Finally watched the game

[tower912]

1.   Seriously?   Not taking joy in an 18 point comeback on the road in conference?  15 down with 10 to go, a win, and mewling.   WTF?
2.  First half, four possessions requiring late clock forces.   One of which Garcia caught a pass on the low block with an angle and momentum and kicked out, sacrifing a lay up attempt.   Another where DJ had a cleared side and the defender on his right hip and didn't drive early in the clock.   
3.  Lewis and Garcia are lost from 3 right now.    Combined, they have to be 1 of their last 20.   But both kept fighting.  As freshmen.   They aren't whining.   The fans are.
4.  Wojo rode a hot lineup.  Majority of the charge came with 3 starters in the bench.
5.  I counted 5 shots in the first half that I thought were bad decisions.   Just bad shooting.
6.  MU caught up on rebounding after getting dominated early.
7.  The Hoyas aren't good.   Half good plays by MU, half bad plays by Georgetown.
8.  As I have said so many times before, conference road wins are worth their weight in gold.  Doing it down 15 with 10 to go?   A unicorn.  Celebrate it.

[PGsHeroes32]

The first half was embarrassing and even some part of the first half of the second half were bad to not sustain a run early. That said...

It's crazy how many people are acting like we needed to comeback down 18 vs Pine Bluff. Gtown isnt good but they were up 22ish on Nova and were up double digits on WVU. They blew both those games too.

Which tells you they are not good enough to really put teams away but far from brain dead that some are acting.

[Judge Smails]

I watched it this morning. It was ugly. But I admired their resilience and fight. Great to see Cain have such an awesome game.

[shoothoops]

1.   Seriously?   Not taking joy in an 18 point comeback on the road in conference?  15 down with 10 to go, a win, and mewling.   WTF?
2.  First half, four possessions requiring late clock forces.   One of which Garcia caught a pass on the low block with an angle and momentum and kicked out, sacrifing a lay up attempt.   Another where DJ had a cleared side and the defender on his right hip and didn't drive early in the clock.   
3.  Lewis and Garcia are lost from 3 right now.    Combined, they have to be 1 of their last 20.   But both kept fighting.  As freshmen.   They aren't whining.   The fans are.
4.  Wojo rode a hot lineup.  Majority of the charge came with 3 starters in the bench.
5.  I counted 5 shots in the first half that I thought were bad decisions.   Just bad shooting.
6.  MU caught up on rebounding after getting dominated early.
7.  The Hoyas aren't good.   Half good plays by MU, half bad plays by Georgetown.
8.  As I have said so many times before, conference road wins are worth their weight in gold.  Doing it down 15 with 10 to go?   A unicorn.  Celebrate it.

With regards to number 3, "right now" has been a while. Would strongly prefer to have Lewis and Garcia work inside out earlier in the games.

[NCMUFan]

9.  Cain was a stud. 

[mileskishnish72]

Actually, I feel kind of bad when I realize that a fan as rabid as Tower can't watch the games live.
I remember when I was in MKE making complex switches at school/work to be able to get to games.
Plus, I miss the timely "thoughts" posts right after games.

That said, I can't (as usual) disagree with any of your points (or #9 added later).

[tower912]

Lewis (1-13)   Garcia  (3-11) are not shooting 3's well in conference.     They are too good to keep missing like this.   And, In Garcia's defense, he is hitting a decent percentage for the season.  (10-27)   Lewis is at 5-20 for the season, so he started out OK.    But, if you want to contemplate why our offense is not what we would like in conference, contemplate 4-24 from distance.   

If they start hitting at 35% each in conference, the world will be a much brighter place.   

They are freshmen.    It will get better.   

[MU82]

Lewis (1-13)   Garcia  (3-11) are not shooting 3's well in conference.     They are too good to keep missing like this.    But, if you want to contemplate why our offense is not what we would like in conference, contemplate 4-24 from distance.   

If they start hitting at 35% each, the world will be a much brighter place.   

I was surprised that Lewis hit 3s in non-con. Didn't think that was part of his game. Maybe it was fool's gold. I expected Garcia to hit 3s at a decent clip. 3/11 isn't great, but if he makes one more, at 4/11, that's 36% ... so he's not far off.

