Jamal Cain 👍🏼

[HutchwasClutch]

I wonder what you thought about Jay Wright when MU was humming along smoothly and Nova couldn't score when they played at Marquette. Jay sucks. No offensive system.

Just hilarious you look at one half of basketball and say, "Well the great offensive rankings (a year long look at the offense vs. a single half look at the offense...) have netted us no March wins so throw those out the window. Our offense sucked at Nova, thus Wojo's offense has never had an identity or system."

Good stuff.

I thought, gee he's won two national titles. 

Wojo hasn't earned the most remote of slack for his body of work this far in at a school which heavily invests in men's basketball.  Which is either ignored or just lost on the Wojo defenders here. 

Glad you're so proud of our offensive rankings.  I'd rather win games like Wednesday.  Rankings are an easy fall back to ignore what's happening right in front of you.

[wadesworld]

I thought, gee he's won two national titles. 

Wojo hasn't earned the most remote of slack for his body of work this far in at a school which heavily invests in men's basketball.  Which is either ignored or just lost on the Wojo defenders here. 

Glad you're so proud of our offensive rankings.  I'd rather win games like Wednesday.  Rankings are an easy fall back to ignore what's happening right in front of you.

Lol! Rankings are what is happening right in front of me.

This is just proof no matter what MU does under Wojo people will cry about it.

[HutchwasClutch]

What specifically, RIGHT NOW, can do do to change the "no wins in March" straw man you present. If the answer is nothing (spoiler alert: it is) you are making a dishonest straw man argument.

Sorry if you don't like the facts as they stand at the moment. I don't either for that matter.  But they are what they are. 

But you want to throw out season rankings as your proof things are just fine, including my opinion about lacking any identity (which I didn't limit to offense) without a response in kind. 

[HutchwasClutch]

Lol! Rankings are what is happening right in front of me.

This is just proof no matter what MU does under Wojo people will cry about it.

Was their standing around on offense Wednesday acceptable to you? Was their non ball movement okay too?  Was there throwing up brick after brick for almost 30 minutes without doing anything different pleasing for you to watch?  And it's happened more times than just Wednesday. 

[brewcity77]

But the question becomes, how is it after 6 years they don't have a discernible offensive system in place to fall back on and prevent that from happening so you don't fall into a trap of playing individual basketball?

The crappy thing about the internet is that when someone counters your stupid argument, the quote feature prevents you from pretending you didn't say what you said.

[Cheeks]

Yes, we all know you're the official Wojo defender here, no matter how pathetic it sounds. How to explain Buzz and Crean's success here then?  Wojo was 38 when he took the job. Crean was 32, Buzz was 36.  I could go on, but why bother.

Yes, they missed plenty of open looks. Really keen insight to point that out, thanks. So maybe get your guys doing other things as mentioned- motion, cutting, ball movement; all that were absent and have your system quickly adjust accordingly before game gets away as it did.  Nova was running smoothly and efficiently in the meantime. But then again, Wright is older and more experienced.

But you said the offense was terrible when you now admit it was missing a lot of open shots, too.

[brewcity77]

Bailey's  zero Wednesday is the very definition of reliable. That preceded by scoring tallies of 16, 2,8, 14 in his last 5 games.

Won't even bother with Cain's reliable production.  Too easy.

Great point to wrap your post though.

Howard missed threes against Maryland. Is he now an unreliable shooter? I'm sorry that the facts don't care about your feelings.

[HutchwasClutch]

The crappy thing about the internet is that when someone counters your stupid argument, the quote feature prevents you from pretending you didn't say what you said.

Where have I been inconsistent?

[HutchwasClutch]

Howard missed threes against Maryland. Is he now an unreliable shooter? I'm sorry that the facts don't care about your feelings.

That's your counter point? One game from the all time leading scorer in program history? 

Bailey and Cain haven't been remotely consistent game to game.  To say they have been is moronic.

[brewcity77]

That's your counter point? One game from the all time leading scorer in program history? 

Bailey and Cain haven't been remotely consistent game to game.  To say they have been is moronic.

