Armed intruder

[NCMUFan]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/armed-intruder-disguised-as-police-officer-is-shot-killed-by-resident-pa-cops-say/ar-AAWlbUY?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=18ef0839df0b45cfb84aed4e7467bcee

[The Sultan]

Did you think you were posting to Nextdoor?

[NCMUFan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dykaJjegDEY

[MU82]

Toddler fatally shoots 4-year-old sister at Pennsylvania gas station:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-fatally-shoots-4-year-old-sister-pennsylvania-gas-station-rcna23130

Illinois mother killed by her 3-year-old son playing with gun in grocery store parking lot:

https://abc7.com/mother-killed-by-child-accidental-shooting-dejah-bennet-toddler-shoots-mom/11651498/

Texas toddler shoots mom, baby sibling in Walmart parking lot:

https://globalnews.ca/news/8493684/toddler-shoots-mother-sibling-texas-walmart/

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Toddler fatally shoots 4-year-old sister at Pennsylvania gas station:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-fatally-shoots-4-year-old-sister-pennsylvania-gas-station-rcna23130

Illinois mother killed by her 3-year-old son playing with gun in grocery store parking lot:

https://abc7.com/mother-killed-by-child-accidental-shooting-dejah-bennet-toddler-shoots-mom/11651498/

Texas toddler shoots mom, baby sibling in Walmart parking lot:

https://globalnews.ca/news/8493684/toddler-shoots-mother-sibling-texas-walmart/

Your obsession with toddler shootings is creepy AF.

[Babybluejeans]

Your obsession with toddler shootings is creepy AF.

The fact that toddler shootings exist at all is even spookier.

[NCMUFan]

Other dangers with children would be:
   Access to lighters and matches (fires)
   Around water deeper then themselves (drownings)
   Bathtubs filled with water and electric appliances nearby (electrocution)
   Abductions
   and probably many others
It is very sad when children are just being children but do not understand the dangers.

[Jockey]

Your obsession with toddler shootings is creepy AF.

And your obsession with 82 is normal?

[Jockey]

Other dangers with children would be:
   Access to lighters and matches (fires)
   Around water deeper then themselves (drownings)
   Bathtubs filled with water and electric appliances nearby (electrocution)
   Abductions
   and probably many others
It is very sad when children are just being children but do not understand the dangers.

The main purpose of matches, water, and appliances is NOT to kill people.

[NCMUFan]

Like anything, things can be abused.
Ask the good folks in Waukesha.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Other dangers with children would be:
   Access to lighters and matches (fires)
   Around water deeper then themselves (drownings)
   Bathtubs filled with water and electric appliances nearby (electrocution)
   Abductions
   and probably many others
It is very sad when children are just being children but do not understand the dangers. and their adult caretakers do not take proper care of their firearms.

FIFY

The differences with your list and 82's is that other than the matches/lighters, the child is only going to harm itself (which is still tragic). With guns, they can harm themselves and others. My guess is that child/firearm accidents are also more common than fires set by children where someone is significantly harmed, as well as more common than electrocution and I would guess about as common as drownings. These are guesses though so I could be wrong. Also, the main purpose of the items on your list is not to cause harm. The only purpose of a weapon is to cause harm.

Guns in rare instances can deter a crime like a home invasion. They are more likely to result in the death/injury of someone in the house. Most times they result in neither.

[MU82]

FIFY

The differences with your list and 82's is that other than the matches/lighters, the child is only going to harm itself (which is still tragic). With guns, they can harm themselves and others. My guess is that child/firearm accidents are also more common than fires set by children where someone is significantly harmed, as well as more common than electrocution and I would guess about as common as drownings. These are guesses though so I could be wrong. Also, the main purpose of the items on your list is not to cause harm. The only purpose of a weapon is to cause harm.

Guns in rare instances can deter a crime like a home invasion. They are more likely to result in the death/injury of someone in the house. Most times they result in neither.

Nah. The only way to stop a bad toddler with a gun is a good toddler with a gun.

[wadesworld]

Moral of the story, people don't follow laws so we need to become a lawless society.

Imagine how terrified some people on here would be to leave their houses if there were no laws.

Heck, you're not safe IN your houses.  Breaking and entering?  Not a crime.  Homicide?  Legal!  Arson?  Have at it!

[Pakuni]

Moral of the story, people don't follow laws so we need to become a lawless society.

Imagine how terrified some people on here would be to leave their houses if there were no laws.

Heck, you're not safe IN your houses.  Breaking and entering?  Not a crime.  Homicide?  Legal!  Arson?  Have at it!

The only solution is The Purge.

[JWags85]

Nah. The only way to stop a bad toddler with a gun is a good toddler with a gun.

