Foxconn Update

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I'm going to take a very different position than is espoused on this Board.

It was a calculated gamble worth taking in a very volatile time.

Look, manufacturing has been fleeing Wisconsin -- and most of the Midwest -- for much of the past 50 years. The carnage comes in the form of unemployment, social and political unrest and simply broken people without hope. One one level, it's sad. On another, it's a state and national tragedy. Southeast Wisconsin in particular, with the loss of AMC, Allis-Chalmers, Briggs & Stratton and a host of other large firms, has really paid the price for an overly free market attitude toward imports.

We see states like Tennessee, who made a bet on Nissan in the 1980s. The bet came amid enormous criticism by lots of people that the Alexander Administration was "giving away the store." Yet, Tennessee become an industrial powerhouse. Nissan has multiple plants in Tennessee, as does VW and a host of supplier companies. Drive down Interstate 24 from Nashville to Murfreesboro and you'll see growth and development that most of us who grew up there would have never dreamed of.

After seeing backwater states like Tennessee and South Carolina become industrial powerhouses, the Midwest has to do something. Foxconn may have been betting on the wrong partner but at least the state ponied up to the table. Admittedly, the educational institutions, access to transportation networks, raw materials and skilled labor force should make the Chicago/Milwaukee region as well as much of the Midwest the economic engine of the region and the nation. Sadly, it's not and we need to change the defeatist attitude about the Midwest and go after opportunity.

It's really easy to be a Monday morning quarterback. It's a lot tougher not to act amid the problems of the post-industrial age.

But this is a dated view of Wisconsin really.  AMC and Allis-Chalmers left 30 years ago.  Briggs has been downsizing for years.  In fact, the stories pre-Covid were more about not finding enough skilled labor to fill the needs of the area.  The persistence of poverty, and low skilled labor, isn't going to be helped by putting a LCD factory in Mount Pleasant.

That being said, there is obviously room for subsidies no doubt.  But subsidies of that size aren't going to pay off.  That was the biggest issue - the size of the subsidy, not the subsidy itself.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

It won't be a Trump backed candidate, it will be Trump himself.

Sorry but if Trump loses in a couple of weeks, between now and 2024 you are going to see a lot of revisionist history by his former supporters about how much they were behind him.

[Uncle Rico]

Sorry but if Trump loses in a couple of weeks, between now and 2024 you are going to see a lot of revisionist history by his former supporters about how much they were behind him.

Never forget

[Tortuga94]

Sorry but if Trump loses in a couple of weeks, between now and 2024 you are going to see a lot of revisionist history by his former supporters about how much they were behind him.

I don't see that happening. You know Trump will never admit defeat, if he loses, he will claim he was robbed. There is no way he steps aside for someone else, because his ego will not allow someone else to claim the spotlight.. The base is solidly behind him and I don't see that changing in the next 2-3 years.

[Pakuni]

I don't see that happening. You know Trump will never admit defeat, if he loses, he will claim he was robbed. There is no way he steps aside for someone else, because his ego will not allow someone else to claim the spotlight.. The base is solidly behind him and I don't see that changing in the next 2-3 years.

Honestly, I'm not sure he could afford another run even if he wants to. Many of his big donors have abandoned him and he's staring down a $400 million debt.

As you can see from his latest filing, he's flailing when it comes to financing his campaign this year.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/20/us/politics/trump-money-biden.html

[Hards Alumni]

It is the media because they need to appeal to the fringes. Fox News on the right and MSNBC on the left, and let's not forget about talk radio. Talk radio is probably the biggest culprit of the partisan divide in this country. It's all about ratings and ad revenue and the fact is today, people tune in to hear what they want to hear and nod their head along to everything they hear. That's why most people cannot identify individuals like Davids, Porter, Mikie Sherrill, Elissa Slotkin, etc. Instead, it's "The Squad."

both are hard left, but they represent hard left districts. Not communists, it's been fun to see the right dig that out of the 80's graveyard. However, they're great self-promoters. There's a reason why AOC is known as "Always On Camera." Don't forget this little nugget:  "In any other country, Joe Biden and I would not be in the same party," in an interview with New York magazine."

And meanwhile, Joe Biden is going to be our next President and AOC and Omar have given conditional support, not a full-on endorsement (with Omar basically saying "I support him, but let's hear from Tara Reade first").

Yeah, but that isn't what I said.  Their views are much more mainstream than people are led to believe.  Also, she is Always On Camera partially because the right tries to use her as a talking point rather than attack her ideas.  She is an attractive, smart, assertive woman who can defend her views... and that scares the hell out of a lot of them.  But Trump mentions the 'squad' in all of his rallys... "AOC +3"  It's red meat for his base, and it is easier to remember an acronym like AOC than it is to remember a fairly generic name like Katie Porter, or congressperson with a name like Ihan Omar.  And when we are talking Trump supporters, we are talking people who remember very specific, very targeted talking points.  The less they have to remember, the better.  It's why when they are challenged on the talking points, they respond childishly... because they're low info voters.  It's why Trump's messaging is so effective.

