collapse

* Resources


UDM 4

* 2018-2019 SOTG


2018-19 Season SoG Tally
Howard11
S Hauser4
John4
Anim3
Chartouny2

'17-18 * '16-17 *
'15-16'14-15 * '13-14
'12-13 * '11-12 * '10-11

* Big East Standings

* Recent Posts

Please Register - It's FREE!

The absolute only thing required for this FREE registration is a valid e-mail address.  We keep all your information confidential and will NEVER give or sell it to anyone else.
Login to get rid of this box (and ads) , or register NOW!

* Next up: A long offseason

Marquette
Marquette

Madness

Date/Time: Oct 4, 2019
TV: ???
Schedule for 2018-19
24-10

Author Topic: Help on the way for 19/20?  (Read 25467 times)

MU82

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 11761
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #200 on: April 25, 2019, 09:36:30 PM »
You know who has given our program great publicity?

Our own Markus Howard.

There have been a few nights that SportsCenter led off with his 45-plus scoring exhibitions. Every time Marquette was discussed, his name was first, second and third. (Maybe that's one of the things that ticked off the Hausers.)

Even after Sam hit that shot vs Creighton, the one who was interviewed nationally was the guy who passed him the ball ... and scored 53 freakin' points. He gave Sam all the credit, right there on national TV, too.

He's an All-American and BEPOY, and he got the attention that goes with those honors, and those things helped put a lot of spotlight on Marquette basketball.

Plus he's on that student council thing and that gets mentioned prominently ... and both he and Marquette come out looking great because of it.

I'm thinking recruits watched the second half of that Buffalo game or that K-State game or the Creighton game or the home Nova game or several others and went, "Damn! That Marquette dude is like watching a video game!"

And I think they said that a lot more than they said, "Oh, and Greek Freak is in Milwaukee, too."

I'm not totally dismissing that it's cool to have a good NBA team in town, and the guy who should be NBA MVP. I do think our coaching staff can sell that as one of the great things about Marquette. But I'm guessing we can sell Wade and Butler at least as much, if not more.

You know what else we can sell?

"You can come to Marquette and, if you're good enough, we will feature you and you can average 25 ppg and be an All-American. Just look at Markus Howard."
"We need journalists who are on the side of victims, on the side of those who are persecuted, excluded, thrown away and discriminated against ... situations of suffering that often are in the dark, or have light shining for a moment only to return to the darkness of indifference."

-- Pope Francis

Jon

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 531
  • Fire Wojo!
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #201 on: April 26, 2019, 03:25:46 AM »
Cheeks,

You are correct,  many here are rooting for Wojo to fail.  Their mind is made up.  Others talk out of both sides of their mouths on the issue.   

With regard to definition of success, the 70s boys think you are either competing for National Championships every year (or very close to it) or you are a failure.   

What they fail to understand is that in order for that to happen, we need to 1) catch lightning in a bottle and hire the next Al McGuire or 2) we are going to have to hire a coach that may not have the initial impact they yearn for but who learns on the job, improves year to year and stays for a long time.

A couple questions:

1. Should I short MSFT?

2. Where would my spouse care to vacation this fall?

3. Who will win the World Series this year?

4. Chicken or beef at next week's conference?

5. Lotto numbers?

Thank you and,

Sincerely,

A 70s boy (sic)

Jon

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 531
  • Fire Wojo!
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #202 on: April 26, 2019, 03:30:15 AM »
BOHICA

A classic. Some things are timeless.


Goose

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 6159
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #203 on: April 26, 2019, 07:09:46 AM »
82

I think I overestimate you when it comes to understanding some of my posts. There is no doubt that MU has a ton to promote the program from within. I guess I assumed you, and most anyone, that MU would promote current kids in the program, the university and it’s history. That should be a given.

My point on The Freak, Bucks and Fiserv was quite simple. Many in here use recruiting to MKE is a difficult task, and in some regard I agree. For the first time in my memory, MKE has some real selling points. I would much rather be selling a recruit on The Freak than a Polar Vortex.

Secondly, you and I would recruit far different players. I would be going after kids that their objective post college is playing in the NBA. If you want to target student council kids, the Bucks probably are not a big selling point. IMO, this is an opportunity to reach out to players that at are a different level.

