Golf 2022

[MuggsyB]

I'm not the least bit concerned. It didn't affect the way I watched the majors, or my enjoyment level of them, nor do I think it will in the future. And I'd say I'm a fairly typical golf fan.

It's early in the process.   If other top 10 players bolt It's really bad for the game. 

[Uncle Rico]

I am not worried about defections. The majors and OWGR are rallying behind PGA Tour.
I think defection will fit into the same categories that have signed with LIV so far:
Over The Hill Stars - most recent example Bubba Watson

Body Broken- Brooks Koepka , DeCharcuterie

Young NCAA stars that have not yet made tour

So far the only two top quality players have been DJ and Reed .

The rest are filler to make the field .

No TV sponsor and no tournament sponsors yet. If those happen then there might be some staying power. For now I think it only lasts through next season

I don't like Cam Smith bolting and he's taking Leishman with him.  Cantlay is rumored, too. 

Losing the Aussies hurts. 

[MuggsyB]

I don't like Cam Smith bolting and he's taking Leishman with him.  Cantlay is rumored, too. 

Losing the Aussies hurts.

I don't either.  Cantlay leaving would suck as well.

[Uncle Rico]

I don't either.  Cantlay leaving would suck as well.

Sounds like Niemann and Pereira are bolting as well, so you're losing two good young South Americans.  I don't think Niemann has lasting power with his swing but he's got a good 5 year stretch in him, ala Jason Day

[MuggsyB]

Sounds like Niemann and Pereira are bolting as well, so you're losing two good young South Americans.  I don't think Niemann has lasting power with his swing but he's got a good 5 year stretch in him, ala Jason Day

Absolutely.  Both have serious game.  The whole thing stinks to high heaven. 

[cheebs09]

I think it's less about how much each player brings in viewers and more about the overall field. Part of the reason tournaments are prestigious and bring in ratings is due to deep fields.

I think if enough guys leave and you have John Deere Classic level fields plus Rory, JT, and Finau, you definitely will see an impact.

[MuggsyB]

I think it's less about how much each player brings in viewers and more about the overall field. Part of the reason tournaments are prestigious and bring in ratings is due to deep fields.

I think if enough guys leave and you have John Deere Classic level fields plus Rory, JT, and Finau, you definitely will see an impact.

Yep.  But also if you are playing LIV, even if you're allowed to play the Majors, it's pretty likely your game is going to drop a level with the lack of real competition.  This is absolutely horrible from a competitive and historical standpoint for golf, at least in the short-term. 

[Spaniel with a Short Tail]

If they resign from the PGAT, they can requalify again after one year. Many of the earliest defectors resigned, which now appears to be a solid move.

Has anyone who went LIV tried to go back to the PGAT, whether resigned or was suspended?

[RJax55]

Sounds like Niemann and Pereira are bolting as well, so you're losing two good young South Americans.  I don't think Niemann has lasting power with his swing but he's got a good 5 year stretch in him, ala Jason Day

Losing the top flight international players is going to hurt. Especially from a sponsorship angle. I'm assuming that Hideki goes to LIV as well after the Fed Ex Playoff.

The Tour has been able to keep the best Americans sans DJ and Bryson. Reed sucks, so he doesn't qualify in my eyes. And, Brooks passion for the game looks to be about zero, so not much of a loss there. But, losing all these internationals is becoming a problem.

[RJax55]

Has anyone who went LIV tried to go back to the PGAT, whether resigned or was suspended?

Not yet. Too early in the game. I'm sure it will happen sometime next year as LIV continues to add players.

[Herman Cain]

Sounds like Niemann and Pereira are bolting as well, so you're losing two good young South Americans.  I don't think Niemann has lasting power with his swing but he's got a good 5 year stretch in him, ala Jason Day

I read somewhere that LIV was expanding their team size to 6. 4 playing and two alternate, so maybe Sergio recruited Niemann and Pereira to be on his all Spanish speaking team.

[Uncle Rico]

I read somewhere that LIV was expanding their team size to 6. 4 playing and two alternate, so maybe Sergio recruited Niemann and Pereira to be on his all Spanish speaking team.

Sergio is a born loser

[Uncle Rico]

Cameron Young also going to LIV.  That's a tough loss, too

[MuggsyB]

Cameron Young also going to LIV.  That's a tough loss, too

Not good.  Not good at all

[MU82]

I'm having a hard time getting all worked up about this.

Maybe that's because I watch the majors and just about nothing else. It also might be because that, eventually, these start-up leagues (in various sports) either fizzle out and die or end up merging with the established entity.

I feel confident in saying that I'll never watch a LIV event. But then again, I don't watch most PGA Tour events. And I don't see how this would affect my enjoyment of the Masters or U.S. Open.

But for those who really follow pro golf and enjoy watching many or most events, I can see how this would suck.

[Uncle Rico]

Not good.  Not good at all

Appears this may not be true

[MuggsyB]

Appears this may not be true

Hmmmmm.....okay.

[tower912]

Loop Red and Forest Dunes today.   Loop Black tomorrow.

[RJax55]

I'm having a hard time getting all worked up about this.

