Texas Fans Done With Shaka Smart - Is His Fate Tied To Wojo's?

[Hards Alumni]

By "Mike Deane 2.0," I meant that I viewed both he and Moser as good tacticians but my gut instinct was that Moser would struggle with recruiting just as Deane did.

Ultimately, we'll never know how Moser's recruiting at Marquette would have played out.  But his recruiting at Oklahoma has done nothing to change my opinion.

two four star recruits this year

[WhiteTrash]

I see it as:  Shaka>Moser>>>>>>Deane

[milwaukee ex-pat]

I think Moser is going to do fine at Oklahoma.  Being a football school will give him plenty of rope.  His MO seems to take a couple years, sort of like Majerus, but he has shown he knows what type of players can succeed in his system and after a couple of years his teams are an incredibly hard out.  We'll see.  Shaka is a unicorn, sort of like Al.  As stated above it was alot of unlikely things happening at just the right time but now he is building a  program in exactly the way, as an MU fan, I love to see it built - culture, culture, culture.  I love how he plays the freshman even though that can put some games at risk, I love the defense style he has chosen - maybe not the style that will produce the statistically best defense but it is a fun way to play, and what is fun is easier to motivate players' efforts.  He seems to be all about getting the intangible competitive edge of having the payers find spiritual (not sure if that is the right word) motivation to exceed their natural abilities.  It is an incredible program.

[tower912]

I have done so well at avoiding this thread....

One of Moser's trademarks at Loyola was running a lot of the offense out of the high post.   Oso would have thrived in that.    Perhaps not as much as he is in the endless motion pick and roll.   But he would have done well.

[Dr. Blackheart]

5 years to judge

[Uncle Rico]

5 years to judge

I know it's a joke that we like to use, but there was a time that was accurate, for the most part.  That time is over, though.

[MU82]

I think Moser is going to do fine at Oklahoma.  Being a football school will give him plenty of rope.  His MO seems to take a couple years

Yeah, it took him only 14 years to finish higher than 5th in any conference. He's got this!

[milwaukee ex-pat]

Yeah, it took him only 14 years to finish higher than 5th in any conference. He's got this!

Yes and then he had it rolling at an elite level. Final 4 and 2 years later taking down a 1 seed in what was pure art.  That Illinois team was amazing and playing great and he beat them. I'd say he's a proven program builder however long it took him. Took Majerus a minute too.

[MU82]

Yes and then he had it rolling at an elite level. Final 4 and 2 years later taking down a 1 seed in what was pure art.  That Illinois team was amazing and playing great and he beat them. I'd say he's a proven program builder however long it took him. Took Majerus a minute too.

The coach Marquette rejected appreciates your support.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I know it's a joke that we like to use, but there was a time that was accurate, for the most part.  That time is over, though.

Agreed. There's still some wisdom in not getting overly excited/disappointed about a coach based on the results of single seasons....but insta-transfers changes the game. Coaches can now build contenders from nothing in a single offseason.

[The Sultan]

Yes and then he had it rolling at an elite level. Final 4 and 2 years later taking down a 1 seed in what was pure art.  That Illinois team was amazing and playing great and he beat them. I'd say he's a proven program builder however long it took him. Took Majerus a minute too.

Oklahoma wasn't nearly as bad as Loyola and it was a different time wrt the portal.  I think he's completely miscast there and will be gone if he has another year like last year.

[brewcity77]

Some on here simply questioned the quality and attractiveness of the MU job. That was where I was honestly baffled.

It's just history. Look at our hires since Al. Hank, Rick, & Buzz were all internal hires. O'Neill, Crean, & Wojo were assistants getting their first HC gig. The only sitting head coaches we hired were Dukiet & Deane from the mid-major MAAC.

Probably didn't help that we were very publicly turned down by a certain mid-major coach our last go around.

We know what this program is and could be, but 40 years of hiring indicates the outside view didn't match with our assessment.

[WhiteTrash]

It's just history. Look at our hires since Al. Hank, Rick, & Buzz were all internal hires. O'Neill, Crean, & Wojo were assistants getting their first HC gig. The only sitting head coaches we hired were Dukiet & Deane from the mid-major MAAC.

Probably didn't help that we were very publicly turned down by a certain mid-major coach our last go around.

We know what this program is and could be, but 40 years of hiring indicates the outside view didn't match with our assessment.

What were Duke's last two hires? Low major HC and an internal hire. Villanova? Mid major HC and internal hire. Arizona? Mid major HC and assistant. MU? Duke assistant and Texas HC.

[brewcity77]

What were Duke's last two hires? Low major HC and an internal hire. Villanova? Mid major HC and internal hire. Arizona? Mid major HC and assistant. MU? Duke assistant and Texas HC.

First, you can't count Shaka to this thread because it was started when Shaka was in the middle of his last season at Texas. Second, Duke and Nova aren't good comps to Marquette's pre-Shaka hires because there were multiple national championships between those two hires.

But what this really shows is that aspiring to hire sitting high major head coaches is really uncommon and difficult. That's why Shaka was such an incredible hire, and it's even more impressive how well it's worked out so far.

[WhiteTrash]

First, you can't count Shaka to this thread because it was started when Shaka was in the middle of his last season at Texas. Second, Duke and Nova aren't good comps to Marquette's pre-Shaka hires because there were multiple national championships between those two hires.

