Masks

[Jockey]

Because people in every city I've been to in Wisconsin outside of Milwaukee have been blatantly disregarding mask recommendations.

Anecdotal but that's been my experience.

Absolutely true. Racine, Kenosha, Baraboo, Dells, reedsburg - majority of people are not wearing mass except in some stores.

[Hards Alumni]

Hm, looking for opinions here...lately folks have been latching onto the idea that masks with ventilators are bad (including my workplace).  Here's an example:

https://healthnewshub.org/health-news-hub/top-news/do-not-use-a-mask-with-a-filtered-valve-it-can-spread-covid-19/

Now, I understand that the ventilator allows "unfiltered" air out, and that *could* be bad.  But a cloth mask also allows a lot of unfiltered air out - and that's why they're more comfortable.  But - this should  only matter if the virus is airborne - correct?  Both the cloth mask, and ventilated 95 stop a majority of "droplets" which is their purpose. 

I mentioned in another thread, I have a couple ventilated N95's, and I'm not trying to be a jerk by wearing them.  Am I being jerk? 

I feel like this guidance is going overboard, and the only risk of using a ventilated mask (or cloth mask) is in "sterile" environments.

valve or vents are bad.  It isn't overboard.  Analogous to having your fly open and your dick out and still saying you're wearing pants.

[rocky_warrior]

Analogous to having your fly open and your dick out and still saying you're wearing pants.

Uh, that's not Analogous, that it isn't very similar and doesn't clarify the science.  But I'll accept your opinion that it's bad

[muguru]

Would you do this??


https://www.theblaze.com/news/miami-mayor-wear-face-masks-home

[TSmith34, Inc.]

So my question is, isn't it reasonable to assume(based on the data/science) that in a vast majority of counties in Wisconsin, the cases/deaths are so low per 100,000, that masks really won't accomplish much anyway??

No. The U.S. is still suffering through one, long, near-continuous outbreak because we handled it just as you are suggesting. If we had had a consistent, uniformly enforced shutdown across the country we'd be where virtually every other western country is in terms of the virus. Instead, we did the opposite.

Places like Texas, Arizona, and Florida, amongst others, were making the same argument that you are. 'New York and New Jersey, and Washington have it, but we don't, so why should we shut down, why should we wear masks, why should we social distance?'  Because people travel. And because if you wait until you have it it is too late.

[shoothoops]

Honest question, not looking for an argument or anything like that, do you believe there are other( more effective) ways to "protest" than kneeling during a national anthem?? Or is that the only option they have to get their point across??

The answer is both, or, all of the above.

One can easily say, peacefully kneeling during a National Anthem has brought quite a bit of attention to the topic, which is the point.

A better question is do we need to play National Anthems every day at sporting events. And at least for me, that answer is no.

This, one of many examples, is what the legendary baseball player Bob Gibson said about it this weekend.

https://twitter.com/Ben_Fred/status/1287049116128870407?s=19

[muguru]

No. The U.S. is still suffering through one, long, near-continuous outbreak because we handled it just as you are suggesting. If we had had a consistent, uniformly enforced shutdown across the country we'd be where virtually every other western country is in terms of the virus. Instead, we did the opposite.

Places like Texas, Arizona, and Florida, amongst others, were making the same argument that you are. 'New York and New Jersey, and Washington have it, but we don't, so why should we shut down, why should we wear masks, why should we social distance?'  Because people travel. And because if you wait until you have it it is too late.

Honest question for you, and really anyone else that cares to answer...Okay I understand a vast majority of people think how this was handled was completely bungled by bad orange man. Fair enough. My question for you is, and please be honest, were you satisfied/pleased with how Barry and Biden handled H1N1??

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Honest question for you, and really anyone else that cares to answer...Okay I understand a vast majority of people think how this was handled was completely bungled by bad orange man. Fair enough. My question for you is, and please be honest, were you satisfied/pleased with how Barry and Biden handled H1N1??

Sure

[tower912]

Made fighting it a federal and national priority.  12,000 died from it.   


No organized effort at the federal level.  140,000 dead in 6 months with no end in sight.


One is a lamentable tragedy, but America eventually stopped it.


One is a a completed dereliction of duty and failure of leadership.


I'm not saying which, as that would be political.

[muguru]

Made fighting it a federal and national priority.  12,000 died from it.   


No organized effort at the federal level.  140,000 dead in 6 months with no end in sight.


One is a lamentable tragedy, but America eventually stopped it.


One is a a completed dereliction of duty and failure of leadership.


I'm not saying which, as that would be political.

Okay, I'm glad you and Tony responded...the reason i asked that is because...https://www.theblaze.com/news/ready-top-biden-aide-admits-botched-response-to-swine-flu-just-luck-it-wasnt-mass-casualty-event

Ron Klain, who served as chief of staff to Biden before being appointed to serve as President Barack Obama's "Ebola Czar," said at the National Press Club in 2019:

    I was in the White House in 2009 and 2010, and I was working for Vice President Biden. I wasn't involved directly in the H1N1 response, but I lived through it as a White House staffer, and what I would say about it is: A bunch of really great, really talented people were working on it and we did every possible thing wrong.

