dense apartment buildings had been destroyed; others were badly damaged. Armoured columns of the Israel Defence Forces (idf) had torn up roads. Electricity, water and sewage infrastructure no longer exist. The situation is similar in much of Gaza city and in outlying towns.

After six weeks of war and three weeks of ground fighting, Israel now has effective control of the area north of Wadi Gaza, a riverbed that bisects the 45km-long strip (see map). The devastation heralds the end of one phase of Israel's war against Hamas, which began on October 7th after the Palestinian Islamist group carried out a massacre that ended with around 1,400 Israelis killed or kidnapped. Weeks of Israeli action have killed more than 11,000 Palestinians in Gaza. They have also, in effect dislodged Hamas from power, at least in the north of the enclave: the group that has controlled Gaza since 2007 is now scattered and reeling.

---

In recent days attention has been focused on al-Shifa hospital, the largest in Gaza, and other such facilities. Israel says Hamas has an underground headquarters beneath al-Shifa. It also believes that some of its 239 hostages were hidden there, at least temporarily. On November 15th, after encircling it for six days, Israeli troops entered the hospital compound.

The situation was still unfolding as The Economist went to press, but initial reports suggest the idf found neither the leadership of Hamas nor any of the hostages. Most of the 60,000 or so Palestinians who had been sheltering at the hospital in the early days of the war had also vanished. When Israeli troops entered, only 1,500 or so people remained, a mix of medical staff, patients and displaced people.

Most fled south—as did everyone else. Once home to more than half of Gaza's population, the north is now a deserted wasteland. The Israeli troops in al-Shati report only a few encounters with small groups of civilians. There are no accurate figures for how many people remain, clustered around hospitals and relief centres. Israeli and foreign sources believe they number only in the tens of thousands.

[forgetful]

I guess the livestock pen in Israel is not needed.

If you wonder why you have been titled "not a serious person," its because of things like this. You intentionally make crap up, and grossly mischaracterize anything anyone says, if you don't agree with them.

When proven wrong, you double, triple, or quadruple down.

I tried to engage in honest discussion, but it is time to put you on ignore. There is no honest, and fruitful discussion here.

[forgetful]

Was pointed to this by someone last night. Apparently part of the evidence the US/Israel is using in regards to there being a base under Al Shifa is the fact that Israel built a bunker and operating room underneath Al Shifa back in 1983.

They believed Hamas was using the Israeli bunker.

https://www.newsweek.com/fact-check-did-israel-build-bunker-under-shifa-hospital-1844107

Newsweek validated that Israel did indeed build a fortified bunker under Al Shifa, by cross-referencing multiple Israeli news sources in the past that referenced its construction.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Ah, so you're only interested in Musk when it serves your purposes to fellate him. No interest in his anti-Semitism at all. Only certain people's anti-Semitism bothers you. Got it.

Douchey is now claiming he has no interest in Musk? LOL, the Twitter Reading Limits thread says otherwise.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

If you wonder why you have been titled "not a serious person," its because of things like this. You intentionally make crap up, and grossly mischaracterize anything anyone says, if you don't agree with them.

When proven wrong, you double, triple, or quadruple down.

I tried to engage in honest discussion, but it is time to put you on ignore. There is no honest, and fruitful discussion here.

Welcome, plenty of room left in the club.

The mixture of dishonesty, stupidity, and illogic make useful discussions impossible.

[4everwarriors]

Oh da irony! Plenty of brown, stinky, mushy matter between the mope squad ears here, hey?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Says the guy that thinks Scoopers are so influential that they need to be on a list of antisemites, but elected national representatives, one of the world's richest billionaires, one of the right's most popular pundits, and the presumptive nominee of the Nazi republican party are small fish beneath notice.

I don't know, maybe stick to anti-vax memes?

[JWags85]

https://www.timesofisrael.com/musk-endorses-tweet-claiming-jews-stoke-hatred-of-white-people-as-the-actual-truth/amp/

Nice summary of Elon's anti-semitism with numbers showing how X has become a bastion for anti-semites and racists.  Very telling stuff that a social media owner is propagating anti-Semitic tropes.  No wonder anti-semitism is on the rise

When will his supporters push back?  Very important question

This isn't addressing to me, but Ive found this all very disturbing/interesting.

Ive been a fairly vocal Musk "defender".  Not so much a fanboy, but an admirer of his work and his efforts in a bunch of tech spaces.  More recently, Ive pushed back hard against the, IMO, super dumb efforts to discredit him based on people not liking him.   Hes not smart, he actually inherited hundreds of millions from a magical emerald mine, etc...

That being said, I'm beyond disgusted with where he's went over the last 2-3 months.  I'm not in the camp that thinks this is what he always has been (oh he's from Apartheid SA, he's always been a racist bigot), but I think his attempt to be galaxy brained in rooting out all "conspiracies" has melted his mind, put him in alignment with a bunch of hateful dipshits, and turned him into someone who has a pretty twisted view of everything.  Anti-semitism, like racism, is a learned behavior that develops over time.  And buying into absurd conspiracies helps that ideology bloom like algae in a pond.  And, FWIW, I think this has gone beyond typical two party political bounds.

Ive always been able to separate business from the person, but I'd have major pause if I was heavily invested or tied to TSLA, SpaceX, etc...

[4everwarriors]

"Says the guy that thinks Scoopers are so influential that they need to be on a list of antisemites"

So, its ok to be antisemitic...if you're just a regular Joe, hey?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

So, its ok to be antisemitic...if you're just a regular Joe, hey?

Said no one. But, some idiot has given rich, famous, influential people a pass...as long as they are on one side of the political aisle.