The War in Ukraine

[MuggsyB]

This also further illustrates that 0.0 deals whatsoever should be put on the table.  As someone wrote in the WSJ today, Ukraine has to win this because  Putin's ambitions will never change. He wants a Soviet empire, period.  He has now broken Article 5.and continues to demonstrate his scumbaggery. 

[🏀]

This also further illustrates that 0.0 deals whatsoever should be put on the table.  As someone wrote in the WSJ today, Ukraine has to win this because  Putin's ambitions will never change. He wants a Soviet empire, period.  He has now broken Article 5.and continues to demonstrate his scumbaggery. 

Very fine people on both sides.

[MU82]

Putin is still the bad guy.

Tucker strongly disagrees.

[MuggsyB]

Tucker strongly disagrees.

Which means he's an imbecile

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Makes one wonder whether it was intentional, Putin trying to goad NATO into aggressive moves in order to shore up his own flagging support at home, or whether it was standard Russian in competence.

It will also be interesting to see what the GOP House does in terms of support for Ukraine. The loud mouth pro-Putin faction has already said they won't support any money for Ukraine, but I think there are enough GOP House Members to still pass additional support bills, presuming McCarthy (again, presumably) allows a vote.

[MuggsyB]

Makes one wonder whether it was intentional, Putin trying to goad NATO into aggressive moves in order to shore up his own flagging support at home, or whether it was standard Russian in competence.

It will also be interesting to see what the GOP House does in terms of support for Ukraine. The loud mouth pro-Putin faction has already said they won't support any money for Ukraine, but I think there are enough GOP House Members to still pass additional support bills, presuming McCarthy (again, presumably) allows a vote.

My guess is it was an accident but it demonstrates how incompetent his military is which is obviously dangerous.  Fortify the Polish border immediately.

[tower912]

Tucker strongly disagrees.

I assume that to be the case in most things.   I am able to manage my disappointment.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

My guess is it was an accident but it demonstrates how incompetent his military is which is obviously dangerous.  Fortify the Polish border immediately.

I am seeing reports that possibly Ukrainian missile defenses may have knocked the incoming missiles off course. Not confirmed.

[MU82]

I am seeing reports that possibly Ukrainian missile defenses may have knocked the incoming missiles off course. Not confirmed.

What does the police scanner in Doc Dribble's basement have to say about the situation?

[The Sultan]

Makes one wonder whether it was intentional, Putin trying to goad NATO into aggressive moves in order to shore up his own flagging support at home, or whether it was standard Russian in competence.

I am pretty sure it would be incompetence because anything to get NATO more involved would not go well for Putin at all.

[JWags85]

I am seeing reports that possibly Ukrainian missile defenses may have knocked the incoming missiles off course. Not confirmed.

That would make sense.  Beyond the huge ramifications of bringing Poland into it, just look at a map.  This was a village of 400 people in the middle of nowhere, an hour plus from any major settlement (and that settlement is smaller than Waukesha).  There is zero to be gained from wasting missiles into a place like that, even if someone was into wanton violence and war crimes.

However, its not terribly far (~100 km) from Lviv if missiles were launched from Belarus or the like

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

That would make sense.  Beyond the huge ramifications of bringing Poland into it, just look at a map.  This was a village of 400 people in the middle of nowhere, an hour plus from any major settlement (and that settlement is smaller than Waukesha).  There is zero to be gained from wasting missiles into a place like that, even if someone was into wanton violence and war crimes.

However, its not terribly far (~100 km) from Lviv if missiles were launched from Belarus or the like

Russia is already wasting missiles it doesn't have on civilian targets in Ukraine instead of military targets.  It's another symptom why they are losing this war badly.  There will be a NATO response but probably measured.

[JWags85]

Russia is already wasting missiles it doesn't have on civilian targets in Ukraine instead of military targets.  It's another symptom why they are losing this war badly.  There will be a NATO response but probably measured.

There is a difference between firing missiles into a civilian target of a country/people you're trying to takeover and/or intimidate...and into a sparsely populated farm village in the middle of nowhere.  That doesn't intimidate Poland, it would just be a WTF

[🏀]

Missiles are missiles, poles were killed.

Accident? Probably.

NATO response is still required.

[withoutbias]

Missiles don't kill people, people kill people.

How'd I do?

[forgetful]

Missiles are missiles, poles were killed.

Accident? Probably.

NATO response is still required.

A NATO response would be moronic, that is how broader wars start. Assuredly an accident, just like we accidentally bombed Bulgaria.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/1999/apr/30/richardnortontaylor.kateconnolly

And we bombed a Chinese Embassy.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-48134881

[MU82]

Missiles are missiles, poles were killed.

Accident? Probably.

NATO response is still required.

What response would you consider appropriate?

[The Sultan]

AP reporting that it looks like these were defense missels fired by Ukraine.

[🏀]

What response would you consider appropriate?

Nothing short of nuclear, but sounds like it wasn't Putin. We can stop pretending.

[MuggsyB]

So it was a Ukranian missile that went astray?  Okay.......weird. 

[The Sultan]

So it was a Ukranian missile that went astray?  Okay.......weird. 

If the Russians were shooting at Lviv, which is about 50 miles from where the missile came down in Poland, it is easy to see how a Ukrainian defense missile can go off course.

[RJax55]

So it was a Ukranian missile that went astray?  Okay.......weird.

Not really. Given the amount of air defense the Ukrainians are deploying for these missile attacks, I'm surprised it hasn't occurred earlier in the war. The same goes for Russian missiles. At some point, one is bound to fail and go off course hitting a target outside of Ukraine.

[MU82]

Nothing short of nuclear.

Exactly. If Putin HAD done something like this, we'd have expressed outrage, put pressure on Russia's allies, try to punish them more financially, give more weapons to Poland and other NATO countries, etc.

But unless Putin goes nuclear, we're not going to even think about responding militarily. Nor should we.

[🏀]

Exactly. If Putin HAD done something like this, we'd have expressed outrage, put pressure on Russia's allies, try to punish them more financially, give more weapons to Poland and other NATO countries, etc.

But unless Putin goes nuclear, we're not going to even think about responding militarily. Nor should we.

If it was Putin, any NATO weapon would be available to Ukraine.

Any actual aggression towards the Poles should be matched ten-fold, but let's be honest, the guy has his hands full with Ukraine.

[MU82]

Any actual aggression towards the Poles should be matched ten-fold, but let's be honest, the guy has his hands full with Ukraine.

Not sure one can apply logic to the thinking of a megalomaniacal dictator, but I hear what you're saying.