Bracketology Thread 2023

[DoctorV]

After the game, Fox Sports bracket guy Mike DeCourcy said he was going to move Marquette to a 2. He also said it could move MU to Des Moines for the first 2 rounds and into the Kansas City regional ... along with Kansas.

We absolutely can beat Kansas, but having to play them in KC wouldn't be my preference. But screw it ... seed us wherever, make us play whomever wherever.

Yea I watched Kansas for quite a bit today and that's a team that screams Final4 and very hard to beat.

Very long, extremely athletic.
Grady Dick is a nightmare to guard, and they were throwing alley oops in crowds where they shouldn't be thrown, but making them look easy.

You're right though, at the point in the tournament where we would see them, the Elite8, who cares?
If Marquette made it that far I wouldn't be concerned about any matchup.

This years tournament seems like the type that if/when Marquette wins game 1 they will just get more and more comfortable as it goes on. They will continue to grow in confidence.

[82fanatic]

Can't wait to hear the head of the committee answer how Marquette, 28-6, 17-3 and BE regular season champion as well as BE Tournament Champion ends up on the same seed line as UConn and one line lower than Baylor.

UConn 25-8, 13-7 and lost to Marquette 2x.
Baylor 22-10, 11-7 and lost to Marquette by 30.

I get it, and I know it doesn't work this way, but I've said this before and I'll say it until I'm blue in the face...
Sometimes we get too bogged down by numbers, by data, by computers, and we all become robots to what the next guy is saying and what the computer is spitting out.

Marquette is a 2 seed, and if they aren't, it's a shame on that Committee.
When they win tomorrow it'll help all bracketologists "save face" because many will quickly move Marquette to the 2 line before the Selection Show on Sunday.

Honestly, I wouldn't be at all shocked to see BOTH Marquette and Gonzaga on the 2 line, but I think Gonzaga is a bigger stretch than Marquette.

When Marquette wins tomorrow night they will solidify their spot as a 2 seed. Even if they don't, they should be a 2 seed.
If not, that's a shame on the Committee.

Agreed Doc. 

Looking at these results.

         since Feb  14     
1   Alabama     1   5-2      2 losses,  ranked 12 and 24
2   houston      1   7-0
3   purdue       1.  4-2   2 losses to unranked teams
4   Kansas       1   6-1. 
5   Texas         2   4-2.  2 losses ranked 7 and 22
6   arizona       2   4- 2.  2 losses unranked and 4 th.
7   Baylor        2   2-4.  4 losses. #3,#11, and unranked    Loss to Iowa St
8   UCLA          2   7-0
9   Tennesee    3   3-4  4 losses. #23,#24, and unranked. Loss to miss
10. Virginia      3   6-2  2 losses. Both unranked
11.  Iowa St     3   2-4   4 losses.  #3, #22, #9, and 2 unranked
12.  Kansas St  3   4-3  3 losses to unranked teams.
13   Indiana      4   2-3   3 losses to unranked teams.
14   Marquette  4   7-0
15   Gonzaga    4   7-0
16   Xavier        4   4-2


Someone, somewhere has to say, " this computer output, does not compute". I think both MU and Gonzaga are 2 seeds. 

1 seeds.  Houston,Kansas, UCLA, Alabama?
2 seeds Purdue, Texas, MU, Gonzaga
3 seeds. Baylor, Az,UCONN, KAN ST

[GoldenEagles03]

Can't wait to hear the head of the committee answer how Marquette, 28-6, 17-3 and BE regular season champion as well as BE Tournament Champion ends up on the same seed line as UConn and one line lower than Baylor.

UConn 25-8, 13-7 and lost to Marquette 2x.
Baylor 22-10, 11-7 and lost to Marquette by 30.

I get it, and I know it doesn't work this way, but I've said this before and I'll say it until I'm blue in the face...
Sometimes we get too bogged down by numbers, by data, by computers, and we all become robots to what the next guy is saying and what the computer is spitting out.

Marquette is a 2 seed, and if they aren't, it's a shame on that Committee.
When they win tomorrow it'll help all bracketologists "save face" because many will quickly move Marquette to the 2 line before the Selection Show on Sunday.

Honestly, I wouldn't be at all shocked to see BOTH Marquette and Gonzaga on the 2 line, but I think Gonzaga is a bigger stretch than Marquette.