He had plenty of inconsistent games. Both Anim and Bailey are top-215 in the country in 3P% and have each made at least one three in 18/24 games this season. That's exactly what consistency is. Again, sorry the facts don't match the BS narrative you are trying to create.

[Cheeks]

That's your counter point? One game from the all time leading scorer in program history? 

Bailey and Cain haven't been remotely consistent game to game.  To say they have been is moronic.

This is categorically false.

[Elonsmusk]

Hope to see Jamal build on his performance and earn more playing time going forward.

[🏀]

This guy gives Hutch a bad reputation

[MU82]

Fun thread!

[bilsu]

Murray St and how to handle Morant sure was figured out easily by Leonard Hamilton and staff the next round. He did opposite of Wojo's approach in defending them and blew them out.

Yeah, my agenda, an opinion that doesn't match yours. You are so pompous.

This is dumb, because Florida St. was a much better team than MU. Had MU beaten Murray St. they would of still been destroyed by Florida St. Florida St. had very quick defensive players that could get out and cover outside shooters.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

"Recruited over," now becomes the term for guys regressing from Year 1, 2 and 3. 

Who did you think Sandy Cohen should play over in his sophomore year?

"Repeatedly Injured," yet didn't miss any games due to injury while Wojo was coaching.

What are you saying here? That the injuries didn't happen or that injuries can only impact development if they result in missed playing time?

Perhaps we should add:
Deonte Burton:  Recruited Over (by Sandy Cohen), who then was recruited over by whom?

Ners, this has been debunked so many times, I'm not sure what more can be said. Sandy Cohen started exactly three games when Burton was here. There were more games when they both came off the bench than Sandy starting over Burton.

What's more, there were only two games (the first two of the season) where Cohen played more minutes than Burton. Burton played more minutes than Cohen in 6/8 games.

In the two games where Burton didn't play more minutes than Cohen, one he picked up two first half fouls and then picked up his third and fourth foul with 13:52 left in the game. That's why he didn't play more. In the second game, he went 1-4 from the field with two turnovers while Cohen went 3 for 5 including 2 threes. After that game, Burton played more minutes than Cohen in every single game.

So really, there was exactly one game where Wojo played Cohen more than Burton because of play on the floor. Burton outplayed Cohen in every other game. Burton averaged 16.1 mpg during that stretch, Cohen averaged 12.3. This whole idea that Wojo played Cohen over Burton is a fabrication.

[Elonsmusk]

Who did you think Sandy Cohen should play over in his sophomore year?

What are you saying here? That the injuries didn't happen or that injuries can only impact development if they result in missed playing time?

Ners, this has been debunked so many times, I'm not sure what more can be said. Sandy Cohen started exactly three games when Burton was here. There were more games when they both came off the bench than Sandy starting over Burton.

What's more, there were only two games (the first two of the season) where Cohen played more minutes than Burton. Burton played more minutes than Cohen in 6/8 games.

In the two games where Burton didn't play more minutes than Cohen, one he picked up two first half fouls and then picked up his third and fourth foul with 13:52 left in the game. That's why he didn't play more. In the second game, he went 1-4 from the field with two turnovers while Cohen went 3 for 5 including 2 threes. After that game, Burton played more minutes than Cohen in every single game.

So really, there was exactly one game where Wojo played Cohen more than Burton because of play on the floor. Burton outplayed Cohen in every other game. Burton averaged 16.1 mpg during that stretch, Cohen averaged 12.3. This whole idea that Wojo played Cohen over Burton is a fabrication.

Sandy Cohen started his first three games in his MU career.  Deonte Burton never started 1 game under Wojo...thus Deonte got recruited over.  LOL.  This simple fact is what gave me major cause for alarm as to his coaching ability.  How in the F he thought freshman Sandy Cohen was a better option to start than Deonte was inexcusable - even if just for the first 3 games of that season.

Then the next year, Sandy Cohen got slightly more playing time than JJJ.  Yet again a WTF moment in Wojo's early career coaching at MU.

