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Author Topic: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules  (Read 10417 times)

Pakuni

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #50 on: June 25, 2021, 08:18:18 AM »
Let's remember the vast, vast majority of NCAA sports are huge costs to the schools. The schools do, and at great expense,  provide the opportunity and venue for the athletes to perform.

The issue seems to be that the NCAA is tasked with treating Duke basketball and South Dakota State swimming the same.

How does NIL affect this?
South Dakota State's swimming program won't be impacted one bit because some Duke basketball player gets $20K from Nike.

Pakuni

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #51 on: June 25, 2021, 08:20:26 AM »
A Venn diagram of the people worried about an unlevel playing field and lovers of capitalism

A Venn diagram of the people who want athletes from revenue sports subsidizing athletes from nonrevenue sports and lovers of capitalism.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2021, 08:23:15 AM by Pakuni »

MU82

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #52 on: June 25, 2021, 09:53:35 AM »
Chaos. Should be fun!
“A lot of the stuff that we believe in and that I’ve always believed in — it takes time. It’s not a quick fix. It’s not an instant-gratification thing. It’s a drip-by-drip process.”

-- Shaka Smart, in The Athletic, 10/13/21

MU82

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #53 on: June 25, 2021, 11:12:24 AM »
Lead of an op-ed in today's Charlotte Observer:

This week’s U.S. Supreme Court ruling allowing schools to offer extra benefits for college athletes is another blow to the NCAA’s tortured attempts to maintain the amateurism of those whose talents produce big pay for others.

But the blow wasn’t really dealt by the court. The NCAA did it to itself. First it let the standard of the true student-athlete erode and then the NCAA exploded it in 2017 when it sidestepped the scandal over athletes taking phony classes at the University of North Carolina. The governing body of college sports declined to sanction UNC, saying it had no authority to require a minimum of academic rigor in classes taken by those it calls student-athletes.

Southeastern Conference Commissioner Greg Sankey, who led the NCAA’s investigation into years of sham UNC classes involving more than 3,000 students, nearly half of them athletes, said the NCAA was troubled by the fraud but was unable to act.

“NCAA policy is clear,” Sankey said. “The NCAA defers to its member schools to determine whether academic fraud occurred.”

That concession capped decades of the NCAA looking the other way as schools increasingly flouted the presumption that athletes in big-time college football and basketball programs would be compensated with an actual college education.

“A lot of the stuff that we believe in and that I’ve always believed in — it takes time. It’s not a quick fix. It’s not an instant-gratification thing. It’s a drip-by-drip process.”

-- Shaka Smart, in The Athletic, 10/13/21

Jockey

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #54 on: June 25, 2021, 11:48:52 AM »
Yes,  both Duke basketball players and South Dakota State swimmers should be allowed to earn money off their NIL. The free market will determine how much each gets.  What's the problem?

Free marketers only believe in the free market some of the time?

Jockey

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #55 on: June 25, 2021, 11:56:14 AM »
Both players are well compensated; one will make money through NIL the other though not impossible highly unlikely. I am just wondering how this will affect schools like Marquette, where will they find the NIL money to compete with the P5 schools for the best players? Not sure this will end well for Marquette basketball. Hope I am wrong.


Marquette (or any school) will not pay NIL money.

Newsdreams

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #56 on: June 25, 2021, 12:14:53 PM »

Marquette (or any school) will not pay NIL money.
I think a lot of people have no idea how NIL works.

The Lens

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #57 on: June 25, 2021, 12:34:19 PM »
Where you're going to see a lot of success is kids being able coach / personal train / mentor younger players.  Parents will pay a premium for a D1 athlete working with their middle school & HS son or daughter.  Imagine if you could have your freshman in HS work with Andrew Rowsey for $100 / hour each week?

