Adios, Carolyn Kieger

[Nukem2]

End of the day this is about huge television money which comes from TV.  The SEC, Big Ten and soon ACC with their television network, have loads of cash. They are starting to spend it on Olympic sports as well as Women's hoops.  MU should not be paying $700K for a women's basketball coach.  The pie is only so big, one sport drives the show for MU....simple as that.  If a wealthy donor wants to foot the bill, then hell yes.  But with department resources, it cannot happen.  That sounds rough, sounds terrible and mean, but those are the economics at MU.

Yep, such is life.

[Shooter McGavin]

In the end, I understand the economics of the situation but she was almost too good to be true.  I hope they at least gave her a counter offer.  Just a shame because she could have built another MU athletic program that alums could be proud of watching.

[Marquette Fan]

Bullcrap move by Krieger in my opinion.  Fin nut up and build the program, discuss and be flexible with ur income, ur in the top 5% of all americans in earnings.  Give it more than 5 years.  Do u think Pat Summit, geno or muffett were making the biggest salaries in the game in year 5?  Or they built a brand?  Built a name?  And to do it at your alma mater?  What a legend and legacy that could have been built.  The job was only gonna get better and the goodwill and influence she would have continued to build at MU would have only benfitted her.  Personally i think its a short sighted BS move.  In my opinion not even close to worth a couple hundred thousand a year and i say that with the belief that she could have made it all on the back end at MU and been a almost lifetime contract.  Versus now stepping into the life of potentially a vagabond coaching career always 2-3 seasons away from being fired. 
I almost guarantee the kevin oneills, lon krugers, etc. or even a tom crean at this point look back and say boy the taking up roots in a comminity and being there for there career is worth all they made in extra cash compared to moving around once or twice a decade and being merely an afterthought by different fanbases and the profession.
Jmho and maybe the way im wired. Ive had two jobs and moved twice, have also had income increase or decrease by 6 figures in a year on a number of ovcassions

I disagree - there is a huge discrepancy between the quality of the Big Ten and Big East in Women's Basketball (the BE only had 2 teams even make the NCAA Tournament this year).  And you really have to be UCONN or in a P5 conference to get far in the Women's NCAA Tournament these days.  I am not thrilled she left because I fear it's kind of screwed the program for quite awhile but I really can't blame her for taking the Penn State job.  It's a much better opportunity for her in my opinion. 

[Marquette Fan]

Her success already dictated a competitive raise.  She was going to be the Buzz Williams of the women’s team but better because she is an alum.  If Marquette did not offer a similar or better salary as Penn State they are short sighted and missed a huge opportunity to build a very successful women’s program for the next 20 years.  They have essentially relegated the program to a second, if not third tier program.   MU will regret this I’m the future.  Continued success would have brought a fan base that would have eventually started selling out the AL with bigger games at Fiserv.  What a shame.

They couldn't even average 2,000 fans a game this season.  If the success the 18-19 team had along with all the media attention they got for both MU teams being ranked didn't draw fans in, I don't think it's ever going to happen.  And they had two local stars too.  The only way they're playing in the Fiserv Forum again any time soon is if a car lands on the court and I sure hope that doesn't happen again .

They haven't even had that many sellouts since they've been playing in the Al (began in Jan 2004).  I think a UCONN game in 2007 was their first sellout mainly due to UCONN fans.  Now they tend to mark the scream games hosting students at sell outs and they sold out the Notre Dame game this year.  But the ND sellout was due to ND fans - not due to MU fans.  And I can't remember the last non-scream game that was a sellout before the ND game.

I was worried they weren't even going to sell out the Al had they been able to host NCAA Tourney games.  But that didn't end up mattering since they slipped to a 5 seed.

[Shooter McGavin]

Agreed on current state of the program and current attendance or lack there of.  Unfortunately we’ll never find out what consistently winning over a long period of time will do for attendance because we have all predetermined that it is a no go.  MU will not make the commitment.

[Marquette Fan]

Agreed on current state of the program and current attendance or lack there of.  Unfortunately we’ll never find out what consistently winning over a long period of time will do for attendance because we have all predetermined that it is a no go.  MU will not make the commitment.

They had pretty good teams for 3 years and there was really no bump in attendance - I'm doubting it would have gotten much better over more time.