This is another example of different opinion of the program. I don’t want thugs, but if student council players are the goal, Wojo has built a solid program. Again, this goes back to my argument of what is ultimate goal for the program. If the goal is to build an upper level program with student council kids, Wojo should have a ten year window. That model takes a long, long time to be built.

I know you are not suggesting only going after student council kids and I get your premise. In my business life I have always looked for an advantage to get to the next level. IMO, MU now has a little extra to be touting and that is exciting.

Not being a smart ass, but I would be tweeting pictures of Howard with The Freak over a team huddle with Wojo laughing with the guys. Selling team unity, family and togetherness should be a given. I thought MU did great job in Wade day and I would use that more.


MU82

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 11761
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #204 on: April 26, 2019, 07:34:14 AM »
I know you are not suggesting only going after student council kids and I get your premise.

Good. No other comment necessary.
"We need journalists who are on the side of victims, on the side of those who are persecuted, excluded, thrown away and discriminated against ... situations of suffering that often are in the dark, or have light shining for a moment only to return to the darkness of indifference."

-- Pope Francis

jesmu84

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 4424
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #205 on: April 26, 2019, 08:57:06 AM »
82

I think I overestimate you when it comes to understanding some of my posts. There is no doubt that MU has a ton to promote the program from within. I guess I assumed you, and most anyone, that MU would promote current kids in the program, the university and it’s history. That should be a given.

My point on The Freak, Bucks and Fiserv was quite simple. Many in here use recruiting to MKE is a difficult task, and in some regard I agree. For the first time in my memory, MKE has some real selling points. I would much rather be selling a recruit on The Freak than a Polar Vortex.

Secondly, you and I would recruit far different players. I would be going after kids that their objective post college is playing in the NBA. If you want to target student council kids, the Bucks probably are not a big selling point. IMO, this is an opportunity to reach out to players that at are a different level.

This is another example of different opinion of the program. I don’t want thugs, but if student council players are the goal, Wojo has built a solid program. Again, this goes back to my argument of what is ultimate goal for the program. If the goal is to build an upper level program with student council kids, Wojo should have a ten year window. That model takes a long, long time to be built.

I know you are not suggesting only going after student council kids and I get your premise. In my business life I have always looked for an advantage to get to the next level. IMO, MU now has a little extra to be touting and that is exciting.

Not being a smart ass, but I would be tweeting pictures of Howard with The Freak over a team huddle with Wojo laughing with the guys. Selling team unity, family and togetherness should be a given. I thought MU did great job in Wade day and I would use that more.

If that is the goal of the admin, is that a problem for you?

GOO

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 1149
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #206 on: April 26, 2019, 09:34:37 AM »
A couple questions:

1. Should I short MSFT? Yes, along with the entire Market if history is any indication of what is to come.  The only question is when. /color]

2. Where would my spouse care to vacation this fall? No idea, but skip the fall vacation unless you are heading North, in which case I'd suggest Sweden or Montreal Quebec

3. Who will win the World Series this year? Not a Cubs fan, but always pick the Cubs

4. Chicken or beef at next week's conference?Neither, save the planet and yourself and skip both

5. Lotto numbers?You don't play and neither do I.  Give the $2 to someone when you vacation in a poor country who can really use it and you both will benefit

Thank you and,

Sincerely,

A 70s boy (sic)
Since you asked.  No charge.

WithoutBias

  • Starter
  • ***
  • Posts: 148
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #207 on: April 26, 2019, 09:43:01 AM »
uh oh. the triggered pilot is back.

Goose

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 6159
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #208 on: April 26, 2019, 10:39:42 AM »
jesmu

I have stated countless times that would not be a problem for me. I do have a problem not knowing if that is the goal. If that is their goal, Wojo has unlimited timetable from me. That would be a difficult task and he should not take heat for time needed to achieve that goal.

I have stated that I would definitely lower the ball budget if that is the goal and hire a Brian Wardle type guy. Pay him $750k year and keep him for 20 years. There would be no need for private jets for recruiting, high lease at Fiserv or other perks currently within the program.

I would be 100% happy with swinging for the fences or having a nice program with great kids. My expectations would match the vision the school laid out.

Vander Blue Man Group

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 1220
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #209 on: April 26, 2019, 10:55:52 AM »
82

I think I overestimate you when it comes to understanding some of my posts. There is no doubt that MU has a ton to promote the program from within. I guess I assumed you, and most anyone, that MU would promote current kids in the program, the university and it’s history. That should be a given.

