Author Topic: TBT 2019 (Read 130652 times)

wadesworld · « **Reply #625 on:** August 06, 2019, 10:17:39 PM »

I've always hated the Elam ending. If it's a tight game the refs do everything they can to not blow their whistles to give a team an easy shot at getting 25% of their points needed and it turns into a hack fest and terrible basketball, and if it's a blowout it's hoist up 3 pointers on both sides of the court and turns into a brick fest and horrible basketball.

MU82 · « **Reply #626 on:** August 06, 2019, 10:24:15 PM »

Didn't McNeal miss some earlier TBT games because he was hurt? He sure looked a step (or two) slow today, and those two giveaways were brutal. I'm actually hoping he was still hurting a little, because that's at least a viable excuse.

When they came out of the timeout before the start of the Elam ending, I turned to Mrs. 82 and said, "I can't believe Acker's not out there instead of McNeal." I'm glad to see several Scoopers said they thought the same thing.

Still, despite it all, MU had good open looks for Diener, Jamil and Buycks down the stretch. Still had a chance. It was a good run, and I enjoyed the 3 games I watched.

CountryRoads · « **Reply #627 on:** August 06, 2019, 10:38:32 PM »

Quote from: wadesworld on August 06, 2019, 10:17:39 PM

I've always hated the Elam ending. If it's a tight game the refs do everything they can to not blow their whistles to give a team an easy shot at getting 25% of their points needed and it turns into a hack fest and terrible basketball, and if it's a blowout it's hoist up 3 pointers on both sides of the court and turns into a brick fest and horrible basketball.

Elam ending has flaws. Anti climatic that a game as physical as that ends on a foul 90 feet from the basket. It can be pretty exciting but I’d never want to see the college game go to the Elam ending or 4 quarters.

MU82 · « **Reply #628 on:** August 06, 2019, 10:43:21 PM »

I like the Elam ending for this kind of tournament. Makes it different, and it has resulted in many exciting endings without a dozen fouls and 6 time-outs turning the final 3 minutes into 35-minute slogs. But, like AirPunch (and obviously wades), I would never want to see it in D1 basketball.

4 quarters? I'd be open-minded about it. I do like that team fouls reset after each quarter. Not clamoring for it, but I wouldn't reject it out of hand. Works quite well for women's game and high school, so I don't see why it absolutely wouldn't work for men's D1.

Dr. Blackheart · « **Reply #629 on:** August 06, 2019, 10:44:08 PM »

Tom Crean (@TomCrean) Tweeted:
Even in defeat, it’s incredible to watch people we love on the @GoldenEaglesTBT Play and Coach with the passion, determination and resolve that our family got to see first hand for years. Great job and thank you @thetournament and @espn for such an incredible platform.

MUfan12 · « **Reply #630 on:** August 06, 2019, 10:47:54 PM »

I think the game flows so much better with quarters. Unfortunately they'll screw up that flow by shoehorning that final TV timeout into the second and fourth quarters.

Mr. Sand-Knit · « **Reply #631 on:** August 06, 2019, 11:05:08 PM »

Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on August 06, 2019, 10:44:08 PM

Tom Crean (@TomCrean) Tweeted:
Even in defeat, it’s incredible to watch people we love on the @GoldenEaglesTBT Play and Coach with the passion, determination and resolve that our family got to see first hand for years. Great job and thank you @thetournament and @espn for such an incredible platform.

@tom go f urself

wadesworld · « **Reply #632 on:** August 06, 2019, 11:08:43 PM »

What happened to the fake Tom Crean twitter account? That was gold.

21rooster · « **Reply #633 on:** August 06, 2019, 11:18:24 PM »

I love the Elam ending. The finish was no more anticlimactic than watching a team dribble out the clock or shoot endless free throws. The team that executed at the end won.

I don’t love playing a guy at the end who has done nothing to help the team get where they are. Acker kept them in the game with his threes, then he rode the pine while his replacement handed the game away. JC was excellent all tourney, but that coaching mistake was co$tly.

