New Frosh Class at MU

[The Sultan]

How are you going to recruit wealthy kids from the coasts to Marquette?  I'm not saying you can't, but its going to be costly.  I guess you could really lean on the Catholic mission and recruit kids from those schools, but that's a strategy they have been moving away from for decades.

There is plenty of wealth in the midwest, that is easier to recruit, than on the coasts.

[4everwarriors]

Need to up MU's academic game. USNWR score isn't going to attract rich flies. Middle of the road, aina?

[The Sultan]

Nobody really pays attention to USNWR rankings anymore.

[Porky's Butthole]

How are you going to recruit wealthy kids from the coasts to Marquette?  I'm not saying you can't, but its going to be costly.  I guess you could really lean on the Catholic mission and recruit kids from those schools, but that's a strategy they have been moving away from for decades.

There is plenty of wealth in the midwest, that is easier to recruit, than on the coasts.

The number of very wealthy kids from suburbs of Boston, NYC, Philly and DC that go to both public and private schools in the Midwest is staggering.   UMich, UWMad and IU in particular are way more popular in these places than all of the Northeastern flagships combined.  A lot of that is due to lifestyle, not academics.  No one there necessarily denies that UMASS and UCONN and the like are fine schools, but you can't compare the student experience there to going to Michigan or WI.  It's not even close, and these kids' families are paying out of state tuition.  Porky doesn't agree that it requires substantial investment, nor would Porky advocate that approach, but they could be doing more than they are.   Generally speaking it can be achieved through word of mouth and positive student experiences.   It's not just Big 10 schools though.   A lot of kids from the Northeast go to places like Beloit, McAlaster, Carleton, and Grinnel too.   This idea that MU can't compete isn't true but they have to be willing to make themselves more appealing to those types of students and their families, who Porky will be the first to acknowledge are snobbier about such matters.  Other new englanders on this board have all said similar things over the years but I don't think there are any MU administrators on here listening.

[4everwarriors]

Nobody really pays attention to USNWR rankings anymore.

I disagree, but no one has living on 15th and Kilbourn or smoozin' with the locals at Walgreens on their bucket list. Urban campuses were the thin' a few years ago. Not certain that's still the case, hey?

[The Sultan]

I disagree, but no one has living on 15th and Kilbourn or smoozin' with the locals at Walgreens on their bucket list. Urban campuses were the thin' a few years ago. Not certain that's still the case, hey?

Seriously people don't pay attention to rankings much at all these days. You can say you disagree but they have been declining in value for years.

[Disco Hippie]

Seriously people don't pay attention to rankings much at all these days. You can say you disagree but they have been declining in value for years.

I really want to agree with you Fluff, and I think they shouldn't but unfortunately they still do, at least in my area.  Probably not as much as they did 10-15 years ago, so I do think you're on to something that they're not quite as influential as they once were but most prospective students and their families still take them into account.  When my niece was deciding where to go to college a couple of years ago, her dad created a spreadsheet with all of the schools she was considering with about 5 columns including location, annual tuition, graduation rate, and US News Ranking so to him it was important enough to be included, but just one data point.  They weren't obsessed with it. 

I personally believe a lot of schools only went test optional to encourage more applications and boost their denial rate to look more exclusive.  These schools can deny it all they want but I still believe that's an ulterior motive of some of them.  The recent college admission scandal proves that rankings and prestige are still important and still matter.  If they didn't their parents wouldn't have been willing to break the law to get their kids into these places.  Sure one can dismiss that and say it only matters to a rarefied group of elitists.  That's fair enough but plenty of folks far less wealthy and influential still think rankings matter. 

What bothers me more than anything is the hypocrisy of our mutual alma-mater on this issue.   They're extremely dismissive of rankings when they don't fare well, but last year when Marquette was ranked 18th in undergraduate teaching, they shouted that from the rooftops and there was a link to the press release about it on the MU homepage for like 2 weeks after publication.  It's a great recognition and something to be proud of, so I have no problem with that at all.