But what this really shows is that aspiring to hire sitting high major head coaches is really uncommon and difficult. That's why Shaka was such an incredible hire, and it's even more impressive how well it's worked out so far.

Fair points. I think they kind of support my position that while MU may not attract a sitting and successful high major HC, that by no means indicates that it is an unattractive job.

The origin of my thought was fans on this board arguing that essentially Wojo was the best we could get and no decent coach would take the MU job so we had to keep Wojo. IMHO, that was crazy and unsupportable.

[The Sultan]

First, you can't count Shaka to this thread because it was started when Shaka was in the middle of his last season at Texas. Second, Duke and Nova aren't good comps to Marquette's pre-Shaka hires because there were multiple national championships between those two hires.

But what this really shows is that aspiring to hire sitting high major head coaches is really uncommon and difficult. That's why Shaka was such an incredible hire, and it's even more impressive how well it's worked out so far.

And how smart it was to not burn bridges with him after he turned it down the first time.

[brewcity77]

Fair points. I think they kind of support my position that while MU may not attract a sitting and successful high major HC, that by no means indicates that it is an unattractive job.

The origin of my thought was fans on this board arguing that essentially Wojo was the best we could get and no decent coach would take the MU job so we had to keep Wojo. IMHO, that was crazy and unsupportable.

I'm with you there. Obviously no hire is guaranteed (bad under Majerus got worse when we let him go for Dukiet) but I agree that this was always going to be an attractive job. Even landing Wojo showed that. It didn't work out, but at the time he was probably the most prominent assistant name in the country.

But I think it was obviously time to move on and thankfully recent history has supported that.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

two four star recruits this year

Fair.  Looks like two top 100 sophomores and one top 100 freshman on the roster.

But two projected starters started at mid-majors before transferring to Oklahoma.  Two other projected starters played at Oregon and Pitt, but neither were stars.

That roster is 48th in Kenpom and 71st in T Rank preseason rankings.  It's year three of the Moser era and Oklahoma is treading water in mediocrity. 

I understand the Big 12 is a meat grinder and the SEC might be a little easier when Oklahoma switches conferences.  But Moser has done nothing to convince me he would have thrived at Marquette.

[Hards Alumni]

Fair.  Looks like two top 100 sophomores and one top 100 freshman on the roster.

But two projected starters started at mid-majors before transferring to Oklahoma.  Two other projected starters played at Oregon and Pitt, but neither were stars.

That roster is 48th in Kenpom and 71st in T Rank preseason rankings.  It's year three of the Moser era and Oklahoma is treading water in mediocrity. 

I understand the Big 12 is a meat grinder and the SEC might be a little easier when Oklahoma switches conferences.  But Moser has done nothing to convince me he would have thrived at Marquette.

I don't disagree, but he would have been better than Wojo.  I was elated when Shaka was available, but Moser would have been 'fine'... but very boring.

I think Moser will be fine at Oklahoma.  He will adapt, and is obviously a knowledgeable coach.  He has a good chance of turning that program into a Wisconsin clone that exists in the B12.  Is that enough to make noise or keep fans interested?  I'm not sure.

[The Sultan]

I don't disagree, but he would have been better than Wojo.  I was elated when Shaka was available, but Moser would have been 'fine'... but very boring.

I think Moser will be fine at Oklahoma.  He will adapt, and is obviously a knowledgeable coach.  He has a good chance of turning that program into a Wisconsin clone that exists in the B12.  Is that enough to make noise or keep fans interested?  I'm not sure.

Not sure he'll be given that chance. Ryan made the NCAAs in year one and showed marked improvement in year two. Moser didn't. 

[Hards Alumni]

Not sure he'll be given that chance. Ryan made the NCAAs in year one and showed marked improvement in year two. Moser didn't.

Personally, I think coaches will be given a larger leash for a couple of years while everyone adapts to the new transfer and NIL environment.

I could be wrong. 

[Jay Bee]

Fair.  Looks like two top 100 sophomores and one top 100 freshman on the roster.

But two projected starters started at mid-majors before transferring to Oklahoma.  Two other projected starters played at Oregon and Pitt, but neither were stars.

That roster is 48th in Kenpom and 71st in T Rank preseason rankings.  It's year three of the Moser era and Oklahoma is treading water in mediocrity. 

I understand the Big 12 is a meat grinder and the SEC might be a little easier when Oklahoma switches conferences.  But Moser has done nothing to convince me he would have thrived at Marquette.

Moser doesn't have the benefit of lots of Wojo recruits

[WhiteTrash]

Moser doesn't have the benefit of lots of Wojo recruits

Ahhhhh, the damn ol' bare cupboard. I say 9 years to decide on Porter.

[milwaukee ex-pat]

If he makes the tournament this year he's fine I would think and I predict he'll make the tourney.  Can't wait for season to start.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

The origin of my thought was fans on this board arguing that essentially Wojo was the best we could get and no decent coach would take the MU job so we had to keep Wojo. IMHO, that was crazy and unsupportable.

I honestly think you are misremembering. No one ever disputed that a top mid-major coach or high major assistant would come here. But there were posters arguing that we could poach guys like Nate Oates (after he went to Alabama), Eric Musselman, and Billy Donovan. And any time you hire a mid-major coach or top assistant, there are risks. You never know how moving up in competition or getting the big chair will impact results.