Mr. Sand-Knit · « **Reply #634 on:** August 07, 2019, 03:45:53 AM »

Players win games
Coaches lose them

ZiggysFryBoy · « **Reply #635 on:** August 07, 2019, 06:15:03 AM »

Quote from: wadesworld on August 06, 2019, 11:08:43 PM

What happened to the fake Tom Crean twitter account? That was gold.

TC lost his sh!t when the fake account reported Harbaugh to the 49ers, before harbaugh went to the 49ers.

NickelDimer · « **Reply #636 on:** August 07, 2019, 08:38:29 AM »

As good a job as Chapman did the entire tourney, he blew that game. Awful roster management. Rel hadn’t earned many minutes at all much less the crucial minutes with 2mil on the line. I feel really bad for the guys that got them there only to have it blown by a guy who didn’t contribute. I love Jerel but that was inexcusably bad by him and JC

Scoop Snoop · « **Reply #637 on:** August 07, 2019, 08:43:56 AM »

Quote from: wadesworld on August 06, 2019, 10:17:39 PM

I've always hated the Elam ending. If it's a tight game the refs do everything they can to not blow their whistles to give a team an easy shot at getting 25% of their points needed and it turns into a hack fest and terrible basketball, and if it's a blowout it's hoist up 3 pointers on both sides of the court and turns into a brick fest and horrible basketball.

I really do not like the Elam. I hope that other concepts develop as to how to eliminate some of the problems at game end. Here's one idea (that surely will quickly be picked apart by Scoopers) :
at the 3 minute mark (or wherevever you want to I.D. as the time frame) a buzzer goes off alerting the teams that the following is now in effect: both teams in double bonus and up to 3 shots are allowed to get the 2 free throws (or 4 to get 3) . The shot clock goes to 20 seconds on possesions after the first stoppage of play following the 3 minute buzzer.

Billy Hoyle · « **Reply #638 on:** August 07, 2019, 10:01:26 AM »

Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on August 06, 2019, 10:44:08 PM

Tom Crean (@TomCrean) Tweeted:
Even in defeat, it’s incredible to watch people we love on the @GoldenEaglesTBT Play and Coach with the passion, determination and resolve that our family got to see first hand for years. Great job and thank you @thetournament and @espn for such an incredible platform.

Thank you, Coach!

I see that Buzz has stayed silent, not acknowledging guys who played for him.

warriorchick · « **Reply #639 on:** August 07, 2019, 10:34:45 AM »

Quote from: Scoop Snoop on August 07, 2019, 08:43:56 AM

I really do not like the Elam. I hope that other concepts develop as to how to eliminate some of the problems at game end. Here's one idea (that surely will quickly be picked apart by Scoopers) :
at the 3 minute mark (or wherevever you want to I.D. as the time frame) a buzzer goes off alerting the teams that the following is now in effect: both teams in double bonus and up to 3 shots are allowed to get the 2 free throws (or 4 to get 3) . The shot clock goes to 20 seconds on possesions after the first stoppage of play following the 3 minute buzzer.

Too complicated. How about just 2 shots and the ball?

Benny B · « **Reply #640 on:** August 07, 2019, 12:36:24 PM »

Quote from: Scoop Snoop on August 07, 2019, 08:43:56 AM

I really do not like the Elam. I hope that other concepts develop as to how to eliminate some of the problems at game end. Here's one idea (that surely will quickly be picked apart by Scoopers) :
at the 3 minute mark (or wherevever you want to I.D. as the time frame) a buzzer goes off alerting the teams that the following is now in effect: both teams in double bonus and up to 3 shots are allowed to get the 2 free throws (or 4 to get 3) . The shot clock goes to 20 seconds on possesions after the first stoppage of play following the 3 minute buzzer.

How loud is the buzzer when the moon phase is a waning gibbous? And how much time is added to the shot clock when the visiting team has three players with the same middle initial (but different first names)?

The Elam Ending is simple and easy to understand, and it requires no material change in the rules of the game... it only modifies one thing: how the game ends. Buckets still count the same, fouls still register the same, number of players on the court stays the same, etc.

There are three ways you can end a game without changing the rules of the game: current clock rules, running clock (ala soccer) and Elam. There are also three end-of game situations at the under-4 stoppage: large lead, tie game (1 possession game), close game (within 3-4 possessions). Looking at each.

