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Date/Time: Oct 4, 2019
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Author Topic: Help on the way for 19/20?  (Read 25466 times)

brewcity77

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #125 on: April 24, 2019, 06:06:29 PM »
Does the UNLV guy have any range or is he just an interior/banger type?  In the absence of a true star, Wojo needs to bring complementary pieces, not guys that play the same way as guys we already have.

I don't get the Juiston thought at all unless he's a sit out player. We already have two centers with no offense outside 4 feet. What, will Theo, Ed, & Shakar all play 13-14 mpg? I can't see any of them playing together. He isn't a good fit at all.

muguru

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #126 on: April 24, 2019, 06:42:55 PM »
I don't get the Juiston thought at all unless he's a sit out player. We already have two centers with no offense outside 4 feet. What, will Theo, Ed, & Shakar all play 13-14 mpg? I can't see any of them playing together. He isn't a good fit at all.

Except Juiston can step out to 15 feet...he's more than just a back to he basket guy like Theo/ED

In 2017-2018 he shot 58-127 on jump shots...45.7%

He was the #1 ranked JUCO prospect in the country when he committed to UNLV...he played at Hutchinson(sound familiar).

He's a better scorer and a better rebounder then Theo or Ed, and like I said...he actually has some range. What is not to like??
« Last Edit: April 24, 2019, 07:16:56 PM by muguru »
“Being realistic is the most common path to mediocrity.” Will Smith

We live in a society that rewards mediocrity , I detest mediocrity - David Goggi

I want this quote to serve as a reminder to the vast majority of scoop posters in regards to the MU BB program.

BallBoy

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #127 on: April 24, 2019, 06:46:31 PM »
Semantics. I could construct a roster with nothing but guys you consider D1 players that would go 0-31. You know what Goose meant - and he's right. If guys can't contribute (or their contributions are negative) who needs 'em?

You can’t win with nothing but you can win with something. JC added value just not enough but gave us a better chance to win without JC and no Markus.

#UnleashCain

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #128 on: April 24, 2019, 07:00:41 PM »
I don't get the Juiston thought at all unless he's a sit out player. We already have two centers with no offense outside 4 feet. What, will Theo, Ed, & Shakar all play 13-14 mpg? I can't see any of them playing together. He isn't a good fit at all.

With the way they foul. That might work.

avid1010

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #129 on: April 24, 2019, 08:05:16 PM »
[quote author=JamilJaeJamailJrJuan link=topic=58686.msg1128058#msg112805

98/100 guys are picking Kansas, Kentucky, Arizona, etc., etc., over MU.  The sooner you come to grips with that, that more enjoyable your life will be.
[/quote]
We had a pretty close one in Joey...

MU82

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #130 on: April 24, 2019, 08:11:32 PM »
The amount of attention this one irrational poster gets on this board is totally bizarre. You are a smart guy, you realize that you aren't going to fix him by replying to his every post like this.

Don't be trying to take away our fun!
"We need journalists who are on the side of victims, on the side of those who are persecuted, excluded, thrown away and discriminated against ... situations of suffering that often are in the dark, or have light shining for a moment only to return to the darkness of indifference."

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Herman Cain

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #131 on: April 24, 2019, 09:30:09 PM »
IMHO, Yeboah and Demir are the 4th and 5th best stretch forwards currently available for next season. The 3rd best has had multiple arrests.

So yes,  this may be the best we can get at this point. It's the best most programs can get at this point.
What is the arrest kids name? He could be a real prospect.
All love affairs end.  Eventually the girl is gonna put curlers in her hair.
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TAMU Eagle

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #132 on: April 24, 2019, 09:30:37 PM »
Except Juiston can step out to 15 feet...he's more than just a back to he basket guy like Theo/ED

In 2017-2018 he shot 58-127 on jump shots...45.7%

He was the #1 ranked JUCO prospect in the country when he committed to UNLV...he played at Hutchinson(sound familiar).

He's a better scorer and a better rebounder then Theo or Ed, and like I said...he actually has some range. What is not to like??

