THE COACH WOJO PRESSER/ New Contract & Expectations

[Herman Cain]

I don't remember if you were the one I had this argument with already or not, so apologies if you are. But recruiting comes in cycles. When a big class graduates, like what happened in 2017, a down year is expected. The last time Marquette had an expected down year was Wojo's first year where he had a losing record and missed the post season. The next down year, he made the NIT as a high seed. That's improvement. Maybe the team doesn't improve from one season to the next (that doesn't happen every year for any team otherwise we'd have one team winning the national championship every year) but the program may still be improving overall.

Same thing is going to happen in 20-21. With everyone graduating, a down year will be expected. The hope  and maybe even expectation is that despite the down year, Marquette will still make the tourney, though possibly by the skin of their teeth.

20-21 we still have Theo Jamal Greg , Brendan,Koby And hopefully Ike . Symir will be on board and Dexter a sophomore . Probably get some transfers and grad transfers .

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

We did have that argument.  Going from the NCAA to the NIT is not improving no matter how you try to couch it.  And it holds even less weight when that big class that graduated was the empty cupboard.

That's fine, we just see it differently. You're right that the quality of the team didn't improve from 16-17 to 17-18, but I think the quality of the program did.

It was an empty cupboard. Even with a full four years of development and supplemental recruiting, the best the group could manage was a 10 seed in the NCAA. Got them out and the next group has already managed a 5 seed and will hopefully get more next season. The goal is that every recruiting cycle brings better results than the last one.

[Cheeks]

Never been better? We haven’t won a tournament game since 2013.

I saw a coach who got heated for no reason at a press conference on May 9th that was supposed to be celebrating his extension.

His answer on the Hausers was a total chicken sh!t answer. You’re surprised? Really? You’re the head coach, how are you surprised. Control your locker room. And the whole 800 kids a year transfer is total BS. Yeah those numbers are true but it’s probably 90% of kids transferring down a level cuz they can’t hang, kids transferring up because they need better competition, or kids transferring closer to home. Teams don’t lose 2 of their top 3 players.

Also, Markus is extremely celebrated and appreciated. For him to think otherwise is another area where I guess he just doesn’t know what the hell is going on.

Having said all that, I do think we’re going to be pretty good next year and I hope that the product on the court makes us forget about this offseason

A chickenshat answer?  Sigh

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

20-21 we still have Theo Jamal Greg , Koby And hopefully Ike . Symir will be on board and Dexter a sophomore . Probably get some transfers and grad transfers .

I'm well aware of what we will have. If Wojo somehow turns in a better season after graduating an All American, Ed, Jayce, and Sacar...then he might be a better coach then anyone ever expected.

[Cheeks]

He even acknowledged it. “Don’t let my intensity stop you from asking questions”

It’s a press conference in May. To take a page out of your book Wades R-E-L-A—X

Intensity and passion equals heated?   Nope

[Cheeks]

I feel like the program was in a better state in 77, 03, and 11. But that's just me.

Program in 77 was actually a mess .... last team into the tournament, lost last three home games, fight in the locker room...Scoop would have been insane.   Then we went on a run.  ‘03, don’t you remember the gnashing of teeth on Previous board when we were blown out in CUSA tournament with like 30 turnovers?  In ‘11, if I recall, we were 18-13 going into the Big East tournament with bracketologists wondering if we would even get in.  Lost our last Big East tourney game by almost 30.  We went on a run in the NCAAs.

[Small Orange Soda]

That's fine, we just see it differently. You're right that the quality of the team didn't improve from 16-17 to 17-18, but I think the quality of the program did.

It was an empty cupboard. Even with a full four years of development and supplemental recruiting, the best the group could manage was a 10 seed in the NCAA. Got them out and the next group has already managed a 5 seed and will hopefully get more next season. The goal is that every recruiting cycle brings better results than the last one.

A lot of people go after guru and willie for bending over backwards to find the negative.  "We've improved every year" is the other side of that coin.

Everyone wants to talk about how bad those players were until they left, then it was "well what do you expect?  The bad players left!"

[Cheeks]

A lot of people go after guru and willie for bending over backwards to find the negative.  "We've improved every year" is the other side of that coin.

Everyone wants to talk about how bad those players were until they left, then it was "well what do you expect?  The bad players left!"

Hypothetical for you.

Year one you go 22-10 make NCAA with rating of 39
Year two you go 23-9 make NIT with rating of 36

Year two better record, higher rating, but selection crew said no.....therefore didn’ improve....is that correct?  Purely hypothetical question.

[Small Orange Soda]

Intensity and passion equals heated?   Nope

https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/heated

They're both right there, my dude.

[Cheeks]

https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/heated

They're both right there, my dude.

Also right there... excited, impassioned.  Just another example of people seeing what they want to see.  I didn’t see any anger as is implied, but whatever

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

A lot of people go after guru and willie for bending over backwards to find the negative.  "We've improved every year" is the other side of that coin.