Also, good looking co-eds with nice sized IG followings.   
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lawdog77

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #58 on: June 25, 2021, 12:37:40 PM »
I honestly didnt know college gymnastics would garner so much in NIL. I always thought the college gymnast were the ones not good enough/too old to make the Olympics.  Here's a couple articles I found interesting.
https://www.athleticdirectoru.com/articles/how-much-is-nil-really-worth-to-student-athletes/

https://www.ajc.com/sports/mike-check-blog/volleyball-player-proves-less-famous-athletes-can-cash-in-on-nil/KE47XPNO6JGGREDB32CURVGYMU/

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/icon-source-shares-top-nil-130200068.html


Question, can a school put in their scholarship offer a clause about getting a certain percentage of the individuals NIL?

lawdog77

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #59 on: June 25, 2021, 12:39:21 PM »
Where you're going to see a lot of success is kids being able coach / personal train / mentor younger players.  Parents will pay a premium for a D1 athlete working with their middle school & HS son or daughter.  Imagine if you could have your freshman in HS work with Andrew Rowsey for $100 / hour each week?

Also, good looking co-eds with nice sized IG followings.   
I don't think schools will allow players to be personal trainers/coaches. That's not what NIL is for, unless you want a hologram Andrew Rowsey.

TAMU Eagle

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #60 on: June 25, 2021, 12:44:58 PM »
I don't think schools will allow players to be personal trainers/coaches. That's not what NIL is for, unless you want a hologram Andrew Rowsey.

Every person I have talked to in college athletics has said the opposite. Sure it likely won't be allowed during the season but offseason.
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The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

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lawdog77

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #61 on: June 25, 2021, 12:53:16 PM »
I have been wrong before, and wrong often, but it would be fine to say Andrew Rowsey, MU athlete, landscaper, but I would think MU would be able to put limitations on what type of side hustle he would do (such working as a personal trainer), just for liability purposes in case he gets hurt.

Hards_Alumni

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #62 on: June 25, 2021, 12:56:28 PM »
I honestly didnt know college gymnastics would garner so much in NIL. I always thought the college gymnast were the ones not good enough/too old to make the Olympics.  Here's a couple articles I found interesting.
https://www.athleticdirectoru.com/articles/how-much-is-nil-really-worth-to-student-athletes/

https://www.ajc.com/sports/mike-check-blog/volleyball-player-proves-less-famous-athletes-can-cash-in-on-nil/KE47XPNO6JGGREDB32CURVGYMU/

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/icon-source-shares-top-nil-130200068.html


Question, can a school put in their scholarship offer a clause about getting a certain percentage of the individuals NIL?

Simone Biles has been the best gymnast in the world for quite some time, and she is 24.

lawdog77

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #63 on: June 25, 2021, 12:58:29 PM »
Simone Biles has been the best gymnast in the world for quite some time, and she is 24.
Correct. She did not go to college. She was going to attend UCLA, but instead, she turned pro in 2015.

MU82

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #64 on: June 25, 2021, 12:59:03 PM »
I have been wrong before, and wrong often, but it would be fine to say Andrew Rowsey, MU athlete, landscaper, but I would think MU would be able to put limitations on what type of side hustle he would do (such working as a personal trainer), just for liability purposes in case he gets hurt.

I hope you're wrong (but I don't know that you are).

This would be the perfect use of an athlete's NIL - he or she would actually be able to use his or her talent within the scope of his or her "profession."

It would be akin to an accomplished violinist in a school's music department being allowed to give violin lessons in the "offseason," or a math genius being allowed to tutor kids in math.
“A lot of the stuff that we believe in and that I’ve always believed in — it takes time. It’s not a quick fix. It’s not an instant-gratification thing. It’s a drip-by-drip process.”

-- Shaka Smart, in The Athletic, 10/13/21

lawdog77

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #65 on: June 25, 2021, 01:07:30 PM »
I hope I am wrong too, but I just think the risk of injury would be too great for football and basketball players especially. The instagram/youtube avenue seems to be where the big money would be.

Here's what some NBA players make via instagram
https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/these-nba-players-are-earning-big-bucks-on-instagram.html/
« Last Edit: June 25, 2021, 01:10:02 PM by lawdog77 »

cheebs09

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #66 on: June 25, 2021, 01:24:06 PM »
Correct. She did not go to college. She was going to attend UCLA, but instead, she turned pro in 2015.

I would guess the decision would have been different if she was able to receive NIL money.

Did Ledecky have to put her Olympic endorsements in a trust until she graduated college?

Edited: I stopped being lazy and Googled. Looks like she passed up $5M per year in order to swim collegiately.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2021, 01:28:01 PM by cheebs09 »

Newsdreams

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #67 on: June 25, 2021, 01:30:46 PM »
I hope I am wrong too, but I just think the risk of injury would be too great for football and basketball players especially. The instagram/youtube avenue seems to be where the big money would be.

