Was: Israel is at War; Now: Scoopers diagnose your anti-Semitism

[The Sultan]

On Saturday, Bill Ackman sent a long letter to Claudine Gay, the President of Harvard. He posted it here.

https://x.com/billackman/status/1720987581549080965?s=61&t=Kba4MD7iUYHMRlrUOaqrng

If you think this is purely about the first amendment, read this letter. He details the physical assaults and verbal abuse Jewish students are constantly under at Harvard. He did not call on Gay to resign, largely because she has only been their four months. But it reads as a final warning, and changes, suspensions and even explosions better commence immediately.

Ackman's voice on this issue matters. He lead the boycott of getting jobs if you are pro-Hamas. He's a big donor to the school and he already had a personal relationship with most, if not all, the trustees before October 7.

Harvard Students are not alone. Cornell canceled classes Friday, see the Marc Rowan profile above about Penn, Columbia is the same.

It is happening at every university in the country. As a Midwest Jesuit university, MUs Jewish population is very small. But assume they feel the same, have endured the same.

"Every university in the country?" Cmon... Again, you are making the same mistake you always do because Ivy League schools do not represent American higher education in general.

At most schools, very little is happening. Few or lightly attended protests - if any. Students, including Muslims and Jews, are going to class, listening to their professors teach the subject matter, and doing other stuff socially.  Pretty sure this describes Marquette students too.

[Heisenberg]

This is fascinating from a not so distant past, of how American politics were influencing and received in the region compared to now. Completely flip flopped.

https://x.com/vptevo/status/1719771298014859518?s=46&t=G2FhP_F2kWewaBOpvRv5lg

Since then United States has pretty much adopted the AIPAC rhetoric for the issue (right or wrong, not the point of this observation) that the U.S. should not only support Israel, but that this support be an unquestioned bipartisan matter.

Where I begin to have more difficulty though, is that we are supposed as citizens accept as just part of life that the United States must send billions of dollars in aid to one of the wealthiest countries on the planet, every single year, but does not DARE ask for anything in return.

Maybe someone smarter than me here can correct any falsehoods here.

Anyway, it is remarkable how far a lobbying dollar can go in regards to national bipartisan policy. If in 30 years it has changed so extensively across the entire political spectrum.

Their has been a giant phase shift in politics in the last generation.

In 2001, the right, lead by the neoconservatives, pushed for war. It was the left in opposition.
Today it is the progressives pushing for war in Ukraine and the party of the neoconservatives becoming ambivalent.

In 2012 it was Barack Obama famously mocked Mitt Romney about his hawkish views on Russia by saying, "the 80s called, they want their foreign policy back."
That 1980s Russian policy in now the policy of the left.

30 or 40 years ago, the democrat party was the home of the working class (think populist party). The Republican Party was run by the wealthy (think country club, chamber of commerce types).
Today the party of the populist is the Republican Party and the party run by the wealthy is the Democrat party (academics and celebrities).

——

It is because of these phase shifts that left-right might no longer apply.

See Bill Maher. As a traditional liberal that has not changed his views at all, his audience is switching from progressives to conservatives.

Ditto Matt Taibbi and Glen Greenwall.

[The Sultan]

Munich was a terrorist attack on foreign soil by the Black September group 51 years ago. October 7 was the government of a neighboring foreign country invading Israel and killing over 1,400 and taking 230 hostages.

Their response was exactly the same to both.

Israel slaughtered every known member of Black September as quickly as possible, and while they made every effort to prevent civilian casualties in this effort, they did not let the potential of civilian casualties stop them.

They are doing the same in Gaza right now.

Actually that's not accurate at all. The response to 1972 lasted for more than a decade, and was largely targeted to people Mossad thought were behind the acts. (Though they made mistakes along the way.) But did not kill nearly as many civilians as have died in Gaza.

Implied in your post is a belief that this was not a foreign invasion representing a threat to the existence of Israel.

It's was a threat to the existence of Israel. That doesn't mean there shouldn't be a response.

[The Sultan]

In 2001, the right, lead by the neoconservatives, pushed for war. It was the left in opposition.
Today it is the progressives pushing for war in Ukraine and the party of the neoconservatives becoming ambivalent.

OMG you are hilarious.  "Progressives" are not "pushing for war in Ukraine." War exists in Ukraine because Russia invaded them!!

[Heisenberg]

"Every university in the country?" Cmon... Again, you are making the same mistake you always do because Ivy League schools do not represent American higher education in general.

At most schools, very little is happening. Few or lightly attended protests - if any. Students, including Muslims and Jews, are going to class, listening to their professors teach the subject matter, and doing other stuff socially.  Pretty sure this describes Marquette students too.