When Marquette wins tomorrow night they will solidify their spot as a 2 seed. Even if they don't, they should be a 2 seed.
If not, that's a shame on the Committee.

You're absolutely right.  Quad 1 wins be damned...Marquette has just lacked the opportunities that Baylor did.  Nothing on their resume shows they should be ahead of Marquette.

[MuggsyB]

Can't wait to hear the head of the committee answer how Marquette, 28-6, 17-3 and BE regular season champion as well as BE Tournament Champion ends up on the same seed line as UConn and one line lower than Baylor.

UConn 25-8, 13-7 and lost to Marquette 2x.
Baylor 22-10, 11-7 and lost to Marquette by 30.

I get it, and I know it doesn't work this way, but I've said this before and I'll say it until I'm blue in the face...
Sometimes we get too bogged down by numbers, by data, by computers, and we all become robots to what the next guy is saying and what the computer is spitting out.

Marquette is a 2 seed, and if they aren't, it's a shame on that Committee.
When they win tomorrow it'll help all bracketologists "save face" because many will quickly move Marquette to the 2 line before the Selection Show on Sunday.

Honestly, I wouldn't be at all shocked to see BOTH Marquette and Gonzaga on the 2 line, but I think Gonzaga is a bigger stretch than Marquette.

When Marquette wins tomorrow night they will solidify their spot as a 2 seed. Even if they don't, they should be a 2 seed.
If not, that's a shame on the Committee.

Well said Dr. V!! 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Can't wait to hear the head of the committee answer how Marquette, 28-6, 17-3 and BE regular season champion as well as BE Tournament Champion ends up on the same seed line as UConn and one line lower than Baylor.

UConn 25-8, 13-7 and lost to Marquette 2x.
Baylor 22-10, 11-7 and lost to Marquette by 30.

I get it, and I know it doesn't work this way, but I've said this before and I'll say it until I'm blue in the face...
Sometimes we get too bogged down by numbers, by data, by computers, and we all become robots to what the next guy is saying and what the computer is spitting out.

Marquette is a 2 seed, and if they aren't, it's a shame on that Committee.
When they win tomorrow it'll help all bracketologists "save face" because many will quickly move Marquette to the 2 line before the Selection Show on Sunday.

Honestly, I wouldn't be at all shocked to see BOTH Marquette and Gonzaga on the 2 line, but I think Gonzaga is a bigger stretch than Marquette.

When Marquette wins tomorrow night they will solidify their spot as a 2 seed. Even if they don't, they should be a 2 seed.
If not, that's a shame on the Committee.

You're getting caught up in what you feel we deserve. You are right, we do deserve a 2 seed. The problem is, 13 teams deserve a top 2 seed. 4 of them will get 1 seeds, leaving 9 teams deserving of a 2 seeds fighting for only 4 spots.

All that being said, I do think we now have the better resume than Arizona. Problem is, that didn't happen until after the committee set the top 2 seed lines. Historically, the committee hasn't allowed for much movement after that point. Maybe this is the year that changes. Of course, Arizona could beat UCLA and that would probably push their resume back above ours.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Sam Houston State and Utah Valley both get upset in the WAC tourney. Winner of Grand Canyon/Southern Utah to get the autobid. Sam Houston or Utah Valley like would have been seeded on the 13 line. These two will likely be on the 14 line or lower, making the winner a possible first round opponent for MU.

UC Irvine also went down. Winner of UCSB and CSU Fullerton also likely going to end up on the 14/15 seed line.

[MarquetteMike1977]

Today Joe Lunardi has Marquette as a #3 Seed playing #14 Seed Furman in Columbus with the #6 Seed being Miami

[DoctorV]

Sam Houston State and Utah Valley both get upset in the WAC tourney. Winner of Grand Canyon/Southern Utah to get the autobid. Sam Houston or Utah Valley like would have been seeded on the 13 line. These two will likely be on the 14 line or lower, making the winner a possible first round opponent for MU.

UC Irvine also went down. Winner of UCSB and CSU Fullerton also likely going to end up on the 14/15 seed line.

Those are both good results for the high seeds that would've faced them.
Sam Houston State especially, they were a mid 60s KenPom team with a top 20 D and 320 tempo. That type of team woulda been a nightmare for whoever they faced

[wisblue]

I think some of the people complaining about the seeding of the Big 12 teams are forgetting that Marquette was a beneficiary of the treatment of teams from strong conferences with strong schedules when they played in the old Big East when the conference would get more than half of its 14 teams in the tournament.

