General College Basketball Thread 2020-2021

[GrimmReaper33]

Michigan and OSU have better wins and more consistent overall performances. Iowa plays no defense and doesn't just go cold from game to game, in game they vanish at times. Iowa is more likely to miss the second weekend than make a deep run IMO.

Michigan is gonna be really tough moving forward but they are gonna REALLY miss Wagner and Smith next year. Smith is unreal running that team and playing them under control. Wagner may be the most underrated player in the country.

Illinois seems to be the forgotten about team in the B1G and I think they could end up being the toughest out in the tournament.  Ayo Dosunmu might be the best guard in the country and he just seems to have the "it" factor.  Always seems to hit the big shot and can get in the lane at will.  Seems like the guy who could be the guard that takes over in the tournament, like we've seen in the past. 

Kifi Cockburn is an absolute man amongst boys in the paint.  They are a tough matchup for any team in the country.   They shoot 39% from 3 as a team and Underwood's teams always play tough. 

[PGsHeroes32]

Illinois seems to be the forgotten about team in the B1G and I think they could end up being the toughest out in the tournament.  Ayo Dosunmu might be the best guard in the country and he just seems to have the "it" factor.  Always seems to hit the big shot and can get in the lane at will.  Seems like the guy who could be the guard that takes over in the tournament, like we've seen in the past. 

Kifi Cockburn is an absolute man amongst boys in the paint.  They are a tough matchup for any team in the country.   They shoot 39% from 3 as a team and Underwood's teams always play tough.

They are really good too but much most suseptable to clunkers than Michigan or probably even OSU.

Ayo is elite, maybe the best total package player in the country. The rest of the team supports really well and like you said Cockburn is a load.

But Cockburn is also a traffic cone on D. He was basically unplayable vs Baylor. They had him in foul trouble and completely took him out of the game.

Illinois doesnt have the same defensive abilities and length as a team like Michigan. They also have a big man force.

They dont have the "take over" player like Ayo. But LIvers is really good and an elite shooter. Wagner is a match up nightmare with elite length on the D end. And they have two guards that simply know how to run the show.

[Dr. Blackheart]

If they played even top-50ish defense, I'd be more bullish.  Very reminiscent of a local team circa 2017.  Iowa is better but I won't be surprised if they get run off the court on the opening weekend

Exactly my thought. They are starting to play much better defense and they are the type of team that is deep enough and has the right amount of match-up variety that can go on a Dance run. While UM, tOSU, Illinois are the better teams, Iowa seems more apt to me, with the right match-ups, to stick around  each game and find the right levers to advance.

That said, watch them throw up an egg in their first game.

[wisblue]

Dickinson is the perfect 5 for this team.   Look out if he stays at Mich for a few years.

One thing to remember about Dickinson is that he is surrounded by a team of experienced, unselfish players who know how and where to get him the ball and who are enough of a threat themselves that opponents can't put too much attention on Dickinson. Before yesterday he hadn't scored more than 12 points in the previous 6 games. The 8 man rotation has 5 seniors (including the two grad transfers). He also has an experienced, competent  backup that allows him to play only 25 minutes or so per game. It might be tougher for him next season when the team will be younger.

[Herman Cain]

Pitino said Iona is shutting down their regular season due to Covid and not having enough players. Like their coach, it sounds like the players were not using adequate protection.

Maybe Iona can lend us Pitino for the rest of the season.

[JWags85]

Some in Ann Arbor think Smith may be back next year

That would be incredibly silly IMO.  He's already 23, would be 24 by tip off next season.  He's not going to be anymore NBA ready if he stayed another year.  But I don't think he's an NBA PG, but he's got the makings of a REALLY good Euroleague guard.  Go make your money and improve your game there.

[Uncle Rico]

That would be incredibly silly IMO.  He's already 23, would be 24 by tip off next season.  He's not going to be anymore NBA ready if he stayed another year.  But I don't think he's an NBA PG, but he's got the makings of a REALLY good Euroleague guard.  Go make your money and improve your game there.

I agree with you.  I forgot how old is he was and think it's wishful thinking on their part.  Then again, I think there's an assumption in Madison a lot of that team comes back and they are old

[wadesworld]

He's got a degree from Columbia and can potentially finish up a masters from Michigan if he plays another year there.  Maybe he has no interest in going to a foreign country away from his family and would rather finish up a very good education and then get a job in the US.  Or maybe he can delay one more year of being paid to play basketball for a very good education knowing that when his playing career is over he can make plenty of money with his undergrad from Columbia and masters from Michigan.