The ivies are the preferred school of the northeast wealthy. They have among the highest percentage of Jewish students outside of Jewish oriented universities like Yeshiva.

So, it is natural they are experiencing it the worst. So don't mistake lower Jewish populations elsewhere as it is not happening.

—-

But your larger point is correct, the vast majority of college students support Israel, even at the ivies. It is a loud and too often violent minority that is terrorizing Jewish students. University administrators is doing terrible job of protecting them.

[Heisenberg]

OMG you are hilarious.  "Progressives" are not "pushing for war in Ukraine." War exists in Ukraine because Russia invaded them!!

Tautology

[4everwarriors]

On Saturday, Bill Ackman sent a long letter to Claudine Gay, the President of Harvard. He posted it here.

https://x.com/billackman/status/1720987581549080965?s=61&t=Kba4MD7iUYHMRlrUOaqrng

If you think this is purely about the first amendment, read this letter. He details the physical assaults and verbal abuse Jewish students are constantly under at Harvard. He did not call on Gay to resign, largely because she has only been their four months. But it reads as a final warning, and changes, suspensions and even explosions better commence immediately.

Ackman's voice on this issue matters. He lead the boycott of getting jobs if you are pro-Hamas. He's a big donor to the school and he already had a personal relationship with most, if not all, the trustees before October 7.

Harvard Students are not alone. Cornell canceled classes Friday, see the Marc Rowan profile above about Penn, Columbia is the same.

It is happening at every university in the country. As a Midwest Jesuit university, MUs Jewish population is very small. But assume they feel the same, have endured the same.

Bravo for Ackman! Gotta push back, hey?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Thanks for your daily dose of ignorance.

Stick to 'Crean sucks'. It shows much more insight.

Calling it ignorance is a bit of a misclassification IMO. Truly it is an example of repeated propaganda having the effect of complete brainwashing, which weak and feeble minds are extremely susceptible to.

The mentally enfeebled dentists now believe in a reality where J6 was purely imaginary and Barack Obama is running the White House. That goes way beyond simple ignorance.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Tautology

Ummmm, no. You often seem to think words mean things other than they really do.

[tower912]

OMG you are hilarious.  "Progressives" are not "pushing for war in Ukraine." War exists in Ukraine because Russia invaded them!!

Putin is the bad guy there.   The same Putin who meets.with representatives of Iran and Hamas in the last couple weeks.   Putin the anti-Semite.

[Heisenberg]

OMG you are hilarious.  "Progressives" are not "pushing for war in Ukraine." War exists in Ukraine because Russia invaded them!!

Russia invaded Ukraine in 2014 (Crimea) and Obama did not commit to war.

Point is their has been a phase shift, the left is now the right and the right is now the left.

[The Sultan]

Putin is the bad guy there.   The same Putin who meets.with representatives of Iran and Hamas in the last couple weeks.   Putin the anti-Semite.

Exactly. Putin and Iran are allies. The war in Ukraine and the war is Israel are branches off the same tree.

[Heisenberg]

Actually that's not accurate at all. The response to 1972 lasted for more than a decade, and was largely targeted to people Mossad thought were behind the acts. (Though they made mistakes along the way.) But did not kill nearly as many civilians as have died in Gaza.


It's was a threat to the existence of Israel. That doesn't mean there shouldn't be a response.

And 1972 was an event by people with no borders that took years to identify. It was also an event that killed 15.

[The Sultan]

And 1972 was an event by people with no borders that took years to identify. It was also an event that killed 15.

Thank you for the history lesson. It neither supports your point, nor refutes mine, but it's a nice basic fact. And that's nice.

[Heisenberg]

Thank you for the history lesson. It neither supports your point, nor refutes mine, but it's a nice basic fact. And that's nice.

If their was some place to invade that was behind this event, they would have. Black September did not claim to be the government of any country.

——

What is your point? That Israel withdraw and spent a decade on quiet assignation? You really think this would be an appropriate deterrence.

Why do you offer nothing but potshots and dissembling? You argue narrow point's with your opinion presented as facts. Because your opinion is a fact in your mind and you cannot tell the difference.

[Pakuni]

Russia invaded Ukraine in 2014 (Crimea) and Obama did not commit to war.

That you would compare Crimea to what's happening now in Ukraine shows a real lack of understanding.

[The Sultan]

What is your point?

My point is that you finally have your user name accurate. You aren't a serious person no matter how hard you try. You have made three flat out false statements in just the last few hours.