Here's what I do have a problem with........If MU Administrators really believe that rankings don't matter and are destructive to higher education as several administrators are on the record with public statements to that effect, then why are all of their ranked programs acknowledged on their website at all?   If they really feel that way, MU shouldn't even acknowledge that these rankings exist. They should just continue to educate their students and let the college going public decide whether or not rankings matter for themselves.   Whether they want to admit it or not, rankings do matter and Marquette knows it.  Do they matter as it relates to student outcomes?   Probably not much if at all, but this thread is about enrollment and to deny rankings have an impact on enrollment is foolish.  Maybe it's not a significant impact but for an extremely tuition dependent institution like Marquette where an enrollment shortfall of as little as 25 students can have a noticeable negative impact on the budget, they need to pay more attention to them.

[79Warrior]

Seriously people don't pay attention to rankings much at all these days. You can say you disagree but they have been declining in value for years.

Totally disagree. You are kidding yourself.

[4everwarriors]

Seriously people don't pay attention to rankings much at all these days. You can say you disagree but they have been declining in value for years.

Rich folks care. They spend a lot of money on private college counselors, ACT prep, etc., hey?

[brewcity77]

Of course, I can get a hell of a good look at a T-Bone steak by sticking my head up a bull's ass, but I'd rather take the butcher's word for it.

--Big Tom Callahan

If we were talking dentistry, 4ever would be the butcher. But when it comes to how universities regard recruiting, FBM is the butcher, which makes the rest the bull's ass.

[The Sultan]

Totally disagree. You are kidding yourself.

Disco said it better.  They mean less now than they did 10-15 years ago and will mean even less in the future.  There are so many rankings on all sorts of factors, so every school can find some reason to brag about itself.  The marketplace recognizes this.

[MU82]

Rich folks care. They spend a lot of money on private college counselors, ACT prep, etc., hey?

There will always be rich people doing whatever they can to get their kids into Ivy League or "Ivy League-ish" schools, nu? Yale and Stanford and Dartmouth and Northwestern will always have cache.

One doesn't need magazine or online rankings to know that Harvard will be more attractive to many than Marquette or Miami or Maryland.

And below that level, I have no reason to believe that FBM is wrong about this:

They mean less now than they did 10-15 years ago and will mean even less in the future.  There are so many rankings on all sorts of factors, so every school can find some reason to brag about itself.  The marketplace recognizes this.

[muwarrior69]

I think Marquette doesn't care about quantity and is focusing on high priced areas like nursing, engineering and business.

Which can be had by going to community college for the first 2 years and graduating with your BS or BA at a 4 year state school for far less. My parents could afford to send me to Marquette back in the 60s; today no way.

[GOO]

Which can be had by going to community college for the first 2 years and graduating with your BS or BA at a 4 year state school for far less. My parents could afford to send me to Marquette back in the 60s; today no way.

And that is the bottom line.  Funds need to be raised towards sustainable scholarships to compete.  I really like the 31M donation to the nursing program for that reason.  Affordability is paramount to compete.

MU, like most schools, has to plan to be smaller and offer more scholarship opportunities. A lot of kids that would have ended up at MU now end up at state schools or where they get a great scholarship opportunity. I see this first hand in my own family. And yes, money and rankings come in to play big time, likely pushing or replacing, for many, the former importance of religion.  Ranking do matter. Acceptance rate does matter. It doesn't have to be logical to matter.

[Porky's Butthole]

Which can be had by going to community college for the first 2 years and graduating with your BS or BA at a 4 year state school for far less. My parents could afford to send me to Marquette back in the 60s; today no way.