My point on The Freak, Bucks and Fiserv was quite simple. Many in here use recruiting to MKE is a difficult task, and in some regard I agree. For the first time in my memory, MKE has some real selling points. I would much rather be selling a recruit on The Freak than a Polar Vortex.

Secondly, you and I would recruit far different players. I would be going after kids that their objective post college is playing in the NBA. If you want to target student council kids, the Bucks probably are not a big selling point. IMO, this is an opportunity to reach out to players that at are a different level.

This is another example of different opinion of the program. I don’t want thugs, but if student council players are the goal, Wojo has built a solid program. Again, this goes back to my argument of what is ultimate goal for the program. If the goal is to build an upper level program with student council kids, Wojo should have a ten year window. That model takes a long, long time to be built.

I know you are not suggesting only going after student council kids and I get your premise. In my business life I have always looked for an advantage to get to the next level. IMO, MU now has a little extra to be touting and that is exciting.

Not being a smart ass, but I would be tweeting pictures of Howard with The Freak over a team huddle with Wojo laughing with the guys. Selling team unity, family and togetherness should be a given. I thought MU did great job in Wade day and I would use that more.

I'll let MU82 speak for himself but I'm not sure you understood his post because what you wrote above is not at all what I took out of it.  I did not at all get the impression that 82 was saying Marquette shouldn't focus on players whose ultimate goal is the NBA or that Marquette should focus on "student council kids".  Not sure where you got that from at all. 

Nor did I get the impression that he was saying Marquette shouldn't use Fiserv as a selling point.  That is absolutely a focus of the staff when recruiting.  Now I'm not sure how much having the Bucks in town and a potential MVP Giannis is mentioned but I'd imagine it's touched on.  However, I don't think the Bucks/Giannis is going to necessarily be a deciding factor on where a kid goes to school.  It's going to be the staff, teammates, the opportunity for playing time, the facilities, the arena, the conference, etc. 

jesmu84

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 4424
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #210 on: April 26, 2019, 11:02:08 AM »
jesmu

I have stated countless times that would not be a problem for me. I do have a problem not knowing if that is the goal. If that is their goal, Wojo has unlimited timetable from me. That would be a difficult task and he should not take heat for time needed to achieve that goal.

I have stated that I would definitely lower the ball budget if that is the goal and hire a Brian Wardle type guy. Pay him $750k year and keep him for 20 years. There would be no need for private jets for recruiting, high lease at Fiserv or other perks currently within the program.

I would be 100% happy with swinging for the fences or having a nice program with great kids. My expectations would match the vision the school laid out.

That's fair.

Where I disagree is that even if we want to build the program with "student council" types, we still want the best bball players of those. Which means we need all the resources still in place.

Fluffy Blue Monster

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 1322
  • When I'm in Holland I eat the pannenkoeken
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #211 on: April 26, 2019, 11:05:00 AM »
Why do we assume that kids who are good at basketball are usually "student council types?"

swoopem

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 800
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #212 on: April 26, 2019, 11:06:16 AM »
jesmu

I have stated countless times that would not be a problem for me. I do have a problem not knowing if that is the goal. If that is their goal, Wojo has unlimited timetable from me. That would be a difficult task and he should not take heat for time needed to achieve that goal.

I have stated that I would definitely lower the ball budget if that is the goal and hire a Brian Wardle type guy. Pay him $750k year and keep him for 20 years. There would be no need for private jets for recruiting, high lease at Fiserv or other perks currently within the program.

I would be 100% happy with swinging for the fences or having a nice program with great kids. My expectations would match the vision the school laid out.

Phuck that. Up the budget and let’s win some games in March
Bradley Center, the best bar in Milwaukee

Goose

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 6159
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #213 on: April 26, 2019, 11:11:49 AM »
swoop

That is my preference.

TAMU Eagle

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 15817
  • A Reading from Wojo's 1st Slide to the Marquettens
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #214 on: April 26, 2019, 11:21:27 AM »
This is another example of different opinion of the program. I don’t want thugs, but if student council players are the goal, Wojo has built a solid program. Again, this goes back to my argument of what is ultimate goal for the program. If the goal is to build an upper level program with student council kids, Wojo should have a ten year window. That model takes a long, long time to be built.