Then when teams with better records would come up, MU fans wouldn't hesitate to say "who have they played."

Comparing teams with dramatically different schedules is always going to lead to differences of opinion. There are no trophies awarded for what seed a team gets. Getting worked up about whether a team is an X seed or an x-1 seed never made sense to me.

[lawdog77]

Field of 68 After dark stated Committee Chair Chris Reynolds said 6 or 7 teams still being considered for the 1 line. They discussed if Marquette might be that 7th team

[1SE]

Agreed Doc. 

Looking at these results.

         since Feb  14     
1   Alabama     1   5-2      2 losses,  ranked 12 and 24
2   houston      1   7-0
3   purdue       1.  4-2   2 losses to unranked teams
4   Kansas       1   6-1. 
5   Texas         2   4-2.  2 losses ranked 7 and 22
6   arizona       2   4- 2.  2 losses unranked and 4 th.
7   Baylor        2   2-4.  4 losses. #3,#11, and unranked    Loss to Iowa St
8   UCLA          2   7-0
9   Tennesee    3   3-4  4 losses. #23,#24, and unranked. Loss to miss
10. Virginia      3   6-2  2 losses. Both unranked
11.  Iowa St     3   2-4   4 losses.  #3, #22, #9, and 2 unranked
12.  Kansas St  3   4-3  3 losses to unranked teams.
13   Indiana      4   2-3   3 losses to unranked teams.
14   Marquette  4   7-0
15   Gonzaga    4   7-0
16   Xavier        4   4-2


Someone, somewhere has to say, " this computer output, does not compute". I think both MU and Gonzaga are 2 seeds. 

1 seeds.  Houston,Kansas, UCLA, Alabama?
2 seeds Purdue, Texas, MU, Gonzaga
3 seeds. Baylor, Az,UCONN, KAN ST

Yeah - WTF is going on in Bracket world - most now have Gonzaga ahead of MU.

If we were ahead of them are reveal and this has happened since

MU:

X (19 - Home - Q1)
CU (16 - Away Q1A)
DP (163 - Home - Q4)
Butler (133 - Away - Q2)
SJU (99 - Home - Q3
SJU (99 - N - Q2)
UCONN (8 - N - Q1A)

Zags:

LMU (107 - Away - Q2)
Pepperdine (201 - H - Q4)
San Diego (230 - H - Q4)
Saint Mary's (11 - H - Q1A)
Chicago St (299 - H - Q4)
San Francisco (108 - N - Q3)
Saint Mary's (11 - N - Q1A)

So MU has 2 Q1A wins (against different team), another Q1 win, 2 Q2, 1 Q3 and 1Q4

While Zag has 2 Q1A wins (against same team), 0 Q1a, 1 Q2,  1 Q3 and 3 Q4 wins.

Maybe brackets aren't update - but pleass TAMU and Brew - tell me how Zag would move ahead of MU?

http://www.bracketmatrix.com/

[Ellenson Guerrero]

I don't know whether we'll be on the two or three line, but I'll be very pissed if Baylor is ahead of us. There is no way to justify that at this point.

[The Sultan]

Not all the brackets have been updated since last night, so the UConn will may not even be playing a role.

[MuggsyB]

Marquette has won 13/14 and avenged that loss last night.  Dr. V''s points are spot on.  There are three teams fighting for two spots:  MU, Zona, and Gonzaga.  There is a zero % chance Baylor is a #2:seed.  I am biased but even if Zona beats UCLA the committee will not slot Gonzaga ahead of MU if we slam the door today because they beat SMC twice.

[lawdog77]

I don't get the people who say "the committee has already made up their minds on the top 16 seeding and are focusing on the bubble teams". I guarantee they have time for both. Especially today. There are very few bubble teams alive, as opposed to the multitude of teams trying to get to the 1,2 or 3 seed lines. They have computer programs to make sure the criteria is met on who they can play, as well. What else do they have to do. Too cold to play golf.

[CountryRoads]

I don't know whether we'll be on the two or three line, but I'll be very pissed if Baylor is ahead of us. There is no way to justify that at this point.

I would as well but if it happens I'd at least like the committee to answer for it, though the question would never be asked. Seth Davis will be too focused on why 100% of the Big12 isn't included and why the Badgers weren't selected.