Those 58 jump shots....most were well inside 15 feet....and they represented less than 25% of the shots he took...the rest of which were around the rim. Juiston is not a floor stretcher. He's a good player, but I don't see him as a fit for what Marquette needs. Also as I mentioned before, I'm not sure it's been confirmed that Juiston is actually immediately eligible. We tend to assume all redshirt juniors are immediately eligible but they actually have to qualify.
God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

~Prayer of the Scooper

muguru

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #133 on: April 24, 2019, 09:39:47 PM »
Those 58 jump shots....most were well inside 15 feet....and they represented less than 25% of the shots he took...the rest of which were around the rim. Juiston is not a floor stretcher. He's a good player, but I don't see him as a fit for what Marquette needs. Also as I mentioned before, I'm not sure it's been confirmed that Juiston is actually immediately eligible. We tend to assume all redshirt juniors are immediately eligible but they actually have to qualify.

Have you seen him play?? Did you count each jump shot and where it was taken?? I never said he was a floor stretcher...I consider a "floor stretcher" a guy that can shoot it from deep. That's not him. But he DOES have a jump shot, whether it's 8 ft, 10 ft, 12ft, it's further away from the basket then Ed or Theo can go. That's useful.

People want Yeboah and would be excited about that, and he is much more of an around the basket player then Juiston even is. He is MUCH more like Theo and Ed, but people would like to bring him in and not Juiston?? I will tell you why that is...the ONLY reason I can think of is because Juiston would HAVE to be a starter(he'd ne one of MU's 5 best players), and people don't want him to come in and take a current players starting spot even those he's better then Cain, or Bailey, or Ed or Theo. That males ZERO sense to me. It's the ONLY reason I can think of that people would like to bring in Yeboah over Juiston becauset hey don't want a current player to lose his starting spot. That's nonsense.

Yes, he's eligible, he is on every grad transfer list I have seen. Expected to get a medical hardship for this last year
“Being realistic is the most common path to mediocrity.” Will Smith

We live in a society that rewards mediocrity , I detest mediocrity - David Goggi

I want this quote to serve as a reminder to the vast majority of scoop posters in regards to the MU BB program.

TAMU Eagle

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #134 on: April 24, 2019, 10:32:14 PM »
Have you seen him play?? Did you count each jump shot and where it was taken?? I never said he was a floor stretcher...I consider a "floor stretcher" a guy that can shoot it from deep. That's not him. But he DOES have a jump shot, whether it's 8 ft, 10 ft, 12ft, it's further away from the basket then Ed or Theo can go. That's useful.

People want Yeboah and would be excited about that, and he is much more of an around the basket player then Juiston even is. He is MUCH more like Theo and Ed, but people would like to bring him in and not Juiston?? I will tell you why that is...the ONLY reason I can think of is because Juiston would HAVE to be a starter(he'd ne one of MU's 5 best players), and people don't want him to come in and take a current players starting spot even those he's better then Cain, or Bailey, or Ed or Theo. That males ZERO sense to me. It's the ONLY reason I can think of that people would like to bring in Yeboah over Juiston becauset hey don't want a current player to lose his starting spot. That's nonsense.

Yes, he's eligible, he is on every grad transfer list I have seen. Expected to get a medical hardship for this last year

I have seen him play. I didn't count all of them but most of his work is done close to the basket. Yes, he has a jump shot, it's not particularly reliable and the range is very limited. I don't think he fits what we need.

The staff has no qualms about bringing in a starting level player. There aren't many on the grad transfer market that would start for us.

Yeboah does have some excellent around the basket moves. He scored 89 points out of post ups in 89 attempts....essentially scoring a bucket every other time he posted up. That is NOT where he works primarily. He scored 182 points last season off of spot up jump shots. He's not an elite floor spacer but he has made 170 3Ps in the past three years with a career accuracy of around 34%. Put him in a system where he is the 4th or 5th scoring option and I could see that average getting north of 35%, more than enough to keep defenses honest. Juistion can't do that. So, no Yeboah is not "more of an around the basket player than Juiston is."

When Juiston first came out, one of the Vegas beat writers said it was unclear if he was immediately eligible. He is on all the grad transfer lists but I know from experience that unless a more local source makes it widely known that he is not eligible for a grad transfer, these lists assume all four year players (RSJRs or SRs) are immediately eligible. Some players need more than 4 years to graduate. I've been doing the paint touches list for the past 4 or 5 years and have run into several occasions every year where a player was on all the lists but then had to be taken off because they weren't actually eligible. Often players who spent two years at JUCOs fall into this category. This combined with how oddly silent Juiston's camp has been has made me wonder. Could be something else, could be Juiston is very tight lipped, but just wondering.
God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

~Prayer of the Scooper

brewcity77

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #135 on: April 24, 2019, 10:41:45 PM »
Juiston tweeted that he won't be announcing until after he graduates. Might be why there really hasn't been any info yet.

