COVID-19 (f/k/a "the Coronavirus")

[Lennys Tap]

The irony here is that if Comey et al had acted like professionals in doing their job instead of like incompetent boy scouts who were terrified of the NY FBI office, Trump never would have been elected in the first place.

Yep.

He was a self important moron in the Clinton investigation. He didn't change his stripes (though likely added corrupt to his resume') in the Carter Page, George P, Flynn and Trump probe. Quite a guy.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

is that with states fully open including schools and large events?

I am assuming he was taking all that into account but we didn't specifically get into those details.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Where I think he has erred is in assuming people actually believe that message on doing the right thing. If this does go away to a large extent over the summer. People are going to have the memory of everyone over-reacting. The result will be when/if it re-emerges, people will be reluctant to take as severe of measures.

Yeah, that's part of what I mean by I don't think he is taking human behavior into account. But he does have a background in public health so one would think he's factored that in.  I guess we shall see soon enough.

[injuryBug]

Yeah, that's part of what I mean by I don't think he is taking human behavior into account. But he does have a background in public health so one would think he's factored that in.  I guess we shall see soon enough.

unfortunately it starts at the top.  If trump and the entire crew standing in front for each presser early on had a mask on and stood 6 feet apart more of the nation would have followed and it would be acceptable to wear a mask. 

[Lennys Tap]

https://www.post-gazette.com/news/health/2020/05/11/Pennsylvania-plan-nursing-homes-long-term-care-coronavirus-COVID-19-cases-deaths-response/stories/202005090064

68% of Covid deaths in Pennsylvania are in nursing homes - epic fail to protect the most vulnerable as robust, comprehensive plan was never implemented.

[GooooMarquette]

https://www.post-gazette.com/news/health/2020/05/11/Pennsylvania-plan-nursing-homes-long-term-care-coronavirus-COVID-19-cases-deaths-response/stories/202005090064

68% of Covid deaths in Pennsylvania are in nursing homes - epic fail to protect the most vulnerable as robust, comprehensive plan was never implemented.

Just awful. Actually having a plan that could work, and then failing to implement it.

Why consult with experts if they are going to ignore their recommendations?

[mu03eng]

Any thoughts on how/why Flordia seems to be doing much better than most states despite all the really bad press about them closing down late?

[GooooMarquette]

Coronavirus: Robot dog enforces social distancing in Singapore park

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/technology-52619568/coronavirus-robot-dog-enforces-social-distancing-in-singapore-park

[MU82]

Any thoughts on how/why Flordia seems to be doing much better than most states despite all the really bad press about them closing down late?

Three thoughts:

1. Florida ranks 8th in number of coronavirus deaths.

2. Florida ranks tied for 25th (with Missouri, Iowa and Arkansas) in coronavirus deaths per capita.

3. For me, it's too early to conclude anything. Maybe they'll do even better in the coming months, or maybe they'll get devastated as bad as anybody. I'll wait to see what the science says X number of months from now. Here's hoping things stay OK there.

[The Sultan]

Three thoughts:

1. Florida ranks 8th in number of coronavirus deaths.

2. Florida ranks tied for 25th (with Missouri, Iowa and Arkansas) in coronavirus deaths per capita.

3. For me, it's too early to conclude anything. Maybe they'll do even better in the coming months, or maybe they'll get devastated as bad as anybody. I'll wait to see what the science says X number of months from now. Here's hoping things stay OK there.

Are they now releasing all of their data?

That being said, I have a feeling we are going to find that having crowded beaches and the like isn't going to be much of a problem as long as people aren't sitting on top of one another.  (Outdoor fookin' ai'na?) 

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Any thoughts on how/why Flordia seems to be doing much better than most states despite all the really bad press about them closing down late?

I am interested in this as well.  I heard an interesting interview with Scott Gottlieb yesterday where he reiterates that summer should provide some shelter to us.