That's fine if you see it that way. I just hope you recognize that if you look at that way then no one improves every year and roughly half of everyone does worse than they did the year before, so Wojo not improving between seasons once in 5 years is ahead of the curve.

Everyone wants to talk about how bad those players were until they left, then it was "well what do you expect?  The bad players left!"

They weren't bad players, they weren't great players. Their peak was to be complimentary starters on a team that barely made the NCAA. But you still need players like that (or better) to fill out a roster. We lost a lot after year three, but we only dropped about 4 seed lines. The year after that, we got our 4th best NCAA seed in 40 years. Goal is to have each recruiting cycle be better than the last one.

[dgies9156]

Program in 77 was actually a mess .... last team into the tournament, lost last three home games, fight in the locker room...Scoop would have been insane.   Then we went on a run. 

Umm, that was back in the days when the expectation was a Top 5 ranking, deep run into the NCAA and a consensus All-American.

We were insane even without Scoop. We just talked out our thoughts rather than publishing them. Could not figure out what the heck was going on.. and why?

And then....!

Do any of you on this Board think we're poised for an "and then" moment?"

[Small Orange Soda]

Hypothetical for you.

Year one you go 22-10 make NCAA with rating of 39
Year two you go 23-9 make NIT with rating of 36

Year two better record, higher rating, but selection crew said no.....therefore didn’ improve....is that correct?  Purely hypothetical question.

For me, there is no greater divide than the NCAA/NIT.  So while I'm sure there are stats and measurements that one could point to and call improvement, big picture it's about making the tourney.  If people want to say "We've improved every year according to *insert stat*", that's fine, but they should probably clarify that.  According to the tournament hierarchy we inarguably took a step back.

[Cheeks]

Umm, that was back in the days when the expectation was a Top 5 ranking, deep run into the NCAA and a consensus All-American.

We were insane even without Scoop. We just talked out our thoughts rather than publishing them. Could not figure out what the heck was going on.. and why?

And then....!

Do any of you on this Board think we're poised for an "and then" moment?"

Understood, but doesn’t change what I said.  The three examples given had one thing in common, good success in the ncaa tournament.  They also had some other things in common....narrow wins in the tournament that one possession different could have ended abruptly, regular season for two of them that was erratic in nature, blow out losses in the conference tournament (obviously we didn’t play in one in ‘77), etc. 

The and then is a crapshoot.  Did Loyola Chicago think and then....but their bracket cleared out and they were fortunate to win games.  And then is about many things, including luck which Mr. Izzo and Mr. Roy Williams stated along with so many other high level coaches.

And then....luck, skill, etc happened.  We will have our moments again.

[Cheeks]

For me, there is no greater divide than the NCAA/NIT.  So while I'm sure there are stats and measurements that one could point to and call improvement, big picture it's about making the tourney.  If people want to say "We've improved every year according to *insert stat*", that's fine, but they should probably clarify that.  According to the tournament hierarchy we inarguably took a step back.

But you do recognize each year there isn’t a magical guarantee unless you win your conf tournament you ultimately have to be put in by a committee.  My point being you can be better from year to the next and not go one year, or not go as far, etc.  Our ‘76 team was better than our ‘77 team, but ‘77 won it all despite damn near not making the dance at all.

[Herman Cain]

I'm well aware of what we will have. If Wojo somehow turns in a better season after graduating an All American, Ed, Jayce, and Sacar...then he might be a better coach then anyone ever expected.

Amended that to add Brendan. So we will have 5 very experienced Big East Level players . No reason that team won’t be very competitive .

[onepost]

I don't want to spend a lot of time quoting Coach, but I started really tuning in when the 6:00 mark of the video began when he spoke of maturity and such as what one needs to be able to separate true or realistic expectation from 'noise.'

And how some players or young men are treated like Pro's already and have a lot of outside influences in their ears.

"You should drown out the noise. . . "

"The noise comes from a small minority."

"And...and...that minority might not have your best interests at heart." *

"Expectations, GREAT . . . BRING THEM ON. I think we have done a hell of a job."

"I am proud of what our program has done, I am proud of my staff, I love my kids, . . . and you know what, do we want to do better? ABSOLUTELY."

"We want expectations, that is one of the reasons I came to Marquette. There are high expectations, and to me that's awesome."
 

"Every team in the country has expectations, except maybe 1 Virginia [The National Champion each year]

Maybe many of you the 'expectations' you had were not met...but I do not think it was due to a lack of effort or desire but I think it came from the 'noise' or advice or dissatisfaction from outside on behalf of a few that crept in from the outside that had worked to break up what was a winning situation...

<These are mic drop's for me here. He could have ended the conference here and I am satisfied, so . . . Um, ..yeah. > lol 


And that is just 6:55 into the conference...let me watch the rest of it and we will see...