Klain continued, "Sixty million Americans got H1N1 in that period of time, and it's just purely a fortuity that this isn't one of the great mass casualty events in American history."

He added, "It had nothing to do with us doing anything right. It just had to do with luck."

As TheBlaze pointed out last week, Biden has been highly critical of President Donald Trump's handling of the coronavirus. But the Obama administration was exposed in 2009 by then-CBS News reporter Sharyl Attkisson for shutting down H1N1 testing.

"The rationale given for the CDC guidance to forego testing and tracking was," Attkisson wrote, "why waste resources testing for H1N1 flue when the government has already confirmed there's an epidemic?"

Maybe most importantly, because I know most people have accused bad orange man of lying when he says the cupboards were bare:

Townhall further noted that H1N1 depleted America's stockpile of PPE supplies, and that Obama failed to refill it. The outlet cited a Los Angeles Times report that stated:

    After the swine flu epidemic in 2009, a safety-equipment industry association and a federally sponsored task force both recommended that depleted supplies of N95 respirator masks, which filter out airborne particles, be replenished by the stockpile, which is maintained by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

    That didn't happen, according to Charles Johnson, president of the International Safety Equipment Assn.
    The stockpile drew down about 100 million masks during the 2009 epidemic, Johnson said.

    "Our association is unaware of any major effort to restore the stockpile to cover that drawdown," he said.

Huh...Now I'm sure the Barry/Biden truthers will say this is a nothing burger(like they do with any facts you present them), but this was a Biden staffer. So maybe, just maybe people's flat out HATE for the POTUS makes them see things that aren't actually there?? Or their love for another POTUS makes them want to/blind them to the simple realization that you can't have it both ways.

[rocky_warrior]

were you satisfied/pleased with how Barry and Biden handled H1N1??

This isn't the H1N1 board.

[Vander Blue Man Group]

Okay, I'm glad you and Tony responded...the reason i asked that is because...https://www.theblaze.com/news/ready-top-biden-aide-admits-botched-response-to-swine-flu-just-luck-it-wasnt-mass-casualty-event

Ron Klain, who served as chief of staff to Biden before being appointed to serve as President Barack Obama's "Ebola Czar," said at the National Press Club in 2019:

    I was in the White House in 2009 and 2010, and I was working for Vice President Biden. I wasn't involved directly in the H1N1 response, but I lived through it as a White House staffer, and what I would say about it is: A bunch of really great, really talented people were working on it and we did every possible thing wrong.

Klain continued, "Sixty million Americans got H1N1 in that period of time, and it's just purely a fortuity that this isn't one of the great mass casualty events in American history."

He added, "It had nothing to do with us doing anything right. It just had to do with luck."

As TheBlaze pointed out last week, Biden has been highly critical of President Donald Trump's handling of the coronavirus. But the Obama administration was exposed in 2009 by then-CBS News reporter Sharyl Attkisson for shutting down H1N1 testing.

"The rationale given for the CDC guidance to forego testing and tracking was," Attkisson wrote, "why waste resources testing for H1N1 flue when the government has already confirmed there's an epidemic?"

Maybe most importantly, because I know most people have accused bad orange man of lying when he says the cupboards were bare:

Townhall further noted that H1N1 depleted America's stockpile of PPE supplies, and that Obama failed to refill it. The outlet cited a Los Angeles Times report that stated:

    After the swine flu epidemic in 2009, a safety-equipment industry association and a federally sponsored task force both recommended that depleted supplies of N95 respirator masks, which filter out airborne particles, be replenished by the stockpile, which is maintained by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

    That didn't happen, according to Charles Johnson, president of the International Safety Equipment Assn.
    The stockpile drew down about 100 million masks during the 2009 epidemic, Johnson said.

    "Our association is unaware of any major effort to restore the stockpile to cover that drawdown," he said.

Huh...Now I'm sure the Barry/Biden truthers will say this is a nothing burger(like they do with any facts you present them), but this was a Biden staffer. So maybe, just maybe people's flat out HATE for the POTUS makes them see things that aren't actually there?? Or their love for another POTUS makes them want to/blind them to the simple realization that you can't have it both ways.

The Blaze?    

[tower912]

Sometimes, the answer is in the question.   Or in this case, the source.

[jficke13]

Ironic, no?

Ah, Guru was citing Project Veritas so none of this was serious at any point, was it?

[tower912]

Veritas and The Blaze.  Both paragons of unbiased reporting.

[Uncle Rico]

Veritas and The Blaze.  Both paragons of unbiased reporting.

Anyone using Project Veritas as a source isn’t to be taken seriously

[muguru]

The Blaze?    