May point that being outside with people with some sense of space is less of a problem.  Even in some of the more tropical areas that have had outbreaks, it was traced back to living conditions....so further support maybe.

[mu_hilltopper]

I'll bet a beef n cheddar that 1000 people in a room the size of a football field will get infected at a 10x rate than 1000 people on an outdoor football field.

Add in 5mph breeze and a sunny day, and I'll go 20x.

I was never massively bothered by the "Florida Beach" scenes.  It was outdoors and I've been on a beach before.   Unless it's hella crowded, people's encampments are spread out.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

I'll bet a beef n cheddar that 1000 people in a room the size of a football field will get infected at a 10x rate than 1000 people on an outdoor football field.

Add in 5mph breeze and a sunny day, and I'll go 20x.

I was never massively bothered by the "Florida Beach" scenes.  It was outdoors and I've been on a beach before.   Unless it's hella crowded, people's encampments are spread out.

Even better, let's get a platter of beef n cheddar's and feast outside to test the hypothesis.

[Lennys Tap]

Three thoughts:

1. Florida ranks 8th in number of coronavirus deaths.

2. Florida ranks tied for 25th (with Missouri, Iowa and Arkansas) in coronavirus deaths per capita.

3. For me, it's too early to conclude anything. Maybe they'll do even better in the coming months, or maybe they'll get devastated as bad as anybody. I'll wait to see what the science says X number of months from now. Here's hoping things stay OK there.

1. 8th in Covid19 deaths, 3rd in US population. 6.5% of US population, 2.1% of US deaths.

2. Florida has the (along with Maine) the highest % of senior citizens in the US - 20.5% and the second highest total number behind California. Nursing homes/senior living facilities are everywhere. Given these factors and who Covid kills, one would expect Florida to be an unmitigated disaster. Instead, it's been a relative success.

3. It may be "to early" to draw conclusions about Florida's success, but It's not too early to draw conclusions about New York's, New Jersey's, Connecticut's, Massachusetts', Pennsylvania's, Michigan's and Illinois' failures. I'm content and grateful to be in Florida and reasonably confident that despite our aging population we'll be better off than most.

[StillAWarrior]

I'll bet a beef n cheddar that 1000 people in a room the size of a football field will get infected at a 10x rate than 1000 people on an outdoor football field.

Add in 5mph breeze and a sunny day, and I'll go 20x.

I was never massively bothered by the "Florida Beach" scenes.  It was outdoors and I've been on a beach before.   Unless it's hella crowded, people's encampments are spread out.

I believe I've read several times that there is only one confirmed case of spread out doors.  Personally, based on what I've read from a variety of sources, I believe outdoor activities are extremely low risk of infection.

[MU82]

1. 8th in Covid19 deaths, 3rd in US population. 6.5% of US population, 2.1% of US deaths.

2. Florida has the (along with Maine) the highest % of senior citizens in the US - 20.5% and the second highest total number behind California. Nursing homes/senior living facilities are everywhere. Given these factors and who Covid kills, one would expect Florida to be an unmitigated disaster. Instead, it's been a relative success.

3. It may be "to early" to draw conclusions about Florida's success, but It's not too early to draw conclusions about New York's, New Jersey's, Connecticut's, Massachusetts', Pennsylvania's, Michigan's and Illinois' failures. I'm content and grateful to be in Florida and reasonably confident that despite our aging population we'll be better off than most.

Thanks for expounding on that data, Lenny, and I hope you and yours stay healthy and happy.

[GooooMarquette]

As for why FL doesn't currently have higher numbers despite being late to the party, it's hard to say. Maybe they did a better job of isolating their senior facilities.

I am more worried about their early lifting of the stay-at-home order. FL lifted its stay-at-home order on May 4 (9 days ago). The incubation period of COVID-19 is believed to be 14 days, so any impact won't be seen for at least a few more days.

We should wait another week or so before we even begin to draw any conclusions....