[JWags85]

I agree with you.  I forgot how old is he was and think it%u2019s wishful thinking on their part.  Then again, I think there%u2019s an assumption in Madison a lot of that team comes back and they are old

The difference is the majority of those old seniors for Madison will have limited overseas opportunities. They aren't one of the top 4-5 guys are upperclassman at their position in the country.

He's got a degree from Columbia and can potentially finish up a masters from Michigan if he plays another year there.  Maybe he has no interest in going to a foreign country away from his family and would rather finish up a very good education and then get a job in the US.  Or maybe he can delay one more year of being paid to play basketball for a very good education knowing that when his playing career is over he can make plenty of money with his undergrad from Columbia and masters from Michigan.

He's was a sociology major and his masters at Michigan was/is undecided. Lets say he continues with that path. Regardless of where he got his degrees, very few job opportunities, if any, in the next 5 years will compete with the limited window of earning mid to high six figures in Europe. It's not like he's weighing a job with a hedge fund or at a tech company in SV with his basketball options.  I know plenty of people with sterling collegiate resumes who don't make much money, whether by choice or circumstance.

I know nothing of his career aspirations and his interest or lack thereof in pro basketball, but he's made savvy choices thus far.  It's just pretty rare for someone who is as good as he is to to eschew pro opportunities at least straight away.  He would get legit looks, not balance moving on with his life with bouncing around lower leagues or places with great uncertainties like some players.


Unrelated, if Drake makes the tourney and Hemphill isn't 100%, I'll pick against them instantly. Outside of that rock fight with LUI in the second game, they've been so unimpressive. I know they have injury issues, but jeez. A bad Evansville team is just having their way with them on the road. They look lifeless and lacking fight. Might want to pump the brakes on the Devries excitement

[Uncle Rico]

The difference is the majority of those old seniors for Madison will have limited overseas opportunities. They aren't one of the top 4-5 guys are upperclassman at their position in the country.

He's was a sociology major and his masters at Michigan was/is undecided. Lets say he continues with that path. Regardless of where he got his degrees, very few job opportunities, if any, in the next 5 years will compete with the limited window of earning mid to high six figures in Europe. It's not like he's weighing a job with a hedge fund or at a tech company in SV with his basketball options.  I know plenty of people with sterling collegiate resumes who don't make much money, whether by choice or circumstance.

I know nothing of his career aspirations and his interest or lack thereof in pro basketball, but he's made savvy choices thus far.  It's just pretty rare for someone who is as good as he is to to eschew pro opportunities at least straight away.  He would get legit looks, not balance moving on with his life with bouncing around lower leagues or places with great uncertainties like some players.


Unrelated, if Drake makes the tourney and Hemphill isn't 100%, I'll pick against them instantly. Outside of that rock fight with LUI in the second game, they've been so unimpressive. I know they have injury issues, but jeez. A bad Evansville team is just having their way with them on the road. They look lifeless and lacking fight. Might want to pump the brakes on the Devries excitement

It will be a wild off-season either way you slice it

[Uncle Rico]

Duke doing a number on Syracuse tonight

[Billy Hoyle]

Unrelated, if Drake makes the tourney and Hemphill isn't 100%, I'll pick against them instantly. Outside of that rock fight with LUI in the second game, they've been so unimpressive. I know they have injury issues, but jeez. A bad Evansville team is just having their way with them on the road. They look lifeless and lacking fight. Might want to pump the brakes on the Devries excitement

They're down two starters, they lost their PG for the season yesterday. 11 ppg and 5.5 app.

[MuggsyB]

Say what you want about McClung but the dude is a gamer.

[GooooMarquette]

Say what you want about McClung but the dude is a gamer.

Was just going to post the same thing. I think opponents view him much the same way our opponents viewed Travis Diener.

[JWags85]

Officials decided to take OT off in the OK St/TTU game. Good lord. TTU abused multiple times with no calls. Just pathetic. Also, for a good team with a bunch of gamers, Tech hoisted a shocking number of bricks in critical moments late

[MU82]

Say what you want about McClung but the dude is a gamer.

Yeah ... maybe ... but his 3s at the end of regulation and OT both broke the backboard without even hitting iron. Hard to decide which was uglier.

He's everything the Markus haters whined about. And Beard treats him almost the exact way Wojo treated Markus, too - "Shoot it whenever you want, kiddo."

I do like this Oklahoma State coach, BTW.

[MuggsyB]

This coach for Ok. State has done an outstanding job.  I know they landed Cunningham but no one expected them to be a tourney team. 

