What was Wojo's alternative?

[MU82]

MU 82
The signing of one and done is both a short and long term success. Continually signing top recruits feeds off of itself. To me, the long term success outweighs the short term. I really thought Wojo would build off the Henry signing, but things did not materialize.

Well, if signing two beloved Hausers, a future 25 ppg All-American, the future Big East blocked-shot leader and a few other potentially good players equals "did not materialize," I guess you've got a point there, Goose.

As for that particular 1-and-done ... what if the Hausers left because Wojo signed him? I could just hear the caterwauling about that one! Again, we're back to the circular reasoning. Wojo letting himself get influenced by the Hausers re Herro is bad; Wojo not letting himself get influenced by the Hausers re Markus also is bad. It's dizzying.

[brewcity77]

Wojo letting himself get influenced by the Hausers re Herro is bad; Wojo not letting himself get influenced by the Hausers re Markus also is bad. It's dizzying.

I think the biggest mistake Wojo made was not that the transfer happened, but running the offense the way he did. 2017 is the model he should be working off. No one played much over 26 mpg, 5 players hit 50 threes, 7 guys scored 8+ ppg. More guys involved, more diverse offense.

What may have hamstrung this team was the combination of Greg's injury & Chartouny not being a Big East player, which led to Markus out there constantly & Wojo was unable or unwilling to reel him in when necessary. No matter who's here next year, I think a more diverse offense, less reliance on 1-2 individuals, & a better minutes spread is the key to keeping everyone happier.

[tower912]

Selection of unsolicited opening thoughts from friends and coworkers who have approached me to talk about the Hausers....

"What  are they thinking writing a letter to the coach in the middle of the season?"
"24-10 and they are bitching about their touches?"
"Let me get this straight.   Markus Howard returns so they leave?   WTF?"
" They're mad because Markus shot too much?    See ya."



These are opening lines from people who only have me as a connection to Marquette.    These are how they started their conversations with me about it.    Not my comments, theirs.    As the discussions went on, they expressed shock/outrage/amusement that players would try to dictate style of play to a coach, all saying in one way or another that is not how it is done. 

Just a view from the other side of the lake from Wolverine and Spartan fans.     The Spartan fans will take them and laugh at the notion of them trying to work Izzo for more touches.     

[Nukem2]

I think the biggest mistake Wojo made was not that the transfer happened, but running the offense the way he did. 2017 is the model he should be working off. No one played much over 26 mpg, 5 players hit 50 threes, 7 guys scored 8+ ppg. More guys involved, more diverse offense.

What may have hamstrung this team was the combination of Greg's injury & Chartouny not being a Big East player, which led to Markus out there constantly & Wojo was unable or unwilling to reel him in when necessary. No matter who's here next year, I think a more diverse offense, less reliance on 1-2 individuals, & a better minutes spread is the key to keeping everyone happier.

This was a team with really one guard, a bunch of forwards and 2 centers.  It was painful watching Chartouny, one of the least athletic players I’ve seen in my years of watching MU BB.  He was mostly overwhelmed in BE play.   Wojo really needed to give Markus more rest and play Brendan and Jamal more to get the better minutes spread.  Kind of a Catch 22 from a ball handling perspective.  But without Greg and given Chartouny’s issues....... 

[forgetful]

This was a team with really one guard, a bunch of forwards and 2 centers.  It was painful watching Chartouny, one of the least athletic players I’ve seen in my years of watching MU BB.  He was mostly overwhelmed in BE play.   Wojo really needed to give Markus more rest and play Brendan and Jamal more to get the better minutes spread.  Kind of a Catch 22 from a ball handling perspective.  But without Greg and given Chartouny’s issues.......

I think Wojo's biggest mistake was not having Greg come back after the Wisconsin game. He was able to play if needed.

He was needed.

[4everwarriors]

Plato would ask what truth you are speaking. 

Dukiet compares in no way.  He lost to Fordham, Iona, Loyola.  Never beat Wisconsin to my recollection.  Had his team score 12 points against Notre Dame.  No NCAA berths.  Did this as an independent playing a sorry schedule.

See Goose's interpretation of my comments above. Could give a rat's ass about record comparisons. More interested in building and sustaining a elite program. Dukiet took us to mid-major status. Frankly, Wojo is at a crossroad in his program's trajectory.

[Nukem2]

I think Wojo's biggest mistake was not having Greg come back after the Wisconsin game. He was able to play if needed.

He was needed.

With things going so well through 23-4, it was hard to burn the redshirt.  In the end, guard depth was really needed.  Coulda...shoulda........?

[4everwarriors]

Which is why several have repeatedly ripped Wojo for not signing a 1-and-done whom the precious Hausers didn't even want on the team? Huh? Which do folks want? Sustainable success or Herro-quick success?

They are not mutually exclusive. Success breeds success. See Duke as an example

[forgetful]

With things going so well through 23-4, it was hard to burn the redshirt.  In the end, guard depth was really needed.  Coulda...shoulda........?

Agreed. I thought it was the right decision at the time.

