Wet Markets

[wadesworld]

Ebola, HIV, bird flu, swine flu, SARS, and Covid-19 are all traced back to these wet markets. Why are they even allowed at this point?

[Galway Eagle]

Watched a video explaining it. I'll see if I can find it again, apparently China attempted to ban them after the last new disease

[JWags85]

Ebola, HIV, bird flu, swine flu, SARS, and Covid-19 are all traced back to these wet markets. Why are they even allowed at this point?

Cultural and regional pushback I'd imagine? I've seen plenty of takes objecting to the condemnation of wet markets as racist or culturally insensitive, but not every tradition or custom is "good" or to be accepted in modern times. Would those same people speak out in protection of foot binding too?

[mu03eng]

Drop MOABs on every wet market that shows up from here on out

[forgetful]

Ebola, HIV, bird flu, swine flu, SARS, and Covid-19 are all traced back to these wet markets. Why are they even allowed at this point?

I don't think there is evidence that any of these started in wet markets. They all likely come from mishandling/butchering  animals, but none have been proven to come from a "wet market".

Bird flu came from butchering chickens in factories. It can also come from farming chickens.

Swine flu is very old, it usually comes from farming, and being in close proximity to live pigs. The last several outbreaks have started in the americas.

HIV and Ebola came from people hunting and eating Chimps.

SARS and COVID-19, we do not know. But the best evidence we currently have is that it wasn't from the wet market, as the oldest cases had nothing to do with it. They both likely started with people hunting and killing wild game, similar to things like Chronic Wasting Disease in the US.

[🏀]

Drop MOABs on every wet market that shows up from here on out

Shock and awe.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Dr Fauci agrees

https://thehill.com/changing-america/well-being/prevention-cures/491025-fauci-mind-boggling-that-chinas-wet-markets

[MUBurrow]

Its this from article above: "The Chinese government tried to ban wet markets in 2013 after a deadly avian flu outbreak, which only led to more dangerous black markets"

While I'm sure there are some cultural traditions built into these, people with the option to run to a conventional supermarket generally aren't going to wet markets, fam. 

[Eldon]

China is reopening its wet markets:

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/china-reopening-wet-markets-thats-000050944.html

[Billy Hoyle]

and it appears it may not have come from the "wet markets." One more area where positions on COVID were taken because one side didn't want to acknowledge the other side *might* be right.

https://twitter.com/RadioFreeTom/status/1397012975203102723

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/05/25/timeline-how-wuhan-lab-leak-theory-suddenly-became-credible/

[Hards Alumni]

and it appears it may not have come from the "wet markets." One more area where positions on COVID were taken because one side didn't want to acknowledge the other side *might* be right.

https://twitter.com/RadioFreeTom/status/1397012975203102723

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/05/25/timeline-how-wuhan-lab-leak-theory-suddenly-became-credible/

We still don't know where Covid19 came from with certainty.  But reopening the wet markets is a terrible idea.  That many unsanitary practices in one location is a tinder box for viruses to jump species.

[Billy Hoyle]

We still don't know where Covid19 came from with certainty.  But reopening the wet markets is a terrible idea.  That many unsanitary practices in one location is a tinder box for viruses to jump species.

I'm against the wet markets for reasons unrelated to COVID. But, dismissing the lab leak theory and immediately pushing the wet market theory as fact is an example of partisanship coming before scientific inquiry.

[Jockey]

Its this from article above: "The Chinese government tried to ban wet markets in 2013 after a deadly avian flu outbreak, which only led to more dangerous black markets"

While I'm sure there are some cultural traditions built into these, people with the option to run to a conventional supermarket generally aren't going to wet markets, fam.

Wet markets are some people's livelihood. Easy for us to say stop. Not so easy for them.

[JWags85]

Wet markets are some people's livelihood. Easy for us to say stop. Not so easy for them.

So are sweatshops and poaching, but both are wrong and should be acted against.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

I'm against the wet markets for reasons unrelated to COVID. But, dismissing the lab leak theory and immediately pushing the wet market theory as fact is an example of partisanship coming before scientific inquiry.

We used to have health monitors in these areas/labs that helped us keep tabs on this....why weren't they there to report the facts or even that the outbreak was occurring? 

The reality is that partisanship didn't shut down this investigation, the Chinese did.  Partisanship didnt come up with wet markets or lab leaks - the chinese did.  You think the prior administration didn't investigate or push this because of 'partisan scientists'?  Come on.

We need to investigate and we need to be allowed to investigate.  Good luck getting to yes on both of those things. 

[Jockey]

So are sweatshops and poaching, but both are wrong and should be acted against.

You might be right, but sweatshops and poaching mainly exist to make the rich even richer. For a lot of people, wet markets mean survival.