We must get the MU program back on track.  Don't tell me people aren't out there because we see programs all the time get new coaching staffs and quickly are back in business. 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

This coach for Ok. State has done an outstanding job.  I know they landed Cunningham but no one expected them to be a tourney team. 

We must get the MU program back on track.  Don't tell me people aren't out there because we see programs all the time get new coaching staffs and quickly are back in business.

If by all the time you mean less than 20% of the time then sure. Most rebuilds end in failure. The rebuilds that are successful typically take 3+ years.

All that being said,  it's time to move on barring a miracle run to end the season

[MuggsyB]

If by all the time you mean less than 20% of the time then sure. Most rebuilds end in failure. The rebuilds that are successful typically take 3+ years.

All that being said,  it's time to move on barring a miracle run to end the season

When you say "rebuilds" do you mean coaching changes?  If you're not remotely successful  for 7 yrs the "3 year rule" doesn't seem to mean much imo. 

[GooooMarquette]

Yeah ... maybe ... but his 3s at the end of regulation and OT both broke the backboard without even hitting iron. Hard to decide which was uglier.

He's everything the Markus haters whined about. And Beard treats him almost the exact way Wojo treated Markus, too - "Shoot it whenever you want, kiddo."

I do like this Oklahoma State coach, BTW.

The shots at the end tonight were ugly, but McClung can play, and he's going to win a lot more games than he loses.

[MU82]

Well, Muggs, we both just complimented the Oklahoma State coach. This is his fourth year. In his first 3, he never finished in the top half of conference standings, never had a winning conference record and never appeared in the NCAAs.

In other words ... results many Scoopers would call abject failure.

[MuggsyB]

Well, Muggs, we both just complimented the Oklahoma State coach. This is his fourth year. In his first 3, he never finished in the top half of conference standings, never had a winning conference record and never appeared in the NCAAs.

In other words ... results many Scoopers would call abject failure.

Fair enough but the B12 until this year has probably been the best overall league the past 5 yrs.  I understand  "rebuilds" take time.  Wojo was put in a tough situation in 2014, I'm not sure how it compares to Ok.Stare in 2017.  That said, year 7 is year 7. I can tell you with 100% certainty that Wojo did not expect this program to be stagnant and mediocre with a grand total of zero tournament wins when he took the job.

[JWags85]

Well, Muggs, we both just complimented the Oklahoma State coach. This is his fourth year. In his first 3, he never finished in the top half of conference standings, never had a winning conference record and never appeared in the NCAAs.

In other words ... results many Scoopers would call abject failure.

To be fair, he took over a mess. Travis Ford ran that program into the bottom of the Big12.  Then you had the transition to Underwood for just one season and then more change at the top.  And the best player from the season before, Juwan Evans, left for the draft.   Plus the FBI investigation.  He had a mess to clean up

[MuggsyB]

I believe in 2014 Marquette was considered the 13th best program in college hoops history.  We have fallen into the  Mariana Trench with no chance of coming up for air any time soon.  Very depressing and totally inexcusable.  It's important to reiterate this regularly, get our act together, and surge back as quickly as possible.  Expectations should be sky high for this program. 

[MU82]

I totally understand that OSU was a mess. However, anytime any coach not named Wojo does well, the line here is, "See? He can do it!" But then when you look it up, you see that the coach not named Wojo is in Year 4, still hasn't won an NCAA game, and still hasn't had a winning conference record (though probably will this season). And again, I like what I've seen from Boynton a lot.

Yes, there are occasions where a coach comes in an fixes things in a couple of years. But as TAMU says, those are rarities. Here's hoping that whoever our next coach is and whenever he takes over from Wojo, he will be one of those rarities.

And I obviously agree that Wojo hasn't done enough in 7 years because I've been saying for a month now that he should have been fired after the DePaul loss.

As for McClung ...

He's a tough kid who is willing to try to take over down the stretch of games, and Beard is willing to let him. But he's been a mixed bag.

He hit the winner to beat Texas, hit clinching FTs against Okla after a teammate hit the go-ahead bucket, and he made a couple 3s to help rally the team vs LSU. He also missed 2 shots and a FT late in the first loss to OSU, fired two horrible scuds in tonight's loss to OSU, missed a buzzer J vs W Virginia, and committed a turnover and missed 2 shots late in the other loss to W Virginia.

I'd take Mac on my team 100%. I like him. He's very exciting. But let's not canonize him. He's basically Markus without the 40+ point games and with only a career .310 percentage from 3pt.

If he were on Marquette, and if Wojo coached him the exact same way Beard has coached him, Wojo would be getting ripped for letting one player dominate the ball.