Enjoy prom this weekend.

[Small Orange Soda]

That's fine if you see it that way. I just hope you recognize that if you look at that way then no one improves every year and roughly half of everyone does worse than they did the year before, so Wojo not improving between seasons once in 5 years is ahead of the curve.

They weren't bad players, they weren't great players. Their peak was to be complimentary starters on a team that barely made the NCAA. But you still need players like that (or better) to fill out a roster. We lost a lot after year three, but we only dropped about 4 seed lines. The year after that, we got our 4th best NCAA seed in 40 years. Goal is to have each recruiting cycle be better than the last one.

I absolutely recognize that.  This conversation started, just like it did last time, because someone claimed we improved every year.  I'm happy to put it to bed so long as people stop saying it.

Regarding what we lost after Year 3, had we gotten more out of Wojo's first big recruiting class, maybe we're not having this convo.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Amended that to add Brendan. So we will have 5 very experienced Big East Level players . No reason that team won’t be very competitive .

I didn't say we wouldn't be very competitive. I said we will be worse than we were the year before.

[Small Orange Soda]

But you do recognize each year there isn’t a magical guarantee unless you win your conf tournament you ultimately have to be put in by a committee.  My point being you can be better from year to the next and not go one year, or not go as far, etc.  Our ‘76 team was better than our ‘77 team, but ‘77 won it all despite damn near not making the dance at all.

I think there are extenuating circumstances, sure.  I do not think they apply to the team we are discussing.

[jesmu84]

Is there a contingent of fans of who don't believe Wojo expects to succeed here?  Or that he doesn't work hard?  Or doesn't put in the effort? That his expectations are out of whack?

The issues with Wojo are results based.  In the expectations thread I saw a lot of agreement about expecting to be Top 25.  Well, Wojo has done that once in his tenure, this past season (And for a while there, it was a lot of fun!).  But it ended with blowing a shot at a Big East championship, getting pantsed in the NCAA tournament by a double digit seed, and then losing two starters (most likely to our in-state rival).  And that was, without a doubt, his best season.  So while I'm not gonna defend any extreme vitriol from the segment of the fanbase that he complained about, it's not surprising in the slightest that there are unhappy fans out there.  Hopefully we have a great season and Wojo can tell everyone to shove it.

And going from the NCAA to the NIT is not "improving each and every year"

Yes

[brewcity77]

A couple recalcitrant players didn’t trust the process and, with likely goading from helicopter parents, quit on the program. I see a fire in the eyes of coaches and players I didn’t see all last year. The state of the program has never been better.

Why do you feel it necessary to libel Dave & Steph Hauser? Why do you feel it necessary to constantly go after the boys as well? They're gone, just let it play out. I feel like all this site is right now is people blasting back and forth about this, we have no control, just let it play out. Sometimes people do things for reasons they perceive are in their best interest. If it has nothing to do with you, which in this case it certainly doesn't, why keep bad-mouthing them for making that decision?

[muguru]

I don't remember if you were the one I had this argument with already or not, so apologies if you are. But recruiting comes in cycles. When a big class graduates, like what happened in 2017, a down year is expected. The last time Marquette had an expected down year was Wojo's first year where he had a losing record and missed the post season. The next down year, he made the NIT as a high seed. That's improvement. Maybe the team doesn't improve from one season to the next (that doesn't happen every year for any team otherwise we'd have one team winning the national championship every year) but the program may still be improving overall.

Same thing is going to happen in 20-21. With everyone graduating, a down year will be expected. The hope  and maybe even expectation is that despite the down year, Marquette will still make the tourney, though possibly by the skin of their teeth.

This is what I don't get..why should it be, and why does it have to be expected?? Bottom line, it doesn't need to be. No reason a program like MU can't at minimum maintain their success from the previous year when a class graduates. Why should they make it by the skin of their teeth?? My expectations from year to year is that they make the tournament comfortably(everyone's definition of that is different). People talk like this program is Old Dominion or Dayton or something. I get tired of that.

[GrimmReaper33]

Wojo can talk the talk, I'm just waiting for him to walk the walk.  Reminds me of his press conference at the end of the 17-18 season when he was saying "We are going to be a program that wins a lot of games in March.."

They went 1-5 this past March including a tournament beat down by a 12 seed.

[Cheeks]

This is what I don't get..why should it be, and why does it have to be expected?? Bottom line, it doesn't need to be. No reason a program like MU can't at minimum maintain their success from the previous year when a class graduates. Why should they make it by the skin of their teeth?? My expectations from year to year is that they make the tournament comfortably(everyone's definition of that is different). People talk like this program is Old Dominion or Dayton or something. I get tired of that.

Why did an actual elite program like UNC miss the tournament? Or Syracuse? Or any number of schools?  Why don’t they just make
It Every single year.....reminder, there are what, 6 or 7 schools that currently have made it more 6 straight years.  That’s it.