I have stated that I would definitely lower the ball budget if that is the goal and hire a Brian Wardle type guy. Pay him $750k year and keep him for 20 years. There would be no need for private jets for recruiting, high lease at Fiserv or other perks currently within the program.

If the goal is to build an upper level program with "student council kids", why would you cut the basketball budget, private jets, Fiserv? This doesn't make sense to me. I'm also not sure what a "student council kid" is.

God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

~Prayer of the Scooper

Goose

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 6159
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #215 on: April 26, 2019, 11:21:50 AM »
Vander

I will make my point clearer. With the added excitement of having the most exciting player on the planet, a great NBA team and a first class NBA arena, I would up the ante on guys being recruited. I am sure most guys that play D1 ball either dream or have dreamed about playing the NBA and that is great. The guys I am talking about recruiting are guys that are coming to MU, or wherever, with the sole purpose of playing professional ball.

If MU is recruiting the stud from Drexel, in addition to promoting MU to him, I would be pushing NML or Baird as being a big part of the landscape of MKE. Telling him of the great post graduation business opportunities that exist in MKE. Now, if I am recruiting Jalen Johnson, or players of his stature, I likely would use a different recruiting approach and highlight the most exciting player on the planet being in town.

Mike's post is a great approach for recruiting 90% of the kids out there. My point was/is, this could be an opportunity to not use "it is difficult to recruit to MKE" excuse for awhile. I do think it is funny, that every year MU has a crapload of kids on sports scholarships, but it is hard to recruit to MKE.

NickelDimer

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 3041
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #216 on: April 26, 2019, 11:33:48 AM »
Marquette fans are rooting for the Marquette coach to fail which means their team will fail? Because they don’t believe in him?? Some of you crack me the hell up
G.T.S.T

LAZER

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 1442
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #217 on: April 26, 2019, 11:34:53 AM »
swoop

That is my preference.
What's your idea of swinging for the fences?

muguru

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 3443
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #218 on: April 26, 2019, 11:36:51 AM »
You go and get the best players....roll the ball out and go play.
“Being realistic is the most common path to mediocrity.” Will Smith

We live in a society that rewards mediocrity , I detest mediocrity - David Goggi

I want this quote to serve as a reminder to the vast majority of scoop posters in regards to the MU BB program.

Shooter McGavin

  • Starter
  • ***
  • Posts: 140
  • MU92
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #219 on: April 26, 2019, 11:38:26 AM »
A couple questions:

1. Should I short MSFT?

2. Where would my spouse care to vacation this fall?

3. Who will win the World Series this year?

4. Chicken or beef at next week's conference?

5. Lotto numbers?

Thank you and,

Sincerely,

A 70s boy (sic)

Ha!, cant answer those for you and ultimately I’m not trying to tell you how to think.  You, especially, have strong opinions on wojo and the fact the program can never reach the heights we want it to with him as the coach.  I believe that you and others may be correct but am allowing for the possibility that he can move MUBB forward enough in the next year that it would start to satisfy even the most impatient fans (losing the Hausers was not a good start). 

Having gone to MU in the 80s (80s guy) almost solely because of the success MU had in the 70s my patience is greater.  My fear with changing coaches too early is that it will lead us to another disastrous ten year period.  I’d rather ride this out a little longer and have the administration make a decision on Wojo one year from now.

JamilJaeJamailJrJuan

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 6275
  • Js for days
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #220 on: April 26, 2019, 11:43:43 AM »
If the goal is to build an upper level program with "student council kids", why would you cut the basketball budget, private jets, Fiserv? This doesn't make sense to me. I'm also not sure what a "student council kid" is.

Pretty sure he means not sacrificing academics and having good kids for the benefit of wins and losses on the basketball court. 
I would take the Rick SLU program right now.

Goose

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 6159
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #221 on: April 26, 2019, 11:46:14 AM »
J5

Correct.

muguru

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 3443
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #222 on: April 26, 2019, 11:55:42 AM »
"You play to win the game"
“Being realistic is the most common path to mediocrity.” Will Smith

We live in a society that rewards mediocrity , I detest mediocrity - David Goggi

I want this quote to serve as a reminder to the vast majority of scoop posters in regards to the MU BB program.