NorthernDancerColt

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #136 on: April 24, 2019, 10:43:20 PM »
Truthfully, my biggest issue, is this really the best MU can get or are we just taking guys? I would have to think a potential top ten team, with NPOY on it, would be able to attract better than these two guys. In addition, it seems like 90% of this site is not wondering why we aren't going for better guys or why better guys are not interested.

Goose when I read this post earlier I was right with you...why aren’t we aiming higher? When I watched these guys’ highlites, i really feel like sometimes you go after guys that fit into how you play. Watching the Turkish kid, tell me Butler wouldn’t be all over a post prospect like him...bulky, really crafty inside and durable. The Stony Brook guy can play at a high speed, good passer, decent perimeter game, yet with enough size and definition to attack the hoop. These guys actually would both fit right away, and I’m truly not certain if we landed both if our drop-off would be much at all from pre-Hausergate.
Zenyatta has a lot....a lot... of ground to make up. She gets there from here she’d be a super horse......what’s this.....Zenyatta hooked to the grandstand side....Zenyatta flying on the outside....this....is...un-belieeeeeevable!...looked impossible at the top of the stretch...

Loose Cannon

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #137 on: April 24, 2019, 11:10:16 PM »
I'm having a very difficult time understanding the downside of taking an immediately eligible player for one year.

I'm with ya, better to have something than nothin.
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is NOT ignorance, it's the Illusion of knowledge."....Stephen Hawking

muguru

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #138 on: April 24, 2019, 11:35:42 PM »
I have seen him play. I didn't count all of them but most of his work is done close to the basket. Yes, he has a jump shot, it's not particularly reliable and the range is very limited. I don't think he fits what we need.

The staff has no qualms about bringing in a starting level player. There aren't many on the grad transfer market that would start for us.

Yeboah does have some excellent around the basket moves. He scored 89 points out of post ups in 89 attempts....essentially scoring a bucket every other time he posted up. That is NOT where he works primarily. He scored 182 points last season off of spot up jump shots. He's not an elite floor spacer but he has made 170 3Ps in the past three years with a career accuracy of around 34%. Put him in a system where he is the 4th or 5th scoring option and I could see that average getting north of 35%, more than enough to keep defenses honest. Juistion can't do that. So, no Yeboah is not "more of an around the basket player than Juiston is."

When Juiston first came out, one of the Vegas beat writers said it was unclear if he was immediately eligible. He is on all the grad transfer lists but I know from experience that unless a more local source makes it widely known that he is not eligible for a grad transfer, these lists assume all four year players (RSJRs or SRs) are immediately eligible. Some players need more than 4 years to graduate. I've been doing the paint touches list for the past 4 or 5 years and have run into several occasions every year where a player was on all the lists but then had to be taken off because they weren't actually eligible. Often players who spent two years at JUCOs fall into this category. This combined with how oddly silent Juiston's camp has been has made me wonder. Could be something else, could be Juiston is very tight lipped, but just wondering.

Look..i don't much care about where a guy can score from as long as he can score..consistently..Theo and Ed haven't shown that they can..yet. Juiston is a proven scorer..Yes I am very worried about how the offense is going to score next year when you remove a 15ppg scorer from the equation..It's easy on the surface to say Koby will take up some of that slack..and that's fine..I like him.. alot. But the problem with saying that is..with Sam there..whatever Koby and the others brought was just going to be a huge bonus and a big part of why they were a preseason top 10 team..all 5 starters were back in addition to Koby and Greg.

I had figured next year between Koby, Markus and Sam they would combine for 50ppg..however that split up between those 3. Let's say they had a steady 9 player rotation(for arguments sake). And lets say they averaged 80ppg as a team..with those three combining for 50+ppg, that means you only needed 30 ppg from the remaining 6 guys to get to that 80..thats a miniscule 5ppg per player..VERY reasonable..now you're removing a 15 ppg scorer..and using that same 5ppg per player average..now you need 3 players to make up the scoring average that one player is leaving behind. So now that means Koby & Markus combine for 35..3 more players combine for the missing 15 to get us back to the original 50 ppg..only instead of 3 guys..its now taking 6 of the 9 rotation guys..so to get to the 80 ppg in this scenario..the 3 remaining rotation players need to average 10ppg..thats an impossible ask. No matter how you slice it..the math doesnt work nearly as good now as it was going to..dont you agree?
“Being realistic is the most common path to mediocrity.” Will Smith

We live in a society that rewards mediocrity , I detest mediocrity - David Goggi

I want this quote to serve as a reminder to the vast majority of scoop posters in regards to the MU BB program.