Here's what some NBA players make via instagram
https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/these-nba-players-are-earning-big-bucks-on-instagram.html/
I don't think on their own time, after and before season schools can't interfere, if he gets hurt his scholarship doesn't get renewed. Remember scholarships are on school year basis, and I'm sure athletes can pay an insurance for that and for injuries to any people participating in trainings.

lawdog77

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #68 on: June 25, 2021, 01:33:09 PM »
I would guess the decision would have been different if she was able to receive NIL money.

Did Ledecky have to put her Olympic endorsements in a trust until she graduated college?

Edited: I stopped being lazy and Googled. Looks like she passed up $5M per year in order to swim collegiately.
I agree on that, but that wasn't my point. My I was trying to state that I thought College Gymnastics was currently a bunch of semi irrelevant athletes who were clear second tier to the Olympians. These gymnasts clearly have some social media clout.

 I think the NIL will help colleges in the Olympic Sports (Track, Swimming, etc). Many who go "pro" early, might stay in/go to college.

lawdog77

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #69 on: June 25, 2021, 01:40:02 PM »
I don't think on their own time, after and before season schools can't interfere, if he gets hurt his scholarship doesn't get renewed. Remember scholarships are on school year basis, and I'm sure athletes can pay an insurance for that and for injuries to any people participating in trainings.
Those type of policies (LOV) are generally for lottery picks, as it would be hard to prove their loss of earnings otherwise.  Even if they did get this policy, it doesn't help the school if the student athlete is injured.

MU82

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #70 on: June 25, 2021, 01:41:19 PM »
College basketball players take part in non-school-sanctioned pickup games all the time and are far more likely to get hurt in those than in giving shooting lessons to a 5th-grader.
“A lot of the stuff that we believe in and that I’ve always believed in — it takes time. It’s not a quick fix. It’s not an instant-gratification thing. It’s a drip-by-drip process.”

-- Shaka Smart, in The Athletic, 10/13/21

lawdog77

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #71 on: June 25, 2021, 01:50:17 PM »
College basketball players take part in non-school-sanctioned pickup games all the time and are far more likely to get hurt in those than in giving shooting lessons to a 5th-grader.
I understand that, but that doesn't mean that the school doesn't have a right to deny the type of work a SA does. It's moving toward a employer/employee relationship rather than student athlete anyway. If it truly becomes an employer/employee relationship a school would have that right. But then again School B may allow that side job.

Jockey

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #72 on: June 25, 2021, 01:57:22 PM »
How does NIL affect this?
South Dakota State's swimming program won't be impacted one bit because some Duke basketball player gets $20K from Nike.

Not only that, but a swimmer would be a bigger fish in a small pond at a school like SDS. There is no reason to think that the top swimmer there wouldn't have opportunities just like a Duke BB player. Might be for a lesser amount of money, but then again, it might not be.

StillAWarrior

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #73 on: June 25, 2021, 02:09:02 PM »
This would be the perfect use of an athlete's NIL - he or she would actually be able to use his or her talent within the scope of his or her "profession."

It would be akin to an accomplished violinist in a school's music department being allowed to give violin lessons in the "offseason," or a math genius being allowed to tutor kids in math.

Although there are some ridiculous restrictions - most notably that the student athlete cannot use his/her name or likeness to promote the lessons - it's actually allowed under current rules.
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MU82

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Re: NCAA Might Lift All NIL Rules
« Reply #74 on: June 25, 2021, 03:08:05 PM »
Although there are some ridiculous restrictions - most notably that the student athlete cannot use his/her name or likeness to promote the lessons - it's actually allowed under current rules.

Thanks for that. I didn't know. But what appears likely to happen after all is said and done will be that the student-athlete WILL be allowed to use his/her name or likeness to promote the lessons. As it should be. The coach sure as heck uses his/her name to promote his/her incredibly lucrative camp.
“A lot of the stuff that we believe in and that I’ve always believed in — it takes time. It’s not a quick fix. It’s not an instant-gratification thing. It’s a drip-by-drip process.”

-- Shaka Smart, in The Athletic, 10/13/21