Everybody shot for crapola yesterday.

[tower912]

Hey!   Don't quote before I can go back and make edits!    Ha.

[JakeBarnes]

I was surprised that Lewis hit 3s in non-con. Didn't think that was part of his game. Maybe it was fool's gold. I expected Garcia to hit 3s at a decent clip. 3/11 isn't great, but if he makes one more, at 4/11, that's 36% ... so he's not far off.

Everybody shot for crapola yesterday.

Lots of wide open misses. Dj also had one that the release looked off too.

Lewis did hit 3s in hs. But wasn't the biggest part of his game. Dawson just needs to see it go through the net. He wad pretty good from three at a high level

[Ardmore Mug]

Its so nice to see some good discussion about the game ! ! !  not dominated by the $5 Bitch, who needs to be Blocked, and not quoted ! ! !     Go Warriors ! ! !

[Jockey]

Its so nice to see some good discussion about the game ! ! !  not dominated by the $5 Bitch, who needs to be Blocked, and not quoted ! ! !     Go Warriors ! ! !

I always look forward to Tower's game post. Generally, his threads stay pretty clean.

[warriorchick]

I have stopped watching the games live. They give me too much anxiety.

[MU82]

Lots of wide open misses. Dj also had one that the release looked off too.

Lewis did hit 3s in hs. But wasn't the biggest part of his game. Dawson just needs to see it go through the net. He wad pretty good from three at a high level

On one of our first possessions, DJ missed a layup. Turned out to be that kind of game offensively ... until the last 10 minutes.

[MarquetteDano]

One part of offense that was successful was when Lewis had either "5" on him to get him the ball at the free throw line and drive. Good things happened in most cases getting their big trying to defend a drive.

That really isn't Theo's game so Lewis gives us a new dimension when he is playing.

[brewcity77]

1.   Seriously?   Not taking joy in an 18 point comeback on the road in conference?  15 down with 10 to go, a win, and mewling.   WTF?
2.  First half, four possessions requiring late clock forces.   One of which Garcia caught a pass on the low block with an angle and momentum and kicked out, sacrifing a lay up attempt.   Another where DJ had a cleared side and the defender on his right hip and didn't drive early in the clock.   
3.  Lewis and Garcia are lost from 3 right now.    Combined, they have to be 1 of their last 20.   But both kept fighting.  As freshmen.   They aren't whining.   The fans are.
4.  Wojo rode a hot lineup.  Majority of the charge came with 3 starters in the bench.
5.  I counted 5 shots in the first half that I thought were bad decisions.   Just bad shooting.
6.  MU caught up on rebounding after getting dominated early.
7.  The Hoyas aren't good.   Half good plays by MU, half bad plays by Georgetown.
8.  As I have said so many times before, conference road wins are worth their weight in gold.  Doing it down 15 with 10 to go?   A unicorn.  Celebrate it.

1. The comeback was nice. But the circumstances that got us to that point against the worst roster in the conference are at least as troubling.

4. One of the few times Wojo hasn't gone back to starters quickly. That was a relief. I think he could've brought Koby back a bit sooner, but it worked.

5. The defensive end was the troubling part. Again, wide open three after wide open three. MU allowed 10 unguarded threes against GT, the most the Hoyas have been gifted in Big East play. They only made two, which was an incredible stroke of luck.

8. That's not really true so far this year. Ken Pomeroy noted in the Athletic that the value of home court is at its lowest point ever so far. Home teams winning 56.3% of conference games, the previous low mark is 59.0% and the average is 60.1%. That tracks with Big East results, where home court is a bit more than a coin flip at 13-10 (56.5%). And as Georgetown has given up significant leads to lose at home 4 times this year, either it's not a unicorn, or unicorns are both real and rather common as that's what happens more often than not when the Hoyas play at home.

And yes, I know I'm a wet blanket, but there are glaring deficiencies that we have seen for years and continue with this team. If we're going to seriously discuss this team, those deficiencies should be acknowledged not just when we lose but also when the issues crop up and we defy probability to win, such as this one and at Creighton.