TAMU Eagle

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #139 on: April 24, 2019, 11:48:20 PM »
Guru, there is no situation, no combination of immediately eligible players, where Marquette will be projected to be as good as or better than they were with the Hausers. That ship has sailed. Sam is better than anyone on the grad transfer list. Joey is better than most. Even if we landed Blackshear and Juiston we would still be projected to be worse than when we had the Hausers. That is reality.

If Marquette is going to be as good as they expected to be pre-Hausers, they will have to outperform their projections on paper. Fortunately, that's why basketball is played on the court and not on paper.

Back to the grad transfers, I'm liking this Yeboah kid more and more. Ran the defensive numbers on him....they are niiiiiice. His defense is actually better than his offense and his offense is pretty darn good. Question will be how he translates his game to the high major level. A 6'6" 235 lbs, I could very easily see him winning the battle for starting PF.

Demir, defense is even worse than I would have guessed. As others have said, flat footed and slow. Still don't mind him as a depth pick up, but I would be surprised if he ended up being more than a 7th or 8th player in the rotation.
God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

~Prayer of the Scooper

MUHoopsFan2

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #140 on: April 25, 2019, 12:33:06 AM »
Guru, there is no situation, no combination of immediately eligible players, where Marquette will be projected to be as good as or better than they were with the Hausers. That ship has sailed. Sam is better than anyone on the grad transfer list. Joey is better than most. Even if we landed Blackshear and Juiston we would still be projected to be worse than when we had the Hausers. That is reality.

If Marquette is going to be as good as they expected to be pre-Hausers, they will have to outperform their projections on paper. Fortunately, that's why basketball is played on the court and not on paper.

Back to the grad transfers, I'm liking this Yeboah kid more and more. Ran the defensive numbers on him....they are niiiiiice. His defense is actually better than his offense and his offense is pretty darn good. Question will be how he translates his game to the high major level. A 6'6" 235 lbs, I could very easily see him winning the battle for starting PF.

Demir, defense is even worse than I would have guessed. As others have said, flat footed and slow. Still don't mind him as a depth pick up, but I would be surprised if he ended up being more than a 7th or 8th player in the rotation.
You contradicted yourself. It is not about being "better" it is about being different. They will have to win in a different way...

And they can match their record of last year or more. The emphasis and style in which that is done will be completely different without the Hauser's.

And don't nit-pick about the 'bigs' not being able to shoot. That is irrelevant. Feed the post and play and cut and do some action through them...screen and lobs, anything.

It will be more about the cohesion, and chemistry and compatiblity of the collection of players Coach Wojo can have on the floor and find out what works.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2019, 12:39:49 AM by MUHoopsFan2 »

Jon

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #141 on: April 25, 2019, 01:07:33 AM »
Truthfully, my biggest issue, is this really the best MU can get or are we just taking guys? I would have to think a potential top ten team, with NPOY on it, would be able to attract better than these two guys. In addition, it seems like 90% of this site is not wondering why we aren't going for better guys or why better guys are not interested.

Very well said, Goose.

The casual acceptance of mediocrity is bizarre. I guess that's why there is a market for things like Spam and Busch Beer in this world.

Shooter McGavin

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #142 on: April 25, 2019, 01:51:06 AM »
The amount of attention this one irrational poster gets on this board is totally bizarre. You are a smart guy, you realize that you aren't going to fix him by replying to his every post like this.

Unfortunately it’s not just that poster but multiple “insiders” who went to MU during the Al years he’s referring to as well.

Shooter McGavin

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #143 on: April 25, 2019, 02:05:18 AM »
Truthfully, my biggest issue, is this really the best MU can get or are we just taking guys? I would have to think a potential top ten team, with NPOY on it, would be able to attract better than these two guys. In addition, it seems like 90% of this site is not wondering why we aren't going for better guys or why better guys are not interested.

A potential top ten team huh?  This part of your post seems a little disingenuous unless you are all in like Sand Knit.