I don't disagree with your general premise, but do you ever get tired of repeating the exact same absurd hyperbole over and over?

[jficke13]

I predict many participants here will find their ideological rivals to be persuasive and enlightening. Many, if not all, will change their minds and be persuaded by the civil debate and many anecdotes shared.

Truly, an inspiration on these internets.

[rocky_warrior]

I predict many participants here will find their ideological rivals to be persuasive and enlightening. Many, if not all, will change their minds and be persuaded by the civil debate and many anecdotes shared.

Truly, an inspiration on these internets.

+1

[JWags85]

I predict many participants here will find their ideological rivals to be persuasive and enlightening. Many, if not all, will change their minds and be persuaded by the civil debate and many anecdotes shared.

Truly, an inspiration on these internets.

I don't know about you, but I never decide any personal ideological position until Ive heard anonymous internet posters wax poetically.  Only then can I truly feel justified in my beliefs.

[tower912]

I don't disagree with your general premise, but do you ever get tired of repeating the exact same absurd hyperbole over and over?

Probably no more so that 4never, roqqet, etc.

[JWags85]

Probably no more so that 4never, roqqet, etc.

I wasn't talking about general topics or points.  I meant the specific "More toddlers with guns, FREEDOM"  "The only solution is everyone needs a gun, AMERICA!".  Like literal parroting of the same sentence, with maybe a slight differentiation.

Rocket posts the same premise, but in some always shifting multi paragraph eye rolling diatribe.

One you can play Scoop Bingo with on a weekly basis.  The other gives you a migraine.

[buckchuckler]

FIFY

The differences with your list and 82's is that other than the matches/lighters, the child is only going to harm itself (which is still tragic). With guns, they can harm themselves and others. My guess is that child/firearm accidents are also more common than fires set by children where someone is significantly harmed, as well as more common than electrocution and I would guess about as common as drownings. These are guesses though so I could be wrong. Also, the main purpose of the items on your list is not to cause harm. The only purpose of a weapon is to cause harm.

Guns in rare instances can deter a crime like a home invasion. They are more likely to result in the death/injury of someone in the house. Most times they result in neither.

This keeps coming up and it made me curious.  This is from the CDC...

Although definitions of defensive gun use vary, it is generally defined as the use of a firearm to protect and defend one's self, family, others, and/or property against crime or victimization.

Estimates of defensive gun use vary depending on the questions asked, populations studied, timeframe, and other factors related to the design of studies. The report Priorities for Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence external icon indicates a range of 60,000 to 2.5 million defensive gun uses each year.

The CDC (for 2019 so a bit old -- these numbers have likely gone up) cites about 16K non-suicide deaths from firearms. 

https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/firearms/fastfact.html

[tower912]

I wasn't talking about general topics or points.  I meant the specific "More toddlers with guns, FREEDOM"  "The only solution is everyone needs a gun, AMERICA!".  Like literal parroting of the same sentence, with maybe a slight differentiation.

Rocket posts the same premise, but in some always shifting multi paragraph eye rolling diatribe.

One you can play Scoop Bingo with on a weekly basis.  The other gives you a migraine.

Which is which?

[ZiggysFryBoy]

I don't disagree with your general premise, but do you ever get tired of repeating the exact same absurd hyperbole over and over?

I think he's trying to be funny.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

This keeps coming up and it made me curious.  This is from the CDC...

The CDC (for 2019 so a bit old -- these numbers have likely gone up) cites about 16K non-suicide deaths from firearms. 

https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/firearms/fastfact.html

So it's not from the CDC. The CDC links to a 2013 study and interestingly, when you click on the link on the CDC website, this is what comes up:

"Links with this icon  indicate that you are leaving the CDC website.
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) cannot attest to the accuracy of a non-federal website.
Linking to a non-federal website does not constitute an endorsement by CDC or any of its employees of the sponsors or the information and products presented on the website.
You will be subject to the destination website's privacy policy when you follow the link.
CDC is not responsible for Section 508 compliance (accessibility) on other federal or private website."

I tried to read the linked study but it's behind a paywall. I'd need to understand what the study is defining as "defensive gun use" before make a judgement. I'd be very surprised to learn that there were 60,000-2.5 million incidents a year where a crime was occurring and then stopped because someone brandished a firearm. That's a rate of 164.38 to 6,849.32 incidents a day. At the higher rate, that means virtually every gun owner in the US should be experiencing a crime that they stop with their firearm every few years.

Also keep in mind that I said death/injury, not non-suicide death. So you have to include all of the suicides and non-fatal injuries as well.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Moral of the story, people don't follow laws so we need to become a lawless society.

Yes indeed, the Wisdom of Ziggy. Who could be against such flawless logic?