Israel's current reaction is not at all "exactly the same" to their reaction to Munich. In fact it is very different.

Antisemitic actions are not happening "at every university in the country."

Progressives are not "pushing for a war in Ukraine."

If your arguments were strong, they wouldn't need your exaggerations and lies to support them. But they aren't strong. You are prone to over-statement and lack significant details and nuance. 

[The Sultan]

Why do you offer nothing but potshots and dissembling?

Nope. I have stated very clearly why think is happening and why Israel's reaction to this is so important. No exaggeration. No American culture war implications.

You can't refute this without exaggeration because your arguments are weak on their own.

[MU82]

Their has been a giant phase shift in politics in the last generation.

In 2001, the right, lead by the neoconservatives, pushed for war. It was the left in opposition.
Today it is the progressives pushing for war in Ukraine and the party of the neoconservatives becoming ambivalent.

In 2012 it was Barack Obama famously mocked Mitt Romney about his hawkish views on Russia by saying, "the 80s called, they want their foreign policy back."
That 1980s Russian policy in now the policy of the left.

30 or 40 years ago, the democrat party was the home of the working class (think populist party). The Republican Party was run by the wealthy (think country club, chamber of commerce types).
Today the party of the populist is the Republican Party and the party run by the wealthy is the Democrat party (academics and celebrities).

——

It is because of these phase shifts that left-right might no longer apply.

See Bill Maher. As a traditional liberal that has not changed his views at all, his audience is switching from progressives to conservatives.

Ditto Matt Taibbi and Glen Greenwall.

There are quite a few misstatements and over-generalizations here.

As usual, you make some good points overall but undermine them by passing off your opinions as "facts" that aren't factual.

[Heisenberg]

My point is that you finally have your user name accurate. You aren't a serious person no matter how hard you try. You have made three flat out false statements in just the last few hours.

To repeat, you wrote:

"Made three flat out false statements in just the last few hours."

I made three opinions, and since you cannot tell the difference between facts and opinions, you presented you opposing opinion as if they are acceptable and measurable facts.

Here is more on my opinion ...


Isrel killed those responsible for Munich. Isreal is killing those responsible for October 7. Their response is exactly the same. This is an opinion.

Regarding every campus. Tomorrow night Ben Shapiro scheduled to speak in Madison. Can't wait to see the respectful and peaceful protests that every Jewish student on campus will not consider threatening in any way. I'm sure no security will be needed for this peaceful protest. Or do you worry the Jewish protests will require security?

But yes, this is only happening on four or five campuses and nowhere else. This is an opinion.

Which party wants increased funding for Ukraine and which party is hesitant to pass it (I say hesitant as it is still under consideration). This is probably more of a fact, but it is also an opinion.

—-

We all understand your opinion, and you think it is the only way to correctly view things, so to think it a correct fact.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

On Saturday, Bill Ackman sent a long letter to Claudine Gay, the President of Harvard. He posted it here.

https://x.com/billackman/status/1720987581549080965?s=61&t=Kba4MD7iUYHMRlrUOaqrng

If you think this is purely about the first amendment, read this letter. He details the physical assaults and verbal abuse Jewish students are constantly under at Harvard. He did not call on Gay to resign, largely because she has only been their four months. But it reads as a final warning, and changes, suspensions and even explosions better commence immediately.

Ackman's voice on this issue matters. He lead the boycott of getting jobs if you are pro-Hamas. He's a big donor to the school and he already had a personal relationship with most, if not all, the trustees before October 7.

Harvard Students are not alone. Cornell canceled classes Friday, see the Marc Rowan profile above about Penn, Columbia is the same.

It is happening at every university in the country. As a Midwest Jesuit university, MUs Jewish population is very small. But assume they feel the same, have endured the same.

Sigh. No Douchey, the letter does not "detail the physical assaults and verbal abuse Jewish students are constantly under at Harvard." It details some examples of "verbal abuse" but all the examples he lists are examples of free speech. The letter then mentions "physical intimidation" (but doesn't explain what he means by that), that students have been spat on (this would be a physical assault that the university should follow up, but again he doesn't detail any examples) and mentions one physical assault caught on video (Presumably the one you posted here earlier which again, i didn't see any clear visual confirmation of physical assault. I invited you to point out the timemarker where that clear visual occurred but you never responded. Ackman claims there are muktiple videos.  If that's true,  I've never seen them and maybe they contain that clear visual).