[Pakuni]

Any thoughts on how/why Flordia seems to be doing much better than most states despite all the really bad press about them closing down late?

Unless their policies have changed (honestly don't know), Florida is tallying their deaths differently than most, in a way that lowers their toll.
They're only counting lab-confirmed cases as COVID-19, and they're not counting people who die in Florida but don't claim state residency. So, if a snowbird from Wisconsin got sick and died from COVID in Clearwater, that person wasn't included in the state's death count.

https://www.tampabay.com/news/health/2020/04/11/floridas-count-of-coronavirus-deaths-is-missing-some-cases/

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/coronavirus/fl-ne-coronavirus-florida-pneumonia-flu-deaths-spike-20200417-lkel6rlik5blhd5zdktkrxhzze-story.html

https://www.floridatoday.com/story/news/2020/04/23/counting-florida-coronavirus-dead-includes-post-mortem-covid-19-testing/5147971002/

[WarriorDad]

Despite making up less than 1% of the population, nursing home residents account for 43% of COVID deaths.  CT got it right.  Cuomo finally reversed his order over the weekend, but way too late.  PA the same.

What a tragedy and display of incompetence.


If German intelligence report (Der Spiegel over weekend) is correct that China had WHO spike the person to person transmission info for 6 weeks the ramifications of retribution will be immense.

[#UnleashSean]

I'll bet a beef n cheddar that 1000 people in a room the size of a football field will get infected at a 10x rate than 1000 people on an outdoor football field.

Add in 5mph breeze and a sunny day, and I'll go 20x.

I was never massively bothered by the "Florida Beach" scenes.  It was outdoors and I've been on a beach before.   Unless it's hella crowded, people's encampments are spread out.

I've been very confused by all the responses to lock down wide open outdoor public areas like parks and beaches.

[WarriorDad]

Unless their policies have changed (honestly don't know), Florida is tallying their deaths differently than most, in a way that lowers their toll.
They're only counting lab-confirmed cases as COVID-19, and they're not counting people who die in Florida but don't claim state residency. So, if a snowbird from Wisconsin got sick and died from COVID in Clearwater, that person wasn't included in the state's death count.

https://www.tampabay.com/news/health/2020/04/11/floridas-count-of-coronavirus-deaths-is-missing-some-cases/

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/coronavirus/fl-ne-coronavirus-florida-pneumonia-flu-deaths-spike-20200417-lkel6rlik5blhd5zdktkrxhzze-story.html

Here in Illinois we are counting any that dies with the virus even if the virus isn't what killed them. 

[Pakuni]

Here in Illinois we are counting any that dies with the virus even if the virus isn't what killed them.

That's not quite true.
The head of IDPH discussed this yesterday.

"There are also some additional deaths that happen in someone who happened to be COVID positive, but where the COVID infection had nothing to do with the deaths," she said. "So we are at IDPH trying to remove those obvious cases where the COVID diagnosis was not the reason for the death. If there was a gunshot wound, if there was a motor vehicle accident, we know that that was not related to the COVID positive status.
"We are trying to make sure that things that aren't related at all to the COVID diagnosis are removed, but if someone has another illness, like heart disease, and then had a stroke or other event, it's not as easy to separate that and say COVID didn't exacerbate that existing illness. That would not be removed from the count," she added.

https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/coronavirus/dr-ngozi-ezike-refutes-notion-that-illinois-is-over-counting-covid-19-deaths/2270810/

[cheebs09]

Is it possible that those in Florida who caught it on Spring Break took it home with them, thus the numbers are spread out a bit more? I wonder if most of the impact isn't showing up in Florida numbers. Also, with most spring breakers being young, maybe there weren't a ton of hospitalizations.

[tower912]

Florida was refusing to release data for a while.   So, either sunshine or different data.

[wadesworld]

Here in Illinois we are counting any that dies with the virus even if the virus isn't what killed them.

When did you make the move from SoCal to the Midwest?