[connie]

After digesting loads and loads of knowing speculation, inside information and flat out guesses, I finally have the answer to the topic question:  Beef and Cheddar.

I don't really know how the hunk of roast beef holds together, I'm not sure whats in the cheddar sauce, and I don't think anyone really wants to know what goes into the horsey sauce,  so I'm just going to order it, enjoy it, and move on.

[tower912]

Agreed. I thought it was the right decision at the time.

I thought it was a terrible idea at the time.  I thought Marquette would need him and the was when I still had hope for Chartouny.

[rocket surgeon]

Can’t wojo nix the move to Madison?  Buzz released Maymon to any school EXCEPT big east

[muguru]

Can’t wojo nix the move to Madison?  Buzz released Maymon to any school EXCEPT big east

No, you can't block transfers anymore.

[WarriorDad]

MU 82
The signing of one and done is both a short and long term success. Continually signing top recruits feeds off of itself. To me, the long term success outweighs the short term. I really thought Wojo would build off the Henry signing, but things did not materialize.

The teams that are winning it all now are junior and senior driven teams.  The Kentucky and Duke one-and-done are not going far in the tournament. Isn't that what some of you are pushing for as success metric?

[WarriorDad]

See Goose's interpretation of my comments above. Could give a rat's ass about record comparisons. More interested in building and sustaining a elite program. Dukiet took us to mid-major status. Frankly, Wojo is at a crossroad in his program's trajectory.

Then with respect, you shouldn't make those comparisons then.  The one you made was terribly wrong.

[WarriorDad]

WarriorDad

MU scored 12 points against ND?

As for comparisons to former coaches, I will wait until the Wojo era is over before making conclusions. That said, a lot will be based off condition he leaves program upon his departure. At this point, I believe there are a lot moving pieces at the moment.

In the first half, the team was booed off the court.  https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1988-01-10-8803210247-story.html

We agree how he leaves the program will judge his legacy, but I cannot help but think we have fans that use circular logic continuously to justify their reasoning to support or hate on our coaches.  Not a very solid approach.

[Goose]

WarriorDad

12 points at halftime was one of the all time low moments in program history. I misunderstood your post when you statecwe scored 12 points against ND. Sadly, remember the night all too well.

[Eldon]

In the Sweet 16 game against UNC, I think MU only had 15 in the first half

[Herman Cain]

Galway

At the moment, he is no Mike Deane.

I agree with this analysis.

[Cheeks]

In the Sweet 16 game against UNC, I think MU only had 15 in the first half

In the game against Syracuse, we only had 39 for the entire contest.  18 and 21 for the halves.

[withoutbias]

think it was this thread where sacar bailing early on the post game presser was discussed but not sure, so many long threads its hard to find what youre looking for.

at any rate, the mubb instagram account has an archived story from that game. they have video of wojo walking into the locker room with a swagger walk to some blasting music and everyone, including sacar front and center, join him in his little dance.

but maybe he was going back and forth from having fun to being fed up with his coach and team.

[Cheeks]

Galway

At the moment, he is no Mike Deane.

I worked for Mike for 4.5 years.  Enjoyed it.  Good coach, not a good recruiter.  Treated me well.

Wojo is no Mike Deane, and that is a good thing for where we want the program to go.  I'm a little surprised people would even be suggesting otherwise. 

Mike's first team had Tony Miller (Sr PG), Pieper, Crawford (future NBA), McCaskill (future NBA), Hutchins, Eford, Abraham and Gates (Sr).  Hard to believe that team didn't make the NCAA tournament with that cast.  We were 7-5 in conference.  Started the year 8-1, but then lost to VaTech, UWGB, blown out by 25+ to Cincinnati at home over a 4 game stretch.  Never really got it going until the very end when it was too late.

[MU82]

Mike Deane was a mediocre coach and a horrible recruiter.

And, from what I know, a pretty pathetic guy. My little brother used to bartend at Turners, and he said Deane would get all shyte-faced and then try to pick up 20-year-olds, who rejected him for the old man loser he was.

Wojo is at least as good a coach, is 10x the recruiter and, to the best of my knowledge, is not a pathetic old man. It's a silly comparison, as is Wojo to Dukiet, who never accomplished a fraction of what Wojo has so far.

So please. There are plenty of ways to rip on Wojo without comparing him to Dukiet and Deane.

And I'm one who primarily blames Wojo for the Hauser fiasco.

[4everwarriors]

Y'all are misunderstanding the Wojo to Dukiet comparison. No on the court similarities, at all. Simply, Steve has the potential to take this program to the dark depths that Bob did when he left decades ago. Let's see who he brings in to fill the roster now, at this late stage of the recruiting season for 2019.

[Galway Eagle]

Y'all are misunderstanding the Wojo to Dukiet comparison. No on the court similarities, at all. Simply, Steve has the potential to take this program to the dark depths that Bob did when he left decades ago. Let's see who he brings in to fill the roster now, at this late stage of the recruiting season for 2019.

Be more specific next time. If enough people misunderstand something it's usually the person that said it wrong.