The Hamberdler

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #144 on: April 25, 2019, 06:13:40 AM »
Unfortunately it’s not just that poster but multiple “insiders” who went to MU during the Al years he’s referring to as well.

Was just making a general point, if you could look at all of the posts on this forum, probably 10ish% of them are either replying directly to this poster or are entirely about him in some way. Thousands of these kinds of posts, most likely, each trying to teach rationality and reason... None successful in anything but making it worse.

I imagine it would be satisfying to tell Stephen A. Smith how wrong he is every time he says something ridiculous, but since we can't do that, I guess the next-most-fun thing is to find irrational people on the internet to obsess over...

lawdog77

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #145 on: April 25, 2019, 06:42:41 AM »
Very well said, Goose.

The casual acceptance of mediocrity is bizarre. I guess that's why there is a market for things like Spam and Busch Beer in this world.
1. Potential Top 10 team after losing Larry Bird II and Larry Bird III, pretty good job by the Coach, I must say.
2. Neither you nor I  actually know for certain which transfers we are recruiting

WithoutBias

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #146 on: April 25, 2019, 06:44:03 AM »
keefer is right. only posters with true inside knowledge of the complete chaos that is the mubb program should be posting anything. and if you have true inside knowledge you would not be posting anything positive or hoping players improve because that will never happen with woj at the helm.

for someone who climbs on the molehill top to scream and let everyone know how tough he is at every chance he gets he sure is a chicken little baby.

muguru

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #147 on: April 25, 2019, 07:06:22 AM »
Guru, there is no situation, no combination of immediately eligible players, where Marquette will be projected to be as good as or better than they were with the Hausers. That ship has sailed. Sam is better than anyone on the grad transfer list. Joey is better than most. Even if we landed Blackshear and Juiston we would still be projected to be worse than when we had the Hausers. That is reality.

If Marquette is going to be as good as they expected to be pre-Hausers, they will have to outperform their projections on paper. Fortunately, that's why basketball is played on the court and not on paper.

Back to the grad transfers, I'm liking this Yeboah kid more and more. Ran the defensive numbers on him....they are niiiiiice. His defense is actually better than his offense and his offense is pretty darn good. Question will be how he translates his game to the high major level. A 6'6" 235 lbs, I could very easily see him winning the battle for starting PF.

Demir, defense is even worse than I would have guessed. As others have said, flat footed and slow. Still don't mind him as a depth pick up, but I would be surprised if he ended up being more than a 7th or 8th player in the rotation.

First of all, I call BS...it's not going to happen, but if MU landed Blackshear and Juiston they would be projected to be as good. Second, even if that isn't attainable, you HAVE to try to get as close to that as possible.That means getting the best players you possibly can. It's irresponsible to do otherwise.

Third...Jon is right, the acceptance of mediocrity on this board is incredible and quite frankly, it wears me out. I just don't get it, at all.
“Being realistic is the most common path to mediocrity.” Will Smith

We live in a society that rewards mediocrity , I detest mediocrity - David Goggi

I want this quote to serve as a reminder to the vast majority of scoop posters in regards to the MU BB program.

Uncle Rico

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #148 on: April 25, 2019, 07:17:11 AM »
First of all, I call BS...it's not going to happen, but if MU landed Blackshear and Juiston they would be projected to be as good. Second, even if that isn't attainable, you HAVE to try to get as close to that as possible.That means getting the best players you possibly can. It's irresponsible to do otherwise.

Third...Jon is right, the acceptance of mediocrity on this board is incredible and quite frankly, it wears me out. I just don't get it, at all.

Who says they aren’t kicking the tires on him?   There is little to no news on him.  But keep complaining about him. 
Alleged Slurper

brewcity77

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Re: Help on the way for 19/20?
« Reply #149 on: April 25, 2019, 07:30:48 AM »
the acceptance of mediocrity on this board is incredible and quite frankly, it wears me out. I just don't get it, at all.

There's a difference between accepting mediocrity & accepting reality. Reality is this team likely won't be as good as was expected 2 weeks ago. And if it is, it will be because the team is coached up.

Better defense, a faster pace, creating more live ball turnovers, that's the formula for meeting expectations. It isn't finding two Hauser caliber starters. That's just not reality.

Can Wojo adapt to the personnel he left himself with and attain the results we've been expecting for 6 years? If so, great, he's earned his place. If not, then in my opinion, time to move on.

FBOW coaching will be the determinant in next year's success or lack thereof.