LMAO knew this was coming...this is EXACTLY how any of you radical lefts respond to anything when presented with facts you simply don't like. Or as Biden said "we use truth over facts" 

But...maybe just maybe(doubtful) this will be enough for you..

Maybe an actual youtube video is proof enough?? Nah...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POX9FtQF0pY

[tower912]

It is text over a still photo.  Do Michael Cohen or John Bolton carry weight with you?

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/05/04/joe-biden-contain-h1n1-virus-232992



So, I did a little google search and came up with this story that references your favorite quote.     In it, the person says his quote refers to being able to get enough of the vaccine to meet public demand.       

Context matters.     

Oh, and by the way, the above article also points out mistakes that Biden and the Obama administration made.      A shame that their mistakes couldn't be learned from, aina?

[Hards Alumni]

LMAO knew this was coming...this is EXACTLY how any of you radical lefts respond to anything when presented with facts you simply don't like. Or as Biden said "we use truth over facts" 

But...maybe just maybe(doubtful) this will be enough for you..

Maybe an actual youtube video is proof enough?? Nah...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POX9FtQF0pY

*sighs*

[Vander Blue Man Group]

LMAO knew this was coming...this is EXACTLY how any of you radical lefts respond to anything when presented with facts you simply don't like. Or as Biden said "we use truth over facts" 

But...maybe just maybe(doubtful) this will be enough for you..

Maybe an actual youtube video is proof enough?? Nah...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POX9FtQF0pY

Is every person that thinks Trump sucks part of the "radical left", guru?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Ron Klain, who served as chief of staff to Biden before being appointed to serve as President Barack Obama's "Ebola Czar," said at the National Press Club in 2019:

To add to what Tower posted, here is the full quote:
"Klain now says his comments, which were made at a biosecurity summit, referred solely to the administration’s difficulties in producing enough of an H1N1 vaccine to meet public demand. The Obama team, he says, quickly adapted to the situation, making choices that were starkly different from those the Trump administration would make 11 years later, such as quickly distributing emergency equipment from the federal stockpile, deferring to public health experts and having them take the lead on messaging."

So the question now is, guru, since you now know The Blaze lied to you by taking a quote out of context, does it change your mind? Because earlier you were complaining about people not accepting facts that didn't match what they wanted to believe...

If you are actually open to learning the facts, here is a NY Times article that points out the missteps and mistakes the Obama administration made in fighting H1N1. You'll note that despite the mistakes, the experts call the overall response "at least a B-plus" and "excellent".
https://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/02/health/02flu.html

Townhall further noted that H1N1 depleted America's stockpile of PPE supplies, and that Obama failed to refill it. The outlet cited a Los Angeles Times report that stated:

    After the swine flu epidemic in 2009, a safety-equipment industry association and a federally sponsored task force both recommended that depleted supplies of N95 respirator masks, which filter out airborne particles, be replenished by the stockpile, which is maintained by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

Well this is partially true at least. It's true that a lot of the PPE was used up fighting swine flu and other outbreaks and never replaced, but the reason it wasn't replaced is a little more complex than the Obama administration saying, "Ahhhh, F it, we don't need those."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/04/03/fact-check-did-obama-administration-deplete-n-95-mask-stockpile/5114319002/
"Again according to NIH, the stockpile's resources were also used during hurricanes Alex, Irene, Isaac and Sandy. Flooding in 2010 in North Dakota also called for stockpile funds to be deployed. The 2014 outbreaks of the ebola virus and botulism, as well as the 2016 outbreak of the zika virus, continued to significantly tax the stockpile with no serious effort from the Obama administration to replenish the fund.

ProPublica reported on April 3 that congressional budget battles in the early years of the Obama administration contributed to stockpile shortages. But the article notes available funds were used not to replenish masks: "With limited resources, officials in charge of the stockpile tend to focus on buying lifesaving drugs from small biotechnology firms that would, in the absence of a government buyer, have no other market for their products, experts said. Masks and other protective equipment are in normal times widely available and thus may not have been prioritized for purchase, they said."

But if you are going to blame Obama for not replacing the stockpile, shouldn't Trump also be blamed for not replacing it in over three years as President?

The thing that is really amazing, however, is Trump trying to point the finger at Obama for not leaving him any COVID-19 tests.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Veritas and The Blaze.  Both paragons of unbiased reporting.

Glen Beck.  Have met him and knew his current wife at one time.  What a D-bag.
 And the story of how they met is pure Glen Beck

[muguru]

Veritas and The Blaze.  Both paragons of unbiased reporting.

No different than MSDNC, CNN, the NYT or Wapo, right?? Prove me wrong.

[Jockey]

No different than MSDNC, CNN, the NYT or Wapo, right?? Prove me wrong.

A 6 year old could prove you wrong.

[Jockey]

The majority of republicans support wearing masks.

Most people who are against masks are republicans.