MSNBC is for old people, neither IO or AOC... or Bernie Sanders end up there as much as a lot of others.  Have you ever considered why?  Corporate media system.

Single payer health insurance support = 69%
https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/494602-poll-69-percent-of-voters-support-medicare-for-all

Tuition free college support = 58%
https://thehill.com/hilltv/rising/461106-majority-of-voters-support-free-college-eliminating-student-debt

Green New Deal support = 41%
https://thehill.com/changing-america/sustainability/climate-change/517778-new-poll-finds-a-surprising-7-out-of-10-voters

So, to be clear, her views aren't far left, she is left of center... while the rest of the Democratic Party is basically centrist.  So I guess you could say her and Joe Biden wouldn't be in the same party in a lot of other countries... but that makes sense because our two party system is terrible at representation.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Has anyone tracked down the TV they donated to Marquette during the bootlicking tour that happened during Marquette Madness?

It's in the press room of the "Tom & Joni Crean Soccer Pavilion"

[Jockey]

It won't be a Trump backed candidate, it will be Trump himself.  The GOP will still be the party of Trump, unless Ben Sasse or Mitt Romney run against him, Trump will run unopposed in 2024 should he lose in a couple weeks.

He will be living in Moscow. He ain’t running again. Take it to the bank.

[4everwarriors]

I think if you remove the names Ilhan Omar, and Alexandria Ocacio-Cortez and display only their views they'd win a lot of primaries.  A lot of people have been led to believe that these women are scary commies.  They aren't.

You're right. They're fookin' idiots along with those who support them.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

You're right. They're fookin' idiots along with those who support them.

And hardly representative of the party at large.  Just like Steve King isn't representative of the Republicans.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Yeah, but that isn't what I said.  Their views are much more mainstream than people are led to believe.  Also, she is Always On Camera partially because the right tries to use her as a talking point rather than attack her ideas.  She is an attractive, smart, assertive woman who can defend her views... and that scares the hell out of a lot of them.  But Trump mentions the 'squad' in all of his rallys... "AOC +3"  It's red meat for his base, and it is easier to remember an acronym like AOC than it is to remember a fairly generic name like Katie Porter, or congressperson with a name like Ihan Omar.  And when we are talking Trump supporters, we are talking people who remember very specific, very targeted talking points.  The less they have to remember, the better.  It's why when they are challenged on the talking points, they respond childishly... because they're low info voters.  It's why Trump's messaging is so effective.

MSNBC is for old people, neither IO or AOC... or Bernie Sanders end up there as much as a lot of others.  Have you ever considered why?  Corporate media system.

Single payer health insurance support = 69%
https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/494602-poll-69-percent-of-voters-support-medicare-for-all

Tuition free college support = 58%
https://thehill.com/hilltv/rising/461106-majority-of-voters-support-free-college-eliminating-student-debt

Green New Deal support = 41%
https://thehill.com/changing-america/sustainability/climate-change/517778-new-poll-finds-a-surprising-7-out-of-10-voters

So, to be clear, her views aren't far left, she is left of center... while the rest of the Democratic Party is basically centrist.  So I guess you could say her and Joe Biden wouldn't be in the same party in a lot of other countries... but that makes sense because our two party system is terrible at representation.

Left of center?  You are delusional.  The squad are admitted socialists.  That's far left, no matter what "modifier" like "Democratic" you slap on the turd of socialism.

And yes, roads, police, snow removal, blah, blah, blah.

[wadesworld]

And hardly representative of the party at large.  Just like Steve King isn't representative of the Republicans.

No man, you don't get it.  If you lean left at all, you are an extremist.

[Galway Eagle]

In before the lock.

But also in spite of what ziggy's ridiculous fear mongering says, democratic socialism isn't socialism. At all we've seen that all over Europe it's why Sinn Fein or the Labour Party aren't known as socialist parties anywhere in the developed world but to the far right here.

Edit: yes some purists believe it's a slow transition to socialism but most who believe in it just believe in better and more prevalent social programs to lift up society

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

In before the lock.

But also in spite of what ziggy's ridiculous fear mongering says, democratic socialism isn't socialism.

Exactly.  They aren't calling for the government to own the means of production.

[MU82]

Yeah, but that isn't what I said.  Their views are much more mainstream than people are led to believe.  Also, she is Always On Camera partially because the right tries to use her as a talking point rather than attack her ideas.  She is an attractive, smart, assertive woman who can defend her views... and that scares the hell out of a lot of them.  But Trump mentions the 'squad' in all of his rallys... "AOC +3"  It's red meat for his base, and it is easier to remember an acronym like AOC than it is to remember a fairly generic name like Katie Porter, or congressperson with a name like Ihan Omar.  And when we are talking Trump supporters, we are talking people who remember very specific, very targeted talking points.  The less they have to remember, the better.  It's why when they are challenged on the talking points, they respond childishly... because they're low info voters.  It's why Trump's messaging is so effective.