As for the injuries you cited - no, I don't feel as though they were relevant factors in those players not achieving what they had prior in their career. You have your opinion on the matter, I have mine.  Agree to disagree.

[BM1090]

Players can have had their minutes limited because of effort in practice, mental mistakes, or countless other things. JJ and Burton were clearly more talented than Sandy, but your most talented players don't automatically get the most minutes.

If all other things were equal and Sandy was playing more than those two guys then that's a red flag. We have no idea if all other things were equal.

[Cheeks]

Sandy Cohen started his first three games in his MU career.  Deonte Burton never started 1 game under Wojo...thus Deonte got recruited over.  LOL.  This simple fact is what gave me major cause for alarm as to his coaching ability.  How in the F he thought freshman Sandy Cohen was a better option to start than Deonte was inexcusable - even if just for the first 3 games of that season.

Then the next year, Sandy Cohen got slightly more playing time than JJJ.  Yet again a WTF moment in Wojo's early career coaching at MU.

As for the injuries you cited - no, I don't feel as though they were relevant factors in those players not achieving what they had prior in their career. You have your opinion on the matter, I have mine.  Agree to disagree.

Deonte wasn't playing defense, his head was in the clouds. 

Al McGuire similar issue with Bernard Toone.  He would not start Toone because he didn't play defense.  He said on any given night Toone could give Al 20 points, but at a trade off of 24 points for the other side which wasn't worth it.

You thought John Dawson was good....so why does your opinion matter at all regarding MU hoops?

[MU82]

Let's argue about who should have started 5+ years ago again, Ners. That's some real useful stuff

I think I'll hop back over to the Big East thread, where at least guru is only arguing about crap nobody can do anything about that happened only 5+ weeks ago.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Sandy Cohen started his first three games in his MU career.  Deonte Burton never started 1 game under Wojo...thus Deonte got recruited over.  LOL.  This simple fact is what gave me major cause for alarm as to his coaching ability.  How in the F he thought freshman Sandy Cohen was a better option to start than Deonte was inexcusable - even if just for the first 3 games of that season.

So who starts is more important than how many minutes a player gets in a game? So what did you think of Buzz starting Erik Williams over Jae Crowder? Was that also a major cause for alarm as to his coaching ability? Or is it possible that just because a player starts doesn't mean that the coach thinks they are the better player?

Then the next year, Sandy Cohen got slightly more playing time than JJJ.  Yet again a WTF moment in Wojo's early career coaching at MU.

This isn't true, Jajuan averaged 23.7 mpg, Sandy averaged 23.3. Though I think this is a better argument than your Deonte/Sandy one.

As for the injuries you cited - no, I don't feel as though they were relevant factors in those players not achieving what they had prior in their career. You have your opinion on the matter, I have mine.  Agree to disagree.

You have an opinion on the matter. That doesn't mean I do. Both Duane and Ed had significant injuries that impacted their development. I specifically remember Duane tweeting a video of himself from high school saying that he wished he had those legs again. Plus, Ed didn't even regress. Another poster, I believe it was Dr. B, showed that he had the same advanced stats that he did at Nebraska, he just played less minutes for a better team.

[Uncle Rico]

https://www.jsonline.com/restricted/?return=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.jsonline.com%2Fstory%2Fsports%2Fcollege%2Fmarquette%2F2020%2F02%2F17%2Fjamal-cain-becoming-key-substitute-marquette-basketball%2F4784061002%2F

[JakeBarnes]

Where have I been inconsistent?

Fair. You have been consistent in ignoring facts and reality.

[Elonsmusk]

https://www.jsonline.com/restricted/?return=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.jsonline.com%2Fstory%2Fsports%2Fcollege%2Fmarquette%2F2020%2F02%2F17%2Fjamal-cain-becoming-key-substitute-marquette-basketball%2F4784061002%2F

Can you paste content here/summarize for those of us non-subscirbers?

[rocky_warrior]

Can you paste content here/summarize for those of us non-subscirbers?

Cain is becoming a key substitute for Marquette.  You're welcome.