Which is why it's so important that MU heed Forgetful's advice to become a lot more creative and aggressive in its national recruitment efforts.  Forgetful's way of thinking is sorely absent from the BOT and Alumni board.  Speaking of which, how does one get involved with the Alumni board and how much influence does MU's Alumni board have?  Do they have a representative on the BOT?  Last time Porky explored this, it seemed as though everyone on there bought their way in and the composition of the Alumni board was based almost exclusively on donations.  Porky could be wrong but that's what it seemed like after reading what little literature is available about it on MU's Alumni site.  Seriously does anyone know how this works?  Does one need to run for it or something?  If membership is based mostly on donations, Porky isn't a viable candidate since Porky's level of giving has been curtailed significantly in recent years due to a disagreement with MU's direction.   Not that it was ever substantial, but it was enough to the point where they noticed.   Porky has actually had discussions with some MU students and reps who called asking for money and Porky explained (as politely as possible) why Porky no longer gives except to Athletics.   In one case, Porky successfully convinced a student caller how MU was continuing to take steps to de-value their degree.  This student who worked part-time in MU's fundraising office to make some extra scratch also happened to be a journalism student on the MU Wire.  They agreed with Porky's assessment and did a whole series of Trib articles calling out administrators about these issues.   The amount of "no comments" from administrators in these articles was staggering, and it prompted even more solid reporting from student media.   Porky was very proud and still keeps in touch with this former student and now alum who has become quite successful in their field in fairly short order.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Which is why it's so important that MU heed Forgetful's advice to become a lot more creative and aggressive in its national recruitment efforts.  Forgetful's way of thinking is sorely absent from the BOT and Alumni board.  Speaking of which, how does one get involved with the Alumni board and how much influence does MU's Alumni board have?  Do they have a representative on the BOT?  Last time Porky explored this, it seemed as though everyone on there bought their way in and the composition of the Alumni board was based almost exclusively on donations.  Porky could be wrong but that's what it seemed like after reading what little literature is available about it on MU's Alumni site.  Seriously does anyone know how this works?  Does one need to run for it or something?  If membership is based mostly on donations, Porky isn't a viable candidate since Porky's level of giving has been curtailed significantly in recent years due to a disagreement with MU's direction.   Not that it was ever substantial, but it was enough to the point where they noticed.   Porky has actually had discussions with some MU students and reps who called asking for money and Porky explained (as politely as possible) why Porky no longer gives except to Athletics.   In one case, Porky successfully convinced a student caller how MU was continuing to take steps to de-value their degree.  This student who worked part-time in MU's fundraising office to make some extra scratch also happened to be a journalism student on the MU Wire.  They agreed with Porky's assessment and did a whole series of Trib articles calling out administrators about these issues.   The amount of "no comments" from administrators in these articles was staggering, and it prompted even more solid reporting from student media.   Porky was very proud and still keeps in touch with this former student and now alum who has become quite successful in their field in fairly short order.

Porky for president 2024.

Not enough buttholes in politics.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

FWIW, MU clocks in at 83 on the USNWR rankings.

[Galway Eagle]

FWIW, MU clocks in at 83 on the USNWR rankings.

Honestly better than I was expecting. Obviously not what I'm hoping for but a few bounces go our way and we don't have major mental errors then we might look decent enough

[muwarrior69]

And that is the bottom line.  Funds need to be raised towards sustainable scholarships to compete.  I really like the 31M donation to the nursing program for that reason.  Affordability is paramount to compete.

MU, like most schools, has to plan to be smaller and offer more scholarship opportunities. A lot of kids that would have ended up at MU now end up at state schools or where they get a great scholarship opportunity. I see this first hand in my own family. And yes, money and rankings come in to play big time, likely pushing or replacing, for many, the former importance of religion.  Ranking do matter. Acceptance rate does matter. It doesn't have to be logical to matter.

I was able to attend MU without a scholarship because a scholarship was not needed.

[The Sultan]

I was able to attend MU without a scholarship because a scholarship was not needed.

It's not 1969 any longer.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

I was able to attend MU without a scholarship because a scholarship was not needed.

I'm glad to hear you are for Bernie Sanders' plan for free college tuition for everyone.

[4everwarriors]

If its free, it's worth zero. Nothin's free, aina?

[🏀]

FWIW, MU clocks in at 83 on the USNWR rankings.

#83nation

[The Lens]

Can USNWR be bought?  If so, how much would it cost to be ranked 77th?

[Galway Eagle]

Can USNWR be bought?  If so, how much would it cost to be ranked 77th?

Is it worth it to move up 6 spots? I'd invest for a top 75 degree but no less.