Were there positives? Yes. Cain came up huge. Nights like tonight display why I think had he gone to a program like Nova, his length, athleticism, and shooting ability would've had him on the track we've seen guys like Josh Hart, Mikel Bridges, and Saddiq Bey take. In addition, Carton was great in the final moments. His shot to put us ahead with a minute left and his find to Cain to seal it were clutch. And Koby's chase down block was one of the best plays of the season.

That said, there was more bad than good, despite the notch in the win column. And when that is pointed out and the people pointing it out are villainized, it reduces the level of discourse on the site. I agree that positivity is more fun, but painting over the moldy spots in the basement doesn't make them go away, it just allows them to fester and grow unseen.

[Shooter McGavin]

Brew,

Cain doesn't have the handle of those other guys from Villanova. It's on him and not Wojo to work on that.  At best those comparisons are a stretch.

Agree with many of your other points.  I'm just waiting till the end of the season to see if this team develops before I go irreversibly pessimistic about the future of MU under Wojo.  I still have a sliver of hope.

[brewcity77]

Brew,

Cain doesn't have the handle of those other guys from Villanova. It's on him and not Wojo to work on that.  At best those comparisons are a stretch.

Agree with many of your other points.  I'm just waiting till the end of the season to see if this team develops before I go irreversibly pessimistic about the future of MU under Wojo.  I still have a sliver of hope.

Had Cain spent years in a different system, I think there's every reason his handle could be much better. Underuse for the bulk of his career seems to have put his development on the back burner.

[MU82]

1. The comeback was nice. But the circumstances that got us to that point against the worst roster in the conference are at least as troubling.

4. One of the few times Wojo hasn't gone back to starters quickly. That was a relief. I think he could've brought Koby back a bit sooner, but it worked.

5. The defensive end was the troubling part. Again, wide open three after wide open three. MU allowed 10 unguarded threes against GT, the most the Hoyas have been gifted in Big East play. They only made two, which was an incredible stroke of luck.

8. That's not really true so far this year. Ken Pomeroy noted in the Athletic that the value of home court is at its lowest point ever so far. Home teams winning 56.3% of conference games, the previous low mark is 59.0% and the average is 60.1%. That tracks with Big East results, where home court is a bit more than a coin flip at 13-10 (56.5%). And as Georgetown has given up significant leads to lose at home 4 times this year, either it's not a unicorn, or unicorns are both real and rather common as that's what happens more often than not when the Hoyas play at home.

And yes, I know I'm a wet blanket, but there are glaring deficiencies that we have seen for years and continue with this team. If we're going to seriously discuss this team, those deficiencies should be acknowledged not just when we lose but also when the issues crop up and we defy probability to win, such as this one and at Creighton.

Were there positives? Yes. Cain came up huge. Nights like tonight display why I think had he gone to a program like Nova, his length, athleticism, and shooting ability would've had him on the track we've seen guys like Josh Hart, Mikel Bridges, and Saddiq Bey take. In addition, Carton was great in the final moments. His shot to put us ahead with a minute left and his find to Cain to seal it were clutch. And Koby's chase down block was one of the best plays of the season.

That said, there was more bad than good, despite the notch in the win column. And when that is pointed out and the people pointing it out are villainized, it reduces the level of discourse on the site. I agree that positivity is more fun, but painting over the moldy spots in the basement doesn't make them go away, it just allows them to fester and grow unseen.

1. Villanova fell behind Georgetown by 20-something earlier this season. It happens. (And I am NOT trying to claim Marquette is as good as Nova.) Can you rally from that big deficit to win? That matters a heck of a lot more to me.

4. Agreed. I was imploring Wojo to go back to both Koby and DJ a coupla minutes earlier than he did. He went back to Koby first, and I was stunned to watch Koby short-arm his first FT and brick his second. I hope that doesn't hurt Koby's confidence, because he's the only clutch FT shooter we have.

5. Agree about too many open 3s for GT, and I commented on it several times. Of course, we came into the game hitting 40% from 3 and GT gave us a ton of open 3s, most of which we missed. If both teams shoot their normal percentages on open 3s, we still win, probably much more comfortably. It's funny how they insist on playing the games on the court rather than determine winners by what pregame stats say or what Pomeroy says or what Scoopers say should happen.