MU82

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 11761
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #223 on: April 26, 2019, 12:10:30 PM »
Goose, my post above applies to any and all recruits.

That post had 11 paragraphs. For some reason, you chose to focus on a one-sentence paragraph in the middle that began with, "Plus ... " In other words, it was just that, a plus. I also spent a paragraph acknowledging that Marquette being in the same city as the Bucks/Freak also was a plus.

Nowhere did I say we shouldn't recruit elite athletes. That is the opposite of what I believe, and I have stated that many, many times. I want Wojo to go for the best players out there, and I firmly believe he should use every method that is legal to do it.

Of course, he also has to have a Plan B because the simple fact is that, given the choice between Marquette and a blueblood, most will choose the blueblood. The same is true for every other program that isn't a blueblood ... unless you think Marquette is the only non-blueblood that "loses" recruits to bluebloods.

So if he is going all-out to get Jalen Johnson, he also better have a good chance to land a skilled 4-star, because the truth is that even if Greek Freak lets Jalen sit on his lap and feeds him grapes, Jalen will choose a school other than Marquette.

I call that being realistic; you apparently call it "settling." Do you think that if Wojo, Stan and the rest of our recruiters go on all-out blitzes, one recruit after another will say, "To heck with Duke, Kentucky, Kansas, Michigan State and UNC; Ring Out Ahoya!"? How do you know they don't already go on all-out blitzes?

I get that you don't want us to trail the bluebloods -- you want us to be a blueblood again ourselves, as we were under Al. So does every other Marquette fan! But it obviously isn't easy, which is why there are only a handful of bluebloods. Raymonds, Majerus, Dukiet, KO, Deane, Crean and Buzz couldn't get it done. A couple of them came close but no cigar. Maybe Wojo will be the one who can do what KO, Crean and Buzz couldn't. Maybe he won't and we'll have to get somebody else. Or maybe he will come close and then run away like KO, Crean and Buzz did.

I specifically said: "It's cool to have a good NBA team in town, and the guy who should be NBA MVP. I do think our coaching staff can sell that as one of the great things about Marquette."

Nevertheless, the main point of my previous post was that a Marquette player who achieves what Markus has and who has brought incredible positive attention to Marquette basketball is a damn valuable recruiting asset. I'd argue he's more valuable than an NBA player who happens to play in the same city, but you're allowed to disagree.

And yes, Wojo also can tell a recruit's mom, "We have more than just great athletes; we also have kids who grow up to be leaders, and we even have one who sits on a national council. We care about the whole person, and Markus and our other outstanding young man are proof." I dunno ... call me old-fashioned ... but Majerus always used to say a big part of it is recruiting the moms, and I think examples like Markus do help.

Goose, for some reason that I haven't quite figured out, whenever you have disagreed with me or have wanted to push home your own point the last couple of weeks, you have been misrepresenting what I say. The first couple of times I ignored it as an aberration because you never used to do that. But this is at least the fourth or fifth time you've done it since Hausergeddon. I chalk it up to frustration on your part, but I don't have to like it. You are a smart guy and I think a good guy, too, and you are so much better than this Ners-like or MSK-like tactic. Please stop.
"We need journalists who are on the side of victims, on the side of those who are persecuted, excluded, thrown away and discriminated against ... situations of suffering that often are in the dark, or have light shining for a moment only to return to the darkness of indifference."

-- Pope Francis

NorthernDancerColt

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 569
Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #224 on: April 26, 2019, 12:31:30 PM »
MU82 rightly states that given the choice b/t Marquette and a blue blood, most will choose the blue blood.

As Pink Floyd states in KeepTalking, “It doesn’t have to be like this.” Or does it?
Marquette is a really cool, unique place...and not just because we all went there. However, I’m starting to think that the game is irreparably corrupted by the shoe companies and the cheating blue bloods....and that schools like MU should not jump into this fray. Very sad. The fact that KU just signed a $200 million deal with the Adidas, the very company which they claimed “victimized” them in the FBI wiretaps case. It is beyond disgusting. 
Zenyatta has a lot....a lot... of ground to make up. She gets there from here she’d be a super horse......what’s this.....Zenyatta hooked to the grandstand side....Zenyatta flying on the outside....this....is...un-belieeeeeevable!...looked impossible at the top of the stretch...