MSNBC is for old people, neither IO or AOC... or Bernie Sanders end up there as much as a lot of others.  Have you ever considered why?  Corporate media system.

Single payer health insurance support = 69%
https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/494602-poll-69-percent-of-voters-support-medicare-for-all

Tuition free college support = 58%
https://thehill.com/hilltv/rising/461106-majority-of-voters-support-free-college-eliminating-student-debt

Green New Deal support = 41%
https://thehill.com/changing-america/sustainability/climate-change/517778-new-poll-finds-a-surprising-7-out-of-10-voters

So, to be clear, her views aren't far left, she is left of center... while the rest of the Democratic Party is basically centrist.  So I guess you could say her and Joe Biden wouldn't be in the same party in a lot of other countries... but that makes sense because our two party system is terrible at representation.

C'mon now. Today's Democratic Party is left of center, and "The Squad" is well left of that.

Biden has been close to centrist most of his career, but as the Dem nominee he has been forced left by the party.

But you are right that it is Trump and his fearmongers who constantly bring up AOC & Co. Nevertheless, if the media reports what they say, Billy will say it's their "fault."

[ZiggysFryBoy]

No man, you don't get it.  If you lean left at all, you are an extremist.

Thats funny coming from a rich white kid like you, Patty.

[Uncle Rico]

Anyway you cut it, Foxconn is part of the Trump, Walker and Vos Wisconsin legacy.  Hopefully, future generations learn from this.

I’m not holding my breath

[ZiggysFryBoy]

In before the lock.

But also in spite of what ziggy's ridiculous fear mongering says, democratic socialism isn't socialism. At all we've seen that all over Europe it's why Sinn Fein or the Labour Party aren't known as socialist parties anywhere in the developed world but to the far right here.

Edit: yes some purists believe it's a slow transition to socialism but most who believe in it just believe in better and more prevalent social programs to lift up society

What fear mongering am i engaging in, other than saying socialism doesnt work?

Must be hatd to be so fragile that calling socialism a turd is fear mongering.   

Anyone know a good laptop repair shop?

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Left of center?  You are delusional.  The squad are admitted socialists.  That's far left, no matter what "modifier" like "Democratic" you slap on the turd of socialism.

And yes, roads, police, snow removal, blah, blah, blah.

Actually "Democratic Socialists" is their term and by typical European Socialist standards they are very weak "Socialists" at best. 

[Pakuni]

What fear mongering am i engaging in, other than saying socialism doesnt work?

Must be hatd to be so fragile that calling socialism a turd is fear mongering.   

Anyone know a good laptop repair shop?

You're right that socialism doesn't work (the blind squirrel has found its nut).
Good thing no one in either of our major political parties is calling for it.

Anyone know how to tuck in pants?

[Galway Eagle]

What fear mongering am i engaging in, other than saying socialism doesnt work?

Must be hatd to be so fragile that calling socialism a turd is fear mongering.   

Anyone know a good laptop repair shop?

I agree socialism doesn't work.

But you aren't calling it a turd you're calling democratic socialists, socialists. Democratic socialism, in check, has been shown to work in many places see literally any developed country not named the USA.

If you want to call me the fragile one go for it, I'm not the one who resorted to personal insults because he mislabeled some of our nations leaders to create fear mongering. It is par for the course from your side though.

[Hards Alumni]

C'mon now. Today's Democratic Party is left of center, and "The Squad" is well left of that.

Biden has been close to centrist most of his career, but as the Dem nominee he has been forced left by the party.

But you are right that it is Trump and his fearmongers who constantly bring up AOC & Co. Nevertheless, if the media reports what they say, Billy will say it's their "fault."

No, most Dems are Neoliberal capitalist hawks.  They're centrists at best.  Globally, they're right wing.

SocDems are left of center.  Socialists are further, and then Communists are far left.

[wadesworld]

Thats funny coming from a rich white kid like you, Patty.

Ahh yes. Can’t argue with what was said, so throw out a personal attack about somebody you’ve never met and know nothing about. I’m shocked you support Trump!

If I am a “rich white kid,” what would make that funny?

[Jockey]

In before the lock.

But also in spite of what ziggy's ridiculous fear mongering says, democratic socialism isn't socialism. At all we've seen that all over Europe it's why Sinn Fein or the Labour Party aren't known as socialist parties anywhere in the developed world but to the far right here.

Edit: yes some purists believe it's a slow transition to socialism but most who believe in it just believe in better and more prevalent social programs to lift up society

I'm guessing that 95% of Americans would be unable to define the differences between socialism and democratic socialism.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I'm guessing that 95% of Americans would be unable to define the differences between socialism and democratic socialism.

I'm guessing 95% of Americans would be unable to define socialism at all.