8. Yeah, like you, I'm not impressed with GT's homecourt "advantage" this season. We won at Creighton and at GT; we lost at home to Okla St, SH and Nova. More of that kinda stuff to come, not just for us but for the vast majority of college hoops teams.

You just love Marquette hoops, you want us to be great, and you get frustrated sometimes. We all do. And you have joined those who are convinced that Wojo has to go, and that's cool. While you might be right, and while his departure wouldn't bother me one iota, I am not so driven by it that I will let it dominate my every thought about Marquette basketball.

Appreciate your contributions to Scoop, brew.

[panda]

Had Cain spent years in a different system, I think there's every reason his handle could be much better. Underuse for the bulk of his career seems to have put his development on the back burner.

Underused and wrongly utilized. He excelled freshman year as a spot up three point shooter and rebounder.

He then had an extremely short leash as a wing driver which isn't his game.

I think his trajectory could have been slightly different had he continued on in the role from his successful freshman year.

[tower912]

Brew, to my eyes, the reason for the deficit was missed lay ups and missed open 3s.   MU got whatever they wanted.   That isnt coaching, that is basketball sometimes

[vogue65]

What is wrong with giving open 3's to players who are missing their 3's?
Don't good shooters also make contested 3's?
Don't good shooters also use the step back 3?
At this level don't the players practice the high shot, for a better term, over the hands of the defender?
I sence that statistics are being misapplied.  Gross numbers lose the details of what is really going on.  The numbers are also being used to intimidate and make a case.  Arguing with a statistics guy is a fools errand.

By the statistics we should have won in Vietnam and lost WWII.

BTW, Rick Patino is doing well at Iona.  How did we miss him?  He will have great statistics, should he be our next coach?  You know as Vince would say, "winning isn't everything, it is the only thing".

[BCHoopster]

Had Cain spent years in a different system, I think there's every reason his handle could be much better. Underuse for the bulk of his career seems to have put his development on the back burner.

The kid is natural athlete but not a natural basketball player.  Last year he was a turnover waiting to happen.  Can not really dribble, last game was the first time I
saw him put the ball down and use his left hand, nice to see.  I think his mind is catching up to his game, game is slowing down for him.  Lets see if he can build on
this game.  Wojo gave him more than enough chances to show his improvement last year, and he did not.  It will be interesting to see if he comesback next year, as
they do not have a wing in the program that I can see.  I would be happy for him to play one more year.

[Its DJOver]

What is wrong with giving open 3's to players who are missing their 3's?
Don't good shooters also make contested 3's?
Don't good shooters also use the step back 3?
At this level don't the players practice the high shot, for a better term, over the hands of the defender?
I sence that statistics are being misapplied.  Gross numbers lose the details of what is really going on.  The numbers are also being used to intimidate and make a case.  Arguing with a statistics guy is a fools errand.

By the statistics we should have won in Vietnam and lost WWII.

BTW, Rick Patino is doing well at Iona.  How did we miss him?  He will have great statistics, should he be our next coach?  You know as Vince would say, "winning isn't everything, it is the only thing".

I think the truth is somewhere in the middle.  Stats are important, but at the same time, allowing bad shooters to take open shots can be a good strategy.  I think the UW game is another good example, I would guess that all of Ford's three point attempts were pretty wide open, and the game plan was to let him take those.  He only went 2-7, but one of the ones he made was late in crunch time, even though he made it, it's a shot you're okay with.  The only Gtown player that is above 35% with a decent sample size is Carey, and we closed out well enough on him for him to attempt below his season average on 3 point attempts. There will always be things to improve on defensively, but I'm okay with allowing bad shooters to take open three's.

[brewcity77]

Brew, to my eyes, the reason for the deficit was missed lay ups and missed open 3s.   MU got whatever they wanted.   That isnt coaching, that is basketball sometimes

MU shot 4/10 on unguarded threes, for 1.2 ppp which is above their season average. Georgetown shot 2/10 for 0.6 ppp which is below their season average.  The coaching issue is that we repeatedly allow those open attempts. Not having the team ready after a long layoff when we were told the problem was tired legs also seems like a coaching issue.