[rocket surgeon]

I'm against the wet markets for reasons unrelated to COVID. But, dismissing the lab leak theory and immediately pushing the wet market theory as fact is an example of partisanship coming before scientific inquiry.

  interesting how most of the "experts", including some on this very board who pushed everything but the lab leak theory are silent now and those that pushed the lab leak theory early on were censored and ruined by the likes of facebook, twitter and all the other "cool people".  this is what happens when we have an incompetent, lying media.  i'm hoping this was a big eye opener, but more than likely not.  they would rather spin our wheels about jan. 6th while the next "virus" is coming...mask up

 

[jesmu84]

  interesting how most of the "experts", including some on this very board who pushed everything but the lab leak theory are silent now and those that pushed the lab leak theory early on were censored and ruined by the likes of facebook, twitter and all the other "cool people".  this is what happens when we have an incompetent, lying media.  i'm hoping this was a big eye opener, but more than likely not.  they would rather spin our wheels about jan. 6th while the next "virus" is coming...mask up

With platforms like YouTube, patreon, substack, etc...you should really find new media sources

[forgetful]

  interesting how most of the "experts", including some on this very board who pushed everything but the lab leak theory are silent now and those that pushed the lab leak theory early on were censored and ruined by the likes of facebook, twitter and all the other "cool people".  this is what happens when we have an incompetent, lying media.  i'm hoping this was a big eye opener, but more than likely not.  they would rather spin our wheels about jan. 6th while the next "virus" is coming...mask up

The most likely source of the virus is still a natural source.

There is actually still no evidence this came from a lab. Zero. There is also no evidence of what the natural host is.

Most of these types of releases of new viruses emerge from one of two means. Venturing into areas man doesn't go (e.g. guano miners), or mishandling wild game.

[pacearrow02]

The most likely source of the virus is still a natural source.

There is actually still no evidence this came from a lab. Zero. There is also no evidence of what the natural host is.

Most of these types of releases of new viruses emerge from one of two means. Venturing into areas man doesn't go (e.g. guano miners), or mishandling wild game.

If there is zero evidence this came from a lab then why the about face from Fauci and colleagues?

[forgetful]

If there is zero evidence this came from a lab then why the about face from Fauci and colleagues?

There really isn't an about face. They are saying it can't be ruled out and it is worth looking into.

Their original dismissal was related to this being "lab created," which there is reasonable data that indicates it is most likely of natural origin.

That doesn't mean it can't be of natural origin and still be a lab leak (very different). A very simple example would be contaminated waste that wasn't properly disinfected leading to accidental release in wildlife going through the trash. Then emerges through spread of local wildlife.

As they struggle to find the original host, other possibilities continue to need to be looked at.

The fact remains though, that right now there is zero evidence this was related to the lab at all.

[rocky_warrior]

The fact remains though, that right now there is zero evidence this was related to the lab at all.

Agreed, and there's zero evidence it came from a wet market.  The only thing we know for certain is that the outbreak began in China.  Though if you want to go all conspiracy <warning />, there's also zero evidence it wasn't "imported" into China so they could be the fall guy.

As others have mentioned, China hasn't exactly been welcoming in investigators to figure it out.  So I think that breeds a lot of the mistrust/belief it was "manufactured" there, and they are hiding something.  They may be - or they may just be hiding their incompetence of figuring out where it came from.

[forgetful]

Agreed, and there's zero evidence it came from a wet market.  The only thing we know for certain is that the outbreak began in China.  Though if you want to go all conspiracy <warning />, there's also zero evidence it wasn't "imported" into China so they could be the fall guy.

As others have mentioned, China hasn't exactly been welcoming in investigators to figure it out.  So I think that breeds a lot of the mistrust/belief it was "manufactured" there, and they are hiding something.  They may be - or they may just be hiding their incompetence of figuring out where it came from.

I agree. We will never actually know the origin. China and the WHO have said that serological tests of employees showed no COVID infections within the Wuhan institute. But those samples, which could prove that it wasn't leaked have not been shared. This is in part due to the political posturing of the White House, who from the beginning was looking for someone to blame, and who had already pulled out monitors that usually keep an eye out for stuff like this. Once it is clear that one side is looking to blame, and punish, vs finding out what happened, crap goes sideways.

My main contention, and one of the reasons I stay out of the fray regarding the origins, is argument and posturing about whether it was leaked or not serves no purpose. Lab accidents happen, if this was one, it was a particularly terrible one, but the take home would be extra precautions not shutting down research.

The same gain of function research being conducted (through US funding) in Wuhan, was also ongoing in the US. The US gain of function research identified remdesivir as a potent therapy for Coronaviruses, both circulating and novel (and including SARS and MERS) back in 2017. That research saved lives.

No facility is ever immune to accidents, as safety only goes as far as people actually listen to training.

What would be more important is finding a natural host so maybe we can identify other threats before they emerge.

[Jockey]

Forgetful,

Have you read The Premonition by Michael Lewis? With your knowledge base, it seems like it would be right in your wheelhouse.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Forgetful,

Have you read The Premonition by Michael Lewis? With your knowledge base, it seems like it would be right in your wheelhouse.

Itchy, thanks for the tip, it looks very interesting. On reserve at my local library.