Large Lead: Rarely does a team who is down by double digits with under four to play have a chance to win the game under current rules, so with a running clock, it would be virtually impossible. Either way, you're not looking at the possibility of an extended game (OT or intentional FT's). With Elam, the trailing team at least has a chance to come back simply by shutting down the other team... no risk of having the clock run out. So Elam could potentially extend the game a bit longer than current or running clock, but like the NCAA Tournment itself, it doesn't matter how well you performed the first 90% of the game, everyone controls their own destiny to the very end.

Tight Game: Very exciting, back-and-forth contests. Great for watching and TV. But potential for OT extends length-of-game significantly, regardless of current or running clock. Elam can maintain the excitement without increasing length-of-game.

Close Game: Intentional FT's usually means one of two things... you're going to extend the game into OT, or you're going to extend the game in an exercise of futility. Running clock actually provides a meaningful length-of-game benefit in these situations, but it also means that a 3 possession game with 2 to play would be virtually insurmountable without reducing the shot clock duration. Elam is the best of both worlds... both teams play the game until the very end without material increase to length-of-game.

That said, I don't think we'll see Elam Ending in NCAA anytime soon, but if I'm a content producer, capping the length-of-game and/or keeping games competitive to the very last bucket might be music to my ears.

rocket surgeon · « **Reply #641 on:** August 07, 2019, 12:39:52 PM »

for $2 million, play it out the right way-might as well make it take it

jsglow · « **Reply #642 on:** August 07, 2019, 01:06:48 PM »

I personally think the bashing of Rel is somewhat uncalled for. Did he struggle in Elam last night? Hell ya. But let's remember the critical minutes he played on Sunday to get them to the Final.

Rel forced a turnover right at the beginning of Elam in that game if my memory serves in what were his first minutes on the floor. I think Chapman's thought process was the D he brought to the table plus some rebounding was more than Mo could offer in a 3-5 possession stint. Remember that Travis, Dwight, Jamil AND Cook were all going to be on the floor, guaranteed. Chapman simply did not anticipate that Rel was going to have turnover problems. Perhaps the 'rust' associated with his injury should have been a factor. Water over the dam at this point.

I'm sure Rel is taking this personally today. Let's be a little charitable.

#UnleashSean · « **Reply #643 on:** August 07, 2019, 01:10:54 PM »

Quote from: jsglow on August 07, 2019, 01:06:48 PM

I personally think the bashing of Rel is somewhat uncalled for. Did he struggle in Elam last night? Hell ya. But let's remember the critical minutes he played on Sunday to get them to the Final.

Rel forced a turnover right at the beginning of Elam in that game if my memory serves in what were his first minutes on the floor. I think Chapman's thought process was the D he brought to the table plus some rebounding was more than Mo could offer in a 3-5 possession stint. Remember that Travis, Dwight, Jamil AND Cook were all going to be on the floor, guaranteed. Chapman simply did not anticipate that Rel was going to have turnover problems. Perhaps the 'rust' associated with his injury should have been a factor. Water over the dam at this point.

I'm sure Rel is taking this personally today. Let's be a little charitable.

I think jerel played 20 minutes in the semis.

jsglow · « **Reply #644 on:** August 07, 2019, 01:14:01 PM »

Quote from: #UnleashCain on August 07, 2019, 01:10:54 PM

I think jerel played 20 minutes in the semis.

I'd have to back and look at the box. I do know he was in at crunch time.

#UnleashSean · « **Reply #645 on:** August 07, 2019, 01:17:47 PM »

Quote from: jsglow on August 07, 2019, 01:14:01 PM

I'd have to back and look at the box. I do know he was in at crunch time.

I remember looking at my bud and saying he looks old. I believe it was the 2nd quarter. I also drank a lot though. Soooooo

Jay Bee · « **Reply #646 on:** August 07, 2019, 01:19:50 PM »

Quote from: jsglow on August 07, 2019, 01:06:48 PM

I personally think the bashing of Rel is somewhat uncalled for. Did he struggle in Elam last night? Hell ya. But let's remember the critical minutes he played on Sunday to get them to the Final.

16 mins. 0/2 FG, 0 pts, 1 Reb, 1 stl, 1 foul on Sunday. #critical