The other thing is it's not as if they were going to be a top 10 team again next season had Kieger stayed.  She was facing a rebuild of sorts at Marquette also and I was expecting a season kind of like the freshmen year of the current senior class at Marquette - they were just under .500 that year and didn't qualify for post-season play.  And then it remained to be seen if the 8 recruits she'd signed would have the kind of success the current senior class did.

[MarqKarp]

I applaud the enthusiasm of some of you in regards to the women's bball program. 


I want to be excited about Coach Duffy, but I find it hard right now.  When an alumni treats the program as a 2nd rate stepping stone program it is hard to see it any other way. 

I get why she left, I am just still incrediably disappointed by it. 

[SaveOD238]

I applaud the enthusiasm of some of you in regards to the women's bball program. 


I want to be excited about Coach Duffy, but I find it hard right now.  When an alumni treats the program as a 2nd rate stepping stone program it is hard to see it any other way. 

I get why she left, I am just still incrediably disappointed by it.

Frankly, in Women's basketball, Marquette IS a second-rate stepping stone program.  We have, what, like 6 NCAA appearances ever?  And one WNIT championship?  While the Big East is not a step down in mens, it is definitely a step down in the women's game. 

As much as Terri Mitchell wore out her welcome by being mediocre for so long, she was an excellent representative of the University and loyal for nearly 20 years.  Kieger, despite being an alum, was really just a flash in the pan for us.  Sadly, expecting more than what Mitchell did other than a few "special" seasons is probably unreasonable as things stand right now.

[Dr. Blackheart]

In Kieger’s first year, MUWBB averaged 1185 a game.  This season it was 1884 per game, a 59% increase.  In 2018 (most recent), the NCAA average was 1622, Big East was 1190, Miami OH was 626, Miami FL (where Kieger came from) was 1136, and PSU (where Kieger went) was 3118.

Kieger took MU a long way, but there is a lot to build yet to get to even top tier. MU is about a 115 index over national average on attendance. Football $ matters.

[Skip Intro]

In Kieger’s first year, MUWBB averaged 1185 a game.  This season it was 1884 per game, a 59% increase.  In 2018 (most recent), the NCAA average was 1622, Big East was 1190, Miami OH was 626, Miami FL (where Kieger came from) was 1136, and PSU (where Kieger went) was 3118.

Kieger took MU a long way, but there is a lot to build yet to get to even top tier. MU is about a 115 index over national average on attendance. Football $ matters.

These numbers paint a great picture - PSU, in a down year, had nearly 1500 more fans per game.  And their coach also made at least twice as much ours.  Coach Kieger is moving to a better conference (for women's bball), with much better fan support, for more money.  She's making the right call for her career, no doubt.  MU was never going to pay her $700k/year, and that's ok.

I also have no doubt that if Coach Duffy sees similar success, she'll move on to greener pastures, as well. 

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

I disagree - there is a huge discrepancy between the quality of the Big Ten and Big East in Women's Basketball (the BE only had 2 teams even make the NCAA Tournament this year).  And you really have to be UCONN or in a P5 conference to get far in the Women's NCAA Tournament these days.  I am not thrilled she left because I fear it's kind of screwed the program for quite awhile but I really can't blame her for taking the Penn State job.  It's a much better opportunity for her in my opinion.

What were uconn or la tech or tennessee or ..... before their head coachs took over n built the brand?  What has la tech or tennessee ir etc done since?  U can build it ir kinda chase it?  PSU aint one of them anyway.  Dumb shortterm move.  The money n everything else was there is she just dug in.  Imo fook Krieger, welcome Duffy i hope she learned a thing or two from her old coach about program building, she looks to be an upgrade.
Coach Krieger welcome to the Tom Crean career path... f u

[THRILLHO]

What were uconn or la tech or tennessee or ..... before their head coachs took over n built the brand?  What has la tech or tennessee ir etc done since?  U can build it ir kinda chase it?  PSU aint one of them anyway.  Dumb shortterm move.  The money n everything else was there is she just dug in.  Imo fook Krieger, welcome Duffy i hope she learned a thing or two from her old coach about program building, she looks to be an upgrade.
Coach Krieger welcome to the Tom Crean career path... f u

I don't know what kind of work you do, but it's too bad Marquette didn't try to hire you because apparently they could've gotten you at a substantial discount due to your loyalty!