[MuggsyB]

I don't get the people who say "the committee has already made up their minds on the top 16 seeding and are focusing on the bubble teams". I guarantee they have time for both. Especially today. There are very few bubble teams alive, as opposed to the multitude of teams trying to get to the 1,2 or 3 seed lines. They have computer programs to make sure the criteria is met on who they can play, as well. What else do they have to do. Too cold to play golf.

Exactly.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I don't get the people who say "the committee has already made up their minds on the top 16 seeding and are focusing on the bubble teams". I guarantee they have time for both. Especially today. There are very few bubble teams alive, as opposed to the multitude of teams trying to get to the 1,2 or 3 seed lines. They have computer programs to make sure the criteria is met on who they can play, as well. What else do they have to do. Too cold to play golf.

Because historically they haven't valued conference tournaments and haven't moved teams much as a result.

Now personally I don't think that's right,  I think conference tournaments should count just as any other game counts. As much crap as we gave Buzz for his manifesto last season,  I do think he should have gotten in to the tournament last year

[panda]

They won't be. Probably FAU -2.5 or so. I'd lean UAB.

Uab -1.5 tonight

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Yeah - WTF is going on in Bracket world - most now have Gonzaga ahead of MU.

If we were ahead of them are reveal and this has happened since

MU:

X (19 - Home - Q1)
CU (16 - Away Q1A)
DP (163 - Home - Q4)
Butler (133 - Away - Q2)
SJU (99 - Home - Q3
SJU (99 - N - Q2)
UCONN (8 - N - Q1A)

Zags:

LMU (107 - Away - Q2)
Pepperdine (201 - H - Q4)
San Diego (230 - H - Q4)
Saint Mary's (11 - H - Q1A)
Chicago St (299 - H - Q4)
San Francisco (108 - N - Q3)
Saint Mary's (11 - N - Q1A)

So MU has 2 Q1A wins (against different team), another Q1 win, 2 Q2, 1 Q3 and 1Q4

While Zag has 2 Q1A wins (against same team), 0 Q1a, 1 Q2,  1 Q3 and 3 Q4 wins.

Maybe brackets aren't update - but pleass TAMU and Brew - tell me how Zag would move ahead of MU?

http://www.bracketmatrix.com/

Three things.  One bracketmatrix.com hasn't updated so the UConn game isn't counted there.

Two,  the Zags got their conference tournament games in before the committee seeded the top few lines. It sucks but historically the committee doesn't give much if any weight to games after that point. Having your conference tournament earlier is an advantage.

Three, I think Gonzaga may be a case where all their other metrics were great but they were missing Q1 wins.  Since they addressed the biggest hole in their resume,  they got a bigger jump.

All that being said,  I personally think our resume is superior to Gonzagas. I hope the committee does too.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Marquette has won 13/14 and avenged that loss last night.  Dr. V''s points are spot on.  There are three teams fighting for two spots:  MU, Zona, and Gonzaga.  There is a zero % chance Baylor is a #2:seed.  I am biased but even if Zona beats UCLA the committee will not slot Gonzaga ahead of MU if we slam the door today because they beat SMC twice.

Muggsy, Baylor is in that mix. It's 4 teams for 2 spots. I know you can't get that 26 point beat down out of your head but they've had a really good season deserving of a 2 seed. So have we.  Let's win tonight and give the committee a really difficult decision.

[1SE]

Muggsy, Baylor is in that mix. It's 4 teams for 2 spots. I know you can't get that 26 point beat down out of your head but they've had a really good season deserving of a 2 seed. So have we.  Let's win tonight and give the committee a really difficult decision.

The Baylor love is so puzzling - a team that was 7 on the curve at the reveal and has lost 4 times since.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

The Baylor love is so puzzling - a team that was 7 on the curve at the reveal and has lost 4 times since.

Has lost 4 times.... in 3 Q1A games and 1 Q1B game. Losing Q1 games doesn't move you down on the S curve. They also won a Q1A game and a Q1B game. Winning Q1 games moves you up the S curve. They either strengthened their resume or at least stood pat since the reveal.

We have made great strides since the reveal but had a lot of ground to cover.  It's very close now

[MU82]

I blame Shaka. We shoulda beaten 'em by 27.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

And I'll echo what Wisblue said. If we switched resumes with Baylor, yall would be screaming about them not having enough Q1 games and too weak of a SOS