Maybe that's because I watch the majors and just about nothing else. It also might be because that, eventually, these start-up leagues (in various sports) either fizzle out and die or end up merging with the established entity.

I feel confident in saying that I'll never watch a LIV event. But then again, I don't watch most PGA Tour events. And I don't see how this would affect my enjoyment of the Masters or U.S. Open.

But for those who really follow pro golf and enjoy watching many or most events, I can see how this would suck.

I get your point, however I think it is short-sided.

First, LIV is not your typical challenger league where the market (media deal, sponsorships, ticket sales) is dictating it's staying power. It is a government program, a long-term play with an open check book accountable to only one man. It is here to stay unfortunately.

In addition, what's happening in the professional game between LIV and The Tour will make an impact on the major championships. The majors can't hide from it. For one, the majors could ban LIV players. While I don't think that will happen, it would definitely diminish the quality of the field if it did. Even if a blanket ban doesn't occur, LIV guys are likely to have issues qualifying for some of the majors due to issues related OWGR points. If that happens, will Norman and LIV claim these majors are illegitimated? Norman wants to burn pro golf to the ground, I wouldn't put this past him. Suffice to say, not a good situation.

Furthermore, even if the LIV guys are playing in the majors, the whole LIV vs. The Tour arguments are going to suck the oxygen right out of the events. While the rivalry might add some fireworks to the first few events, I think it will quickly spiral down over time. The focus will be on the two tours, not the actually event taking place or the individuals battling for the title. This won't be good for the majors, nor the viewer. Another negative.

Finally, the split between LIV and The Tour I believe will diminish the interest in pro golf over time. Pro golf is a niche sport to begin with and splitting the talent pool is not the way to gain viewers. Also, after seeing what happened at the LIV Bedminster event I'm not sure LIV is even trying to really court a broader audience. They are saying one thing, but their actions are telling a different story.

The majors will always have their place in American sports and with casual sports fans. However, I don't see how having a smaller and less interested core audience will be a good thing for the Masters, The Open, etc. What's happening will undoubtedly bleed into the majors and I just don't see how that will be a positive.

[Herman Cain]

I'm having a hard time getting all worked up about this.

Maybe that's because I watch the majors and just about nothing else. It also might be because that, eventually, these start-up leagues (in various sports) either fizzle out and die or end up merging with the established entity.

I feel confident in saying that I'll never watch a LIV event. But then again, I don't watch most PGA Tour events. And I don't see how this would affect my enjoyment of the Masters or U.S. Open.

But for those who really follow pro golf and enjoy watching many or most events, I can see how this would suck.

I get your point, however I think it is short-sided.

First, LIV is not your typical challenger league where the market (media deal, sponsorships, ticket sales) is dictating it's staying power. It is a government program, a long-term play with an open check book accountable to only one man. It is here to stay unfortunately.

In addition, what's happening in the professional game between LIV and The Tour will make an impact on the major championships. The majors can't hide from it. For one, the majors could ban LIV players. While I don't think that will happen, it would definitely diminish the quality of the field if it did. Even if a blanket ban doesn't occur, LIV guys are likely to have issues qualifying for some of the majors due to issues related OWGR points. If that happens, will Norman and LIV claim these majors are illegitimated? Norman wants to burn pro golf to the ground, I wouldn't put this past him. Suffice to say, not a good situation.

Furthermore, even if the LIV guys are playing in the majors, the whole LIV vs. The Tour arguments are going to suck the oxygen right out of the events. While the rivalry might add some fireworks to the first few events, I think it will quickly spiral down over time. The focus will be on the two tours, not the actually event taking place or the individuals battling for the title. This won't be good for the majors, nor the viewer. Another negative.

Finally, the split between LIV and The Tour I believe will diminish the interest in pro golf over time. Pro golf is a niche sport to begin with and splitting the talent pool is not the way to gain viewers. Also, after seeing what happened at the LIV Bedminster event I'm not sure LIV is even trying to really court a broader audience. They are saying one thing, but their actions are telling a different story.

The majors will always have their place in American sports and with casual sports fans. However, I don't see how having a smaller and less interested core audience will be a good thing for the Masters, The Open, etc. What's happening will undoubtedly bleed into the majors and I just don't see how that will be a positive.

Some very good points are being made about the average sports fan only folllowing the majors and golf  being a niche TV sport

I think there is a real chance the big dollar PGA Tour sponsors get fed up and slowly start to pull their commitments from the tour once their commitments expire .

Corporate entertainment budgets are looking for something exciting or new. PGA Tour could get old and stale quickly. Purses could go down etc

[MU82]

You could be right about a lot of that, RJax. I guess we'll see.

[🏀]

LIV guys aren't getting the invite postmarked from Washington Road.

Additionally, LIV will transform into a world tour, while PGAT becomes largely stateside. Meat eaters going to pretzel themselves into supporting the anti-American tour.

[Herman Cain]

Hope Zalatoris can hang on and earn his first PGA Tour victory

[MuggsyB]

Hope Zalatoris can hang on and earn his first PGA Tour victory

Z is exceedingly dangerous Herman if he can ever figure out his putter.  Tremendous ball striker.

[MuggsyB]

Sweet Jesus!  Perhaps I jinxed him.