If you can give me some specific examples of where a harvard (or any university) student or employee has physical assaulted or engaged in unprotected speech against a jewish/israeli student and the university has done nothing,  id be happy to condemn that university. But Id also remind you that student disciplinary records are protected by federal privacy laws. Students accused of these things also have due process rights (that were recently strengthened by the Trump administration) that make investigations and disciplinary processes typically take months to conclude. Ackman is asking for the university to violate students free speech and due process rights (though he doesnt call for "explosions" as you put it).

One thing I will say about Ackmans letter, if what he says about the presidents communication regarding Harvards commitment to end anti-semitism only being given to a small group of Jewish students/alums and not the whole university (I haven't looked into it to see if it's true) that's misstep and she should be criticized for that. Same about his claims about Haravards DEIB statement/office not including support for students of minoritzed religions.

[Heisenberg]

Sigh. No Douchey, the letter does not "detail the physical assaults and verbal abuse Jewish students are constantly under at Harvard." It details some examples of "verbal abuse" but all the examples he lists are examples of free speech. The letter then mentions "physical intimidation" (but doesn't explain what he means by that), that students have been spat on (this would be a physical assault that the university should follow up, but again he doesn't detail any examples) and mentions one physical assault caught on video (Presumably the one you posted here earlier which again, i didn't see any clear visual confirmation of physical assault. I invited you to point out the timemarker where that clear visual occurred but you never responded. Ackman claims there are muktiple videos.  If that's true,  I've never seen them and maybe they contain that clear visual).

If you can give me some specific examples of where a harvard (or any university) student or employee has physical assaulted or engaged in unprotected speech against a jewish/israeli student and the university has done nothing,  id be happy to condemn that university. But Id also remind you that student disciplinary records are protected by federal privacy laws. Students accused of these things also have due process rights (that were recently strengthened by the Trump administration) that make investigations and disciplinary processes typically take months to conclude. Ackman is asking for the university to violate students free speech and due process rights (though he doesnt call for "explosions" as you put it).

One thing I will say about Ackmans letter, if what he says about the presidents communication regarding Harvards commitment to end anti-semitism only being given to a small group of Jewish students/alums and not the whole university (I haven't looked into it to see if it's true) that's misstep and she should be criticized for that. Same about his claims about Haravards DEIB statement/office not including support for students of minoritzed religions.

You expected the letter to give date, times and physical evidence of assaults? Or are you accusing Ackman, or the kids he talked to of being liars?

It is up to Harvard to address this issues and they have not. To date they have kept quiet on all these matters.

His letter is asking them to address these issues.

[Heisenberg]

It's was a threat to the existence of Israel. That doesn't mean there shouldn't be a response.

You argue yourself in circles, presenting opinions as facts and confusing the two.

So which is it? Above or below?

Also does your current opinion fact still mean they should only "severely weaken" Hamas. That reads as they should still be in charge of Gaza, and given an acceptable number of Jews they can kill every year. 1400 too many, 50 to 100, acceptable.

Look forward to your dissembling.

No this isn't a "war for the existance of a race of people." That's hyperbolic nonsense.  I also never said that Israel should "calm down." That's just silly. Of course they need to severely weaken Hamas in response.

[Heisenberg]

There are quite a few misstatements and over-generalizations here.

As usual, you make some good points overall but undermine them by passing off your opinions as "facts" that aren't factual.

You say I make good points. I assume that means you generally agree that the left and right views have phase shifted.

But you feel a need to dissemble to what purpose?  To then disagree?  Or, to make yourself sound smart?

So, please correct this with your "facts"

[The Sultan]

To repeat, you wrote:

"Made three flat out false statements in just the last few hours."

I made three opinions, and since you cannot tell the difference between facts and opinions, you presented you opposing opinion as if they are acceptable and measurable facts.

Here is more on my opinion ...


Isrel killed those responsible for Munich. Isreal is killing those responsible for October 7. Their response is exactly the same. This is an opinion.

Regarding every campus. Tomorrow night Ben Shapiro scheduled to speak in Madison. Can't wait to see the respectful and peaceful protests that every Jewish student on campus will not consider threatening in any way. I'm sure no security will be needed for this peaceful protest. Or do you worry the Jewish protests will require security?

But yes, this is only happening on four or five campuses and nowhere else. This is an opinion.

Which party wants increased funding for Ukraine and which party is hesitant to pass it (I say hesitant as it is still under consideration). This is probably more of a fact, but it is also an opinion.

—-

We all understand your opinion, and you think it is the only way to correctly view things, so to think it a correct fact.

Israel response:  Goalpost shift argument used.

Campus incidents:  No refutation. Just anecdotes.

Ukraine:  Doesn't refute a thing that I said or attempts to justify the original statement.

0/3 - not a serious person.