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

What were uconn or la tech or tennessee or ..... before their head coachs took over n built the brand?  What has la tech or tennessee ir etc done since?  U can build it ir kinda chase it?  PSU aint one of them anyway.  Dumb shortterm move.  The money n everything else was there is she just dug in.  Imo fook Krieger, welcome Duffy i hope she learned a thing or two from her old coach about program building, she looks to be an upgrade.
Coach Krieger welcome to the Tom Crean career path... f u

I think you're irrationally angry about this. 

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

I don't know what kind of work you do, but it's too bad Marquette didn't try to hire you because apparently they could've gotten you at a substantial discount due to your loyalty!

Yep means something to me, as ive said before the money is there.  If u wanna chase instant gratification for something less meaningful then have at it. Also going to a program that has significantly underperformed MU of late.  So its not like it coulnt be done.  Davenport n mccoy dont go down n ur looking at a top 5 team n very possible final 4.  So its only for the money. Chasing it is a fools folly.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

I think you're irrationally angry about this.

Not angry in the slightest just calling out stupidity where i see it.  Also at this stage in my life/career i think my take is extremely rational. I pefer to build rather than chase. As a business owner who started with nothing but a s#it ton of debt, i guess its just my perspective.

[Daniel]

Looks like we are announcing Megan Duffy (Miami of Ohio) to replace Kieger today.  Supposed to be good, but loves ND and would ultimately go there I’m sure.  What I heard anyway.   

[TallTitan34]

Personally I'd want to stay at the school I went to and build up the program, but that's just me.

[Pakuni]

Personally I'd want to stay at the school I went to and build up the program, but that's just me.

Even if it cost you several hundreds of thousands of dollars a year?

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Even if it cost you several hundreds of thousands of dollars a year?

I gave up upwards of $700k in income over the short term to leave and start my own business. I had business revenue of under $50k in my first year.  So in my case ... yes

Wasnt making a 3 year decision

[TallTitan34]

Even if it cost you several hundreds of thousands of dollars a year?

The last job change I made was a slight reduction of salary for more enjoyment, granted that difference in salary is nowhere near this one.

I don't know what the actual numbers are but if I had to choose between 500K at Marquette and 700K elsewhere, I don't believe that wouldn't a large enough difference for me to leave. 

Don't get me wrong, I get why she did it, but I wouldn't have made that move myself.

[Pakuni]

I gave up upwards of $700k in income over the short term to leave and start my own business. I had business revenue of under $50k in my first year.  So in my case ... yes

Wasnt making a 3 year decision

This will be relevant when Carolyn Kieger decides to start her own business.

[warriorchick]

Yep means something to me, as ive said before the money is there.  If u wanna chase instant gratification for something less meaningful then have at it. Also going to a program that has significantly underperformed MU of late.  So its not like it coulnt be done.  Davenport n mccoy dont go down n ur looking at a top 5 team n very possible final 4.  So its only for the money. Chasing it is a fools folly.

How many women's basketball games did you attend last year?  How much did you donate to the Blue and Gold fund specifically earmarked for women's basketball?

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

How many women's basketball games did you attend last year?  How much did you donate to the Blue and Gold fund specifically earmarked for women's basketball?

Wtf does that have to do with anything? 
And the answer is no where near 0 and 0

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

This will be relevant when Carolyn Kieger decides to start her own business.

Very narrow minded response.  In fact, your wrong, its about a path, tall titan and i would have taken a different route as im sure would have others, some agree with the other route.  Thats fine too, just not my cup of tea.
Good to see ur as obtuse as ever tho.

[shoothoops]

Looks like we are announcing Megan Duffy (Miami of Ohio) to replace Kieger today.  Supposed to be good, but loves ND and would ultimately go there I’m sure.  What I heard anyway.

She’d have to get in line to go to ND. Carol Owens was named WBCA National Assistant coach of the year this year. Niele Ivey was the first ever recipient of the award in 2016. Both are long time assistants. There are also other successful past assistants, McGuff at Ohio St. etc...so i wouldn’t be too concerned about Duffy leaving for ND any time soon. Ivey would likely be first choice when McGraw retires. She is a big reason for the past 12 years of greater success there than in the past.  She also won a national title as a player there, just before Duffy arrived there as a player.